to show to the teams, to a vindication of terrorism and approve of patient head of the presidential elections in october. which still is generally an in depth coverage to 0. is when you close to the last of the story, the powers pockets on dealing with the security threats emanating from afghanistan is slomo body has reported an increase in cross border attacks by the park hasanti solid on what's behind this search. and is the telephone government doing enough to stop? this is inside story, the

hello and welcome to the program. i'm how much enjoying park is done to provinces. along the ask and border had been under relentless attack by the armed group to rick at tyler bon. practiced on, it's also known as t t p or the partners donnie tyler bond is mom of audi. q is, is the telephone government in afghanistan of allowing these fighters to use its territory to launch attacks. the afghans tonight is, will go to our panel in just a few moments, but 1st friend of mine has this report to an attack on a political riley in northwest pockets. done in july is just one of more than 300 raise this past year. blamed on the t t p to rick, it's all about. and puck is done. the army group also known as the pockets, donny tile about the government has found it increasingly difficult to maintain security. it accused the taliban government in neighboring afghanistan. a providing

fighters with a safe haven focused on, has, unfortunately seen in recent months is spike in violence. and the terrorist attacks, most of these attacks are being perpetrated by a t t p, which it has centuries across the border in a fun. his son, the pockets donnie telephones. ideology. align closely with its ass, guy, and counterpart. it wont, stricter enforcement of islamic law. and the withdrawal of the military from some border provinces, but the telephone government denies supporting or harboring the group transacting. tcp has no height outs inside afghanistan, but despite that talk hassan accuses ask um, so i love being used by the to re catawba, pakistan's enemies are within their own country for which we are not responsible. we do not allow them to operate from us. so the most talk is don, security for this happened stepping up operations against the army group as well as police raids. the military conducted strikes across the border in 2022. there's

also been some diplomatic success. the ask on telephone recently arrested 200 fighters within its own jurisdiction, but with elections and pockets done set for next year. pressure is growing to get the security situation under control. bins and bald headed for inside story the. all right, let's go ahead and bring in our guests and it's talking about is what car fun it defense analyst and retired, bring it here in the pakistan army in new york is always all about here. adjunct to lecture at the american university of afghanistan. and in london is the sean, so our dean, director of the center for regional and global connectivity at to bob lab, a geopolitical think tank and advisory service, a warm welcome to you all. and thanks so much for joining us today on inside story . what car, let me start with you today. there had been a hundreds of raids this past year. the pockets don has blamed on the creek

a tally bon pakistan or t t p. what's behind this surgeon attacks? that is a very complicated situation, especially after the american below the last 2 years and a box. i don't want to sound metrics is actually not really new. it's, it's, i wish the decades or, and fog a one borders one has been above the media because of my didn't dimension. i'm not going to history was the so read union and then the us. so definitely they're being forwarded jim chance us as last, i think for 250 years. so definitely they're going to be instability. now that i spent the wireless is because of duty fees, ideology, and probably a bunch of tests that can just do it for the book. shall be it might have tons of probably 2 d b for dollars to do it in a boarding regional soccer stock. and i think there is some, some support coming from a what his time has been nursed more than i think focused on a one. a son problem is not becoming an international problem. don't you listen to

the most of the former defend yesterday? i think that with the image it by the for the and then people are countries even outside the image, it better for you all distance on and off the i want the bumper, dismantle admitted to a higher adults and minturn groups. so i think it's not becoming an international problem, but definitely in case of the ttp who has access to the view does or also for lead . yes. so i'm not able to not, we'll just spin do the whole on his time, i think. and just uh, do you want the month for different down there can be a major chain, a sort of test fax and focused on our son. and i think that it is being used as a leverage will draw certain concessions for progress on and also to be a space for develop on focused on uh for the you know, for the strategic interest. what car i also just wanna make sure we're clear on one thing. when you mentioned in your answer t t a. were you talking about the taliban in afghanistan to yeah,

