is released in terms of your movements, something like that. so i thought that it was like the thoughts provided hang on. says how much with trick do you think impulse he's right now to ask it seems to be spreading more easily. he of the story on talk to how does era for months ukraine is wanted to use american missiles against the russian territory. now, outgoing president joe biden has given the go ahead and a significant change in us policy. so will this turn the tide of the war on? how will russia respond? this is inside, still the hello. welcome to the program. i'm put, and it's us present. joe biden is lifting restrictions on the use of american technical missiles against russian territory. this is

a major shift in us policy. previously, washington has only allow the use of his weapons in occupied ukrainian territory outcomes. just weeks before the end of biden's to present elect, donald trump said he will, and the will quickly present. vladimir putin has repeatedly stated the use of american weapons on russian soil. would mean nate, so was a bull. so one of the reasons behind 5 whose decision included turn the tide for ukraine. we'll discuss this with our panel of guests in a moment. but 1st, this report from dmitri bank a permission to use western supplied weapons against targets in russia, is something ukraine is wanted for years. precedence bulk dns of landscape included in his so called victory plan, presented to allies last month. after the 1st media reports that washington have given the green light, he had this to say, a little darting strikes and notes carried out with woods. such things are not

announced miss solves will speak for themselves. i certainly will. the us has been sending me tactical missile systems, or a tech comes to ukraine since last october, but troops were only allowed to use them inside ukrainian territory, including russia next to crimea. now they could, strikes all gets up to 300 kilometers from the front lines. this means up to $245.00 military sites within range. according to the institute for the study of war. the use foreign policy cheap, joseph burrell, says europe should follow suit and grant, similar permission had been se one's, and they gave that to you, but they should be able to use the be provided. i let me know that to not only to stop the arrow, but also to be able to feed the article i continue to believe in vision is what's best to be done. moscow has stated multiple times to the use of western made

weapons against targets and russia is a red line. the kremlin expanded its military policy in september to allow nuclear strikes in response to conventional arms that threaten its sovereignty. and president vladimir putin warrants that the use of american technical missiles would mean direct nato involvement. and moscow would respond to the video. it is not about the allowing the ukrainian regime to strike russia with these weapons or not . it is about making a decision about where the nato countries are directly involved in the military conflict or not. if this decision is made, it's significantly changes the very essence, the very nature of the conflict. and we will make appropriate decisions based on the threats that will be created for us. the criminal spokesman to the cheapest golf has accused the us of intensifying the war intravenous to issue. it is obvious that the outgoing administration in washington in teams,

as they said earlier, to continue adding fuel to the fire and further product escalation of tension around this conflict. the policy change comes in the final weeks of jo biden's term and office president elect. donald trump said he intended to end the war and ukraine swiftly without elaborating what his plan would entail to meet him if it didn't go out as the rustle inside story. the right lights got so the insides with all guests from moscow, were joined by andre federal form, a deputy foreign minister of russia, and chapman of the funds of political research and consulting in burning. i'm in the u. k of stuff on wolf, a professor of international security at the university of funding and he focuses on competition between local powers and didn't. keith is usually a cash debina senior fellow in security studies at ukrainian prison. i think welcome to the program. all of you, you in the key of,

i'll start with you. so will a decision by joe biden to allow the use of tactical weapons to hit russian tired tree make a difference to the wall for ukraine? well actually one yesterday, when the news broke, that the decision was granted. it was a big elation at home because people believe that the granting ukraine, the opportunity to strike the targets deepened the russian territory. and we mean military targets deepen the russian territory will help us gain an advantage of at least partial advantage. but then this morning, the solution was to a large extent gone because western media reported that the permission was actually very limit, that it was not the permission to strike any military targets in the russian territory. that is within range of, of these missiles. but only those targets that are located in the course of the old

list of the russian federation, where now they, north korean soldiers are stationed and are actually involved in fighting the ukrainian army. and so this is seen more as a signal to the north korea to stay out of the fight. and not so much as something that is going to help your brain uh when or when does for a step home, what do you think? will it make a difference for you? crane? and as if it is, as you suggest, is restricted to where north korea and troops may or may not be what it impact the long term costs of the war and ukraine's bye a as well. i don't think so in any way, going to make a major change in the old old trajectory of the wall. so the video to be quite clear. yeah. the disposition, if it really would have been meant to enable crime to win this field

