Skip to main content

tv   Newsnight  BBC News  May 25, 2018 11:15pm-11:46pm BST

11:15 pm
scene has new scene has now been the scene has now been decontaminated and it is safe for the public. that's a summary of the news, now it's time for newsnight with evan davis. caught up in red lines. is theresa may's brexit in trouble? stuck in a tangle of inconsistent objectives it's seemingly impossible to escape. is this a case of eu entrapment? over the course of a week, there has been a marked shift in mood on brexit. it seems we might be asking for a second transition phase with no plan for where it goes after that. we'll ask a prominent brexiteer whether the dream of a clean break with brussels has now been all but abandoned? also tonight, harvey weinstein on trial. and now, it's not the court of public opinion. this defendant used his position, money and power to lure young women into situations where he was able to violate them sexually. we talk to one of
11:16 pm
weinstein‘s many accusers. and a top lawyer who represents some of the others. and after a week of harrowing testimony at the grenfell inquiry, we ask what effect it has on the bereaved to take part in such emotional proceedings. hello there. one of the problems with reporting on brexit is that it is a process, not an event. it shuffles along, but on any given day there is a case for ignoring it. however, when you stand back and look at what has cumulatively happened over the last week or two, it seems something is up. in fact, it's been slow—motion extraordinary. suddenly, some brexiteers have been asking whether their brexit dream is unravelling. certainly, the government's vision — one tied together by red lines that require us to be out of the single market and the customs union,
11:17 pm
is now in peril. and more significantly, this week may have given us the clearest idea yet as to what actual brexit will look like, as opposed to the government's desired one. it's all come down to our old friend, the irish border. having now explored the solutions as to how you can have brexit, with its requirement for a border without actually having a border, this week the government appears to have decided the best policy is simply to defer a decision. but, that has a knock on. it means we enter the world of the backstop — the agreement we reached in december as the fail—safe solution in the event that nothing else worked for ireland. the famous backstop was agreed back then after some fraught negotiations involving theresa may. she was a tough, smart, polite and friendly negotiator. we have had a meeting with the group of the european parliamentarians being involved in this, and so we were able to conclude that sufficient progress has been made. it was a breakthrough,
11:18 pm
but only with the help of some constructive ambiguity. for the eu, the backstop eradicated the irish border by putting northern ireland into a softish brexit, in a customs union with the eu and aligning its product regulations with those of the single market. britain could have a hard brexit, but with some border in the irish sea. the british version said no to all that because there could be no border in the irish sea. instead, come the worst, the whole of the uk would be in a customs union. the government now seems ready to accept this softish brexit backstop for at least several years beyond the transition period. this is why some brexiteers are getting nervous. here's jacob rees—mogg in a podcast this week. you've got to judge people ultimately by their actions rather than their words. fine words are well known
11:19 pm
for not buttering parsnips, and we are not getting our parsnips buttered at the moment. have you lost faith in the prime minister? that would be a harsh way of putting it. but not an inexact way of putting it? no, i'm not going that far. but i have doubts. i have doubts, that what she says is still fine and what she does is not delivering on what she says, and that inevitably raises concerns and she needs to bring the two together, and thejune summit will be an opportunity for her to do that. and the man who ran the vote leave campaign, dominic cummings, wrote yesterday that the government's strategy had imploded. it now thinks its survival requires surrender. this version of a softish brexit is no certainty. the uk hasn't asked for it, and, more importantly, the eu has always said it won't offer it, but there is an increasingly widespread view that it's the only outcome left.
