copper taste at the bottom, or active, whether spelling out of afghanistan reinstate in the snow here, but she for pakistan, it's norm india. ah. 1956 to nicea gain, independence from france. but the brutal power struggle broke out between the b to this is monica. and the countries nationalist prime minister al jazeera world, tells the story of the downfall of the dentist. you folded the paper and read to him the decision issue. the last monarch of tunisia, power and politics on a georgina, syria is struggling to respond to the earthquakes disaster. but how much of that is down to politics? the regime in damascus insists that it should control aid and rescue efforts. but as it's on the international sanctions, boycott sport that hamper aid reaching that stated areas. this is inside story.

ah her welcome to the program. i'm adrian finnegan. they all the was earthquakes to hit turkey and syria and decades. seems of devastation have emerged on both sides of the border with thousands of people dead rescue teams, a working round the clock to find survivors. humanitarian assistance is essential, particularly in northern syria. but our politics hindering the response. al jazeera cartier, lopez, hot ion reports. years of conflict and now earthquakes. the challenge of delivering aid to northern syria is now even tougher. i had a i knew i learned while you in

a way we had grown accustomed to war. but this earthquake happened all of a sudden i wish we were very, very scared. we got frightened with years of conflict, but this was different. just horrific man. i own a gentleman that much of this region includes reveled health areas of badly affected by years of conflict. and separating politics from international aid is difficult it would be quite ironic, ah, if not even counterproductive for us to reach out to a government that is brutalized, its people over the course of a dozen years now. instead, we have humanitarian partners on the ground who can provide the type of assistance in the aftermath of these tragic earthquakes. resources are limited and rounds used by the united nations to transport aid from truck. here to syria have been disrupted. and the situation here as handled as being handled by the government.

but as we know, the governments capacity is very limited in terms of fir eskew t. as in terms of fir equipments, still, many people are under durable and the government has very little capacity. humanitarian groups are calling for us sanctions to be temporarily lifted to ease the delivery of aid and encourage countries to help a message echoed by serious government. so even those countries who want to send you many tarion assistance, they cannot use the aeroplane cargo because of the sanctions. syrian president, bashar on a son has been accused of withholding aid and services from rebels held areas to punish the opposition fight with a major response needed to cope with such a wide spread disaster. humanitarian groups are calling for politics to be set aside. both at home and abroad. patty ella,

pistol again for in saint story. ah, let's bring in our guests for today's discussion from ankara were joined by emma cosette, his associate professor at hassan kali's uncle university and from brussels. we have, i said i'd she who is executive director of beta syria. that's a non governmental organization that provides grants for development projects in syria and from norman, oklahoma, joshua landers, director of the center for middle east studies at the university of oklahoma. gentlemen, welcome to you while i'm at that start with you, syria. then as we heard says that it should control the delivery of aid into all of syria. it doesn't recognize the non governmental organizations working in the north northwest is syria playing politics with aid her. to, to be honest, a man we are talking about syria, you know, at least a da com pres,

already. if you write it into 3 sections and different powers are controlling each section in the north eastern part, we have the peacock i p p k, k, p i v y p g, a courtesy blues area and it yeah, at the center at damascus through our nipple and mediterranean area we have the regime forces and on the north western part, under the turkish influence we have the opposition forces at a serious elevation government. so in each area they have different difficulties after the earthquake, but the most effective areas are especially under the regime control. and under the salvation side, insulation going in control because the losses concentrate in those 2. those 2 regions. for example, under the northwestern part, under a salvation government, i think the debt to all of the people reached to more than 1280 and on the regime

concur on this 1250. so different administrations, different political powers make this creation a little bit more difficult, but this college and why it may give it peg. you pay to need political advances in the region for the unitary structure of deciding and maybe for the future we will see what the situation is cosmetic. and the 1st thing to be conducted by the international community and united nations should be to focus on the military and 8 in all the regions with and yours and international organizations. all of them i want to region as one of them's, i'm sorry to interrupt you. how can you and do that if, if serious government though insists that all of the 8 to limit to syria has to go through it for 4 door regime park, there might be some difficulties, but i think for the opposition, but it will not be a problem because already there are international organizations,

they're working in that regions. and so i think the negotiations should be given as some i let say, where they should be concentrate on coming together and finding solutions. because today is not the day for political poverty class to day. the humans are a really a new day they need the basic needs shelter because of the into conditions or the amana terry. and fooled lord or every kind of thing. and that should be the 1st thing that the all word should concentrate on that the political clash that demand, i said, does the syrian government, still a pariah and much of the international community. and under u. s. and e, u, the sanctions doesn't have any role to play in the distribution of aid to rebel held areas of the country. if it accepts offers of assistance. what measures could or perhaps should be put into place to ensure that that aid reaches its intended

recipients? well if i'm, if i may thank you for having me if i may start very quickly by side. but no matter what the syrian government say's the you, i am has a mandate to deliver humanitarian aid to the northwest. so yeah, as the cross border solution was just renewed in january and has a mandate to do that until the end of june. so there is a clear mandate for the us to be able to do that with their own government. and so whatever ones what we really need though the moment is not only equipment and material, but he's actually international rescue teams. and i here want to salute egyptian lab already sent the 1st international rescue team into jan dennis and d. i was under control of the position, but the international rescue teams are needed. it all affected areas for that.