exactly. to do me that i'm going to in the want us on. i see the kind of final question, what part may i also ask you um the partners don says the country's intelligence and security officials have concluded that most of these attacks are being carried out by ttp packers. donnie tyler bond has pakistan shared that intel or evidence with afghanistan. i think number of time, especially if you look at 2022. i think price there has been a forwarding is going to be next. it especially the presenter mister and best the i'll shoot rodney along with that thing. the highest ranking, the dentist office, so then mentor to offices and uh, i think it was covered in lot of detail. the shared the problem with pictures of, uh, some of the a to d b to you and you know, a dining or staying or being sponsored by some of the sections within that to do it . uh, that is definitely. uh uh, i think plus time. does she have bucks out of somebody else dr. speaking about it publicly. like you must have heard about od from the dynamo farm. understood and

done a prime minister even speaking from our united mission, jennifer, somebody for them that just has to stop and actually look at what has happened to walk this thought. i think dumbs are forced ingle for 2000000 upon refugees that are brother and sister and all you have almost one minute empty vendor from just so and that's also been thing a very difficult situation. sorry. what's the evidence that the insured on? i think though it is very easy to doing so intently as to who want to diagnose and so on us. i think it ever does. a clear evidence has been shared. it's entirely up to you to knock on digit and stop at a let. let me turn to you next. as you heard the last few moments um, you know, practiced on has been accusing the taliban government in afghanistan, a providing t t p fighters with a safe haven. what does that can a stand say to that charge on the 1st? so thank you for having me on. so it was a pleasure being here, but also this accusation is as old as time itself. i mean, there is always been an element that the bulk of funding authorities are worried

about are concerned about it was to be in the before this. it was different elements before that. if you look at the other side, the other ones would actually see that. but this one was doing the same thing. it has been doing the same things to consecutively, games in a song and then claiming that the border itself cannot be controlled. there are few things we have to be very mindful off. there is a question of implying of origin, also thought of one which does not originate in us on this one. so we have to be very clear on that. then there's a question on the base of operations. there be some operations is not inside the sun. we have to be very clear about that as well. but then if there is a worry about the corporation from the top to bottom in the sun with a t t b and bucket strong. do you have to understand that the thought of on have done more than any of the gene before this? the have already be clear? if there is a specific loyalty of t d b fighters to the leader off upon the why they have announced a decrease that people are not supposed to go in or really just your hot outside on

a stomach. so they are very clearly signal to their own factors. they are, that have happened or another indicator of how much corporation is being done. you have to see that the most causal summit, the most common meetings that are mentioned earlier, based upon the volume for their efforts for containing a stress to the region and the globe. so turns out all the neighbors aren't happy, the united states is happy. we saw them in the door how meeting with the bundle, by praising them for their efforts, they can come to an insurgency in counter terrorism. however, part of the song seems to be the only unhappy neighbor. what i'm seeing is there are problems and these problems can only be solved once we get out of the personal this, them all prisoners that i'm a can only reuben wants to serve their freighting incorporation doesn't happen. so grand gesturing on media, accusing the pottery barn and basically out forcing up from that as you go to

another country like they are responsible for it. hopefully they'll look if this continues, are you concerned that this could turn into a conflict between afghanistan and pakistan? the short answer is no, but we've had skirmishes on the borders. we have to understand that there are national sentiments involved, that they are people within a finest on. ready do think that the bug kasanya authorities are as of august on the regina hasn't played a positive role, hasn't help secure the border health enforce the tanya barn and bring them to power as they are today. and so the current deterioration in relationship part for the is because of the park is funding policy towards the front of the box. not giving it enough agency. it's not respecting itself, vanity. on the other end, i think that the bottom might be over correcting as well because they've been accused of being focused on proxies for so long that they have to show that they can be ard on the progress bar. however, like i said before, the deterioration of the ties doesn't help anyone. it actually hurts both the

regions on, on, across the border and the people, the people end up suffering the most. so uh, do that make sense is trying to de escalate some, find a way forward. however, recognizing the basic law, they are not what you needed to know by some they're not based there. but if you want to corp, we can have that to rational diplomacy. is each on you heard a way to live there talking about the deterioration of the relationship. i want to get your opinion on this from your vantage point. how, how, how much of the ties between pakistan and afghanistan deteriorated at this stage? i think the ties have deteriorated tremendously over the last 2 years, especially there was a range of mechanisms and for formal and informal instruments. the farthest on to bring to bear on. i've got a son both be funny with james and bought the car is a james to try and negotiate of the way out of whatever it was that was a point of concern at that particular point in time. but of those things,

