is doesn't operate, yes. didn't play that rules, that is what you, when you talk to political, not least didn't play their hands or play the kinds of very well. i'm so africans looking towards, but he's now either full financial assistance or military assistance to deal with that one crisis. how many trays? seeing a bu, jerry, yeah, thank you very much for that. the. the $1900.00 cmt 10 pm. in moscow, you're watching ology, sierra and i live continuing coverage of the breaking news story out of russia. where wagner approve founder you have any per goshen has reportedly died. freshman officials say he was among the passengers on a plane that crashed a few hours ago. the jet went down in that very june north of moscow. 7 passengers and 3 crew members will on board the craft, which was in route from moscow to saint petersburg. at a multiple videos which have been posted on social media,

which appeared to show the jet on fire. let's get the latest with daniel hawkins in moscow for us. what's the latest information done we have we've also media citing sources close to the investigation on c, saying the russian and the rest of the committee. all now looking at several versions of what could have happened around the they opened the case into a breach of aviation goals, essentially, negligence. now the understanding saw, i think russian media here is the look you up multiple versions including part of the era technical hour on the plane as well as external influence. so again, that is a brushing media, citing these investigative committee members on c. now looking into a multiple versions of discretion, not simply some sort of accidental which on safety rules that fits into schools

with eye witness accounts, which rushing media have said, reported bloss, at least to bloss before this plane came sporting to the ground. spill no news on report solve that 2nd jet truman, the russian media. uh for the last 20 minutes. the server has to be reporting 20 seconds yet. right? just the 2 is going for goes in, circling from moscow. having landed at one of those most square pools, still no news officially home. what happened to that check? he was on board and any more on that uh full nowadays. right. you have a need for goshen. uh the head of the russian. in fact, the most scenary group was listed very early on as one of the passengers on the plane that went down 2 days ago, there was a video of him in africa on the african continent. he was previously in bella roost . we know why and what he was doing and russia at this time

a lift gate precaution has been sponsored the media reports since that failed needs me all. the 24th or 23rd, i should say of june multiple times. it was supposed to the st. petersburg forum meeting african dignitary is of course, bog that has very link close links to several african states. we heard from nicholas on the witness that also for media reports that so for goes along, signed his right hand man to meet the old king. the section of a found all vol gonna was flying back from africa to russia in the last 24 hours both. so it was, his aims in russia was it's hard to say at this stage, of course, most of his policies, those that chose the stay in people, you know, now located in the roof where they've been working and training the been a russian all me and account that's been expanding. so housing, thousands of log into fighters imposing great concern across the border, of course in poland. so it was clear that so you have any promotion,

despite the clear judy had with the russian. how come on with the defense minister? so agree with the head of chip stall, garage symbols, still had a role to play in russia's interest and most goes interest both in now for components and in but it was, he was and he, he moved around according to these media report. so really and let's say it was sponsored at the sort of major events, what exactly caused him to come back from us for code, but he appeared in the video a few days ago is unclear at this stage. okay, daniel, thank you for the moment. daniel hawkins lived there in moscow, and here now is i'll just here is dimitri med with dental, who's been taking a closer look at the wagner group and the mind behind it all. a real good spot if you have any pre ghosts, rose to power and russia from humble beginnings and st. petersburg. after being jailed for 9 years for robbery and fraud, he became a hot dog salesman,

and then the man known as pretend chef his catering company hosted events for foreign leaders as well as president vladimir putin, his private birthday parties. it wasn't until 2022, the precaution admitted that he had found it the wagon a private military company, 8 years earlier in eastern ukraine. he previously denied all connections to the most scenary group and suit any one linking him to work that most. and the result illegal in russia, but precautions close links to prove to him and rushed as a lead, allowed him to bypass legislation and gave possible deniability of any involvement in operations of a seats as well as ukraine. the wagner group has been links to military operations in syria since 2015 and aiden government's combat, reval groups, and the central african republic, libya molly and so don precaution is also linked with existing military and political influence, and chad, mozambique and zimbabwe has been so successful as

