with is taking a step back from democratic values. we've got it this way, you can kind of kind of just ignore and not comment on the speech that we've heard from the west vice president. we fight for your rights to be against us is one of the multiples of the german armed forces. and it stands for democracy. this democracy that was just called into question by the us, vice president, not just germany's democracy, but that of europe as a whole. if i understood incorrectly, he's compared what's happening in europe with what prevails in some of the ritz area and regimes leading. ladies and gentlemen, this is not acceptable relation. tens of thousands of and take off with a protest as a routing across serbia. the student led demonstrations have been taking place across the country over the past few months, protested the demand as accountability for a roof collapse. so the train station in november, which killed 50 people, they blamed corruption, leading to full construction standards for the collapse plus the motion. the goal

of this is to make our institutions work so that we stay in serbia for some kind of harmony to be made for people to simply live with loved in this country. all my problem bill, this is a real deal. i've been here since the beginning, day and night, helping and doing as much as i can to help us go a tree. hope that one day this country of us will become a normal country for the institutions will start doing the job. i love to be, i was born here and i want to work here. unfortunately, because of the regime is it is that is impossible. a spanish coast guard vessel has rescued 64 migrants of the canary islands that were transferred to the island of grand canaria. the red cross said many were injured the spanish islands and struggling to absorb the surgeon, migrants travelling in boats from north west africa. at least $3200.00 migraines and refugees have made it to the canary islands so far. the caea, according to spanish authorities, the head of the roman catholic church, put francis, this isn't

a stable condition off to being admitted to the hospital. so brown causes the vast con, since the 88 year old pontiff has a slight fever. but problems has, has faced several health problems the past few years. and recently suffered from 2 falls hundreds of water tanks of being dismantled, it depends focus even nuclear power plants. the sight of one of the world's worst nuclear dissolved is the tank holes treated radioactive voice of following the 2011 sonoma that spot a nuclear meltdown. the removal will make space for the storage of highly dangerous fuel debris that will be extracted from the reactive. well, those that set familiar elizabeth put on them, but stay with us on al jazeera. the bottom line is coming up next. thank you for watching the this is turkey, turkey a is the 1st country to develop a national,

sustainable tourism program in collaboration with the global sustainable tourism council. this country holds more beauties than just those you see, blue flag, beaches, historical and cultural treasures you rivelo routes and michelin green style restaurants come and discover not true. historical and cultural beauties the nation in because deep connection with nature. because in spite them to spread the message about the critical importance of protecting it, i'm traveling down the ammonia river with thank you to visit approach at 2 sides to within 5 to start up to seeing a vision. and then i was concerned many he was moved to take the action and cause wisdom. beyond that territory. to place is a pit, somebody's in the disconnect from nature, fueling the destruction of the forest. he chose the nearest town and irish,

how time a took on to fulfill his vision. and in 2018, he opened an institute, which he named your rank tasser mc a. hi, i'm steve clements and i have a question. how did israel's war on gaza become one of the defining moments of the 21st century? let's get to the bottom line, the after decades of being swept under the rug and neglected the issue of palestinian rights. and just as has gone from the back burner to the top of the world to agenda the attack by hamas on israel on october 7th, 2023 in israel's response has become one of the defining events of the 21st century . and it has implications far beyond the region on free speech, on the solvency of international law, on the conversation on racism, the conduct of warfare, and even the values of diversity, equity, and inclusion. i said it. so how is gaza change the world today?

we're talking with author upon cash mitra who just come out with a new book on the global impact of the palestinian is really conflict the world after gaza. a history on cash. thank you so much for joining us today. just gonna start out as we talk about the ingredients that got us to where we are at this moment where the president of the united states is talking about moving 2000000 palestinians out of gaza and setting up their riviera on the gaza. i like is our audience to understand what is gotten us to this point where we've almost become non, to hearing about ethnic cleansing. but it is an interesting question, isn't it, steve? i mean, i think um, you know, the fact that it's now or a president of the united states who is now talking about ethnic cleansing. and is you could say you could argue that it's almost taking a back seat to you. then also entered as yes, think about it. of course while i leaders that have been talking endlessly about the necessity of ethnic cleansing and how they should go about it and how they