trip. the main party to turn off is going on on the, on stage 4 o. pressure against, are you crying? that said, i think it's very important that the decision has been made on us off, given that whatever on donald trump might be counting, it looks like he will impose the seas file on the front lines as the exist at the moment. and he tries to make his students so from this perspective anything that can help you create now will be beneficial. but it actually comes to to the attraction. andre, uh, the company spokesman, dimitra, pest golf size. if such a decision has been taken, it means a whole new spiral of tension, the bottom, the by the administrators, adding fuel to the fire. all 2 of the panelists don't think he's going to make that

much of this a difference given the restrictions placed on how the weapons can be used. what would must go see from this said change and tactic support from a personal point of view. according to my knowledge, then also show cold restrictions. that is inflexibility. and of course, there are some arguments concerning the school bus, but in fact, in this course creature use of this a town cut cut marks. besides that is simply census, because uh, there is no, any kinds of cedars from flying in force or blushed. i don't know any kind of that usually is the facilities we sure can be the target, but is the fuel well excuse me, under. that was the idea of ops to scare off the north koreans as buying the suggested. i know it's, it's not,

it's not the thing because it does nothing with north korea because uh, the main target, the main target for this me shots, of course, uh, russian fields which are outside the pool area. but the structural fields are used for making strikes in ports area to gaze. you cancel the oh, the problem for grammar is that, uh, it looks at the whole situation as new stage of installation because no one in a crime and believe that it will be limited to what's called left or something else . and uh, the problem for moscow today is our response that we've confused yet and that uh no final decision because it was set to day decision will be made only up, things will happen. but uh,

i can still see uh you stage of escalation, right? uh i think so, is that is this is this step can simply pick you up from speech plan. okay, thank you. thank you. yeah, stuff was touched on this a moment ago. is it too late? anyway, this has happened when your credit has been given tanks and fighters jack. so these last 4 months after they asked them, you think this is too late? well unfortunately it is. it's been the western policy from the very beginning that they were giving in ukraine weapons to little to late on. so. busy that was able to keep your brain on the find my actually the able to deal with the size of uh, victory or decisive, struck with stripe and the russian federation. and it's precisely this logic that the threats from the russian president that if the west decides to help you pray more,

then it's going to face retaliation. and so this leads to self determines by the western powers. and it's a, it turns into a very strange situation when actually russia is the country who is committing the oppression. and at the same time, accusing western countries of aggression while they're only helping ukraine to fight back and just arrive stuff on a, on a practical level. what, what russia just sort of move material or troops that might be targeted further inland, further out of the range of basement solves it might not hurt russia that much in the end on, i think the just because difficulties involved in that. of course. i mean, that's not necessarily something that can be done all that easily. all right, plus, in addition, i mean, nobody knows exactly how long the stockpile off a tech ends when somebody is in print. so is that really something that russian

needs to be deeply concerned about? his dad, this only may be a total of thousands of dollars on missiles from out. marshall could very well sit out and he's twice using also, it's our client, all right, as technician just deeply entrenched younger functions. uh, in defense against these on possible uh, attacks on, on the other edge. i also think they, they should not forget that on rush of course it's not going to just take dismissal or any responses. ok. i don't pretty if that does any danger at the moment or anything my computer escalation, but a lot of the barriers on points and washer will need to be quite careful in terms of how many positions itself off in relation to this new situation as, as the federal law, smart on the invite officer,

take it to the next president of the united states in january 2025, and there will be a permanent condition, has called out to bring this oh andre, what the, what we understand that was debate within the bottom ministration over whether out to allow these weapons to be used in russian territory and the what those who said that it could cross a russian red line provoke a wider conflict is not a concert and you shot yes, it's a concern because the problem is also that russia don't leave such a step without us. of course the, what am i sure will depend what kind of strikes, what kind of targets will be on the find out. and uh, out of this that will be in a spot for russia is going to be strikes off of the strikes on energy and for

