the, did you realize that's what the vision is, the new to the movie has and goes head to head with for mr. elected president, rhino but converse thing go. i a really important even before you were born. i know we so much i called of the problem. at the head on al jazeera is east fire and goes a hines in the balance says israel insist on extending phase one. thomas says it's a breach of the original truth agreement. benjamin netanyahu is wanting of consequences as a group does not accept. so well. israel resume its wall on gaza, all kind of the cx 5. the salvage. this is inside. sorry, the hello and welcome to the program. i'm rob matheson palestinians, and guys of were suppose to enter the holy month of ramadan in some form of peace

as the 2nd phase of the seas. 5 between israel and thomas good underway. but is there any problem in this or benjamin netanyahu, whose government now wants to re negotiate the terms? israel is pressuring homeless to extend the 1st phase of the cx, 5, and exchange for releasing half of the remaining 59 captives. adults cut all fade and supplies to gaza. again, how much is accusing israel of carrying out a tube against the existing deal? it says the international community has to act. thomas says it wants to continue has agreed with talks on face to the cease fire. and that includes negotiating the withdrawal of israeli troops from the strip. but israel's appears intent on changing the deal and it seems to have strong backing from the trump administration . we're going to speak to our guests in a moment. first this report, by fatty a car surrounded by the ruins of their own homes, palestinians in gaza. take what joy they can celebrating the holy month of ramadan

at last. we 5, it is ready for me. but that piece now hangs in the balance 1st for he to day phase of the seas far between israel and a mass ended on saturday. or israel has now cut off supplies and threatened consequences unless from us agrees to new terms. and that says that amounts to blackmail. israel is now endorsing us plas, for an extension of the ceasefire over ramadan and the jewish holiday of passover, rather than entering the great 2nd phase talks. and phase 2 were meant to negotiate the withdrawal and was ready forces from casa and the release of all $59.00 remaining captives, $24.00 who are believe to still be alive. but some says israel has refused to engage a new proposal by us envoys. steve woodcock, let's see, half of the remaining copies released once an agreement is reached and the other

half when both sides agree, permanency is fire, says allowing israel to a band and phase 2 would give it the option to resume fighting. once all captains are returned, that's because israel would effectively ditch phase 3 and the ending cost of these and negotiating the rebuilding of gaza and it's future governance. something. israel has been keen to avoid. the don't want the power as soon as they don't want to buy a national state. they don't want to configuration. they want the jewish state and all of palestine, and they're trying to do it by force, get the palestinians out of gas or push them out of the west bank. the road already pushed 4050000 out of the camps and they're going to try to get them out. but these postings are not going to go anywhere in the ceasefire brought some reprieve to the more than 2000000 people in gaza. his license being wrecked by simon and displacement, and despite repeated his ready violations coming more than 100 product stains during the trace, blocking entry of shelters,

a mass has been pushing to continue the seas far. but with broad backing from the new us trump administration, it's really appears intent on re shaping it in its own interest palestinians across guys that remain defiant and was there of the we are here in the midst of destruction and rubble and we stood fast despite the paint and now ones. we are breaking out fast on our land and we will not leave this place. we will stay here. celebrating rama den with their surviving families. palestinians here can only hope for lasting peace. for the a car, which is 0 for inside story. the we're going to bring in our guess now in bethlehem we have have a, i will age, he's a political analyst. he's also a former advisor to the p l. o and also of the book of lucid and palestine. joining us from washington, dc is fine, says reset. the name is a former us ambassador to egypt into ki i. he's also

a former president of the american university in kyra camden, west, who is when we have we have shown baskin he's, i'm at least director of the n g or the international communities organization. he's also a former piece and hostage negotiator. thank you very much indeed. for being with us gosh, and i want to come to you 1st. what's your take on this proposal to extend phase one. i think it's a nonstarter. i think it was a non starter. the moment it was presented by the it's really sorry to the americans to steve would cost the presidential invoice. and it was very clear from the opposite that from us would not agree when they entered into this and negotiated in deal a 4445 days ago was very clear that from us entered the agreement. because they understood in phase 2, it would lead to the end of the war, and as well, the withdrawal from casa now is really strange. we make on that application to end the world which are from gaza. and from us, of course, is not going to release the 59 remaining hostages until there is, it is really guaranteed to end the war ring withdrawal from casa the heavier let me

