tv BBC News at Five BBC News June 12, 2018 5:00pm-6:01pm BST
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today at 5. .. we're at westminster, where mps are holding a series of crucial votes on the eu (withdrawal) bill. the government has already won several votes but passions are running high over moves to give parliament a greater say in the brexit process. we have to consider anything done in this house and done in the other house, if passed, will actually have a very serious effect on the negotiating strategy of the other side. what they are watching is an attempt by the real zealots in this house to stop this parliament playing any part in the process. this is the scene live in the commons. we'll bring you the very latest on those votes, and all the reaction. the other main stories on bbc news at 5... making history with a handshake. us president donald trump and north korea's kim jong—un meet in singapore. thank you very much.
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it's fantastic. the leaders later signed a document, which included a pledge from mr kim to work to rid the korean peninsula of nuclear weapons. you're going to be very impressed. people are going to be very happy and we're going to take care of a very big and dangerous problem for the world. and the england world cup team arrive in st petersburg, ahead of their opening group g match against tunisia, on monday. it's 5 o'clock. good afternoon. it is an overcast day here at westminster. our top story is that a series of crucial votes
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are taking place in the commons, on the eu (withdrawal) bill, with the brexit secretary, david davis, urging potential conservative rebels to back the government. the bill aims to ensure a smooth transition away from the european union, and means eu law will no longer be supreme in the uk. ahead of the debate, thejustice minister, phillip lee, resigned, saying he couldn't support theresa may's approach to brexit. the government is hoping to overturn a series of defeats in the lords, including giving parliament a greater say in the brexit process, if no deal is initially reached with brussels. we'll have the latest on how the votes are proceeding shortly but, first, our political correspondent, alex forsyth, looks at how the debate has unfolded. in london last night, protesters made feelings clear with an anti—brexit vigil. the question that faced ministers today, how many mps might choose to make a stand? this
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morning, the brexit secretary was chipper, despite the possibility of a difficult day ahead. he knows not all of his party agrees with the government's brexit plans, including this minister, who today quit his job so he could speak out against brexit. i believe that the brexit policy should be pursued on the basis of the 2016th referendum is detrimental to the people we are elected to serve. some thought the resignation might spark further rebellion as mps started to vote on crucial legislation. interest was focused on one key aspect of the bill before the commons, how much power parliament should have if mps don't like the final brexit deal. as they sat down to debate, a warning from the man overseeing procedure.
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no member of this house, no matter what opinion they hold, it should be threatened because of it. mps did not seem to be holding back, some suggesting the government was trying to stop parliament having a say. suggesting the government was trying to stop parliament having a saym it not the case that his amendment to the lords amendment i9, it not the case that his amendment to the lords amendment 19, gives his government a passport to take this country out of the european union with no deal, with this house having had no say on it whatsoever? there was some support on the tory benches oi’ was some support on the tory benches or that you while others in the same party disagreed. meanwhile, the government warned its own mps, voting against this legislation would undermine the process in brussels. we have to consider anything done in this house and the other house, if passed, will have a serious effect on the negotiating strategy of the other side. perhaps fearing a loss, the government gave some ground midway through,
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promising to reconsider the role of parliament in the final brexit deal. by parliament in the final brexit deal. by indicating my position on a key pa rt by indicating my position on a key part of it, i am indicating that the government is willing to in gauge positively ahead of the lords stages. the potential tory rebels had to weigh up whether that was enough to keep them onside.“ had to weigh up whether that was enough to keep them onside. if the house makes the concession of allowing dialogue to continue and i can see the merit of that happening, it must be done in good faith. in the chamber, government whips satin huddles with backbench mps and an extraordinary tussle laid out in public as the government tried to avoid defeat. 0utside, public as the government tried to avoid defeat. outside, the debate raged as well. brexit is dividing opinion as sharply as ever. 0ur chief political correspondent, vicki young, is in parliament's central lobby. just bring us up to date with what we have learned so far with these
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votes a nd we have learned so far with these votes and the situation concerning the members put forward late last night by dominic grieve. we up onto the fourth vote so far but we think there might be up to ii, probably three hours of voting for mps. the government has so far won all of the votes a nd government has so far won all of the votes and that is probably not a huge surprise. where it is getting into trouble is over this idea of a meaningful vote for the house of commons at the end of the brexit process , commons at the end of the brexit process, if you like. 0nce commons at the end of the brexit process, if you like. once there was a deal, if there is one, and it is brought back to this place, what happens if they don't like it and they vote against it or there is no deal at all? what parliament is concerned about is having to make a choice effectively between a deal they do not like and no deal at all. they want parliament to take control of the process. last night, dominic grieve, the former conservative eternity general and on the remains
