sing a record extending 10th australian open title. he took it 6 to ah, and despite a little bit of resistance in the 3rd joke, which sore off his russian opponent with the little trouble. he took the set 64 for the match, and head into the semi having dropped just one fit all tournament. i think there's this cor line in the 1st 2 sets doesn't speak the truth or the reality of the, of the matcher. and i was some, some really close games. honda is a great upon and is a great player, have tons of respects for him job which is now just to in the way of equalling rough l adult record of 22 grand slam titles. so he'll ma leaks al jazeera ah, they're watching al jazeera. these are the headlines this our europe's quarter of

human rights has announced it will hear a case against russia. the downing of flight mh 17 in 2014. the netherlands submitted the complaint to 198 people on the malaysia airlines flight were killed when i was shot down by a russian made me some. it was flying from amsterdam to cologne, palm. germany has finally grades this and it's less than 2 tanks to ukraine, and berlin will deliver 14 of the combat vehicles from his existing stock. and it's also allowing patent countries to send german tanks from their us and to ukraine. this. this is chris dish. does it up just him? we support ukrainian coordination with our international partners financially with humanitarian means and also with the supply of weapons. and we can see that in europe, we and britain are the countries that have support ukraine with arms. the most germany will always be in the forefront when it comes to supporting ukraine. we are the country that does it with the greatest energy and on the large scale. and

president, let me the landscape price a decision by the gym and chancellor dressing once again, ukraine's gratitude for the release of the tanks. south africa's main opposition party is held rallies against power cots and electricity prices. grace. most households go without power for at least 6 hours a day. for people in bangladesh facing their own energy crisis with fuel costs and power cuts increasing. the main opposition party called for nationwide rallies to demand the action on the store in cost of living. it was prime minister, shake has seen into resign and a k. take a government to take over until elections are held where she's so next there's no issue was raised during the appointment process of conservative party chair. not him as a housing snack, ordered and independent inquiry after it emerged that we agreed to pay millions of dollars in back taxes and penalties. and lebanon's top prosecutor has ordered all suspects detained. over the 2020 barrow pope,

lost to be released more than 200 people were killed when chemicals stockton, a warehouse called fire, causing the explosion. the prosecutor has also filed charges against the judge or the said mccain's. all right, those are the headlines. i'm emily angle in the news continues here on al jazeera after the stream. they stay with us. the american people as spoken. what exactly did they say, is the world looking for a whole new border with less america in it? is the woke agenda on the decline in america. how much is social media companies know about you? and how easy is it to manipulate the quizzical look us politics, the bottom line with hello and welcome to the stream i manage aberdeen on today's show. why are women still so poorly represented in news media? take a look at this statistic. in 2020 women were featured as the subject and sources of

news stories only 25 percent of the time. and that figure was found in the latest analysis of more than $30000.00 stories around the world in tv, radio, print, and online sources. so what happens when women's perspectives are left out of the news and how does it fit into the bigger picture of gender equality? well, you can join in on this conversation with your comments and questions via our live you to chat with dan. here with us to talk about how women are seen and heard in the media in perth, australia, katherine shine a senior lecture in journalism at kurt and university in nairobi, sarah materia, global coordinator at global media monitoring project, and in new castle in the u. k. we have karen ross, professor of gender and media studies at new castle university. ok ladies,

i'm so glad that you're with us and you know, just to address sort of the elephant in the room. it just so happens that this show topic happens when our usual host, who has phemie, okay, of course. who is it woman unlike me, should usually be in this chair instead of me. so, you know, we're mindful of that. i can promise you, there won't be any mans planing because you are the experts. so we're here to hear from you. let's get straight to it. i want to ask you, i'm sarah. you know, we heard that that statistic, 25 percent of the time immune. how would you underline or highlight the real problem when it comes to representation for women in media? well, the problem of linda representation of women in mainstream news content will most likely be with us for the next 3 to 4 generations. so we're not going to see a parity in our lifetime. and in fact, her, what we have seen over time is that the piece of progress towards gender equality

