for where they have to stay with the president, the vice president, secretaries there's, there's a lot of people that they need to protect. but again, every time you see donald trump's motorcade, i was struck by just how it looks like it did when he was president. that is unusual. i don't know if that's because the secret service realize that he is such a controversial figure. but again, a secret service. there they, they can't be a 100 percent. uh, they obviously have a lot of teams there. they, they try, they had all the equipment at all of this, all these resources, but no, you can never be 100 percent, especially if you think about it. this is a country that is literally a wash in guns. i believe we have more guns in this country than we have people possibly thank you. without an official joins us live enough and they walk in wisconsin and we understand you may have some details about those who may have been affected by this since well, this is,

this is coming from the district attorney and butler county, which is where the shooting took place just in the last few minutes, he's confirmed in a statement that the one person in the audience has been killed. someone has been arrested by the secret service on president trump received a graves on the cheek after bullets were fired in his direction. so confirmation from the district attorney, it's important to remember at times like this, initial reports tend to get very garbled. you start getting reports about a number of shooters you start hearing about different directions. and the best thing to do is really just to wait for the official sources to confirm and we're getting that confirmation from the district attorney in the last couple of minutes . now, we know that joe biden has been informed you said another briefings. i, i, and certainly there are some people suggesting that this is the evening that the, the joe biden, one has to speak to donald trump and speak to him soon to make sure that the former president is okay. i'm to,

to speak to the nation. there will be concerned about the heated rhetoric that we've had across the united states, not just during this election campaign, but really over the last 20 years or so. and both sides are guilty of it. and donald trump talking about how does the united states would be finished if you'll bite. and i do with the came to power for another 4 years. and people saying that the end of america was at the end of an election campaign to put donald trump back in the white house. so the politicians will be under pressure to, to, to, and things done, but certainly on social media with already getting the conspiracy theories are being passed around. so just to confirm what we have had and confirm from the butler county district attorney. that's the area where the shooting took place. one pass and in the audience has been killed. there are a couple of injuries there. donald trump was great. he's been taken to a medical facilities. he's put out a statement in the last i was thinking the secret service for doing the job that

the they are to do, which was to get him from the scene as quickly as possible and protect him. and we also know that another person has been arrested and is cunningly in police custody . we know the video will be scanned completely by local enforcement, federal enforcement, and also the secret service as we try to establish exactly what has happened, how the shooting took place. was it someone inside the arena where the riley was being held? was it someone outside the arena as potty has been seeing? it is incredibly difficult to get through. essentially, the metal detectors that are on the age of these areas with politicians, hold the rallies and we can assume that going forward as we see more rallies in the run up to november. the 5th that a lot of the security arrangements will change it. these rallies and they, it's some past not been texting within the last hour or so has suggested that perhaps we are going to see more of the politicians,

joe biden. and donald trump speaking from behind bullet proof glass to ensure their safety and ensure that there's no repeat of the incident that we've seen in the last couple of hours in pennsylvania. and to start with that update that were us senate majority leader, democrat, chuck schumer has also waiting on social media. he said something very similar to his republican count default. he said, i'm horrified by what happened. the trump rally in pennsylvania and relieved that former president trump is safe. political violence has no place in our country. above or perry is professor in that presidential studies at the university of virginia. she joins us from charlottesville, virginia, thanks for joining us. what do you make about of what's happened here? we understand we haven't the report that someone was killed as well. what are your feelings about this?

if someone or more than one person was a need for the former president, i suppose this is what is horribly referred to as collateral damage. and how horrible that is, that an innocent person at a rally which is usually very joyous, should lose a life. and, and that is just, just to heretic to contemplate, i was thinking, i, as i've been listening to the support of coverage. but as i was preparing yesterday for what we thought this conversation would be, would be about pennsylvania being a key state in this 2024 presidential election. i was reading about trump's appearance today. i had of time and i did something really sticking in my mind. and that was that they were expecting about $15000.00 people to come to butler county. i and see the president, the former president for this rally, and that some people are in the security realm, i think are on the organizational round for this affair like atmosphere,