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side of the argument he came forward with a compromise suggestion. they have been trying to get the government to accept it. at the last minute there were conversations going on all afternoon. it is obvious on the faces of government party managers they did not have the confidence that they were not going to be defeated, so they ended up offering concessions. it is not totally pinned down what that will mean. there will be more discussions tomorrow and before they go back to the house of lords. effectively there were probably accept some of what the conservative rebels want. that is saying if there is no deal scenario come november, then a motion will be put before the house which can be voted on, crucially, and be amended. that is what we are looking at the moment. that will probably be enough to stop the government being defeated in the next hour or so. as some have suggested, a lot of the issues are kicking the can down the road. we
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know as far as the debate and the vote on an amendment over the customs union, another fudge vote on an amendment over the customs union, anotherfudge has been put forward by the government which might mean that they do not get defeated in that vote either. that was the other problem area they had. that is a slightly different issue in the sense that the government itself, the cabinet itself, has not decided what customs arrangements want to put forward as the preferred option. that is a slightly different issue and why theresa may has been forced to call the ministers together at chequers in order to try to thrash out out before they go to brussels with their suggestions. the government is really having to change what they wa nt really having to change what they want here and certainly to compromise to some extent. to discuss further i am joined by the chairman of the brexit select committee, hilary benn. what did you make of what was going on in the
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chamber? there seem to be a private conversation between conservative ministers and rebel mps. conversation between conservative ministers and rebel mpsi conversation between conservative ministers and rebel mps. i do not think i have ever seen the government chief whip scurrying around the chamber quite some actively as we saw earlier today. it does look as if the government has had to make this commitment because it was not confident it would be able to defeat the lords amendment. the fundamental issue here, and this is the most important issue we will be looking at today and tomorrow, is what happens, first of all in the event that parliament looks that a d raft event that parliament looks that a draft withdrawal agreement and does not like it in some respects. the second possibility is the government comes back and said, i'm really sorry, it has not been possible to agree any deal at all. there is no majority in the house of commons for leaving the new with no deal. therefore, what the whole debate is about is how parliament gets to express its views and, if necessary, to give the government what i have always described as fresh,
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negotiating instructions because, in the end, surely the parliament that we elect should be the body to decide what will happen. david davis is saying, just a couple of hours ago, you cannot negotiate with brussels with 650 people sitting behind you got that is not practical. you are tying the hands of the government. parliament telling the government what it thinks it all to do is not tying its handscomb it is parliament doing its job. if the european parliament which also got a vote on the draft of the withdrawal agreement rejects it, explaining why, the eu negotiators will have to think 0k, what will we do about that? it is not uncommon in negotiations for those doing the negotiations to go back to the members, in this case parliament and say, what do you reckon? parliament says that is ok, thatis reckon? parliament says that is ok, that is ok but this is not, you don't have that. in this case, to say, iam don't have that. in this case, to say, i am sorry, it is not going watch, can we discussed the further?
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that is what normally happens. given the scale of this, the number of issues that brexit will involve, implications for every part of the country, every business, the way in which we do so many things, this is like 25 bills coming before parliament at one point. the idea that parliament could not vote to amend bills, of course we can. the opportunity is to say to the government we need to go back and get something that is different because what you have returned with is not good enough, it seems to me right and proper and it is mps doing theirjob. the other argument is that the eu is watching all of this, brussels is watching all of this. if it thinks parliament will be in control of all of this, why is a very good deal? why offer a deal when they know this parliament, the house of commons, is pretty closely allied to the eu? this is what happens, isn't it? the biggest problem at the moment is we are nearly two years on from the
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referendum and the cabinet, which is supposed to be offering leadership is still arguing about the customs arrangements with our biggest and nearest and most important trading partner. they were not publish a white paper until after the next european council. there will be a two—day awayday at chequers. no wonder businesses losing confidence in the government. the eu looks on in utter bewilderment because when we meet because she hated than others, what is it you want? mps have whispered conversations in corridors saying, what is going on? we need leadership now, not disagreement. frankly, that is what is most damaging to chances of a successful negotiation and not the idea that, in the end, it would be normal that parliament would decide what happens in the same that european parliament with a bow on the as well? thank you. we should have a result on a crucial vote, meaningful vote, for parliament at
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the end of the process, maybe within half an hour. thank you for that. more votes happening as we speak. the government isjust happening as we speak. the government is just —— has just won the moment on the exit date for any deal. those votes continuing as we speak. in fact, the government has won all of the votes so far today, fourin won all of the votes so far today, four in all. let's get some perspective. i'm joined now by kate proctor, political reporter for the london evening standard, and caroline wheeler, deputy political editor of the sunday times. good to see you both. how do you think theresa may is feeling?” think theresa may is feeling?” think she will be feeling still nervous about the meaningful vote thatis nervous about the meaningful vote that is coming up later on. she has done well so far and i know her chief whip has been scurrying around all over westminster today, following people in the right direction. she still could face