should finish the job. but you know, it's never really being kind of explicit state policy and in just the way trump is analysis as us policy to carry out ethnic cleansing. and so if you know, you also expressed and how did they come to this situation where a us president is more into the aspect about ethnic cleansing, about us to the entire cheat that i think you really have to go back and look at this extremely complicated american engagement with israel resign is in some part of the story has been toward the floor. but i think, you know, really the story that be know which is more familiar to us is a sort of story of diplomacy and changing, you know, relations between american history, not the government to government level. but i think the emotional history of this, the cultural history of this has really only be told in cottage, you know, sort of monographs the scholarly monographs. so this book really is an attempt to

kind of, you know, tell the story and make it kind of in a way acceptable to, to a wider audience. i don't know if you agree with that framing that i've given to your book, but i think it's an interesting journey to think that those that were the oppressed, the victims are now. i have victims that they are, they are perpetrating these horrors on today and gaza and the west bank and other parts of, of, of the middle east. but who, this is a sort of historical, i really would say it's a, you know, particularly grotesque or any of history. that's a victim. so, racism, victims of imperialism turned into perpetrators themselves when they come to read a certain amount of collective power. and this is the case, you know, i should emphasize this is the case, not just with the, with, you know, the people who run the state of israel today who claim victim would, who claim to that on sisters. uh, you know,

what vicious the prosecutor cannot claim is absolutely correct. uh, no community i would, i would argue, has been as viciously persecuted as european jews in the 1st half of the 20th century. and you could, you know, also argue that there are many other communities around the world who can, who can also makes pretty accurate claims on this, on this, you know, victim hood. but at the same time, once you cost you to a nation states, once you're on history begins as a solver and people, then you have to be judged by what you actually do as a nation state. you can keep always claiming that particular narrative, a victim or to justify you know, your, your sort of atrocities on other defense this week state to speak, which is what the state of israel has been doing for a long time. and i think we need to break free of these narratives, whether it's israel or whether it's india or any other postcolonial country. i think, you know, those countries have to be judged by what they're doing,

the present, how, you know, what kind of values they are pools. um, you know, this is not really a question of giving and this license to people who comment masika is just because something absolutely terrible happened to their ancestors. so as you look around the world, where do you have hope? i mean, you try in the end and i think you fail to sort of look at what the equation of hope or a better direction would be. where in the world, do you think the value is equation is prevailing. you know, steve, i don't really invest hoping in countries or nation states, you know, the idea of america, the idea of china and the idea of india. i'm as hoping generations, you know, and i invest open, younger generations. every job, young generation re, makes the world. it's remax, it's for itself and for its own children and grandchildren. and i think, you know, it's probably safe to say that the generation today that it's been expose to,

you know, some of the most horrific scenes, human beings i've ever witnessed in, in, in, in history. you know, seems of people being bunch of debts, teens, of, of, of, you know, balance, gathering the headless corpses of the children in the, in their ons. young people today have gone through so much in the last 15 months. and i think the immediate response, which is one of shock outrage hara entity compassion this i think you know what, it was really, you know, the political consequences of their protests and the know they have been brutally crushed, not by the trump administration, but by departments administration so they lie politically passive right now, but what's important is, you know, they saw and this outrages and as far as, and the responded, they responded profoundly, morally, profoundly,

ethically. and i think, you know, some of these people my grow up and, you know, coming to positions of our influence, unreturned some memory off the hottest they saw. and you know, the sense of more, obviously the developed back to end the values of compassion, the values of empathy for, you know, our, our, our fellow human being. so this may seem to abstract, but i think that is the hope i withdrawal from the, the, the, the sort of images we saw, young protest as young students and young people in, in, in general, over the last few months. because we know that the generations that have been involved in positions of power and influence over the last couple of decades, whether these generations vote for the democratic party or the republican party have failed us terribly. so we definitely need to look forward to another generation rectifying our, our more abundance and you, you grew up in india, you grew up as i understand that in a hindu nationalist household,

