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tv   Up Front  Al Jazeera  October 10, 2022 2:30am-3:01am AST

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mentally secured an injunction against the section of railway between 10 coon and to loom citing environmental concerns. government carried on construction by using a national security decree. in late september, the judge, you granted the injunction rescinded team's decision. as for the deforestation, the government says it be mitigated by trees planted just elsewhere. in the back to the impact of track 5 is approximately 400 hector's were reforest thing, 400000 hector's 500000000 trees are being planted in the south west of mexico many more than are being impacted. but what about the people who live in the u company? what did they think of the train? the bus is that the os family have a small shop in one of the precarious informal settlements along the coast. when, if you tell me which this will benefit us because it will bring work for the young . i think with the maya there will be more need for hotel staff and for the young people who want to grow. i think the government for thinking of that but there are
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already lots of hotels and jobs in this area. the problem is most pay very low wages. people still live in poverty. the question is, will the government train pay better? and will it be worth the environmental cost your home? and i'll just say that riveto maya. ah, your challenges there is lisa hill, robin and her reminder of all top news stories. at least 13 people are being killed in a russian missile strike. it happened in the ukrainian city of reacher, and upon the block was hit and it said more people are trapped in the rubble. ukraine's president has called the shelling. merciless strike happened, dallas, after a blast, possibly destroyed the bridge connecting crimea to russia. present vladimir putin calls in a terrorist attack and blames ukraine, but keith has not claimed responsibility. some union. there is no doubt this as an act of terrorism aimed destroying russia's critical civilian infrastructure. its
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authors, perpetrators and beneficiaries other security services of ukraine, protested and relying for condemning a violent crack down a little demonstration in the capital columbia. at least 6 people have been arrested after security forces told protest as they couldn't dissemble in a public location. to protest continue, cancer on that was a violent down by security forces legion based around human rights group says at least 185 people have died in the rest. the protest spreading to schools and universities demanding a regime change. dozens of fed dead after boat capsized and nigeria, they was carrying 85 people when it was swamped by flood waters. in an umbrella state, 15 people were rescued. austrian president alexander of the belin is projected to secure a 2nd sick shed. 10. after those he ended on sunday, the partial count shows that he has a clever jollity to avoid run us 78 year old they,
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for believe of the greens and god abroad popularity by campaigning on promises of stability. a powerful store was expected to hit more countries in central america. after that, he will unfold indic or arguably, hurricane julia has been downgraded to a tropical storm. it brought heavy rain and high winds that slammed into nicaragua on sunday. the storm is expected to move along the pacific coast of hot duracell salvatore and what to mom. the stories on the website al jazeera dot com more news and a half now up front is next here on launcher sarah to stay with us. the chinese communist party holds it. 20th congress, delegates for me to discuss constitutional change, economic challenges, and phone policy with president gene pain likely to secure at that time. will he be given even more power to pursue his vision for the future? full as a story on, oh geez era. is the amazon reaching the point of no return from deforestation and
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fires to land grabs and mining? scientists say we may be seeing the end of the planets, largest rain forest, the effect condemning a 1000000 species to extinction. and are likely irreversible acceleration of the climate crisis. that conversation is coming up. but 1st weeks after devastating floods displaced millions in pakistan. the country is still struggling with the aftermath. this week, the united nations updates humanitarian appeal for the country from $160000000.00 to $816000000.00. this is not the 1st time pakistan has felt the effects of the climate crisis. so what role should the international community play in the wake of such disasters? earlier i sat down with pakistan's minister of state for foreign affairs, this weeks headliner. he knows rabbani car in a romani car. thank you so much for joining me on up front. over 1500 people have died as a result of catastrophic floods in pakistan,
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another 33000000 people have been displaced. at least one 3rd of the country is under water. diseases are spreading rapidly, flood damage is, or it's expected to exceed over $30000000000.00. you're here at the you, in general assembly. can you talk to me a bit about the scope of the devastation in pakistan? ok, so when you look at numbers which are in tens of millions, we dehumanizing number, the number becomes a number. and the humans sort of leave and the number stays with us, right? so let me define, put it in perspective. this is a population. the size of all of the kingdom of saudi arabia is a population which is larger than all of malaysia. this is an area which is the same size as the whole of the united kingdom. that's the scale of the disaster. and then on top of that, it's a disaster. united be been saying it is not of our making, luckily attribute will science now exists to tell us that this is