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defeat on the next vote that is coming up on giving parliament say on brexit. i do not think she is out of the woods yet. it seems the government has made a concession on that hasn't it? it has not taken on the dominic grieve remembered tabled late last night but it has given some ground? it has given quite a lot of ground. the response generally is it is quite a big climb—down by the government, saying they will cede some of the say to parliament if there is the situation ofa no parliament if there is the situation of a no deal by 30th of november, which is quite a big deal. i would expect there will be is some brexiteer mumblings that yet again she has had to concede some ground. in terms of the government staggering on day to day, as it seems to do in these very big crunch days, the response i have seen to what has been proposed is there is a little bit more relaxation there, the labour whips are possibly feeling like a deal has been done which will really potentially save
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that vote for the government and certainly the news that antoinette sandbach is behind the government will be a huge relief given that we started this morning with the resignation, which would really have started the panic within downing street, i suspect. with news that maybe four others were going to policies, i would maybe four others were going to policies, iwould imagine it was maybe four others were going to policies, i would imagine it was a very shaky policies, i would imagine it was a very sha ky start policies, i would imagine it was a very shaky start to the day. drama asa very shaky start to the day. drama as a result of the resignation this morning and a lot of hands being kicked down the road, seemingly. is that the only way that the government will be able to get through today? i think they have put in this concession at the last minute. i think that has placated a lot of people. i think, in terms of the customs union vote winner that things will be discussed at a later point in time, so that when the trade bill comes up. kicking the can down the road is not good enough for some people which is why we saw vividly so dramatically resigned
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today. i cannot describe the anger at what he did. it is not the done thing. you do not do something like that on the eve of a vote. he is walking around westminster looking miserable but he may have been buoyed by some of the comments he got now from people like sarah wollaston, who said, well done for what you did, it was courageous. i really test the atmosphere in there today. what about labour, and particularly the problems they will be coming up against regarding the customs union and the eu? actually the vote on the customs union, there was was a fudge around anyway. the way in which the amendment was put together suggest the government would only have to make a statement about exploration of the customs union. we have seen over the coming days recently is that labour, even within themselves, do not think they have the numbers to push it all the way. again, it will be a testing time for the government. what we will find, as kate is saying, is
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actually in the trade bill that we will come back and return to these issues. that could potentially trip up issues. that could potentially trip up the government again, more so than the votes tomorrow. it is only a few weeks away. thank you for joining us. as i say, the votes continuing in the commons as i speak. so far the government has won them all. theresa may is feeling more comfortable as the votes progress. the all—importa nt more comfortable as the votes progress. the all—important vote on a meaningful vote for parliament and whether or not it should be involved ina much whether or not it should be involved in a much more deep away in the brexit process, that is still to come up later on. back to you in the studio. we will be back with you in a little while. now we will take a look at the other big story today. donald trump and kim jong—un look at the other big story today. donald trump and kimjong—un have held a historic meeting, the first between a sitting us president and the north korean leader. they shook hands ina the north korean leader. they shook hands in a luxury hotel in
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singapore. after the talks, they signed what was described as a comprehensive document, promising a new relationship between the two nations. the agreement included a pledge from mr kim to work to rid the korean peninsula of nuclear weapons. and president trump later said the us would suspend its military exercises that have infuriated north korea. karishma vaswani report contains flashing images from the start. making history with a handshake. many thought this moment would never come. but when it finally did, it was measured and choreographed. once inside, though, the two men appeared more relaxed, even smiling for the cameras. we had a great discussion and it was a tremendous success. tremendously successful. but from kim jong—un, a slightly more reserved tone. he said it hasn't been easy to get here, and that old prejudices have
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been obstacles in his way, but that he's overcome all of that, and that's why he's here today. later at lunch, a chance to size each other up. and for kim jong—un to get a glimpse of his adversary across the table. getting a good picture, everybody, so we look nice and handsome. beautiful. perfect. then a short stroll in the gardens before, in typical trump style, an unexpected announcement. a lot of progress. really very positive. i think better than anybody could have expected. top of the line. really good. mr president... we're going right now for a signing. some confusion initially as to what they were going to sign, but when they put pen to paper, donald trump called it a comprehensive document that would see the process of denuclearisation begin very, very quickly. he's a worthy negotiator. negotiating on behalf of his people. a very worthy, very
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smart negotiator. and then another handshake to seal the deal. but who was this a better deal for? no details, no mention of whether this denuclearisation process will be verifiable or irreversible. one might wonder what's actually been achieved at this summit. there's also no timetable for denuclearisation, although president trump has said that international observers will go into north korea at some point. president trump did clarify, though, that sanctions would remain in place on the north. well, thank you very much, everybody... but in another surprise, revealed during a media briefing, that the us would stop war games with south korea and that us troops could one day be removed from the peninsula. i want to get our soldiers out, i want to bring our soldiers back home. we have right now 32,000 soldiers in south korea and i'd like to be able to bring them back home. but that's not part of the equation right now. at some point i hope it will be, but not right now.
