yes, sunshine, in between because a rather heavy splashes of right now making the way across northern parts of pakistan. northern areas of india, orange wanting same force anywhere from around upon job. right into our west bengal . some very heavy rain there. it's a bit higher as we go on into the way can pushing across a good part of bangladesh. ah. when the news breaks, some buildings that had already been damaged, have been further pushed over to one side. others that were close to collapse when need to be heard and the story toned. i couldn't tell them that i was a musician when i was supposed to be burned with exclusive interviews and in death to each centimeter of this stuff represents a year of life. al jazeera has teens on the ground when you move into human trees and lives. ah, what's driving the recent unrest in kenya and opposition leaders say they are

protesting against the high cost of living. they also accused the president of feeling the last election. so can this be contained or will it escalate? this is inside story. ah, ah. hello and welcome to the program. i'm sarah. danielle kenya has seen several days of protests and unrest sparked way a rising cost of living and political divisions, opposition liter riley dingoes, leading the demonstrations while calling on his long play. rival president william root o to resign a dingo last last year's election by a small margin to rudo. he says he was cheated out of victory. will join our guests after this report from malcolm web in their robi, people are demonstrating against the high cost of living prices. the food and fuel

have been rising and the government of president william retail has removed subsidies. its opposition leader rider were doing who called people to the street. he's also disputing the results of last year's election. he's run for president 5 times before and he's never been declared the winner. but in some of the past polls, it was substantial evidence that he'd been rig out the victory. but last year the evidence was correlation presented to the supreme court was not found compelling by the judges. and they held the election results, previous rounds of opposition protests in kenya have led to royal of being offered deals or positions in government. but they've done little to alleviate poverty, to address the stock inequality all the grievances on july, the reasons the people coming to the st. this time around the repair to be an attack. some people on property like groups aligned to the government and the

opposition side. on monday, businesses belonging to royal everything and say, the former president who re kenyata, he fact wider in the last election were attacked, will say in the to be or informal settlement here when i robi a church and a moth with then there were also widespread reports of violence targeting generally covering the protest by police by protested by gang religious leaders and rights groups are cooling for com people waiting to see if the tensions will escalate or if the politicians will come to the table and make more deals. malcolm web for inside story. last year's election results were very close. and why lou dingo has rejected the results. the long time opposition leader has run for office 5 times and says he was cheated each time. in 2017, the supreme court agreed with him and, and know the results. it said it found the irregularities in order to rerun but,

but didn't go withdrew from that re run. and at least a 1000 people were killed in the violence that followed the 2007 disputed election . so did go ahead, encouraged his supporters to protest at the time. ah, let's welcome our guests now foreign. moline is a member of parliament, a member, also the wiper, democratic movement, a member of the opposition as in coalition, and the former deputy speaker of kenya's, national assembly. thank you for joining us on the show. been a mistake. 0 is the executive director of the daily africa and n g o, which works to increase female participation in politics and governance. and herman menorah is the political analyst and professor at the university of nairobi who voted for riley dingo. all of you are joining us from nairobi today, a warm welcome to each of you far emily, let's start with you. you're a part of the opposition coalition, which is behind these protests. but i understand that you don't support people

taking to the streets on this particular issue, explain to us why? well, i don't support people 2nd to the streets on this occasion. democracy the basic, very fundamental rules of democracies. that when you go for elections and you lose an election, your law, we have a, has won the election to begin running the government and being the governance. this trip will not be in office now for hardly 6 months. i mean the bomb on 7 months. i think i'm usually takes the time for the government to organize itself on too many challenges here. in any case, it's not our business to now tell the same government government will be featured as in the last election, but who went ahead and even defeated us in the parliamentary elections because of the speaker council. beside the deputy speaker, come from the site and then again we tell them that you've booked 2. we went to

court, the supreme court. we lost them, let's say in the court. we accepted it that they the judge meant though they're holding up the quoted. so we said we're not happy with it or we accept it. and then we come back again until that some government look you. you want that election, not fairly, but it. and again, you have to do a, b, c, b, you must. oh, what to at? they're bringing down the cost of living in the country. you are mazda, and check back a. i don't know the people who are called to read a for people who and then it's a recent before. so basic it is sent in conditions for a government that's there. on an open the saba. i may be some of the things that the government can do because the sabbath under the control of an independent body called b i. e, b, c the, the payment in excel and bond is commission. so i, i think it's not fair. we just can go out into the streets because we lost their elections. we admit that we are september 5th. we just have to give them an opportunity for them to start the planning the government. and then we will begin

protecting stock ticking and use whatever i mistakes them back and 5 years to inform canyons and what i'm doing the next election. okay, there's a lot to unpack and everything you just did says a good thing we have like 20 plus minutes to do that. bina, it is not. i take far as point that you have to let government govern. but at the, at the same time, the opposition is there to oppose the government and your take on what's happening right now in the streets, in nairobi, and consumer and other parts of the country. i think 1st of all, we have to acknowledge that some of the issues being raised by the opposition. you didn't protest a valid reason. but then also understand that we have a political issue and we have an economic issue. and we have to see how to solve with of those issues. you know, we live in a country where we don't even trust the institutions that actually oversee election . and that's a form the basis upon which people don't trust whether they are credible or not.

