our top story: donald trump says he will look into whether to temporarily ban automatic rifles, such as that used in the las vegas shooting. the white house also welcomes a conversation about the use of a gun accessory used by las vegas gunman stephen paddock. cardinal george pell has arrived in court in australia, to face charges of historic sexual abuse. the vatican treasurer has consistently denied any wrongdoing. and this video is trending on bbc.com. a church in the belgian capital brussels, that was nearly forced to close its doors for lack of parishioners, has launched a new beer. it's hoped sales of fifty thousand bottles could raise vital funds to keep it going. that's all from me now. stay with bbc world news. now on bbc news it's time for hardtalk. welcome to hardtalk. i'm stephen sackur. my guest today is a legend in the music business. he has written and performed some of the most memorable tracks of the last four decades. nile rodgers co—founded chic, the band which defined

the late 70s disco generation. from his own band to his collaborations with everyone from madonna to daft punk, his beat goes on. now he is releasing another chic album. so what makes his sound and his spirit so special? nile rodgers, welcome to hardtalk. thank you. for four decades you have found a way to reach out to every successive generation of music lovers.

what is it that's the secret to that success? i am not really sure. otherwise, every record i put out would be a hit. ijust do what feels natural to me. and i have to admit that when it was earlier in my career, i knew that i wanted to make a living doing music. so when i was younger, it was a little bit more calculated. i was actually trying to make hits. before we get going on your career, i want to talk about your childhood. i have read enough to know there was lots of music in your childhood, a lot of creativity, but also an awful lot of chaos as well. and ijust wonder, when you reflect on it now, thinking about your mum who had you when she was 13, thinking about the fact your parents were, frankly, junkies for a while, how... frankly is correct. ..how close to sort of teetering over the edge into total chaos did you and your childhood get?

um, it made... from the outside looking in, it might have seemed chaotic, but there was actually a fair amount of order to our chaos, because by my parents being so dysfunctional and self—centred, it made me take on adult responsibilities at a very early age. i remember while i was doing my autobiography, i got to one chapter and i said — i believe i said i was the oldest nine—year—old in the world, because at that point my stepfather, who was white — which was an interesting dynamic in the black community, because we were raised in the bohemian part of the hip community... well, actually it was already bohemian, but the ghetto, the puerto rican community, it was very poor, but it was still a very cool lifestyle that my parents had. but when my stepfather had his first overdose, we were living in a puerto rican community and i

remember coming home to have a big thanksgiving meal and the amount of police that came to attend to him seemed incredible, like a total tactical assault, when meanwhile i had seen black people and puerto rican people die of heroin overdoses, and it wasn't that big a deal. that was when i first became aware of... being white in america meant more than being black. so it was a tricky lifestyle. but there was real... as i said, a real sense of order. as i got that life lesson,

i got many more byjust coming home from school and expecting dinner to be made and my parents were off doing whatjunkies did. let's get into the music business. you had been around for a little while. it seems to me the key was the amazing chemistry you developed with your partner in music, bernard edwards, and it was he and you who founded chic. correct. we need to talk about chic. when you talk about being the number one, chic were described as the number one disco band in the world in late 70s. what was the essence of the chic sound? there was a certain raw honesty to our style of grooving. it was based on, sort of, jazz, harmonic movements, chord changes... but we didn't base the chic sound on traditional blues or gospel. that was probably the biggest difference between us and a lot of other r&b groups. we were going for a more refined sound. even though we were raw and we did everything the way everyone else did, we approached it

with an air of sophistication that wasn't quite in vogue just yet. or we didn't know if it would be in vogue. i tell you what, cast your eyes to that screen — we will take you down memory lane. this is from 1979, this is le freak. # have you heard about the new dance craze? # listen to us, i'm sure you'll be amazed... # big fun to be had by everyone... # it's up to you, it surely can be done... # young and old are doing it, i'm told... # just one try and you too will be sold... # it's called 'le freak', they're doing it night and day... # allow us, we'll show you the way... # ah, freak out! # le freak, c'est chic. # freak out! apart from the fact that you look

even cooler today than you did back then, and you don't look any older, what strikes me about that is just that amazing driving bass. right. and the sort of brilliant interplay of voice and rhythm and beat and it is distinctive. listen to it for a second and you know that it is chic. that is probably what i'm most proud of. when we started we had a concept but we didn't have any proof of concept. and a good friend of mine who recorded our very first composition i wrote for chic, everybody dance — i wrote a song, we didn't have enough money to get a copy. the only time i got to hear