county fair, like atmosphere. so that's a lot of people, you know, 15000 are you sure we were saying this is a trouble campaign? are you sure that that that this can be handled and the response that i read came back. yeah. no, we, we feel comfortable that this can be handled. so i do agree that things may change as we go forward for both of the candidates food compet president, the former president bowling pre screens the stand behind and that goes back to my previous point. but presidents and presidential candidates typically don't like to have any kind of barrier between them and the people, even a clear bullet proof barrier. in some ways, i think it will take us back to 2020 and cove it and, and yet i should also point out that that was something a quite inflammatory that former president trump said about, oh president by the new or used in a basement. and he's the worst president that we've ever had, and i see that the stolen likes and in 2020 it's back. very kind of been slammed

for a language that can join up the hatreds of people with guns and people who have psychological problems. and so to lower the level of that kind of inflammatory rhetoric wouldn't be very helpful. whether that will happen. i can't say that this isn't what anyone would have wanted. obviously, the safety of both candidates is the most important thing. what does this galvanize donald trump's course support on even water than that's going forward to i think it will. i think that if there were many doubts about who will win in november now, obviously things can change in a heartbeat in a moment. in something terribly unexpected. and something terrible, which we hope will not happen again as we get closer to november the set. but we're just saying the things words and remain as they are right now. i think this is actually something that will pull the,

the mag of people together. and as one of your guests also said, maybe some people who were leaning towards trump but didn't feel was comfortable enough. may again, be the sympathy vote that you will get or that he's so strong and that he will come back from this. i to point out in 1912 a former president, theodore roosevelt was running for another term, another non consecutive term as a 3rd party candidate which makes a difference. but as you stood up to speak, and i believe it was milwaukee in an open car on a would be assassin shot in the chest. but he had a very long speech that he had folded up in his breast pocket along with his eyes glasses. his glass case and the bullet did penetrate, but did not kill him. and he then said much like trump holding up his fist, teddy roosevelt said it takes more than a bullet to kill a ball loose. and in fact, his 3rd party, which was the progressive party, came to be known as the ball news party. now because it was a 3rd party,

he did not win that 2nd term, non consecutively, but i'm sure that there were people who supported him to begin with and then only increase their support because he bounced back from adversity. barbara perry would like you to stay with us. we're going to bring in another guest and you'll both be able to to speak to each other and have each other as well. so that's a bring in my home own going. now he's a full my us deputy assistant secretary defense. he joins us from whitefish, montana. welcome to the program. what is your reaction to what, what's happened here? well, good to be with you. my tell a guest in your audience. i wish i could say was shocked, but i'm not, quite frankly, this is really where us political discourse is gone. we have seen a rise in violent extreme is on both sides. we don't know who exactly who this was, but it's clear the person was extreme. it and if it was 2 shooters, it may have been a, some kind of conspiracy and not just a long roles. person was some kind of psychological disorder and this is

preliminary. so i would couch that all of this is subject to the investigation and finding out what actually did happen. but i think it's clear they do, do us political system. this discourse is taking a very dramatic downward turn. does this again raise issues. they know they've gone control in america too much money, right. well, yes, and you mentioned i'm in montana where a lot of people do own guns, but the u. s. has the highest per person. uh, ownership of guns, i think so i just looked it up. so a $120.00 guns per a 100 people. so more than one per person, which means not only do law abiding citizens have them, but plenty of other people, they shouldn't have them have access to it. and we will find out just exactly what happens here. but it does, it will raise issues of why with these individuals able to get these type of weapons of torture. barbara perry raising issues over gun control. what's your fee?

and this was going to be part of the discussion, i think going forward in this campaign, as it often is in the united states because of the mass. you need to continue to happen. and certainly have happened under both of these presidencies of donald trump and joe bought it. and obviously they have to, they're very different views of this policy. so i think it will now come to before, as well as not just gun control, gun safety. we should have a guy who shouldn't, but also the issue as it relates to political violence. i would add, as we've been talking about inflammatory politics in the united states, i'm sitting here in charlottesville, virginia, where it's 7 years ago. this coming month in 2017. the nazis descended upon this glorious university town and the one person who was killed was killed by one of the nazi protesters. and he killed a counter protest or on the side of what is called

