positions is a virgin, often challenging female stereotypes were a conservative society. i'm very proud of this, but there was a negative view towards e mail, saying is, out to 0 who, who is behind this? with 2 bands bringing traditional, middle eastern music to new audiences, sisters and song yemen and don't mind. and i'll just be around the how far can you cranes, military go inside russia? most goes, come on to one of the largest drug and attacks of the war with a team government controlling more than a 1000 square kilometers of coast region. how will russia respond? this is inside story, the color that on james bays when president vladimir putin launched watches,

so called special military operation and ukraine, 2 and a half years ago, expect to the speedy victory. not only did that not happen, but ukraine is now brought the war home to russia. the capitalist phase, one of the biggest, ever driving the tax, according to the matter of moscow and ukraine's incursion into the co squeezen co rush, or by surprise. how's the rushes, bold in a symmetric mood put on hold discussions about a stalemate, some possible negotiations involving concessions to russia. and if so, how will most go retaliate? we'll discuss all of this without guests in a moment. but 1st, this report from victoria gate and be during the week and which rushes defense to shut down 45 ukrainian drones talk 10 most go under surrounding region and ukrainian forces advanced further into the russian region of cost. president vladimir putin visited 2 places that shaped him you own as a, a death in best land in north,

et cetera. he remembered the victims of a school attack in 2004. chechen set produced took more than 1000 people hostage, 50 noted russian soldiers to storm the complex and, and the siege. pigeon says there are pearls between brushes, minute reaction, investment and role in ukraine. funding pathologists that continue this work with an attempt to destabilize our country. this is obvious. and just as we fought against terrorists, we now have to fight those who commit crimes in the coast region and don't pass on to north. i'll see you please. and also visited chechnya for the 1st time in searching is in 1999. as a newly appointed prime minister, he launched a war against chechen separate his vices. chechen leader rems on cattle rolls is a key ally of most go. telling me the 5 it is all nice. we have deployed is a $47000.00 fights as to the area of special military operation. including about

19000 volunteers. we ever resolve of several dozen trained them equipped twice as ready to leave at your fast or that you create new forces. a continuing that pushed into the coast region with strikes on russian military positions and equipment. national project quotes our operation and the task region. us, our combat were continuous, simple steps of being taken to we control the designated area, you only bought as ukrainian troops advance russian forces and moving closer to the key logistics hub of polk cross and you cranes, eastern dentists. so that's all we must find in the don't bass and show coverage, and the strategy must be to defend our country and the don't best. that's the 1st priority. the only thing we could do something like this, the screech we put quotes such an important prize for russia fighting is set to intensify in the coming days. victoria gave some b, l, g 0 for inside story. the

time now to bring in a guess 3 experts who know more about this much more about this the me in taipei, we have had a shade list, the program director of security studies, a declining prison or you claim uniform policy and security. think tank in brussels to raise of the problem is the founder and director of the center for russia, europe, asia, studies and in rome. i wouldn't matthews also of overreach, your book about the origins of the war in ukraine. thank you. all 3 of you, you for joining us today on inside story to raise it. let me start with you and brussels when you heard 1st on august, the 6th about this surprise. daring raid by you craig interruption. did you think of a time more than 2 weeks on that would still be sizable numbers of ukrainian troops holding territory inside russia? well indeed it was an incredibly bold move. and i think even the premiums

themselves were surprised at how fast and how far they could penetrate russian territory. so i think that the russians have been very slow to move on this and it's been a shock, i think, to everybody in a, a welcome surprise to i know you're there in taipei, i bet there are some people that who want to, to mine your experience as a ukrainian and how to, how to deal with being on the attack by russia for so long. and the question to you is the element of surprise here, a 1st for an invasion of russia since world war 2. how humiliating is this for 13 to the vision? i remember the nice and 6 is china data. so law for russia is just that they prefer just to get the bunch of pages of the history. but that's going to be the surprise . the fact that was during what's up, what we should look over is to me, surprise itself. as we know now they were