11:20 pm
i am nowjoined by dan hannan. he was a leading campaigner for vote leave during the eu referendum and is currently a conservative member of the european parliament. joining us from amsterdam. good evening. do you agree with dominic cummings, who ran the leave campaign that the whole process is a shambles? good evening. look, i haven't got direct sight of the documents, so i can only go from what the reports are saying. but i think there is still an outcome that allows us to have a phased, gradual withdrawal, and recovery of power, which of course will leave us with some of the existing arrangements intact. i don't know anyone who is against having a close relationship with the eu. i don't buy the way you set this site up as people who want a clean break for the sake of it. i think all supporters of brexit wants to have close and mutually agreeable arrangements. asking about the backstop, the current default plan seems
11:21 pm
to be, although there is nothing official, that the british will request that we effectively stay in this backstop, with the whole uk in a customs union, aligning product regulation, way beyond the transition period we have all agreed. do you think that is likely, and do you think that is acceptable? i don't think it's acceptable. this has been my worry from the beginning, that we would end up in a situation that is worse than either remaining all leaving. staying in the customs union, and giving brussels total control over our trade with zero input into that trade is worse than staying or leaving. we would have done much better to grab a sort of efta transition. then we would have our customs and fisheries... just to push you, it's not acceptable, do you think it is now likely, or at least likely for a period of some years? i can't answer that because i am
11:22 pm
not in the negotiation. the basic problem here is not that no other brexit is available or that the prime minister is going back on what she said, or anything like that. parliament has never fundamentally accepted the verdict, and in both chambers, or certainly in one chamber, possibly the other, there are people who will deliberately go for deliberately silly options because they don't want to go for the outcome and they want to reverse it, and that's a real challenge. i think the reason we are entangled in it at the moment is because we don't have a solution to the irish border problem and it looks like the eu is making some unpleasant offers and parliament is saying we will not go for no deal, we have to have some deal. what is being offered does not solve the irish border. turkey, in a customs union, has an extremely closed border with the eu. switzerland isn't but has a much more open border. switzerland is a better
11:23 pm
place to start. it's bogus to pretend it's about the irish border. what it's really about is about a majority in parliament trying to subvert the result. we have not had a significant vote against yet. we have not had votes for customs unions or anything like that in parliament. and in brussels they know they are negotiating with parliament and notjust the government, and that's a weak position to be negotiating from. isn't the real truth of this, it is a shambles because the conservative party hasn't decided what it wants to get from brexit. it could, with the dup, have a majority in the house of commons if it could agree on something. it isn't agreed. when you think about the referendum, it was about five years ago that the conservative party declared it would have a referendum, and here we are, less than one year to brexit, and you still haven't decided what the heck we are going to do.
11:24 pm
if that isn't a shambles, i don't know what is. again, i don't think that is fair. the prime minister set out very early, first in the lancaster house speech, and then in florence, the basis of the deal she wanted. the problem hasn't been that she couldn't make her mind up, or that it was unavailable, because similar things are available in other nearby countries. the problem has been that as long as british remainers are doing the eu's work for it and threatening to keep us in this sort of subservient status where we have all the obligations of membership but no vote and no voice, why does brussels have any incentive to negotiate? you can't blame the remainers for screwing it up. the irish border is the thing where theresa may is struggling. you admit a transition where we are in a customs union is worse than remaining in. why do we have a transition period, followed potentially by a second transition period? in your view, wouldn't it be much better to stop brexit now, or delay it, stop the article 50 process, while the conservative party goes away and works at what it will do, and when you have decided, come back, and reignite the process
11:25 pm
and get it going again. but we will be stuck in the limbo that you say is worse than leaving or remaining, and we will be stuck there quite unnecessarily, when we could be in the eu for another three years instead. the problem is not that the conservative party couldn't make up its mind. the problem would still remain that there is no majority in parliament for delivering a sensible brexit. i think ultimately the way to break the logjam is through another election. interesting last point, but we have to leave it there. thank you, dan hannon. some highly charged scenes in new york today. moments we all expected to come, but which were nevertheless a thing to see. the once—powerful harvey weinstein turning himself into the police and then later handcuffed and walked by a policewoman to a car, a police station, and then court. he's charged with raping one woman and forcing another woman to perform oral sex.
