tv Inside Story Al Jazeera December 9, 2022 10:30am-11:01am AST
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more men pulling the water, making the up boat. wow. seem really seem power. it's so fast. it's so fun to watch. you all the people becoming like a machine and that's the thing. the 200 mika is going to happen quickly and very quickly. i synchronization 2 milli seconds. well, not one of those sports if you all visit to connect by and take a this is out here. and these other top stories now are american basketball star brittany grinders expected to land in the us shortly after being released from our russian prison. she was exchanged for honesty, the vic to boot on thursday,
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before boarding a plane back to the knighted states. i ready with you know we're heading to a club, but comb with not mine. harrison will define russian arms d that victor booth has landed in moscow after being freed by the us. he was greeted by his mother and wife boot says he wasn't told he was been released ahead of time. protest as in peru have fought with police, sought the arrest of impeached president pedro castillo. he was detained and removed from power on wednesday, after attempting to shut congress and rule by decree. there's been
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a color outbreak in the makeshift camp outside go, man, eastern democratic republic of congo. in the past 2 weeks, more than 250 patients have been admitted to a local treatment center. thousands of displaced people are living in the area of the violence between the congolese army and emmett 23 rebels. a landmark legislation protecting the same sex marriage has been passed and the u. s. b. respect for marriage is act will act to support a 2015 supreme court ruling requires the federal government and the states to recognize gay marriages as long as they were legal in the states they were performed. and the football well cup is back in action on friday as the 1st quarter final matches get under way later. pressure up against 5 time. chopin's, brazil at 15 gmc and at 19 gmc netherlands of face argentina. there's a headline news, continues hernandez, era that's after inside story. after more than 2 weeks of intense
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competition, we're now down to the final 8. we've witnessed seismic upset many of the world's top teams still remain. cut our 2022 on al jazeera german police have disrupted a fall right plots to seize power. they rested dozens of people on wednesday, that as whiteman party is when will vote and even how're in some you states, are we seeing a border shift to the rice in european politics? this is inside story. ah. are there and welcome to the program. i'm the start your day. now police unintelligence services in germany say they've disrupted a right wing plot to to overthrow the government. they conducted raids across
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a $130.00 sides nationwide arresting what they said were ringleaders, including a 71 year old prince. a retired senior military officer and a judge and former far right m p. prosecutors believed that that group was planning an attack on parliament that will bring an al guests in just a moment. but 1st this report from dominant came in berlin. thursday has been very much about reaction to the events of wednesday. the arrests of those 25 people, the searchers in so many different states in germany. and the very clear sense that something serious had been planned, which the authorities say they've thwarted and that is reflected in the news media . certainly in the newspapers here. this is the suit dodged at sites and newspaper saying security forces fought a strike against this. the state or couldn't tie, in other words where the picture of the alleged ringleader hanley lies being led away by heavily on police officers. same sort of imagery in the thankful to aga
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mine at sight on. and this time it says a strike against the racks. boerger movement or group whole that's important because that's where the attention is focused. this far right grouping that wants to sir, return to the imperial germany that govern this country prior to the end of the 1st world war. the interesting thing being other questions. how could some of these people in this alleged plot reach such positions in society as a former member of that parliament? some one who was in that parliament representing constituents until last year and is now accused or suspected of having plotted to overthrow it. so many questions being asked donna kane for inside story in berlin. i want to take a quick look now at where far right party is have made gains across europe. italy is near the georgia, maloney became prime minister there after september election leading the most right to in government since mussolini. the german far right party, the f
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d that badly in elections. and main bands still has about 20 percent support in the east. frances far rise, increase its number of m. p is nearly tenfold after jane's legislative elections becoming the main opposition. now poland, nationalist law and justice party has been in government since 2015 with some of its right when policy is leading to disputes with the you and sanctions. and hungary is a right wing, prime and aesthetic to or than one is also election in april. while the far right sweden, democrats hold the balance of power there with a minority coalition, government dependent on their support. ah, oh, let's not bring him our guests in berlin. we have been heiress. he is the found an editor in chief of b. any and tele news and room, we have eleanor, a polish, he's the head of analysis of the centers for european policy network and in north hampton. you came pull jackson, a professor in the history of radicalism and extremism at the university of north hampton. and also the author of pride in prejudice,
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understanding britain's extreme rights. i will welcome to you. thank you for joining us on the inside story. then i'm going to start with you and berlin. the rest of a former member of the buddhist dog and a member of the f d. and that must be sending shock waves through germany. just how fringe is the group that we're talking about. it's pretty french, and of course everyone's talking about this. it came out, feel that was the last thing you expect in somewhere is organized democratic. germany is a, could a tar by a former prince, or indeed rupert, however, it's a pretty french group and the police, when they're commenting on looking at it, saying that they were actually extremely disorganized. that the plans they had with not realistic. and that this really wasn't going to go anyway. the chances of success were nearly 0. nevertheless, it sort of represents the on the current here, i'm in the groups of people in the iceberg. it's an organization which has been
