take a week or a month to put one environmental group says the pollution is costing millions of dollars in lost production. after the crash, local media said officials began studying how to remove the so called ghost ships from the bay. but while they're studying the options, these skeletons are sinking deeper into its muddy waters. and for those sound in the alarm, it's a crisis that needs to be treated with urgency. alexandra buyers, al jazeera, the british fashion designer, dame vivian westwood, has died at the age of $81.00 and a statement on twitter. her fashion house said she died peacefully and surrounded by her family and clap him south london. westwood was one of the leaders of the punk fashion movement of 19 seventies was credited with bringing modern punk and you way fashion into the main street. ah,

this is officer and these are the top stories. now. legendary brazilian footballer pele has died at the age of 82. he been undergoing treatment for colon cancer to south palo hospital is considered by many to be the greatest footballer of all time . warner could not give isn't rio de janeiro with more. his death was a surprise in some ways, but it was also expected arm he had been taken he'd taken to the hospital some weeks ago. he had coven 19. and that are developed into an infect, a lung infection which was being treated for. but what really, ah got him was the cancer that he could no longer fight because the medicine wasn't working any more. the most right wing and religious conservative government in israel's history, has been sworn in the prompting their country's ambassador to france to reside in protest. the coalition will be led by benjamin netanyahu, whose returning for his 6th term is prime minister. russia has launched one of its

biggest missiles strikes on ukraine since the start of the war. ukrainian military says a defense is shot down 54 of 69 rockets launched by russia. far crews have been fighting ablaze that what they call an electricity infrastructure site. in hockey, italy's prime minister says she wants the rest of the european union to follow its lead and bring in mandatory corona virus tests for travelers arriving from china. that's in response to a surgeon new infections that georgia bologna says. the country's new measures may not work if other nations don't follow suit. and china center for disease control has warned that the upcoming new year's celebrations could lead to horizon cases in rural areas. it's chief epidemiologist says a new wave could break out in less populated areas as people travel back to their home towns and the u. n. a chief is set to visit afghanistan in the coming weeks

hoping to meet the taliban over. it's been on the female aid workers. the group of foreign ministers has criticize it's had advance actions, calling them reckless and dangerous. because the headlines, news continues. herron al jazeera, that's after inside story. ah . after weeks of protests, ethics serves in kosovo, agreed to take down the barricades, hope so high that the latest layer of intentions will now come down. the how fragile is the piece with reserves and cost of us? this isn't social ah, with

hello. welcome to the program on the wrong concourse of those uneasy peace has once again come under threat. this time from protest by a think, serbs that lasted weeks in a display of how delicate the situation. is there a single incident? the detention of a former costello so police officer ended up drawing in the u. s. the u and serbia to diffuse a dangerous stand off the form officers arrest lead to spiraling violence with gunfire. arson attacks and ethnic serbs, blocking roads with barricades that are being taken down. but the political barriers remain, does not to the 2 or sutra. from the morning hours, the removal of the barricades will begin. this is not a simple process and can't be done in 2 hours as some have imagined. within 24 to 48 hours, the barricades will be removed, but distrust is not removed. those who are playing with the very existence of serbs and kosovo must know that we will not allow it, not now,

nor in the future. and russell, so that has law from christina. there have been a tremendous pressure from, particularly from the european union and the united states over did the course away . and did the serbian government, he had to, to deescalate the situation here because the concern, the fear among the european companies and viewed by the united states is that russia will be keen to open up a 2nd floor. and after the war in the ukraine to open up a 2nd front of consultation in the heart of europe, and that, that is definitely something that needs the nation. the community is quite concerned off a scene here. so that's why the pressure is ramping up over both governments to deescalate the situation. but the situation still here remain fragile, and any time it cool escalate again. restful said that for inside story, kosovo declared independence from serbia in 2008. that was 10 years after at least

