now on bbc news, hardtalk. welcome to hardtalk. i am stephen sackur. they say you can judge a man by the company he keeps. if that is true, my guest today should provide telling insight into the character of president donald trump. roger stone is a hugely controversial and divisive figure in american conservatism. he is a long—time friend and sometime adviser to mr trump. is he also a symbol of all thatis trump. is he also a symbol of all that is currently wrong in american politics? roger stone, welcome to hardtalk..

pleasure to be here. it isjust past the one—year anniversary of the donald trump administration. how would you describe the political atmosphere in the united states today? i would say improving. the president continues to be a polarising figure. a relatively close election with both candidates seen as polarising. but the rising tide of a strong economy is helping enormously. we have created under the watch of donald trump 2 million jobs, a record stock market, african american and hispanic unemployment is at historic lows. suddenly, you have a billion—dollar company like apple coming back to the us to

repatriate money. i am growing lay positive about it supplied all the more marach —— remarkable, his approval ratings are at historic lows. a great economy, and yet, a president who is profoundly unpopular with the american public. i would argue that he is polarising rather than unpopular. you have seen the figures. i have. iquibble rather than unpopular. you have seen the figures. i have. i quibble with some, there are methodology issues and so on. in the first year of the presidency, i do not think you can judge his overall success. i think as the economy grows, as he gets more of his programme in place, particularly after his historic tax

cut has in effect, you will see a change. what about the intangible political ultrahad the change. what about the intangible political ultra had the extraordinary signs of a president who, according to independent fact checkers, has, in the course of his first year, delivered pretty much 2000 falls we re delivered pretty much 2000 falls were misleading statements. —— false. if you like your healthcare programme, you can keep it. read my lips, no new taxes. no president has ever told the exact truth... but these are untruths on a scale never seen. these are untruths on a scale never seen. do you accept that? not exactly. every president has a potential to barricade. ——

prevaricate. he won. his opponent had not the best truthful track record. is this style of politics something you imbued in the president? you have been a friend and political ally for a long time. ata time and political ally for a long time. at a time you were a senior adviser until 2015 when he decided to run. there are people that believe your attitude to quote unquote misinformation is something you passed on. first of all, no one imbues donald trump with anything. he marches to his own drummer. he is his own wordsmith, tweetmaster, speechwriter, press secretary. he is the chief architect of his own success. it was an extraordinarily improbable election that he won.

something he may have picked up on, you said i believe in doing anything, anything, necessary to win, then you added short of breaking the law. i actually lifted out from lyndon bainesjohnson in his biography. —— lifted that quote. i meant leave no stone unturned. the implication is you make an all—out effort, short of breaking the law. lying is not illegal. it is fair game. you do not lie on purpose... sometimes you say things that proved not to be true. donald trump lies on purpose, we both know that. you can talk about very little things, the size of crowds and things like that, but there is evidence to show he

must know it cannot be true. evidently, voters have taken that with a grain of salt because they elected him. absolutely. i am saying that your politics, it is not about words like values, your conscience, it is about doing whatever is necessary to be that is a political culture you believe in which donald trump believes in as well and perhaps they are associated because you have known him for an awful long time. it is a political culture that every successful president in modern times has subscribed to. i do not think donald trump or i have done anything different than has been the norm. here is a quote for you, i know you know him, you may not respect him very much, but a writer who has looked at your career and donald trump's, he says in many ways, roger stone created donald trump isa ways, roger stone created donald trump is a politicalfigure, the donald trump candidacy was a roger

stone production. i am flattered, but i cannot take credit. it is true that i first thought of the idea of donald trump as a candidate for presidency back in 1988. i was drawn to him as a potential candidate because of his independence created by his wealth, independence in the sense he was not deeply committed or responsible for the policies of the past, he had no investment in m ista kes past, he had no investment in mistakes already made. and what i saw was a growing to duopoly in which the two parties working together had started an endless war without national inherent interest in clear, national debt, spending and borrowing with no end in sight cheating people going through the system and brought in people practical —— rorting people, trade

