tv Inside Story Al Jazeera November 15, 2022 3:30am-4:01am AST
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what's, what's dogs and football fan? well, to me a francisco's doing his best to ensure his street is once again crowned champion of the st. decorating competition license. but as of the, in a brazilian, we are brazilian and brazilians, even with so many difficulties. so many struggles so much to worry about, always make space to celebrate the world cup. decorating the streets as a brazilian tradition. the world coppers providing a happy distraction to millions of people. after a turbulent political gear and elections that lived brazil deeply divide it ha gyal sanara, the former president who was voted out of office last month adopted the national colors as his own during campaigning and the shirt that re presents a love of football and brazil has for many been tainted and politicized. by the far right flop of madame's mer. hope's cause
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a 2022 will help people come together again developed there's more met before literally get in on know we had this political moment that we the we wanted it or not was the cause of much discussion and complex but now the world cup is coming, so we have to have a party we have to celebrate. we have to unite united behind world football's most successful national team and their quest for 6 world cup title. lexia brian al jazeera. ah, this is al jazeera and these are the top stories. israel says the united states is decision to launch an investigation into the killing of al jazeera journalist. sharina barkley is a grave mistake, adding that they will not cooperate should in was shot dead by his really forces in may while covering a raid on jeanine in the occupied west bank. my hannah has more from washington dc . there's no confirmation whatsoever from the u. s. side,
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these reports emanating from israel, originally, news reports in israel, and now it would appear to be confirmed by that series of tweets made by the israeli defense minister. there has been a reaction from congress, though, from a democratic senator crisp on holland. he's issued a tweet, a welcoming that the a parent moves by the department of justice to launch a unilateral investigation. it must be remembered that earlier this year, more than 50 members of congress wrote a letter to the department of justice asking for exactly such an investigation. to be conducted, the u. s. and chinese presidents look to improve a strained relationship at their 1st face to face meeting on the eve of the g. 20 summit in indonesia, joe biden, and she's in ping discuss taiwan, north korea, and ukraine. and g 20 leaders have been arriving at the summit for the 1st official day of talks. the war in ukraine and rising global inflation are expected to
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dominate the agenda. ukraine's president has visited the recaptured city of her san volota. miss zalinski said ukraine is ready for peace with russia. moscow withdrew its forces from the city on friday, funerals had been held for some of the victims of a bombing in istanbul. on sunday, the explosion killed 6 people and entered 81 others turkish police investigating the incident have detained, 47 people, but of the headlines. the news continues here on al jazeera, after inside story, thanks for watch. ah. it's an agreement aimed at implementing
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a theme deal the if european government and to grey rebels applies to allow humanitarian a deliveries into the water region, but will the truce hold and his peace in northern if you're possible, this is inside story. ah hello and welcome to the program. i'm hash an al bala if the us government and rebels have agreed to allow immediate humanitarian access to te gray and other regions in the north. the pledge signed in nairobi is the latest step towards ending 2 years of conflict. it follows last week's tours on implementing a peace deal inked at the beginning of november. northern africa is in the grip of a severe humanitarian crisis. the un estimates, 13000000 people in the to gray are far and amar regions urgently require food aid.
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dominated european politics for 2 decades until abby bohannon came to power in 2018 in november 2020. the prime minister ordered a military operation against the group, accusing it of attacking military base is something that to be a laugh, denied. the rebels retaliated and the fighting intensified spreading into the neighboring a fall. and i'm how to regions. i read 3 and troops were also involved backing if european soldiers, several truces and temporary cease fires were declared and collapsed during the nearly 2 years of conflict. the un amnesty international and humor weiss watched have accused both parties of atrocities and possible war crimes. ah, listening and our guests in stockholm is tick. les gabrey, michael, associate, editor of to got a platform that documents the war integrate in london,
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martin plowed senior research fellow, other institute of commonwealth studies and in birmingham is bizarre. now get that shoe, your men are teaching feller the university of birmingham. welcome to the program. to clay vera occupations and counter accusations and both parties, the to gray, to gray as and the government about the axes that has been granted to the humanitarian trucks into to gray. it doesn't seem to be happening according to that degree ins. well so so, but what we know is that the, the, the to grands were in very, very uncertain terms told in south africa that they didn't sign the deal. he monitor and aid would be continued to be with her as it has been, had been for the past 2 years, essentially that he had been regime and they returned regime joined hands and used starvation as the, as a, as a, as
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a women of war. and that was had against them against it, to grow representatives in south africa. so the reason now we have time to learn, they were forced to, to sign the deal was because they were told by the observers by the facilitators of the a you and the americans. but if they didn't sign the, the didn't, starvation would continue to be used as a weapon of war. so that's what happened. oh, and the signed because they wanted a to get in to starving. people are dying from starvation from multiple reports. we have been able to understand that there is immense suffering integrate. but even though they, they signed under that enormous pressure, we know that aid hasn't got into to grab until to day. so nothing has changed in terms of actually aide and get into the grad, even though the very reason that to grow representative signed the deal, but is otherwise extremely unfavorable to to gray. was to make sure that aid got into to grandma is extraordinary. that the a,
