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tv   HAR Dtalk  BBC News  April 23, 2018 12:30am-1:00am BST

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hello, i'm kasia madera with bbc world news. our top story: as the french president emmanuel macron prepares for a state visit to the us, he's called on donald trump not to pull out of the iran nuclear deal. speaking to fox news, mr macron accepted the agreement wasn't perfect, but that he couldn't see a better option. president trump has consistently threatened to scrap the 2015 deal. at least 57 people are known to have been killed in a suicide bomb attack outside a voter registration centre in the afghan capital, kabul. so—called islamic state says it was behind the bombing. and this story is trending on bbc.com. a menu from the first meal ever served aboard the titanic has sold for $140,000 at an auction in the uk. the lunch was served to officers on the first day of sea trials in 1912. that's all from me. stay with bbc world news. it's now time for hardtalk. to the hardtalk with me it, zeinab
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badawi. my guest in this exclusive interview has been attending the commonwealth heads of government summit here in london. it is president adama barrow the gambia. he came to office late last year after defeating the incumbent, yahya jammeh, who had ruled the gambia with an iron fist for more than 20 yea rs. with an iron fist for more than 20 years. president adama barrow found a bankrupt nation scarred by years of living underfear a bankrupt nation scarred by years of living under fear and intimidation. things have improved but not fast enough. ken president barrow to live for his people? —— deliver. president adama barrow, welcomed the
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hardtalk. thank you. you're new to politics, it came in straight at the top as president. people's expectations are extremely high the yea rs of expectations are extremely high the years of the intimidation. can you meet their expectations? is a very interesting question. people's expectations are very, very high after a long time of 23 years of dictatorship. but it was important for the gambian people, psychologically, we all thought that we cannot make the change. as in, that was a big success for the country. and we are really focused to make it so, to make a difference for that country. it was difficult
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but we have to progress. you were the candidate for a united opposition, he won the presidential elections in 2016. president yahya jammeh first accepted the result and then he said no, he wanted to remain in power. you had to go to neighbouring senegal, you were inaugurated as president there, then he finally went into x i won't equatorial guinea. however, the fact remains that around 40% of people voted for him. you have to win over those a0%. voted for him. you have to win over those 40%. that is voted for him. you have to win over those 4096. that is right. that is why we have the focus on reconciliation because as president, thatis reconciliation because as president, that is part of your responsibility. and the gambian people are very important here, it cannot succeed as a president without the gambian people. you are the president for
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everybody, that is why it is important and we have been working on that to make some really good laws, so that the gambian people renew their confidence and we opened a window for everybody. but you know the party that supported yahya jammeh, if you speak to party members, they complain that the democratic space has been crowded, they have been crowded out from it will stop they complained about clashes between them and supporters of your party. we saw one very recently following local elections, police using teargas and so on. they talk about a climate of fear for themselves because they are seen as macro to supporters.” themselves because they are seen as macro to supporters. i think that is ya hya macro to supporters. i think that is yahya jammeh's macro to supporters. i think that is ya hya jammeh's legacy. macro to supporters. i think that is yahya jammeh's legacy. they thought
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that yahya yahya jammeh's legacy. they thought that ya hya jammeh's yahya jammeh's legacy. they thought that yahya jammeh's rule would never finish, he took them by surprise and 110w finish, he took them by surprise and now they are in the opposition. but because of those few problems here and there, we now have given orders to the security force that any political party that is conducting a campaign or whatever should be given security. that is really happening, is that? just give you one example, a supporter of former president ya hya a supporter of former president yahya jammeh from one of the areas that he has a lot of support, she fears reprisals. she says they cannot leave my village because of my political affiliation. we are seeing the divisions in the gambia and you must be very, very keen to ensure that they do not get out of hand? these are minor incidents. if you look at the cycle, the national assembly elections, a lot of
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candidates contested elections. but at the local elections that have just taken place. most of the elections, if you look at the candidates who took part, it is a record in that country, it is because of the climate, it is because of the climate, it is because of the environment and we created the environment. people feel free and people feel safe. your justice minister has said we are dealing with a very fragile political situation. yes, fragile situation because 22 of dictatorship, the system was... a lot of bad laws, dictators support them and for 22 years, that makes it very, very fragile but we have a responsibility here. but as of now, i think we are progressing in those