it was when we recorded it. fast forward three weeks later and he called me and said, "come and down and see something". i asked what it was and he said, "i can't explain it, come and see it". i walked into the club and he put the needle on the record and the whole crowd lets out a bloodcurdling scream. and they rush to the dancefloor. i said, "that's my song"! i am like a little kid. i can't believe it because it's only the second time i'm hearing my song. the interesting thing about chic was, your moment was short. from '77 through to '79 you were having hits, defining dance music around the globe and then it was gone and people moved against disco in a big way. i wonder, if you think about dance music that we have seen in the last couple of decades, everything from house to techno and hip—hop and everything else, when you listen to those dance genres today, do you

still feel that what you did is a foundation? i won't claim to be... well, maybe foundation, yes, you are right. i don't want to have false modesty. yes, quite a number of music tracks cut nowadays are literally based on chic stuff. as a matter of fact, the first big gigantic hip—hop smash, rapper‘s delight, was a interpretation of chic‘s good times, and they even sampled our record to do the string parts. we still have an influence on current dance music. one thing that you said was really also very spot—on — the time of chic‘s reign went from the summer of 1977 to the summer of 1979. we were done. it was famous for people in music at the time — there was this movement driven by a couple of djs in america, against disco.

they headlined it disco sucks and invited people to a baseball park in chicago where nearly 60,000 people brought disco records and they publicly trashed them, and it was like this moment when disco died. how did you feel then? at the moment that happened, i didn't feel anything — i thought it was a great publicity stunt. i didn't realise it would have a ripple effect that changed my life, and it changed my life in an instant. we went from heroes to zeros overnight, and what people don't realise is that in 1979, the year of disco sucks — i didn't realise this until the other day. i had two number one singles, one of them, le freak, still the largest selling single song in atlantic records history, and good times, which was the foundation of the first hip—hop record, rapper‘s delight. so two big number one hits in the same year from the same band and then come 1980 and we are persona non grata. thank god we had a deal with diana ross, because we could keep making hit records with other people. when you look back,

i wonder if you feel there was something deeper going on thanjust a changing musical taste? the culture commentator in the us, steve knopper, wrote later about that move against disco — he said it was the howl of cultural rage from middle america which associated disco with black people and with an increasingly confident 'out there‘ gay movement as well. indeed, yes.

middle america wasn't comfortable with that and that's what was going on. did you see it that way? yeah, i did, as i said, only after, sort of, in the aftermath. i didn't see it during the day of the event or even the week or so after. but i saw what was bubbling under and coming to the surface. and it was frightening to me. do you still feel there is a current in america? oh, indeed. things have changed so much in america. in your youth, you were in the black panther movement. you have a black president today. but you still have a suspicion between the black community and the police and you still have an america that is not at ease with the issue of race. i wonder how you reflect on that as a successful black man today? it's difficult to me, because when i was younger i was insanely idealistic, i believed we were working towards a future that wouldn't look like the current reality that we have now. on some level, it is heartbreaking. you do have a black president. doesn't that make a difference? well, yeah, but that's like... that's like saying, chic is the only band that had three number... it doesn't change the reality

for most? right, it is the exception rather than the rule. president obama is an exceptional human being, incredibly smart. i mean, i remember... so, that... it's almost like my career. you know, when i have had hit records with people, those records have been the biggest records of their lives. now that's not normal for me. most of the records i put out are flops. you talk about these collaborations, and they have been phenomenally successful for so many of music's biggest stars. it's interesting for you, because you're the producer, the man behind the scenes, you create the sound and deliver the sound... but it doesn't put you out there

as the big, big star yourself. does that suit you? i love that. i mean, the whole concept of chic was based on anonymity. i had seen roxy music a few months before we became chic and we were called the big apple band. i saw roxy music playing at some place like — i think it was called the roxy theater or the roxy playhouse or the roxy club or something. i remember that moment — it was amazing to me. i called it a totally immersive artistic experience in music. i had never seen that — the name of the club matching the name of the band, and then the audience looked very chic, like the performers. typically,

when i was in rock'n‘roll bands, whatever we wore that morning is what we wore on stage that night. so i never saw a band get dressed up to do a show, except r&b groups. so it was really interesting to see this in rock'n'roll, and the effect that it had on me. so, you know... you never really needed to be the star, yourself? we actually set out to have our music be the star, because we didn't feel like stars. see, if you look at roxy music, bryan ferry really is a star — he's a suave, debonair, handsome guy. bernard and i just looked at ourselves as workhorses. wejust worked, worked, worked. so our concept was, "what if we made the music and the experience the star?" let's bring it back to the personal, then, and what was going on inside you even when you became such a successful guy in the music business. because there was a time when you struggled a lot... i still struggle!