has remained vaguely show the needle towards gender period. he has moved on the 8 points in 25 years. so really i the problem has persisted and has remained stubborn over time. and i just like to see if this thing better. but in fact, the probability of i irp is in taisha and of visibility in the news is even slimmer for women who are, who come from minority, magical as groups, such as racialized in men, migrant women and older women. and mit perhaps i can give an example. yeah. yeah, please agree that a please give us give an exam yes. in the u. k. for it, for instance, the likelihood of under presentation more than doubles for ethnic minority women in comparison to white british women. no, i appreciate you giving us that example because you know, this is not just about, you know, one aspect, but things can tend to be compounded when it comes to women, minorities, as you've mentioned, i see that as you were speaking. i. catherine was nodding,

so i just want to give her a chance sarah, to jump in here. catherine, what did you make of how sarah sorta framed this issue. this problem i saw you were nodding and i want to know, you know, when we talk about inclusion and then representation, those are 2 separate issues. a why are they important to discuss we, we need to those statistics that the g m m p has highlighted so consistently over time showed that women are under represented. and that is, that is a huge part of the problem. but the way that women are included in the news is also very important say, including minority groups, including marginalized perspectives, is really important, but also trying to avoid the stereotypes that often come with, including women in the news say, including women and always referencing them as mothers for example, mainly including women to a personal opinion instead of as authority figures. i'm karen you, you know when you this and then on what, what's been said so far. i'm curious,

you've been working on this for many years, and i know that you frame it as marginalization as well as stereotyping when we kind of outline the main issues. why those 2? i think that's a done. let me give a, a couple of examples. while i'm the walk i'm doing at the moment is looking at women oh, to women within the media workforce who have been maneuvered out of of that jobs because of well for, for a variety of reasons. none of which ought to do with that competence of the professionalism. so i would totally agree with, with the point that kind of sarah's been making. and in terms of the, you know, we have to take a much more into sectional approach is not just about women, it's about be a women with particular characteristics. and indeed, you know that there's also issues about older people more generally being seen, both in, in front and behind, that the camera and in terms of nice rooms and, and representation. but the point about juxtaposing marginalisation with

stereotyping is that it's, if you're doing research around kind of gender media, it's actually quite difficult to try and, and analyze an absence. in the absence of women, you can only really look at where women are present to where women present. they tend to be exactly as katherine's mentioned. you know, they are often seen as people who will give expert who give a public, a personal opinion be, you know, part of, you know, the, the, the public. we don't see women as experts. and again, just thinking about co fade. you know, we know that kind of. 1 house has been seen very much, is a domain of women. however, if i think about the u. k. news media and i, i guess it's the same everywhere else where you would expect more women's voice is to come in as expert within a kind of health context light cove. it, we just didn't see that, you know, and when we, when we looked at the g, m, p, in the last, the, the last iteration which was in 2020 right. in the middle of the pandemic. we,

we looked specifically at cove at 19 stories as opposed to yet more general new stories. and again, we just saw it. we see the same patterns repeated. and the question we have to all surely is why is that? is it? let me have nothing to say right, because women are not expert and the opposite to both. those questions is no, no, of course it's not. and then, you know, that's why we're discussing this issue. and because you brought up the corona virus, i want to get to some of the comments that are coming in on youtube in a moment. but before we do, sarah, when we talk about the corona virus and use coverage specifically of the pandemic, we know that it skewed heavily to mail experts. i think it was what one 3rd. yeah. one 3rd of sources quoted about the cove in 1000 pandemic were women. i mean only one 3rd. and i'm wondering, you know, what, what does that actually mean? i mean, you know, it why, what is contributing to the problem? is it, are you, are we able to identify sort of the 2 biggest factors in your mind,

sarah? well actually it's interesting because, and we found that, oh, well i for the longest time that we have been analyzing the science and health stories they've, i, they've always been at the back of the news agenda, occupying about 70 percent of all the topics in the news but to the corporate maintain health crisis. ah, the proportion of stories doubled, 17 percent of the news agenda. and as a, as a news becomes more important gain salience. oh, we've faith that to women, i been relegated to their margins as, as the people who are subjects or the news or sources of news, which is pretty interesting. i've been there to know withheld. yes, i'm sorry. i'm only interjecting to say, it's maybe not surprising, but it's astonishing that, you know, there's that correlation where, you know,

when women's visibility before sort of the attention of, of the pandemic on how they were hire more visible. and then once it became popular, all of a sudden they were less miserable visible what's, what's, what's driving now? it's interesting, it seems, lay, cur, you know, as stories become important and on the news agenda. busy women, when you are the other, the, they tend to be really guitar to the margins, and i bet only it's, it's hard to explain that. a, for example, i doing the health cray sees it is women who are the caregivers or women who are present in a, in trying to mitigate the impact of depending on the elderly, on children, on, on the, on general populations. yet when the news reporters us was forcing for x by the opinion. so women, why?

