to system a little boat is a mechanical or even that self driving train. the vehicle that androids today can be human. only robots, like me, will be everywhere else. is here a documentary which lead on the weird and wonderful world of global land. think and even trust, i feel like on the line, but i know i on the machine origins of this is a policeman shot dead in northern cost of us. the gunman killed in a modest received. it's the latest bottom last point between s next us and albany. and so how damaging is this to international peace efforts and kind of a last thing solution as will be found. this is inside story, the

hello down. welcome to the program. i'm nora kyle, cause of a is fragile piece is once again on the strain with sunday shooting of a policeman which led to a seat and a model street in which 3 ethnic sub gunmen were killed. that's frequent tension in the south declared with public between the ethnic albanian cost of us and the sub minority in the north, international political efforts. the latest by the you have so far failed to find a lost in solution. the region has a population of just on to $1800000.00 people, but is the focus of big pa is with east and west on opposite sides of cost of a self declared independence and future. we'll be discussing all this on what's next for costa, but with, i'll guess in just a few moments. first, this report from fence and one of the aftermath of a siege of mazda street in northern costs about

a one police officer and 3 gunmen were killed in sundays. shoot out cost of those prime minister says the attack was masterminded bytes. neighbor serbia. within a month to sit on the on the we condemn this criminal on terrorist attack, organized crime with political financial, logistical support from official bell grade is a packing country. serbia, as president, has denied any connection. he says, the interest of northern costs a vote is of its leaders making or you didn't agree with the service. this is really the only culprit for all that is happening in the north of costs, or though, although those who helped him in the international community are also partly responsible, is alvin curtis attention has been rising in the region in recent months after controversial local elections and costs about its population is more than 90 percent ethnic albanian. but several northern districts are almost entirely made up of ethnic serbs. they want to autonomy and many we called at about that led

to the election of ethnic albanian mares. in predominantly serbian areas, toltz and brussels have failed to reach any solutions. the use foreign policy says both sides are risking their prospects of joining the block. we saw normalization that we would not be to be in the future. 40 the comfortable or certainly go to the survey are risking to be left behind. we know this origin up on us are moving quicker. diversity. the recent filing stems from long running animosity between the 2 sides. cost of, of declared independence in 2008. but serbia considered a break away province. it's recognized by the us, and most of the you, china and russia, oppose its independence status, is in order to prevent more outbreaks of ethnic strife. pressure is growing on the 2 sides to find the lasting solution. bins and monahan for inside story

was bringing all guests now and in belgrade. helena, even of so it'd be an offense list of associated research fellow at the henry jackson society in pristina down in laws. the heads of we set to the cost of authentic for security studies and in brussels, suzanne lynch, chief brussels correspondent for politico. all right, warm, welcome to all of you. have a. let's start with you. we've got the cost of a prime minister alban cassie once again very quickly, pointing the finger here at bell grade. think i'm groups are responsible for the violence in northern close of a, but they also being state back troops all of a while. i think of course that that remains to be seen. i think we need to have a proper investigation into who these people are. how did they get the uniforms that they allegedly were wearing? how do they get the weapons that they've used?

i think and in all of these cases, whenever we see escalation between cost about and serbia, i think both the serbian and the cost of, of government immediately pen to point fingers to the other side of what plays play and responsibility on the other side. but i think i always like to air on the side of caution and say when escalations like these happen when missing, this information tend to fly around from both sides. it's important to do a proper investigation and really see what actually happened there. and who is responsible? so who is this not the 1st time that we've seen such and since yvonne is in this region, have that been investigations of the past? has it been proven that that has been bell great involvement? well, i think of course, spell great involvement has been assumed and, and shown by many and many different cases. of course, the connections between subsequently start and bellwood politicians is also no secret to anyone. and of course bell good price to increase and maintain as much influence on the costs of our as possible. so connection is very clearly there. the question is to what extent this connection is this, how strong is it? and in this particular case, whether the serbian government was directly involved,