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a climate change crisis disaster. so the skin is just humongous. and just to be able to grapple with the enormity of what happened and the task ahead is something that didn't make you hopeless, but that's the challenge for me to ship, not to. and for the people who've already shown such great deal of, i don't like the word resilient use the word veneers because it somehow means that, you know, no matter what this did, it's fine, they're living so it's fine. i don't think it should be like that. and it isn't, it should not be like that, but in some ways it is because i don't think we have built enough structures in the world in the global order, in the, in the global architecture for crime, climate change, lead events to be able to grapple or diva des crisis is effectively when you think about the global capacity to deal with these issues. as you pointed to some of
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argue the international response has been insufficient. un secretary general antonio gutierrez said, there is a lot of attention on the war and ukraine, but people tend to forget that there is another warmed the war we are waging on nature. and nature is striking back. many of said, look, there's been a powerful response to the war and ukraine. we saw extraordinary responses to the flooding in europe. has it been adequate, the global response to pakistan? look, we're very thankful and grateful and for whatever response we've got. and i think the response has been, i mean i can, i can tell you that countries like, there you are, you, for instance, have an ear bridge. countries like through kia, have assisted a lot, many other countries. jain, of course, continues to assist or the united states came in with in large numbers in terms of, you know, on the you and try shipping and sort of the you came in europe in countries. i don't really want to leave any country, but pretty much the whole world has come to help, right?
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but as i said now, the skill of the graces is 33000000 people, as the number of dense required is in millions. and the number of tents available is in hundreds of thousands at best. so that's the, that's the gap. how do for the gap, the world is not prepared to fill that gap and that is, and therefore a, you know, to me, this is literally our in knock from whether you, you know, believe in the law as we do or mother nature, who, whatever nomenclature, use great, this is a weak up goal, and dime has already run out. but if he do not see this as e grid warning off things to come within the same season, literally marked onwards. pakistan saw forest fires, pakistan saw severe drought conditions, pakistan saw 3 degrees and to grid higher temperatures are that one of the hot to summers they'd be there were heard in some areas, far water than was ever even noted. there was glacial melting in the same area that
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we currently have drought, there was heavy. oak currently have floods. there was heavy drought conditions. so if you see at this scale of all of that, you realize that this is is serious climate change event. in august, the international monetary fund approved the additional $1100000000.00 in bailout funds to pakistan. now, as is often the case with i'm if laws there are condition the condition is often austerity. in this case and federal stairs were or conditions of the government under prime minister, chabarise sharif has eliminated fuel and power subsidies and diesel pump. prices have gone up by almost 60 percent. ok. people are struggling with double digit inflation yet in august are prime minister, so that pakistan is called economically in sleeved by the i am ma'am. so then why take the money look and this is how it works,
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right. you need macro economic stability for the country to have a chance in order to have macroeconomic stability. you need a fun program to be able to enable under funding sources to, to come. this is how the financial bill will architecture works. you know this better than i can explain to you. now when we have the floods in pakistan and floods of the biblical proportion. ok. so this is an extraordinary event, not on the pakistan skin. this is an extraordinary event on the global scale. this is in the rent which was not triggered by irresponsible behavior of pakistan. this was an event which was triggered by response, civil behavior of decades or of industrialization, but did not happen to have in my country or the poor. 33000000 people or ny experience, the receiving end of it. having said that, would you expect these $323000000.00 people to do, to have 1st down into floods? now down into conditionality is an extraordinary event. like this requires extraordinary response. my fear is having seen how the structures work that we will
