the the ukrainian may solve strike his brushes, naval headquarters in climax attacks on the russian control territory having testified just as you planes, ground defensive in the east makes little headway. so why is quite mess so important to both sides? this isn't side story. the hello there and welcome to the program. i'm nora, kyle, russian controlled crime. it has been coming on the increasing attack from ukraine

. the treasury annexed by most go 9 years ago is now an active bustle. funds between the wall between the 2. once seen as a fortress of most goes minute tree mites, the latest attack and so vast topple has shown that ukraine is capable of reaching targets far beyond the front lines. the speculation that buses or french missiles help school, a direct hit on the russian naval headquarters on friday. one of most guys, most important spaces, will ask our guests and just a moment why comment is so significant to both sides. first offense, and one of them has this report on fridays attack. a strike at the hearts of russia's operations in the black sea. ukraine says friday to tack on the russian regional naval headquarters into the basketball, killed several high ranking military commanders debases in crimea. well, behind russian lines, it came as present, bought a mirror, zalinski wrapped up

a trip to north america. ukraine's allies have been wrapping up shipments of advanced weapons that make it possible to strike deep into a russian hill territory. maybe guys, solutions talk to my mind a q. we are grateful to the united states and with all due respect to all of our allies, it gets united states provides the largest share of, of the list of the assistance that our soldiers on the battlefield really need at this moment in the summer. so we are discussing all the different types of women with long range weapons, artillery and air defense system. and what am i speaking at the un rushes foreign minister, keith western powers of using ukraine to fight a proxy war fuck issues. while you the west on defacto fighting against us using the hands and bodies of ukrainians, i think everybody present to you who pays at the summit tension to the situation in ukraine knows very well that americans, buttons and others are fighting on those countries. providing more and more weapons because it was so along the front line of the conflict,

ukraine's progress has been slow. a much anticipated counter offensive has failed to make significant gains and re taking territory held by russia. but the strike against the possible has shown that you crank and hit russian assets far from the main battlefront and of attacks like this can be repeated. it could open up a new front in the war. tense and bought ahead for inside story. it was been a series of attacks on crime and leading up to the latest sykes on september 14th, ukrainian forces used a combination of trains and ms. laws to knock out a surface to missile system. and just one day long range crews must solve damaged, unable shape on a submarine. a dry adult for fleet maintenance was also head times expected to be out of action for months. and then october 23rd and attacked the town. and if caught, destroyed another defense system under radar station the

what i was bringing all guests now. and in that most go andre back ton of deputy chairman of the association of russian diplomats. he's also a former, a russian ambassador to saudi arabia in london, montela sacrifice the senior electra in security and development at king's college, london, and the also of russian and parents. and we visited from disengagement to hedge money. and in new york, michael bull, secure senior fellow at the atlantic council, and a former spokesman for the o. s. c e. special function mission to ukraine of i will welcome to all of you, michael. let's start with you. the, the black fleet head, the quote says it's a major high profile target. how did you claim put office attack? sure, well, um, look, you referred to uh, the correspond to referred to that area as uh, military for transfer. but the worst thing because of the print into tax is nothing more than a sign kyle: so even that's kind of a compliment. i mean, the fact that the russian, i'm sorry,

the fact that the ukranian rockets were able to penetrate the highly vaunted s 400 bucks and their defense system is absolutely astounding. look, naser systems, the country is like turkey and india have paid billions of dollars for and now we're saying that it's largely an effective not only protecting their crime in peninsula, but also the aerospace in moscow against fairly rudimentary drone. some huge success for the printed forces, but if i can, i mean we have to remember also the wider picture that caught me is very, very important. strategic for 3 reasons. historic economic and military and economically everyone's looking at this and these, the stay nice with oil and gas reserves, but there's a lot there. and as well, up previous to russians, russia, it's illegal annexation or crime. yet, there are paying billions of dollars of rent to ukraine. so if you put all of that together, it's very strategic. and then i should also add,