it seems no longer at the kind of effect the either $1.00 to $2.00 or had hoped would be in effect on the con balaban. in fact, i would argue that specifically in 3 areas. so for example, cross border trade and transactional trade. the rescue prices that exists in box on and has been there since 1979, as well as the ve, the origin, that being medical visas and education visas being denied at the border crossings for i've gone citizens entry into boxes. some of these are some pressure tactics with boxes on, historically used to bring to bear a certain amount of a, you know, force on i've got a some of that so far. it does not necessarily seem to have worked with. they've got some, and i think it's a little more nuanced than just, you know, one side being right or the other side being right. or the fact of the matter is that despite, i've done this on saying that the he b does not operate. i don't have done this time that you want to report from the security. a security committee,

specifically state somewhere between 3505500 fighters activity to be fighters inside of the borders of i've got a strong. those are established facts. that's not the state before one, definitely for another. and it also must be fed that it's not easy for me. i've got the on either, you know, conduct a full blown product down on the ttp considering as look at funds. i've said the ideological alignment that exists between the 2 and the fact that one of the 1st things that happens after august 15, 2021. maybe i've gone onto the cobble, was that the feed to be leadership scenario legions to the, to the leader, have the funds, other unsure to, you know, swear by them. the last thing i will just say in response to something that the said to me is one of the finest minds to come on down to some of the history. is that creating a degree that this allows fighters to, you know, attack target decided body to sign in of itself is not going to be sufficient to

somebody to be. and there's something to be said about how if a country says there are no fighters on a sorrel that are planning attacks against august long and then also arrests. 200 of them. something is a disconnect somewhere. is this sean? let me also ask you guys, want to take a step back for a moment. um, how much of a security threat does the ttp, the park is on the top of on ppos to park is on and in the region. and that's a great question. the bulk of the thread is actually contained to what we call the bible belt. that is the southern credit book. the problem is and the normal village of on problems with 2 or 3 fairly and exceptions. on january 28th of this year, the conduct of the bombing and the city of the shower, which killed $81.00 police officers. and then conducted another rate uh at the police chief headquarters and the city of cut out your largest city. in the middle of fed, followed by as one of your presenter said the attack on the political rally in july . this, these 3 attacks very specifically to indicate that they have some additional level

of urban english and struck capability that goes beyond the tribal belt. and of course, is a huge problem for the state of armstrong. as you might know, between 20082015, the cdp was predominately responsible for an entire campaign, but spend the length and breadth of the country going somewhere north of 7500 people on a yearly basis. until a very concerted kinetic operation call operations that have been lost on june 15th 2020 effectively dismantled the group. so the product is very much contained to a particular geographic region. it's been focused on would be okay on the flip edge . and the inability focused on security apparatus, the flip, the, the terrorism dominant j as of tries to turn into a target that target urban centers. what are the shot mentioned there that the the off can tell him on recently arrested 200 fighters within his own jurisdiction. i want to ask you if that is something that has in any way help to try and repair the relationship between pakistan and afghanistan. so yeah, i think it is that

a significant move by that you just ship and i'm sure that if you look at the industry when coming from las performer before the 7, and now i'm going to central savannah is the sports stablish in the state is one thing been done in general government at another. and if you look at the contribution and just to take a bite, a bucket fun is done for a defendant. the bundle g is a diploma regularly international conferences to recognize the one in stock, including the investment process for him to his mom about. and dennis, i think so many other liberties i would say a lot of their trade especially, you know, being there. but those and sister then people also come for, you know, dude, parent, education and diploma s t and everything including you know, the food invoice from it. or we even have it in general claiming that there's something that is an extra favor. these are the positive and i'm sure if you can build up on that ship, that isn't the only thing. i and i think a bunch thought music prince. unfortunately, as i mentioned,