the mid 3 for such a good thing. i cannot exclude habits percent, that is of the moment that can be some statements. uh that that's uh are actually still nuclear power and the new conception of, uh, nuclear security. and you flip the strategy can give you a chance to use it if it's needed. but i don't think it will happen any way, escalation is coming, the solution is coming little closer to prompt a little grateful, more escalation. we might see you under that says escalation is coming to do the crating and hope that the u. k. and friendship, storm shadow missiles might now be authorized for use or to target russian territory and maybe even the germans. taurus cruise marseilles is not a home from ukraine that they will get access to yet more. but we've actually uh,

received the permission to use uh, the french and the uh, british called missiles already and we have received the answer from uh, the german brendan scott. and his counselor shows that the taurus are not for its coming in the germany is actually opposed to a escalation, but to we can and uh, but we understand that uh, the only way to actually uh try to get out of this conflict is to approach negotiations from the position of strength and so we are hopeful, i mean we do want to resolve. busy this work we do want to stop the war, but we also want to achieve just the center. we believe that any weapons that can be supplied to us to the boat, allow us to diminish russian and strengthen just as a our russian that panelist mentioned that strikes on ukrainian civil civilian infrastructure will continue as well. so they have been

going on for, for quite a while and you're showing now pictures of the civilian ukrainians were just staying in their own homes and getting killed every single single day. and so we are on the boat that we will get those and we will be able to stuff more russian blaine's from attacking us stuff on why. why do you think 5 and is doing this now as well? so, i mean, this is everybody's, i guess, you know, i mean if i were just by to mean my sense is that what vitamins trying to do now is a basic useful, ukrainian o position in advance off on, on in terms of big push for cease fire. for case agreement might be, and as i said earlier, i mean this is likely going to freeze the front lines at the time, but i try to make says

a big push on. and so any game that you're crying cannot make any laws that cannot, of 100 can avoid on to take it's, i think going to be very important in the long want to start thinking in that sense . this is very much sort of the last roll on the items are called and he made at least be able to stay on your claim on a guy humiliating defeat at the negotiation table. this trump important. so i think in, in that sense, again, it's too little too late to end the walk, but it may just be in time to actually are, even in the field or even thing, viewed on the new cransberg or not. oh, i don't, right. how do you assess a biden's timing? is it too short to try and sure ukraine ahead of perhaps inevitable negotiations next year. that must go. i would be invited to take part in by trump. uh,

1st of all, i don't believe in any of the faces because all the points of drops plan which i know they are absolutely unsuitable to moscow. and uh, what is uh, important for you pay now is to keep the front line. because if you find that there will be some complex multiple fisher, but at least some concepts are set to agreements. uh, its will be very important where the referral live is and from this point, a few periods of uh, new me files both from us or from us and you get can help you create an army for people on our andre. we understand, you know, the bottom it puts in a said in the past, the russian president, that any, any negotiations or talks about you,

crime would have to reflect the sort of realities on the ground. a suggestion that ukraine would have to seed tara tree, but that's what trump may also we understand, isn't it is not acceptable to, to most goes into it as a starting point. no, but no elements and problems plan. uh huh. which likes it up to, must go as a gaze freeze on the side of the list in the line. moscow is demanding a international recognition of full of their answers, which i included in the russian constitution mosque who is demanding a never, never a membership in the nato must go. use them on the dentistry. if a patient is past the change of the political system of the plan, that's separate. so uh, lots of cost of collection of factions and all of these uh for microphones or fuel makes any talks at this stage just simply boss. it's usually do

you think uh, the current in president is preparing his country for the negative bullet that will have to be told. so if i called when militarily, he said on saturday that ukraine is allowed to use it on saturday. but ukraine was too old to come to ensure the war with russia ends next year through. diplomacy concedes the battlefield situation in east new credit is difficult because as russia is making advances. so ukraine is going to have to give way on terra 3 perhaps, and then he talks as well. this is not something that the presidents communicates domestically and actually this position to see the territory to the russian federation. it was most supported by a majority of ukrainians. and also we understand that the production, workings, and ukraine are not limited to making some territorial gains. we understand that there were ames, are lots bigger than that from the very beginning when they talk about dns,