come to you because uh, this a statement is come out from us. um, in which, uh they say they've already signed a discussion with saying a 3 stage ceasefire agreement under the auspices of 3rd party media interests, including the americans. uh, the understanding from what i got from was saying that there was never an expectation on most of the homeless was willing to accept this because what's happening that is a states role. and thanks for inviting me here. it is the, the us of easterwood are in violation of the ceasefire. the in the court find a few weeks ago. and i think you may think it's very important to emphasize on this point and also to realize the level of coordination that the us of getting facebook trumpet ministration and the phrase, the government. it have a business dates, it was just a few hours from, from this u. s. adoption of a new starting new position which was to extend face one and not to get to a face to it that led to it separately for any announcements supposed to be

supported by the us. including hold the old to many parent a to desa at the beginning go from other from says this the way this is being reported. it seems like israel is essentially saying like, give us everything and you want that. so the deal is this actually a negotiation anymore? well, it seems like the israelis are moving the gulf coast here. it is clear that the in the larger picture, both sides have lost it or neither side is an easy way out. and the united states is trying to work away in between at least the short term fixed on the table to get them. and these are speech by a to rama down. that would be something, but the problem is that both sides are stuck. they can't get out of this without even worst losses. how must have nowhere to go, nothing, nothing. you can salvage from this war,

that it on me at once. it were to give up all the hostages on this really side. they have no, no plan, no idea of where to go. and as a previous commentator has said, they've rejected units already state they reject be paid or anything they seem to have in large. they're working too uh removing the, the palestinian people from what i, that's clearly not going to happen. they seem to be enlarging and to remove people from the west bank. and that's not going to happen. so both sides are stuck. it seems to me the best that can happen here is for them both sides to accept the united states proposal for their short term at least to get to ramadan and pass over me. i would get some how much of this do you think this extension by, by the us and subsequently by israel is ultimately about avoiding israel withdrawing its troops from gaza and commissioning to end the war under face to the

big problem from these really point to view is that as long as the semester gains in control of godsa, and it has its military arm still functioning, there is, will test one and the war is, will, of course, will not end the world as long as hostages remaining casa, and there's a very strong belief on the as really side, particularly in the government that if they do in the war and you know from us will only in trenches position will gain in strength and will continue threatened israel . this is why i think we're seeing a call that thing of the art world. we'll see this in the, our summit that's coming up with you. not either position both on the need to end the war, bring the hostages home it and see a different governance or palestinian governments and gaza, which would be acceptable, are legitimate by the majority of palestinians, and yet with no longer be a threat to israel. this all has to be packaged in a political understanding that we're moving towards the 2 state solution. and it's obvious that with the current is where the government, that's not a reality that we can expect. so there needs to be political move into,

we want to see the changes in cost of that need to happen because there's a humanitarian disaster. the eric more than 2000000 homeless people, there needs to be an international effort, primarily a regional efforts to see how we bring this to a close that will lead to an end to the war. the awesome digital and a replacement of gusts of how nice and gotta so if we get to the point i have a of, of reaching the deadlock that we, we seem to be getting close to as far as the negotiations are concerned. i want to ask you about how much and tensions with regard to disarmament because it is one of the things. but i've not been aware of all that. they have said that they have been meeting the, the agreement, their side of the agreement in terms of the ceasefire. but there doesn't appear. and they've, even as we know, i said that they are prepared to step back from the administration of guys as well . we've what we've not seen, or any clear statements about the removal of weapons and who those weapons would be handed to. do you think that a for how much was prepared to make us the statement towards that that, that might help to break the deadlock or at least move the talks on a little bit?