there are 4 major interventions or somebody blames that. you know, if i responded via these other 6 factions, so i don't think so. we are in the box on the back. but of us go to new york, undermining these punches. but you graphically, most of our pause stomach yesterday with a lot of stuff for concerned about the beautiful diet bunfield are almost 9, you know, the difficult decades. and if somebody says that people don't bucks on drinks, i think we just adjusted bucks on just adjusted to the situation. right. but the international community and shouldn't, right? when i was, i think the blame should also go with those 2 supervisors who future so much of estimate or do you understand anybody unfortunate or so? but on the door, i think gustin of both sides should vote for beast. and guess what i'm seeing under the ship is betty simmons. and then i understand the pressure in terms of, you know, human rights and mondays. there's so many other things to the mind. i think that can be a very good uh, just shit and marks on has it on it. but i think you've seen the another who at the

dentist, faxed the beach bed mushrooms working and i don't know what kind of style design group of goods, what car also i want to ask you about the fact that the to be the park, something tyler bond has been intensifying attacks on focused on the security forces, is this essentially meant to send the message to the state that the state is not able to stop them. yeah, i think there's a lot of, i think uh, i receive a new pause and all the portraits. just imagine the 1000000 been that it all bonds staying in progress. i don't know who's doing what so, so definitely they can order, sneak and not the attack, especially in favorable fire and go to start and you want the times that i've been sent to the state has been, i think, fighting to work for last 2 decades. and i think it had been banished officer, distracted by this type of the gartner, pressures boxed off has to definitely this. yeah, there will step up. and i think you're just part of that liberty of that, of them for boss, or bring concession both due to be probably fees that in us to buy in part. but

they can get some space. now the rest of this, you know, this is something off of control as they had, you know, before, to make it a person for about 3 months that i mean, but i'm sure the chief is determined is very clearly said that 0 thought us for rob at that is, i'm going to fight them and so maybe they can test it in the box, not them energy or does done it from das boot diggers. so it can, i think good for another one. yes, i'll be the. are there concrete steps that can be taken at this stage to improve the situation and, and from your vantage point, could we see any kinds of negotiations or talk started again going forward? um yes, um, i think there is a lot of school. the son is. ready he is trying to, he is a wonderful person himself. however, we have to correct that to you and report that he mentions was the bunk by us agencies or us security agencies. the bunk bed report said that the numbers were

not correct, that the data that they had was different. we saw welcoming off the improvement all squared on the security fund by the united states state department. and they'll have a few months ago in the last couple of months as well. we heard a discussion about the arrests that have happened and tried doing whether it makes rational sense for the teacher be not blue exist. there's a difference between the positive buttons being there and the very large order that is impossible to control something that the bucks plenty of our case has been saying for the past 20 years, when they were accused of collecting the one positive one across the border. and use pockets time as a safe haven, there were fighters of coverage started ration army that the pocket signs were very concerned about. somehow they aren't concerned about them any more than the past 2 years. that shows that the one have provided guarantees that there have been improvements, including the rest that were mentioned earlier. yes, we do believe that united states for the militant and cd and ready to come to some as well. we blame other actors as well. however, practice on data have a central role and just to clarify that the cdp doesn't originate and off

a lot of stuff, it's really important to remember. but also you have to understand that there are security failures. we're heart broken by the attacks happening and focused on we think that they should be stuff, the bucks dining authorities and the obama parties, whatever they can do to the 5 to authorities and find a song the have the corporate and find a way to make it stop, however, you have to understand that internal politics sometimes demands that you do not own up your own security failures and have someone to blame it on. i think that very often happens with up on his tongue there on the agencies under what that does in the long run is able to help you. but you're right now, but it's really deteriorated that people to people contact between uh why it's what we gotta do right now is when we have to have security cooperation, they gotta have a joint national security council meetings between them. something they might could speak is capable of doing with the boss and be with the fighting years. so why is

it impossible for bucket spunk, producer? they're kind of the corporation. there can be ways of stopping the elements from if there are operations that are a concern, they have to be stopped. but just a stretch of rigor ongoing as each other and blaming each other does not really help relations. is this shon, it looks like you might have wanted to respond to what will be della was saying, i will let you do that if, if you did want to. but i also want to ask you about the fact that pockets on security forces have been stepping up operations against the t t p. um, as well as police raids that have been conducted, the military conducted strikes across the border in 2022. might park as don, carry out those kinds of strikes again. and so the only with horizon strikes have been a controversial topic and boxed on from the simple reason of the strikes that we did conduct in april of 2022, but not necessarily kill any to be fighters. and instead of potentially,