policies which sucked jobs out of america. and a stagnant economy of those who did not know how to run a business. i thought a person with enormous courage to change things. how disappointed, what kind of sense of betrayal, did you have, when when once the bandwagon started to roll in 2015, which you set in motion, you were thrown overboard. in 2015, which you set in motion, you were thrown overboardlj in 2015, which you set in motion, you were thrown overboard. i would argue with that interpretation. i resigned, and showed that resignation to the new york times the night before. if we take the words of donald trump at face value... no one breaks up with donald trump, he breaks up with you. there is no point in disparaging or disagreeing with him. i did more television interviews on his behalf after i left the campaign than before. i recall all of that, you

we re before. i recall all of that, you were a very familiar figure, offering your total loyalty and support to donald trump even though you left the official campaign. support to donald trump even though you left the official campaignlj support to donald trump even though you left the official campaign. i am a strategist. a campaign cannot have two strategists. there was no sense in my staying so i could fight about things which he turned out to be right about and i turned out to be wrong about. this is the first candidate for the presidency in my experience of 10 national presidential campaigns who never took a poll, who never spent any money on, you know, he'd network campaign advertising, analytics, focus groups. -- paid. are you still in contact? from time to time. do you give advice? occasionally. does he take it? sometimes. for example? i believe the president is entitled to discretion. if he asks you what you think would tell you what he thinks, you should have discretion.

ido thinks, you should have discretion. i do not discuss in detail what we talk about, which i have had as a policy since the beginning. i would never want to be of detriment to him. you talk about steve bannon, a person donald trump calls sloppy steve, for so long his chief strategist. a self appointed role. he was very important for the key months in which donald trump won the presidency. steve bannon was a key figure and entered the white house. general michael flynn, national security adviser, anthony scaramucci, sean spicer, reince priebus, katie walls, as well as key figures outside of the administration, james comey, the fbi director, recently andrew mccabe, fbi deputy director. all of these people, they are people who have

either been fired or quit in the first year of the donald trump white house. it looks like chaos. first year of the donald trump white house. it looks like chaoslj first year of the donald trump white house. it looks like chaos. ido first year of the donald trump white house. it looks like chaos. i do not agree with that. some did not serve the president well. steve bannon blew up the president himself and has only himself to blame. a man who lied about his meetings with the russians? no, his actions were legal. he lied to the fbi agent. we will get to something which hangs like a very dark shadow over the whole of the donald trump presidency, that is the special counsel investigation into allegations of collusion during the election campaign between the donald trump campaign and the russians to interfere with and directly influence that election. yes, a fairy tale, a falsehood, meaningful

co—ordination, conspiring, collusion with the russians, there has never been any evidence of it produced either by the house or the senate committee. you speak with such confidence. you could not possibly know. we would have read about it by now. there is an investigation. he has nothing. i guarantee it. we will wait and see. what about the indictments related to russia? he processed indictments. it was a process. . . processed indictments. it was a process... and manafort, on crimes not related to russia, but ukraine. paul manafort, a close friend of yours, facing serious charges. none related to russian collusion. look at the facts, at least 12 donald trump associates had contact during the campaign. contact with the

russians are not illegal, and it is not evidence... what the hillary clinton? summer, 2016, contacts to the kremlin. jared kushner, one of donald trump's sons, a meeting which trump himself oversaw. the meeting was illegal and produce nothing. why was illegal and produce nothing. why was he hillary clinton out of the country? what about 0bama? why would she be in the country for such a meeting? and what about the evidence of our season is? the meeting is a nothing burger. —— malfeasance.” have heard this phrase nothing burger before. it is an american expression. it comes down to what we

do and do not know. i am willing to go on record. he has nothing relating to russian collusion. i agree with the president. it is a witch—hunt. agree with the president. it is a witch-hunt. it could be about obstruction of justice. witch-hunt. it could be about obstruction ofjustice. now we are going back to the firing ofjames comey. first there was the recount that failed, the recount showed that donald trump one wisconsin and michigan by a larger margin than expected. then they wanted to brief the electoral college on russian collusion. it would have been the shortest briefing of all time. there was no evidence then, there is no evidence now. then there is this investigation. roger stone has had a lot of time and a lot —— robert mueller has had a lot of time and a lot of money. meetings do not equal

