as it has been a cool, central and southern parts of china, but still some showers here in the cloud conditions as well, making their way towards shanghai. a story of heat continues with the korean peninsula, sol seem to attempt to pick up into the high twenty's. but cool condition of the plague in japan, tokyo at 15 degrees celsius of that on choose day. thanks to the west of weather the. the latest news as it breaks, used to expect the 2nd row. that's why has already started this. it can't be here with detail coverage for the whole. the members of the g. 9 gang are not far away from here and they have been attacking this area from around the world. they haven't seen anything like this so far. since the conflict again, we get a sense of how enormous the scale of this humanitarian crisis is.

israel's cabinet needs under the us, the most common towns kind of spinning and say it's and the publication is really funded, digging below the area and occupied these theresa and has been condemned by international audiologist for why is this? well point so controversial. this isn't type, store the hello there and welcome to the program. i'm the styles here. ok. now these really governance has held us weekly cabinet, amazing and tunnels. excavation under the l. x the most compound and occupied east jerusalem. and above ground. a fluoride is really minutes to enter the area shortly before the government gathered provocatively. he claimed, as well as is what he times landlords of jerusalem. that's again infuriated palestinians who has been increasing the good by more incursions by alternation as jewish groups and to one of as long as holiest sites. it was again

a flash point earlier this year with his rating police to basing hottest indians praying in the mosque. the cabinet musing below ground again brings into focus the control of the supervisor by is really audiology and excavation beneath the ancient city. we'll be discussing this shortly with our guests. but 1st, let's take a look again at why the ox, a compound is one of the most volatile flashed points in occupied historicism. it contains 2 of as long as holy sites, deluxe a mosque, and the time of the rock juice called at the temple mound. revering it as a fast temple, they pray at the western war. these really cabinets held its weekly musing and tunnels below the war on sunday. in 1967 jordan and israel agreed that the walk is on a trust would control the compound. and israel would control external security. only muslims are allowed to pay in the most qual, jews probably outside at the west. and will, deluxe allows non listens to visit the compound 5 days a week under its supervision. and torres are also allowed.

the also more or less i'm joined by august and television, we have a long road. he's the executive director of an ex, chavez and his really. and you are welcome to protect ancient sites for the public and people of all faiths. and communities in london is mazda in tennessee and his director of the palestine institute for bias. i've asked in sustainability, he's also the founder and director of the palestine museum of natural history in boston is. rami whoring is a syndicated columnist and also the director of global engagement at the american university of beverage. i will welcome to you all and thank you very much for joining us today on inside story. i want to start with this cabinet meeting, which i believe was also convinced to knock israel, jerusalem de mazda. why was the choice of a new, quite so provocative to ah, yes indeed. i mean, a, is a government from its funding listed arisen and tires and that sort of thing. so learning it to you over the land of pen assignment,

calling it said you were busy rides, as well as creating a pretext for colonization, giving you an excuse. that is not. my vision is to return the jews to some historic time that they had before. and hence they wanted to, i said to let me see over these areas which by international law they have no ride to course as an upkeep, buying power. so that's what they haven't been doing. creating pretext. busy for color, life zation, for expansion, and failing, and finally, and the out of 2 logical or historical relevance. basically it's pretext, and this is one of the pretext i agree it. let me ask you a little bit more about the tunnels that this meeting took place in the past of the west and will along side it. can you tell us a little bit more about about the sites and,

and its significance. so the kind of themselves they are running in time to, to, to watch them all to the, i'll show you will basically and then major on the, the by where all the, all to the jews are there. and for that we have to understand that they will see it saw as built layers upon layers. and there are all these faces. so i feel like it is such as excavations um basically are clearly all these spaces and allowing uh, different developments such as a student, the places that the closest as well this choice of holding a cabinet amazing that this also came on the hills of commons from the time of been given the far right is really minister who actually walked in to be outside most compound and,

and made those comments. and they appeared to be very deliberately provocative rami, is there a sense that this is a little positive, a, a strategy at all this fall, right? government scaling off as of narratives. perhaps. yes, this is part of a strategy that organized or santabonyas among designers, especially extreme designers and other dates back about a 100 years to the very beginning of the process by which a small group of jewish designers, extreme, this nation was convinced that british and 1917 to a promise that there would be a jewish national home in palestine. the balance of desperation was issued by the by pressing which has no right to do the land. and so this is part of a long historical process by which the some jews modeled village. uh, sometimes uh,