13000 people were killed in the cost of a war, where ethnic albanians fought ethnic serbs and the former yugoslav government the u . s. and most e. u. country is recognized costello's independence. but serbia refuses to cost those membership of the un is blocked by soviet satellite. russia, about 4000 nato peacekeeping. troops remain on the ground after the alliance bond survey and intervened to end the conflict. in 1999, the you began sponsoring talks between the 2 sides in 2013, but they've made little progress. resolving the conflict is one of the main conditions for both countries to join the blog. ah, let's bring in our 3 guess from budapest memos, cuz i really let she's the former deputy prime minister of casa vote, and a current member of parliament from belgrade. helena, even off, she is an associate research fellow at the henry jackson society, anna serbia analyst, and finally from grass florian bieber. he is a professor of south east european history and politics and the director of the

center for south eastern european studies at the university of grass. i will come to you all, i'd like to begin in belgrade with helena even of um, at the heart of all of this. and this is something that flared up from time to time is serbia's refusal to recognize costello as an independent state. one of the barriers to that well, i think, you know, very obviously this is a situation whereby serbia and it's government feel that a part of its territory has unilaterally declared independence. and from belgrade point of view, recognition of costello is just not an option. the 2nd concerned that the serbian government has as well is the safety and security of the serbs who live in the north. and lately they have been communicating that they do not have the confidence that customer authorities will in the protect. the serbs who live in northern castillo, and i think, you know, from customer's point of view, anything but a complete independence is also an acceptable. so we basically have 2 sites with

completely mutually exclusive political aims. mimosa casara lela. why don't you look after the ethnic serbs in the north of the country? why didn't you simply give them the rights that they need? that's what august and bill graders i actually mr. cron. i think the main deficiency here is the lack of principal proper arguments because in cost of their 10 needed to thousands of the majority of serbian population for out of 10 are located in the north of the country. and it's not a matter of not giving them the right their reach, requesting. it's a matter of using them to instrumental lies their policy in the country of possible and constantly in dependent to have the need to be the case in 2010 as being for national court of justice. that there are no violations international law. so the declaration of independence of customer has been in full importance with

international law and also the rights of everyone who lives in customer including albanian, served boston and other minorities is fully legitimate. so what we are facing now is the last mechanism of alexander, which is the president of serbia, to play an interview or interfere in cost of affairs. actually the most important is the state that the recent attacks that have not happened by a 1000000000 possible being a snore institution by, by 30, again, directly orchestrated by we had a lot of properties being damaged. we had cars burn that war as a fine tooth possible that you don't actually obey fusion because we were threatening you. so i think this is the last chain off attempt to actually full cost of all under their direction or intervene possible affairs.

but as we've seen it, it's not been about 1st of all and set them boundary needs to go off of a 3rd living in the north to live their lives in independent possible. as is actually the situation with other steps live on the south part of florida. i'm going to bring you in in just a 2nd, but i would like to get her, helen, as a thought on those comments, are the ethnic serbs being used as a political tool by belgrade? well, you know, as, as i always say in my research, i think politicians across the globe and serbia is not always an exception. here. do play the nationalist card whenever they see it convenient for their political gains. however, the fact that that is sometimes potentially done is not the same as saying that certain concerns that sense in the north might have a not legitimate and you know, one of the things that's always been the most difficult part of negotiation between belgrade and police. dina is the association and it's

a pallet is of the service in, in the north, which is something that they are requiring to do. so i think that i think the situation is a bit more complicated and complex rather than just one side, using sobs from the north for their political gains are let me bring in florian beaver. here florida. is it much more complicated or the only one side using another? well, i mean, it of course is complicated. i mean, i think it's very clear that the prime, you know, responsibility for the escalation we've seen in recent weeks has been the kind of very heavy handed kind of response to cost of was attempting to reduce uniform license plates across the country by belgrade. and encouraging kosovo serbs in the north to respond in a very intense manner. that doesn't mean that there aren't legitimate grievances. i would agree with her and that there are. busy concerns it's not that they don't have the minority rights, the rights are well established. it's just about kind of making a credible offer by the cost of words to chusen sometimes to really incorporate the