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we will be stopping the war games, which will save us a tremendous amount of money. meanwhile, after meetings with the north korean delegation, president trump showed that he is always the businessman, even in this unusual context. as an example they have great beaches, you see that when they explode their cannons into the ocean. i said, "look at that beach. wouldn't that make a great condo behind?" isaid, "instead of doing that, you could have a the best hotels in the world right there." for kim jong—un, seen here leaving the summit, this has been a far more positive outcome for north korea than many had originally expected. this is what he's been working towards for so long, gaining international legitimacy whilst making very few concessions. and for president trump, ever the showman, this summit achieved what he was after too. this was always about the optics, the chance to show american greatness in the region even if it means nothing substantial has been achieved as a result. karishma vaswani, bbc
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news, in singapore. in a moment, we'll speak to rajini vaidya nathan in washington. but first let's talk to our world affairs correspondent, nick beake, in singapore. it was not short on drama. what we wait to see it's really the devil in the detail. how much detail there really is. absolutely. it is midnight here in singapore, the end of the day of extraordinary political theatre. amazing when you think about the insults these world leaders were hurling at each other just a year ago. but now we see the fire inferior replaced by handshakes and smiles. yes, what exactly have they achieved? the american contingent in singapore were saying that the key aspect of any agreement they signed with the verification, thatis
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they signed with the verification, that is to say people going in and making sure the north koreans have done exactly what they signed up to do. that was not in the document. however, in this extraordinary press conference resident trump gave, it went on for more than an hour, he said that he had in fact received an assurance from mr kim ‘s behind—the—scenes at this deal would behind—the—scenes at this deal would be verifiable. there is some scepticism this evening. mr trump is hailing this as a great success. certainly with all the drama and theatre, this is writing history president donaldj theatre, this is writing history president donald j trump theatre, this is writing history president donaldj trump style. the thing is, there are two authors involved in this process and we don't know what mr kim jong—un has in mind forthe don't know what mr kim jong—un has in mind for the next chapter of the story. let's head to capitol hill. any scepticism there? well, that corridors here in
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congress are buzzing with reaction to the singapore summit. some of it is quite nuanced. unsurprisingly, democrats criticising what the president has done. some describing it as nothing more than a photo opportunity and asking for what the details are. then you have republicans. the republican leadership is broadly saying that what president trump did was great. senior republicans were congratulating him. when you dig through, other members of his party say it all comes with concerns. the biggest concern is that president trump is doing a deal with the dictator. strong language from some senior senators like the senator from florida, who says kimjong—un is not a talented guy and president trump is trying to butter up a total weirdo. 0ther republicans expressing similar sentiments, saying, even if
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kim jong—un promises denuclearisation, it does not change his character. the fact he is a human rights abuse or dictator. that isa human rights abuse or dictator. that is a concern for the you have republicans and democrats in congress calling for the secretary of state to come to congress and explaining give more details about what happened during those meetings in singapore. people still feel they are in the dark. just quickly, i have spoken to some donald trump supporters who are delighted because they say this just shows that donald trump isa they say this just shows that donald trump is a man who knows how to make a deal. thank you very much. let's stay in washington and talk about what has or has not been agreed by the two leaders. marc fitzpatrick was responsible for nuclear nonproliferation in the nuclear nonproliferation in the nuclear state department up until 2005. he was responsible for north korea. thank you so much that your
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time here tonight. good to speak with you. how much optimism do you have about the deal that has been signed? i am very glad that diplomacy is proceeding and i think that in the secretary of state, they will embark on a fruitful process. i am not very optimistic that north korea will agree to complete denuclearisation and they will agree to the verification that will be required and they will do it within a time frame in the next couple of yea rs. a time frame in the next couple of years. there are so many details left to be decided that it is hard to reach any judgment left to be decided that it is hard to reach anyjudgment about this deal. as in that sort of somewhat vague commitment been made twice before? —— has not that sort of somewhat vague commitment?m before? —— has not that sort of somewhat vague commitment? it has been made more than twice before. 0ne my colleagues in the think tank community in washington went back through the records and found at
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least six occasions in the past when north korea has agreed to denuclearisation words similar to that. each time it hasn't happened, or it only happened for some period of time before it was broken. there is no reason to trust north korea that they will proceed. that is why verification is so important. the absence of any mention of verification in this deal really shows how vague it is. given that, how is the president really conceded too much when he came out later and said that we are going to stop all these us military exercises? wow, that was such a surprising concession on his part! and then also talk you out wanting to bring home us troops. the two things that north korea once most, he is giving in without getting anything in return. those card should be played atan return. those card should be played at an appropriate time, when north