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you and the americans and the other people who facilitated that the diva would, would, would really use the v withholding of aid as a bargaining chip on. so that's where we are. okay. martin, they, it seems that the idea of starting with the humanitarian aspect of the agreement is to build trust and confidence between the 2 boring size but after 2 years of located on starvation, the w h o chief is saying that many people are dying from critical diseases and many are dying from starvation. is this an indication that the agreement itself remains fragile? well i think until the aid actually begins to flow and we have no indication yet that it is flowing then certainly it will remain fragile because as, as tech is just made. ready clear, this is one of the main reasons that the grand signed, but we have to see some kind of proof. and that's why it's important that not only
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the aid goes in, but we should have some independent journalist going in as well. who can then report from the ground and say, this is what is happening. because in a why is it that on one hand, you get a sense from above other they have made major gains in the agreement. but at the same time, they seem to be extremely cautious. careful when it comes to channeling a than allowing aid in to take away what is happening. i think both parties have gained from signing the 15 and the water has been devised 15000000 people who are starting because of the conflict and this conflict should get solutions in one way or the other. they finally agreed to resolve the issue peacefully, which is a huge achievement in the continent by just looking at the deal even if it's implementation is crucial. but on the other side,
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in terms of anybody that started throwing to the region, how they are still under the t p, lead control in the south, me and demobilization integration not be completed. the 2 groups military neither signed the detailed procedure or disarming and integration only 2 days ago. and i think it is very out of me to, to evaluate the amount of the low paid. but we, we need to also remember that there are a lot of issues and convincing each mia. so i'm going to send that passing down the co mom needs some time even from the t p. lead considering that data feeling that deal was bought from their perspective. this may need some days to convince ok one of the negotiate or get that to run the only part too much today. and i think it's 2 out of me to, to flag about there is a problem or, but the deal has not daily,
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but anything. hopefully they need to work a lot in order to deliver. now what the ticket to play, the ta gray is how to set of conditions in the past about starting political talks . with this above this, they seem to have decided to abandon most of those demands for the sake of having aid trickling into their own areas. is, does it really explain the fact that that way, as we're willing to go for those massive, massive fits back when it comes to signing this agreement. just for the sake of him in humanitarian catastrophe on the ground. what i don't think they have abandoned their demand. i said, i think what happened is when they went to south africa, they found out that the cards were stacked against them because they were told that whatever the deed was offered to them, they had to sign. because if they didn't,
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aid wouldn't get in. so they were not in a position to demand the other political. the other political pushes that they had before they had to sign in the faint hope that some aid would took it in to, to, to grab it. and what they did at what i think, and we don't know because they haven't been really speaking opened about for why they signed the deal. but i think what happened is that they put the other questions in the back burner. and the sign in the hope that some, some aid would get it. so that seems to be the thinking on the part of the to grounds delicate delegate. but i don't think they have a abundant that demands because they haven't basic want that the month base say that the tick to grands to categorize holborn territorial integrity must be respected, wants that she must be respected. perpetrators of crimes must be held to account. so they are basic ones that demand, i don't think they would be in a position to draw them up if i could just at one point and job the ip address to
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the point that they tape and recruit um a guest raised the, a senior government official with yesterday, co to line, he said that aid was blowing to to gripe, but immediately he might and work as an idiot passing that that was actually categorically a lie because they have been bad and they still continue to be banned from delivering aid. so be on the, i'd the claim, the eighty's getting to, to great is a complete categorical ally. and this is that something that he monitor and work as have been repeated the say a point they reached out in the caution of we were talking talk and you get to actually get a claim of the grant. so i'll promise, i'll get back to you when we talk about it later. the program about a retro martin, you have narratives. here you have the to raise her, say no advantage to secure what we wanted, although the diaspora is talking about an act of humiliation. you have the other sub on the other hand, which says that as long as we manage to secure an agreement that does not talk about the degree in government does not refer to the 2020 election. integrate and