a private, so military company has become essentially a franchise. and so you have different, really, very distinct organizations that carry the same brand. it was an important force and rushes invasion of ukraine, including the assaults on some of the and i commute a precaution commanded up to 50000 troops and ukraine, mostly recruited from russian prisons in exchange for pardon. he underlined his most of mary's victories while playing down the role of the russian army to obviously put and has created precaution regardless of a self made man. he spoke most projects to create a sort of a competitive alternative military for assuming usher to boost the effectiveness of the regular russian army or go through this later to end into open criticism with the golden didn't mean says was in attacking defense minister said h,

i go and chief of stuff i let it get us involved for under supplying his troops. well, not so you can watch go by pretty positive. we have a 70 percent shortage of admission. shelly, go, garage you month to month. where, where's munition look at the new movie that went back load was seized in may 2023, often more than 6 months of fighting big ocean and his men took a passive roll and the kremlin began to reign in wide, demanding the group register and report directly to the army, the golden refused, and his confrontation with russia's military leadership reached the pointing point on june 23rd. when he was accused of the mutiny entry since reaching that but didn't go out to 0. when i saw speak to segue, my call was a former public spokesman for present 14 and director of institute of political studies in moscow. thank you so much for being with us. i just wanna ask you 1st, i guess your thoughts about what's been happening over the last few hours and these

reports that you have any precaution may have been killed. oh yes, those are fine. use your my elizabeth says church. she was already the my a to the don't you know, sometime moving it was giving cause some of this falls. he was a pound and the legal was a, a, this related to the girl. but is there more than bolt, quite incorrect in terms of it as a human on. so ha, now is that i see the option bonnet. it's a occasional connection. i think the decision, nobody videos is a 2nd. that sounds that, that it's, uh, been a good night bye. you could and, and i sort of just because these uh would be a gift. uh, so were you great. uh because of, uh, tomorrow, uh, independence day, well, 5 grade. and so the sense that it would be our lives is are launched bytes, um, not action. uh,

so it is so specifically defense minutes instead of the show results. uh, what was, uh, it was, it went back to the list for some reason. uh now you're getting if it goes up and forwarded even otherwise you, which i'm happy to send over our system. so i support the conditions that they. ready was a different set back to the full file you put in, you know, sort of just because, but you couldn't, you know, sort of just if you're getting a big boss in the box in the groups wasn't better the m s and the survey to be successful thoughts this, the jetta subpacket submitted it, but there's also a lot of bad blood between him and the 10. and since the failed, the failed school in june since the failed mutiny, what would we know? what would you crane gain out of killing precaution? as you say, a sink cuz that would be too old for so if you see this and i sort of just like i might just even cease, but it's not to be because you're so cool. well,

let me put you on and get show you where you're getting it from your from. ready that have not as a problem with the tool because he's a, he's a button, there's room could been diminished to separation. 3 in 10 times. it's one second today. and if i should, i sort of just like i might just play with keel russian pirates. what was his chair was absolutely not guilty about the innocent. so a more appropriate visit that you're getting and also it is because it's freight if it goes on, but that's what you can sort of just let me know if i've got a group as a phase and very much that that of course, is a speculation in your opinion, i wanted to ask you about the wagner group in russia today. uh they, they practically are not involved in the war and ukraine anymore. i mean, they've many of them of left to move to better views, how i present is 5 know, and,

and in rushes military today and rushes activities. so if i sink up most of the group, i know me already assigns that context was actually depressed ministry. so it's almost a 90 percent. some of them are probably a 5 percent we'll say in africa because they have different contexts with a different topic on a conscious sounds and portable revolves 5 percent will stay being billed on our side because they will get billed at us and i meant to be more appropriate for that, i'm more than i was in the let us and i sort of very much it's angel. all possible invasion look for this fun. and some of them will just leave me to, to the service to the peaceful life. because the setup was a call from the station because the beginning, but it wasn't, it was a bit it cut his marty pulido buckner. go. thank you mr. michael for talking to us

and sharing a few 2nd my golf. joining us stay from moscow while us present. joe biden has been briefed about this plane crash that's bringing patio hayden in washington, dc. what's the word out of dc potty? well, i have to tell you, to be honest, i was actually quite surprised that we heard any statement from us, both person at the state department, because usually in these situations with unconfirmed reports, they tend to wait till they have more information. but again, this is folks person who is going to be a named says we have seen the report if confirmed no one should be surprised. this disasters for a new crane led to a private army marching on moscow. and now it would seem to this. so the big question is, when they say it would seem to this, because i think the c i, a and all the intelligence agencies are going to be doing probably exactly what every intelligence agency with a concern here is going to be doing is try to figure out if for version knowing that he had cross vladimir putin would have put his own name on a plane on

