a committee of the red cross, the united nations commission of inquiry on israel's health sign. i'm certain that they would stand ready. yeah. that to enter the hospital to, to corroborate any claims these ratings made. but given the historical record of misery, the claims of this sort never having been proved by these re, these are ex post facto. see the gold stone report, for instance, a 2009 as an example. or even most recently the, the rate of these readings on the run cc hospital where film critics, which i watched earlier today, reports to show a list of a palestinian terrorist and so on. all one needs to do is read that list in the arabic language, and you would see that it only shows the dates the days of the week listed. yeah, i mean, so the claims really aren't substantiated. and again, as i say, there's a major credibility problem for these really, they claim them military intelligence demonstrates that this hospital has been using is being used, but as we speak, even though as

a basis. so yeah. how can you compare military action action? and this is the same military intelligence that failed to identify or anticipate the october 7. yeah. and decide on it was odd the credibility problem. the, there's also a great accountability problem as been not because this is not the 1st time that israel has attacked hospitals, and i'm not talking about the 1st time since october 7th. i mean, as one has been attacking hospitals for years, has it ever being held accountable for that as well? the short answer is no, it's not ever been held accountable because the international community is not made israel unhealthy israel to account for it as an occupying power. israel has an obligation to ensure the protection of a civilian population subject to its military occupation. not to persecute it, not to target is it most treated humanely and so on. and we've seen the exact

opposite take place over the course of the past month. while israel may have had an obligation to protect its citizens from the attacks of 7 october, it's gone well beyond anything proportionate or unnecessary to repel those attacks since october the 7th. and for the passing months has killed thousands over 11000 palestinians and 45 over 4500 post to me and civilians and so on and 4500 pallets. and in children, mister m size, i'm so sorry to interrupt, but we have run out of time, but the fact you so much for being with us and sharing your expertise on this subject, we really appreciate this to well, that's it for me, elizabeth. a lot of the news continues here on our 0, often upfront, that's coming up next and we have another full news release and then just on the 13 minutes the this is a region that is last week. we do the little thing,

but it's one also that is afflicted by conflict. police collapse. we try to balance the stories, the good, the bad, i believe, and he's the people allow us into their lives. they give me 10 to minus. he asked me to tell this story is 6 weeks after her mazda is a tax on october 7th. israel continues it's bombardment and siege of gaza, while israel's response has had the full support of the majority of european countries. some dissenting voices are making themselves heard and calling forth these fight. so what role is your playing in the israel does a war and how has it support for israel changed over time? i'll ask renowned economist and former brick finance minister. just verify in an upfront special the yeah, those are factors. thank you so much for joining me on upfront. it has been 6 weeks since a mazda is attacked on october 7th,

and the start of israel's been barred meant of gaza. the vast majority of european governments were unequivocally supportive of israel as well as its response. but in recent days, belgium's deputy prime minister is called for sanctions against israel and french president emmanuel. my crown has called to quote, work towards a ceasefire. are we thinking of shipping the positions of your pain governments? tragically, is this taking more than 11000 desks to see a minute shift a shift which is so late coming and so small? that as you opinions, we should have got heads in shame. the hang our heads in shame. what these things should have been the initial response that go on october 8th. what should the european union wishing you were being states have been saying the thing that logic dictates which is beyond condemnations. we all come then war crimes.

welcome them. horrible, horrible things that have been done through these regular citizens, to die citizens by hamas, to palestinians by separate us in the west bank. but, you know, let's move on beyond contamination because we, europeans have created this problem. we've created centers a 100 semitism problems against the people of the game or did you know the from that land, the jews and then we subjected them to the holocaust. then we supported that, the vital dog or victim of a land without the people for the people without the land as if by the sign was empty of people. this is settled at a white supremacist language. the british used as an australia to declare australia at that and we use an empty land and the people who don't just buy the genocide ofa the ability gene is in australia and not just in australia, they didn't dania,

they did in south africa. and you know, in the 19 twenties and so there's the process begun by which europe we're starting to get the read off. it's go over the programs against the jews. maybe get rid of the jews from you by supporting a general side against the police thing is this time victim and not be this has been going on for a d. so what happened at the beginning of october? so for anybody simple, what should have demanded the end of the state of card which creates 2 different systems on the same small bunch of land between 2 different peoples. that is the source of photo violence, violence for decades. we have a problem is that in that israel, who's a zone, but the whole point of his existence was to destroy the peace process that i have. who has one objective and likes to make sure that there is never

