least the vast idea of the salt lake, a unique ecosystem that indigenous communities are desperate to protect from a mining people empower asks, is it possible to extract the metal without causing an environmental catastrophe? argentina's white goals on that just renewed. find you in northern molly between the military and um groups view and it's speeding up the withdrawal of as peacekeepers as the security situation to terrorists can molly, women's bathroom for stability, and how to form plants shape the conflict. this is inside story, the other walk into the program. i'm going to talk to you in peacekeeping mission, and molly says it's a tier or anything security situation is forcing it to speed up is withdrawal from

the country. a week ago, 6 you and troops and dozens of finance from an armed group were killed in a confrontations near the northern city of back. the u. n. is already in the process of wrapping up its operations. in june, the security council voted to terminate the decades long mission, announcing the $13000.00 peacekeepers would leave money by the end of the year. they followed a request from the military government, which accused and u. n. a fading to act against on groups. there is a diverse range of plas adding to the instability in money. so who all the different groups and what areas today control? well 1st as a coordination of, as was movement, sol, cma, which is a coalition of must be to are a groups there advocating for grateful autonomy and independence for region of northern molly known as, as what. that's where i just have a history of grievances with the military, like government which took part 3 years ago. it's a network of lines in as in, for, and support strained relations with full met colonial pa, from to let the june to,

to seek alternative backing, which includes most res, from russia's wagner group, along with the pro government fights as a number of other groups operating money, some of them are aligned with iso and i'll call you to and the complexities on the ground of how to put the efforts to stabilize molly set out in a 2015 piece deal. before we discussed the various elements of play with, i guess, as far as this report from carlock hacking the bags and heading home, the united nations peacekeeping mission in money is coming to an end. launched a decade ago, the operation became the u. n's most dangerous. the so called blue helmets deployed to help the military flight on groups in the north. in june optic rubbing public descent and what the foreign minister described as a crisis of confidence. the military government asi you and to withdrew its 13000

peacekeepers. the un security council voted unanimously to drill down the forces off by the end of the year. please raise their hand as you dis, just by government accusations of un interference and counter accusations of widespread abuses by soldiers. the head of the mission quoted, a success turned in manufacturing. i left the on the table and come by or by the the mission did a very good job with cost is not perfect. we worked with devotion, sincerity, and coverage, and we paid a high cost. 300 my colleagues have lost their lives and 700 were injured saving modeling. so we feel we have done a lot. franklin tamale's military government disagrees, and believes the country is better off without the un. it's a ready sort help from russia's walk in a group. human rights organizations accused the mercenaries of war crimes and they were fee, is that without the peacekeepers, things will only get worse. need somebody. yeah. a lot of me my,

the in somalia and the state and the body and we will try to take over those. you in positions which appears to make sense, but given the context and the soul and piece process, the presence may increase existing tension. on a year ago, french troops ended in h. u, a deployment. after a breakdown in relations between molly and its former colonial power. in the subsequent months, the groups of intensify their attacks and extended their reach. cruise in neighboring the king of faso, anesha have added to regional instability and sofa. the west african block has failed to make good on its threats to intervene and restore order by force. with several parties now fighting to gain ground left behind by the un. it's the people of molly who main court in the middle car leg for inside story

or. and it's trying to unravel the complexities of all this. joining me now or i guess and bottom. okay. we have moved to a condo, who's a former especially advisor to the president of money. he's now executive director of this a hell institute for democracy and governance in ankara is of big way. are going to do a security on list focusing on west africa. and it's a hell of a frequently to get a security consultancy also in pamlico is possible. and so political and security, unless specializing in this a how and founder the to watch a piece network into about to a warm welcome to all of these great to have you with me sir, if i could start with you. so if i may m 1st up, why does the money and government think the un forces such as to requirements? uh, yeah, thanks so much for having me here. and if i ever was, uh, 1st of all, we have to think about the position and also the role of the un mission in molly since the arrival, and also the improvement of the situation in the field. and are simply after the

