hope your husband ever experienced a landslide on this day of with this so many people killed from around the world between those white coast guard ships and the blue vessel. that's where a 2nd tankers think last week. so close to the store, we can see it clearly with the naked dye of the . busy i made or instead of get a, this is comes in the cost on. i'll just see where you are. we can look at the world business and a couple things. the spring theorist says domination of the global economy, it's a decades, but the world is friendship like geo political tensions. and globalization is facing a backlash. is the economic or the change? is it the u. s. versus china? the trade war between the 2 nations are seen to help the competition between washington and the aging could accelerate the collapse of the old system. so what's

the alternatives? developing nations are formed. economic alliances like bricks to count up the dominance of the west. but when it book, the economic integration and globalization, the free flow of trade, but the us for held that's the economic go to the world is known for decades today though, this integration of the rules based world order is evident for all to see countries of becoming more inward looking regulates re fences have been erected. the world trade organization is in limbo, nations or racing to build the industries of a few chips and trade restrictions are increasingly being imposed by the system that govern the global economy. since the 2nd world war is at a tipping point now, both and ever so is a new world order emerging. we'll discuss that with our guest shortly. but 1st, let's listen to what some leaders have to say about the old one of the poor

countries have bein and being a pest and title lies by the rich countries. naturally, the poor i'll be de, and angry and have lost faith in justice and on global political economy. government created more than 6 decades. i have not kept pace with the changing realities of 2 were punching on sale. really. metrics remains the one dynamic elements in the global economy. and as such, they will account for a significant share of trade. changing showtime, where the funding room, where the 5, the development of the emerging market and developing countries is not intended to move the cheese. but to make the pie of the global economy bigger, we should push forward this stablish, many of governing models and rules, which will balance and inclusive. we should push forward the reform of the global

economic governance system to reflect the current structure and realities. you know, it can be been a want to keep the whole spike each night. i asked myself, why should every country have to be tied to the dollar for trade? why can't we trade in our own currency if you don't know before they move in? why don't we have the commitment to innovate? newport discovery with an uber with the union. we are against any kind of a gemini or exclusivity propagated by some countries and the new policy of ongoing colonialism near colonialism based upon this assumption. know, we have to reform global economic, financial and political, as well as the most to little trading system. so that we can create a couldn't just safe environment for federal. let's introduce you to a panel of experts and get a quick reaction from them from single pull rejoined by dante clark, who's dean and location. professor at economic at the national university of single

pool from johannesburg, which went by arena. your son, who's a senior research at the institute for global dialogue, and a specialist on the ricks block. and finally, at london, philip lagrano, who was a political economist and full of special adviser to the director general of the world trade organization, di is the, will older, the old world order, close to collapse. i don't think so much is close to collect spite. so it's certainly being question from all sides. the clips that you showed, the clips that we heard a few minutes ago with ones that were from what sometimes we think of as the global self. and they were critical of the international economic for the one of the interesting turnarounds, is that today the advanced economy used to reach economies out also critical of the international economic order. and how this comes out is going to be really interesting going forward. i don't think that we're going to have to be thinking

about how we, we think categories it might no longer be breaks on global south or west versus east. but more groups of countries that have an adherence to economic performance that dynamic and forward looking. a keen to emphasize trade key to think about building out economic fundamentals, need to continue to work with a level playing field. then on the other side, a group of no nations that might have historically had the up ahead. but for whole now, growth is in need and so that it seems to me is the increasing confrontation that would be a challenge to the international economic order. 3 that would you agree with that? if the overall order is, is not collapsing right now, the economic central gravity is shifting, isn't it? absolutely, and i mean,

part of the fixture strategic intention is to use that partnership to create windows where they can also change the world and where the search everyone should not be the focus because countries, pragmatic for the forces themselves. but if we look at the institutions specifically from the post world war to order that we characterize the world, the bi multilateralism is and has been under attack. and if you look at the brooks and the values and the statements, but the advocate for rules based order govern by international law and celebration of multi let's chism may take for granted that this may be interpreted for one's fine value systems. and so the criticism is that the world is in a constant state of stable and key in the institutions like your w t. r should be instilling these relevant boundaries to metal acadia and strategic interests. and it's improved really the racist

a smaller countries. but managing and middle powers that need to uphold institutional values to build this kind of critical mass that is needed to create a culture of accountability, the people that, that we want to see for they've, what's going wrong with the institutions that were designed to safeguard the the old well order of a now defunct, that i think was changed is the all to the which is the one of the provided since they have to come. who in the early ninety's was based on focus for parents are now crumpled out. the 1st is western economic dominance and assigning a sense um the west is defined as the rest have risen. the 2nd was exceptional period of us a g of physical like harmony. and we now live in an increasingly multi part of wild, which is characterized by 3 by jet political conflict between the still dominant us and the rising china assembly as that it was a narrative um, before there was