tried to do everything that can do them to the process of the contemporary. as mentioned a part time employee who is on that says jews have the total rights to live in this land and to define it in their image and their legacy. non dues have only ones that are left over. so in this extroversion and the totals understand what, what they find little players, they find other learners slammed players. and they just either ignore the motivation. one of the model. this longer phones or structures i found was driving to enjoy the bible, the center. so this is really a continuation of what we can best call archaeological colonialism in apartheid. that gets reduced pharmacy of exclusivity, 10 life in the lab. they want to give us one for her m,

whatever is under the impulse of how long you mentioned to the layers upon layers of history here. obviously this is a, an area that's very rich in human history. and there are many interpretations of, of what you're finding that especially of what's on the ground. when in your mind that long did the politicize ation of archaeology hit really begin. so i, i see, or geology is political. so i'm just beginning to reach that decision wherever we want to ask of a problem. i want to excavate which layer as do we do more of this for you to research? which last would be emphasizing later on when we present, besides to the probably these or basically more political decisions. so when you have a place, especially like the old city where you have thousands of years, years of human friends. um the,

the fact that the state of history is emphasizing by how locating a lot of resources and by just not just excavation, but also to reason and, and there was a vision of these as all the and the outcome is that we are given a very one sided, sorry, of those live and why the, the, or ignored as the rest of these layers of the rest of these be it as my comments you're set along and you're saying the that every single decision is a political decision. i wonder how it has become quite so charged mazda, an archaeologist of supposed to be scientists on this. so how has oncology become quite so subjective here? and this started out in the 19th century, the beginning zionism and the politicize ation. a lot of k o and g 's talked to

them when the sign expiration funds sent some archeologist to try and prove if you want stories in the by the, the time the artifacts has created failed to show other sock, you know, and just failed to show this and in fact stephen is a, the archeologist like is what i think of the, you know, the some of really invest the, wrote the whole call 101 missed some of the live them based on those keywords. you can examination that these 4 mission logic is a branch and historic get into the, you know, fabrications of the bible. the other 2 is of course, a set of budget present. get an agenda. this is nothing unusual and well, there's 3 uh, printed citation. lucky o g is done and now that oppression but is not as blatant 10 as

i don't know how to describe it. what was the one can use uh words like out of google and you can racism log utilize, it can a part time or q. and you can call noise ation, but it is a system that same green one item number of people like much is a yahoo is a minute that are man becoming causing quote, a mentor of appeal to just gathering and stealing basically the facts. and i'm using them in um, in justifying something you know, like can i'm, it's a god's to fax being reading that printed somehow quote, the jewish dollars to fax this, this is the to you. but trying to prove this connection, then it is a failure or at some level that is also the to f r good behind it, including the use of these tunnels, which what does

a long before and the potential of the hebrew arrays very like history. we have to remember the reason for shot and was built by the english side driver's side long before and the associated history is that it was associated with there's a but this is a history of the country that is can i take my ancestors off canada tickled carson, so this is so unfortunate, you know, politicize ation about. busy even as a the, the some backyard, just as i mentioned this field and i'm told that it's the last i want to pick up on something that you said that you talked about, archaeologists receiving funding. and i'm wondering where on me is that how you all are just being influenced, or is it primarily about receiving funding or money for that digs and how, what, what kinds of summons are we talking about here?

i couldn't tell you the exact amount, but the reality is that the parking ologist generally attempt to be serious scholars apply certain rules are talking ology in terms of their excavation and their analysis of their publishing their phones. a lot of this is not followed in that kind of work. that is really, is doing an interesting and i have other parts of palestine. and as you know, so i would say you have the political are the logical motivation. that is the strongest one. and is really a rather than people want our money because it's on it when i around the all or just let me just mention 2 quick things as to real bigger problems related to this, the whole biblical to actually provide all the whole test on. i've read through as many times i've written about that before gallery and mostly in jordan, a 1000 people are geological tests are part fiction. our

imagination part of the solidly, the national aspirations and part of factual evidence written by a whole group of people between the, the, the, the 9 some some century and you see a put together. so these biblical texts, the old testament, especially the hebrew bible, cannot be seen as verifiable, texts to follow, that's one of the other one is that these are, these are, have desperately for a 150 years. the test, the colonial british american boston extreme is on the advantage of target. just looking for evidence of stuff changing the song that they have in jerusalem. and this is what they're still trying to do to they have their peers knows who could refutable evidence. there's little density on there, but there's little pencil. introduce all of them, at least like the, the,