i am temporarily based in odessa. we think of crime. he had a lot for several reasons. but one of the reasons is that it is the base for these russian missiles being lodged and targeting not literally a desktop, but the ports and a critical component of the global food supply chain. so when you crane does strike, crime is not only for its own military reasons, defensive reasons, but also because it is keeping the world's food supply chain in mind. okay, michael, thank is a lot to get into the, in this discussion festival. andre, let's get your response here. this is the latest in a string of attacks that we've seen in the crime it how big a blow is this to rushes black sea feet. busy ok, i think just. busy to shoot this uh, give me a little think. oh yeah. so she wanted to see you in the store. but uh, actually i really expected something about that. and uh,

that you didn't know. that's why i don't have a goal. we decided to college. busy church for those of our. busy and. busy all the chance to do to just show them the riddle for me and some of. busy places and of course this was the blow back to the people that i work in the cab. what those brought to the building that ever sometimes the shipping, it is a serious thing. i think the website uh well uh old tell dish in the room. we're lacking education. sure. and the, the new system that gauge and so cool times that our systems are all lose in the start of the developing. so we'll start virtual the mandate on just show you a few little adventure the, to the development of the, for those services, the l. a. g o, the present date. oh,

you know, we have origin. andre. if, if russia it could bosco it expects, it's this attack, why did it not back to defend its black sea fleet headquarters? it was the only a, a real shot to way of defending against such attempts each uh, you know, or stag even get braces. the base is the whole thing. and so i'm starting to assume that you show me your brain. i think what will happen in some of the theater. so i remember for sure that the actual share well uh the smoke do sure. what to stream the show your screen, you know the 3 and don't get it. so perhaps you can also look to and i'm not sure why should i pull to see if we should care for that for you if you do start against these bases. so. busy go, going to andre saying that this attack was to be expected, but it didn't come as

a surprise. do you agree with that? yes, i think that it is clear that already now for several months, it's not over a year that the you know, you that your printers i've been trying to, um, we can uh, russians and military presence in premier for his reasons. as was explained by the 1st best speaker, the fact that from premier there is always a challenge on the sort of nose, western coast of ukraine on the black sea. and that's where a lot of the grain is being exposed to. so russia and therefore ukraine exploring for them to make sure that there isn't a sort of a landing or what you need to be on the show. so based on these, these shows of ukraine at the same time, uh premier, is the seat. uh, is it not stuck on the black sea fleet of russia? um, the id is from uh from the fleet that the nissans are being fired. i'll be praying

and infrastructure when i lot of the from, from shapes or something right inside of the bone. but they're based in the uh, in the crimea on, um, basically by stop. also, this is also a very important point to try to diminish the, a big rush at to pick your brain up. it may not on the infrastructure. so i think that it's, it's something that the, you know, what's to be a, you know, what i mean was talked about for quite some time. and we've seen many operations already last year when the were attacks on, on the basis that dresser, i have the, the, the page is that joshua has in crime. yeah. under present lieutenant has always said rush that claim. it is a red line that must be crossed. so how will he respond to this? because we now keep seeing crimea being hit as well, the real estate agent that the space in the federal

some the uh that will be much more attached again. so the premium facility is. busy on a basis and. busy role uh cuz we pursue and usually we bill $316.00 and the check. uh you know, what. busy actually which i've been doing this. busy busy book to own the level that you do but but to me due to the. busy to the victory in. busy new the new bill should be the time the shuttle most. i think i don't have to leave no less than 2. yes. because uh, the cool thing to do over to the survey lane that you have to be real. busy liberating your career and then the 2nd was what was that turns drives me to the brand. so this is the image it's going to do in to finish the name of the junction to you. ready brandon's oh do you. busy on the surgeon