serbs to give them a sense that it's also they are state. and this kind of sense of unease is something which, which is playing on is amplifying. and of course, he is controlling it. and we have to keep in mind that the main political party of serbs in the, in cost is basically controlled by belgrade. and so belgrade tells the cause it was served political representatives what to do, including a few weeks ago to withdraw from the institutions of cost of what all that really has been heating of the tension that it goes back to a point which helena was saying earlier, about, you know, is kosovo insistent independence. i mean, that's a normal after 13 years of independence and survey doesn't accept it. but the question is really why i was still in this place after 10 years of dialogue between serbian kosovo, mediated by the european union. why haven't we moved towards a more calmer relations not recognition, but just an environment where those kind of tensions, unimaginable. i think they're the prime responsibility. realize with serbia not

trying to a certain way, calm the atmosphere and moving towards accepting the status quo. it doesn't mean recognition, but it just means accepting the fact that there's a government in kosovo, which acts like a states. as an interesting question, let's ask it to mendoza. casara. lila, why have these talks failed? why have we even not go to a place where you can have an environment for talks actually because the box failed. as i beginning started being at the beginning of this interview. it was not a matter of principles. there was no respect on the agreement. it was always very hard to implement agreement speaking, 1st of all and then the 2nd, it was created a sense that within these 10 years, in the box oper fine. and then as a later time, leslie because there was a different approach of serbia on the grounds versus what it was,

what it was trying to reach in brussels during the past 10 years, we had served yet increasing the number of the military president around the border if possible, we had the situation actually even more money rather than improving in between 200 . in particular when it comes to security and the presence off possibly in terms of what happened in the north. we had the agreement on the region of serbs in the northern me it's about is incarcerated. but then as we've seen, it recently have been directly under the director of which is also in relation to what to be with thing earlier on the representation on that one political party representing parliament. and in other than we've seen that their reaction has not been the representation on representing actually the need of customer, be that in the nor oriented out, but more recognize all of this. so as

a member of parliament in the 2nd turn, i've seen that have never followed there and had raised any our daily lives a 3rd, but mostly had been regarding or intervening about any of the plans that came directly. hello. can you just explain to us what bell grades point of view is why of these talks filed well from belgrade when of you, or at least how the government is arguing. basically they're saying that in the latest months, any attempt to negotiate have failed. because they argue that constable authorities don't seem to be willing to negotiate anymore. it is basically the statement that we can hear about to say almost any time he leaves brussels. and one particular point of condensation has been the association of certain municipalities in northern coastal. and i think, you know, if, if we're going to look at it from an objective point of view, i think one of the big reasons as to why negotiations are not working is because both sides are often resorting to blaming the other side and to not at all looking

at the potential problems that they themselves are posing that that's exactly why i said at the beginning that this picture is way more complicated in serbia, always having its behavior and like at its best, no has service, sometimes frustrated negotiations. most certainly, but has kosovo done the same. absolutely. yes. this is that, that's what i'm saying. i think trying to see this thing from the other side's point of view and trying to stand the other side, grievances might actually be a better way forward when it comes to when it comes to negotiations, memos or get your thoughts or just a 2nd body want to bring in florida and vba, florida. it's very difficult to negotiate anything when there's a massive troop build up on your border as we've seen. happen quite regularly from serbia. is that part of the problem? well, i mean, these true build ups, i'm more bluster. i mean, you know, really, you know, crossover is protected by a nature lead peacekeeping troops for serbia to imagine crossing this boundary or border, you know, this would escalate things survey doesn't want to risk awards nato. so i think this