for me and the questions along with the release of the, the idea that this was one area that was dominated by the deluxe or not. because an ancient times they lived there a chance for, but it's, it's designed, it's not going to this website is lots of state for the jewish people. and they started working on it a 100 years ago and they should see this. but they're now been pushed bar on many, many facts because the facts are coming out. so you have to look at the august. i'm sure when you look at this alone, i want to bring you in here because i, i do want to ask you specifically about the loud foundation. i understand that they've been involved in a lot of funding around some of these things. can you characterize for our view is who they are and perhaps if they are becoming more active on the discovery and you know, say, well a lot is, is a google assessors the identifies the neighborhood, the city one as the city of david. uh,

and they have been working uh for many years in this region in the area. see why, for the 2 main purpose is one, is that the border of houses as defense mechanisms and the other is to create is too risky to risk educational areas. uh, all the remains for different areas and to create is kind of additional that attraction to, to is attending basically the story, all of the city of david david and so on. so wow, and i see that what does this uh we have to look at a lot authoration and we'll generate a dealership, a little different mechanism as a, based on to me comments. why don't you, you weren't charges as basically strongly. so what happens when you declare

a specific you hear me as a designated as or do i just on the side and the other is the story or arguments because then i'll do is really cost and introduce remains and then, and then how this works. and to end these to with what a lot is we can create is to basic occupational tourism. and so to say uh this how this. ready mechanism works basically what, let me bring rami back in here to, to talk about the tourist side of things because obviously this is a huge money maker for the israeli government. i'm curious about how much revenue, if you can give us a vague sense that these really government does get from these sites every year. i understand we're talking hundreds of thousands of visits is yes. and then there are different kinds of archaeological sites. the, the is really, is trying to develop

a contract to the jewish ones are important for them, for nationalistic psychological, propagandistic, and colonial reasons. and christian ones are important for the best revenues, bedroom christian program to fill out the visitor. so a huge amount of money to be made by developing and hoping to have more of a slot next slide show, slide to show all over the world to store it and just trying to do now in other countries or are doing what these values are very kind of a logical with what they're doing, they're not really interested in that to a religious tourism for all religions that are interested in forming the jewish identity because of this land antiquity and today, and they keep searching for the, you know, the fortresses of david on solomon for is getting a monumental structure that would show this was the capital city. at some point where most archaeologists are basically having saying virtue package and the age of

the judge advanced and married on the issue, i can do that, can go and take with you or what many of the other kingdoms were entities. but they were people who live on a piece of land. they shared some tribal identity. they didn't have massive, huge fortifications and a place to shop and been found in intrusion that had been found by some other parties and syria must obtain. yeah. so it's really important to recognize that we, we should, excuse me every day or 2 article side, whatever it is, a slot, my jewish christian, multiplicity of all these things. honestly, we're, we're, we're integrity, ethical and strongly integrity. and that means you go down the, the ladies round and you find the layers one after the other preserves and what the users are doing, largely in jerusalem was the horse awfully. they going and i'm going to try to find

a more evidence of this and difficult uh, for patient david and solomon. it may exist somewhere, but they're looking for to 150 years and they are, they still haven't found a drop slot the place. so these are, these are really doing a lot of things that are great, criticised by scholars and other people's, they're just relaxing care. the, all of its inhabitants are being what they're like for everybody. romeo talked about digging down right from above. and there's obviously lots of issues about tunneling because hulu is by my understanding a lot of the layers of the art technology as, as we're digging through, if you're doing it horizontally, mazda and i want to ask you, do you feel that awesome sites which perhaps very secret in terms of various different religions, that shouldn't be touched because if you're going to be digging down properly as, as a papa, aki logical take, you have to go from above. i do want to make

a point about this. some point about the relationship between this really government center, this institutions like the fox or nation part. so for t and private institutions, like a lot of these have their zip code. you said what the relationship set the groups like the tell them in the snow and many other groups have the section then brick and reports on for example based now i have as a written report on how they. busy set the level again on zation was vilegas by the government and how they out of that range on united zation in 2018 for example. the total number of photo list was 160000000 chico's for any lab you know, and the lot of the new and novel, it's probably much more or less a. and they have a sense of what a value, the some of the many associate goals that have controlled. so they are very well