so well uh yeah, well i think the district is used to prepare. busy shows. busy well, the war against the chief in june, but the nature of this is a preliminary stage shows that this time to the call to the man think is now to say, don't, don't give them opportunities to gain the emotion. so the experience, real verbal experience this uh, they saw the main elements of the start that you okay, i'm like, oh, just give it a chance to respond to that, to what andres has before bringing us back to crime in a less than 2 years before russia seems victory and new crane. what's your response to that? a guy that would be a miracle kind of by any standard. they are not doing well on several front lines, whether it's land based the, the long front line that distracts us from north of ukraine to the south. but also obviously in crimea novel also able being able to protect the zones kaiser. and i'm

also wondering how does the average russian think about this, whether they live in crimea, or they live in the outskirts of moscow, or even send from us cops that they are now getting a taste of what you create, instruct you're creating face everyday. this barrage of muscles and drones. so i, i wonder what this means for mr. pollutants. uh, hold on. power. the other thing uh, we should say uh, is that uh, what russia has done with crime. yeah. in the past decades is the a fits into a pattern of not only disregarding its own international bi lateral treaties, but also of control genocide. what's been done in crimea to the crime in terms of the killing them or deporting them to places like slugged area. so we're seeing that russian play book play out now in the war. what do credit, but once again, they are due performing very badly on the battlefield. port morales, the troops,

they're losing soldiers at 2 or $3.00 to $1.00 to the ukraine inside. and one more quick thing is with the introduction of these a more powerful, longer range missiles like the storm shut off from the u. k. and the talk comes which are expected to come. you can probably expect a raj thing up a problem. you could to even include it could even include a direct strike on the coach bridge, which is an important re supply chain in the whole war effort. a, i think with these newer missiles it would not only put a whole on the bridge, but put it out completely. and again, we have to emphasize this, these, these resupply rates are legitimate military targets. going to, michael raises the point that wondering what people in crime may think of all this, it must be pointed out, must net, the poles have consistently starting to move in half of the population in crime me a favor unification with russia. this is a broad, the russian, ethnically,

russian population. i think it's very important to highlight 2 points. first, start in 1991. when your brain had a referendum on the form independence. the majority of people in crimea voted in favor. it wasn't on resolving majority just another parts of your brain, but nevertheless it was george's, i'm not mistaken of overall i'm 57 percent. and that also included the safety of somebody stole. so when your premiums have a johnston voted in on open uh sort of referendum they did vote in favor of ukraine's independence incorrectly. yes. when i'm, what is important to highlight is also the fact that the referendum that was carried out in 2014 was not really free and fair. and the opinion polls are very hard to uh, to a, to sort of a bind here. so i wouldn't, i wouldn't face myself from that. i mean, of course, we know that there are

a simple faith. i'm generally that raise a mood and support of, of our integration with russia. but that are, you know, doesn't justify bionics ation, nor does it allow russia to operate in that way. dogs in the region, especially because premier has become really a seed of many tribulations for russia. if we must remember that major soul and 2nd was carried out in february 2022 into ukraine was carried out from premier. so premier as it can be used strategic as a base. so many tribulations and also for russia it has been, uh, you know, i'm trying to find the, i has allowed it to we are sort of close a see of us off to ukraine's grain exports on all kinds of other industrial exports on the western co, excuse me on the eastern knolls and coast of the cranes black c. so there are very many arguments in favor for, you know, as i said,

for ukraine to try to re take control over time. here. i think what is also important if we talk about a key for so remember the time you got tons, they originally many, many of them have been forced to be the spring depredations during the soviet era. and they will not be allowed to return even even when other peoples were allowed to return to their country areas of origin. but out, those were not. so there's not a lot of a sort of in a way cleansing of populations of l originally from crimea on. many russians are really the 1st generation there. they're not there since many generations and brand new. andre, why did print some document pollutant acts? crime it in 2014. it was seen to be illegal on the international know, and it starts to on a collision course with ukraine and the whole world. well actually after the. busy oh, why don't you like to watch the really good stuff that's going to be really just been

