from sin provinces, which are still about 5 or 6 degrees above average. there's no reason why they should change. i'm afraid. it's just some shark. ah, but al jazeera goes beneath the waves with a team of women determined to save the dolphins. we all share the same responsibility when me to do something floaty, was acting amazing on him. i'm using a variety of scientific techniques to study their behavior. we can monitor them and report their vocal photos and behavior. we're able to how they're adapting for their new environment. women make science dolphins sanctuary on al jazeera. she's in thing is formerly appointed for a son, thomas, china's president, all powerful at home. he faces big challenges elsewhere up against the u. s. and i'm a polarized world. so what would be the impact of she's 3rd term in china and abroad?

this is inside story. ah. hello, welcome to the program. i'm adrian finnegan. she's in ping has been appointed for an unprecedented 3rd. thomas, china's president. that may be a ceremonial position, but the man who holds it is by far the most powerful person in the country after he was reaffirmed as head of the communist party and the military last year. following the lifting of strict cove at 19 measures, he appears to face little opposition of home overseas. mo, relations with the u. s. continued to decline and tensions persist with the e. u of a russia and ukraine. so what impact will she's unchallenged? leadership have for china and the rest of the world will be discussing all of that with our guests in just a few moments. but 1st katrina,

you reports from aging on what she's in pink faces at home and abroad. he just thing has just been re elected as president and will begin to store 3rd time in office with a new leadership team behind him. but they faced many challenges, both at home and abroad at home. the issue of the environment is still that still a problem. as you can see behind the beijing has been blanket it has more this week . there's also a central today on friday, but an even bigger focus for the government is the slowing economy. they set at the beginning of the nbc, a target of 5 percent for the year 2023, the lowest target that will be in decades. and that's because china is still struggling to recover from almost 3 years of it's strict, 0 proven policy, where consumers spending took a hit as well as investment. has also seen a rising unemployment rate, especially among the years and an ailing proposition sector as form as well. president, she didn't team leadership,

at least confidence in his leadership. also took a hit. we saw unprecedented protest take place at the end of the year and also discontent, murmuring discontent around the hasty reversal of their strict pandemic policy. yet analysts say that that does not seem to have graded, a significant dent in his how it going forward. he does seem secure, but he does need to look also abroad and the growing challenges that he said on monday, that western countries led by the united states, has been circled and suppressed china bracing, unprecedented and severe challenges for china's development. he's referring to some of the sanctions placed by the united states targeting chinese them, which are really hurting not only china's technology industry, but also it's access to the global market. internationally, china also has problems with it. public image, since it's continuing support of russia and invasion of ukraine, that's also not one china, any extra friends. and china needs to really work hard to maintain its relationship

with europe and other important trading partners. and it's doing all the while was trying to protect and still it's positioning geopolitically, its own global security and its own backyard, its own interest in particular, in regard to taiwan self, rhode island, that they didn't consider as its own, train you out 0 for inside story in beijing ah, so let's bring in our guests for today's discussion and a mock is a senior research fellow at the center of china and globalization. he georgia, far skype from beijing. in washington, d. c. a. shirley, you, she's a senior fellow with the ash center at the harvard kennedy school and via skype from hamburg is adrian geiger's, his co author of the book. she's in ping, the most powerful man in the world are welcome to we're a warm welcome to all of you, adrian. let's start with you. the most powerful man in the world. i thought that monica belonged to the u. s. president. why did you give your book that title is

here about the world's most powerful math? yes, he absolutely is the most powerful man and the events today have confirmed this because he has such a power. now in china for us like nobody's hinz, melissa dome, but more important, china is economically so powerful it nowadays that which is different from the time of cause, which makes him really the most powerful man. also because, i mean, the president of the united states was considered to be the most popular person in the past. the us are so divided politically, we don't know what happens after the 1st term of chill bite and yet i'm absolutely sure. shooting ping is the most powerful man in the but surely confirmation of this 3rd term was widely expected. to what extent though, the next few days more important, with the appointment of a new penny and,

and various other ministers at sole eod. this is so i says 3 a continuum of father chinese, the policy directions that we have seen since 2022. but some were brought lee. i syncer the onset of the trait or in 2018. so we have seen a series of government reforms. we see re centralization of power from the bureaucracy, the government site to the party site, and the restructuring of power from the ministerial level up to the cabinet level and even up to mistress himself, but also in this congressional session and the into the next 5 years we're going to continue to see the state sector playing a pillar in role within the chinese economy. the state sector permeates through o chinese private sectors. and so mr. the char, as the incoming premier, most likely, has