see the organizations that many times they also have branches in the us and then they came what i am now, i'm bradley visiting where they get a tax deductible donations from what seems to jewish individuals. connections either says that there's a portal that i can submit these, but then the next us here between that is i ended, government likes the nation park so sorry, which basically doesn't, doesn't even supervisors what the lab does. nature and fox, so sorry t, as in that, as the 2 aspects, nature reserve service big and the national parks, national parks are places like to on what they call the city they with them and so on. and most of the areas that they as a government uses and then their own work to view on their websites. you see that

they. busy right, the main purpose behind designate the nature there's a national parks is to set reside in the plasma inside inside is that i'm not really about sort example them nature reserves protecting the lives in the back and the just to jump in there because i understand that the implications for residents who are living in what's now been designated at the nature reserve or national park, yet that they, their homes are at risk of a concrete as the animal. is there a huge implications for them? i wanted to ask alone about a particular number that i came across and looking at this issue. and it was from 2019. at that point 61 protestant and communities living next to aki logical side, supporting within the jurisdiction of regional set. the councils had been evicted and bought from re entering the land. presumably along that number has increased and recent news. i don't know this number of the words originally saw. but

as i said, are georgi that is considered by us as a way of leaving here. and the use of certain properties. so the fact that is a mindset, the use of national forests and the designation of our doctor, the size, can be used also in order to limit what use one can do with the lat. now as an archaeologist, i can tell you, organizations like these are the different to somebody. they have roles and absolute power as long, but also to get in with the national park as it would be to the telling to bulldoze of. ready science and we do know, let me look at the cases like susie, uh and uh she though and, and, uh, natalie, somewhere that were there were people who evacuated because of the reasons.

uh and, and their home whose became, and that's all part of the same goal was, is slowly with the neighborhoods. didn't wanna advise you know about it and to some degree other places and be able to do that. i may have to with that. so i just, i just want to clarify for our view as this one which you're referring to is a palestinian village under which excavations have been going on. and i understand they've caused cracks and walls and some parts of how this thing and homes to collapse. rami i want to throw this to you because nothing said earlier, he alluded to the fact that this is actually illegal on the international that any kind of excavation in occupied territory is illegal. is there any kind of recalls the international law is something that is rarely is taught to disregard

the the times that they've done colonization. taking people out arresting little children, everything that is or has done this to, to them to do lives. there's killed over a 100 people this year so far. and the rage is against international law, but they don't care. and the people who and see already created this model and international law after world war 2 and world war wow. most of the european powers in the united states, they're not doing anything about it. so they have to community to do whatever they want to kill foreign journalists, actually, mclaughlin, american posted in new journalists, they do whatever they want. but also to recognize that archaeology is just the one to ember toolbox that designers and uses to, to fix the cost. and that's designers. and to get the color simians out and have a purely or very heavily jewish state that couldn't do it. and for the 748,

the discharge of on 500 villages. they think loud because they make nature reserves and they make shootings. i was like south of trevor and now they're just drawing us in the villages, the shooting areas for the army. they take the last for shuttle was expansion, there take less or more of the issues of the table actually create in places where you are being jurist and some of the maximum intensity of the sounds and body villages. it's crazy. they will come up with any reason you want to be able to excel, costing them from the around the nose as judy as that flash of the, the cheap to get the northern german i from the law. the international community doesn't, but i pressure on them and that's more of the major pressure on the israelis, on the part i just of has come from the, the, the board of the restroom sections of the ship decidedly move are leading the process. the student government is totally, are not totally interactive pension,

actually large, lot implemented. so civil society is leaving this process. so we're starting to get it up against the is rarely move in the courts and the me so she, they are 2 logical issues and other than the normal major perspective. what does that they're part of the design was trying to judy eyes and maintain the slide for over for you very much about telling a story and aid. well, we'll leave our discussion last for today. thank you to all of i guess along the road from me, cory and mazda income c a. and thank you to for watching. remember, you can see this program again, any time by visiting our website that's out of there. a. com. and i've had the discussion do, gosh my facebook page, that's a facebook dot com forward slash a inside story. remember, you can also join the conversation on twitter. handle is as a inside story for me and as long as you pay on the whole team here and uh huh. bye

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