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korea has achieved progress towards denuclearisation. the great deal—maker is not proving to be such a good deal maker in this negotiation. the fact he has said that to some surprise later on great is your best guess that was the president speaking on that specific issue just off—the—cuff? president speaking on that specific issuejust off—the—cuff? do president speaking on that specific issue just off—the—cuff? do you think there were a range of advisers behind—the—scenes with their heads in their hands, thinking, it is far too early to say that? in south korea, the president said, we have to understand what donald trump meant by this. i do not think the us forces in south korea even knew he was going to say this. i wonder if the secretary of defence knew about this. this very much was donald trump speaking off the top of his head. he goes into something ill—prepared and thinks he can handle it on the spare the moment and makes huge mistakes. therefore, what should everybody listening to
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this broadcast be watching out for now? how many weeks or months do we give it until we start to see detail? until we start to look for some action, notjust a signed piece of paper? there is no deadline that was stated. it may go until the end of the donald trump administration. that is a good thing if it does. the absence of north korean nuclear and missile tests during the time that they are still in gauging in diplomacy is a good thing. what i am worried about is, when they get into the real discussions on implementation, they are going to again come to clash over verification as they have done before, and they could go all asunder. i don't think we need worry too much about the lack of speed. it is more the lack of clarity and verification that i am worried about. clearly an issue. thank you very much indeed. thank you and we
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will talk about that again, i am sure. thank you for now. mark fitzpatrick in washington. we'll be back to clive myrie at westminster shortly — mps will be voting shortly on the crucial amendment calling for them to be given a final say on the brexit deal. as many as four of that opinion say aye. division, clear the as many as four of that opinion say aye. division, clearthe lobby. as many as four of that opinion say aye. division, clear the lobby. they are now in fact leading the chamber for that vote. we will be back in
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westminster in the coming minutes for that result. time for a look at the weather. here's matt taylor. good evening. the weather across the uk has been quite static but over the next 36 hours we will shake up but weather system and for some the welcome return of some rain. you concede bigger gaps now in the cloud and with clear skies tonight it will bea and with clear skies tonight it will be a fresh start to tomorrow morning but it will be dry and right. single figure temperatures away from the towns and cities. some cloud around but most seem sunny spells in the
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morning. wejust could have but most seem sunny spells in the morning. we just could have the odd isolated shower. clouding over more considerably in scotland and northern ireland, knocking back those temperatures. and that wet weather comes with some strong wind as well and the potential for some disruption on thursday morning. more of that in half an hour. this is bbc news. the headlines. a series of crucial votes are taking place in the commons, on the eu withdrawal bill. the government has made some concessions to its backbench rebels, but passions on both sides of the argument — over giving mps a meaningful say on a brexit deal — have been running high. it is all about giving parliament a final say on any final deal. this is the scene live in the commons. mps are now out and taking part in
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that crucial vote. making history with a handshake — president trump hails his talks with kim jong un as ‘tremendous'. the leaders signed an agreement committing themselves to de—nuclearisation on the korean peninsula. an alleged member of the banned neo—nazi group national action, has admitted plotting to murder the west lancashire mp rosie cooper. 23—year—old jack renshaw also admitted threatening to kill a police officer. sport now, here'sjohn watson. england have arrived at tehir team hotel in reppina, the coastal town which will serve as their base for the duration of their stay in russia. how long that will be of course remains to be seen. the players left the fa's national football centre st georges park in burton this
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morning, before flying from birmingham airport at lunchtime, touching down in st petersburg a few hours ago. they will have a week to familiarise themselves with their surroundings before that group g opener with tunisia next monday. we like saint petersburg and we are hopeful the players and their families will have the chance to go into st petersburg when we're not working. we liked the fact that we can take the hoteljust for ourselves. i think that is good for the balance of work and also players being able to relax and have some time for themselves. so we're really pleased and looking forward to meeting the community a bit more. well he is clearly confident that this location of the team hotel and its proximity to st petersburg will
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offer the players and their families enough to keep them occupied. a critiscm that has been levelled at england squads in the past. the former england captain alan sheareer believes a lack of focus shouldn't be an issue. forget the board, you get every single thing laid out for you. for four weeks of your life you cannot afford to get bored for that you get given whatever you want, that is provided on a plate for you. you are here to play football, for a month we live, not too much to ask. scotland scored a 90th minute winner, having been two nil down, to keep alive tehir hopes of qualifying for the women's world cup next year. having pulled a goal back in the 78th minuted, they were level two minutes later through jane ross. the win though was secured when lisa evans grabbed a dramatric winner in the 90th minute to pull level with group leaders switzerland. only the top team in each group will qualify automatically. england's women have set
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south africa a total of 332 to win the second one day international at hove. tammy beamont and wicketkeeper sarah taylor both scored centuries, sharing a partnership of 156 for the 2nd wicket. south africa have just begun their reply and are currently 3a for no loss after 11 overs. we'll have more for you in sportsday at half past six. thank you for that. and welcome back to westminster. a bit more on breaking story. mps are voting on a series of crucial votes taking place in the commons, on the eu withdrawal bill. this is where the vote is taking place as i speak on thatjewish