which the serbian government continues to deny. so i think we need to, we need to wait and see basically and until the previous investigations again, i think neither serbia nor costs about have shown willingness to be completely fair and transparent in normalization talks and in other instances where cooperation is required. so of course, proper investigations are often lacking in costs of what was why i'm sure it was definitely we'll get into the tools and just a moment down. first of all, what evidence does christina have? but there is sub involvement from bel grade in. this one is in northern costs or by uh, well, uh, just uh, a couple hours ago. the coastal police, uh, uh, organize the, uh, uh, press conference where they show the arsenal of weapons and equipment they confiscated. and is, according to the cost of the police, are indication that the google is organized by a well known member of the, the wrong called me on the kitchen. the,

there are also the then very good connection between him and some elements in the, in the civic and government. i think the concern is here about the extent to which the russian elements because what perhaps behind this. but what i think i want to know, which is very important, is the nation from the certainly not the doc searching boston was immediately when this uh, when you went to the called the kind of the section started the so the searching goes to what. yeah. did that make sure to inform the following that the a it's 1st so now the base and, and there were some pilgrims of the monastery binds were being held in way hosted. so i think what this dentist is prevented the potential abuse of this situation for a much more as come authority, an escalation, and perhaps a group of expected. so this is just the latest, isn't it?

in a string of escalations that we've seen in this region in the policy, it really does feel like this bullet hall region is particularly on a knife edge at the moment. yes, we kind of serious have been to that is at, during the past year or so including can elections. it's up to you earlier in the year that were that were organized in the north, was comfortable for effects to the point caused by ethnic serve in the community there since the elections and when the as possible to try to install the mer grow, he elected on a couple of percentage of patients in his election and we've had a very strong reaction really from the washington and we were brussels s in an official, the name the international community are using patients within the region for 2 countries. and the check for i think as as wrong or average against the cost of a leadership, asking them to step up a bit more. and traditionally you will see a different kind of language to become from washington. but we've had some very

strong messaging toward the 14 governments. and so i think this is going to do no to at here for either called on the call them or survey or russell just about 10 days ago or so at we have the, the president of serbia and the prime minister cargo in brussels and were told they didn't really much in anywhere in terms of the civic, but this is definitely going to be further set by now about where things are going to go from here. then there has been a fair amount of criticism directed, particularly as the customer and prime minister alban kashi. perhaps suggesting that he's not being a fan, negotiate in this process by the actions that he's taking on the ground. as suzanne said, one of them being installing these ethnic albanian mass in some majority areas, why is he pushing in the way that he is? you will need to remember that it's a brand new to support the ran

a massive campaign, a doing the national elections in ghost of all of the argument that the dialogue of these ational relations between close. and so gay was highly, i've seen metric it to that, that some of the cost of also he was the principal of the process from the start. so some of the is position you can argue is based on his stance and his positions when he was in the opposition. what is important to notice the situation, we're not even close to where it seems as neither the national collegian this has means to us. us across the coastal government and, but it also seems possible government doesn't trust any longer the international community. and this is a very dangerous situation because asked about, you know, how do we move forward from this? he is, i think, a having a c space action plan to implement the agreement that both parties accepted. although verbally only in february of this year,

the sole goal agreement on the balance and the amount is ation or relations and for the amount. so in this is the only additional cost as low as possible government to deliver on the stablish $1.00 association or community of so much. so if you want to sit down, i think this is about what it seems like. also, government expense is some kind of guarantees that moving in that direction to establish this kind of mechanism will be accompanied by complete stops that brings close to the close of the patient process. uh, because in the past, what has happened is that the whole, the commitments that were offered to kosovo. uh, it is done for meeting some, some that so like, uh, establishing this kind of ball shape, photo glass or other, the forms. uh, there was a mazda see, to me, the country, half way terms of the integration process. so with coastal expense, which is very important for the countries that the for not synchronizes dogs buying a new member states a don't recognize close to but, but think you live in portland,