a 2 state solution. the solution, the jo, bites and advocates among them are on the advocates. so this is what we should have them call them all acts of violence and at the same time say to both sides to both extremes. we're not going to tolerate this. there's going to be a peace process under the united nations. there's going to be a complete clump of down all kinds of vitamins, whether it's separate viruses, the westbank by users, or how much volume is again, just varies. and we're going to sort this mess out once in vogue. well, you're going commission president ursula, bundle in propose a kind of vision and moving forward that engages some of the ideas that you just mentioned. uh, she offered 5 principals to guide the future of the gaza strip. those include no safe haven for terrace, no harm, athletic government, no long term is really security presence. no force displacement of palestinians and no sustained block a. what do you make of the proposal and does it fully represent uh,

what the european people want. 6 were missing so, so the present and no one she essentially violated on principles of european democratic process by trying to israel and effectively cheerleading the what kinds of pieces are in the guys asleep. as for the precise proposal, which comes, i have to say that we have a duty not to take me just for the lie and say seriously damn $25.00, the movement that i'm part of. we have a component and a petition for heavy movement and dismissal. she's an embarrassment to get a being, she doesn't speak for you to be innocent, you shouldn't be that should, we should get through to her as quickly as possible. having said that, let's take the 5 points. you mentioned essentially what she's doing is she's playing the game. well, one thing out of the story that the state solution by isolating gaza from the boulder problem or how to have 2 states living side by side. or if we

want to be more humanist and more them vicious, to talk about a single state that the secular and does not discriminate between jews and, and, and by this thing is she doesn't do that. she said that is that so i said, let's find this sort of simple guys. know that sort of thing for the type state in westbank because they allow me to ask the question, what is, how much where do just disappear? yeah. signed. so the idea today what happens in what happens with the west bank, where we have settlers, as we speak, of throwing out the rise and killing, murdering maiming palestinians and throwing them off their system aloud. you have it by the stimulus already that has been completely accumulated, then the price of annual forwarded the over the west bank. and you have a government which clearly says that they are going to onyx the whole thing from

the able to the see what this is for me like in suggestion for that just dealing with the guys that is to become the useful idiots of been you mean the thing out that's home is what's left on the land is that's why we, europeans must bund together and get through the earlier you talked about it, you have a long history and he could have used the prosecution and persecution of use violence against use is this holocaust guilt that leads to this place of sort of not pushing back sufficiently against israel's policies and practices. i'm asking it partly because of a poll conducted by political in 2021, but found that 41 percent of those polled and you have agreed that quote against the background of the history of the holocaust, europe. there's a special responsibility for israel, not 39 percent disagree, but 20 percent. don't know me. that's a sizable number of people. and so it makes me wonder if that informs their

decision to not some more strongly condemn israel's actions. possibly yes, there is a very good reason why we hear appearance, bad the guilt over the holocaust. it is because we are responsible for it, not just a german that says the cut off, and that's is the greek knots is the hand getting the answers in french, and that's all the collaborators. we'll play a small button up individually, but in terms of our culture, in terms of our nations, in that uniquely even event in history, in the history of the world books, humanity, all the holocaust. but the question i put to my fellow human beings, especially with my german friends, and i mean that those things is this. how far must is, is ethnic cleansing of the palestinians proceed before our justified guilt over the holocaust no longer prevents us from challenging is the ethnic cleansing of the palestinians. so to put it a bit more bitterly,

how much published in blog do we need to wash off the guild of the how that goes to the supervisor and, and the question, uh well we have to have masses attack on is really civilians you refuse to condemn either from us, gordon that in yahoo, committing atrocities across israel, palestine instead of condemning either you condemned europeans and americans as you're doing very much today as the true villains who have been, quote, making peace, impossible in israel palestine isn't really fair to offset all of these war crimes born to the west. however guilty we all may be, shouldn't have mice and is really government also be held accountable for their actions. of course, they shouldn't be, but allow me to say that i am going to be in. if i were indian or chinese south africa or like an american, i wouldn't be saying what i said. but i think it'll be, and i am refusing to play the phone, the game. the other europeans play,

especially what comes in sending. they're looking at the people who are now a suffering, both israelis and palestinians, and by twins and there was in the land of engine by this time single. what do we get or bands do? yeah, we look down upon those people say, oh, you know you i the most, you're killing each other. we're going to condemn you. whether we condemn, you know, the last week or the 2nd is, well, the thing out, hold a pillow in the end, we, europeans look down upon them. i think we are superior, we're not superior. with infinity to me. inferior. we, of a centralized, have created colonialism. we have created the semi peers. we have created the mentality of imperialism. we are behind the mass that goes to the being carried out by both sides. so we either lost people on this planet. it is going to reveal thought it be the more of the right the high ethical standards that would allow us

to bound up on these people and condemn them. i'm not going to play this game anymore. i called them everywhere. okay. but you know, was to those who say to me, why you don't come down, you have us, that's it. to them. well, you lost the opportunity to ask me this question. the moment you waiting to condemn the coming of. i'm jealous by this thing in general, unless nobody's to be in general. this is a legitimate list is riley joyce, beside the beast, to the women. old man, you've lost the moment that you forgot you neglected to condemn that at this stuff day. this condemnation game any more. let jessica with us quickly. the very simple question. do we or do you not want to see from the verdict of a c? and i use this expression provocatively, do we want to see from the say i don't care about, is the palestine or anything?