stored? i'll shoot you. the reason we didn't have anything in mind with all. so i was hoping 10. busy 2014 business needs, the development of the parents because of the change of the weather she and then you have the structural change. sure. hold the end of the to the, there's you styled, you know, you don't do mediation, all the people are living in uh, turning your soul reassess mount uh on. does that because you have to be really tough. she says that don't do the 2nd rolls or more. do you want to develop a new brand? we can't have the website menu or what the product, which is that still a good idea to really be matching up to them to put them in prison. but unfortunately, by doing just you patch or show that there's great but yeah for them to to join and they will dispense your sense of the present during strategy of the and the 1111.

been there and have you come in and show living there have been actually through the restroom and the back and everything and i was visiting for several occasions, but i me, i rush assure you the questions i included you for and so they are well happy, but today we are going to jump back to the normal situation where we will get together because we're not sure we still do the division between the wrench and we're going to create a new service. did you do division between the us all of these? so here's you. well that's what i have to do. so in 2014 and back to these people, the additional gives you the address of the service and the payments. and we do a g d, but the 2nd version will do you accept pay, but most of amex ation of crime mass is illegal on the international the the legal exactly. it was the additional risk involved are saying about for

sure. the people that use the surgeon and very decided to result that direction. we did just have this plan. so that told you this is absolute. the 2nd seriously, the goodman. so the people left, you do not use it to them. you do not know anything which is separate and the last thing several weeks are we went to you and the tv there very uh you know where uh, giving us some stores or wherever they are going to wherever the jump their feet is . do you believe it's a kept there, but you need to know what is the so this last step, but since the end of the government, the stairs are part page. we have citizens and this isn't done so all that jonathan secluded, the show called you prince michael was a response to the other people in crime and they wanted to join russia off the full effect to get

a co rich. and the rise of the legend ski animal pro western government in keys is that the way you see it? that is complete nonsense. and um, i think i don't want to dignify the individual spoke by responding to is a twisted version of history. the lies the fake news, so i will just raise one point here and it's important one is um, mr. brewton tried to justify his so called specs on military operation by saying, you know, roughly, is coming today to russian speakers and place a by product cube in odessa and body. hope all, well, these are the very uh, cities that russia is striking without any sort of restraint. um, i was just reminding myself, looking at a video yesterday of how a russian missile as drive came straight into the start district of augusta into that big orthodox cathedral. so expenses, their version of protecting russians. well, god, help russians elsewhere in the world. look,

the other thing here i should mention because i am seated here in the united states . we just finished that while we're in the middle of the u. n week. and most of the landscape visit to washington is that. ready for the ukrainians to finish what they started declare for victory and push the russians back so that they no longer are a threat not only to natal country 0, but the rules based international system is that 2 things need to happen in washington. number one is that um, the, the, the decision makers there need to get over their fear of the nuclear black mare, male, in other words, meant to put and turning to nuclear weapons. i don't think that will happen. and number 2, there also seems to be concerned in washington about russia somehow. imploding. if there's too many threats made to them, especially by their creators, i think that is nonsense also. but one quick point. if i may, what we're seeing play itself out in europe is tied to your pin countries actually have acting ahead of united states, for example,

providing main battle tanks of jobs um those long rates commit. so. so that is a very refreshing thing to say. and i think they realize that they're much closer to the front line box, right, is much bigger of a thread and they need to address it proactively. done. so what do you think of that? because we do have us media reports that joe biden is preparing to send a small number of long range missile systems. cold attack comes, what person do they do? how might that change the fitness of the stays with as for ukraine? i'm how indeed, like russia then respond to it. what i think, what is important is they've done a hip, so the deeper into areas where, you know, your brain didn't have that capability for i'd received a strong shadow on me. sorry. so that hates you know, your brain and still heat. so that'd be, be behind what we call behind getting in the launch. because what happened was when ukrainians receives the he mars, they moved a lot of their so the,