is that the, for one members of nato, perhaps the direction of accepting most was independence and customer has a clear path to membership enable, perhaps also the partnership for peace. also sl apply for membership of you and what kind of the state is right now course is the only one among success above and countries throughout the state. the so this will go long way of building confidence lead property goes to leave messages, but it's, it is clear that cost one is the lowest, obviously the asap. as i know it does, he says that it will, he will not take the 1st step in this the go. she ation process towards normalizing relations. until so be a, takes a move makes a move towards recognizing cost of a is independence. is alex on the features, the precedents making showing any signs of doing that? you know, president voltage in fact, just last night and his public address following the events that we've seen

yesterday in cost of all of his made it very clear that serve you will not ever recognize call so as an independent states. so i think what it comes to serve you in making that move. i'm not sure that we're ever going to see that move happen. however, what i do think is also very problematic. and i think that's the reason why we've seen some strong messaging from the you and the us towards the kristi government is a cortez basically now showing that he's willing to fulfill the obligation of his country has accepted all the way back in brussels. in 2013, of course conversations about serve you recognizing cost of are by no means you, but customer obligation to create the association of cert, municipalities pre dates. uh, many of the folks that we're hearing right now. it's a commitment called so it was taken back in 2013, a commitment that was reiterated in the brussels and all kicks talks that happened earlier this year. but whether and if it's all this kind of like association is going to be formed. now, pretty much ends up in the air because these may have cleared this is unconstitutional and unlawful, according to cost of the low end. and it has basically rejected the latest you

proposal that stipulated that the association must be created 1st and then other steps will, will come into place. and that's basically why we are in, in this deadlock, serbia refuses to recognize, comfortable as independent of one him. and on the other hand, the cost of it was unwilling to fulfill the obligation that happened and create the association cert municipalities. so it says that hey, we ought to size more and more entrenched, refusing to bunch these talks have been going on for move in 10 years. is a huge tiring of this intractable, complex. i think it is. i think the page is begin to free. i mean, the e with a lot of days at the moment, not least, the war a new frame and getting that attention, giving that attention and time to this christina battery died out of it's nowhere near as important, but it's not how the jennifer moved you. members state here, the other issue and it's be touched upon already, is the fact that the was having a huge conversation at the moment about an hour,

but opening up the new member to the going to you want to join the you are the ones are and they are on the top or the west are going to the western book and at 20 to want to join our various stages at the top of the t a, the year for one day. but it is all that is to be the fact that the lays about a amount of the rolling on the between the 2 side is going to have a detrimental effect on us. and the you is going to have a huge conversation about that in december. and it's so much it's also meeting close had to stay potentially. and the serbian, a leader of the called the president in spain are in early october. full is idea of if your t this, the newness yet an organization that go beyond the you so this whole discussion about, oh, to allow you is problem centered. you're looking at about it and instead of having now a more comfortable, definitely not quite set to signing the data now,

but it's probably going to be a major problem. and i will call that will serve as a trifle in different ways to progress and therapies into the. what about says out on top of that i've done mentioned just a moment ago. these number of countries within the you who do not recognize cost of those self declared independence. how much of an obstacle is that? and could they not recognize the independence of the confidence building measure to then bring the 2 sides customer and so they close it together? it's a big issue. it's the, i'm in the room because a lot of the time is because of their own domestic considerations. so for example, space and have an issue with record, uncomfortable because of its own problem with break away made and stuff 3. and now when you say to call them at the thought of patients, they did their work and by law, pretty these countries to try and convince them to recognize that the ben stock number was number 2 is not a conversation about that. are there may be some kind of a halfway has that me okay. call with not much joy to you at the moment that you're

trying to do. but it may move toward that there's a lot of conversation in the different countries like you for a, the west and both and read about it. maybe have a 2 tier system that they're kind of in and some car i'm not on the other. so the conversation you're having and because no that's an issue that continues are about it, but very much is the buyout for the. the other issue, of course, that certainly is less keen on general items next down here. but you know, a lot of which is do i have to go to but hired wasting of trying to join the u. s. navy, that patient was made many years ago. and so the problem of serving people actually was joining the you and now i live on the boat to see increased and dated by russia and served in particular where as opposed to the cost of a in particular, do want to do an even better and solve for, for that other guy, now i had to keep in mind here, well, at the helena just on. so that's what feeling is that within so be