there might be a need to coordinate with a certain government. but i think the main after there would be this here in our bed questions, and they should be the luck of the international community, not the government in damascus. and through, sorry, i say international rescue teams can make their way into my little city, which are the most affected areas and measure in government control. now the challenge professor, i was mentioned is 4 areas under control of the salvation. so do go into the particularities over the northwest, this area. it's not really one area to areas greater lab that is under control of this, this elevation government, which is an h t s punch of government. and the areas under directors control which are controlled by these julian and government, that is, that from the to the position. so for our areas wanted direct control. it took us

government aid is not really a problem, as we do not have to deal with terrorist organizations for it lead that is a challenge. we need it. we need immediate solutions for that because 2 of the largest cities and in the north west of se art and the province mainly highland in. those are the 2 most effected as cities and the greater province. they can easily access through the bible, our cross bible, our crossing is the authorized crossing by the un mechanism. so everything is in place for an international response. now remains to be seen how we can allow for the international rescue teams to go and and for equipment to be there, as well as making, making sure that the road is in good shape to be as, as,

have. now i said that that back crossing is remains closed, doesn't it? to do to the damage to the infrastructure, the, the crossings open. ok, good, the, the, the crossings open just to be the crossings open. there are small logistical challenges on the road from the hub to the border crossing because of the destruction around re handler, which is a bit to the north of the border cross. and it should be fully functional by the end of the day. and it took a government has made babs dilemma and border crossings. agenda for, for your major and 8. so at the moment we have 3 border crossings that are open. one is opertitional, which is bubble. how, which is the main un otherwise border crossing. but there are 2 generator border crossings that are fully functional, easily accessible, and these are above slammer and border crossing. just relentless,

90 percent of people in northern syria were already dependent upon humanitarian aid before this, quite a natural disaster on this scale could not have hit a more vulnerable population, not as we heard it. it's difficult at the moment for a while, not a single root was, was open for aid, but as i said, just told us, at least now that that one crossing is open. time is of the essence, people a dying. what should be done? a by whom, as our fellow humans suffer. surely now is the time to put politics aside, isn't it? it is attained to put politics aside and this may offer a chance for some kind of boost and change of policy. you asked in the beginning of your thing about whether people are playing politics with this. and of course they are, you know, every one of these 3 areas that are controlled by different governments and different regimes are,

are playing politics with food. the united states has put very severe sanctions on syria. it's impossible to send money into loved ones, through banks, all of the bank and codes shift codes have been blocked. the united states controls all of syria's oil and is trying to make sure that no way gets to syria. that means that machines can run and outside is doing the same thing that rebel control areas . he's, he, he wants to control what food gets to the rebels and, and it's the same with the rebels and the a company, it's a rebel area. so this is, it's time for politics to be put aside. and i think that the international community needs to rush aid in to all 3 of these on plates, particularly the northwest rabble controlled area and assyrian area. because a lot of a lotto han regions have been demonstrated by own my own in laws who live in the latter key area. numerous buildings around there's has have collapsed and now and

that's true for change throughout the region. so they need aid desperately. joshua the u. s. s has ruled out delivering aid via the syrian government. as we heard of the beginning of the program, us state department spokesman net price said it would be ironic if not even counterproductive for us to reach out to a government that us brutalized. its people over the course of a 1000 years now, is that the right attitude given the situation? how will okay, well, how will the us get 8 to the us? she's not going to get hate into this area. you know that they're going to get agents in north, east and west, and that's fine. the point is that the international community america can sit aside on this. but the arab governments, we've seen egypt reach out ccs reached out to the syrian government. the steering government is going to be involved in this one way or the other can through the red cross, the red cross is working within the syrian, the steering government control part. so as i read question,