you had tremendous respect for what israel was doing, what it meant as you were growing up and you visited israel in 2008. can you tell us about that journey and how it changed your course? you know, i think it's a very common place johnny, steve, you know, it's a, it's a journey of people and some of the books have been written about this most recently bought on ac codes. the people who know very little about is well or have a kind of uninformed infatuation with it, which is you know, what i had growing up in, in india, in a family that reviewed as well. that reviewed zionism, saw it as a model for india. so it is a model for him to majority of, of india. and then you grew up and you discover other fax, you be read a lot more. you discover either you, you encounter palestinians would tell you another story altogether. and then you go

there and then you realize that uh, you know, this is really the most horrific states of military occupation anywhere. and i've travelled a bit, i've travel, you know, and places. but india and forces admitted she occupation of being to various other parts of asia. where uh, you know, minorities are oppressed by 5 full state doctors. but nothing a prepaid me really for the utility and the scarlet off the is really occupation in the west bank and gaza and more, more scandalously steve. i mean, i think the fact that this occupation was consistently denied, but skilled by main stream politicians. i'm jealous in, in the so called democratic west, i think, you know, when we look at what is happening in me in tomorrow or to donald, there is other sort of places around the world, the atrocities there are not being of skilled or justified or supported by the so called democracies, but this was a, this was an extraordinary case. so,

you know, so a kind of colonial style oppression going on in, in the 21st century. and yet most people didn't want to look at this than most people did not want to examine. it's in the, in the west and also, you know, awesome. so is the question, how long dick and this last and what kind of world does this portend? and i think, you know, we have the answer to that. you mentioned tom and he's in coats when, when i was at the atlantic, a ton of his he was one of my colleagues. of course he wrote between the world and me, but he's also written a book about about palestine. he's been enormously criticized. i think similar kinds of criticisms had been levied against on easy coats against yourself, against the sort of notion that was observing and trying to understand this morally, historically, politically, are not allowed to because of not having gone through the holocaust,

your thoughts. let's do my position, is that so, you know, suffering has been a constant. it's been a, it's been a regular experience of countless people around the world. what would the last pistachio with the last 200 years has been? we've also become more aware of global suffering, suffering in the, in, in various sort of genes, whether, you know, government is to target darian capitalist, imperialist, indeed, uh, you know, anti colonial and postcolonial origins as well. um, i think to draw a particular narratives, a victim what from those and do then claim that, you know, mind, additive is superior to yours. that entitles me to do certain things, which you are certainly not enticing to do. that is really not the way to create any kind of society where they don't people shared common purpose or are to go to,

to, you know, some kind of idea of common when you're looking at people's siloed. and the memories in the particular historical experiences. unable to empathize with the pain and suffering of other people. so, you know, i don't know what these other people who have these positions, what they think about this issue. but what i'm trying to argue in this book that's for democracy, for the i deals of compassion for our fellow beings, but that to prevail, we need to move out of these particular narratives of historical victim. what, why do you think the kind of words that you've just shared are so controversial? you write about intellectual dis, despotism of these times you write about censorship. i know that you yourself, i'd love to hear a little bit about it, have paid a price out there for shining a light on the importance of this conversation. why can't we have this conversation without consequence among reasonable people? well, you know we,

we are living and so i think what can only be described as marley above us times. you have the vice president of the united states. defining know a lot of christianity, which is the exact opposite. it's really the exact opposite of what christianity is today. this is a man attacking conflicts in the united states for encouraging and legal immigration, or for, for supporting and protecting evidence. so this is really an upside down reality that all inhabiting where the value is that of helps human societies together that up, that have really in a way and made a lives meaningful way to those values are of compassion or a sort of entity. but those values are being trampled into the up and, and, and know what the value of the day is today is roots. trent, that is the value that's being upheld. and we have been told that, you know, might is, right, i'm and, and, and the poor must suffer. it's, it's,