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talks about the need to integrate the degree as into the if the up in a military establishment that's a massive political gain for r b. i mean, i agree with you. i think it, i think it was for the to grands to give up on the, on the election, which they held, which was frankly at just as accurate and fair as the ethiopian election, which took place later which the was sewed. rigged, the european union refused to send manas to it, but there's one thing that is really important in the agreement with the competence we just signed 2 days ago. it 1st or it recognizes the grey armed combatants, not the t p l f. so it actually begins to say. busy yes, there are people who are not necessarily party but are the army and those who are the we dealing with. the 2nd point is let me just read you. i tend to see it says upon disengagement. the federal authorities shall assume federal responsibilities
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in accordance with the constitution for all areas, including the resumption of services. if that is the case, then frankly, it's not up to the t p l f or anybody else to let the, the adrian, it's up to the federal authorities. that is what they have, sign business, you can win a war, you can win a conflict, you can manage to use your levers to salvage whatever you can from a political agreement. but don't you think that the biggest challenge facing a man in the near future is to win the hearts and minds of people in to gray after all the atrocities committed against them? yeah, the most important thing is to build trust that was between the 2 parties and it in the leader of the federal government and the people at the same time for this conflict. i don't think it is just one party that you are responsible. the crimes being committed by both parties. so therefore if we have to blame,
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we have to blame more of them and it is not easy for, for the government that's when to reestablish reintegrate to grand population into your benefit. but the program was not between the people, but it was a bit between the political leaders and the military engagement, where between the sort of yes. so it's not easy for the most parties and the people left us. well, if it's one to still remain at the present tactical, to get people, there must be a mccarthyism to renew it. is commitment to the people of the region. but at the same time, a position in the, in the region, also need to do something to engage actively the politics. because all parties have bad record regarding how anybody promises to the public to rebuild. to can you spoke about the recipe and troops who are fighting along with the
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army in t. right? this was a sticking point to the point where the south africa was an insistence on avoiding using the term to value forces and referring instead to following involvement. what does it leave the re and in the future when it comes to dealing with directory and troops? well, so in the, in the, in the agreement signed in, in nairobi and said that the base base say top non, he and the a forces muslim. and the region, so they use a very ambiguous language because they couldn't bring themselves to mention erica, and they couldn't say erica, muslim and to grab because that would have offended eric shout. and because of the domineering role that erica has been having over ethiopia is not, not in a position to assert itself over eric ethel, they're in a bit of
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a 50 k e k. i. when it comes to erica. but we're not the flute to grow. i think the, the one, the one that grounds would say would be about to open to say that erica should leave to gripe on. but if it's refused that to great horses would be in a position to, to deal with area along. that would be the position of the to grounds, but one point that they to paragraph guess said if i could mission, he said that all parties have committed crimes degree. that is true. but the crimes committed by the hip and eric enforcers are materially and qualitatively different, even according to the your report. and the u. s. has been on the whole sympathetic detail. but even according to your report that you report says that you keep an error tempo suck, committed crimes against humanity and true war crimes. whereas nothing of the sort have been committed by to ground forces. so to say that one parties have committed crimes. he's wrong. there's a, he's different to the type and degree of crimes committed,
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what kind of point in terms of the abbey regime, and that's a grand people, i think too much water has passed under the bridge. i don't think there is any way that the 2 parties could reconcile and are come to our right to one to one site. i think the only way is how do they go their own ways. i think it to the extent that needs to be a discussion is above how should the separation be made in, in a peaceful manner. ok, i don't think there is an opportunity for them to, to reconcile martin up. or if we are to talk about how to move forward as far as the agreement is concerned, not as talk about the mechanisms of monitoring and verification which are going to be solely under the responsibility of a small units under the umbrella of the african union is it gonna work, does it hold any sort of legitimacy, any political weight? i mean, it has legitimacy. the problem is it's so small, it's going to be extremely difficult to see how that,
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how this works. and i think they're going to have to rely a lot on satellite evidence which the united nation certainly has. and i presume is making available to the to both sides so they can see what's going on. but i mean, the point really is not only the removal of the era trans from the, from to great, but if you look at the, the other bishop, the, of the agreement, it says this in this, in this argument of heavy weapons will be done concurrently with the withdrawal of foreign and non ethiopian national defense forces from the region that would suggest that both era trans mosley and the m r and final forces must also leave from western t grade. because if everything's going to be done by the constitution, then west integrate is part of the grade. that's what the constitution says right now. that's what must be required. so how is that going to be achieved? very, very difficult. see how that's done and very difficult to monitor present,