collusion. if so hillary clinton was colluding with the ukrainians. people in washington were looking very closely at your particular bit part. it did seem for a time as though more and more detail was coming out about hacked information that was garnered on the democratic party that you were getting a heads up party that you were getting a heads up from wikileaks about what was coming down the pipes. entirely false. everything i tweeted or road was because i was following the tweets of both wikileaks orjulian assange and following his interviews. you are pre-empting them. you seem to know thatjohn podesta was going to come into the firing line before it was issued in wikileaks. yes, because in january 2016i read all the panama papers information about business activities in russia. he did not need a heads up from wikileaks to know that would become an issue in the campaign. after the focus on manifold, the focus onjohn podesta

was going to happen. i did not say anywhere that wikilea ks was going to happen. i did not say anywhere that wikileaks would polish his e—mails, because they did not know. it is odd that the russians we re know. it is odd that the russians were hacking the democratic party darts ——. were hacking the democratic party darts --. when they say with a high degree of confidence it is our assessment, that meant they don't know. i don't agree with that. the same people told you lee harvey 0swald killed kennedy and he acted alone, and now we know, on the basis of recently released documents, is unlikely true. you can take your view of what is credible and i can ta ke view of what is credible and i can take mine. the fact is that the russians, according to every credible intelligence official in the united states, were hacking the democratic party, the information was being given to wikileaks... as former counterintelligence officials. and you appear to be ahead of the game knowing what is

coming up. you went to the ecuadorian embassy to try to see julian assange. what is that all about? we will take that one by one. as former top cut intelligence agents have said, there is more evidence that the dnc information was downloaded to a portable drive and taken out the back door. there really is no evidence it was hacked... you really don't trust your own government, do you? because they lie to us constantly. the nation magazine, hardly a right—wing organ, it was the organisation published that study. secondarily, julian assange himself has said roger stone has not tweeted anything i have the authority said in public either in an interview or re—tweet. i spent four hours in front of a house intelligence committee where i went voluntarily and, as i told them, andi went voluntarily and, as i told them, and i see now, i know of no one who conspired with the russians i have no prior knowledge of the hacking of the dnc, i am not even sure they were hacked. the reason i

went by the ecuadorian embassy, i did not ask for a meeting, that was incorrect, i dropped off a card. it is because i don't believejulian assange is a russian asset. i believe he is a journalist. i do not live wikileaks is a russian front, i believe it is a news organisation. a news organisation with a better reputation for accuracy than, say, the new york times and washington post. even as we speak, donald trump's warp with the top echelons of the fbi and, indeed, it seems with the justice of the fbi and, indeed, it seems with thejustice department is continuing. this is dangerous territory. it is not dangerous at all. the fbi and the cia would not like to release a memo that which showed they used a fabricated dossier as the justification for surveillance by the state on the republican candidate for president. i was than watergate. i guess you are giving me a very authentic view

into the can let that the collective mind of the so—called alt—right. into the can let that the collective mind of the so-called alt-right. not at all. you don't trust, one second, those put into the positions of highest authority in america's leading security and intelligence agencies. you believe the fbi, the cia, and they suppose the other intelligence agencies... they have been politicised. those agencies have been entirely politicised... because they don't do what you and donald trump wanted to do does not mean they are politicised. the fbi and the cia oppose the release of a memo that will demonstrate that they violated the war because they say it threatens national security. nonsensical. the thing is, you have a very strong set of opinions about what is happening. i come back to what is happening. i come back to what they opened with, you win your political career have always prided yourself in the power of disinformation. to quote ted cruz, a right—wing republican, you have spent your entire career lying.

because everything i have said today will be borne out to be true and you can come and re— interview me when that happens. that is how confident iam that happens. that is how confident i am that i am correct. your record suggests that you are, from time to time, inclined to use language which deepens and expands the fractures in american society. like hillary clinton sang bright —— black people should be brought to heel. like roger stone sweeting about the negroes, using the word beginning with robert mueller for women negroes, using the word beginning with robert muellerfor women he disagrees with. i did refer to someone as a negro. disagrees with. i did refer to someone as a negro.” disagrees with. i did refer to someone as a negro. i also issued an apology. but why did you do at? you know what it conjures up about segregation. actually, i don't think it is offensive. but because some black people i know do so i did apologise for that. as far as calling her a bitch, istand by that. a nasty, narrowminded. .. you