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areas. there are reports that two of ya hya areas. there are reports that two of yahya jammeh's right—hand man slipped into the gambia from the board of senegal and that they had been arrested and detained. what has happened to them? they came to the airport on notice. this was a security notice, but as they tell you it is a learning process for us, it will take us time. but they were arrested, in a sense that they arrived without permission from burundi. that is a crime, that is why they were arrested. and are they going to be charged, because i mean you cannot detain somebody... they already charged, they are going to court. the court martial, the process is on. the process is a legal process, whereby the media and
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everybody probably needs to be part of it to ensure the process is free and fair. there are also reports that the former yahya jammeh death squads are also slipping into the country. that must be something that is worrying you? really, i must say iam is worrying you? really, i must say i am worried but i am concerned. —— i would not say that i am. you are concerned? i am concerned but it also is a learning process for us. so what are you exactly concerned about, with reports of these death squads and you have any of what number we squads and you have any of what numberwe are squads and you have any of what number we are talking about? those people, they cannot slip into the country without being noticed and if they are not noticed, it is
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some kind of security threat. the challenges in your country, another example you just talked about is that security could be compromised, reliable reports say that 80% of the army may still have some kind of loyalty to the former president, ya hya loyalty to the former president, yahya jammeh. that is an utter exaggeration, do think so. but a good number. a good number but i think that trend is changing. so you cannot trust your own army?|j think that trend is changing. so you cannot trust your own army? i do trust my army but as i said, it is a process and we are... a process of educating our army, building their capacity, so that they will be professional, so that they know what is their role as far as democracy is concerned. we want is not the quantity, quality. the quantity is
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not the most important thing at quality and in this, we are building the economy for the military. and i wa nt the economy for the military. and i want them also to be accommodated, so want them also to be accommodated, so that they feel they are defence force, not as police. a lot of people that you talk to both in the gambia and also in the day as per feel that there may be signs of tribalism in the gambia. the former president yahya jammeh of course threatened to bury the majority tribe in the gambia nine feet deep, and that is another layer which is making people very, very restless that perhaps they are seeing your government is trying to perhaps push the majority over and above the other group and that is going to cause trouble. we feel that the
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gambian people are the same. the president can come and go but the gambia remains, and we feel that gambia remains, and we feel that gambia is not complete without or. everybody should be part of the new gambia. i will give you an example of what one person is said for instance, from the campaign for human rights gambia uk, he warns against democratic backsliding, is how he puts it. these are just opinions and they have a right to their opinion, but i think the gambia is on the right track as far as democracy is concerned. and our democratic process is unprecedented. so you have set up a truth and reconciliation commission, for example, to look at the excesses of the yahya jammeh years. we saw
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dozens and dozens of people who had disappeared, murdered, people who lost their livelihoods and so on. you have got to make sure that you bring justice to the people who needed without creating an atmosphere of a witch—hunt against those who once supported or still support the ya hya those who once supported or still support the yahya jammeh party. that is why we are following a process, thatis is why we are following a process, that is why we set up a commission of enquiry, the commission of enquiries will make certain of getting the facts together and make a recommendation to the president and that is the time will decide what to do next, but we have a responsibility here and that is what our responsibility is, we want to follow due process to make short every gambian is giving his views. you like to see former president ya hya you like to see former president yahya jammeh turnup for the international criminal court after
quote
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the former justice international criminal court after the formerjustice minister international criminal court after the former justice minister was prosecuted herself. have you spoken to her, for instance? the result of those enquiries will determine what will be our next act, but the is we wa nt to will be our next act, but the is we want to follow the process. anyone who has committed a crime will face the full force of the law. have you asked equatorial guinea for yahya jammeh's extradition? we have not made any request as of now, we still waiting to get the together. you have said that you want to make the gambia beacon for human rights and the whole of africa. when you came to power about 15 months ago, you release all political prisoners, you said yahya jammeh was wrong, the gambia should not have left the icc, we wa nt gambia should not have left the icc, we want to go back in there. by and large, you have been applauded for your efforts but there are some alarms that are being sounded about what is happening in the gambia, and