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loving for long time, and it says that some gemini should have sovereignty back, go back to a monarchy. and the leader of this group says that he was intended to come back as some sort of rule in a moment. monarchy says and take germany back to its former glory, went in pre pre war when it was about japan, spanish season, a senior and powerful country in europe. and there's some sympathy with that. but really, at the end of the day, i think most people are considering these people to be a bunch of fringed extreme mattress until the grip, i believe, was also influenced by what's been happening in the u. s. the rise of q and on the attack on the capital. eleanor let me ask you how have events across the atlantic affected or influenced groups, far rise and extremist groups in europe? they've been emboldened out. well, i think you know, radically in europe,
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especially right when bra, because europe is, is on history. it is, well, it is related somehow to, you know, what, what happened in the us bad reasons and history. i will say that you is not related to a sort of social, my dental discontent within, you know, the economic governance. and i think, you know, is also a method of sovereignty. many european member countries people are asking to solve any back against you or against, you know, they to parties. so it has, you know, some connections on the path. well this in particular was a known group. and i know many of the members have been quite open about their beliefs and also how they themselves are radicalized many on social media portals. i believe the pandemic has created plenty of time for that. so poor, let me ask you, you work on radicalization. would this have not been possible with the technological shifts that we've seen?
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well, i think that's an interesting question. i mean, certainly, technology is pretty open to think about the way much. all right. space operates today. but also this is a group that's going to bring in a kind of a longer sense of tradition and also other factors of technology. i think, to think about not least of the ways in which that's changed. our space is like a driven by conspiracy theories as wow, i think as a kind of a cluster, things are important to think about here. you mentioned me is there. so there is a lot of them are around some kind of shadow power structure. secretly controlling government and then how come in conspiracy theories when it comes to radicalize in people across europe? there are a lot of these theories. i think justifications for groups. i have predisposed a position to, to the status quo the way things are and symptomatic of like there are some serious
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problems and some very large changes that have been going on. and i think a lot of these extreme groups, their reactions to things like migrants. we have, i mean, here in germany we had in the ninety's about 8000000 russians arrive and then more recently, during the syria, we had a 1000000 syrians arrive and of course is allows turkish population has been here for a long time. and very recently, you know, the 300000 training and civil rights and so that all creates a background whereby the, the germans, at some point, some of them are asking, what are these foreigners doing here? and i'm very comfortable and, and we're spending money on the mckinney housing to them where we're giving them support. and it's that the populace by on, and the conspiracy theories. i mean, if you, if you look at the agenda of heinous is 13, that talking about the 70, the german of germany has been destroyed. and that's what they want to go back to. it's a sort of return to germany for the germans and the conspiracy series then is to
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just get into the details of how do we get here. and so in hundreds of those cases, talking about states and that, so you know, international forces that are imposing foreign companies on here to make profit. or it may be so focused on things like the migration. and you've also got economic inequality here, which is eating away and people feel like they're being done down and the other people are taking advantage of them. and they come up with theories in order to explain how that works. so, well, this is like a good time to take a bit of a step back from radical groups per se, and, and look at political parties because we have seen a broad shift towards the far right across a number of countries in europe. and i'm curious because you mentioned the white populace, there been a lot of these are described as far right? popular scripts and, and i want to spend a moment on the idea of populism. so it derives from this belief that there is a rift between the people and then some kind of elite who are processing against it and, and then the populace leaders themselves,
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are the defenders of the masses. pull for me, that sounds like it's built on fair. yeah, i mean i think that kind of description of population that is really interesting. i mean one thing to think about is that that part of the pocket as can be found in all forms of fascism as well. which proposed similar ideas that the, the mainstream political systems and that they need to be replaced by something different from the main differences with today's populists is that they operate within the rules of the game, but in a radicalized way. so they don't try to return democracy, but they do push against many aspects of liberalism. so that can be really problematic. and the other thing to think about is the way in which this kind of politics is shifted and become much more normal over the past 20 years or so. when java or even had went presidential campaign, the early 2 thousands. this was internationally reported as something strange,
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very unusual, and it was a very, very significant story and event where maria had made much more successful campaigns for the last couple of fence presidential elections. this is become a normalized situation. so this isn't really talk about being very old or our usual populism of this type become much more accepted. it was in new york in politics. i was the last 20 years and had a variety from things like breakfast in the u. k. through helping to normalize cultures of islamic phobia and so on. and it's also helps bring in languages that used to be much more the view of the very extreme such as the great replacement theory. the idea that europeans are some sort of conspiracy. so this is become much more stop. this is part of the, the mainstream space or politics than it used to be 20 years ago. we'll look at