started this interview by worrying aloud about the polarisation of things today, and then use that language. your politics, your style of politics, it is corroding and corrupting american political culture today. i have done nothing in politics that is the norm. 0ur opponents have said things about us every bit as coarse as the things we may have said. i reject this idea that i have changed the culture.” was positing earlier that you may have influenced donald trump in some ways. when donald trump said what he set about immigrants who come from countries like haiti and he said that he wished more would come from norway rather than countries like haiti, when he reacted to the cha rlottesville haiti, when he reacted to the charlottesville display of power by neo—nazis by sangha will find people

involved, how did you respond to have what he said in those situations? the president denied saying that. no republican who was there recall since they met.” saying that. no republican who was there recall since they met. i think you will find that lindsey graham says the interpretation was right. i'm not going to criticise the present for saying what people think. the united nations human rights council described it as racist. the united nations, they have accomplished a great deal.” guess it is this commie he used it with me in united kingdom, you know there people around the world who have responded to think they have heard from donald trump and wonder where the united states is led by racist and that doesn't seem to worry you. what matters are deeds, not words. african american unemployment is at the lowest point in our history. they called richard nixon a racist. he gave us affirmative action. he desegregated the american public schools without violence or bloodshed. what matters

are deeds, not words. when you look at what is happening today in the united states and you consider donald trump as a man and as a president, how do you think this presidency is going to pan out? president, how do you think this presidency is going to pan ounm depends on whether he make america great again. our economy is booming. in the state of the union address he talked about restoring our cities, detroit, i would like to see him do that. i would like to see him follow through on the place to get us out of afghanistan and syria. i am disappointed that the generals have talked him into continuing or increasing our presence in those places. he ran as an enter individualist in the campaign. but one year does not a presidency make. “ ran one year does not a presidency make. —— ran as an anti— interventionist. given the intractable opposition of the 2—party elites. given the intractable opposition of the 2-party elites. roger stone, we have two and there. thank you very much for being on hardtalk. very happy to be here. -- to end there. well, it's remaining cold

for much of this week. there is some snow in the forecast. that's going to be causing maybe a few problems on the roads to start tuesday. it is going to be a very cold, frosty one elsewhere. but a good deal of sunshine around too. this is the weather front bringing the sleet and snow to scotland and northern ireland over the course of the night. by tuesday morning, it will be lying across northern england and wales. maybe some rain to lower levels. sleet and snow to the high ground with plenty of showers behind it. skies will be brightening up gradually through the morning across scotland and northern ireland. these are snow showers, also some hail showers, adding to accumulations of snow across scotland and northern ireland. a very cold start. you can see the blue hue. temperatures, sub—zero for many, even by sam.

that weather front lying across northern england, into parts of wales, the north—west midlands, some sleet and snow could cause some problems. further east, a cold and frosty but largely dry start with some sunshine. certainly scraping those cars first thing before heading out. looks like that band of rain, sleet, and snow, will gradually fizzle out as it reaches the midlands. ahead of it, continuing to be sunshine for east anglia and the south—east. and further north and west, apart from a few wintry showers, sunshine but it will be cold. the weather front may invigorate again and take some snow to east anglia before it clears out. behind it, widespread clear skies. and a very cold night to come tuesday night and wednesday morning, probably the coldest night of the week. temperatures well below freezing out of town. it does mean a ridge of high pressure should bring spells of sunshine on wednesday. that's before this weather system brings strong wind and cloud and rain to the north and the west of the uk. with it, slightly milder air, but it will be brief, cold air will make a return by the end of the week and into the weekend. a very cold and frosty start across the board on wednesday. plenty of crisp, winter sunshine for england and wales.

scotland and northern ireland, cloudy with outbreaks of rain. mainly of rain, with some sleet and snow to the hills. the air starting to get milder. into thursday, slightly less cold air. temperatures, 6—9—10 degrees. cloudy day with outbreaks of rain and quite breezy. by friday, a ridge of high pressure builds in. plenty of winter sunshine but that colder air begins to move in from the west. this is the briefing. i'm sally bundock. our top story: looking for the bottom. share markets across asia tumble following the us market meltdown. the dow suffers its worst day since the financial crisis in 2008. will it spread to europe? going too far too fast. i'll be speaking to our correspondents in new york and singapore for the latest. and we'll be getting an expert view from a seasoned market watcher. in other news: crisis in the maldives as police arrest two seniorjudges and a former president after a 15—day state of emergency is declared and the eu's chief brexit negotiator tells

britain that trade barriers will be "unavoidable" if the uk leaves the customs union.