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i want to give you one example of that. a doctor, a lecturer in politics at the university of the gambia, injanuary he was arrested by the police and he does not know why. he is detained, he is now being freed and it was all because he wrote some in the gambian press which was not to your government's liking. i was expecting this question. it is not a surprise. yes. 0ne question. it is not a surprise. yes. one thing question. it is not a surprise. yes. 0ne thingi question. it is not a surprise. yes. one thing i want to make clear he... the doctor and everyone in the gambia are all equal in front of the law. the police are there to do theirjob. if they law. the police are there to do their job. if they feel anybody should be questions by them, i think it is and it is within their mandate, under gambian laws, you can
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question anybody within 72 hours. and the doctor was called for questioning. he wrote something in the newspapers that was he said you lacked focus, he said that the west african security force, which is partly protecting you and is there because you can't trust your own army. he said these forces will not prevent long—term security risks if the president does not win the trust of the army. doesn't sound like a police matter, that sounds like something your government, you perhaps, did not like? the police feel they should question him and get more information about the issues he is talking about. i think it was written in the mandate of the police. were they acting on your orders? they were not acting on anybody‘s orders, i would never
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ordered the police to arrest anybody. there are a lot of people who criticise me, i have never ordered anybody. he says he is baffled as to why he was arrested. asi baffled as to why he was arrested. as i said, in this country we believe in the principle of the rule of law. if you think the policies are wrong in what we are doing, i think we are better him to take the police per course. the media has condemned, saying that we wish to remind the president that the immense contrition of the media and the activists, in ensuring the end of 22 years of dictatorship, we urge the president to ensure that freedom of expression is promoted and fulfilled. everybody contributed towards this. everybody contributed. i was part of that. and not only are
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contributed into the 2016 elections, but i was making this change. there is nobody associated that with more than me. i believe in those principles, it is based on those principles, it is based on those principles that i was elected in office, would compromise the rule of law. said the government is going to make the laws would, compatible with the commonwealth, another issue concerning people's is the issues of lg bt people, you have a very tough law in the gambia, up to 14 years punishment, if found guilty of engaging in gay sex. is this something you will reform? the most important thing here it was a very
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easy decision for me and my government to be admitted to the commonwealth for a simple reason, this institution advocates for good governance. it advocates for the rule of law and respect for human rights. that is why it was easy for us rights. that is why it was easy for us tojoin. and now, we have a process. we want a complete overhaul to make sure that we have good laws, that we accommodate everybody. how soon that we accommodate everybody. how soon can that we accommodate everybody. how soon can gambians see a new constitution? our target is 18 months to two years. will come up with a document as it everybody. those other political challenges but
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you also have immense economical challenges. you said your government ‘stop priority is used unemployment. about 65% of population is under 30, youth unemployment is more than 40%. you have to provide some kind ofjobs, some kind of future for these very frustrated youth. what are you going to do for them? or countries that has succeeded in this area is that they these principles. we want to continue with that. because of the democratic process in those countries, there are a lot of people who have confidence in their country and want to invest in those countries. a lot of countries have this in their countries and that will help injob creation. if their countries and that will help in job creation. if you their countries and that will help injob creation. if you look their countries and that will help in job creation. if you look at the tourism industry... the tourism industry. 2596 of our gdp, in a year
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we will have increased employment. see what to boost tourism as a way for creating jobs? -- so you want. if you look at the numbers we are getting, our target is up to $1 million a year. you got to do this very quickly because per capita, gambia, a small population of 2 million, provides more irregular migrants to europe than any other country. they risk their lives because they feel they have no future in their country. it has dropped drastically now. people are starting to believe the system, that is helping in that area, they have
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lost confidence because of the dictators of everything. now change has happened and that trend is changing. i think this is very good. you are in a dire state. when you came to power usage we inherited an economy that was virtually empty, debt accounts for about 120% of your gdp. every household in gambia owes about $4500, you have no money to do any of these things. the frustration is just any of these things. the frustration isjust going to any of these things. the frustration is just going to build any of these things. the frustration isjust going to build and build. yes, that is why we are able to work very ha rd to yes, that is why we are able to work very hard to take a solution. we have started creating jobs. if —— inflation has gone down, banks are lending now. we are progressing. you have got a national development plan to run through to 2021, but people are saying what kind of plan have