i think out about half of like 26 percent of, of those were interviewed as experts who are present as sources here in as health specialist to our women. and when you look at the real world statistics, almost 50 percent of those who work in health care, right? are women? well, so it is really a finishing to find. yeah. that, that, that disparity certainly invites a lot more questions are one of those. i'll put you karen, i mean, in the u. k. i remember anecdotally that the briefings were largely delivered by men, even though, as we just heard from sarah, you know, i'm sure there were excellent qualified women in the field doing a lot of the work. why is that the case in your experience, anecdotally, and why is such a little progress progress been made? well, i mean, not even anecdotally, i mean the, those there's, there's 3rd evidence to, to show that and even, you know, meet your organization's themselves. mean the guardian did a really interesting piece of work and a couple of other kinds of news news. jameson, towards out on this,

something similar in terms of looking at where women appeared in those cobit briefings, which were regular over at the very long period. and the over overall, i think that, you know, at least one study looked at something like, you know, briefings over 9 months in a very few women. now arguably, it's not because that want really in a x, but women, jenny harry's for, for example, who was a key person who did actually appear occasionally to kind of go to be part of the, the, the, that the panel of 3, which is what we, we tend to get in the u. k. so it's not that that women were entirely absent but where you expected women to be talking and briefing the public that rest really it was very scarcely visible. however, on the other hand, other kind of media organization other countries in particular, if i just think about new zealand, new zealand in particular were much more proactive in putting women in front of the,

the public glassware or other countries on the, on the, on the grounds that, you know, it's, if we think about women's communication style, particularly during cove, it, there is a, not necessarily cut, a gentler stop, a different scholar style about she commuting health messages. right. so it, a lot of the research would suggest that where that did happen, that was much more that, that the public, the citizens, you know, who were being addressed by. ready bees arguably, slightly better communicators actually understood more about kobe and the, or how that, how the bars was working. right. but, you know, but part it just, it get but to your question, like, why, why do we get what we get me? one of the reasons i would suggest, and i can say this because i'm a media academic, i don't look in a newsroom. it seems to me that partly it's because it's much easier to go to the usual suspects for. and if you already, as a journalist, if you already have

a really good relationship with a particular set of experts, with particular such a politicians, you are going to go to those people. and so if we think about it might even be unconscious bias or just habit forming behavior as you're saying, you know, i mean, i think so much of human behavior and i'm not trying to just dismiss it that there's no massage involved or what have you. but yeah, i think it could be just a product of habit, couldn't not. but hockman, i mean, i would just so he just let me just even though i mean i, i would say, unless they saw enough this phrase i'm conscious bus. because for me, my experience anecdotal or otherwise is most of these, but is there anything but i can try in some ways we use this term, but we should just be say, is conscious, right? there is miss such a good, almost every sex, it's various races. so it's almost as if, when you say unconscious bias like you're, you're giving people a pass, if you will, said to perpetuate you're, you're totally and you're chunky during that, which isn't to say that there isn't unconscious bias. you know, clearly, you know, they're all sorts of ways in which we're operating, which all, you know, part of

a kind of cultural dna. i'm not, not, not signed up, but i am saying that yeah, it's not like you don't know that you're going to a mad to out yet again. yes. and not the man here spouting on. yes, yes, another which isn't to say that they don't have interesting things to cite, but wouldn't it be so much more interesting to have a range perspectives from a grass the right, you know, the spectrum of humanity, right. and i think, you know, often in the media, i forget me sir. i just want to jump in here with it with a small anecdote. i mean, for a long time i've said, you know, when discussing the media, the democratization and media, which, which hasn't fully sort of self actualize, if you will, that, you know, there was a time when the only voice is deemed to be sort of authoritative. incredible. we're older white men, and i think those legacies take a long time as we're witnessing to change, let alone completely be equalized. i do want to mention no, if i well sir, i'll put this to you. i was going to go to catherine. but so many people in our