do we want to see people who live without the fear of being killed with a quote, civil and political rights. what has happened to the united states in particular? have we forgotten that great civil rights marches in those 96 this white and we have the same mentality about the land, the father stein and stopped with one assumption that should be coming amongst civilized women. men of gender, whatever we happened to be, and that is that there should be no discrimination. noah park, hide in that bland how we're going to work it up, whether it will be 2 states, multi ethnic states sitting side by side, one state for everyone that doesn't discriminate between jews between those but experience, adams and so on. i don't care. let's begin with, these are the past few weeks. we've seen some of the biggest pro palestine marches ever recorded, both in europe and in the united states. has there been

a shift in the public's attitude towards the palestinians? and if so, this lead to any kind of substance, a government position changing not really. what do we have seen? is it through their expression of the feelings out there in the communities the people of europe in the majority have this lovely additionally recognized the ethnic cleansing of the palestinians. since the lock box is $94.00, that the majority of the french, the majority of the germans, the majority of the greeks, we always understood because as they always think about the sense that there was an attempt ethnically cleanse the people that do not see our governments shifting fast enough so that we would be able in the future to answer our grandchildren when they ask us, what did you do when the thousands of children in guys that were being much that

good in cold blood? what some governments have done and response has been to ban protesting, france, germany hungry, austria have all been solidarity protests with palestine. other european leaders of tried to deal legitimize them, framing them all as anti semitic, or extreme missed events. one german m p, even suggested stripping non e u nationals of their right to protest. but how dangerous is this backlash for european civil rights and the global policy? i mean rights movement as a whole left mouse answer your person in question with an example. a few days ago, a friend who happens to be, and he's really due, who lives in berlin, stuck in the very carefully the german constitution. the stop is what kind of constitutional rights as it has been of germany, are actually discovered that the police cannot bind her from doing it. one person demonstrates that there is a standing in the middle of a square with

a plaque of which red as it needs to bailey. and does it, do i say stop the genocide of other students. and she was that i need, i say more the moment we allow this to happen for the moment to allow our police force upon them. it's our instruments. an old us of a state to the end is that i really do in the middle of believing that she's being asked that because of the expression of a view which was not even spoken, but it was written on a blackboard that is a very slippery slope to 2 things must be disseminated. so here you have a white german policeman. obviously a jewish woman who happens to be very as well in but i mean, and the 2nd thing that happens is the end of civil liberties, photos, sophia,

october 7th. the taxes also been arise and anti semitism across europe. we've seen by the top cocktails thrown on a synagogue in germany. we've seen stars of david sprayed on residential buildings in france. there was a jewish cemetery desecrate in austria. this is all very worrisome stuff. however, some accusations of anti semitism have been against people who are simply criticising israel's human rights. reckon, for example, in response to amnesty international stating that war crimes had been committed by all parties. leroy high at this. what's the reason for these really ministry of foreign affairs called an amnesty, international anti semitic, and a quote propaganda organization that's working for him as terrorist. how does one thread the needle between dismissing the idea that all support from palestine is anti semitic? without the legitimize of the fact that there is a very real rise and anti semitic hate crimes against jewish people going on. right? as we speak, whenever you have a tragedy,

like the one on folding in the line to further sign easily, i have to date the x things out of the great beneficiaries. on the one hand, the gross of the some lights, and all the other hand, the gross. i hate you know, hate that as a but a stance to allow me to answer by means of a personal story. i grew up in a fascist dictatorship, hidden grace, weird cut on those dining of the ministries. they were abominable. they were imprisoning. great democrats. we lived in fear for 7 years, all the early part of my life. now whenever a phone and a gentleman chance that or other time, the brand. great ma'am, who decides the great government? he was being accused by the greek freshest. empower in athens as being on the greek

mishandling. that's right. they call it up of on december. uh whenever a greek confronted the fascist government visits and flashes government talked to him. i talked about him as a greek hating greek. this is what we have now happening across the what there is a concert, the propaganda effort to identify, to equate opposition to the thing act was flash as government and to the archive state the t headsets so successfully creative width of december. the moment you can relate to the, to an objection to f process, the research team which addresses jewish intellectual democrats, just as much as it the opposite is anyone else the moment you identify that group as of others seem, would that be something that isn't? that is that great, this victory of, of the so much i and go back to the previous example with the eighty's have it's