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decision today as to a meaningful vote and what that should mean for parliament and whether mps will have in their opinion and meaningful say on any brexit process if the government comes back from brussels with no deal. we know the conservative whips and tory whips have been working hard to prevent a back bench rebellion. we know that there has been a bit of a concession on the part of the government, not enough for the government to take the amendment put forward by dominic grieve that would suggest that in the event of a no deal then the government would have to put forward its ideas for parliament as to what its ideas for parliament as to what it would do next. that was the concession, that was the amendment put forward by dominic grieve but the government have refused that and they believe that they have the votes to survive this particular
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vote. we've had for a fine folks already this morning. —— four or five votes and the government has one all of them. so theresa may it is being suggested is breathing a little bit easier but this is the crucial vote for her. we note the solicitor general has already made it clear that an amendment will be put forward in the lords once this vote on a meaningful vote actually goes back to the upper chamber. so let's get the view from the young who is our chief political correspondent and she is in the lobby. they are voting now, how confident do think the government is on this? i think they are confident now because they have promised to concede a certain amount, we do not know the details yet but a certain amount to those conservative rebels. i'm told by one of them that 15 or
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conservative mps where in the prime ministers office just behind the speaker ‘s chair in the house of commons and they say they have a personal commitment from her to sort this out and they say that they trust are to do so. i have some sympathy for her position and says she is between a rock and hard place but they think she will make sure that once this goes back to the house of lords parliament will be given more power to control what goes on if we end up in a no situation. that is what all this is about, if we get to the position where parliament votes down a deal or if there is no deal then what happens next. they did not want to be confronted with the idea of a bad deal or no deal at all, they want to have more say over the process. as ever with these things that went right to the wire, the concession was not really given until those last few moments when the solicitor general got up and said i will have talks with you tomorrow. 0n the rebel side of the argument some of them are saying to me why did they wait for so long, it was obvious
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they did not have the numbers it seems the government was facing defeat on this vote. now we can see in house of commons chamber that they are starting to feel back in, from the rear couple of minutes away from the rear couple of minutes away from the rear couple of minutes away from the result. but within half an hour of that vote taking place a couple of conservatives who had been very much minded to prevail on this and to vote against the government got up to say that they thought they'd had enough to swing behind they'd had enough to swing behind the government on this occasion. the other question you put to them is would you trust ministers to do this given they were so reluctant to offer this confession, do you trust that they will follow through with this. the response to that is to say of course this all goes back to the house of lords and remember this is what we call ping—pong, the lyrics make changes, they have come back to the house of commons and now we'll go back to the house of lords and if there is any backsliding by the government, if the rebels are still not happy at the end then the lords still has the possibility of making
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them think again and reinsert this idea of a motion once we get to the no deal scenario. there are bits of the government is not so happy about, they do not like the idea of parliament taking control of negotiations come next march if this has not all been sorted out. that would be a step too far for them so they're willing to do that. but it sounds like they're willing to bring forward a motion to the house of commons, pretty swiftly, if there is no deal scenario. of course that would can be changed by mps and can be voted upon, that is the crucial point. so those conservative rebels think that they have got a pretty significant concession from the government. yet again another can being kicked down the road a lot of people would suggest. you wonder why the government is willing to put down an amendment in the lords but not today. i think probably there
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will not thinking that they would have two, is a government you do not give way and concede unless you know you have two so i would imagine watching what was going on in the commons, the chief whip, the man in charge of making sure that all his mps are voting the right way, asking the government, backing theresa may, he would've had a chart his wall following what each mp is willing to do. if it is true that there were 15 or more conservative in that office with the prime minister and i'm being told being egged on by others who may be are still in government and who have not resigned but you still feel that this is the right way to go, then i think the government would have been facing defeat. so it is only once they thought that that they probably decided they would have to concede on this issue. so that is the way it works with these things, it was getting to the point where it was getting to the point where it was getting so late it might have been late december whether government left it so late to tell rebels what
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they were conceding that actually they were conceding that actually they lost the vote anyway. i could not afford for that to happen again so they've done it this way around and it is on trust of course, these conversations will go on tomorrow. you will have to see what they come up you will have to see what they come up with in the house of lords when it goes back there but certainly conservatives i have spoken to, clear for them conservatives i have spoken to, clearfor them on the rebel side, they feel they have got enough so that should be ok for the government. we're just waiting for themselves and here come. —— for the results and here they come. well we thought we were going to get the result there. here we go. any second now. order. order. the ayes to the right 324. the noes to the left 298.