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some of the drivers that you've. you've mentioned that paul, and just a moment that i feel like it might be worth taking a moment to look at the graphics of the people who are, who are driving the shift. because that gives us a bit of a clue. i was looking at a study that suggests it isn't necessarily deprivation. we've talked a little bit here about the economic situation being a driver, but that it's not necessarily deprivation. that's driving people to vote for far right parties, but more the fear of deprivation, which suggests that they have something to lose. right. elanora, it isn't those who are living in poverty who are voting for these parties. yes, i think if that one of the element that we have to consider is discussed on your by, you know, the working class and the me, the web for. and that's why the reason why it will these be these migrations rhetoric has been raising because people are afraid to lose, you know, the website and pray to lose their cards for light entity. and this, that exactly the point where, you know those far right parties or movements are being things that using,
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you know, properly, rhetoric in the sense that they provide, you know, use the answers to, you know, much bigger problem. it is one of the reason. yeah, the reason is also that it's true that traditional part is unfortunately unable to provide, you know, back to bounces in the sense that you should look at many you can countries right? swing by just like the senator center, right. or center last part is there policies are most of the time, not 3 different. so you know, voters, they don't find, you know, they don't see any difference walking, you know, for the park. you or the other, you know, when he comes to it and do you know, some options, you know, in order to change the situation or to provide solution and you have to have, you have these, you know, the emerging got this movement which are much, much walker which, you know, and put them as close to the people who are suffering because, you know, there you go. so the other element that is off of the news is the big,
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big thing is they should say no, no more people are the victim of the system. they are then outside from the benefits of, you know, it's not me globalization or, you know, everybody's issues. and so, i mean, just said you mentioned you touched on a point that i'd like to dig into a little bit because you suggested that this is a new movement. but a number of these parties like frances national rally, for instance, now called the national rally. they've been around for a long time. it said what 50th anniversary, i believe the said that they were tiny to begin with and they've gradually gained support. they've natalia been very vocal about immigration issues. they talk a little bit about that, but it feels like it goes beyond that tend to more the values question and then let me throw this to you. i'm curious because you alluded to something that when you talk about germany and the idea of sovereignty and all germany, how much has a generational shift contributed to this? i think quite a lot, and i mean germany, berlin, i mean,
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since i've been living in 2003 has changed when i came, you had speak german or, and it spoke english. and over the last 20 years, it's transformed into an international city and everybody speaks english. and moreover, even if you speak germans, they are you in english because there's so many foreigners here. people are starting to invest into it. and the younger generation is sort of bored into that to some extent. but at the same time, this thing of separate sovereignty is still very strong and there's this tension there. i mean, if any we, we cover eastern and central europe and there is even more noticeable that the, the reaction against it, there's a phone line of values, phone line, and to the left of it in traditional you in the west. it's much more liberal and that is democracy and multi cultural tolerance. is prevalent everywhere. however, soon as you go past australia in central europe,
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countries like poland and check the public and hungry. they are based much on orthodox traditional set of values. we're hungry for the hungarians, but it's also about family values that they're almost, you know, university and i'm a phobic. and so people doing a price over the essential year have been done in the balkans even stronger. and this is sort of question by stephanie amongst the young people to because they're looking for a new identity. now that you know there's been these changes and the sickly in central europe. i have now grown, they'd come out of the transmission that was the end of the socialist blog, another quite strong. and i think you're saying people are on the kitchen sky in poland, pushing for this, you know, new hold on this new identity within europe as a european, but they're pushing back against the rest of europe as well. and resisting the
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values because part of the european union project is about 5 years and they've taken the money, but they've rejected the bodies to some extent. and they're selling that to the young people. and the young people are buying it because the previous history is socialist history is meaningless. then i just want to follow up on that cultural thought line. and because i know a number of people have defined this whole class to be against one couch, so to speak, best kind of backlash against that. if we want to turn on that, i know that it feels like there is a constituency of people that perhaps feels that they don't really understand the while they're living anymore. so are people now no longer voting on the economy all day? now? voting on cultural divines seems to be very much, i mean, as a, you know, we cover everything up to and including most going beyond. and the further east you go, the stronger the reaction is against the word culture. if you listen to a person said, you know, he ridicules it actually is a rallying point for the russian, a young russians as well behind him. and he says,