n t 5. and he killed her with a car. he ran over her at top speed and just barreled into a crowd and injured many people. and one of my fellow towns people lost her life. i so sadly, as people on the extremes, if they even don't have a gun, they will find a way to create havoc and sometimes by less to the point of homicide, michael mulroy, getting what we see. no, we don't know the full details. yes, of course, but what can be done then about this kind of polarized nation that seems to be providing in the political arena to? well, i would start with uh, wanting to see a joint statement from both political parties, stating that political violence is completely unacceptable. instead of just statements individually, they could come out together and say that i think of course i won't solve the issue, but i think it would show unity and something that really needs it. and i would

really point out that there's a concern, i would imagine right now that they'll be some kind of retaliation. there is a very extreme holiday on the far right that was just mentioned in charlottesville, who is likely going to try to respond to this in some form or fashion. obviously we all hope that doesn't happen, but i said both the fbi, i in the secret service and the rest of the department of homeland security is looking at that right now and trying to follow the chatter on something that may happen as a result of this and i think is also important toward the trump campaign to put out that, that, that would be absolutely unacceptable so that they can be some, uh, uh, the escalation of what we saw today. and it doesn't erupt in, in, in more violent public power. a joint statements from both political parties. and i really like colleagues, idea there, i think that would be surprising because let's remember that some of this polarization comes from uh at least one side of the spectrum,

the i. and i'm by that i have to say on the president, trump breaking down the traditions i, i just in preparing for the upcoming conventions and how to media requests to look back at presidential appearances or candidate appearances. do you realize the very 1st candidate to appear a convention is not until 1932 f d r a period in person to give his acceptance speech. and because of prior to that, it was thought unseemly. and so just see how far we had come. even from recent years where the guard rails of tradition or the, and a get of political tradition has been so broken down to the point where a president then president trump did not attend the and on your ration of duly elected president biden. so if we could get past some of that and, and maybe it'll be interesting to see personally how former president trump will respond to this horrific event that has happened to him. sometimes people change

their approach to life when they come face to face with uh, was that michael? all right. how might this shape the political agenda going forward with an election? so class a well i from national security analyst. i don't usually do politics, but i would, i would imagine that this may solidify the trump supporters and potentially some that were on decided may go in that direction because they have some kind of empathy for them. but it's important to point out, one of the things he could do is de escalate his talk when it comes to. um, you know, uh the democracy stopped to see you and all these things that had been proven to be completely false. but some of his supporters, quite frankly, believe it entirely. and if you believe it entirely, then you may justify taking actions into your own hands. and i think that kind of rhetoric needs to stop completely. i think they will be a significant increase in security around all campaign events going forward and

a certainly the conventions that are coming up cause there could easily be an attack or some kind of retaliation based on this. and then it could, could escalate from there. hopefully that's not the case, but i do think what the candidates say and what they say jointly really does matter . in the circumstance, you mentioned security there. i mean, what kind of security do uh, for my presence have around them in any case, michael, my as well, he's not just a for, i mean for the president had secret service, a support, but kick candidates the, the main candidates for each party have robust secret service protection and it's going to increase, but i would say, and i, i'd certainly watch the videos, they responded quickly, but there's going to be a question about how potentially 2 shooters got to within that close to a presidential candidate. so. so this is obviously a break down in security. yes, thing reacted quickly, but they shouldn't have had to do that in the 1st place. so there's going to be

a lot of questions i think coming up of just how the suitors got the that closer to the former president and, and actually hit him the best with him and it did look like something. so i'm kind of project, i'll hit the right side of the space. so this is, this is going to be something that i think is going to be looked at. security is gonna increase substantially. and there's going to be a lot of questions of how this happens. baba perry, i'll guess the michael mulroy mentioning about security getting ahead and changing and being rammed. so does this change the nature of campaigning then in a sense, people feeling well candidates feeling less close to the public? oh i saw of that for years and years of from the time that president kennedy suffered the fatal head wound in dallas. and 1963, it was no longer thought to be the right thing to do to have a president ride in an open car. and when presidents might pop out of the limousine

on a non gracious day and walk for part of the uh, the, the stretch between the capital one, the white house that's got shorter and shorter and much more security around that. the people who crowd for the non duration. so i have that with this, that through my entire life and the, and the political sciences and a person who attends political rallies and goes to white house for events. i am always overwhelmed by the amount of security and i'm always thankful to the secret service and i thank them in person. i always say thank you for keeping us safe. but it always makes me sad that at the age of 4, i was taken to a john f kennedy rally when he was running for president and not in a rally at our hometown and level kentucky. my mother took me and my brothers there and we stood in front of the podium. she told us, i and well, there was no metal detecting and, and so i, i missed that. and yet i understand what can happen spoke as i began to think. oh no, are there shots being fired in former president? trump?