a for to join the you or is it more aligned with wash it and done? we'll come back to in just a moment as well, haven't jackson society actually conducted research on this? and we've examined the level of pro russian sentiment and serve you as well as the appetite for joining the you. and according to that data, if the referendum you membership was held, tomorrow, more servers were would vote against joining the opinion that in favor which is extremely problematic. because that is the 1st time that we're actually seeing a flip in, in the volt. that would mean, so it would not enter the e u and, and when it comes to russia, the support for russia is, is overwhelming over 50 percent of service, things that russia should be. serv. yes. for the 1st and foremost, foreign policy partner and even more so 78 percent of service believe that serbia should not impose sanctions against prussia so. so i think the political climate here is very much changing to for many reasons that susie mentioned. don, how much does that concern cost of, of the business movement of bell grade towards most good as

well. i think it's uh, the relations between serbia ross or concern of the wind in region and the west and ball going to you. i think rush on wants in stable west and boxes and, and the bass on this, the, but i said, well, we need to focus on is the stage sure. or the new opportunity to pass a mazda suzanne will say, on the emotion policy, the cost of president charles be show, may be some of these fees that you will be should be ready for in boston to new members by 20, for the unique opportunity. the, our region, the mass, and we need to work towards reaching business partners and key to reaching the starting. is that the region to be solved by lots of disputes into the discrepancy model region that it really states? no new members will be accepted outstanding. a result of by that so this use and for comfortable as somebody uh or proposing generally just clear on the pallet,

tomato, we just fundamentally funded for us. and to me, you goals to the time of the normalization of relations of sylvia and just to be uh, i think correct. in february of this year, our prime minister was the empress in which each bull accepted the the law of the soul about, uh, to uh, agreement on the facts. and then one of the station relations. and part of this deal is the obligation, again, for the cost of what to establish a sol solved management mechanism from the subsidy goes in this part, the association of somebody's working this about this and i will finish here. so i think we're done with hasn't stepped into something ation, but the question is not gives you on going to establish this association of what kind of association you have it should be provided, be sufficient, useful, the subs living in the door to excise the need to become part of the cost to society. so this is the key question. tend to be the direction where

conceptualization the world needs to be sequestered in a way where possible progresses towards smoking, depression as well. but the thing that because they're talking about this association of the majority municipalities, it's a key issue in tools and a stumbling book and talks up some damage weeks. it's okay about it being accepted as a way food. i'm yet prime minister across it is not setting it up. why is he not doing that? so just for the context of interest on the 13th from the 1st time, this was agreed to establish the association that there was another view in 2015. and the constitutional court issued the birth date on the constitutionality of this mechanism. and decided on concluded that establishment of the association, i'm so mine's only thing that it's about these is constitutionally a okay, in a way that isn't all legal obligations for cost of the government for,

for that. so in this after this, absolutely right. and the cost of the government should come full and the proposal over the costs of dollars on how this association with someone so we can start to get some good work. but the key also going to do action has been but kind of association. we want to give me here from united states, they say that the association fee and the cost will cost additional cor, but for many souls in the know that perhaps is not sufficient. so it is fundamental that the discussion in a way and then the discussion is about the condo association of. so my goal is to balance is the needs full, the needs of the substance, learning possible, as well as the concerns of that goes to the government, which in all cases, the idea of how the socialization can become a potential ops to go for functionality. okay, the duration of the state, the situation in boston, highlander, could you just give us an idea of why this solution a just give us idea of why this association is important?