even though the supreme court did give our ruling and say that's the legitimize election of our president, william, brutal so long, i haven't strengthened the institutions that oversee lectures. but citizens can actually trust that elections were free and credible. we are still going to see most of this problems, even in the next lecture on the 2027 about the cost of living. are we struggling with the high cost of living? we are, you know, the media is in this country is 19 years old. we have so many young people who job less, right. and as you know of, you know, the bottom line is even for the citizens, we did elect our leaders to actually stop or what needs need as a permit stuff that actually going to will fill those promises when they are actually elected. so i think also citizens a fed up when they see a little political and less work being done. and if i told walk in being done

behind the scenes, can that be explained to the public in such a way that we were supposed to be? let's say a month, but we are not able to achieve this because of these reasons. so give us time to achieve abc, herman mon euro. we heard from both far and b, know that there are really 2 issues at play here that are driving these protests. one is the high cost of living and there's just no denying that the, the price of petrol has gone up. the price of maze, which is essential for staple food has gone up. but another issue here is the political rivalry between a dingo who narrowly lost the election to route. whoa, and the president. do you think that these protests in your view are legitimate? do you think these 2 issues should be separated? i think there's no way you separate them because they are, sorry, let's on in terms of mobilizing on the part of the position

they did the effort of the much less effective if the issue of cost of living or than part of the so yes, the citizens are unhappy with the cost of living, but also a significant part of the city and this countries also, i'm happy with the election results. so these 2 work together and window position is mobilizing, they're actually talking about the political issue, the legitimacy of the presidents under sometime using the cost of living as i mean mobilizing workforce. so they can, you can also put the marker ok, well as far as the cost of living is concerned, then do you hear far as argument that the government and this president need time to turn things around where it is possible you would need a yo even true,

but in the circumstances where people could be dead by the time the time you're asking for is you will have to move in thought you realize. ready into a number of kids. one of the reasons why the cost of living is high, especially mazel. food on july. i think for fuel and for the substance that would cushion poor attendance was moved. and many people have this feeling. the push on the i am from the world by that is making the government do that. so there are some things you can do weeks. you couldn't wait for long term measures to take place. but if people are dying, they're going to show you life in this country isn't better. and we're talking about reading pops the other living is. and what is so much government can do. in thomasville, for example, the in the district is so much better option. you don't have to deal with option

and see, well, this is the dentist that they can do later. it's a lot more that are beyond the government's control. that is beyond the government control because of international issues. but years there are things that cannot wait so far, farm and the do you support the austerity measures that were put in place by this president and his government in order to secure that i am f loan knowing that the same austerity measures have either driven up the cost of living or kept the cost of living high for ordinary kenya's the cost of living did not become high on the assumption, the office of this current government, the cost of living was high even before them. as a matter of fact, this double the cost of the simple food they, they the mays mill, the made me lose my expensive bedtime was over 200. well over 200. it now is about

$200.00, maybe less in some cases. and but, but you see, let me tell you, one thing you, we, we, this people, we, we were part of a kind of an informal cohesion through something called the handshake. when the mom of president and either i was quite a sunday, the basic get it got together. so for, for, for the whole of the big, the bulk of the last time, the 5 years of that tom and i made a list in the very least that was 4 years of that. the current president was not in the mainstream. he was basically somebody was it, and wanted and, and, and, and we were this a lesson was for us to lose. and we will lost it nonetheless, because even to us, as we are going to closer to the elections, all the addictions, all the opinion polls did indicate that this was a very cross cross election. i've been too close to court, and indeed it was too close to court because we will, we will, they want with a very small magic talk. wait a 2nd. now for us to begin telling them that we're going to people are going to die

before the, the year ends. and for the 4 years before that, the current president was not. and nowhere near power, the power was basically concentrated. and the former president an hour on leader who we hope to make the president, i think to say that it is very unfair and it's extremely honest. and it, because when you go to there it even without the subsidies, i believe the prices are more or less the same of what they were then so, so basically what we have also kind of accustomed to this country is brooke, this people talk more about a broke a brooke, brooke insisted there, then there was no money, there were not reserves, there was nothing. and basically, everybody believes that this, this, while things abused that the subsidies were abused and billions of p. a shillings was stolen through that. we need to have what is the credits of all that and things

like that where the money went. but it's only, it's only fair for us to give a little bit of time in the very least a year to this government for them to begin allow correcting the things that, that, that corrected some things. so. so i think if what has to come out into the open loop, you can have people demonstrate things like was to show late. it's not the spontaneous demonstration that is being done by chance who are unable to bear the cost of living. no, it is one that is called for by our own collision poses the leader by load being that is the one who called for this demonstration far. if i remember, if i can just jump on, if i can just jump in here, should you still be a member of the, of the opposition coalition? should you be in a coalition with reloading a given that so far? you have been critical of the positions he's taken and you've been brother supportive, at least in this program of the government. and you're in favor of giving them a grace period. should you really still be politically in a coalition with relo dingo can?