a lot of can sell it just information that'd be delivered to moscow where we must go. they didn't want to believe that 1st of all, a rush you praise would decide to opt out of the russian territory and the 2nd of the cold. that's a west apartments. first of all, the united states will prevents us from june to the because if you remember just within the last 2 months that they were to all the plans that were at the very last moment sold by our washington partners. that's why is that the is the less price, but for all the least calculations from the side of the russian leadership. oh, in the end of the 3 is nearly upon us. a little bounce upon us of the desk of guinea for goshen who died in that sits suspicious playing crash a year ago because he had a rebellion in june on june. the 24th of last year that everyone's sold was damaging for boots. and that's, of course, i only lost it one day and this has now gone on for more than 2 weeks. yes,

it is remarkable. and i think we have, it's important to actually see the cost in coverage. and as part of the triple, why me? because as i mentioned, it's not just the occupation which is going on for a very long time of that's part of the cost. it's also what's would be about the, the, the drainage track almost good. also, we shouldn't forget that as being a major attack on a giant oil gasoline storage facility and just the overall stall which is still burning on its 5th day and is destroyed up to what's on expos describes 2 $100000000.00 with over find oil production rust off today there's been an extraordinary footage of a strike on a, on a field which as being devastating, apparently a and in by the look good and volatile volt drive. and yesterday, there was a strike on the outlet in your fields when strategic bombs fly from up in motor months from the optic c. so actually, the,

it's not just poor excuse the fact that the ukrainian long range drones that actually been reaching devastation all across russia. and that indeed is on the normal. and i think and one level cumulative fulton, the question is really whether this will damage putin's political standing or whether it will strength and russians resolve to resist. because i continue definitively having spent a lot of time listening to rushing media on the social media sites such a telegram or russians from policy makers to the propagandist to ordinary people, are convinced that this attack has got nothing to do with you crying, but it is a native of the night, the tax on the rest of the homeland. a very interesting to raise that it was a cooling 2 and a half years ago when booting invaded ukraine. one of the reasons he said was the defensive reason. it was to protect, protect russia, sovereignty and territorial integrity. now he's lost as a substantial amount of territory, and more than a $130000.00 russians,

hoping to displaced, putting doesn't look, doesn't like looking week, but he does doesn't t and he was also supposed to take, he has in 3 days. so as we've seen that this war has been a pen doors box for russia, it's the 1st time as the package of noted the russian has been indeed it. so i think that with which is recent visits to children. yeah, for example. and the attack on the run this attack in the past on the school he's, he might be trying to reframe it as a terrorism. and that all russians, you know, this is a terrorist attack rather than this offering country and fading russia. but i think the, what's really interesting about this whole event in regard to the push back, right, the us is very absorbed with their domestic elections and us. so let's be kind of learned a lesson in my view from this real, like they just went ahead. they didn't briefly us,

i just acted and then afterwards, what can they say? they can't really reprimand them because it is a war and it has proven successful. so i think that's this has been a bold move and it's put it back on the agenda. and we also have to remember that the g 7 is trying to negotiate how to use some russians frozen funds to a fund. you create the word new credit and if there's a change in the us administrations might be harder to get through. so it's important for the ukrainians to show that they can win and that they, you know, it's not winning necessarily, but they have these bug bolt moves that they're actually, you know, being able to exchange prisoners. oh, well they, how long will they hold the territory? well, they move back to the border region. all of these things remain to be seen. but i think that it has really captured the public's attention. how russel, which is actually really moving slowly on all of this. they do have manpower issues, and i think that they're a bit skeptical. they're wondering, you can usually does a 12 punch. they're wondering where the next move is for the printing. and so

they're kind of slowly watching to see what the next move is. so what, how russia will respond has been much lower than most people have expected, but i think they're trying to anticipate what you claim will do next. and they're, they don't want to be fooled and be, you know, brought into this kind of ukrainian trap. how to take that point on, what is ukraine going to do next? currently, we're seeing that consolidating deposition, they've blown up bridges now, that blowing up palm to him bridges, the russia put in place. what do you think is going on on the ground right now? what do you think ukraine's trying to achieve? oh, we definitely don't know the full plan, otherwise we would lose this. uh, but what is the overview understandable? there were 3 main goals or from the military point of view, 1st east to draft, some rushing forces from the east, some cross where the station was quite a bad for your brain the last month i here we have seen the serious moves. yes. yes, up your thousands people, the russian soldiers the move just as that's also or