to be honest, i don't think so. it doesn't change much. the story, the calculations, easter, at least not interested to have it kind of thing. you know, 40 the ink uh saw that you'd be investing on kind of freedom division for almost it to dictates. now in order to avoid it giving 12 assessment whereby negotiations on a 2 state solution may happen, we have to keep with that in context extra. and it's not the favor of any solution that involves eh, the full feldman of kind of thing. their rights and from that perspective decided not make of crisis without being created. it's part of what benjamin netanyahu. if he's extreme scorely, some needs that some of the top or level does. so we have what does collections here in the q 5 westbank we have announced looks at the started but this way may be interested to move also into the confidence syria. we have 5, a pulse installed to live on. it left the in violation of the ceasefire. it'd be

with liberals, so we're talking about and it's probably the government that you smoke looking for a political solution. it's looking simply to expand. the crisis is in order to avoid it, getting into it what any, a rustling, a play you're here. we'll go, which is a bowl into what do you think of solution with the rest of the world. and with, by this time you know, to, to end occupation and a fulfill the rights of everyone around. since we've been talking about israel's military goals, at least as what the, as far as the speculation with, with regard to that is concerned. nevertheless, us envoy steve coffee is urging israel to go through with phase 2 to ensure the return of the remaining hostages. and that many captives and the remaining bodies of those who died. i'm much of that. do you think is assigned that we're not, we're not at the point where actually the goals of the us and israel are slightly diverging. the health of the united states retains a longer term goal of the him,

within the contracts. it's always how to peace and stability across the region of a broader solution to the israel palestine context the contract. i think that that remains the goal of this administration. i don't know, i'm not a part of the administration, but it would seem to be from everything that the united states long term objective is what they are really. that is not the goal. i want you to israel. i will say of mister netanyahu and the right ring that he has been with other right, written governments of israel have accepted that called mr. ravine and he paid for that for 2 life. we've had 2 other previous leaders of, of israel. it was about rock and an old merch who are prepared to move forward with that process that would've led to a long term solution that to think 3 request for the israel, always out of touch, rejected this or even that the and really right. so however, it is really long from lifetime position of mr. nathan, yahoo and is various echo and we can government reject

a long term solution. so i agree with what the other i think your colleagues and think of you had said the mit which is around the government does not speak back, rejects the idea of the men to the war, need to keep this campaign going on. and i'm going to use these clearly does not want that heavier. what's your reaction to that? i don't think the problem is just is this what you the government when even the leader of the sun for less than you started? yeah, he's going on of the a statement calling on people on gas at the start until the cup to start return to the start of it. and it's not like we have a server administration that before is sort of where we're going to end occupation and to fulfill the right to the kind of finance people and certainly not the whole but, and, and other support perhaps other who'd automatically post much closer. it, but if, if we are to talking to matters of policy and one of the reasons why we,

we the piece process collapse and we are where we are, is because no, it's really government ever endorse the 2 state solution as an official policy. but hold on, i see, so an annexation of okay, by targets, are you for war crimes and chris and games it gets hu money t have been part of this for the government a policy for all those tickets. so i think i think it's important to, to have like, oh, it's like in this room, there are people that want to move it to for the pickup process and would like to end the certain documentation. but they think the police is we're, we're seeing from and i mean that then, you know, have been paid by previous of ministry. so it's just like the product. it's a been a term in the us be pay but previous will be mistakes on particularly by the disaster was job by the administrators. goshen, i mean, i mentioned at the top of the program that you are a former piece and hostage negotiator. i'm going to draw on your experience from that. how does what we're seeing now in terms of the negotiations around the various stages of the see different things far compared to negotiations that you've

been privy to in the past that and the, the positive. i'm not expecting obviously a direct comparison, but just the way in which they are carried out. because i think that it's important to note that when the current deal was a presented by president viking back in mary a, i came out with a statement saying that i thought it was a bad deal to begin with. there was a deal that doesn't bring it into the war, doesn't return all the hostages and would take months to carry out with many, many exit points. we're both sides to breach the agreement all over the way. and that's in fact what we've seen as a result of being approached by families of hostages. back in august, i approach the from us leadership and ask for an alternative deal. and the right to any degree meant that they even gave in writing in english. i knew the arabic for a deal for 3 weeks in which time to work with the industry which would withdraw from gauze of all the hostages would be released in exchange, red green number and names of palestinian prisoners. and we would move forward from

us even put team writing that they were willing to give up the current, the government to control of cost at that time in favor of a professional civilian tech, the product, government and public started. but they never would take, there were no takers for that deal, nothing israel's, not in egypt and, and cut out unless they were approached by homeless and not the white house who were simply too invested in the bad deal. that they were negotiating my understanding of the way that from us negotiations that there's very little room for negotiations. there's room on the margins, but they put down very early in the game on what they want, what their demands are, and they stick to those positions. and that's what we're seeing now from us leader compromised when it entered into the steel agreeing that we're, we're there and only in phase 2, because prior to that they were demanding that any agreement with them bringing immediately into the war. so they did like a compromise, but now they are seeing that the compromise was only on paper. it wasn't the real part of the deal from his ready side, not honoring the agreement that they made to one of the key elements of the deal