those are 2 action agencies that can deliver aid. and can, you know, if the united states can deliver aid to those agencies, then they don't have to go through the government directly. of course, the covenants involved in delivering trucks and delivering aid in the military is going and digging people out. the syrian government is not, is, is trying to respond to this course. the spotlight is on the government. can it be effective? and syrians are in despair because their government has been so ineffective that the, the national budget of syria this year is about $3000000000.00. which is you know, the reconstruction of syria. it needs needs tens of billions of dollars, and the government is not in any shape way, shape a capable of carrying out the aid that needs to be taken out and it needs to be delivered in this area. we'll come back to this point in

a few minutes. joshua took here also, of course, badly affected by the sort of quick, it's understandably focused on it's on its own citizens right now. but to what extent does it hold the key to, to access to, to, to northern syria, even though the roads on, on both sides of the border at the moment of a very badly damaged actually it today or we have and i say ready, we close connection with deep and temporary administration system, not rest of the sites are under the target implants. so a day are a very a, let's say, a connected to the touch administration system and they are working in cooperation with them. but just to give an idea, proud audience and diverse kits scenario in the earthquakes happened in the region only into camp 10 robins as for effect. and the area is about bigger than

100000 square miles. it's got kilometer, so it's bigger than the fuel ariel iceland. what forties are hungaria? so like a whole country. so it's white in a 1st day. it was very difficult to fix all the roles and other things. but today most of them are working. i and the rules will be connected and opened as already mentioned or by our friend from bridge since at the gates are working and the toward one. 0 will be open ational. i think it till the end of today a so the 8 system will properly work also. but in some regions, we have seen, for example, and you've been out of that at b k. k is also ignoring this extraordinary restoration, an attack to the board of pest a bite mountain ranch rocket systems. so the terrorist organizations are using also these a bet conditions as an opportunity to pour their attack. so these should be apparent

as well and taken on the control of course, because the security forces already concentrated on the rescue efforts. so this is difficult, but it is working so that he's our national community can on something i don't have an eye on it yet. and work, i'm sorry to interrupt you. you said that these areas should be taken under control by whom and of course, the security board to security forces in the region, but i ran the international rescue team's a reach to the area. the actual security parcels can return to their actual works and they can concentrate on the security as well because now the military and other security forces are concentrated on research on rescue. so terrace got innovations are using this as an opportunity to threatened it. a current security situation also to deteriorate it. so that's why i think more research on rescue teams and

other humanitarian. 8 material suits breached to the point. as you go to the forces that dad should remain the security and maintained in security as val comedy is you say that that, that these various groups are taking advantage of the situation for the rodents. to what extent will the syrian government try to do the same and take advantage of the situation for its own ends? for sure that debt is all the political parties. it may try to use it about it is not very easy as well because a day already. damn, cells have a huge problems in their own area as well. and so i don't think that they will try to use this as an opportunity to attack it. la region and other places, but of course it's a kind of a tentative or risk. it should be mitigated or are some pretty cushions should be taken. an intent on eastern international community it should focus on should not

ignore as well as had what effect with it, with the international sanctions on syria having people in the north west of the country before the disaster. so an international sanctions. i and i have no impact on emergency response and he may serenade a reaching deductions as sort of as well. as i said, 90 percent of people in northern syria were all ready dependent upon humanitarian aid before the earthquake. so that so the sanctions must have been having some impact upon what i was getting. i was attention have a direct impact as professor professor lumber said on, on, ravages on financial transfers. and to enter the country because of the banking of the fact that we only last to use the wireless system which is not capable and

very difficult, very difficult and convoluted juice. so the big impact is on remittance on the ability of peer to peer financial distributions, etc. so what financial international sanction but doing are basically they're increasing the costs of the response. however, they're not preventing it. and i absolutely agree with that by the certain government is absolutely inefficient, but not only inefficient, i would say also extremely corrupt and criminal and the way their approach and all disasters that i've, that i've, you know, affect the area and also how they're approaching the of the earthquake so that therefore we need international rescue team. we cannot leave this to the of the different defacto authorities on the ground. we absolutely need an

international board. the initial mckenzie wright, i'm international rescue teams. i to be on the ground in all areas of start. i wanted to ask you who will coordinate the response to what extent will the reluctance of international actors to deal with serious government and support non governmental organizations directly lead to a botched response. therefore we need to create a coordination mechanism. how to do that. there are, there are different ways. one point was that it was the un which are that was doing that for the nation. but unfortunately, as i mentioned that doug has been completely heads and therefore we cannot rely on on the hub, attempted to be able to, to coordinate the aid for the, for the northwest or the country. now, syria has appealed to the civil sort of protection mechanism within the jerky hasn't been for the same protection mechanism. so the eco d,