military code in uh, 2020 and the 2nd in may 2021. we've seen another direction thinking by the inches of the transition and especially in the midst of reactions in the field . so taking over the control over everything. yeah. this is what entity, as dimensions is a part of alpha concurring or recall coloring. all of these dates are you uh to now good by and by the fall i remember groups who are cussing her now has the signing of groups of a piece. aggravated enough, julia saw this much more bottle for data banker and they had the one the uh, the power of the national army. so at this moment or not, when expecting the end of day, do you envision in molly, in this uh, amount of this situation? right. what it's about to happen is the fact of my outlines. at august 2022. the

french, the last french trades pull out of molly august 2023 year later. un peacekeepers of pac. yep. is it not inevitable fatima that violent would and will continue to spiral. oh hi. everyone saves you so much for your patience. i think uh, it really depends. um, it would depend how would they handle their um, different basis, because right now, a certain uh you in a peacekeeping basis in the different of the kind of mind. i think the way the hand over the money i got when would depend on how the violence uh the process would be now, it is definitely to her. i think 1st of all, it is very important that the present, the process of the hanover of the different bases is very inclusive. when i mean it gives the right, i mean having like the. ringback reasons discussion with the un mission and the

government at the same time. also having to start session with the arabs because the arrows like that basis that a key maybe sensitive basis like a kid that that's at least and i don't know those other pieces of the basis that they really feel like they want those bases. and i thing like what we do, like a very aggressive hanover, we don't really haven't collected fund sensational room. it's might be a violence hanover and it's, we're not the cv for the cdns. so i think before we go to like the next hanover, which is to die is really happened in september. i think it will be very important for the money in our meet the demand government. so actually sit down the to the same i and know the permanent dependence. and we'll, we'll see how they can really talk and see how they can have the as i mentioned before, the minutes my head will,

that was basis. so i've seen the orange front of my eyes all the way. i 1st of all, do you think such a sit down conversation between the, the ministry leadership and non grievances likely. and secondly, how serious do you think the situation is? it's yeah, it's a very serious situation and it sounds that will drop me no smile or is it a lot of questions more however, would you progress as specific or to the home oliver? yes. uh this, it looks, it has happened since owed to the, or just process documents including the agreement that the consultation notes so that it's the lead. so the new constitution. so i think the government, those have access on some form of maybe to me see the eyes of a vis, disrepair about rebels. so it comes to come this cost this that comes downstairs with the rebels. and so the is small. okay. but when you and pull out, who will take that place in suddenly and who will take the place and in the

barracks and stuff will depositions to yeah, i mean, the doctor's, the big question i just wanted to see is what i was thinking way about money now, so booking, booking across the us? well we did, we do, i was annoying the size of the of the, um it's a, it's a huge challenge. you know, i mean immuno smart with about 1717000 strong tons of a lot of sources. mind you before, even this month we drove there was the disclosure or the drug, donald french troops and offers on by and by comments as about $5000.00. so we did one year looking at we got about $20.00 to 2000 in of a. so doesn't mean we're me saying it from the buckle feet between missing, but am ali on farms neighboring countries. that's the issue to go on. i think for molly, at this moment is leaning more towards russia. the good thing is getting with consumers out due date is also performing the services of providing them. however, there is no when russia come over and i can provide the amount of forces to blow up

the pickups in hostile recruiting from within the population to make up for the, for this a shot default. right, and we'll get onto the document just a 2nd. but me, so i just wanted to ask you before that at, you know, this is the point is that this by kim is gonna be left by the you and it's, it's several 1000 forces who will now access mediation once they've gone. yeah, so i, i just sort of big go by queen the under point you just mentioned because the sure the do not admission is about 17000 people. but more than 60 percent of these other people will not get into the filters, even though it's been a lot of others. i've done that and working very different areas of development and as community does support the system to be with the developing program so that maybe even the government of molly thinking go in the united nation mission, is doing things which would not ask them to do isn't one thing, the 2nd thing most,