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come in crunch of ordinary responses. and my fear is that the people who have drowned in this floods the cranford little less for them. right? and where is now you could avoid to problem by rebuilding the zalinski in an adaptable, mad with adaptation as it score and give hope. but our concern is that when it comes to the hard phase of the building, resilient years, we want to, when the numbers are to the tune of $30000000000.00, just the replacement cost, not the rebuilding cost, perhaps. then how far, how, how shot would be fall. and if we fall short, what would be the cost of that? it will not only be to plug a sign, it will be to everyone i did indeed. so, so there's the question of what we do if we don't receive funds, right? that's a question that you've addressed. but there's also a question of what happens when you receive funds and you can end up in a very familiar cycle, which is that you receive, i am a funding, you get conditional as assistance and you end up trapped in a kind of cycle of,
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of receiving this stuff, but not necessarily improving, not necessarily developing because of all the commitment you've made in order to receive the conditional funding. actually i'm, i'm not so fond of the commitments if he me, for other people sick. i'm fond of commitments at the stake that we make for up on people say, i think this whole a cycle of are trying to appease other people's commitments rather than commitments to young people is a bad cycle. and this is the real world doing their architecture works right? so they'll be all this finished. now ladies attached by different headquarters. want to now create a project which will, which will appease their conscience more than the realities on the ground in some ways. and by the time it hits the ground in pakistan, it's perhaps not really according to the requirements of the people of focus on. right. it's a typical sake of we need to come up with a model at, in, in, in the project days, mod, which is not only sellable, but it is something which builds in adaptability resilience,
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but is also fully in tune in line with the demand and needs of the people and not only catering to the needs of, you know, what we may consider the funding may be coming from, right. would you make of the argument, the mega project such as dams have actually worse and natural disasters? the worry that sounds kind investments in mega projects versus the kind of climate resilient local infrastructure approach is putting people in nature. okay, that's interesting approach, right? because about 10 years from today, or 12 years from today, focus on wanted to start to go projects with borderline finance fund funding and financing and even told or we do not do cool anymore right now. so it was fine for all the developed world to have done calls, but when it focused on wanting to exploit its own natural resources to be able to provide to let you know energy. we were unable to do that with funding from the bank. i believe that into what you have to look at is cumulative, responsibility, cumulative emissions. so if i'm in the matter 20 years back and i have emitted will,
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and now i'm going to not be the price for it, but have developing countries with low, you know, capacity and low resources to pay the entire price of my emissions. so i, you know, confused like you said, that you guys had a conflict happens and people that started their code plans again. so we are not allowed and they are allowed. so there's an element of unfairness in all of this. back in 2010 of floods killed early, 2000 people said that they packed and been here before 11000000 people were displaced in as well. and yet a mid us o. s. a climate and water expert on pakistan said that in 2022 quote, there's just nothing in pakistan in terms of disaster resilient infrastructure, and that people were literally left to fend for themselves. now your party was in power for 3 years after the 2010 floods that critique applies
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to your party. no, no, i would like to really be able to ask her the same questions that would be required to be asked that will do called resilience and with and readiness. so if a country experiences in new york city today, babysitting manhattan, the heart of the word of the developer right was to were to get for it is each 100 percent more than that typically does intern joan? right. the typical couch materials which receive one from front of rain and flooding and the sun did not receive the joint. there was still a job conditions. so we're still looking at it from a, from a, from among, from that's where this is a climate. is there anything that could have been done, or are there any infrastructure perspective, from an infrastructure perspective, much more can be done? absolutely. well, what could have been done? so then let me tell you very clearly what could have been done and what will be done as video build and trailer. so did the thing to notice is that the typical areas which receive one soon did not receive the same amount of rain for the
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typically. so this happened in an e, typically d n, a non typical area. now despite having said that, what we need to do is that wherever we build back, we have channels to make sure that the flow of water can be management better than it. good. and we build back infrastructure in the we, for instance, some of the schools withstood rate that you build back in the way that they can survive, said severity of water. and, and the fust bro do must be to ensure that the water can be channeled better. but please understand the enormity of the challenger time, 32000000 people. i will, i will share this with you. a lot of people came on the tv screens and then you go to them and said we received nothing and did not like they actually did not receive anything. how can you feed 33000000 people all at the same time when we went to the whole world and the horrible came out, opened their hearts opened this story, just give us whatever dense they had. you know how many tents we received less than the 1000000. you know, how many people were dismissed? 33000000. so i think the globe, the global order,