after the decline of disco and the end of chic for a while in those late '70s, you then, in the '80s and i guess early '90s, got into drink and drugs in a big way. yeah. to a point where it was clearly very damaging. yes. and ijust wonder, when you reflect back on that now, how close — again, i talked about it with your parents — but, for yourself at that time, how close you came to the edge. um, i came very close many times. it's actually a miracle that i'm still here and i'm able to talk to you today and actually form an organised sentence. 'cause it was pretty bad for a while. but, ironically, the thing that brought me there, which was a successful music career, was also the thing that saved me. i didn't think about being a successful musician at that point — i was just sort of living that life. but the day that i stopped drinking and drugging was one day i was playing and the guy that i was playing with — we were doing a live gig — recorded the show, recorded the audio. when i got back to his house later that day, he played it for me. and the crowd was going nuts —

i thought i was like the greatest guitar player in the world. when i heard what i had actually performed, i was so embarrassed. that's all it took — was that, and also people telling me about my behaviour at madonna's birthday party the night before, which actually lasted, for me, well into the morning and well into the next afternoon. mmm. it wasn't a fear of health, it was a fear of this gift or whatever i've worked hard to get deteriorating. right. in the mid—90s, you also had a tragic loss. we talked a lot about bernard edwards — we saw him in the clip there with you — but he had died right after a show that you and he had put on in tokyo, i think in 1996. yes. it seems to me, you know, you've had a lot of relationships in your life but, in a sense, he was pretty much your life partner.

bingo, yeah. yeah. and he's not around anymore. yeah, which is interesting, because i'm doing a new record now, and the new record that i'm doing — almost finished with it — was inspired by i guess what we now mythically call "the lost chic tapes". they weren't lost — i just didn't know where they were. these are old chic recordings which disappeared and then reappeared a couple of years ago? correct. and now you're turning them into a new album? right. some music critics have called your relationship with bernard something like lennon and mccartney. and i thinkjohnny marr from the smiths said it's actually beautiful watching those guys — nile rodgers and bernard edwards — on stage, because their relationship is so special. yeah. how easy is it to go back on stage now and play music that you wrote with him when he ain't there? um, the actual playing—the—music part is pretty easy, because i've only played with really exceptional musicians all my life. so they make it easy — that's the great part of my world. butjust speaking about bernard as a spirit and as a friend

and as a buddy who looked out for me, um, that's the difficult part, because now i'm the boss, which has always been hard for me. the way our relationship worked was, even though i may have composed most or the bulk of the compositions, bernard was clearly the band leader, and that was his role. and it was phenomenal the way he ran the band, because i could sort of be like, you know, this crazy, reckless guyjust writing music and doing stuff all the time — bernard could be the voice of reason. so now, i don't have a voice of reason around me. i don't have anyone to sort of, you know, help me stay on track. so now i have to try and play both roles, and that's really, really difficult, because intrinsically, i am the guy that i am, and i think about art in a very wacky way. the funny thing is, you talk about yourself being reckless

and pretty crazy for some of your life. but you're the survivor — notjust bernard edwards, but all of the other key guys that you played with in chic and around chic — they died. right. and you're still here. it's crazy. that's. .. you know, four years ago, i was stricken with a very aggressive cancer. i remember when i got that phone call from the doctor, and of course, at first i was terrified. but my immediate reaction after i got over that initial shock was i said, "doc, can we resume this call on tuesday when i get back from rome?" i said, "i was just walking out the door to go do a show." he said, "no, no, no, nile — this is severe. you've got to deal with this now. you need to come to my office right now. " i said, "imagine if you hadn't

gotten me on the phone. imagine if this was friday instead of thursday — you wouldn't come over to my apartment and stand outside and knock on the door all day long — you'd go play golf or tennis, and then monday you'd call me and try and look for me again." i said, "so let's pretend that happened." and i took off — i went to rome and i came back tuesday and said, "now, what were you saying?" i get the impression you just need to play, and you will play music until the day you just cannot. yeah. let's finish by talking about the music business today. we've just had this very interesting court case, which i'm sure you've been following, where the estate of marvin gaye accused robin thicke and pharrell williams of essentially infringing the copyright of marvin gaye with one of their songs, blurred lines. and it raises all sorts of questions about borrowing musical ideas and inspirations. pharrell williams said he worries that it's going to freeze