i do believe, but i couldn't believe it. and i couldn't. it was the same kind of reaction i had with someone called me on january 6th, 2021 and said, there's a riot on the floor of the senate in the house. people have breached the security of the us capitol. i said, you must be mistaken, that can't be true. so we have to realize that these things can happen. security can break down and we have to respond as best we can going forward. you talk about history that a history of high profile shootings in the us, you mentioned don't have kenny kennedy and the robot kennedy. remember when ronald reagan was injured in the shooting in 1981. i mean, how does this affect americans? oh i again, i remember that so well i had called a friend to tell her i was just gotten into harvard university for grad school. i was over the moon and she worked at a local radio station or tv station in lloyd, but she said, i'm sorry i can't talk. present reagan has been shot. i ran to the tv and there was bad, horrible sea and the scene of his, his press secretary james brady,

heavy fall on face down and he never would he lived but he didn't recover from a brain injury a bullet to the break. we should know about the press this current candidate and former president donald trump, that the president reagan was hit by the bullet. it bounced off of ricocheted off of his. lemme see the bullet flat as if it was a coin, a flat point and sliced into his chest. so it is possible until we know all the details that former president trump was it perhaps hit directly by bullet, but maybe something that glanced off the teleprompter off the food in my coat mode . right. when you look at what's happened here, do you think this will bring the country together or would it make it even more power to rise? it's a big question obviously. but what's the feeling? do you think of as well, i certainly would like to say that it's good to bring the kind of country together and have to be a uniformed outrage at the use of violence in any kind of political discourse. i

mean, it shouldn't be used anywhere, but certainly the political in a democracy it's, it is absolutely should be a nazi. but i'm afraid it's not going to be the case. there's going to be uh, those on the far right isaac, which made them spark the far left cuz there's, there's extremes on both sides. and that is what seems to be the most volatile side parts of our political spectrum. and we have the means. we already talked about the level of uh, accessibility to gardens, to do great damage. and that's horrible. and i think the only way we can mitigate this is to have joint statements from the candidates, from the parties doing everything they can not only uh to quell their own side, but we'll talk about how we should move forward as a country in a democracy. perry, to what extent do american politicians do you think have a responsibility to make sure that things don't go further just it will keep things

on side in terms of civility as well. i like that term. very british on size. i keep things on side. keep things within the bounds of propriety, and that's what it is, not as though we've never had other democrats in american politics. on 3 i mentioned from the 20th century hughley lawn was left his social democrats, father, coslyn or coughlin, with the radio priest was a fascist, to a catholic priest in the 30s on the radio. and in the fifty's, joe mccarthy, the republican senator from wisconsin. the red bay are the the which hunter of comments and actually of those free one was the fascinated and that was you a lot of from louisiana, the founder said in our democracy in our democratic republic, remember, we're not a direct democracy. we're a republic. so these people who run for office we're running to represent the

people rather than the people themselves, making the decisions. so those people who are running for office, oh, want to our country, the republic to cheese things and bounce keeps things onside the founders, most fear, demagogues, demagogues, why they use half truths. they generate the emotions of the people and they often pick out groups of people in society to turn the, the people they want against them. and that's why we have an electoral college and rather than the popular vote determining our, our outcome in presidential elections. so it is incumbent upon presidential candidates, particularly attend, she within the bounds and not become demagogic. and i think that's where we've gone off the rails to use another metaphor or gone out of balance or gone outside public perry and michael mode. roy, thank you. bye. very much indeed for joining us. we'll go ahead and spoke to a volunteer at the trump riley in pennsylvania,

who was in the row in front of the former president. when the shooting began. i was sitting in the 1st row directly in front of the president, trump. i still call him president trump, that he was speaking. we were standing up. he was speaking all of a sudden we heard pop, pop, pop sounds of a lot like fireworks. then we realized all the secret service, it was at least 4 of them, jumped on the stage, pushed them down, and all that, they were the news people that were around them on the front. they pushed them all down to the ground. and then the man with the guns cold come up and they start clearing the area and i hear them clear one clear to clear, right? clear left. lift them up. so they lift president truck up from the ground. president trump says, i want to get my shoes on. i heard that directly from him. they must have fallen off when we pushed him down on his right cheek was a tear drop of blood right here. then when he turned,

