understanding what's behind the headlines is more important than ever. it takes listening to the people behind the news and to the journalist for reporting their stories except intimacy that makes every international story local at heart. i'm only give you that host of the take a daily news podcast powered by the login reporting of algebra. find us where ever you get your pod cast. renewed his riley bombardment of gauze off the sea, spot entities west lake. the humanitarian crisis. us wants these rails to do more to protect the palestinian civilians. what's the military strategy? and kinda as well learn from the intelligence finally, is that led to how much is october tech? this is inside story, the

color, the a warm welcome to the program. i'm doing a whole israel has one of the most advanced and well equipped ministries in the world, and yet on october, the 7th, how most fights has breached the gaza bowl. defense infiltrated southern israel and killed modem, 1100 people. israel responded by declaring war on em, us. it's bombing campaign has raised much of the gaza strip to the ground and killed more than $15000.00 palestinians. many in the international community have condemned the offensive as disproportionate. after a brief cease fire, the bombardment has resumed and appears to be expending into the densely populated southern part of the gaza strip. what is the is really ministries and gape. a year ago, senior government officials reportedly dismissed intelligence pointing to an impending attack by him. us so who will be held accountable for the on the heated warnings and what would it take for the israeli government dakota to operation in gaza?

a success will delve into all this in a moment, but 1st this report from sent him on ahead to be attacked by him. uh, southern southern israel and october. the 7th killed more than 1100 people. it's widely seen as a major failure of his really intelligence. a report in the new york times suggest senior military and intelligence officials were aware of what a mazda is planning more than a year ago, but ignore the warning signs. the revelation is piling more pressure on this really prime minister benjamin netanyahu. he was widely criticized at home for not publicly apologizing for the security failure. the lead to the most offensive something his security chief did in the immediate aftermath of the october attack upon his writings are placed on a space for peace. coals is to step down, you know, to sleep that they want to listen to. israel has lost faith in the prime minister. we cannot allow ourselves to conduct an extended war with a prime minister that the public does not trust. so many analysts say netanyahu's

political future depends on how he handles the war on gaza. so far is really force of killed more than $15000.00 palestinians, most of them women and children. despite this netanyahu's reiterated that the objective in gaza is to wipe out from us on the one is bundled an image, but we swore an eyesore to eliminate him. us, nothing will stop us. we will continue this war until we achieve the 3 goals to release all our objectives, to eliminate him off completely, and to ensure that gaza will never again face such a threat. but these goals seem incompatible with any kind of push for permanency spire pools and hostilities and gaza. last, at just a week to israel at the ally of the united states were quick to blame from us. it's also important to understand why the laws came to an end

because of them on almost every day dr. limits and may well have moss is israel never intended to extend the ccrpi on 7 days? what the good news the design is to redeem was preparing to start to join the site and well again on god's on it's people. yesterday we were in meetings to extended crews and we offered many proposals. these really don't want any of the counselor and the usa negotiations are continuing for further. humanitarian pauses and exchanges of captives of israel says i'm also still holding a 137 people in gaza. but with these really government seemingly intent on making up for its own failures on october, the 7th is their political will for anything more than a temporary truce. vince and mullin for inside story. the. okay, let's bring in uh guess. seeing tel aviv oregon z have is a journalist and photographer at plus $97.00 to magazine,

an independent is really online news platform in sydney. we've go down to the loan stain, author of the palestine le bar tray of book about israel's alms and surveillance industry. and here in the category of capital is of my assure a professor of security and ministry studies at the institute for graduate studies . and it will welcome to you oh anthony loans doing. i'd like to start with you and these new york times reporting that a year before hand israel, a quiet plans detailing an attack, very similar to the one that actually took place. in fact, they were hints of just such an attack, dating all the way back to 2016, but that a senior military intelligence officer rebuffed the plans because he believed ma simply didn't have the capacity. so it wasn't that they didn't know this was going to happen. it was that they didn't believe it was possible. i think that's correct