a belief in optimal kits, which trump pretty much everything now increasingly that issues that i'm by not master of security concerns added the industrial policy policies, not just in the west also and showing there are indeed as always, been the case. i'm not, but not least of us putting those just suppose international rules enter it by far the most the time. i'm not succession for hegemonic because i'm not now, but it's no longer the case is little because in the united states, it's not the case. i can show it to 900, they were willing to accept, i significant a constraint on very phenomena policy badging. and the actual reason the all the for the quarter of the big question policy microsoft was, is it going to make this rich? and now the key priority is, is it kind of make is most secure. ok, before we go, any further trade and investment flows assessing into new passengers built around

the top 2 economies. the us and china, who racing to shape the norms and rules of the world. so you cannot make, i'm political, old washington is raising that. he's on badging with investment cubs and trade restrictions. china is redirecting large parts of its economy away from the west toward the developing world coffee, a lopez for a young reports. the world is changing fast, and so is the global economic order. trade wars between the us and china are fueling much of the shift foraging new alliances, and fracturing old ones. us president joe biden recently issued a new round of terrier of somebody james, affecting about $18000000000.00 worth of chinese products, including electric vehicles, batteries and semiconductors. bottom line i want for a competition with china, not conflict. and we're in a stronger position and we're not economic competition to 21st century against china that anyone else. china has repeatedly accusing us of bullying and of

market protectionism. they don't go to you if the united states pacific china will take resolute and forceful measures to firmly defend itself, frontier security and developing to enter the domain slash. and when the rising tensions between the us and china are not new, they 1st escalated during terms of presidency and have continued since much of the focus now turns to the european union. and who will choose to do business with in the long term? chinese industrial policy may seem remote as we sit here in this room. but if we do not respond strategically and in the united way, the viability of businesses in both or countries and around the world could be at risk. china is capitalizing on divisions and a recent visit to serbia president,

teaching thing a sound was stronger ties with the eastern european country, which has been waiting for e u. membership for over a decade. inches, i strongly finally going home and shop with the joint efforts of both countries, the china for be a free trade agreement, formerly begins in july. sleigh gene is also building stronger ties with around a long time arrival of western governments. the warrant ukraine is another factor, this disruptive energy supplies across europe. and it's also we can ties between russia and the west, but is strengthen them elsewhere, including parts of africa. getting body is open for business and the world comes and will comes investments, partnerships, and abilities. it's a battle between 2 super powers with the us and china looking to dominate one

economic order, while the res for artificial intelligence, digital technologies, and geo political influence plays out on the world stage. katia lopez again, l g 0 for counting the cost. a new alliance as a pos of the changing world, countries with some of the agendas and priorities of clusters into clubs, among them, the bricks nation. so let's take a closer look at the block. the lead us up for sale, russia, india, and china founded the group in 2009 south africa joined a year later. bricks is designed to be a new global voice. supposing what it sees as a unit latrell approach to g of politics. ricks nations want to change the in balance by creating an alternative to us lead financial institutions. in 2015, they found that the new development bank, the counter organization, such as the world bank and the international monetary fund. they also aimed to

reduce their reliance on the us dollar. bricks represent nearly a 3rd of the global economy and really health of its population. the total g, d, p, and purchasing power parity terms is actually bigger than that of the g 7. the block is growing to the u. a wrong, and if you and egypt joined this year, saudi arabia was invited to join. it's membership is pending, but it's additional only amplify the brooks ambition to become the champion of the global south of rita. to what extent of the bricks, nations, countries like india and brazil to are trading the way to prosperity right now, reliance upon the old world, all the remaining in tax or is it holding them back? so what's interesting about these 2 countries is that in prison and you're able to leverage the relationship with the old, old old. and they've also proven to be more flexible and adaptable powers in the international system. so with brooks coming into play, the success of breakfast,

really dependent on the strength of by truly relationships as well as the country as an individual power course. but as we see brooks towards something like $200.00 meetings a. yeah. and so you have an accelerated course and political economic cooperation is constant meeting, which is definitely contributing to their success dining with, with the more nations, a joining clubs coming together to, to, to make the most of the economic cloud. what's the future for the us dollar? do you think when it remain the dominant currency, the future of the, the world reserve currency? the us to all in this case is going to depend on whole range of factors, but likely a higher on that list is sent to men and confidence. and often that does not run parallel with a hand in hand with you. fact on the ground who's got the greatest coalition. so