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is ill prepared to be able to deal with what is coming are we, i am not good business until this partner summit is facing an economic crisis. and yet, it was announced in june that the country would be increasing its defense budget by 11 percent, or at the same time, it reduced the allocation for its public sector development program by 19 percent. why the government chosen to increase military spinning rather than allocating those funds for the necessary infrastructure to protect people from the harm? mccracken? sure, i could not say that that's rude, that you want to go at all. i think the trend had been in focus on the general terms military spending was actually decreasing now, hero. and so when it comes to real terms, i think the increase would be very, very minimal. just to keep up with existing infrastructure. and that's why it's really important, and therefore i was in the session which was on humanitarian assistance. and they kept on talking about how the mind doing the system needs are increasing. and i
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said that from one side, we are feeding the bees to creating humanitarian assistance requirements. more because conflict is increasing. economics, television is increasing. climate change to good events are increasing. really nothing can deal with the crisis with the, with the reason with the this is for the christ, whether it's climate change or economic starvation for crisis has been triggered by all conflict in our region. conflict, it's right on being triggered in some ways with, with climate change and we still the biggest threat to national security at this point. right? mean it suddenly, right in 2015, the us conducted a drill, simulating an earthquake in the indian ocean. and it was found that the soon as the waves from an earthquake could reach karachi in one and a half hours in the entire city. again, we're good to have large military if karachi, the economic backbone and main city water, you know, to be honest, the things have changed in our region, right? i mean, since 971, we really did not have an active conflict. if you don't take
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a few minor conflicts, take them away. but on to years, back off we had from a neighbor military jets into pakistan, years this proclaimed focus on the air space into our territory and into a territory. and then back and neutral on it was proven that the claims that the made of a you know, going after terrorists outfits, et cetera. none existed. only cheese existed over there. right now when something like this happens, i cannot make the case that you don't need mimicry. spending anymore, i need we need to have jets, which are in a position to be able to fight back. so when you have confrontations, leg that you are in need, you are ensuring that our i wish i owed our desire to be able to swore will be completely from that type of spending and going to serious, you know, adaptability of, forget it up to, belittle i mean adaptability is
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a major part of what we need to do, but this also we're still struggling with proper education infrastructure, proper health infrastructure, proper route and farm to market roads. proper economic infrastructure rates, or when the country like this, which has many, many places to spend its reason is forced to re look at, you know, military spending again. and if you'd notice, i mean all over the world military spending is currently being celebrated. isn't it? rep and critique. i honestly hed critique all over. right? i mean, we're, i know, mark, i think it was a dime when it was being critiqued. but right now, if you look at that, you know, i think trump also started talking about what the central g d p. are you spending on military and now everybody celebrating? yes, we are increasing military spending and those countries which were not carrying large armies and now carrying are strong intention to so we are actually feeding the b straight now. and this is a dime when really, i think there will be more or less for us to conduct wars. and then i think the
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secretary said something to this extent in this. and i have to say that i understand that the, the u. n. may not be the most celebrated body right now, but to have deep respect, deep abiding requests for into a new get earth for at least seeing the red stuff rate alpha calling out where we are falling miserably, miserably behind. then what leadership requires right now in dance, off of fighting for the s d g 's fight fighting for a rear rear climate change. not only adaptability financing, but looking at the whole architect and saying that, why should we not be ahead of the co way behind by behind the cub hinora bunny car . thank you so much for joining us at the front. ah. is the amazon at a tipping point in brazil under president jeered boston. otto deforestation has intensified significantly specifically in indigenous areas increasing by more than