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the ayes to the right 394. the noes to the left 298. so the ayes have it, the ayes habit. armlock. minister to move formally... 0k it, the ayes habit. armlock. minister to move formally... ok so 324 to 298. your thoughts on that? a pretty clear win for the government but important to remember only because of the last—minute concession, so that is crucial now. what happens tomorrow and it is pretty clear that these conservative mps are not willing to back down without a confession, if the government was to go back on their word they gave today i'm told the prime minister get a personal assurance that she would sorted out,
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if they do not go far enough in house of lords is likely to put back into the bill this idea of a meaningful vote and it would come back again to the house of commons to have another go at it. so now the government must act one way or another. the suggestion that theresa may, her hands might be side —— might be tight in her negotiations with the eu, that did not seem to cut any ice with the back benches. that is right, the government say we are bound by this, we cannot negotiate with 650 people and that is why i do not think they would be willing to accept that parliament ta ke willing to accept that parliament take control of the negotiations come next february. that will be very difficult one for the government to accept. but the idea that you can invent this idea of a no deal scenario, that is what they are conceding on the government has not happy about that. the do not feel this works, we know it is being
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watched in brussels, that the government looks like it is not in control the situation potentially that weakens the uk government argument. we will have to see if thatis argument. we will have to see if that is the case but there are other problems as well with the cabinet not even decided on what kind of customs arrangement it once at the end of all this. that was the other crucial vote coming up tomorrow and again there has been fudged compromise on that and really until the cabinet decides what it once it is pretty ha rd the cabinet decides what it once it is pretty hard to see how things can go forward. thank you for that. i'm joined now by the cross bench here lord ricketts. in the last couple of secondsit lord ricketts. in the last couple of seconds it seems that theresa may has got her way, she had to concede quite seriously on this. there is a sense that parliament is going to have some kind of meaningful say on whatever deal we get at the end of this. yes, roads have been berated
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for making amendments to this draft law but actually have done what the constitution says, we have given the commons the chance to think again and to reflect and make amendments. it is quite ironic that the government seem it is quite ironic that the government seem to have decided they would will bring forward another amendment in the house of lords is the price for buying off the rebellion this afternoon in the house of commons. i think the commons and the lords are playing their part and it will now come back to the lords on monday next week to see what the government amendment is and the debate will continue but i think that that shows this process is working with up the thunderous headlines we had this one, do not usurp the will of the people, the message being put forward to those mps voting today. obviously a lot of criticism of the lords and the amendments that have come from the upper chamber. how does that all make you feel as someone who believes that you would argue, you are simply doing what you're supposed to do under the constitution? i think it is really a
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kind of bullying and what the lords tried to do with amendments this to give power back to parliament and at the moment the government proposal was when the deal comes to parliament at the end of the year if it is voted down then it is up to the government what happened next. but europe unelected. we are just inviting the commons to say hang on, is that right or should parliament have a say in what happens if a d raft have a say in what happens if a draft deal is voted down. now the commons is debating that and that is a good thing and it will come back to the road and eventually back to the commons again. i think the lords will feel they have done a job, they have given the commons a chance to have given the commons a chance to have a serious look at some issues which we thought they got wrong first time around and now some of them, there will be amendments to. so you do not believe when this comes back to the upper chamber that there will be other amendments?” comes back to the upper chamber that there will be other amendments? i do not think there will be much appetite for going back on many of the other amendments, the 15 that prevented altogether now that the commons has decided they will not adopt them i suspect most lords
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would say they are the elected chamber and that is fine but the government themselves have chosen to use the lords as the place to bring back a new amendment on this crucial issue of what is a meaningful vote and what role parliament says. i think that is quite interesting. and of course tomorrow we have focused on the customs union and the eea. we know what the lloyds feels about that, the government itself within the cabinet are not united on a position on a customs union.” the cabinet are not united on a position on a customs union. i think the fact that the lords put in this proposal, as in the commons to reflect on that has produced a concession from the government there as well and now we have a new clause on the customs union which i think was provoked by the lords making that proposal all this suggests the system is working, we will see if thatis system is working, we will see if that is adopted tomorrow in the commons and i think it probably will be. i should say as well but while this is going on all this cliff edge stuff, this is negotiating with ourselves, this is not the real
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negotiation that needs to happen with the eu and i think all the other eu members are wondering what really is going on. 15 month through the two—year period and yet the british parliament, the british government is negotiating with itself and going from drama to drama before actually we can get to the real negotiations. but are they as convinced as perhaps you are suggesting about their own position and how to handle the negotiations with the uk on all of this? are they united? they have been surprisingly united? they have been surprisingly united through this so far, they gave a mandate to michel barnier to negotiate with us and by and large they have stuck behind him and backed up what he has said so he is operating with a pretty cohesive set of countries behind him and everyone is just waiting for the uk to work out their issues and come forward with a clear proposal on things like customs union and trade, security issues. everyone is watching this drama andi issues. everyone is watching this drama and i think wondering when the real negotiations with the eu is
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going to start. thank you for that. so several votes today so far and the government has won all of them including that one on a crucial meaningful vote for parliament. a number of concessions made by the government to those 15 or so tory rebel mps who were willing to vote for that lords amendment. but it seems that concessions put forward by the government have been enough to forestall that for the time being. back to you in the studio. thank you for now. more for westminster over the course of the evening. just taking a look at some other stories. an alleged member of a banned neo—nazi group has pleaded guilty to preparing acts of terrorism — in relation to a plot to kill a labour mp. jack renshaw, who's 23, admitted buying a machete with the intention of killing rosie cooper, and making threats to kill a police officer. he's one of six men who deny being members of the group national action.