that is definitely a space to watch. but i would also be a, maybe a little bit averse to suggesting that the whole world wants to dive into an old tentative will order headed by it on the bridge. nations, all whichever of the nation. 80 percent of the will list in countries that are not a great power. and for many of us outside of that circle, what do we want to see? principles that going to thinking about how well order can be constructed rather than simply, oh is where in that coalition on this front, i think that we should be lot, so i'm anxious to so quickly a ditch the old will order of globalization and capitalism that would grant ideas there that arguably the most successful of the bricks, nations, china,

leverage and leverage successfully. the grand ideas included the notion of how you want to organize things. so then you can all make li officiant way. you needed to leverage competitive advantage. and countries like china and smaller nations, embrace these ideas powerfully in the process of lifting hundreds of millions of the citizens out of poverty. i don't think that the will need so quickly rushing to an alternative well order until we've really thought through how we can see the current rules based one. i suspect that many of the bricks, nations, when they come down to think about it, i'm not averse to actually holding onto this old will order. but there are many, was a whole lot trying to pull away from it for the fall, come to just another. but the reason i say, you know, the, the absolutely,

i mean the brick, stephanie, do not want to throw everything out the window or, but in terms of pushing for war, especially in terms of trade, you see the, the big conflict between you and are the no show that the world finds itself in and when you look at the w t r a going with this moment, you have moments of promise, especially and how countries went to work together for the rest of the causes and how my main some sometimes were broder reform seem district fizzle out, but the country so still trying to understand how to understand global supply chains from has major as a major role in this and how it's going to be reconfigured and how the future of global comments as well. so guard to special, especially in the context of environmental concerns and a sporadic job, let's say full changes and challenges and the old well being faced with the failure full of development amongst united the w t or discussions. and the system is katie,

not working for everyone, especially because the system suffers from this trust if this that we've been talking about. but this really drives harms that desire to global reform while trying to pretty and on 2 institutions that miss to gate existing formats and existing efforts. funding. who brings about this, this global reform, then i mean a how, how will it be done? do you see the future of being dealt increasingly by, by clubs like, like, bricks like minded or geographic, the group nations instead of it's sort of this global rules based order. i wanted to ask you about about the i m f with alternative credits as like india and china available right now. what does the i m s have a future? once he gets a phone to make a distinction between at this all i have for a farrah drive in water, which is what, how many advantage here is that the starts of this program express and indeed are the problem is the most are expressed. i'm one of us likely to happen as

a result of the breakdown of the existing order. and i want a favor of a right to fast. i'm skeptical that the moves currently in play to will ship it to a conflict between the us. try adjusting china and the breakdown if it's a national institutions by the w t a is going to lead to the firewall. um, yeah, the brakes running but started off as a goldman sachs marketing slogan. it was that adopted by the latest with as country . it's not place for me, they haven't had a lot to come in. i was in d r and i'm showing that richard political arrivals. some commodity export isn't sounded tremendously info, just some, as a reader said i have tries to tries to the west as well as twice to china. authors are clearly in a n t west and i can obviously the choice between them. all that's significant and in any case they are only um, you know, a small number of countries in

a very large quote. so i skipped school with the brakes itself. okay. um in terms of a full with the international institutions. um we, i think these are the top it sure is probably the was the most successful institution, all feel well daughter, it was crisis on our way for much of actual different possession. there was a huge success of printing china in, in 2001. and since the, basically it's ground uh to a stand still, it's increasingly ignored by the us and showing that they've got their own way. the dispute has went back into some of which results to national disputes is largely in a best. and i think that's a tragedy. i don't think that's leasing to refer, well, i think, you know, the double chevreuse, which will not fit but which was applied largely and partially guaranteed equal voice to small players like guaranteed spanners for pretty much everybody and

going to a world or might, might some extra large and small clubs isn't going to make things better than sleep a brief on. so if you can please, how likely is a full blown economic pool. as you say that with the w t o being toothless right now i how likely is a full blown economic war between the us and all the west in china. it was supposed to go to 0 think, but i'm not sure if that depend on the city in taiwan to generate i think we are moving to a different world older. it's a, a 2nd cold rule. i say a 2nd cold. cool, because that was in which geo products ext uh trumps economics. and the actual, while of course, if you'll see the pool, you want a well based on open markets from which single pull cars profit. and of course, you can decide that because you want a fair economic system for which kind of you could benefit. but if the large powers