a very young of those countries things that they are aiming to stay as much as possible on the east where they're waiting on that because of these, they brought a lot of, of the cost great, so the agent, your whole voice will have maximum one months of the rifle experience. so if you're gonna pay, you should be 2 percent of the border wherever. the 2nd, very important to reason for the separation was to create a buffer zone on the not as these boxes zone has 2 ways. first of all is to prevent the russian from attacking salary just what we have just few months ago. the accounts of jazz. so hard to read you that initially was successful for russian them the up was back, but the wash is being played, the same postuma region. and the now is the 4050 kilometers. so it's possible to control to the found this much better. and that is to protect the northern region, chrome vehicle from shelling of the shortage range. these files bigger. so they

were looking at data, but obviously that's what it's to man, hard to read, just with the extra 100 was a different other types of sorts of jewelry. and now with pushing question horses that was very good and little bit safer. there was reach of how well, what i can with because of the bad reaction of russians. we received additional benefits. first of all, that is a huge amount of the prisoner support smoking called scripts. and as we knew previously, russia was very careful about not sending coal strips to the worst because it is socially difficult question. and is that gonna eat why the number of people? and what do we know from the previous prisoners exchange? so that's one could be the soldier is uh, more of the values than 10 russian, the soldiers, and they usually exchange either more people or more serious officers for these. so now the negotiations will be they over decided about states and uh, police officer, put you out of the housing. now the, the, this contest would be the rest of the was the say, what would you say,

what did you do saying, what's the, what's the news? rebuilder said, what could be the people say all the say, now we see extreme dissatisfaction. first of all of the military bloggers, they all are saying that military come on, the last was not prepared. they are in the very big concept with the church. yeah. so just a beautiful journey and that's why would you be there? and then you see the difference, we actually know i'd like, i'd like to come back to the checks in the a positive it and the views of people in moscow. but i've been staying with the ongoing cost operation. but it seems you cleaning forces still making some limited gains is your understanding or your view on this, but they are actually trying to still push forward or are they just making gains in a way that they can defend depositions as well? i think james, i think we need to take a step back and actually look, uh, i mean, one thing that you is locking in all of the situation maps that you see on the

switch on the internet is a scale. how many kilometers we're talking about. so what and you had in a fundamental jewel question, isn't suggesting there's some sort of equivalence to the you pregnant and cousin into into russia and that of the, of the russian a drugs on the ground. and so you've trained them a, fortunately ukrainians. well, there, there isn't much the psychological impact is kind of right. the said doesn't mess up prison. that impacts in terms of the actual territory that you put in hopes inside russia. russia holds approximately $200.00 times military traits within ukraine. and the coming sort of across as, as, as, as being revolted across is a key transport hub in, in, in, in finance. provenance, which is about the photos, the russians, and essentially cuts off the printing controls, rump of done yet involved. and that's actually much most as, as, as a strategically significant defeats for ukraine found anything that making

a game in cost to be eviction. so with that moving forward with that moving back, i think it's clear that ultimately russia enjoys the massive superiority in in material and ultimately, man, i think, but the surprising positive they haven't got rid of the pregnancy, spelled mazda expelled the finance more quickly. that's definitely humiliating. it's embarrassing, but i think there's very little doubt that about eventually hooton's a sense of himself, his political survival of his in time is in his entire system. depends on him being not weak better than projecting strength. and he's going to kick the paintings out. he has to so the question is not really the raw, the one wrong headed. i think assumption that ukraine has been just, i'm not afraid. landing costs for landing done. that's good. i think that's the way it's going to go. what we're talking about in the course is a very fundamentally psychological operation,

which is done one does to improve ukraine morale within the ukraine and also to damage you more all inside russia and on the mind that missed the pictures and visibility. but that's the utility. it's not really anything to do with the ground operations and cost itself to raise a you had the point that from owen about what's going on in eastern ukraine in the dumbass. some say the objective of the ukrainians was to try and drop troops away from those key areas where they are fighting in ukraine. have they've pulled the troops back from that, right. seems the officer has no that's correct. the, the russians did not pull troops away. and i think that's to many armchair generals, like john mearsheimer or steven waltz from harvard, has said that, you know, this was a failure from that point of view. never the less i think that the political game of morale boosting is very important. so there's 3 levels of warfare,