a flight manifest that he, in fact was going to be on a. we do know that the ca, when it comes to the upper echelons of russian politics does seem to have very good sources. let's not forget, president joe biden came out before the war and you create a very probably said that putting was going to invade repeatedly. again, that was somewhat of any unusual move to send the message that they had someone so deep inside the criminal. and that was applying the information and it shouldn't be noted that the us in the past when this look, mutiny happened really did try to make quite a bit about it. we heard secretary state after you blinking say this just shows that there's the cracks within the russian government. it shouldn't. they would tell us dr. b, i behind the kids, off camera that they said that they showed a weakness for putin's. and then they really tried to make the case that this should be proof that ukraine's dresses worn ukraine is not about nato at all. and

it was someone unusual president joe 5 and was at a press conference who was asked about the meet me. and he said, if i were him, i'd be careful what age i'd keep my eye on my menu. then he went on to say, i don't know, i don't think any of us know for certain what the future provision is in russia. so again, the big question, i'm sure the intelligence agencies right now are doing what all the intelligence agencies are doing is trying to figure out if he was in fact on that plan. okay, patty, thank you for that. of course, when there's more reaction there from our washington, we'll come back to patty, go and live there in dc. now, as we've been talking over the last few hours, well, there's been a lot of focus on on wagner, and you've got any pro, promotion because of wagner's involvement in the russian invasion of ukraine. that's bringing rob mcbride in keith rob. before i ask you about the extent of rushes of blackness roll in your crate, i wanted to to ask you your thoughts about what our previous guest said. and that was a former spokesman for present routine. talking about these various theories out there

as to who could be behind it any precautions? death if it is indeed confirmed that he's been killed. and he mentioned ukraine saying that ukraine could be behind this. is that far fetched? i yeah, i mean, the reaction here in ukraine would be, well, the russians would say that within that i think they are, we are starting to get some reaction here from the, from the cabin c o socrates from ukraine itself. and they do seem to be indicating this very much has the fingerprints of the russian regime all over it. that said, the ukraine has nothing got total to do with this. we are seeing reaction from that we thought just have a statement from because po, yeah, he's a senior advisor to the presidential office here to the office of let him is a landscape and a saying that a pretty goes in basically signed his own death warrant when he and his words entered into an agreement with both the yellows. lucas sang code the president

there and also, and also puts in a to end his uh, ill fated uh, to attempt to 2 months ago when he entered into that agreement, that was his own doing uh, according to puddle yak, and, uh, the, to the, basically he couldn't except to, couldn't take putin axes would add that this was bound to happen to that is, this is in his words, avoiding by pollutants to a rush is a leak that this is what happens issued. you try to cross me or try to cross the, the regime currently in moscow. i think that's a, this loyalty only equals death in the woods of this ukrainian advise us. so that's very much the view here from t of that this is very much the work of the russian administration. although it is likely that we are likely to see in the coming day. also, various accusations being able to keep the glass would be the, the, the work of, of the ukrainian intelligence. talk to us about vitamins role in the war and

ukraine. oh yeah. i mean there is no love lost here. so you have got any precaution. it's no secret that the group was one of the more effective parts of russians, rushes military. it was largely accredited with taking the city of back move this me grind to of an action that not only i talking waves and waves of these bog enough fights is recruited from prisons and so on from that. and so throughout russia, but also i took the lives of so many ukrainians who are held on defending this city . knowing that the bottle of back moved was gradually, although it was costing so much in terms of material in terms of ukrainian lives. it was gradually bleeding to the russian military and that they had to hold on to defend it as much as they can that they the ukrainians lodge. they will be glad to