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our home affairs correspondent daniel sandford reports. jack renshaw, 23 years old, a man accused of being a neo—nazi, who today dramatically admitted planning to kill a labour mp and threatening to kill a police officer. the prosecution say he'd already bought a machete, a kind described by its manufacturers as "19 inches of unprecedented piercing and slashing power. " and christopher lythgoe is the man accused of being the secret leader of the group, who encouraged him to carry out the murder. we let these people destroy us, and they are still destroying us now. along with four other men, they are charged with being members of national action, a group banned by the home secretary as a virulently racist terrorist organisation after it celebrated the killing of the mpjo cox. with all six defendants listening intently, the prosecutor, duncan atkinson qc, told the jury
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that the plan to kill another mp was discussed at a pub in warrington last summer. the group met at this table upstairs in the big window at the friar penketh pub on the 1st ofjuly. the prosecution say that jack renshaw told the group that his plan was to murder his local mp, rosie cooper, take some hostages and then kill a female detective who had been investigating him. the plan to kill rosie cooper was uncovered because the antiracism organisation hope not hate had a mole in the group, robbie mullen, who was also there at the pub that night. according to robbie mullen, jack renshaw wanted to carry out the murder in the name of national action, and that night christopher lythgoe gave his approval. christopher lythgoe denies that and all six men deny being members of national action after it was banned. daniel sandford, bbc news, at the old bailey. 0ur chief political correspondent vicki young is in parliament's central lobby.
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and plenty of reaction to that vote. let's go straight to some reaction. and it seems the government is ready to concede something about a meaningful vote for parliament. the meaningful vote for parliament. the meaningful vote for parliament. the meaningful vote was won by the government by 26 votes, and that is a lot but the second thing is this is about giving the british people bob they actually asked for in the referendum. by a sovereign act of parliament. so all this nonsense about the idea that somehow there is an infringement upon sovereignty is wrong. this was a sovereign act of parliament which legally transferred to the british people the right to make this decision and they try to upset it, this meaningful but
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proposal was an attempt to reverse brexit, it has been significantly and soundly defeated. many of them would deny that and they would say it is about an ideal scenario, their mps who say they do not want to accept an ideal scenario and when it comes to that they want to be able to ta ke comes to that they want to be able to take some control. many people would say and quite likely that we do not want no deal scenario but the reality is that is down to the negotiations and this amendment that was being proposed, the alternative amendment forward by dominic grieve wish was the same to all intents and purposes, said the house of commons by resolution will have to give a decision to the government and the government must accept their direction. this is completely out of kilter with all our constitutional arrangements and not only that is actually absolutely essential that the decision was taken by the people, it is a sovereign act of parliament, that gave the people the
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right to leave and they've done it and this is a great victory for the government. thank you very much. just to bring in dominic grieve who has been fighting to get a concession from the government. what do you think you have achieved today? i think the government realised it must have an amendment, a furtheramendment to realised it must have an amendment, a further amendment to the bill which deals with parliament '5 role in the event of there being no deal and ensures that there is a structured way in which parliament can provide input to what would be in my view a national crisis. and what is your understanding of what you have been promised, they have not accepted your amendment today, parliament has just voted for kicking out the lords amendment. firstly you have to understand that the amendment which i tabled could not been voted on today in any event, i tabled not been voted on today in any event, itabled it not been voted on today in any event, i tabled it at the last minute because i wanted to try to a clash of doctor wanted to try to crystallise the issues and see if we
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could resolve them so i always knew it would not suddenly appear in the bill today but i think it enabled us to have a reasonable debate on the subject and to arrive at a point where we could support the government in rejecting the lords amendments. i now have confidence and trust in the prime minister that we will have a detailed discussion about what needs to be put into the bill when it goes back to the lloyds. that it will get put back in the lloyds and then we'll come back to the commons and of course if for some reason which i do not think will happen, we end up in a situation where we do not get what we thought, then the matter will be debated again in the comments. thank you very much. so the government avoiding defeat now those conservative rebels will be looking for a concession from the government. thank you very much. just time to take a look at the weather prospects with some changes on the way, it was a fine afternoon across much of the uk
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today. just to show you the latest satellite imagery, bigger gap in the cloud beginning to appear. with clearer skies around overnight and after what has been a slightly fresher day it will be a cooler night tonight with temperatures in rural areas down to single figures. but for many it will be a dry and sunny commute. through the day the cloud steadily builds up to produce the odd shower in the south. clouded over more substantially to parts of scotla nd over more substantially to parts of scotland and northern ireland. temperatures in england and wales upper—level on today but cooler to the north with heavy rain moving in and also a strong wind which could cause some disruption into thursday morning. more details later put up.
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this programme contains scenes of repetitive flashing images. a handshake in history — donald trump becomes the first serving us president to meet a north korean leader. just months after trading insults — an extraordinary turn of events — as president trump and kim jong—un meet face to face. very positive. better than anybody could have expected. they've signed a declaration agreeing to work towards peace and to rid the korean peninsula of nuclear weapons. we have developed a very special bond so people are going to be very impressed. people are going to be very happy and we're going to take care of a very big and very dangerous problem for the world. we had a historic meeting and decided to leave the past behind. and we are about to sign a historic document. but already there's criticism that the agreement is vague
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