you could see the right here from the top of the year to the bottom. blood wasn't pouring blood, but it was blood like a piece. then they walked him down the steps and put them in a car and took off. now we could to the right of me, we could see the sharpshooters on the, on the building behind from the gentleman behind me said the sharpshooter struck to the left i heard from other people there was a sharp. there was a suitor on the left in the right side of the drum. i didn't witness that city where there was more than one shooter. that's what i heard was to. the one on the left took out the speaker. there was a where the brain was, took out the speaker. so then i just called my husband is watching on tv, of course. cuz he's wondering, you know, he knows i'm in the 1st row. he said before they put trump down, he saw the blood on his ear. so that almost indicates that he was nicked. so he was hurt before he went down. that's we all thought when he got up that he was hurt

somehow from pushing him to the ground and didn't know what was underneath the teleprompter or whatever he was standing in front of. that's what i thought when i saw. but he said no, they specifically, he showed before they got them down, the blood was there. so they must have nicked the e, i would say they probably next the little bit of the year. but then midway, when trump thought up in our walking away, he did the 1st month on the stage all the way down. the steps did appear direct. now to the left, i knew a gentleman who was on the stage earlier. mister elmore from beaver county, i think he was, he ran for the state house. he had a white shirt on when i saw a shirt, it was blood all the way down like that. so he was definitely in that lift stand where they say somebody was saw, was he shot or was he helping some he looked to me like he was not shocked cuz he was walking out. but neither he was standing next to somebody who or he was helping somebody in the got the lien. it didn't look like the fresh blood trumps.

definitely look like fresh blood. you could tell the difference of real red compared to like us to mir from was definitely had red one here us senate republican leader, mitch mcconnell has been one of the 1st to comment on the incident on social media . he said tonight, all americans are grateful that president trump appears to be fine officer, despicable attack on a peaceful valley. violence has no place to know politics. we appreciate the swift work all the secret service and other no enforcement. us senate majority leader, democrats, chuck shooting that has also waiting on social media. he said something very similar to his republican council called he said, i am horrified by what happened at the trump riley in pennsylvania and relieved that form at present. trump is safe, physical violence has no place in our country. as close now to mont. honda,

who joins us from washington, dc miko reaction has been coming in thick and fast. yes, indeed. and we've just heard from president biden, he's released the statement saying that i'd be brief on the shooting of donald trump. i'm grateful to hear, but he's safe and doing well. i'm praying for him and his family. and for all those who are at the rally, as we'll wait for the information jill and i are grateful to the secret service for getting him to be safety. there's no place for this kind of violence in america. we must unite as a nation and condemn at president biden concludes. he's been brief by the secretary of homeland security by the director of the secret service. we've also heard from former president brock obama, who's also issued a statement expressing concern and expressing relief as act to the former president is safe as a secret service say. so we both have good from a number of other political opponents. the senate to majority leave the chuck

schumer at the bed minority leave the in the house. i came jeffries and also from former speak up the house of nancy pelosi, all of them expressing relief that the former president has not been seriously injured. it would appear and also each of them making that statement that political violence, that violence has no role whatsoever in political disclose. so the condemnation of this attack is coming from across the political spectrum, opponents, as well as supporters of former president donald trump. and we've also heard from outside to the political c, a e learning musk as released the statement pledging his support for donald trump in the election. and also expressing hope that he recovers quickly. so there has been m. s. reactions throughout the united states, both among politicians and also among citizens such as the low mask america, a fast moving situation. i'm sure we can expect

a lot more reaction in the coming hours and days. it present the oil trying to reduce the tensions a very much so the tension that has being prevalent in recent months has been intense. this says many ups of is already saying is a result of a political discourse that has been really, really bad in recent months. and indeed for a number of years now of these acts of violence. so this particular act of violence is seen by some as a consequence of the nature of the political debates or the lack of any formal political debate within the united states. the and good between the opposing sides . the anger between the supporters of various candidates has been very prevalent within this country. and this is seen by many as a direct consequence of the toxic nature of the political discourse within the united.