the 2nd list, the, the one that i referred to in berlin. the is early june that was arrested for protesting. isn't that the height of the sent me? it has to have a white gentleman, police officer at ice thing, and he's really do involving now a lot of europe as far right parties are providing unequivocal support for israel at the moment with those same parties often have a deep and long history of anti semitism. themselves, for example, you have a marine, the pins, national riley party in france, which fully supported israel, but the party was founded by a former ss number and another founder depends on file that was convicted for minimizing the whole of costs. it many a point it towards the trans, among far right parties in hungary and poland and other places. how do you make sense of these trends? we're far right? parties have is incredibly powerful at pro israel views,

but also in the deep histories of anti semitism. a wasted worldwide phenomena and it happens getting police do we have not says who are complaining actively on of the send me the throw cuz they were even saving those disgusting conflicts in volumes about si on and so on the speed of security against the jews and now they are, you know, they are waiting these really flag and acting on the idea of to kill as many as soon as possible. you have this in the united states. you have an event jellicoe movement, which is vic splitting the right wing. it was extremely embassy, may take for 200 years in the united states, and suddenly they have made the extreme design. they position the masonic position, where by god, supposedly he's going to reappear in the fall this time. and that needs, that needs,

that makes it necessary to expands all the palestinians from that land. this is, it was why phenomena, it's very, an interesting one. i think that, you know, since you all are just so side kind of at least side guy, but he's going to have a big day for the next time that he is expedited. but what, what do we see? what we see is you see, that's what really very simple flip of a switch for on a rabbit. and december there's 2 rabbit in symbol. it's not my fault because in the end what the output i means is a group of people to be more nice. it's so happened that it was the jews. now it can be anything is going to be the syrians and can be the palestinians and could be, you know, the belgians, it doesn't really matter. they need a yes. eh, escape good. they need to be able to point other people to say if these people with advocated like would be here. this is what gambles did in the 19 twenties and $0.19

so successfully with the jews being targeted and being the victims. today's happening files by the same people without getting the jews there. now targeting the audience, americans and so on. so the greatest enemy is a fascism that requires scape goats. the fact that the go, the flip flop between different target groups is notation. i wanna ask you about something else of european countries have long been involved with sending weapons to israel. this back home international piece of research institute found that italy and germany have supplied israel's military with crucial weapons and equipment that is now being used on the ground in gaza. the u. k. has helped both of these really air force while germany has sent tank stage real as well. there's a lot of awareness of u. s. military a to is. are we talking about it all the time? we talked with the billions that we send. but how underplayed is europe's direct military assistance to israel severely. and it takes, uh,

2 forms you mentioned. wonderful selling is a weapon. this is the 2nd phone buying weaponry from you, sir. cause is a major producer to a weapon as well. and not just lisa weaponry, but also spyware. think of it or so my government hitting raise the, the government of the 70 bucks up. i oppose. they purchased better though. they've used it against their political opponents. they didn't even use it just by one on one another. so is this location in the international trade all surveillance? and lisa weaponry is, is a very important location. and you to is an active support. the place now to those who are watching us and within yes, but you must have is

a survive. my message to you folks is, is a, is nothing danger? how mass? yes, they have a capacity to inflict a lot of pain on these are, but it is not a present and clear danger for these early state is a is a tremendously powerful state. it's a nuclear state. it's called an ami onto the thief and technologically and good to be advised. there is no way that these really amik a news to anyone. only the palestinians being ethnically cleansed and they are very clear guidelines by that is really government supported by the west to get rid of them. finally to it, i gave them from the guys asleep from east jerusalem and from the west bank for you on his back pocket. thank you so much for joining me in upfront. appreciate your insights as always. i think it all right, that is our show up,

right. we'll be back later this week. the the the that the limited,

the damage at the bottom it's all been on the in the by the general comes in, but the way i get the work done. i believe, i believe is the most of the side. the northern america is a region of wonder i'm joy tragedy and yes of violet. but it doesn't matter where you are. you'll have to be able to relate to the human condition.

the i've been covering all of latin america for most of my career, but no country is a life and it's my job defense life on how and why the these really on the raids cause as i'll see for hospital as doctors say they'll stay with the patients until the end, the so i'm carry johnston, this is i'll just hear a lot from the whole. so coming up a mass claims to us for giving israel the green lights to re, to god his biggest hospital saying president biden is totally responsible. earlier joe biden said he's confident the hostages held by.