a huge job on his shoulder. and he's going to steer the chinese economy towards a possibly a new direction today faced the with mounting domestic and international challenges . and i'm sure he said the li chung is widely expected to replace the the outgoing premier li coaching. what's, what's his relationship with president, she, how will things differ with him in the role compared to his predecessor? well, i think we can expect some significant differences. one of course because there's a new person in the job. but also, as surely alluded to, there are some important structural reforms going on as well. not only within the government emphasized science and technology, intellectual property protection, data as a factor of production, but also others of greater integration between the party and the government. so for those 2 reasons, i think we can expect, ah,

some meaningful changes are in the role of the premier or in the role of the state council and the role of the government. but we also have to recognize to that again because of the leading role of the c p. c that ali chang is also number 2, i after is using ping on the up holiday bureau standing committee, which is the highest ah, level of leadership at the party. so i think for these reasons, and of course his a long decades long, close relationship are working very closely with see could mean that there is much greater efficiency and effectiveness going forward. adrian, would you agree with that? what, what is it about that lee chang. uh that will be different as far as president, she is concerned from, from lee catching. i mean, we have to see what he has done in the past. i mean, as already mentioned,

he always was very close to teaching pin that might, might be an advantage for him to do something more independently. but we have to see what he has done in the past. he was party chief in shanghai in the time of the harshest, looked on in shanghai, you know, he did not use, he's who relation to shooting pin to tell him this is too much. this will cause a big, big problems for the people and be problems for the economy. he did not do this, but he followed a 100 percent the line of teaching pin so so 5 would say there is no sign that he would do something independent from cheating pin quite opposite. he will follow him in everything from what we have seen so far. so adrian, surrounded now as he is by loyalist, is she going to get the kind of fearless and,

and frank advice that a man in his position would surely need? yeah, i mean that's the point. i mean the shooting ping has surrounded himself now with yes say yes. and the problem is also with the cargo personally t, around teaching being in china, that it's very difficult for anybody in the party to stand up against him because i mean, he isn't the party constitution. he's in the constitution of the country. he, he's showing in the propaganda as the savior of china. so that would be very difficult for the party to explain if they would change something. so i think for the time being teaching ping is very much in power and surrounded by loyally. surely, she's re appointed this head of state, then comes at a particularly sensitive time for china's relations with, with the world. what are we to make of?

she's explicit criticism of the us this week, or as the leader of a western efforts to contain china. he was saying so crescent, as she has only talked a bad ha, all out. are you s efforts to contain in circle in suppress china and i thank god, this is the 1st time we heard a deliberate and a with succinct clarity, a chinese vision of far the current, the u. s. china relations. and i think are from the chinese perspective, there is a fundamental miscalculation a misunderstanding between the u. s. in china. about the are the strategic, a rivalry between the world's 2 largest economy. today, the u. s. has talked to bad, so a sanctioning chinese technology benny chinese investments are etc, is essentially

a out of for national security reasons. but the, that understanding of national security is also cri answer. the other words, a chinese company or technology company doesn't have to necessarily impose an ongoing national security threat to the united states in order to, to justify that the u. the u. s. believes that any chinese company, or either state or private, can pose a national security threat at the command of the chinese communist party. so that's our understanding of national security threat is categorical. but on the chinese side, a chinese out rightly rejects that whole notion of china believes, according to the new chinese foreign minister chin gong. he recently stated that it's not about competition that motivates o u. s. the south china policies. today it is about victory. it's winning the competition that motivates o china policies. and so from chinese perspective, this competition as well as trying to continues to rise and continues to come to

economic parity with the united states this contain and is your comments and the suppression of china according to present she himself, a saw inevitable talking about winning competition surely, to what extent does that extend to diplomacy? iran and saudi arabia have announced that their resuming diplomatic relations and embassies, sir, after talks held in beijing. what are we to make about to, to what extent is that a slap in the face for the u. s. i think i asked that if the united states or 80 percent of the world are mostly the global south today, a do not wish to enter into their so global joe political divide. and so the fundamental, a global understanding of the north south city by that, which shall we as economists have been so accustomed to, in the past decades. that's past, say, today,