youtube channel, i mean talking about bias and talking about this, but it's straight to you, i mean said saying the question is when will women be satisfied when they abolish men? completely from the conversation. and then we have maybe a slightly more useful question from our, of a k o, 988 saying how can you say women are under represented in media when there are literal quotas and incentives to hire women? they replaced casts and movies with women, even though the films perform poor. so needless to say, there is a lot of sort of massage and i for lack of a better word and our comment section, i don't know thera, do you wanna address those comments before i come to you, catherine? oh, well well i can t at this sir. and it, is that a, to a large extent or to some extent, you can see that the issue is socialization. carrion alluded to the issue of culture. and in many cultures is particularly in the globe without context. mean many cultures. oh, women are socialized,

girls and women as lazed are not to be present in the public eye in the public domain. true. and therefore it becomes the, you know, even more difficult for them to, to be present to be visible. but these and on us here on news organizations are newsrooms to make the effort to go out and find this women and get them to, to speak. you know, one thing that we found in our research is that for the 1st time in since 1995, there was a jump in the proportion of vo women who were thought for expert opinion between 20152020. and that could be perhaps because there, oh there, you know, news organizations have taken this critique on board. and there have been some, some have taken this on board. and, and there have been a much rooming of, of various initiatives to create directories of women experts. so perhaps it could

be, well, you know, one of the reasons that we found that her, that jump. sure, sure. and let's jump to another expert armor. catherine, i wanna put this to you. i mean, i don't know if you want to comment on some of those comments in the youtube chat. maybe maybe it's not bad and productive to do so. but i do want to ask you specifically, i mean, our women then, you know, we talk about socialization. our women then less likely to see themselves as experts less likely to want to be interviewed on t v. how does that sort of play into this on, you know, i know there's already been such an erosion of trust when we talk about the news media in general. so how does that work in it, in an internalized sense? well, i think the most interesting thing that i found from my research is that overall there is a very high degree of willingness to be interviewed with the women that i have interviewed myself or are done through c o. m got their opinions, re survey research. so i don't,

i actually don't think willingness is so much of an issue. i do think that up with lots of women ah, lack the confidence that men sometimes do have a nervousness. is a factor. and so generalist, i think need to be aware of that. and women do have some reservations about up appearing in the news and some of those reservations, i think a justified. and so i think it's really important that journalists are aware of those things and really try to mitigate them and make the, the whole experience as positive as it can. they, i think the, the, the initial approach for an interview is really, really crucial. and part of that is sort of d, mystifying, the whole process explaining exactly what the interview entails, what sort of information the, the generalist is looking for. so sort of, i'm sort of taking the perspective source through the in me step by step can be really helpful and i'm giving out and i think if you give women a 2 women

a chance they are, they do want the opportunity to speak. they want the sort of the, the validation and the credibility that comes with that. and i, they did their bit mean i'm, i'm really shocked at some of the responses that you're getting on you in a 3 are you change the, when you look at the statistics, they say it's like clear that women are under represented. this is, this is obviously a problem that needs to be addressed. and why shouldn't women's voices being well, i mean, i don't want to, sorry, i do. and i also share, you know, there are some other comments like santa yes me and saying women's lack of representation. and media basically means the exclusion of half of the population. and it's obvious. and in order to develop a country, it is important to include them. we also have people who are saying, you know, that we need to be focusing on this in the arab world. see less, larson saying al jazeera must turn its critical lens on the arab world. more often that there's great disparity there on this issue. i think it's just important for

giving me catherine, for interjecting but i do want to just frame, you know, women in conflict zones or what have you. i mean, it can be tricky. you know, for some women in certain cultures, there is this association for better or worse. this pressure that you must be modest, you must not speak. i garner a lot of public attention. i mean, these are pockets of the worlds, not the whole world, but you know, so culture obviously plays a role as well. and i'm wondering sarah, if newsrooms continue with this business as usual, what's the real fear in your mind? just to put it briefly? well, as for sure, i think the, there's going to been erosion, a continued erosion of trusting journalism at the moment. we know that journalism is in crisis. we have heard about media organizations closing, or we've heard about her many cutbacks in, in, in newsrooms. and that erosion of trust or lead. so the groups that are making a leis 2 are found the only dog and asians at the margins. oh,