see the back of the wagner organizations from ukrainian territory. this now, apart from soldiers who may well have been recruited by the regular russian military. that, of course, was one of the problems that led to precautions uh ill fated to a to attempt to have a couple of months ago. apart from regular russians, who would have signed up to russian on the contract, there's no actual body administration in any of ukraine, but certainly they have been very effective here. and they certainly have that presence in galleries, is still a concert. and that's just a little to the north on the northern border of ukraine. there are concerns that to possibly they might be put back into action again. i think the other thing that will be, as many people have in ukraine will be following is just who else was on this plane . we'd precaution, if indeed it was, it's not consumed, the precaution was on. that plane is thought that some other very senior military

come on just from the vast new group. we're, we're on the cross, you know, the 2 pilots in h. a passengers. if that is the case is what happens now with the remnants of the they staged the 2 attempts 2 months ago. there are still of the remnants of the group around. we are seeing some reports on social media about the threats of restarting some sort of campaign multiple against must go. although we talked to independently verify those comments at the moment. but if there are involved in the rights out there, if this does lead to some sort of backlash from 5 know that they possibly a, some, the elements that tried to start to much on must go again. and that will be followed very closely here in ukraine. and this thing that impacts the uh, the effectiveness of russians rushes military either here in ukraine or indeed back in russia itself. will be a very t lee followed here because i didn't puts on what happens on the front lines here

in ukraine problem. thank you for that. rob mcbride life i sat in keys for the private paramilitary, wagner group was founded by russian business, many of guinea precaution in 2014, after the russian antics station of crimea. wagner forces were recruited by present, pretend to join the war in ukraine. they were heavily involved in helping russian troops capture the eastern city of blackmore, goshen regularly criticized rushes approach to the war, and on june 24th around 5000 wagner. shops advanced towards moscow with the aim of removing the military leadership, but they stopped ops negotiations with the kremlin members as a group have been fighting in africa style legion for years. and the wagner chief, has recently been in molly, had been recruiting fighters to quote, make a continent more free. my own bizarre is a senior political on this. i live in paris to talk about all these developments out of russia today. so i wanted to ask you, my one obviously was talked about the various theories out there as to who could

have been behind us getting for goshen killing if it is indeed confirmed. and already some voice is in moscow saying that the ukrainians could have a role in this. what are your thoughts? what do you know? usually we are faced with any such mystery. the 1st question that comes to mind in any place or any time it is clean born and who benefits. unusual. there's also the opposite question. tweet model is about my benefits or to lose as long as he turns out by that. clearly the premiums probably have a lot to gain if this guy dies, you know, with all the hard vehicles you freight and uh, certainly i'm sure it's part of the sense for me. okay. probably wouldn't see more of your leave. oh, well, you know, as russians will tell, you probably have another way of doing

a driving this particular word muscle. we just heard from our phones findings, washington, what did you say that the united states has something to benefit from that? so there's a risk man, i know as far as united states and was concerned, but it's been this paper. i think it's interesting africa in the middle east in your brain. so i think when it comes to quibble no benefit, so i think there's a number. busy culprits here, we don't know who we don't know why, but clearly the way this has been done, it's done in a spectacular way. meeting. so you know, this plane that basically an explosion falls out of an explanation. we but we haven't visited yet. which is that, you know, accidents happen, right? this does not instead of something that's done creep on with mike read defined intervention by the sense that this is a horrible man that met his face. it's his final days that way he should know that it would, that's the human rights violations that you close all the instability and violence

that he closed in so many places on the world. we don't know, but we do know that apparently his name wasn't that many press center plate has folded and there's a number of parties that could benefit from that us in terms of the future of vac know now we've heard from several guess, we'll say that the group has been decapitated as ever since. in fact, the failed mutiny and the, you know, the failed cool in june. is there a future still 4 or 5? no. any other motion or equals that the russians might create to maintain their influence in regions around the world. as you know, we phones back question after the whole richard cat scandals around the black coats are the american, most of the companies. and that's basically back in that company. and we saw that aspect rock in afghanistan, we would see the minus by proficiency,

change this name, and continues to function. we see other national groups now they will for writing even out on washington. uh, there was nothing new, you know, i visited a number of security private security companies that are on washington, dozens of them. there's also, you know, this is like, is there a boss who has the security for the private security companies? they even ship for interest in the occupied territories. we've seen that also happening and then at least we're seeing happening, certainly in russia. and we've seen some of which also happening from europe in africa. so this has been happening a lot. and it's clearly, it has a benefit for those who hire mercenaries. and the main benefit is that promotion that he used to live and work and function in a gray zone area that they are not exposed to the same disability or to the same transparency that armed forces are. and that's why they are part of the method for international humanitarian law,