it's is too bad, but this is how it is. so let's recognize, you know, this, this extraordinary world that we have come to inhabit and then try to also understand how we, how we got here. i want to count and show you a uh, a recommendation of what president biden shared about a conversation with is really prime minister netanyahu. this is joe biden speaking . i said, be, you can't be carpet bombing these communities. and he said to me, well, you did it, you carpet bumper when you dropped the nuclear weapon. you killed thousands of innocent people because you had to in order to win a war. but many americans don't remember dropping the bombs on hiroshima and nagasaki or many of the other outragious things this country is done. but does that, does that mean that in the, in the fact that we're not necessarily introspective about some of the crimes, inhumane crimes we have done or others have done that. we can't still have a north star, you know,

towards something that is much more humane and just and fair, particularly in the case of guidance, or, let's see what i think it has to do with, you know, what kind of values do you want to privilege. if your things are bible, if you think um the expansion of follow a collective power individually, power, if those are your main goals, then everything is justified in the service of those but at ideas. then of course, mosse, you know, extermination is justified. of course, you know, hitler made the same kind of arguments when he said about destroying the european jewish population. this is the kind of argument that old major, desktops, old major to solitary and figures have been over and over again. we need to do this in order to win something. this is the morality that we are working with here. this is very far away from the mortality that has guided,

most people is around the world for a long time. we have to look at, you know, what is, what is happening to do i, i'm nation states in a click, a model or even immoral. is there something about the political and economic systems that be in the habit today? that do not take into account a simple you know, criteria of right and wrong. having moved so far away from, you know, our, our sort of lead, religious, spiritual, and philosophically promptings that we become these most risk creatures will not stop at you know, mosse loving tens of thousands of people. and following up with, with, with ethnic cleansing, with cleaning the area of dining into a gaza rivera. i mean, this is a monstrous wherever we are inhabiting today. and, you know, all sort of, again, justified in vote by, you know, to be as examples drawn from a very selective history. we would have had the gentleman who had won the 2nd world war making the same kinds of arguments about killing 6000000 jews. a, it's a, it's

a victory to write this kind of history always. but as i sort of look at this broad question of gaza, palestine is real. and, and you sort of asked the question of, you know, where is this going to go in, in a way? what are the barriers to what donald trump is talking about? essentially, ethnic cleansing, is there any barrier you identify with the students and others that are protesting? but in a way, i think you kind of almost morosely realize how gun, how numbered and how plant those that are trying to raise the profile of these questions are. so i'd love to know as you sort of look at the situation now and you see anything that is helpful. a little steve, i said very clearly in the book that it's very likely and know it has become more likely with the drumstick. treat that is relevant, succeed in an ethnic, cleansing garza, and maybe even the westbank. and that

a perfect possibility is closer to being, being realized today. um, you know, obviously is really far right. politicians have been wishing openly proclaiming their their desires with this kind of outcome for a very long time. and obviously, you know, after the 7 games for them as a great opportunity. and again, they were openly talking about this right from the beginning. the, you know, this is, this is the moment to accomplish many of our, you know, long defined objectives here. so this is, you know, a moment for them, and obviously the ex static that donald trump is supporting the endeavor. in fact, on trump is now in the driving seat in many ways. but i think i would like to point to something else, which is this progress, you know, it's, it's, it's perhaps easier to describe is way as tragic tree in this context. because i think we are looking at a much more extensive radicalization across the western world. the kind of

sentiment that is not imagining political sentiments stoked by mainstream politicians, often not just by far right. politicians against immigrants, against religious minorities. this is something that has been in the making for some time, and i think this kind of moral and legal are sent. this kind of butterfly that is read has lived in the middle east of norms, low international morality, just about everything that we decided to make sacrosanct off to 1945. i think this process is now beginning to happen in, in various, all the sponsor, the west of was nbc that most strikingly in the last 2 weeks of the new trump administration is also happening in much more in serious ways. and in places like the united kingdom, when kids thomas said, you know,