the fundamental global divide is really the east and west divide. and unfortunately on global countries are, are being for the ones, you know, the, the proposition a value proposition is that you either stay with democracy or you support our target. see, and you either a, you know, our work with the u. s. technology or you work with the chinese technology. so when these choices become so moral and so mutually exclusive, unfortunately, oh, out of all been world's own, the other 80 percent of the global worlds are entangled in the so jewel political strife. but there are wise leaders out there and i would say if we look our countries like singapore, ah, that's absolutely amazing model of a strategic autonomy. and i think a, you know, a lot of the european countries are changed to up perform a role of a mediating role within the so global, greater architecture as well. and countries in the middle east are obviously are

seeking their strategic interests. and what are your thoughts on that than the fact that these talks were broken by, by china, with the help of oman and q way to course who, who hosted preliminary talks but, but the deal was signed the in beijing. why i think certainly china is playing a much more important role on the global stage. but i want to briefly, if i may go back to this earlier point about susan king surrounding himself with quote, unquote, loyalist, i want to say that briefly. first of all, i think no leader of a large, complex organization, especially a country as challenging as china can rise up through the ranks to the apex of political leadership without accurate information and sound judgment. and i think these people are loyalist, of course not because not only that, they've demonstrated their loyalty to see, but they've also demonstrated their competence as well. i think that sometimes is

underappreciated in some of the the narrative in the west about this. the 2nd point, i think it's important dimension that's related to trying to diplomatic efforts, is that even though see, is seen as a very powerful leader. one of the hallmarks of the chinese system is no decision without to be and no debate after decisions. so i think the optics, of course, it looks like c is in charge making all the decisions. but i think a lot of thought a lot of debate does go into especially important decisions. and as a result of that, we've seen, i think, a very good track record over the last 10 years over the last decades of economic before where china largely has made the right decisions and implemented them effectively. and increasingly, it's taking that competence and that ability to have an impact on the global stage,

or the, or come back to you in just a moment. but i just want to get adrian's thoughts on what you were saying the and at a rate on the, on this, this deal signed in beijing to normalize relations between iran and saudi arabia. yeah, i mean that to shows the growing power of china in diverse and i also would agree, of course not these people are not competent. no, no, no. they said they would people, but still the point is that the atmosphere we have now in china because now i mean it was a big lesson of them. our time when reform and opening up was started to say the polish would be concentrated in the hands of one person and that's also by one curse we should be maximum 10 years in power. and so we have c nights of 20 party conquest. and now today, and as people congress that shooting pin continues in power and that creates

an atmosphere which makes it difficult to discuss with him controversial topics because everybody has to be read like to do to become the victim of the, of the anti corruption campaign which as we know is not only an anti corruption campaign, but only and companion a campaign against everybody who does not agree to teaching. and to the point that they always to have wise decisions. i mean, in general, in the last take it yet, but this was more also related to the opening up and people mervin, don't shopping started. but if we look at the very last yet, i wouldn't say that 0 corporate policy. how it was implemented in china was a bite decision. i think it was a tavern for the economy and turbo for the chinese people. and the vaccine rushes

president probably putting congratulated she healing his personal contribution to strengthening the 2 countries. comprehensive partnership and looking forward to further fruitful russian chinese cooperation. how important is russia to president she right now, given the state, especially of the ration relationship with the us. i think rushes important to china for a number of reasons. are light countries in the middle east. it's a important supplier of energy. so that is, you know, a very, very important factor to consider geopolitically of course, i think it's ingo also a said something along the lines of as long as there's turbulence in the world, ah, the russia, china relationship will be a guarantor of our global stability. i might have the words wrong, but i think roughly the intent is that so and i think from the chinese view, then it is that as long as there are problems,

are threats in the world are that the ability of china and russia and perhaps other countries as well are to work together to ensure a prosperous and stable global environment is vital. shirley, this rivalry them with the u. s. that, that you talked about this, this competition, this desire to win the competition. how much is that rivalry hurting china's economy right now is president she actually interested in repairing or at least for ng a little the relationship between china and the us. i think the series of escalations of the us sanctions, particularly on chinese technology, has made china double down on its efforts and existing practices. and so this time in the congressional session, you heard that mister c personally, inquiring private companies,