can i explain to you one thing it might cost if i put in more and more resources to get all the votes for iowa. as a matter of fact and a loading i had over 20, about 23000 votes, my cos each as the last election. while route i had only $508.00. most of them, one of the locals, not my own people, that they saw the government work as well. so we did everything we could have done . we were there on the on position. i have been in the position myself for the longest. and i'm out of a principal, but the country is, is i, my loyalty is most of the country i'm planning to be to. it has to be a principal. i made all it all to the best of it so much to an individual who's going to tend to wake up. well, i mean this, that it's on the opposite direction and movement, the mo, most that you better been for the country and the people of the country. because layla was the one who was defending the high cost of living, just before the elections, and recorded. and then he suddenly comes out and say, the cost of living is the president. i'm calling for my section. it doesn't happen

like that. when the cost of living is high, it becomes a spontaneous is the muscle and able to build without cost of living and come out into the streets. this is different, this is the political demonstration. and by the way, the agenda can say that you promised to bring down the cost of living and you haven't broke it down. but who took a bath high up? there? it is a hulu. and layla was very close to him, cut the feel of the relationship that i saw. this one is the, in my opinion, is not something one house go loyalty to my loyalty to my country. i oppose them. i am not in the in, in k k always because that's what they call what is a now, i'm still in my college it. but i don't like the way my, my, the leader of that college of our specialize this thing. and i'm taking it to a different level. ok. all right, you are getting. you are creating a situation. we have had a similar situation before. went when mass action. i've got a 1000000 again sir. all right, but thank you so much. and by the way,

just for 4 years were less familiar with with canyon politics when you say, or who is responsible for the high cost of living. you mean, of course, the former canyon president to who are kenyatta bean at herman. i saw some raised eyebrows. i saw some smiles. let me see, let me go to you been a to do you feel that the government deserves to be given more time to tackle cost of living issues? is it unfair for the opposition to try and put so much pressure on them now in the streets when they've been in power for what? just over 6 months. you know, 1st of all are if a total, actually this is a very critical election and to be go by the president winning the selection and if possible directly. so it's saying the cost of keeping did not begin with the straight gym or so i think that may perhaps are new leaders in there isn't what's needed so that they can actually bring about that new chief vision. it's because

the promise in the right and on the promises and make this promises during an extra that you know, what if your next me am going to do x, x, y, z. so we are saying, yes, the government is broke by that, but then other spend time when they think the government is group people, us being a bluetooth government. you see people are complaining citizens are complaining because we are saying we inherited, you know, call us that option empty. we just appointed 50 chief administrative officer that didn't double the number for the office as we had in the last, in the last year we had about 23. and this is an office very unclear to shuttle already. and if you look at also the individuals that we have actually appointed actually look the strongly every day or the united tenants. i'm not struggling young people, the probably cost less that we actually said we want to represent them when we left it. so you know like confusing maybe when we say we actually very book and then you

come and also just, you know, ex tanya government and we don't have to have resources that can actually be channeled to the basic needs. but events are actually talking about right there was such i read that shows actually because i think a month ago, if not 2 months ago, that's, can you spend a sense of their income? yeah. whether in all my employment, put a sense of the income goes directly to food. so how much are you left with to spread across the ad, the needs where they said new patients where they show up whether it's your own plus and i need your, you know, so how much are you left me and then we're talking about. so guys, i think we're being employed who necessarily, i'm not even struggling, kenyon, when we have the majority of the people who are job less in this country. we have about a 1000000 people who graduate from institutions of higher learning, treasury education. as we have a, you know, to a job market that's can only accommodate 60000 people. where did the rest go to,

you know, the majority of the citizens also employed and then for more economy, how we investing. and then for my kind of me, how are we regulating been for more economy given that to the same industry that are home with the majority of the women and the young people in this country who are the most vulnerable when it comes to struggling economy. so i think at the end of the day it's also for the presidents to understand that now is the presidential as the, as i said, not just the people who supported support that he so even with some of the polarizing remarks that he in this country that or this government is for the shareholders. we are all supposed to be share with us. we are all with us having every other person in this particular country. you're supposed to be a national unity. and right now is the most important time to see how do you actually promote de faculty a such a time like this when some people feel excluded and it's not the fact that the building excluded. because if we don't handle this matter correctly, right now,