that was initially put forward by and donald trump of course, was that people had to leave guys an order for his and rebuilding program to begin benjamin netanyahu his hold each month to terminate into guys. yet again, is this short term gosh, him. do you think to get leverage to get how much to agree to the extension or is there a longer term leverage to try to force people to leave guys as part of that process? the right. i think this really is working of, of getting people to leave because that's, but it's also using this is leverage the military pressure on from us the threat of renewing door in order to get from us to give it a release hostages without changing the deal without increasing the number of prisoners to be released and not bring to the war to end. um, but it is real forgets that somebody has to leverage also over israel. and those of the $59.00 hostages. their holdings of which, about half of them are, believe to be alive. so that's a quite serious matter of leverage on is really society that brings me nothing else

seems to care a little about willing to sacrifice the lives of the hostages in favor of him remaining and power. that's at least what it seems to be. and sciences, and we know that egypt and content in the united states are all acting as guarantors for, for this, these far deal. this is, seems precisely the kind of circumstance in which hom us and israel would go to those mediators and those guarantors in order to be able to get them to move the ceasefire process forward. can you describe to us what the limitations might be that egypt and costs are on to some extent the united states are working and find that comes to the guarantor being guarantors of disease? fine fathers. and there's nothing for the guarantors to guarantee unless they should be the parties themselves come to the conclusion that they they must agree, at least on the cease fire, if, if not, and then to the war, there's nothing there to be guaranteed. and i don't know what it guarantees would mean other than the full pace i'm and credit of moral forest.

clearly, i think me the united states is not likely to put forces on the ground. and imagine that the cuts are even the media and would wish to do it on the other. the nice can ball like minor way of law or the property knows that there's no agreement to guarantee that serving simply a mediator is offering. they're good on as the and that's about as far as it's going to go until the side until the dynamics change. we have any resistible force and movable object. it makes it in a very talented situation. me have a we were hearing earlier on the program about they that the site the were entering the holy month of ramadan. and how is that spring box in guys, or we have to remember, of course, that there are hundreds of thousands of people in guys have who are trying to live through this as the negotiations. well, stall at the moment,

just talk to us briefly about what they need to sort of delay means for the lives of people in gaza. we have to understand that even under the conditions, so obligations to face one is right, violated that for example, the entry of the 10th and we both, i think 10 percent of the amount of stem cells were supposed to enter their mobile homes. it does not to enter, it goes us. well, in any case we have less, 8 and 3, and then what's needed in the condition of the human, you're taking the saucer, we have it in go. so if you up to this stuff we have now the holy month of ramadan, it's a clearly an invitation, a for a seems to continue to escalate. and let's again, let's remember that it's all the elite dasa these days, the northern west side. we have over 40000 people that are displaced and the conditions for the connectivity between public opinion seem to occupies with splunk . it's also very complicated. at this stage. i guess i'm, we've got the art of summer being held in a couple of days. i understand that there isn't,

is really validation that is being sent to colorado to have a look at that proposal that is being prepared by egypt and it's going to be presented at the out of some of that at that point. is there any like this? what do you think the israel is gonna find anything within that proposal that they're going to find acceptable and workable? you know, i don't think so. i, i think my understanding used to be are leaders who met the, on the farm, but say, well, how many been somebody a few days ago, it came to a collective agreement on what needs to be done. which includes ending the war and is really withdrawal from gossip. but it also includes a political frameworks for advancing of genuine to state solutions. and we see the power of song radio right now was one of the leaders of their world demanding that not only there be a pop tutor palestinian state, but a palestinian state is required in order for the southeast to normalize relations with israel, which is something that is really great, keen about the saudis are now more committed to the palestinian state than ever