. i mean, obviously like any room for the 9 and we have to take everything with a slight degree sold on to the new york times to pull up might be wrong, but this time actually sold. i know i, one of the things that i, i discovered in myra floating over the years before a type of sentence. my book, but certainly seems, is that he's real. i think over the years like the us in many ways has believe it technology technology on it's on surveillance tech on it's on. locate them safe is police somehow, the $2.00 palestinians in guys, i would be those so i would essentially accept their imprisonment. and yes, it does appear that how mazda is making plans. in fact, i've been reading reports that there were many is riley's on the, is riley side of the guys, a boy that who would seen some us middle of the sense for her seeing something in the reporting back to that to the is riley officials and nice and see where, you know, of including many years reading women and that were dismissed i think which sort of goes to how to think often to very actually alco society in many parts needs. riley

intel is 8 in terms of the new york times reporting, the analyst who signaled the greatest sense of the threat was also it wasn't yes. and i think from what i understand, this is based on my reporting before on time of 7, but in general, he's around the coast. prides itself on being gender balanced and very openly to women and people of color and also for that matter of gay soldiers. but the truth is that when it comes to these kinds of issues, it seems that the messages were being ignored because they believed wrongly and faithfully that somehow sophisticated, repressive tech which had been explored around the world would protect them. which of course believes in the, and that he's ro, had this belief and frankly, minis. riley's, it wasn't just the intelligence it was, is riley, public fees has believe that you could imprison and pay for links really down the road from way they living and somehow be safe, which of course is not true. so in the end, this was less a failure of intelligence. the intelligence in fact looks pretty good, but more

a failure of judgment or a failure of judgment, but also political hubris that israel has believed for decades. i mean to long this occupation in modern times that the west bank and gaza recalls is on the stage for close to 20 is by egypt and israel that somehow people would accept that. now know that justifies what. how must it on october 7? by any means, but it certainly puts it in context that there was this diluted belief. and also this idea somehow that you would have surveillance technology reprice if tech drones and also huge amounts of palestinians who were being spying for each while we didn't know the exact numbering guys, including homeless members, that somebody that would keep ease of riley's safe. and it's a delusion to believe that carnes, they have, let me bring you in on the way all of this is likely to be viewed in israel. because presumably this reporting will be repeated in is riley outlets. and what do

you think the public will make of all this? because of course, they will know that something terrible went wrong. they will know that they will fail by the supposedly impregnable military intelligence operators. but this is incendiary. just to remind you of what has been reported here. the this 40 page document cool jericho would include the plans for a barrel as of rockets at the outset of an attack attack drones to knock out the security cameras and automated machine guns along the board. and gunman to pull into his route on mass in power light is on motorcycles and on foot, all of which actually happened while the government was looking the other way. a yes, i think inside is really to ongoing this discussion. we've seen the appeal reports in easily made through media of the intelligence. as anthony mentioned, brought from the border from the young

a few minnesota serving itself servers on the border. and we're seeing a training of how much in the last month or year. and they even mentioned that at some point at, for what they saw, they understood the training has the ended because they saw senior commander that they haven't seen before coming to kind of fox and didn't get a ceremony or event and they were passing. it is seeking those, the a to more senior officers that the, at some point to even told them to stop harassing them. and this is imaginary. so i think in general, all these are the public across the political last back to me spectrum is that a couldn't imagine that such a dock because people felt the army would have the intelligence. and as we see, it wasn't on the appropriate intelligence, but also understanding when this might happen, like having a specific intelligence on the weeks or months this could that take place, know people across the study probably cannot be the width uh

because they sent you the wrong environment for they sort of disclose to happen in people a society. so focus now on the captives. it appears to be very much behind the war and gaza. perhaps it's in such a retribution for what has happened or to make some sense of it. is it? is it perhaps not yet the time to be discussing? who is to blame or will this reporting stop that debate? and so this is the big debate. this is happening specifically to the public that was brought to thing against them. you know, and overall a government, he's extreme government was promoting before there 7. and it seemed that a lot of the public feeling that the attorney out we delayed the war and extend the war because you know him and he's going to know that in the minute the war officially. and of course of the easily side on the get the side it would take years or decades to, to, to repair the damage it. but on the easily side,