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138 percent during his 1st 3 years in office. in recent years, we've also seen a traumatic uptake in mining agribusiness and land grabs while indigenous rights have been undermined. but deforestation, and its impact on communities is more than a moral quandary. what happens in the amazon doesn't occur in a vacuum. it affects all of us, and it is affecting us now. so the question is, are we headed down a path of no return? joining us to discuss this from keith though ecuador is elisia guzman. she is deputy director of the amazon program at stan, that earth. she's also one of the lead researchers on the report amazonia, against the clock, and from sao paulo brazil were joined by tasso acevedo, technical coordinator for obama adam authorial de lima and former director general of the brazilian fart service. thank you both for joining me on up front elisia. i'm going to start with you. according to the data presented in the amazonia report, from 985 until 2020, 26 percent of the amazon has undergone transformation. most of it categorize as
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irreversible transformation while conservation measure to have stymied some of the environmental destruction over the years. there's still a continuing pattern of loss that we're witnessing. if this trend goes on, what does it mean for the planetary health? ah, in practical terms, there's a lot of the articles in studies about that taking planning, the m s and e i n is still many authors think that we're not there yet, however, that different data that has been released lately shows that we are in the midst of the tipping point, so it's not a teacher scenario that it's a reality. lisa, let me, let me parts on that because that were tipping point comes up a lot. and when we say tipping point, we mean that point after which the rain for us will be completely lost, but the timeline for reaching that point is a question mark for many. for me it's still kind of great what we mean by
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a tipping point. and how close we actually are, i hear different numbers. can you break down what tipping point is, what it means that you've been playing? is this claim where there's a break down? it said it's we're the forest cannot um, re generate on its own. so it strikes a process of die back and we cannot put a date like on to state these area will disappear. but you can see that there's a transformation of viagra system due to the lack of red j o of exhilaration duration ta. so people been raising alarms about the destruction of the amazon for decades. now, what, what are the lived impacts now and also moving forward of losing more of the amazon? well, that there, you know, different scales, right? so you think about the planet as a whole. if we lose the amazon, if i'm, if you take the amazon of the equation, the temperature,
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the global temperature could rise by 0.25 degrees. this means that we probably can't achieve the, the buyer's agreement in terms of, you know, climate change. so for example, if you take, if you take it the amazon off the equation, we lose 30 percent off the rainfall in the country. so we can see that those impacts starting to happen and right now. so it seems that deforestation is largely the consequence of economic drivers. if we look at brazil just as an example, the country's national debt is about 78 percent of the g d p. up, some argue that mining oil extraction and stuff like that in the amazon is needed in order to bolster any emerging market. but what do you say to politicians who are pushing these solutions as the response and as a wave easing, the states economic woes. i mean, we can use the real data from the past to show that this in, oh,
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there is no connection with when one thing in the other necessarily. so if you see like between 20042012 in brazil, the deforestation of the amazon dropped down 80 percent, 80 percent. and that was the last period of economic growth in brazil. so we were growing 4 to 5 percent a year in terms of g d p, for example, the debit was coming down. the exports are including from agriculture products and mining products exploded. so what i think is that when you have a cease deforestation in brazil, 98 percent of the deforestation have elements of illegality. deforestation link a lot with lack of governance. so if you have a good governance in the country, you will have deforestation coming down and good governance is absolutely important to have a, a health economy. so i think that's decreasing. deforestation is a drive for a better economy and not the opposite. early say your report lays out solutions for
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preserving 80 percent of the amazon by 2025. and it points toward forgiving existing debt in exchange for protections of indigenous territories and, and, and of course, priority areas as well. why do you see debt forgiveness, as opposed to other policies? is such a key move for preventing further deforestation? now it's not either or we have to start thinking of systemic solutions. many of the supply chains, oil letter, and others that are that fuel destruction, e d m us an e r r i come from industrialized nations. so for example, 89 percent of the oil in the amazon is producing equity or, and most of it goes to the us. and they're european banks in both us back in both. there's us banks involvement. and there are many oil companies and intern
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mediators that work in the, in the supply chain. so talking about debt forgiveness, it's a good way to involve multilaterals bilateral debt and also the private bonds just to acquire more consciousness of from the linkage between the global north and the global south. and how we all are responsible of what's happening. well, this is an issue on absolutely critical concern. i thank you both for joining me to weigh in on it. so lucy, thank you so much for joining me. all right, that is our show up for will be back next week. ah ah
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