11:26 pm
he is pleading not guilty, has been given bailfor a million dollars, and will be tagged. the scene of the perp walk, with the press fighting for a good photo, invited obvious comparison to the red carpets he's strolled up so many times. his lawyer told the press his client was innocent. mr weinstein has always maintained that any sexual activity he engaged in was consensual. he has vehemently denied any of the allegations which suggest that he engaged in non—consensual sexual activity. mr weinstein did not invent the casting couch in hollywood, and to the extent that there is bad behaviour in that industry — that is not what this is about. bad behaviour is not on trial in this case. it's only if you intentionally committed a criminal act and mr weinstein vigorously denies that. let's speak now to gloria allred, a lawyer representing some of mr weinstein‘s accusers,
11:27 pm
who's in los angeles, and the actor katherine kendall, who was one of the first women to claim publicly that mr weinstein sexually harassed her. she is in washington dc. what did you feel when you saw him in handcuffs today, katherine? i felt really emotional. i feel emotional talking about it now. it was a stunning thing to see. i just feel very grateful to all those people who have worked so hard to make this day happen. what did you think of his appearance, his demeanour? i wonder if you thought he had studied how he would look today with the blue sweater and the books under his arm. i wonder whether he was looking to look harmless somehow in how he came across. it wouldn't surprise me at all. my instinct is to say he probably did study that and put that together very meticulously. nothing undesigned about it.
11:28 pm
gloria allred, we have two cases here. can you explain how this will pan out? i think it's about 80 women who have gone public with accusations of one kind or another. what is going to happen? i believe it is a deal 90 women who have gone public. right now the two felony charges pending against him, on which he was arraigned this morning, rian relation to two victims. —— are in relation. however, 80 or 90 have spoken out. it could be that at the trial, other accusers whom the prosecution have asked to testify, who would also be able to testify to same or similar
11:29 pm
types of behaviour, that they would testify harvey weinstein engaged in as to them. and that is what happened in the criminal case involving bill cosby. five what we call prior bad act witnesses were permitted to testify. i represented three of the five accusers who were so three of the five accusers who were so permitted. there was a scorched earth type of defence where there was an attempt to smear them and discredit them by the defence, it didn't work, the jury convicted bill cosby and something very similar may occui’ cosby and something very similar may occur in reference to harvey weinstein as well. would you welcome the chance to testify in court, many women find that a very difficult experience to go to court and face up to someone
11:30 pm
who they are accusing... i'm sure it isa who they are accusing... i'm sure it is a terrifying experience, i can't say i would welcome it, because it sounds scary but it is also something i would be completely willing to do if need be. does it feel important... i am happy to co—operate. does it feel important that as much as what he is alleged to have done should be put on the public record, should be put out there that women should try and testify so that the record is there, it has been in the public domain and it has been in the public domain and it stands? i don't know about that, i would ask gloria what she thinks about that, because it can be traumatic for some women, and so many women here have spoken out and it may not need everyone to put themselves online. —— on the line. i don't... i'm not mad at anybody who doesn't want to. gloria, the purpose
11:31 pm
of the trial is obviously for weinstein to face a reckoning for anything he has done, but the on that, do you want to see more trials? there is a case in california, he may face trial in california, he may face trial in london, and if —— is there a purpose to more trials if weinstein is locked up for 30 years or 25 years in new york? there are criminal investigation is ongoing in los angeles apparently today it has been reported today that the los angeles police department referred three cases to the district attorney, we don't know whether the district attorney will proceed to file charges as to those three referrals from the police department. and our ongoing police investigation is in london, in beverly hills, and the grandjury london, in beverly hills, and the grand jury may be hearing from more at users in new york as well. so it is possible there could be more
11:32 pm