so anybody around over the bought rice, me just my, the resolution book by the molly, it has been clear, they should keep this back to the government of model. whatever happens even though the thing is not the right way. but when you think it'd be psych remaining in a julia in 2016 all the signing recall, nice the serenity and the independence of model. so this is one point. so it will be going back even though this, when the agreement was signed in every position, the position. so that made the, uh, the form it reveals, drew well defined to dial in other places enough in region. so that makes them like there were some, some of the areas, but when the reason is if the, the wind throwing so all of your sleep big bags and box to the government. so whatever the groups are not going to accept that all day,

they just waiting to accept that. so, so that's why i didn't say we shouldn't have like an hmo revision between margins to sit down and also recently implemented the from the groups from 2000 and mentioned that vision to have a new position between my you to sit down and say, what would be the next step because they have a good seat and the problem is given not more than enough and regions is much more pleasant in the center where we have more to is the best is then enough in region. so that means the pressure that means been bending the irishman of the size of the struggle of the conflict is, is not even by that 100 present to get to nothing urgent. but now how do thing large and things be including everyone in this conversation. so we have a piece. okay, uh, let me bring in front of her at that point to if they are all these discussions and negotiations advice. so i'd have to bring something to the table it. and if the

government say that they want to take over the, the old un positions, what are the groups going to get more to and what, what's the sort of bug? yeah, actually that's why i mentioned earlier that sitting down because right nowadays, no dialogue between the between the groups and the government and i thing when they sit down and actually talk in fact they can come home to appointment. i remember, but and you said i can't find a way because it's easy to say that forgive me, it's easy to say that isn't it? but yeah, what would i give them or to yeah, i'm going to come to the point of see what a few weeks ago, there was a implementing case on social media and saying like one of the demands of the i'm that i'm aware didn't create fees to open it i don't do are asking for. ringback a release of some of the prisoners and, and my, the government have to do the really need someone to present or is the hell of the space security even when to get out of just got to the i'm route and they have released some of the prisoners and the 2nd request,

the was changing the minutes of reconciliation, which is like a very sensitive demand. and the 3rd one was actually they have been since they haven't jumped at the constitution. so they wanted the government to actually cancel it or even see how they can open it back. and i think was 2 dimensions. where like when the government like are very skeptical and i see what they can find a way to sit down and see how they can find it. for me, i remember on those 2 demands, i think they can uh uh, come up with a solution and i don't think the solution will be coming from like an international mediation or anything like that because it didn't work. it's happening before i go . yeah. cuz i remember i did being like do most haven't been like me like infinity efficiency in, in thing like the data between the government because the none of them have been cut off. it's been lost and i don't know they don't really talk. so i think the important have the most, i'd say to have like an extra internal conversation,

the governments need to take the initiative and unable to actually sit down. and so i'm gonna see how they can not to the table. that's the big way. what do you make of that? the fact that we could turn this round and just say out of this, this pull out to there is an opportunity. there's an opportunity for discussion, a chance for it's. it's also seek resolution. is it like me? is it possible? do you think it's, i think it's part of the part of the previous week, itemize the 3 requests, the, the, the time groups i'm meeting 111 who really understands how this process is really good news that the government really at this point has to make concessions because you, you, you really need very difficult position regarding the withdrawal is such a huge amount of, you know, pricing pop up and you don't really have witnesses. so you have the,

the mom parkins to block the pickup. so at this point, it has to really feasible that little, i mean, these are going to make that they're going to go to the game. you have to make concessions. so for this on the pay a particular point, they bought brother, minnesota, comes of frequency visually. again, that's very sensitive like the rustic i said. but maybe you should because the alternative is going to be very busted. and i think that's, that's the point. the kind of distress and of the fact of it is if the situation is not complex enough. now we bring in the wagner madison, raise, what is the mandates and what do you think that presence on the ground does to the whole situation? i mean, the money is, especially when the money and government have never legal denies have the aspect that is lacking there. they always did a was days of instruction risk instruction that you know, under the growth. and i think the nature of the russian ministry under the grow id,