because they are major violators of human rights. whether it's for kind of the shipment or you know, culture, they can be ready by the accessible provider and don't pass that truck. i took a hierarchy that belongs to states, photo setting bureaucracy. so i'm saying that not in the way we understand it as far as the student has tried to do it for us. it's basically tied to the d. s. and the question is whether he will try to re, uh, some pick again in a whole other way. so we can use it that way. he's been using it in order to improve the restaurant influence, whether it is in your brain, in eastern europe, in africa, and them, and reset the password that's arranged to be seen. but what i tell you for sure, is that every time we think about that emotionally permits perfect at somewhere, that maybe this is the end of it. or it's the contrary, leasing of regimes, of depressed, and even liberal governments use measurement to go to order to escape

a comfortable how on thank you for that. my on the shower, i, senior political on this slide that empowers let's talk about, well, russia's role and buttoned his role more precisely in africa, on the african continent with i'm a dietrie san corresponded in nigeria. i is in a boot or the niger and capital. and obviously, a lot of talk about wagner in africa. we've seen of this video, you have any precaution, 2 days ago on the african continent. who said that, you know, they were going to be there to help africa and african, to become more free. talk to us about the extent of the involvement in the relationship they've had with some of these countries in the leadership in these countries. in fact, as part of his arrival in africa recently just 2 days ago is considered by many as an attempt to expand his reach within the continent. immediately after the cool in uh, in news. yeah. yeah. he's also looking towards wagner, towards congress,

like molly and brooklyn, of fossil to help them connect. and now, with this development, it's difficult to say how much the desk is confirmed. you've denny, and they've done it progression. and dmitri, what can will impact wagner's operations in africa? but it's broken to secure to important because i noticed in this country and probably in this house that will tell you that there is also that all here in africa are too tempting for wagner to just just integrate, disappear overnight so that many of them believe that they will continue to see about wagner's role in a maintenance account. is that in helping governments to ensure are this a viable or maintenance authority across the african continent. we've seen the expansion from a central african republic, apart from libya and all these places they have, it's funded into money, but in a 5. so probably gimme and then we're talking about vision as well. and god knows

how long or how far they are going to reach out to african leaders to stop bills aren't due on the continent. so basically people think that the rug nation are going to disappear at any time. so what, what about a, you know, these military leaders on the continent of, in asia for example, where we've seen this quin booking or fossil this reproach. ma, they've been seeking with russia will be reconsider if you think, given the term well, that's been going on within russia and, and, you know, the, the divisions intentions within, you know, russia and the best scenario as the new military rulers in molly booking at 5. so gimme a now news. yeah. everyone will tell you here that they are looking for survival in the face of the proactive sanctions. i mean, been military force from, i'd be at what stopped because originally, but of course, and now the african union is reconsidering and probably assessing the situation

about sending a spend by force pain to the into new jersey in particular for them. it's important to keep moving towards russia, 4 to 4, it's notarized, you at least the china. so basically people will tell you here on this continent. but these miniature rulers will continue to pitch that tent with russia despite the accident. wait, wait, wait, wait, reserving about when we talking about people in those countries, i'm in the military rulers and those countries will continue to stay with russia for that fort for as long as they can. how many trays saying about your nigeria? thank you very much for that. the is coming up to 1930 g m t a watching ology sierra and continuing coverage of the breaking news story out of, of russia, where the founder of the wagner mercenary, go, thank you. have any for goshen?

has been listed as a passenger killed in a plane crash, according to russian officials, or a con, recalculated development. this is the moment the embry across jet came hustling from the sky and the to the region, north mosca or 10 people, including 3 crew members, were killed. all of the one off of the bottom. the minute she quit both, you get a promotion was listed among the passengers flying from moscow to st. petersburg. but there's no independent confirmation yet that he was actually aboard. a look report states to loud bangs or hubs and multiple videos post on social media appeared to show the jet on the fire this flight rate on that shows the moments it disappeared. just 2 days before provisions had his 1st videos since the both mutiny against versus armed forces in june. russian media reports the 2nd pain that was rest.