if it then, you know, officially ends the war process to, to start in days. so immediately. and this is why many people fear here and is it doesn't anyhow, we'll push on the war and would want to endless operation because you know, as you said, it, the chief of staff, the head of the teen bit and the other official already took responsibility. and kind of, they didn't say officially, but it's quite clear they were to resign when the war officially ends on the 30 side, at the heart of this failure of judgments. this failure of intelligence. so military interpretation, if you like, it is a determination upon the, on the part of the military and administered in the government. that home us simply lacked the capacity. it's been described as aspirational, totally imaginative. these plans that emerge increasingly that how much like the intention as well gaza was quiet. the problem seemed contained, how on earth was,

how much able so successfully to mosque its ability and its intent and ensure that israel continued to look the other way. so 1st on this really side i have to say like i'm not defending unit the a 208200 or so or anything like that. but the, the unit. yeah. the assessment did, and so it happened the like. okay, so pearl harbor, the americans fired the 1st shot, you know, they, they, they saw the, the, and the sold, the japanese submarine. and they were still surprised. how did, how most managed to essentially pull the book, tennessee xyz. you can design it, but i can sit down here and design a perfect the textbook, bridge operation. and this is the coming to, to, to your, to your question. so you get it well,

the beach and fundamentals. how much can you still hear me? yes, yes, go on. we can hear you fine. the. yeah, the had the, the between fundamental thomas executed a text book, but like i'm not talking to, you know, book you need to be like a saucer as the press of secure, secure, or reduce assault. they executed it like that textbook multi domain operation, and then with a, an air borne by mention with the drums i mentioned with a naval dimensions with a cyber dimension which is not that much in the media, but i assume it will, it will be, it will appear with the electronic warfare that i mentioned had with the intelligence that i mentioned. so it was executed as a perfect but if you so you can do this on the paper, but then do actually do it then you do. yeah. that the, the amount of planning, training, logistics, men and munitions weapon systems. and then this is the issue under, i think this is, this was the, the, the, the, the main faded on the,

on the is what you decide is a very good they, they saw this as a apply on paper, which is great. you can get a textbook on how to create a perfect ambush. and then, or in that case, a, a large scale between operation and then uh, you know, and then leave it on the paper. and, but then the, the, what, how much did that? i think that was a very, very long process of um preparation and i think some of the documents that were captured goes go back to october. the 2022 and the, the, the issue involved of orders in terms of trading. so we're talking about the year, but probably there was another year on reaching this level. so we're talking probably about 2 years of reputation. so whatever we're talking about because it's the, it was a how much the need, for example, it was

a regimen size formation. so we're talking about the range of $1000.00 fighters at those where the almost tier one they to grade a, you know, fight is if you'd have to do this behind them, every single mistake in the infantry book was done. so what, what, what was committed, you know, wait, so the, the level of training is very, so i guess they focused on the resources on that particular and they were, they were doing all of that. they were doing a lot of that, essentially in plain sight, under the glare of into, into is riley intelligence. and with politicians. and these rel, believing that thomas wanted to get visas work visas to be able to work inside is riley territory. that how much did not want war, all of which organs they've leaves as you were saying, the problem is to nothing yahoo looking intensely vulnerable when the dust of war settles. here. to what extent do you think and you were alluding to it, that, that of pursuing this war is for prime minister netanyahu

individually an attempt at putting off the inevitable, the inevitable moment when public opinion turns against him when he loses his job and possibly with 1st of all, it's important to mention that in that then yeah. when the more extreme and parts of his government it until a week ago that the agreement was signed to hostages, hostages present or deed was the signed exactly 8 days ago. it seems that he's going to, his gave up on the hostages in only the public pressure, the protest of the hostages family. and the 10s of thousands of is what he's going to the 3 despite the, the sirens and the rockets that were fired, that from time to time in to set the result in the process and the actions off the, the families and the support has led at the 6th through government to agree to this data, because we heard that the out saying

