the research and dig level conflicts indicates that more countries are wor today. then at any time in the sense of all the incoming us present, donald trump, nato, on the e u. those were wrong cause and a 2 reasons why the world is less peaceful. now that it any, all the time since world war 2, that's according to the institute for economics and learning comments from national calling in for as a more on them and spending to be a treat. this may, we were told cause pain in the present. so is to change security in the future as the damage closed as a result of fighting comes with a hefty price tag. $19.00 trillion dollars in 2023, representing more than 13 percent of label g d, p. the human cost is catastrophic. in the same year, more than

a 160000 people were killed and a 110000000 forced to flee that homes. victoria gave some b, l, g 0 for inside story. that's bringing out guess from start came way joined by down smith, the director of the stop kind of international piece research institute. so pre a think tank focusing on global security in yield, robbie agra. well, the editor in chief of foreign policy magazine and a montville is boeing rabbani, a known resident fellow at the center of a conflict and humanitarian studies. welcome to inside story. let's start install kime with dan smith down. why is the world more dangerous than ever? on the one hand you've got the conflict that your opponent was talking about are combined with that, although the levels of nuclear warhead, so i've kind of it on folding for the last 25. um, i think if you set back

a bit from, from all of that, what we're seeing is because of the last 75 years or so, the world order as it existed with the united states as a clear hedge, a mon, you know, one of the only super powers has begun to see that so that if i toss you whether there is that the 2nd world war didn't really comes when the whole that really happened is we broke into was in the world, rather than any many specialists and an observer as to the reach of but just to add to, to what this previous speaker said, you know, this combination of, of instability of transition of growing and the quality one could add a, the multiplication of the number of states, for example, with the disintegration of 1st the soviet union. and then you can slowly, so once again, what are we simply seeing growing challenges to the existing system by powers that

believe themselves to be able to access complete impunity like the united states and great britain then the rocker is real now in the gaza strip or are we seeing a genuine disintegration of the international system that was put in place in 1945, and we're seeing the up peebles that go along with the transition to something that is as the new one of know, well, let me pull that down. so we have times for the idea, the deans, entire international institutions like the united nations, like the security council, which is the parts of the united nations that have failed. because that is this idea that the big countries key flows in fact is in the view of many observers, myself included is the un security council because there are 5 permanent members because they have a veto on resolutions of the security council. they operated under one rather flexible loose set of laws open to interpretation so they can push against the

rules every now and again. and the rest of the world operates under another much tighter set. now i think what is happening now and probably will accelerate during the coming 4 years, because trump is back in power because he has as many objections to the world order of the last decades as china, the leaders in china and russia. do i think we're going to see an acceleration of the framing of the international hold of the weakening of it? i'm really concerned about this. i mean, i don't see at the moment international institutions you and board is able to intervene to manage to and so it says what is happening in the 19 nineties and the note says hasn't happened for the last decade or so. i think the, the capacity to get through the agreements on the ecological prices and to implement them is, is visibly weakening. so i think that you and the agents are still carry on doing

a terrific. sometimes i run the job. i mean, think of the international atomic energy agency and the work it's been doing to try and ensure some degree of nuclear safety and ukraine in the midst of all, despite the good work of some of the agents and says, i have some freaks that have a veto power and refused to give up that power. and that lends itself to accusations of double standards. it lends itself to accusations of on we'll, we're not spending anywhere near that on piece building piece structures on solving complex. that has to be the fact the war is more profitable. surely that's going to be the simple reason. well it's, it's not only the more is more profitable, but that we also see that those waging war often conclude that war is a more effective method of achieving their objectives. then, then diplomacy or other alternatives. and this again reflects the problems

with the international system. we have which rewards the powerful and punishes the powerless. arriving the same questions here while we spending more money on piece building f as one rebuilding those institutions, why we just spending it on a relentless will machine. i wish i knew the answer. i mean, i think piece building takes time. it's hard. reconstruction takes time solving big global problems, whether it's climate change, whether it's mitigation, whether it's infrastructure, these things take time. the rewards are unclear. war as instant. you can find the money from one source to another. their territorial conquests and has done pointed out as well. people with power and vision react in strange ways. i don't think it's just money. if you wanted to make more money, you'd put it all in in video stop. so it isn't as clear cut as that. but i think

over all the thing that concerns me as, as someone who is, you know, a general to send the letter to is, is the, the guys of what is happening and gaza is horrible. and i also want to draw attention to what is happening on the west bank, which in some time small away is also um, extremely serious and didn't to remain in crew. but that is, i don't want to sound dismissive in this, but that is a localized horrendous tragedy. and i don't think that that will have that kind of a generative effect for the, for the international system. and for political leaders, ways that, that is likely and sadly, very sadly, going to be the thing that will likely bring countries together to act in, in a way where they can agree on the scope of the problem. and they will have no other option but to talk about solutions. i wanna thank o august stands may affect gravity, other wall,

and boeing rabbani and i want to thank you as well for watching. now you can see the program again any time by visiting or websites out is there a dot com and for further.