friends from the nation that the, when it was thing to you. and really it was working on community based dialogue with different community. the more like having you, you money to an access in places that the money in government cannot have access to . and i don't think that the russian military wouldn't be able to how money on that . and that's not even that initial down with that for that. so i think right now is a way, it's like for the government to come out with this type, did you on how to actually fill out the got do you mind telling him that like for instance, the accident that happened in bed having like a, is it a week the impact response from the government to actually how to do is like communities to have access to the money to the and how. and i think a few weeks ago and in my name dot middle, how happened last label is fine, which is like 500 and you know, the time to hold for like,

for me to like to die. amen. i kind of, we were like community based programs so that organizations that are working on you monitoring and they can give them the funding so that they can actually because we need to be around the 1st time with a developed domestic raise that you know, back to my questionnaire, how are they helping the situation that i'm say, the nation. i love this in the military that for military uh, for reasons. so they're not there to help them do you mind to you in apartment? so definitely my government responsibility to, to, to work on that. okay. reset. what, what's your view of the, the volume to a position here because it said that civilian casualties have more than tripled since wagner forces with deployed tamale in late 2021. so how are they helping in any way the piece equation uh, 1st of all as um i believe said officially the government said that he's no wagner

. so even though the minnesota reporting it for the rush, i said buckner just didn't bother me. i would say i would go with the russian center. so tell me what exactly did sufficient in the field you're getting really borrow for in that said, the 1st of all of the not bringing any you made certain support because been not of you for that. and similarly they are doing a lot of human rights abuse and we have heard is from a lot of victims directly from the field. i have personally not been there to the devil tact verified buttons. we say this same way as i did not know record of that on file. so i will not implement even these by the way people are moving from the places and the way that people are living their own philly, just because of that. and because of all human rights abuse from the partners of the national army,

these are things we didn't bad that on say they this russian as center gross. not bringing any kind of support to the piece we building right now. and also going to feature because i definitely believe even the way we build the piece depends on how we do the conflict. so the way things that are happening, it would be really hard for equations and living together in this scenario where these guys are acting, the thing is, uh me. so the way we do the conflict as you put it, it, it's not being done in a good fashion anyway. is it because according to us extra estate i just need blinking. uh, many of those tests that i talked about, where were the results of operations conducted by molly and on forces along side members of the vault and a group? so yeah, definitely because of the end of the calculations what to will not move to work.

you know or may not, i will not move to committed to the new shift bid on the city is where the remainder has been seen in what a set of people. so if there is like an illegal, i mean the worst situation everyone can find each other, but here's the key or it kind of fall human rights abuse, reached a point. it wouldn't be really hard for people to understand the individual for the, for, to build a really strong and lasting piece. that's why i said the way it through conflict, because counseling is not like at the end of the day, some of those will be no more than a day. big difference, a lot of these companies now, we're not fighting another mission. the company is operating between brothers, between sisters and whatever they mississauga spinning for gay. however, the county dates, it's a very important to keep this in mind. like i've put in conflict. i've been in peace. however, with get it would be living together at the families as brother if there's okay,

let's put in the house a little bit of away. what are the dangers of this combusting regionally given the, the playing the unsettling nature of things right now in the chair and elsewhere. so yes, i think it is very close out. the mainland government does not lose peoples things to us. we are seeing and using this must have drilled down off of troops for i mean those my particular and that is because one of the quotes of bids. most of the reasons you had to groups in this i have is it probably going to love a region which is it tried both uh, between my lead burkina faso on, on your, on the right. now really something between molly, i'm looking at parts is very good. if you're doing title image, it takes the color of this power v, of course, uh, because of the support of my number. can it possible providing mind they might be, might be very into just stick to us for me something more than once and not, not during tax force because the districts the, the 5th does not,