what he calls the creativity inside the entertainment business. you've been very involved in this sort of issue, too, about borrowing other people's styles and sort of musical genres. are you worried now? no — that's what we all do. i've said over and over again, the greatest motivator in music isjealousy. you hear a song and say to yourself, "god, i wish i had written that." then you go and try and take it apart and figure out all the cool things you can do to incorporate that into your sound, your music, your songs, and then you move forward. that's the great thing about music. there is no—one i know that's a good musician that also isn't also a great fan. they're a fan of somebody and, on some level, they're channelling that person. they‘ re channelling that composer, that performer. the genius classical composer verdi said, "what's the difference between good composers and great composers? good composers borrow, great composers steal." laughs let's end by bringing it right up to date. you're in london to play this music you talk about —

the rediscovered chic tracks, which you're putting together in an album. um... is it the same old chic? or is there something about... ..every part of the journey you've made over the past 35—40 years that means, when you go on stage now, you'll of course be thinking of your fallen partner. but will it be different? it has to be different, because bernard died 20 years ago. i've only thought about this when i started to compose the songs for this album. bernard died 20 years ago. what were we doing routinely 20 years ago? 20 years ago, we could fly from new york to london, have lunch, then go back to new york the same day. if you could afford concorde! well, we could. laughs but i'm saying, theoretically, one could. and we did, quite often — it was like the coolest date in the world — take a girl to like london or paris for lunch, and then go back home the same day. so the world that he experienced, the world that we were on the leading edge

of when he passed away, is a very different world than the world we live in now. i guess the point is, the music keeps evolving. in the '70s, it might have been studio 5a and that environment. today, it might be collaborations with daft punk... yeah. disclosure or daft punk or avicii... ..but it's an evolution that you'rejust carrying on. that's the great thing about music to me — as a matter of fact, the pre—chorus of my current song, i'll be there, says "i don't want to live in the past, but it's a nice place to visit. and if you come along, i'll be there." so, yeah, it's a real disco record in that half of the album is made from "the lost chic tapes", if you will. but he other half is all new stuff, because i didn't die then. nile rodgers, we'll count our blessings for that. thank you very much for being on hardtalk. thank you for having me. thank you. it's been a pleasure. thank you. absolutely.

clear skies and light winds out there right now. so certainly pretty chilly. but the good news is if you want a trouble—free day on friday, it is looking sunny through the country. a window of clear skies. a weather system is heading our way. that won't arrive until the weekend, unfortunately. there will be rain on saturday. not in the short—term, in the short—term, high pressure is building as i speak. it will be brief, not around for very long. i hope you enjoy the calm weather.

this is what it looks like on friday morning. not much happening out there. temperatures, eight degrees in towns and cities. rural spots and scotland, dipping down to around freezing. this is what it looks like first thing in the morning. a couple of showers and more of a breeze for orkney and shetland. but for mainland scotland, northern ireland, wales, the weather is looking absolutely fine. glasgow and the south, sunny for most. temperatures, around 7—9. the winds will be very light. a beautiful start to friday for most of us. the weather will change a lot through the morning and afternoon. however, later in the day, it looks like things will cloud over in northern ireland and western parts of scotland. some spots of rain getting over into the north—west and into the hebrides. possibly some light rain around until sunset in belfast and late in glasgow.

weather fronts increasing. saturday itself is looking very different. after a beautiful friday, saturday is looking completely different. overcast, a changeable day. it is not going to be a wet day. there will be sunshine around, especially in the south. damp weather around in plymouth and london. it will not rain all day long. the weather will wax and wane and won't be especially heavy. a better day on sunday. less of that cloud. pockets of rain here and there. 17 in london. more like 1a in glasgow. summarising the weekend, a lot of cloud, especially on saturday, with spots of rain. by the time we get to sunday, it should brighten up with some decent weather. that is your weather. goodbye. this is newsday.

i'm rico hizon, in singapore. the headlines: the white house and top republicans say they will examine a limited change to gun laws, after the las vegas shootings. australia's cardinal pell appears in court. we may learn new details of the abuse case against this senior vatican figure. i'm kasia madera, in london. also in the programme: hollywood producer harvey wineskin apologises. the and the author kazuo ishiguro wins the nobel prize for literature.