increasingly side, well actually, uh, industrial policies on national security concerns come 1st. you need a sort of power to accommodate yourself. how to those positions and some which is one time. so i'm gonna choose another. and so i'm gonna try to struggle $550.00 not be forced to choose done it. i'll wait in a new code. what are we in an era of nationalization? why salacious and d globalization isn't? well i, i hear that language a lot, and obviously, you know, philip has made a very compelling case for this. i happened to disagree, i think, said we need to pull back from a language that says, this is a cold war and maybe focus on the idea that really the, the part of contention to you, if you can all make and that we conflict the issues where we talked about coldwell were even indeed when we talked about security during the regional coal,

americans would genuinely worried there's a sylvia to building a political and economic system that would come to mind the american way of life destroyed the american. we have government now today. however much one looks at the bullying behavior of the chinese aggressive exporting actions of the south china sea military build it up. i don't think anyone in their right minds would accuse china of trying to build an economic system. that is a plug in replacement for westman style liberals. democracy truth, the truth be told, i don't think she's in thing really cares at all. what kind of political system the west wants to run. what he wants to do is to bring about economic prosperity in a way that hughes as much as he can to the original rules based order. and right now the nations that um, most pulling away from that system are not the emerging countries are not the ones

that felt previously challenged by the international economic system. the, the washington consensus probably can all make system. but instead, the rich countries and you know the language about it's being always secure, the competition. unfortunately, rings a lot of early era, lot of competition with the soviet union for which the competition was not we can all make. but of us competition with japan. a lot of the language about, you know, depend economic superiority, threatening undermining us. security is a code today. and the peculiar thing and all of that is that japan and all of that time was probably a liberal democracy, japan. and all of that time was strong partner of america in america's uh, strategic alliance in the pacific. so my own sense is that, you know,

when we get in to talk about security, talk about the coal, we might be taking our eye off of the real competition. okay. which isn't economic one, which is that there are some countries in the world, the feeling that china is um, undermining dismantling the in industrial structure, stealing the jobs, engaging in, and the program that will lead to the oh, taking control of technology. so the future, any comics, the right way to deal with that is not to shotwell. and then we have to a say bill of security, but to pick one stuff up, raise your own productivity, train your people, get to a point where you can compete. i'm sorry, it's up to just to cut you off, but, but time is, is against us. i wanna have one last time from arena. are you optimistic about the future arena? can the huge reductions in poverty brought about by globalization and imperfect

though it was the, the old world or the continue without is i think it's always possible to be up to mistake about the future. um, especially if it depends who's viewing this kind of future. if we look at the code for alternative anything, alternative, finance sources, alternative payment systems, there is a demand for an economy, but presents all advocates for different menus. and if we were just to, to look at, at a chinese learning, there's an example or in those lines as an example of it's, it's, it's interesting to note that in the long run, maybe they're not as cheap as i'm a single bank. but they're attractive because i mean, especially with the chinese ones that come with the grace period 5 to 2 years with countries can start repaying things. politically. this is where it's high. the practical for a sitting government, i suppose for payment doesn't begin until the end of the $10.00,

possibly. and store your, the desire to have something different to have an alternative and leverage that in terms of, of who is finding who i think that is, that is an interesting time. we find ourselves and, and it is more about the smaller powers finding a way to leverage this moment to pull themselves to find the agency in that the, we must leave it. we're out of time. many sites in the dining cloth arena, bureau, son and phillip le girl, that's our show for this week. if you'd like to comment on anything you heard in our discussion, i'm a friend again on x. use the hash tag h a c t c. if you remember, or you can drop us a line causing the cost of the houses 0, don't let us on e mail address. as always, there's plenty more few online. i'll just 0 dot com slash c t c. that takes you straight to the page that you'll find individual reports, links at a time episodes to catch up. but that's it for this edition of counting the cost on

a tree instead of going from the team here and go have thanksgiving with us. the news on al jazeera, this next a 150 is of a gyptian history. seen through an extraordinary photographic archives, a jeremy through the golden age of music and cinema. when legendary, our voices and famous actors stole the hearts of millions captured by photographers who lived and felt the emotions of the country's biggest star. egypt through the land stage in street on al jazeera, hod he came into means is israel and obstacles piece. i think that the new thing you have on his government with these says 5 digit, you say getting less of a thought provoking on the e. you made weapons being used in cost,

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a suicide bomber and gun and attack a beach in the somali capital killing at least 32 people. l shabani claims responsibility the until mccrae this is alex, is here live from doha. so coming up is there any forces keller, local come on to the complicates and then is strongly called the car and the occupied west, back the us ends more 5 digits and warships to defend as well, against the possible retaliation from around.