charges there. we don't know. what is important is that ross accuses —— ross accuses ascertain whether they believe they have proven guilty beyond reasonable doubt, which is a very high bar, and that is not easy —— prosecutors. and i don't think it is acceptable for every accuser to testify, nor would the court permitted. accuses need to be ready for vigorous cross—examination, and thatis for vigorous cross—examination, and that is not as easy as just telling what you say is your truth about what you say is your truth about what happened. it is going to be a challenge. just a quick last one, a lot of people look at this and say, we have been talking about this for so we have been talking about this for so long and it is so much, the chance of a fair trial is coming to be really —— be very low, isn't it? i think it is going to be very high with all due respect. mr weinstein has highly paid them a very
11:33 pm
experienced defence attorneys. they will challenge the prosecution at every moment that they can. so he will get a fair trial. my question is that will the person is alleged to be victims and will the prosecution be given a fair trial. we do know that yet. thank you talking to us tonight. before we move on, and bit of news coming in from the irish abortion referendum. the polls close at ten but the irish times have conducted a poll suggesting that the yes campaign in favour of repealing the ban on abortion has won by 68% to 32%. i think that is a bigger margin than anyone was thinking. that is just a poll and it is very difficult to conduct exit polls in referendums. you have nothing to benchmark against, so it is not out of the question that it is wrong or wrong. we will get the actual result
11:34 pm
tomorrow, but it is an early result that change could be coming in ireland. it has been another day of emotional testimony at the grand fellow enquiry. —— granville enquiry. making these particular you sad proceedings. in a few minutes we will have a look at the impact on those who have been giving evidence, but we have so far given particular attention to those on the 21st floor of the tower. some of those on the zist of the tower. some of those on the 2ist floor were among those speaking at the enquiry today. here is a selection of today's misses. at the enquiry today. here is a selection of today's misseslj at the enquiry today. here is a selection of today's misses. i often visited my cousin mehti and he would play a landing with his neighbours. the 21st floor was so much more fun and child friendly than the ninth floor. where i lived. i take comfort in knowing that my cousin mehdi's neighbours, who will soon be my
11:35 pm
neighbours, who will soon be my neighbours when we move into a new home, but it is difficult knowing that mehdi will never be able to play with us ever again.|j that mehdi will never be able to play with us ever again. i am her husband. well, i play with us ever again. i am her husband. well, lam play with us ever again. i am her husband. well, i am going to leave this for... for my friend to explain everything. the smile doesn't leave her face. she is everything. the smile doesn't leave herface. she is such everything. the smile doesn't leave her face. she is such a person of making jokes and laughing and making you feel so comfortable, for me it isa you feel so comfortable, for me it is a unique person. i lost part of me. steve power was my first love,
11:36 pm
and the father of my first son. my heart, my soul. we only buried steve week before christmas are so last year is raw and it is still very raw. we would like you to hear some words from a song that remind us of steve power, it is a beautiful song, and it reminds us may be of steve and it reminds us may be of steve and maybe even his last moments. "when my skin grows old, when my breath runs cold i will be thinking about you. when i run out of air to breathe, it is your ghost i see. i will be thinking about you. when i reached out for your hand when the walls came caving in, well, i will see you in the other side and we can try out all over again." he grew up elaborate growth and live there for the majority of his life. he had lived in grenfell tower for 32 yea rs. lived in grenfell tower for 32 years. in that time he had seen and been a part of many changes to the
11:37 pm
area. i spoke to him about moving out once, and he said "why would i wa nt to out once, and he said "why would i want to leave this view, i want to leave my penthouse? was quote some of the news reports state that my dad did not on to leave because of his dogs, but this is not true. like eve ryo ne his dogs, but this is not true. like everyone else, we were told to remain in our homes by authorities. so we did. it was not a peaceful night, there was panic and drama, he did not die peacefully in his sleep. in his last moments, i don't know what he was feeling, i don't know if he was scared, waiting for someone, or simply waiting to die. the dog stayed wrapped around him right to the end. he needsjustice, all the victims do. is upsetting to listen to this testimony to how hard it must be to deliver it. not all of those related to the ins of the fire toast to
11:38 pm