is not really to be taken seriously. i think much more serious is the fact that serbia has been intervening indirectly into casa, both through it's in are kind of more elicit less visible security structures. but i, you know, i think what, what is really the case and this is, i mean some of the blame needs to go back to the european union. and i would agree with the other. busy both countries have not been implementing all of the commitments they've signed up to. the problem is all of the commitments they've signed up to over the last decade, including the 1st can break through brussels agreement 9 years ago. um are very lacking in detail. so we don't know exactly what did they sign up to and they're kind of more like statements of intent and because they didn't want to kind of commit to a full contract. and so we don't really know who is to blame for non implementation is true that both sides have not lived up to the commitments they have made on paper, but those commitments are very thin. so when helena was talking about the cert municipal association of municipalities, which is supposed to be established,

there's great controversy. whether that's kind of another layer of government, as serbia argues, or whether as constable argues, it's just kind of more informal network of those of those municipalities. and right . both sides are back because the anticipating some talk about the final stages, which would entail some kind of recognition by serbia casa, well, that's why it's hard to move forward. unless you're in listening intently that will florian was saying, do you agree that both sides have actually no implemented the agreements that they were supposed to? absolutely not for the 1st. and the most important fact that the agreement is supposed to be and the discussion and negotiation are normalization of relations between 2 countries evolving in a final recognition and mutual recognition that the 2nd is that has been so much changing within this decade in the dialogue as well, and this is when i initially mention that there are no principal and values because

if it is the principle that 2 countries have to normalize relations and actually discuss about the full normalization that is not about discussing about internal affairs of the other country. if for example, and principal system, if we're talking about the minority, right, c salva, or asking for the association of municipalities of serving. so then we can ask the question back to serbia, are you willing to establish the association of omarian's municipalities in serbia or other minorities is 3rd? yeah. first of all, 2nd, the initial agreement that was signed in 2013 and then re negotiated 2015 with additional layers that was declared against it was the grad actually in violation of our past. had foreseen the association of all pen units, a pallet is off with majority of serbian population to engage or be a part of the association of serbia municipalities. whereas from 2017 to 2020, we had a discussion for the changes of borders. helena, what we're hearing from

a foreign vba is that needs to be some movement in the tools for both sides to get round the table. if you can agree on some things than the other, things don't seem to be that big a deal anymore. and agreements can be made, but having listened to what melissa is saying, you seem to be very, very far away from even the basics. there's no agreements in the near future, right. i would completely agree with that. and i think that is exactly why, for instance, the car registration plays escalated as much as it did. i know that to someone who is not from the region of doesn't follow the context of the region. it might seem a bit even silly that something like her registration phase can escalate to a point in which it did. the problem is that for the 2 sides, this is either seen as giving up sovereignty from serbia's point of view or substantially gaining sovereignty from customer's point of view. and that's the reason why it is so hard to get the deal because any even minor deals, any administrative deals at their bottom at their higher i actually about sovereignty. whether cause was gaining it or whether serbia is losing it,

which is light is extremely, extremely difficult. you come up with a deal that that would work. and when you added the fact that you know that his eyes are more focused on blaming one another than actually trying to find a functional language that just yet another level of obstacles for reaching a function vo, between the site. florian, we're talking about 2 very young states here, both of them that fought a battle fur national identity off of the breakup of former yugoslavia. all of that has to play into this, right. it's about national identity serenity. as helena says, indeed it is, but you know, 10 years ago it looked a lot more promising that these things would become less front and center of the process. i mean, the, you really put the incentive for both to move beyond on the table by saying if you come to a settlement, membership is more likely you're going to join the union. and this is really where the whole thing has been stumbling attraction of joining the european union, much less they are than it was a decade ago, especially in serbia. there's barely

a majority vote favor of joining the you and the government has been cut deliberately down, playing the attractiveness of your membership and the duties on part. and that really undermines this whole, the sort of way to transform does not into a 0 or a 0 sum game into something where actually both parties stand to win. and this is really where, where things are stuck in many ways without an offer for both, especially for serbia, which can live with the state of school, much better than coastal can. there's really no way of moving things out of it. and let's keep in mind the current conflict is all triggered by the fact that germany and france put a proposal on the table, which would normalize relations without serbia recognizing causal. and it's really in response to this proposal that things have escalated to his large weak degree because serbia has no interest in this proposal because this would actually kind of reduce tensions and would not allow it for the serbian government to use it for domestic purposes. and this is, you know,