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you got? the standard asks about agriculture, mr president, our government buying farm is peanuts without outside help is not any plan to revitalise our apicultu re. without outside help is not any plan to revitalise our apiculture. —— agriculture. nearly three quarters of your population depends upon agriculture, there is a investment, no fertiliser seeds, you have no plan. after 22 years of dictatorship, things cannot happen overnight. there is a process. we believe it is a challenge and we have two recognise, we are contacting a lot of companies. some chinese technical people are coming into the government as we need knowledge and money to improve the agricultural sector. when you pursue your plans and so on, there is also a danger that you want to build so quickly that things get out of hand andi quickly that things get out of hand and i look at tourism and your
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pension how tourism is booming now in the gambia, but one terrible side—effect of the tourism business in the gambia is exploitation, sexual explication of children by tourists coming into the country. in your country there are posters saying zero tolerance of child sexual exportation, but you do it goes on. vista president, you have to make every effort to ensure that your children are protected. we are doing a lot of efforts and in doing this effort we have to enlighten our people. we have to educate our people. we have to educate our people. the security, the tourism sector, the security is different. the people who we are partnering with in the tourism sector are part of these reforms to make sure we have good choice in this country and also... and protect your children? of course. when you came to office it was understood you are only going
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to serve three years of your term in a memorandum of understanding, are you going to stay in power for five yea rs you going to stay in power for five years and would you contest the next election is? briefly and finally. as you say, we came together for an agreement. three years. the mandate is five years, people voted for five yea rs. is five years, people voted for five years. so you will stay in power for five years? this was the gambian people ‘s decisions. legally, i have a mandate of five years. so having been a businessman, newt politics and coming in at the top, you like where you are and want to stay and you will run for another term in 2021? is not the best job. i am giving it response politically because people trusted me. is not the period you will stay in power,
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or what you do for your people is important. i legacy is more important. i legacy is more important. it is ultimately the government ‘s responsibility. president adama barrow of the gambia, thank you indeed for coming on hardtalk. it is a great pleasure. you are most welcome. good morning. yesterday was the last time we will see anywhere in the uk get above 20 degrees in the week ahead. the kink in the jetstream to the north helped to drag in that unusual warmth through last week is now away and further week ahead we will see it piling up on the atlantic and move to the south of the uk, putting us on the colder side. what does that mean? back to more typical weather for the time being, nothing untoward, nice enough when the sun is out, it has strength but it does mean we will see cooler conditions
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especially when the rains are around. cooler conditions to start your monday morning commute, temperatures into single figures uk—wide, compensated with some sunshine in the south and east of the uk. a bit more cloud and overnight showers continuing. some of those will fade, but cloud amounts increasing from the west, sunny spells to the east, turning grey. northern ireland, occasional rain spreading into western scotland, the isle of man and western parts of wales too. like sunday, temperatures around 10—14 degrees. further east than what we are seeing but 15—18 celsius still pleasant enough for late april. sunshine quickly dissipates during the evening as cloud increases from the west, occasional rain spreading across most parts of the uk, linked in to this weather system, the bulk of which would have gotten out of the way on tuesday, but leaving a trailing front of the north of scotland and across southern counties. these are the two zones, start the day on tuesday cloudy, bright for northern ireland and england, showers developing through the day but while we will see a few breaks in the cloud and the south later on,
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it rethickens and turns grey, misty and damp. wales and southwest england in particular. your temperatures for tuesday, roughly around the teens. could see 17 degrees, cloud breaks towards the south—east corner but even that milder air will be pushed out on tuesday night, the weather front bringing rain for some, that edges out the rain into wednesday and puts us into north—westerly winds. wednesday, a typical april showers day, most starting with sunshine, showers in the west, but developing more widely with hail and thunder, gusty wind as well and as the showers come through, getting rather cool. temperatures much lower, especially in the east, 11—15 degrees your high. wednesday into the north—westerly, they will dominate. low pressure to the north of us, a showery airflow. cool by day and a mixture of sunshine and showers, showers and to the north, turning rather chilly by night too. take care. i'm babita sharma in singapore.
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the headlines: as he prepares to visit the us, president macron issues a plea to donald trump — don't pull out of the iran nuclear deal. let's preserve the framework because it's better than the sort of north korean type of situation. grief and rage in the afghan capital, kabul, as a suicide bombing kills at least 57 people. i'm kasia madera in london. also in the programme: we talk trade, equal rights and motherhood with new zealand's prime minister, jacinda ardern. and lucky to be alive. we meet the man who has survived snake, bear, and now shark attacks.
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