and here is the political aspect is very key. but nevertheless, this is a very difficult work for ukraine. and i think that this move really does help them gain more political support in the future and clear funding issues. because we saw recently in germany, the far left party has announced that they no longer want to fund ukraine. so they really have to show that there is some momentum here. and you know, it's been a terrible grinding wherever tricia and the for ukraine. and i think that it is a bold move of but yes, they are losing in this key area of talking about so yeah, well let me, let me, let me bring it in hand or okay, let me bring in hunter on that pork roast. i'd packet pork roast, i think i've said it wrong, but um that town um, how likely is that? how close is it to fully i spoke to one of my out. is there a colleagues who's being that? who says after years of defensive preparations, it is a highly fortified garrison,

and we may may take much tougher bottles than we saw it in places like buck moved. would you agree with that? the 1st of all in terms of value in each of it much for you. great. you value it. so it's about satisfied to this about all what people leaving, but those territories about those atrocities russians are doing on the occupation. that's why it doesn't matter how big for chrome or data. that is our people, there's uh, whichever stories for which the soldiers will 5. but from the strategic point of view. cross, cuz important because each in case excel, it opens the roads all for logistics. so in this case, the, the projection and to cancel the solid would be quite a serious at the same time if you compare what a sampling with the withdrawal. of course, it's a lot even put polls kind of a few russians got the milk tray and professional soldiers that they have as to what they had in terms of the territories thrown across or in terms of the success

. this is very minimal and you know, cost as a result they have on the i'm prepared, zip. 2 the young boys up last a little bit of the professional officers, don't russians kind of have a lot of, of them and far in terms of the population. but the interest of the residents to 5 preparedness of their soldiers is absolutely not the same manpower. so just to the numbers of population, we have a number of the soldiers officially, the armed forces doesn't say anything about their ability to fight block those to get from where rushes to the soldiers for exam will be to go from getting and up and getting who got use the cloud among the major companies, and usually russia sold that they really protect it needs to strategically even they choose their uh, soldiers from there to defense. they are a 1000 border. it's means just to be absolute honest preparedness in terms of the matter over and features of the plans for defense of the russian territory. and let's look at what's going on in moscow which faced the driving attack. putin,

throughout this couple of weeks seems to be down playing everything he said is not far fod, many people demoted people, but there's been no co mass cool up. are you surprised if someone has been watching polluting for a very long time? the way he's responded? and he certainly has to be done putting it, but that's actually kind of a crucial thing, which i think weston commentate has failed to understand about the whole rest not to, to, to was the entire what they call the spectrum of the trump ration that down, play is a must go basically hasn't met, just must go, doesn't. it does not feel like the capsule of a city that is fighting the biggest 121st century. yeah. it's being swept tons of the carpet consistently. and you might see that some of that, but you might see a contradiction that between what we hear the pregnant propagandist, some televisions are threatening to new london and things has been about some blood breaking. so thought about whole and the fact that the criminal,

the single tendency down playing it, but those things. awesome tennessee true, i think in a person is just attempting to pretend that everything is normal. and so far that has been a major driven attack. indeed, the 4045 drugs are shut down according to the matter of musket, but in fact, none of them i suppose, any damage to hit anything. so um, until um that starts to happen. i think most go has experience some brain strikes of some isolated ones. they just actually cause some consternation last year. but let's remember that drugs that had drained strikes and beside strikes, even heavy bombing, did not break the will off kia, know that they break the will of london or take care or by late. and by the way, maybe say in, in, in, on a much larger scale. so it's not really about the, the trend strikes again, rather like the cost concussion have a psychological effect. it's about reminding the russians that the war actually is real. and it could actually threaten them, but on the other hand, so far,

patient seems to be doing a relatively good job of actually the but pretending that everything is, is fine, i'm sweeping it onto the carpet. and i think, until the boy actually comes home, either in terms of keeping them in catastrophe or like personal catastrophe to the majority of russians. i think most of them would continue to just can all this and enjoy the economic benefits. that's, for instance, a massive must have increased wrong. russian states military spending as perhaps too many areas of the country. right, so he's not just down playing things. he's also getting on the tool now president put in someone is rather limited in where he can go. these days because of that international criminal court arrest warrant, but he's been to, as about johnny's, also been to north aesthetic, depends lab. and that is the place where that was that attack very early on in his presidency. and he's also being to chechnya, of course, where right at the beginning of his presidency, he was responsible for a very brutal victory and a will the do you think it's significant these 2 places that he's going which of