the main kind of immediate trigger which brought this escalation about in recent months. now most of what flooring be best seems to be saying is that it's one of the big incentives. the piece is a european union membership, and certainly in serbia that's known as popular as perhaps a once was in an even in causal. and that's maybe not as popular as it once was. so what is the incentive full piece for you guys? is very important actually to focus on day right off the communities in including serving community. i think with the sorry package that was presented right? that ration of independence in the rights of minorities. so are definitely much more advanced than maybe in some of the countries. and if we are focusing on implementing those right and called grading and include increasing the dialogue between a situation and they're being community living in the 4 north municipalities. i think this is the a major improvement actually,

but it puts customer internal affairs. whereas in relation to serbia, i think just the matter of applicable international law. the same as it was with the ruler of international court of justice. that was independence did not violate international law. this should be a good ground. and we're talking about here, serbia, that is a country that has a status of candid country for the european union. and i think it has to be more advanced. definitely in actually reflecting on the principles and values and the rights of communities in serbia or other majorities, either mine or just shoot me a time. and it's a very interesting point you make. i do want to bring it up with helena. i mean, there is a law of diminishing returns here. the has had a role for 10 years. however, it seems to get weaker every stage of negotiation over the stage. now, where the role is just simply unhelpful. well,

i wouldn't say that it is unhelpful. i think the international community presence is something that is often crucial for the escalating any tensions as we've seen in the last few days. and as we've seen in the summer. i also think that the international community involvement in general is serving is a very good turns for both sides not to overly escalade. so i wouldn't say that it's not helpful. what i would say, however, is that it's leverage and its ability to respond effectively or to really influence the relevant actors is decreasing over the years. partly because the confidence, at least on service from service point of view, the confidence that somebody will ever really joined to block is incredibly low because the negotiations have been dragging on. and you know, that's, that's what i think is actually the case with foreign lever. if moscow simply turned around and said, ok, you guys make peace, peace would happen, right? well, i don't think so. i mean, you know, service pursuing its own interest, its own agenda. it's not, not really. you know, it's, it's looking for protection from russia when it comes to your membership of kosovo,

but services on actor has its own interest. and it's going to do what, you know, especially the current government. we have to also distinguish between society at large and the government. the government has a particular agenda that's keeping the status quo because it's also domestically. we have to keep in mind, serbia has becoming less democratic over the last decade. it's been the government of which has been really, really downgrading media freedoms independent institutions. and so to sort of the way the cost of a conflict helps him to distract from this issue. and so from that point of view, he does what he sees in his best interest, no matter what you know, other actors might say, melissa, what do you think of that? would you think the of the idea actually russia doesn't have that much of a role to play? and so anyway, i know you've been critical of those things before. well, actually i share a different opinion. i think there is a major role of serbia. however, considering the recent events in particular of young promote a freshman,

there were a good way and actually a statement on dividing itself from that in the sense yes, now and be international or in b r a is not a very beneficial point. when it comes to the question, i think there is been focus in general actually right over the events of 99. so be a last were and then find today in a dialogue something that is lost during the war. and that is very destructive in itself because you are not thinking about the piece and you're not thinking regardless of what they're saying, you're not in the normalization, but you're thinking of how you actually can switch. the reality that happened in the ground that had been developed on in recent years, including the declaration of independence, b, b, i guess. but you're actually, i claim everything as big as you would be possible with

and with actually b, a have been in position out. i want to thank all our guests, missouri casara, lila, helena, even off and florian beaver. and i want to thank you as well for watching. now you can see the program again any time by this thing. i was like, i was there a dot com for further discussion. go to a facebook page, that's facebook dot com, forward slash asia inside story. and you can also join the conversation on twitter . handle is at asia in touch story. for me, i'm wrong on the whole team here. ah ah. and

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