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look at a burden and it's christopher street, gay parade. this is ridiculous. and as there's a lot of sympathy for that view in central eastern europe and then it's about the same thing if not stronger and the, the world culture versus the traditional also works. but then again, when the leaders in check or angry or poland or serbia are sending these ideas to the people that the traditional family orthodox values are very easy. so where is the sort of more work? liberal, multi cultural, multi gender, denominational cultures that much harder cell. rather, it doesn't make much sense to people there. so it's easy. this is one of the reasons i think is driving people. i or bon, who came in by in hungry, came in as a liberal reformer and is now increasingly further, right. you know, to solidify his control. i worked very well. well, we saw
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a shift from la santana left to the right around brack sets in the u. k, that really became a flash point for the right. and i'm curious poll. we had rhetoric then from bias john from about essentially making britain grace again. if we want to use that phrase, is this about trying to distance itself from the values of the european project as we've been talking about? i think the really interesting question. i mean, you know, somebody who kind of used aspects and elements of a populist style of politics with it as well noted on and something that was borrowing. i think it's just about to come the previous disappoint as well around what? well, i think we kind of, as i know that we need to be careful about kind of taking on those kind of binders between what culture, both to the anti will to be honest. i think most people don't live in that kind of
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reality. i think doug identify with either kind of a category most people moderated and i have those rise edition the fall right. on the other hand, really like to play on that sense. but there's often that that's trying to need simplicity either is for understanding the world. so to relate to break said that will to kind of the binary around free from a dominating european project. but as i said, those are kind of messages. but my appealed people, especially in kind of a start pity from social media context and language. but not just to kind of talk about describe the far right but also analyze it, challenge it. and i think we need to say that those categories themselves so simple binders themselves are really actually super problematic. moreover, when you kind of look at why the work of a science is cultured,
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most people don't operate in that kind of sphere anyway. and as media commentators, if we don't find a problem that in itself is a problem. so moving away from binary is let me ask you eleanor, i'm curious how georgia maloney is now viewed, not only in italy, but also by the e u because her party had its roots in fashion of them. but now it's being described as a post fashion party, she professed to support for the e. u has the port name. there is a normalization of the fall, riots happening within european politics then. well, i don't know if there is a know my zation, but the baby of that you know, the, you need to lead to be working to be on this side of the west. and in this specific moment saw of course, this government has been elected. and at the moment this government is not perpetrating any politics which is against you or, you know, nato or the west not ends thought somehow, you know, you're working with maloney on the other hand, maloney is playing, you know,
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and it's sort of normal like no map no, my a the sense that she's being potty trained, she's not making you know, really dangerous situation. when you come for 40 i think you know the main aspect of the government, you know we didn't eat in the sense that shifts raise. you know the migrations rhetorics and yet you know, that we need to protect them. and we need to provide for them to do this. but it's mainly of authority in the sense that when he comes to real options, nothing has really changed much for the moment. so while i wanted to take a moment to look at what might happen in the future, because we've talked about this being driven by the economy and economic crises, and we know that income inequality is rising. that's been a panoramic, there's a war in ukraine. there's an economic crisis, no end inside the migrant crisis is continuing and that's also been a real flash point. presumably then elanora. these parties are going to continue
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making games. well, yes, it depends on how to dish parties will be able to reform themselves and, you know, provide, you know, more complete answers to the people. i think it was one of the problem is that europe is the north continent and your generation has been seeing, you know, so many, you know, shit in the way of living. you not konami cods or whatever. so this is making them those, you know, the group of people and they matching up any change or losing, you know, there was for and those are the ones supporting mostly, you know, anticipation on his movement. but this doesn't mean that in the future, those pocket with the main power, i believe, you know, for the moment since you are living at the moment shipped as national my kids to the national level. i think, you know, the fact that would be put a test, but you know, the shot for them to survive be limited,
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especially because in the case will be back in between the st. additional politics . that is part of the a very interesting to see how this whole pays out and also where the european project goes from here. well, thank you to all of august been our us elanora polly and paul jackson and thank you to for watching. you can see this program again anytime by visiting our website that's out there or dot com. and further discussion do go to our facebook page that facebook dot com forward slash 8 inside story. you can also join the conversation on twitter. handle is add a jayden type story for me to start a whole team here in the what happens in new. 1 york has implications all around the world to make these stories resonate requires talking to everyday people, the mayor of the city, and i was doing away with the curfew that was supposed to get everybody off. it's
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stranger to political rivalries, but what happens from countries notoriously, don't be either i are competing against each other in the world. wow. it brings it, it's huge. fragile delegates lounge here api issue ah, american basketball player brittany grinder is heading home after she was released by russia, the prisoner swap from arms, dina. ah, on carry johnston. this is all to sarah la from day, also coming up with anger in lima. supporters of former president pedro castillo demand his release after he was impeached. and.
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