they're going to be low, but then next election and then next election. well, that's, that's undeniable. especially when you factor in the riley has run for office for the presidential office 5 times in a row last 5 times in a row contested the results multiple times. yes, there is a chance that some of this spills over into the next election. i think that's fair, herman been euro, you were raising your eyebrows earlier. what did you want to say? oh, listening. my friend marlene, i good friend of mine and he sounded like i going apologised. first of all, right, loading. i was not part of the government was perhaps friends with them from a president and i've been kind of disuse via but it wasn't federal government is not as it may it is also to like the good lady say's when

you want to run gum and you can paint line, you know, the problems you are going to face so you cannot get the government again engaging next to this. and again, intellectually see which bottom mileage and other seeing one doesn't seem to want to certain people going to give you time. if there are signs, indicators of the tomorrow would be a better if you become president on the sort of team you put up, the government you put together doesn't inspire confidence. is a government that made up of the was that collecting dot com? you're stretching imagination too far to expect the student, the country to give that to the government a chance to better things to model. secondly, the people can also bear with their government. understand that these are hard

times and give the government times to put things together. but if government is doing good in excesses in its trouble, going in sitting aside, was $7000000.00 us dollars to buy cars for putting to be in excess appointment. the one who loves us it. excessive club in in flood little of gum. mendoza's well bloated delegations in running down the country and homecomings on those little things. we are gum into the saucepan. you will be expecting too much from the seats in the back country. if you ask them to give them up but to le gum and tie. yes, gum and kind of be given time and indeed it should be given time. but it must be indicated on the ground that that tire am will be utilized in a, in a way that we can believe will yield the fruit. but what is on the ground doesn't spot any, could have been of the door. but again,

what i said on this bit of an important, if the citizens of your country, i die and you, i am tired. and you are listening to a 3rd. but who tells you do not foot stubborn measures in place or pulled position measures in place. when you know the break the box of your people. if you listen to a, an institution like i may have telling you no subsidies. and yet, you know, get away your people are going to die. surely, that cannot be acceptable. not in the 21st century where the prison accounting must make it is a responsibility to ensure the people with country, at least slight and li, just to survive. and therefore, these kinds of things cannot wait, because if we wait, we are quoting disaster. you can see the numbers in the streets to bear with re loading. those numbers are not, there we go, didn't necessarily believe in this issue was stolen election. the numbers are mainly there because of the challenges. economic challenges of the problem of food,

of transport. herman, i wanted, i want to jump in because we have just 2 minutes left and i am sorry to interrupt you respectfully, i want to ask all of you, does there need to be a hand shake moment? so for background, the head, what's known as the handshake moment in canyon politics is when a dingle stunned kenyans riley. dingus done kenyans after being bitterly opposed to then president to who are kenyatta by turning around shaking his hand. and they had some form of informal coalition, and i couldn't call it co governance, but they came to an agreement after being bitterly opposed. formally new 1st. does there need to be a handshake motor to be out between president routine again, while dingo, and we only have a few, a few moments left. i'll ask you to keep it short. to begin with. the cost that she brought to mr to secretary is that he has now appointed was not something that's not the amount is the president that it was initially appointed by oh, to pietro when it was head of state and not now,

but 10 years back. okay. number one, president in law, there's something competitive when this thing has been there before and his mind is just followed by them, the numbers guess you could debate the numbers. the 2nd thing is up. every time i need it, i need an answer. does then, is it handshake moment? no, no, there is no need to be hunched between who you see. ready if we are going to, if we're going to appreciate what's called a democracy, then we appreciate democracy within its complaints. and the way correct is the all, not a democracy that's always of the election. negotiations that the, the power in the power it is that i mean by the president and the opposition guy now come again into another. another agreement that only some interests we have seen because many times before, right? we don't have enough time, but i will talk about it for days on end. and then they then my side one, another legal and i d, nothing gets corruption,

does not get. they're going to get employment book. it does not get them. it's just the 2 of them are going to sit somewhere and have a blanket between them. so i don't like myself. i've seen many of it before. ok, i'm afraid we're going to have to leave it there, but far. molina being a messina, herman your i thank you so much for joining us. enjoying this panel today on al jazeera and thank you to for watching. you can see the program again any time by visiting our website, delta 0 dot com, and for further discussion, good. our facebook page that's facebook dot com, forward slash ha inside story. you can also join the conversation on twitter or handle at a inside story from me. so any, any i seen here in the home like this is a region that is rapidly developing, but it's one also that is afflicted by conflict. political epsky rules. we've tried

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