a few times that eliminating come us and we can talk about this the target later and returning to hostages is equally important. then according to different reports, we've seen that already in the 1st days of the war. how much offer the deed or fair there is already in the it is ready, children and women and exchange of the female present kind of thing and present, or for the something for the prisoners and the, for the thing in my interest in easley presence in the going to reject a dispute open a war to satisfy the sense of prevention days like probably going to show they're doing something. and after a month on the very media, these are the media figures and the government is claiming that the military efforts it allowed this new app and in better condition. so it's one which i disagree. so i think we're really, we're seeing that the public pressure has been here to achieve this deal and the government to, to agree to feel the fire under the condition to renew the war. this is the something small kitchen,

and then another minister demanded that the sci fi will not be too long in their opinion. and i think now, slowly we would fade bigger parts of the public. it going to prompt us directly against that then? yeah, we're ready. seems self with people. some of the families offered the victim is the kids didn't murder on october 7th, brought this thing in the front of the parliament. we've seen that some more brought to the intel of even jerusalem. but the, i believe, as, as this go on and more people in the public would realize that the, within the hour is, do we not the setting goes back to the floor. it and you know, talking generally about immunization come up, but not talking you how to do it and more important. not talking what really happened on the day after and got the we've seen the it. yeah. let people ahead of the position is where the publishing a document today is talking about the day after and does it talking about international, the interference there and other point it but more important, he's saying that then you always not offering anything. and it's quite clear that

under, is it extreme government? it no solution is acceptable, then maybe just the settling and same does the some of the ministers in other writing the apartments members declare what was making of the day after and speaking of play a goals. i mean, one of them is to protect israel from any future threat from gaza. anthony lowenstein, foaming gaza to the ground. doesn't to achieve that? does it? uh, they need to be of the ways, intelligence driven and lead methods of protecting israel from what of a threat it perceives to existing goes beyond this war. i think that's right. and it's interesting and not in the last 24 hours inherits these rather newspaper. they were comments that many of the arab states to publicly have been very critical of these around across many of them in the last days and sign site. but normalization deals weekly 0, assign privately according to this report,

that in fact and the heavy. how must to be militarily deficient, assuming that's even possible because they regard how mouse, animals, and brotherhood as a threat to themselves and their own countries wherever it may be. and the error will look ultimately the reason that military solution, israel has currently destroyed the northern part of gauze. so they seem to be moving into destroying the southern attack. nicole's that can only lead to one conclusion, which is that the idea ultimately is to make it an habitable for the vast majority of palestinians. the. and i say in the last 24 hours, multiple reports. and these riley press, talking about how elements with units and yahoos government, the vision, if you can call it that he's asked, is to have as few palestinians as possible last at the end of this doesn't mean they're going to kills them. of this means that to potentially find ways to remove them. egypt, jordan, living on those nations at the moment have not accepted the idea of taking palestinians instead of clause the 10 cities that has not happened yet. despite the

fact that i know israel has attempted to bribe easy egypt in huge amounts of mind taking lots of palestinians in the saw 9 fact, the report in the last 24 hours to days these rel even imagined trying to get, tell us the names out of guys of by see in the middle to ryan and kind of crazy ideas in a way. but that's the vision here. if you can call it that, the reason the vision will be on, but the us is pushing, which is a posting authority which is deeply corrupt and unpopular in the west bank. i mean there is no solution here without actually engaging palestinians and israelis in dialogue which so far no one series seems to want to do the outline designed to as a sure. what do you imagine represents victory for israel in gaza? when will enough be enough? well, it's a, it's the object of holes in the declared is what is the destroy the, is the store, how most basic nation we know met military and politically. and is that the

objective is there's a lot of civilians, the going to be killed and to get through this objective and then he will consider them collateral damage. they will not really stop at that point unless it is like significant political pressure from the international community from the us as specifically and from others. but, but the objective is to degrade and destroy him. us probably also will take over guys, a city i don't know what it's, it's unclear to me. uh, the, the end game. i don't, i don't think it is here for the, for these are the, you know, the, the, the end game is that there's a question, mom is i'm taking on this notion of destroying hamas. and i'll throw this to you only if this notion of destroying him us it. i mean, on the face of it looks fanciful in the sense that what struck me this week in the