why is it such a sticking point of how might it benefit subs living in northern costs of i well, i think obviously deserves who, who live in the north do not want to see comfortable independent and all things considered would have preferred the cost of whatever declared independence, right, and i think for a lot of them, they have substantial concerns whether their rights would be protected if they would solely to fall within the legislation of the cost of the government. subsequently, the argument goal was given that we are to graphically located in this area. and given that we are the majority in this area, and given you know, the past differences, the conflicts, the history of the tool. these people believed that they have the right to to more autonomy and to make decisions for themselves. and that was basically the key argument that was presented. and i think right now in the aftermath of everything that we've seen for a lot of these people, correct, the government is, is unacceptable. and they would probably not feel comfortable living solely under the government and authority of mr. courtney,

which is why i believe this assistance on the association has further increased on top. of course the fact that this is a obligation, comfortable has indeed accepted in in 2013 and suzanne. we're talking about one issue here. there's a close another issue about the elections where the albanian ethnic matches were installed. christina has said there will be new elections to replace them, potentially boy taught it or not by the says, we'll have to wait and see, but that is another potential flash point. i mean, because another one haven't weigh another deadline at the end of this year, which we really should be looking towards because that's is for an end for sub issue license plates on vehicles. this deadline is already slipped because of the tensions that had quotes and the violence that had caused. what do we think is going to happen towards the end of this year? if no headway is made around the negotiating table? well, i think the advantage is that i speak of completely changed the conversation around

those 2 issues. as i think we've taken over the backwards. as soon as we know, sorry about a program between the 2 countries in the last few days and the amount of the incident. so i think they're not going to be credit for by the government. have nothing to colorado has said that they are committed to having you elections, but very few days yet of the bottle new elections look like that's the key issue. i mean, they have the elections before the rock problem law and they were not the, you know, the, the, to serve, you majority didn't presentation for the day and them. so it all depends on what kind of like you have that number one. and number 2 is a, you know, she said that and before the laces, i waited a virus. so i think this joe, those changed dynamic simulated with the number place. the 1st kind of sign that are really, you know, a re appearance of tensions in the area. what over a year ago now, which was about as a right to house or number place for a certain community in order to very important symbolic b and

a very important issue. so i think the event, the last week of changed added conversation, right? and on the left, and there is some progress in the coming weeks before the deadlines and well i see the non looks progress on either of those issues. do you agree with that? do you agree? that's the situation has taken steps backwards and there are a number of crucial flash points to look for to, towards the end of the year. the photos of the situation has become very stable enough to dig the bowl. and unfortunately, we in a way, predicted this in this very also i think it was the and however, as well with the calling just focus situation and the a clear to the process that it will produce a political solution that i think that will just be, can increase for the more so we need an urgent return to the to the dialogue. i think it is the responsibility to meet you to come forward with

a sequence based action where it does the responsibility of the causal government took off the proposal and establishing the system so much. i think that's about these, and i think it is the responsibility of all these believe the single. so certainly are to send the right kind of messages and to refrain from restoring steps for the problem nice to use. because the service, the, it's not the norm a and the there are those things was coastal. okay, i'm just, so i just want to just want to jump in that time because we've just got a less than a minute left him. helena, i want to know what you think it will take to see a real breakthrough and prevent move on. and i think one of the key things is for the you to actually find enforcement mechanisms. i think at this point we have seen round and round of talks where, you know, right now one person just walked out and absolutely said no before, we've had some verbal acceptances, but nothing really signed. after almost every round of talks,

we see another escalation, and each following escalation is worse than the one before it. so i think that you really need enforcement mechanisms. i think at this point, if the sides are committed to something unless they do it, they actually have to be properly sanctioned. otherwise we're just going to keep on going into circles and this really makes lives. and i cannot stress this enough. people uncomfortable only mysteries, incredibly difficult because i believe what we need, that we will have to leave on the discussion today. helena, even though of donna laws and susan lynch, thank you very much for joining us here on inside story. thank you. and thank you to for watching, you can see the program again any time by visiting our website that's out. is there a dot com and have other discussion to guys? well, facebook page, that's facebook dot com, forward slash a inside story. you could also join the conversation on x or handle it as a inside story from the laura kyle and the whole team here. bye for now the

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