if occasion, when they talk about the militarization right. and they never change the position and what it means is that they want to change ukrainian government. they want to make the, they actually don't recognize the existence of the brand new a nation. and we see what they were doing in the occupied territories. eliminating every thing ukrainian and so when people talk about and never. busy concessions they to the they need to take into account all of these things that have happened and that are happening and all the statements that the russian federation makes. and also the experience that we've had previously negotiating with the russians. one uh we put never actually established the ceasefire because they always maintained both the ability and the intent to continue their war while talking about negotiations. and so with this position, if the president savanski voice has a domestically that we're going to make concessions, it's not going to find support along ukrainians, no matter how hard it is to continue fighting and to continue standing up to this

aggression. well, just quickly on that point, i mean we've had a recent poll from, keeps international is due to sociology, says 32 percent of respondents a do. a recent poll said they're ready to give up some territory for the end to the wall and the preservation of independence. that's up 14 percent from the arrow yet local, still a majority. not prepared to give up territory, but it's, it's changing opinion is changing, isn't it? if any of those changing is true, but i think the part of the reason is that we were kind of thrust into this full say, call to me that it's the territories for peace. and it's based on the assumption that if we give territories at the russia, then it's going to bring peace. but this is not true. it's not going to happen because russia is not about taking part of a brand new territories. russia is about destroying and ukrainian stated. all right, stuff on. do you think, is a lensky again with a new permission is given to him by boston is readying himself to try and take

tactical. to take the take tactical positions that had to be inevitable towards the trump will make him have with russia. and i think that is very much the case. um, we also shouldn't forget that um these concessions do not necessarily need to be a problem. i mean, some of the scenarios that people are talking about, like the korean scenario off this include restaurants in there. they do not necessarily trade territory permanency for a lot of these files. so if you look at the german expense phone call, i mean they had to german sides of the us and uh, in the soviet union, i'm calling about the unification. most law possible mean the in degree of a case beer had ceased 5 includes uh since the 1950s um with no recognition on either side of this being permanent state or from transfer

thing. and that says um concessions do not necessarily have to be permanent getting off a tire rotation because i think the other part that is quite important to you is uh to get in mind that uh vitamins decision now in some ways also makes it easier for to potentially to achieve his goals because it was not at all clear. so this motive or to that on russia is actually going to be able to keep on a ceasefire, as long as it has to momentum on the ground and create a washing gains in particular. indeed, on bus area, and also recently around to hockey certainly puts, put in a much, much stronger position now is by leveling the playing field on trump, himself, or potentially have more knowledge to say to important that you needs to come to

that have changed into instant or so on, we have some time and the so quickly from you, andre, is that how moscow might see this of the playing field is being leveled in readiness for what? that's not in my opinion. and so what season inevitable return to the negotiating table. when trump takes power next year, it in the system pulling from the sample, propose something concrete, something reasonable from most postpone to a few. yes. that might, because that's there might be a phone conversation. there might be some kind of teams. $12.00 each side, but uh, i'm not sure this will happen across the whole because uh, really uh, the prompts plans the positions the infection with this, based on the battle ground. and ball russia. as many russians

are saying to freeze the freeze, this patient means means more of if you right. okay, i would just back last done question to you step on a quick answer. if you can, is this a we are heading towards and then game here isn't making other forms. so we just have to like to know if it's like georgia mold over the baltic countries. i'm, should they be not? i think we always have to be a novice or for 2 reasons. one is that russia on the porch in the bank, clearly as a very strong, very aggressive imperial admissions, long term osha's, revisionist state. and on top of that, we now have an incoming president. the united states was very unpredictable, but doesn't necessarily mean bad news all around off. but it means very great difficulty in terms of timing for keys and for it's your again

awesome. all right, well we're out of time, i'm afraid, but thanks to all guess still i'm dr. federal to step on rules. i'm usually a cash debina and thank you to for watching. you can see the problem at any time by visiting our website out. is there a dot com for further discussion? go to our facebook page about facebook dot com forward slash ha inside story. you can also join the conversation on x. we all at a j inside story from me, bernard smith, and the whole team here. bye for now, the a full year of war in gaza. and now is this really troops invading lebanon or the us and israel working to reshape the entire region? now with trump back in the white house, what can america expect? and what can the world expand?

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