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or are we likely to see a prime minister with your peer saying that it's about time not only to, as you've been talking earlier about the need to set aside those differences and move forward. but to recognize the fact that there's something terribly wrong over the last 2 years. to address it, we have to say we've made mistakes and we have to acknowledge that the tick ray is, won't accept anything less than something like an autonomy. the need for themselves to own their own fate. i got to let me start from the point of view. i don't think there is that there is also no media clearly presented by the 2 great, a presenting girl who negotiated the pretoria in nairobi. i swear the most important thing here is how to go for water. that one of the finalists component is mentioned that it was part of crime. we're committed by, by the federal government, soldiers, etc. but i don't see unless an examination is,
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is conducted by an independent body is very difficult and destructive to pass judgment. you know this, my name would be, by the way, and up the ticket a just for our, for the sake of our viewers v, where the us said that half a 1000000 people were killed in the conflict. the united, the europeans, top foreign, and boy, joseph burrell. said that a 100000 of people were killed, the united nations back the investigation commission accused all sides of committing abuses, atrocity, but also accused the government in addis ababa of using foundation as a weapon of war. and they also accused the retreating army of committing atrocities against people in takeaway, just for the sake of the record. good. yeah, yeah, thank you very much for, for bringing this to, to attention. the whole point about to me. so that document is that let's go back
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to pre water scenario and lets respect the constitution. so we know what we want to say not awards in terms of jo raffi code content real contest. so we continue legitimate political part of the considering that it would be the least from the terrorist list, and it will start engaging like another political party. so pre water was, there was no originally a conductor election because acting in conducting election is only been run monday according to the constitution. so the whole point is going back before, before what was happened and then re engage in a part of my way. so in this we got to that is not on the me or autonomy has been granted for all ridges. i think the ok, they have autonomy up to cessation tonight at the end of the constitution. so if, if the t great people to one does that they can present through foreign constituent
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procedure. and i don't think that's an issue at this point. the issue is trying to re engage and, or integrate the reason i have other issues to discuss with you and i appreciate if you can give you some visuals, answers if you don't buy them, is not with a tickler. do you think it's about time for the typical at itself to be in that in invent itself because in a way or another, they started with an adventure and it's backfiring on them a massively well, yeah, i mean it's true that the to be a little, it's a lot o reinvention of bought on itself. i think it has to bring this up to modern times . i think it has to be more inclusive integrate. i think it has to start working with opposition. parties integrate, but in terms of the demands that it has been making when aspire, the war is concerned. i don't think there is anything that, that again, it would have done because they are making very simple demands. which is that whatever happens integral, what kind of government gets elected, integrate is entirely up to the people of the gray. and the federal regime doesn't
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have any a, any mandate coming to degree and okay, can change and forcing people to, to elect one party or another. not it must reinvent isa, but not as far as is dealing with the best consent. martin, you would have thought or everybody would have thought that the in the you and the americans would with a level as they have would be, or secretaries of the agreement or at least would have a, as a say in it doesn't seem to be the case leaving the a you itself as the soul garment out of there. whatever happens in the future. is it a good idea or you're, you're absolutely right. i mean the, but then don't forget the un and the, in the us, we're not signatories. they witnessed what happened not signatory. and really what we need to see now is a place in which to gray can feel itself comfortable and secure with in ethiopia. it's then up to them as the a colleague from from addis was putting it to use the constitution. if that is what
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they want to seek separation, if they want it under article 39, but you know what really needs a lot of goodwill on both sides. okay, why there's not gonna be sooner. when you look at the very a heart of the agreement, cessation of hostilities was the rest of the military and ada establishment of federal authority over the tea gray and the disarming of the to be left fighters. there is absolutely no way this is going to happen today to model or even in the near future. this explains why many people are really cautious about this agreement is this is, is some consensus in addis ababa? i don't think narrative is something that's it. as impossible, it is not correct because this is something possible. nobody assume that they will reach such agreement in 67 days negotiation. but it happened in the progress is well and in kenya, they also signed that agreement regarding how to implement. so it is possible to
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solve this complex is funny and some of the services, for example, banking guys, resume in some parts according to government report, about 7. so when areas integrate with government control, so the standby state procedure, but it should ask them to support the national act that's through short support. the process isn't together. so you're mano martin plow tick leg of re michael. i really appreciate you. instead looking forward to talking to you in the future, thank you for watching. you can see the program again any time by visiting our website elses eda, dot com for further discussion. cuz our facebook page that facebook dot com forward slash ha inside. sorry, awful. during the conversation on twitter, and that is ad agency, sorry for me passion, bother. and the entire team here in doha bye for now. ah
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