these ladies have every right to cut off the power and water to the palestinians. um, you know, this is the human rights lawyer speaking, you know, and, and sort of open violation of every kind of schuman rights lawyer you can think of . um, he was preparing the stage when he becomes prime minister and declares war on some of the pores and because people in the country we are looking at a much more extensive breakdown here by just, you know, what is happening in, in, in gaza and is very likely to happen in the west bank, but let me just ask you briefly and, and, and finally on cash. i find it so interesting that you're an indian observer of this and, and it's just, i'll tell people it's happening strongly powerful, an important book. and i want to congratulate you on that. in my book, india is the most significant rising power in the world. you know, china is important, but china's population is decreasing. india is growing in these economy is going to

india is going to be one of the major a norm setters in, in, in the entire world. and we look at what do you think the government india is learning from this moment. so as we see what unfolds with gaza, i don't think it's played, it's god so badly so far. i tongue, i think this sort of, you know, in the indian government went along with the fund to see that they were going to be there was going to be some kind of a normalization t. between is really and saw the area under american offices. and they would benefit from, from such a deal and, you know, become this kind of, the sort of, you know, the arrival to china. but the prefer drive it to china in, in, in, in the middle is not, of course, we know the situation is very different. that's um, you know, so many of the is rails, out of our neighbors. extremely, none of us, extremely wary about what might happen, the next,

the data is off the table unless and until there is a policy in states which we know, is it a remote possibility at this point? so i think the indian diamond state is going to the united states again to try and persuade donald trump to be less punitive in his type of song on india. but the know these kinds of persuasive tactics don't really work with the, with something like donald trump. so i think um india, uh, having supported israel to explicitly in, in, in the sort of, in the last 15 months, i'm not really paying enough attention to public feelings or public opinion. and large box of the northwestern was, has lost out, has lost out on, but more leadership. and also in the way, the kind of diplomatic leadership that countries like south africa or brazil have

a sealed kind of course, you know, the not, and beneficiary of all this is, is, is china. the author's pon cartridge nature. and his latest book is the world after gaza a history. i really recommend that you read it. thank you so much back as for joining us today. thank you, sue. so what's the bottom line? much of the world has become indifferent to palestinian suffering. and u. s. president donald trump is now main streaming ethnic cleansing in his comments that he wants to all to 1000000 people in gaza, shipped out somewhere with no right of return. and the us owning the gaza strip, where the point in history were lessons of the past, especially about the banality of evil or being boldly and purposely ignored. we know which way we are pointed and it's not a place where palestinian justice will be achieved, nor is really security our conscience as people once informed by a belief in human rights and dignity will be deeply stained and damaged by what's

on folding now. and that's the bottom line, the a democratic nations justified this kind of behaviors. collateral damage has collateral damage. that's why it's reality is leading to what we're seeing that will allow me to push back for a moment is the you are systems. corporate is real effective. it's a little bit branding from the impact of the us selections. the escalating conflict in the middle east of the urgency of climate action upfront sets the stage for serious debate on out jersey or when to induce in terms of the truth, the fact tag in the balance. he's going after the media in a way that's unprecedented. the narrative is being re, re these, choosing to the amplify when voices of silence agendas prevailed. attacks on the press or an accident, or part of a broader effort to suppress the story. systemic emissions mean control,

what has this discussion looked like, you know, right. wing and media circles again is for 50, is being labeled with the situation. the listening post decoding, the media analysis era, the streets of domestic us and look safe for children. the safety in numbers, but that doesn't always work. i was passing by the bridge and this guy came up. you asked me how much money i've got. i told him i didn't have any. just hit me on the glass both to afraid of being a doctor. king 14 your own use now sleeps in a different location in the night maternity. the often foundation estimate. they are 1200000, often abundant children. of course, syria. the morning, a cold winter night, 13 year old fucking on us and our friends hope to one day be able to go to school. but for now that dream is just to have 3 meals sunday,

the united nation say serious 15. yes, people, husky infected. it's to bring the most affecting 80 percent of the more than $30000.00. what 2 or the features? the, [000:00:00;00] the hello until mccrae. this is and use. our line from the l focus is the swamp, is ready kept, is for palestinian prisoners as part of the cx, 5 deal in gauze, and which was close to collapse this week. a mouse and he is on the jihad prepared to release 3 joel nationalist or any type of health and gaza. freedom awaits for