not talk much at all. so we definitely solutions have to be drawn, smashed on the issue of success, i'm using my separate isn't a model is, is, is it is a little issue is that makes sense about in addition to the issue of towers as well? well, present infinity in the country, so modeling can not necessarily use people booked into the house. we'll find a way to ensure the both the political process is we being money we think of is going through the groups. it is when handled. what are the same time it has the military capacity gives music opportunity with the money and also extend our lease community corporation with regional conscious particularly mother and became of us on the year to ensure that they continue to come down on the service. okay, and that's what i've been to the region because they don't then the situation. i think this to me would be you know, mean useful compared to what it's going to be coming to is. yeah,

so that's very troubling. is that the fact that it is a complex web of interest and the alliance is in malia and in the region to say the least and to add to that money itself is had a ministry government since 2020 the leadership is bound to restore a civilian governments do, they were on cost for that to happen. the oh yeah, i see the uh we, we, uh we, we have done the dish or the 1st harvest thing, which is organizing like duty from dogs. now they might in government have a new constitution. and a few weeks ago they had a meeting with all the pretty to go after is to discuss on the deadline of when they should be organizing the election. i think i don't like the fence 14 or like i don't like the political party to power of the meeting for 15 percent or 15 of them . well, a weekend like postponed the organization of the election,

which was supposed to be in march to another. these a 40 percent? well i know we have to organize that excellent in march. so i think right now it is a discussion when they actually finalizing the date of organizing the election. i think that's the key, much like been defense to say that they are going forward. i think there's a chance that they may actually on the 9th of the election and he's followed the legacy then after all right, we'll see about old times out to depreciates oil perspective. thanks very much to i guess the music on the overweight griego and fatima alonso thank sir and very much indeed and thank you for watching. you can see the program again at any time by visiting our website i'll just or dot com. and for further discussion, just go to our facebook page, that's facebook dot com, forward slash ha inside story. and you can also join the conversation on x a handle. is that a j inside story for me, mccloud and the whole team here in the it's bye for now.

the the, [000:00:00;00]

the as a i driven robots become more intelligent and more a ton and this will lead out smart us. do you think you could from the world one day if i ever decided to take on the world? i'm sure i do a great job. roberts never gets tired. sophia, one of the world's most advanced human like robots, and i'll be talking to algebra. african narrative from african perspective to be some money by sky. this seems to be a good fight. short documentary term, an african still make is from kenya, nigeria, and we want to talk someone conservation from a joy into the traffic and feeding the game applicant direct. just away from home, these ukrainians and bodies celebrate division found

a national holiday designed to uphold the traditions of ukraine's national clothing . with looks lot like a russians. we have separated language and we have national close. nearly $60000.00 russians arrived in body last year, making them the 2nd launch is goof off towards the number of ukrainians arriving, as also increase the number of tens of russian arrivals. the 2 countries are to the thousands of the citizens living on the side of each other on this intrusion. i alena too is had a bakery and keep. for now, she says she'll remain here the dreams of the day when she can return home award winning for 27 years and thoughtfully confinement. it's an extreme formalized solution. i think it's designed to break international, so make well clos, janet, 80 percent of 80 percent is controlled by god. bring programs to a spine. you don't be any time on an amount of time. i'm trying to push myself all the time. pushing, pushing, see the world from

a different perspective on. ouch is era. we know what's happening in our region. we know how to get to places that others can know as far as instead of going or the way that you tell the story is what can make a difference. the, [000:00:00;00] the hello i'm about to send, and this is the news, our life from dell coming up in the next 60 minutes. voting is underway in ecuador as presidential election days after one of the candidates was assassinated. that's confirmed el supply. ukraine with f. 16 jets to help him to fight against russia. russia, as far as mood admission in almost 15 years ends in failure as