where is the chip made in your machinery. and so this whole chinese domestic economic challenges primarily arise today acutely from the financial sector in the technology sector. and of course i, china has restructured and he has he rooted to the whole new state lead a whole us government architecture in order to seek technological self reliance. but today technology and the, the capital market. the financial sector goes handy hand. and so we saw recent, a very aggressive investigations and corruption investigations in the financial services sector. but also china just recently implemented the, a nationwide registration based on your system. so once that system is in place, which is very much akin to nasdaq or us kind of capital markets, then the chinese writing technology companies will be able to seek financing from

the domestic stock marketing water to finance. sustainable rights and finance and technology rise goes with handy hands and he's not hope at any say, i don't think that mr. c. were wake up and say the u. s. would start to supply us ships again. why, why though is, is she extending his oversize, his personal oversize of the financial sector and the tech industry? he's replaced china's banking watchdog and he's set up this new agency. this is this also that the science commission that he's, that he's been gone as well. why a, mr. c has set up many special are ex executive committees to oversee various strategic sectors within the chinese economy. and that you may call, it's part of this whole chinese structure transition of power from the government to, to, to the party any essentially back to mr. c. himself. and i think that trends is

going to continue. and now the supervisory financial committee that snooty set up is going to replace the existing function. so from china, so thank you and watch dog and insurance, watch dog and some of the other functionary. so with then across different ministries. and so that sort of restructuring, it's actually a hopeful sign because when you have a lot of government entities that have cross functions of each others. and then there are various regulators regulating essentially the same thing that doesn't bring efficiency in terms of governance or transparency. and so now the new entities likely to resolve some of that. adrian, let's discuss china's relations with you at the moment. where as we said at the beginning of the program tension persists, of china starts on, on russia and ukraine, who, to what extent is, is the e, you seen is just

a puppet of the us in china. yeah, that's the kind of contradiction. because on the one hand, china twice to divide the you and the us, i mean, we have just seen this unique c security conference on china, tech the united states and said to your, should be more independent to should be boy in the middle between the 2 sides and not together with the us, but on the other hand, in the context of the ukraine. well, i mean, china sees the, you're very much of course in mon front with the u. s. and that, to bring me back to your earlier question. i mean, i had been correspondent in moscow also in the time 990, to 9096 till the end of the soviet union and start of the new russia. and to qu, teen and teaching ping are united because they have the same love view. they both

think that there had been a human gated by the best, especially united states, but in generally, by the best on girls. as stacy, it putin brings nice to get on with the breakdown fall down off of it union, which is kind of ridiculous because i business the for the owner of the soviet union. and it was because of the internal problems of the soviet union and the socialist countries. not because of any foreign interference, primarily and shooting people, as we know, sees it even as a much bigger context, the colonial time and usually asian of china in that time. and wants to make china be power again, which is the aim the to make china and most time of its history had been important country culturally, economically and so on. so it's a, it's to,

to go back to you sir. idea to make a china great country, but i think the confrontation of football site is not hateful to develop this. andy, what's president? she is standing with the chinese public. her it m is reputation. did suffer, at least with some sections of, of chinese society after 0 cove. it and, and there was that the rushed abandonment of 0 cove. it does the property crisis. the the tech crackdown is high. youth unemployment. is he admired by the public respected ah liked by the chinese public that does it even matter? i think it certainly matters no country, no regime can survive without public support. punitive measures only work to a limited plane and provoke, backlash is eventually. so and i would be careful maybe to distinguish

by there certainly was a lot of the satisfaction concern, anxiety, even the anger a during the cold with locked down period. certainly some people did not feel the the relaxation measures went well. but i think overall there is enormous support for presidency across all sectors of society, not just the but the, the communist party as well. i think people recognize to that things can be better . and this is one of the reasons that i think we see the institutional reform going on today as well. surely made a great point that overlapping jurisdiction is inefficient. it creates cost and burdens for firms in the financial service sector, but also creates problems in terms of regulatory arbitrage as well, where companies financial service companies can play off $1.00 regulator against

another. so i think one of the unique features of the chinese system is that it is able to engage in some regular fairly significant institutional reforms. and i think, you know, many people that work in large bureaucracy, you know, just how difficult is not impossible that can be, i'm sorry to cut you off there. but when we're out of time many, thanks, cindy to, to all of you for being with us. and the mock, surely you and adrian gaga, se, as always, thank you for watching tough. again, you can see the program again at any time by going to the website at al jazeera dot com for further discussion. good. while facebook page, you'll find that at facebook dot com forward slash ha inside story, and you can join the conversational twitter handle at a j inside story. for me, adrian, for the whole team here in bo hop. thanks for watching. ah

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