g eco can lead us if there is a political will within the european union to basically lead the coordination effort. the entry of international rescue has already people on the ground in damascus, and therefore they can, they can, you know, take big big the lead on that, and they're trustworthy from, from the different political powers. ready and the different in the different areas of otherwise, it can be left to a coordination mechanism among syria jewels. and that has happened before when there were, you know, force displacement. but mason left for example, there was a coordination mechanism that was created for shelter to, to, to accept people in such a difference. and so there is a previous question where there has been the initial mechanism that worked between the fear in our best western came from one side and government controlled area and

other and joe's operating west of the country, joshua, for years, the international community. this has fudged its policies towards syria. to what extent could this tragedy do you think the capitalist now for change, for the world to take it a different approach to syria? it is time to change the we've seen in the arab world, the u. e parade. now, egypt has stepped forward, there's jordan has normalized relations with damascus and trying to influence the situation in syria. and i think sad ravia has mentioned it as talked about. it's eager to find some modest dandy with what they want political. they want some political concessions from damascus 1st, but this is a moment when i think one needs to look at the sanctions regime, which has been extremely tough on syria and, and question whether it's working because it has failed. it hasn't changed the

political architecture and syria one iota, but it has starved people. it has hurt the most vulnerable, but the women and children, mostly 90 percent of syrians are living under the poverty line. there's almost no electricity. there's no fuel. and the government has the government and the steering economy have come to a standstill. and this is, this is not a way to try to revive the syrian syria future of syria and certain people in this time of great need. so i think it is a time for the international community to revise its policies, which just have not been working or for syria, desperately. the people of syria desperately need the sanction lifted, syria itself wants to be reintegrated into the international community. now is the time you're saying to bring syria in from the coal, but, but is the syrian government to be trusted when it tried to take advantage of the

disaster for its own. and of course, it's going to take advantage. you know, everybody is taking advantage of this in one way or the other. and an upside is going to try to take advantage of this in order to relations. that's what he's reached out to egypt. egypt reached out to him. he's in the process of trying to normalize relations with turkey. of course, it's going to be streamlined difficult because of the enclave in a north. and turkey has been the traditional defender of the arab insurgency, an arab obligation groups. so this is a difficult path ahead, but there really is no target. the international community has spent the last 11 years trying to destroy outside in the syrian harmony and bring about political change. it failed. it gave up, we saw the rise of isis, the rise won't hide up in syria, and it, it, it got spooked by the syrian opposition. and it left aside in place that decision made by the international community here. and therefore,

they can't just star the syrian people forever. the king of jordan also reached out to, to president. i started a very quick way, joshua on the presence of, of russia and iran in syria, where they fit into this briefly. we've got about a minute left. the russian who run, i've been waiting back there a to one of his major problems. iran just almost double the price of oil sales to serious macro subsidies anymore. so this, this is, it makes it very difficult to help us out for the west to step in. because of course, we're fighting this war in ukraine, and our enemies are russia and iran. so if we can heard syria, many people will say, let's do it. because it hurt russia any character, ron, and it turns syria into a quagmire from those 2 countries. and unfortunately, that's the kind of thinking that has prevailed so far. and perhaps it's time that we change that thinking for the syrians. now that we see the suffering,

gentlemen there, we must end the discussion many thanks. indeed to all of you, our carsa, i said aloud she and joshua land us. and thank you for watching. don't forget, you can see the program again at any time just by going to the website is l 0 dot com for further discussion. join us on our facebook page that's at facebook dot com, forward slash, a j's inside story. and of course, the conversation continues. twitter handle at ha, inside story for me a free and i got the whole team here. and so thanks for being with us for the me. ah. and

for the 1st time in his young life, you know, gets his 1st taste of chocolate. he's been walking on his tablets, cocoa fall for 7. yes. you know, father says he put his son to work to prepare him for life's challenges. they do have a bad so i don't have any money to pay labor. and because there are no schools nearby to accommodate all the children, they help with the farmer. children as young as for are brought to farms to become conditioned to such an environment as they grow. actively say more than half of all children living in agricultural areas. i engage in work, most of them dangerous work across west africa, one and a half 1000000 children. i involved in cocoa farming many work as time laborers and, and less than a dollar or nothing at all. i would say attempts by western cocoa bias to force down prices is keeping hundreds of thousands of children out of school and condemning them to a life of poverty. and they argue only by them receiving better prices and education being improved. can the lives of children like, you know,

keep poor to bottle of encounter in swivels? come on england. st. plastic is everywhere. but if thoughtful it can be facing that. and bubble gum, wellington, be what the moral can be done with this play get polymers. thrive. re imagining class on algebra ah, found carried cancelling dough, how the top stores, home al jazeera, the death toll from monday's earthquakes in turkey, and syria has passed. 12000 rescue operations are still ongoing. turkish president, jeff, have a dwan, has the knowledge shortcomings in his government's.