from portland permutation on some of their amunition that both so that behind and these my sons, what are now, are you praying to hit add to control communications and also logistic of support that is helping was that really trick on base? so it is really very helpful and very important. and i mean the question of whether they would keep russian terry tree. i think i, you know, is, is a, is a delicate one. but this one, but you know, sort of power lies the sort of, uh, support for your brain. because what we're seeing is that, you know, that the 1st of all made is necessary and essential for ukraine to receive these weapons to carry on more effectively. its main click on pain on 2nd here, no russia. so that stands alone, but it has the image of the capabilities unless it escalates much further to the territory, which i think they will not do so they will continue responding. and the way they

have responded so far, i mean, was one of the concerns is if the small drugs on for very, very long. but i don't see that russia will do a sort of estimate to one level which is really threatening, which will allow, in sort of a nuclear power entry as a result of reducing the com sites on drugs know that you should be worried about andre, to what extent does the use of western weapons in this will provoke pollution? oh well well actually i think just uh you know, the, uh, the references that are coming from the rest of the vision is one of the social on the bottom and vision of his uh, was uh, uh the, the $22.00. so have a huge and um, hold on, i'll call so you should i put you in a g for you in june and uh in due to a goal. busy sure,

uh for sure that and some periods of time uh the people being vision the doctor is uh uh more transition. so in the. busy in the brain, maybe not to we, we both ways you brian the present day, but as you will show, the report do opportunities so for smoke to use reference and doing such a little but to, to use the do to make sure you, i know you're great and i was living there for many years. i went in school and i found plenty. busy fresh. busy the category information which i gave you my cell book but. ready magazine, so in this paper or something else, i'm fairly new information directly from the great engine, including the rest of the bar to the end of the. ready of the french thing, but to this address and the law. here's the negligence and. busy okay, do people are waiting for these for the stop which of this. busy ready you know, additional, i'm just going to jump in that because we've just got a,

a minutes once i left and michael lost. what to you. how long can you crane keep defending itself as well? it should be defending itself for as long as it needs to the west. uh, allies should be providing ukraine with everything it needs. because once again, we are seeing mr. put in weaponized food migration. uh to you know, the trade with the world. and um, if the ukrainians are not given everything they need, i assure you that this war will come to the door steps of many people around the world. it already is in terms of higher food prices higher. petra price is much more in security. so look, you, mr. zaleski has made it cleared, here in the united states and written more recently to canada, is that they're not going to give up on, in some territory to the russians. i think the russian should get tied into their heads and do the proper thing and just pull back to the 1991 borders. and otherwise they risk

a lot more damage to their society to their lands. especially with these new methods arriving, that we do have to move our discussion today. thank you very much to all guess for joining us. andre. background of don't montela sacramento, and michael, both kids. i'm thank you to for watching. you can see this program again, any time by visiting our website. that sounds is there a dot com for further discussion to go to a facebook page that's facebook dot com, forward slash a inside story. and you could also during the conversation on the x humblest of a j inside story from me laura kyle and the whole team here is bye for now the the the

october on algae 0, showing a host the asian games with athletes from across the region competing and celebrating sports rigorous debate unflinching questions upfront. come through the headlines to challenge conventional wisdom u. k. prime minister. assume that it's expected to address these 1st party conferences lead to the general election looming. and the wave of strikes being housed, the bro cost premier of a new series, exploring the implications of us and to avoid talking to the 1st amendment, right. which is in liberia, to the pose kinda incumbent president george way. i overcome corruption allegations

and keep the temp job up. tell you back on which is era the the fellow in several venue. it's great to have you with is. this is the news, our life from the coming up in the program today, a warning of a city of breaking points. the us sees a record number of migrants crossing its southern border with mexico ethnic armenians leading to go know carol back while the leaders of our media and as a by john agreed to meet, to discuss the crisis stand off in northern kosovo as over the lease of arrested attackers, we'd been hold up an amount of steps and touched down.