i ended up harming civilians on the i've gone side of the big reason for this is of course because us trooping forces that pulled out of they've got us down. we don't have access to the same level of funding, telling us that we used to inside of a bonus on and it did become a bit of an embarrassment for part time. not to mention the fact that as well as also say a friday and these kind of or the horizon strikes and extreme kinetic measures really shouldn't be of the last resort. read over 20 years. boxed on has been speaking about how the problem and i've got a strong can only be solved for negotiation. and we saw that happen on february 29th of 2020. the 1st formal legitimize ation of the i've got the button to the agreement between the united states and the i've gone on. but of course, is very much serves as a, as a baseline document for how, with all the bunch of conduct itself as far as its international commitments are concerned specifically regarding counter terrorism. and as far as a bonus on an item itself is concerned, uh, you know, i very much agree that it's very much, it's strategic imperative for bikes on to see a stable process. i've got

a son that has dramatically escalated, it's a trade regime with progress done. because as far as the goes, she gets has been the 2 sides a concern. while the to go see ation between the 2 d, b and the g o b is extremely unlikely at this stage, considering the 2 sides. one things will be on the side simply will never agree to the negotiations between the i e a and the g o p. and the continued thoughts are absolutely essential. we saw some positive news coming out of the box on special on what to have done. this done. a master on the, on the, and the acting for minister, i mean, looked at the, on september 22nd, where they have come up with this plan to try and neutralize to be present inside of a gun this time. but of course, that can very much be at, on the, with some of the more pronounced nuances that exist as far as the connection between the 2 d, b and the i. e. a is concerned. as you saw, we don't have a whole lot of time left, but i want to ask you about the fact that the parts on the government is really under a lot of pressure to improve the security situation ahead of elections next year.

what can be done to improve the security situation to so the security situation, the election is actually a very, very good point of elections. generally speaking are a soft target for these groups. and i mentioned earlier, the box on the seems to be no longer concern with the be laid, that factually is not correct. the b a is actually a part of a much larger group of organizations called the b r a s. and they have been consistently conducting a tax in progress time. but since the beginning of this year they're been close to $300.00 and the vast majority of them over 90 percent have been conducted by the to be. so that's a personal reason why so much attention both for the state and the security apparatus is on. but as far as what you've been do, i mean the thing of security, especially around the election rallies, making sure that the appointment of law enforcement agencies in key areas of concern, as well as extensive fun intelligence and ivy. it was, those are intelligence based operations, especially inside of august on are absolutely necessary while simultaneously

putting multilateral pressure on the i've gone, found a button to contain the situation on their side of the border of the waste for over the we only have a couple of minutes left, but i just want to ask you, we talked earlier about the fact that there had been this arrest of 200 or so t t p fighters in afghanistan. and, and obviously that's a move that some impacts on have praised. do you think that there will be more gestures of this nature going forward? there can be, like i said, the decrees were given stopping fighters from going into boxes, done and finding their the arrests are happening. however, if i find those funds that area will solve brandon t as violated the default to authorities have no other option. but to seize cooperation, there has to be respect for the opportunity off upon us on not doing so. ready hers, any corporation we can have so only rational thinking coming out of this prisoners, tyler ma, stop accusing each other and actually seeking each other's hell in contextualizing

what we are saying. and what we're thinking for thought about how to stop the, from operating against focused on the how of done the rest of the fighters they are offering to help. what else can be done, other than actually sitting down and sharing information. that's where we can improve. and i really wish things improve because at the end of the day, the cost is paid by the common people or the box. the funny business bundle of access to a lot of fund of winds don't have access to buck is done. we're joined by the heavy pots on such a large order and basically there is so much spin over 90. it doesn't help one of us if things deteriorate. all right, well we have run out of time to we're going to have to leave the conversation there . thanks so much to all of our guess what car fun. i'll wait a little bit here and see sean so loud in and thank you to for watching. you can see the program again any time by visiting our website. i'll just you or dot com. and for further discussion, go to our facebook page, that's facebook dot com, forward slash ag inside story. you can also during the conversation on x

r handle is at ag, inside stores for me and how much i'm doing the whole team here. bye for now the, the the, [000:00:00;00]

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