before. and i think they found the agreement with all the other arab leaders, including the abraham, a court states, a of the united or reverence and befriended morocco and others were in reading that there needs to be a swift change in the 3rd policy towards the state of israel in order to see that this war ends and that there is a political formula, moves us forward out of this conflict. it will require a change of leadership in the region. i think both in israel and palestine, the change of leadership will be required in order for us to actually get into a genuine political process toward the palestinian state funds. as in terms of o gosh, i'm was just mentioning there with regards to changes in leadership, changes and, and focus far are of nations. what do you think is going to be the longer time impacts in terms of adults politics and geo politics and in the gulf region as a result of what we're seeing now, almost a almost irrelevant as to whether or not there is actually a ceasefire. even just based on what we know now about the situation, the israel and palestine find themselves in i, i guess, actually subscribe to what,

uh gosh on. has said there needs to be a change or leadership in the 2 parties to the conflict. and with, as i said earlier, both parties effectively how things last it's a long term sort of loss in any, in the making. but neither side has one and the loss of both sides, but not in this case. and 5, the when the other side, both sides of last time, i should know where to go. if the governor of such l sending and resistance is not over by any means if that's what this considered to be the henri. but how much is it is not going to be ruling palestinian stage or, or new version of it in the long run. i mean, it's on yahoo! in the long run, i think keeps up the what he's doing because he has consequences to face at home. no one, there is any settlement of the fact that so many in israel, things like that soccer and under and in pursuit of the conflict in the way he has

. and we'd be with the one who were listed in the amount of time off to divide the pallets. and you know, there's lots of there from what you're showing that that i, i believe there's some reason to be optimistic that one way or another there will be leadership changes, both in israel and on the, on the palestinian side, on the golf side. and you get, it seems to be the art they are a are stable and in terms of their leadership and their profit, these for the same thing, their leadership and they all have a. ready kind of consensus on accommodation with israel long, long ago starting with try that in the dining group and building over the years through the abraham accords. i don't see that changing i you see if anything had cool less thing and strengthening as they are about conflict between the palestinian player. it's better today and,

and the really plays out and have a lot of companies in universe for all finite terms of way that the, such as i do for all the gosh for interrupting you. but i just want to get a last question from harvey. i have in terms of how palestinians themselves, both on the west by and kind of guys are seeing the situation that is unfolding in gaza. do you think the palestinians do see any sort of optimism for a future in guys or do the csc as far or as a return toward inevitable? looked like just to make a few points. i think many people are very concerned, not just them. what that return to the general side of the more in gossip, but also they what's happening here in the westbound and i think that the students feel totally abundant. they're particularly way in the western world. you appealing to just a few days ago, a welcome. thank you, bill side of this, really for a minister with a red carpet. impressive a why peace boss this one, but in international court of justice when palestinians go to the best organization, some type of make points to diplomacy, en, eh,

and legal organizations. they're looking just, we're not supported. it we have you appear in countries welcoming. been so mean that the media who allow him to go through their artist phase like from like you tell you like greece. so from that perspective, i think kind of thing. you'll see how the professional community they are in this crisis. only see crisis that you'll see some, an old formulas that have faded completely normally say so it has to be a disaster. it for the palestine easterly left documents positions as you have been going way more radical after normalization, with a few out of countries. that's the only people can i can leave it there. but thank you very much indeed for, for joining us. and thanks to all our gas have you all, boyd defrances or something they can guess on basket. i'm thanks to you too. for watching you can see the program again, any time by visiting our website. i'll just 0 dot com 9 for further discussion. go to our facebook page, that's facebook dot com, forward slash age a inside story. you can also join the conversation on x a handlers at

a inside story from me, rob matheson and the whole team here. bye for now, the the latest news families explained is what uniform apartments often became separated into chaos, leaving the children stranded for in damage shelters with detailed coverage, the fathers, mothers, and children. and until every last one is found, the will will never truly be from the house of the story. schools and universities were all destroyed, depriving 10001000 of palestinians from proper access to education. the effective sifting power dynamics bully have to do is flip the switch and he has an authoritarian state. his 1st name is to take off of trinity, or any weakness there would show up thought takes on the biggest one out here for

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the the hello laura, kyle: this is the news our life from the coming up in the next 60 minutes from us reject 6, sending the 1st phase of the gauze cease, far accusing israel aflac file under violating the agreements as ready, bold as has continued to demolish palestinian homes and the occupied westbank as positive as not.