which is really not what we want, right? we, you know, we all need to belong to the mainstream. and we need to, we need to have a media that are participate at peers. it's role in building a democratic society, right. you know, in being a pillar of democracy in, in and ensuring that all voices are heard. and i, and i see that sarah, or forgive me, sorry, karen that you were nodding as sarah was making that point there. i do want to share with you that we have a youtube common coming in from janine saying media, especially as prejudice against older women in media. we spoke about earlier. if you're a minority. yeah. and a woman, and it's compounded as well as for the elderly before i come to you, sir, for you me, karen? to answer the question. i do wanna include one more women's voice may be familiar to those of you who watch the show. it is none other than family. she sent us this video common. take a listen. please change a parenting portion to us at the stream. i think the question should be,

why is it not as important to every media organization? we what town several years ago that if we are not representing half of the humans in the world, we are not doing a good job, is that every time we sit down, do a show. we ought to see where the women in that conversation, what expertise can they bring to us on the street? and sometimes you will see more within the men. we are balancing out the universe. it is a mission that we are so proud to be on and it is never over. you can never sit back and think we did it this year. we'll do it again next year. we have to keep checking. but the importance of this is not just to represent women, but once you start to look at under represented groups in the media, you thought see many other communities who also need that platform and what she stops. you can't stop. and it should be noted that, you know, there are in 202260.74 percent of gas on the stream were women. that's up from

54.9 percent in 2021. we've exceeded our gender balance goal for the 5th year in a row. and just so, you know, if you go back few years in 2018, we've made a public pledge to never finish a year without at least 50 percent women guests. and it's not just family who is usually the host of the show. but many women who work behind the scenes tirelessly to put the show together and, and you know, i wonder karen are watching some of the questions that from you was asking. what comes to your mind? i mean, looking forward, where are the solutions, what should be done to bridge this gap? okay, so, i mean, i, i love what i me saying and you know, well done elders is the stream of for, you know, being, being in the fun god. i mean, following on in some ways, teed bbc's efforts with a 5050 project, which again they that starts in 2017 doing media monitoring around gender. an us by me says, now they're looking at other kind of us. but so looking at disability,

the looking at close in that they're looking at minority other racialized minorities. so media organizations are doing things. but can i just say that one of the, the key area that we really need to kind of focus on the gen listened students. because what if we can actually encourage our students to think about issues around equality and, and sexuality while they are still journal journalism students. while they're still developing that croft before they become, you know, get, get into a new east room and necessarily become a acculturated to the norms of that particular newsroom. if we can get them thinking about what, how they want to be job is what, what their kind of moral or ethical code is and get the right thinking about these things. now while the students and just to say again, if i don't think about my own student, my own students at nico, so university, very great. we were running out of time. i've been working. when i say is that we

have been working with the bbc's, 5050 projects, and the more that we could make that into face between jonas and students and nice rooms, we might have some hope of producing jun generations of john that for who actually this is part of that didn't have a parent, i'm gonna have to cut you off there, but that is certainly an aspiration. that is a good way to end this. so this conversation one that's going to continue here at the stream. that's all the time we have for today. i do want to thank all of our guests today. sarah, catherine, i'm karen for joining us. any more conversations here at the scene? ah, ah. a tough time. the man

tough question is. what exactly are you asking for you? what the troops on the ground, the rigorous debate we challenge conventional wisdom racism is so deeply entrenched in the country that it's identified with america. so when you challenge racism, it looks as if you're challenging americans and demand the truth. there's no serious discussion about this because it goes to the very root of who we are up front with me, mark lamb on hill. what, how does it, how do you think controlled information? most school is one of them, both from bay and the case in the world. it has an incredible they feel, recognition technology. how does the narrative improve public opinion better? no. want that as well. how is the ticket in gym they can leave flaming during the video spread like wildfire, they denied the platform or in your brain. the listening close dissects the media. we don't cover the news. we cover the way the news is covered. once a month,

social workers pay michelle night visit her. michelle is a single mother struggling to get by on a meagre income in one of the world's most expensive cities. she can barely afford the basics for her and up to stick daughter since the start of the coven 19 pandemic. there's been a big rise, and people seeking relief for charity workers. it's been particularly demanding. 28 percent of social workers quit that job in the last year. many of them left the city altogether. strict on them, it cuts and political uncertainty many relying to help find it difficult to get the support they ah. ready ah.