speak in person, but how helpful or harmful is it to make a public recollection of someone who has been killed in the most tragic way, does it heal or make it more painful? i am joined by professor simon westley, and louise brooks his brother was killed in the hillsborough disaster who joins us from birmingham. simon, first, do you think those people will look back on that testimony as an experienced a value in future?” think they will. they have chosen to do this, obviously it is going to be moving and tearful, but i think we can be oversensitive almost to this, this is more cathartic, this is not a cross examination, it is a shame it has come after your previous clip actually, but this is about paying tribute, giving a portrait of the people that they have lost, and reading the accounts in today's press and throughout, i think the word cathartic rather than traumatic is probably closer to that. but this
11:39 pm
has been a terrible tragedy, it is in fact the largest ever mental health intervention we have ever donein health intervention we have ever done in the nhs. and in terms of the timing, we are almost a year from the fire, is at the right point... that is a good point. we know that if you get people to relive harrowing experiences too early, in the first hours or days, not only does that not do any good, it actually does harm. talking about things now, if now it did harm, we are would be out of a job. because thatis are would be out of a job. because that is what we try and do, get people to talk about it. louise, hillsboro has been the most elongated public tragedy, and i wonder whether you have found talking about andrew cathartic?l bit of both really. with the pen portrait which i wrote, i do feel
11:40 pm
that the world got to know a bit about andrew, especially as andrew was completely opposite to me, and people have got to know andrew by myself, and i am different personality to andrew, and there was very quiet and reserved. and the only regret i have got was that i feel that i did not put everything in theirthatl feel that i did not put everything in their that i would have liked, but we were on time restriction. you can't put it all in... yeah. i do feel that maybe i could have put more in, but... do you regret the number of times you have had to retail this experience, because in a way, because telstra has been so elongated you have been interviewed so many times, haven't you? ash back
11:41 pm
hillsborough. i don't know what the right word would be to use really, but i don't feel it is a negative to speak about andrew at all. and in fa ct speak about andrew at all. and in fact it does bring back a lot of happy memories, when you remember what his favourite food was, his clothes come and music for instance. in one way, it kind of keeps them alive, i don't know if that makes sense. that makes complete sense. simon, can people over speak, over do well, they are obviously never going to let these things go —— well. but if you are asked to repeatedly, does that come to define you? that does become an issue or will become an issue at some stage,
11:42 pm
but people heal in different ways and at different times. a lot of the response to granville now we'll be talking to people about these issues —— grenfell. the whole point of this is not to create victims, which is the stage that people are out now, but eventually for them to return to a life in which they are doing things and not being seen solely as a survivor of grenfell. and this sum that will unfortunately occur, brothers perhaps it won't. —— for some. what would your advice be, louise, to the grenfell relatives? i think it gets worse, i don't think it gets better. i think when you are affected and involved in a major tragedy and disaster i do not think you are ever the person you were meant to be. i certainly am not. since the end of our inquest i have struggled immensely and i have had counselling. but they have said because i have got a lot of complex issues i need somebody more specialised in the aftermath of the tragedy and the disaster. i do not mean this in a disrespectful way to
11:43 pm
people who have lost somebody, whose wife or child or brother has passed away, in what i would call normal circumstances, but when you have lost somebody in unique circumstances, which obviously hillsborough and grenfell are, and justice for the 21. it is particularly difficult to cope with. it is. thank you very much for coming on and sharing your experiences. that's all we have time for. it's a bank holiday weekend, so we are back on tuesday.
11:44 pm
but before we go, a new web app — imaginary soundscape — uses machine learning to match any picture you upload with a suitable audio pairing. all this is the product of a relatively simple ai mechanism developed by researchers at the university of tokyo. it uses object recognition to identify elements within the image, and then matches these to a dataset of more than 52,000 sound files. so we fed it images from some of the week's stories, and it came up with some surprising results. goodnight. passenger marley, travelling to belfast, you are delaying the flight. immediate boarding please, at gate hi.
11:45 pm

54 Views

info Stream Only

Uploaded by TV Archive on