sort of places that what major challenges in the past yes, the may just pick up on one points the oh and made the cleaning drawing the tax on russian refineries has turned to a huge oil producing country into a net importer of refined oil. so this is unbelievable that russia can't even produce enough for find oil for their own industry. they have to import it. so from that point of view, the premiums have really pushed them to those limits and no one would have expected this even a year ago. so that is a huge win for ukraine because it's actually hitting at the most important thing their, their economic ability to continue the war in you can because it makes up about 37 . okay. but on, put on, hold, pump to unlimited storage. clinton's tool does tell me the certificates of these 2 prices or like his glory days tour, we remember what you said about the chechens and how we bumped them back to the stone age of what happened to box on it. that's. it was kind of, you know,

this was a terrorist attack, that's how and it was run this and, and also we've had the recent terrorist attack in moscow as to the theater. so i think that he might be trying to reframe this as not as to offer an attack on russell, but actually a terrorist attack incurs guerria that would make it more palatable for him. but i don't think putting cares if he feels like we, some of the speakers were mentioning that he's humiliated because he controls the media. he controls the message and you know, it's a one day down the next. i mean, i think that he's able to shape public opinion quite effectively, but we're seeing the mothers who have young concepts who are going to be called up, are really protesting and very unhappy about this situation. so i think a fair tried to show that this is the new norm. this is the new normal for russia, that okay, yes. and the russian territory has people in different ukraine, but nothing to see here is folks that worry about it. i think they're trying to

shape public opinion very carefully, and they're very talented of doing that in russia. nevertheless, some of the stories will get out from relatives or people who are very unhappy with the situation with their own children. finally, to you have a lot of the weaponry that's being used in the coast region is nato and us weaponry . so far, those allies and not saying in a thing all you people in ukraine worried that some of the western partners might start guessing uneasy about these operations using nato weaponry to well, that's definitely just, you know, because we're over before the statements from burly yolanda and i'm the washing so that as soon as this web them so with you, great and do the forwarding to the uh, previously uh, re, sabrina, is that for k, i would problem. oh, were using the western web once it gets traffic included with the long range and files such as the top cups. so for these sort shadow that's where we do have

limitations and here these invitations where support them. well, actually the separation was necessary because the little gray strikes against the russian air fills the or are the military objects and the washington that was pretty good for you. great. and your son was rushed to them, the airplane, the up liking with the bomb, not even crossing the ukrainian territory. that's made. everything's very dentures . so in this case, excellent, i'll apartments episode of your case as soon as they don't see any work crime. and luckily for the doing to help your brain and they don't do any work, cries and the saturday you as soon as we have much using the low ration style for them be as part of give okay, bikes, territories, starting to honda. and thanks to lot guess today, joining us to raise a problem. how about share this? and matthews, coverage of the conflict continues on how to 0 around the clock. we have teams in russia and ukraine. you will find full analysis to on out. is there a dot com we use that but welcome your comments,

thoughts and suggestions. post them on facebook page. that's facebook dot com, forward slash ha inside story. or find this one x, where i handle is at a inside stored for me james base and the team in dough hall, please stay safe. i'll see you again right here. very soon bye. the. the 10s of thousands of children were born in to well live down to the i still regime in iraq and syria. now many are in kemp. i the role funds of with the, with the mothers, rejected by their own communities checking the things that people are going to welcome them after that. of course, not an emmy award winning documentary. here's the trailing and traumatic story. the children throw stones at me erects last generation on out just there's a deliberate mission of post, i mean manage in western and it needs to be question. this is not the time to,

to mr. kind of way. examining the effect that news coverage can have on democracies everywhere. here, at the listening past, the

a robust isn't in the top stories on the i'll just say i'm shopping a new way forward in a divided nation. a message of unity from come on, the harris who has made history as the 1st black woman, an asian american, to run for president your nominate was received a standing ovation in a democratic national convention in chicago, where she formerly accepted parties, nomination. a speech began with her personal journey is the daughter of immigrants .