release of palestinian prisoners on the occupied westbank was the number of homeless flags that were flying, the number of prisoners and prisoners families who thanked quote, the resistance meaning him, us, the idea that there are thousands of all friends in gaza now who will grow up with hatred, resentment, and revenge in their hearts. the idea of getting rid of hamas seems outright fanciful. does that idea penetrated to israel? i think me say they also eliminate in come us, at least in the gals, a something that a vast majority of things that he probably agree on if and it's because it's something that is promoted by the media and the politicians from all the political expect them with our treaty explaining that identity, it's not something that it's so easy to, to eliminate. and specifically getting not mentioning that is what

a government them specifically been. i mean it then, you know, with trend thing, you can come up for the years by because it was 10 as they didn't upset it was good for them to come. boss is running a guns and give them a reason not to, to push further to and products choose not to, to promote any political diplomatic solution and separates between the west bank and how much as you said, the by reducing the prisoners. i'm not sure this has done investing, of course, how much is gaining a lot of power in the west bank in any service and we're seeing get people to sanction them as far as that. i thought personally being who needs to submit it last week. the prisoner authority, and as the civilian death toll escalates again, i want to ask you each very briefly, what you think will make this stop anthony 11, steam will it be when israel feels it has reasserted itself as a power to be fitted? and that's what their intention is, you know, anything they can stop, this is america, and really is as simple as that. and of course,

at the moment america has no intention of doing so. but the only power that can do, sir, is bite and getting on the phone and stopping. there is no other international power can do that. and i see that that is not on the agent there at the moment despite the need for it to happen. because america is still sending weapons to israel as we speak, including bunker busting balm. so this is america, on the one hand, talks about bringing some kind of reduction in civilian casualties. and that's the public message. we have private latest sending many more weapons, which is what really matters any. and tragically, cards is, will it be when is riley public opinion decides? so it's enough killing of civilians in gaza. easy enough. and this is one man's war and needs to and a, these are the public is not really looking on what's happening. you can gather these really mates or media is not really bringing the images, the interviews that the things we see on your child and other international channels. so the public is not really aware to the amount of the destruction or end

of a station does not. yeah, and factors, leaks, not perhaps in a n n a we don't know what, where from the international the, the, the reactions to that. and unfortunately, i'm saying the very sadly i think for the easily public we've the sense of free revenge and sadness then was the mistaken score politician nothing. what would it be? not so i think it's, anthony said this is about international pressure and not the bodies would have probably noticed by the suffering of thousands. i understand. i'm sorry. we've got to move on a marshal of finally last would you, would it be when i'm us, gibbs up. it could be if we don't know how much is left and how much is ours. i've seen a lot of men, weapons, and munitions and tunnels. we. but we know it, so it goes on the siege on the double seat drawn from around, doesn't one around the north, and probably there will be a 3rd one that on guys and $52.00 weeks we would to be but adult. it also could be if, if the, as my colleagues, the said international pressure is on one hand,

the change in the public opinion on the other that affects the decision makers, determination. but also the, the, the casualties of the below is what it is, varies that with the casualties. and when we're talking now about the figure, the figures that exceed 15 years or more in south lebanon, 1985 to the south end, as well as to how about you to his and now we're, we're north of the $260.00 pounds of casualty. okay. what did that deal deputy use the the, the missing the, the, the disorders and so on. so the, these, all these all are out of the combat in the area. okay. and what, why would i have to wrap it up there? many, thanks for your thoughts. let me thankful one of my guests for a spirited discussion organs is utilities and of in seen in sydney and of my assure here in the hall and thank you to for watching. you can see the program again any time by visiting our website on tuesday or dot com and for further discussion, go to our facebook page. that's facebook dot com, forward slash

a j inside story. you can also join the conversation on x out handle is at a j inside story for me, joe, the whole and the whole team here. by for that the the, the latest news as it breaks many of the people here. but they say that they're celebrations, or sorry, we don't say the number of those too often kill god with detailed coverage by a release of those. the health comes to the little side of his railways, as in following every sense of this thing and fearless gen and isn't. most children will survive, talk to deal with the pain and trauma of losing their parents. i loved one, or it is a tenant of journalists to produce objectives these coverage is treated. i don't

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