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tv   Dateline London  BBC News  June 23, 2018 11:30am-12:01pm BST

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at angela merkel‘s request, france's emmanuel macron, and the leaders of bulgaria and austria are among those exploring how to prevent migrants from moving around the bloc, after they've already claimed asylum in one of the mediterranean states of arrival. this gathering is in the run—up to the imminent full eu summit — but now also comes as immigration dominates us politics. president trump this week did a u—turn on his policy of separating children from their parents, after they cross the us—mexico border, after domestic and international condemnation. let's start with the european situation. something we have been talking about for many years. something we have been talking about for many years. thomas: chancellor merkel has been under so much domestic pressure, is this mini summit all about that? about her own domestic travails?m is all about that. that is the
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origin of this meeting. she was under threat of losing her coalition because the interior minister was threatening to resign if he didn't get his way about stopping asylum seekers at the bavarian german border. he has a point is a certain —— a sense of asylum to in europe going on. people who have been in one country, some say they should stay there will stop the open borders in europe allows them to continue to travel. the first registration country is meaningless, ina sense, registration country is meaningless, in a sense, because once you have some registration, you can make your home somewhere else. there is the threat of constant migration which is getting too much for individual countries to bear. secondly, your past you agree on a solution. angela merkel is in a quandary because she was unilaterally responsible, three
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yea rs was unilaterally responsible, three years ago, for opening germany's border. now it has become such a problem. she is going to them saying however this began, i need... problem. she is going to them saying howeverthis began, i need...” problem. she is going to them saying however this began, i need... i have to suspend disbelief to think there will be any outcome of this meeting this week ends, because the italian prime minister already only came after they jettisoned is prime minister already only came after theyjettisoned is a prefabricated final communiqu statements. you often have a communiqu already written. jones had stronger doesn't understand... he had a statement already prepared. the italian prime minister said no, i will defence. angela merkel had to promise him they would jettisoned this paper out. the visit grad countries, for eastern european countries, for eastern european countries, also boycotted this meeting. they will ask us this issue
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at the opera summit next week. there isa at the opera summit next week. there is a degree of idea in angela merkel‘s mind that harmonisation has to mean everyone sharing the problem will stop —— the proper summits. they will say, it's not our problem. they will say, it's not our problem. they are, in most cases, the first port of call. that means that italy have to confront the main problem. the interior minister already said we have 5 million for italian, we can't cope with the impoverished masses of africa. and unemployment. yes, we have to come together but it is easier said than done. we probably have to the regime outside libya's and stop the people smugglers to get in. creating...
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which is appalling, absolutely appalling. considering what the eu is supposed to stand for. one of the solutions they are considering is to create a new deal like they have with turkey and with libya. we all know what goes on in those refugee camps, sexual abuses, rapes know what goes on in those refugee camps, sexualabuses, rapes of miners, torture. all sorts of human rights violations. the eu is trying to outsource its refugee problems to the developing world. countries that do not have the capacity to address the migration crisis. this is because there has been an inability of europe to address the inequities in the refugee system. refugees have to stay and register in the first port of call. that puts pressure on
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those countries. yes, greece suffered tremendously in 2015 with the largest number of refugees coming from syria. now it is a sleek, getting around 70% of all the migrants. —— now it is italy. sleek, getting around 70% of all the migrants. -- now it is italy. and italy turns back a ship this week. the eastern european countries refuse any kind of burden sharing. we also have angela merkel, many other european prime ministers will pander to other european prime ministers will panderto their other european prime ministers will pander to their right—wing parties. and far right parties. that is getting to the horrors of it. above the mechanics of the problem, this is the next essential crisis with the eu. -- is the next essential crisis with the eu. —— getting to the heart of the eu. —— getting to the heart of the problem. they wanted to get rid of national governments which could conceivably be seized by populist mobs, that was, european countries
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have this rather terrible history of electing the wrong people come hitler, mussolini. the idea of this benign oligarchy in brussels was that the accountable democratic national governments would lose a great deal of their power and self—determination. this is how think, adsense to make a homogenous entity as of the eu is smashing. —— attempt to homogenise. trying to impose a universal fiscal system on europe, that might have been the points. democratic accountability, the basic principle of 18th—century modern democracy, which is that the legitimacy of the law derives from the consent of the people, that had to go out the window because the people were not reliable. now we are coming to the crunch, the people have become so angry about their
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concerns and worries and anxieties not being attended to and is being treated with contempt by the brussels oligarchy that they are taking over governments like italy. that's a huge exaggeration. all of the pandering to right wing and anti—immigration dealings starts at national level. —— feelings. anti—immigration dealings starts at national level. -- feelings. you misunderstand me. that was my point is, you misunderstood. the danger of nationalism and anti—immigrant healing is what the eu is designed to suppress the top because it has oppressed it with such derision and contempt, they are getting exactly what they want to avoid, which is mob rule. that play -- that might play into our later brexit discussion. there are human beings
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at the root of this, people dying trying to make the crossing. politicians are not talking about the root cause of why people still wa nt to the root cause of why people still want to sleep. exactly. i agree that this is an original crisis but it is a western liberal people. no one has figured out how to handle a great moment of massive migration from the south to the north. most people once you have refugees and asylum seekers dealt with humanely but they also wa nt dealt with humanely but they also want border control. how do you screw those two? no one has figured that out. in the us this week, we saw appalling images of children being detained. —— how do you reconcile those two? we have seen a situation with the us border like europe experienced in 2015.
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massively up on previous years? from last year. there is a crisis on the us border. president trump has reversed its policy on separating children from their families at the crisis is not over, he has not relinquished his zero tolerance policy on migrants. he still wants to stop what he has called catch and release, whereby migrants detained and, with children, and released to appear before court later, often yea rs appear before court later, often years later. he will bump up against a court ruling that mandates that these children cannot be detained, even with their parents, for more than 20 days. the crisis will continue because he has made these arrangements to how families military bases, and i think the courts will strike him down on that. he has been upfront about his views on immigration right from the campaign, this was one of his to stop illegal migration. therefore
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they would argue he has every right to do so. —— one of his platforms. he did not campaign on separating children from their families. he he did not campaign on separating children from theirfamilies. he has made a calculated that and privately said, it is reported, that my people love this. but actually it has managed to unite the country in a way that we haven't seen in a long time. the majority of people do not wa nt time. the majority of people do not want children to be treated in this way. the specific policy was too far. and it has backfired on him. it has let the republican party, laid up has let the republican party, laid up difference as to as to how to handle it. i think it has damaged the republican party. the damage will not go away before the midterms. he has this unrealistic expectation that the republicans will gain control or more seats in congress and therefore be able to pass hardline immigration laws and i
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think that's unrealistic. his language has been the lilian —— offensive and inflammatory. he talks about immigrants in fasting society. does he have any idea about the historical precedents of repairing two groups of people as vermin? astonishing, the ignorance of 20th—century astonishing, the ignorance of 20th—ce ntury history. astonishing, the ignorance of 20th—century history.|j astonishing, the ignorance of 20th-century history. i think he is fully aware. it is deliberate. we have seen that mine which being used in hungary, by the current minister in italy. similar language. in hungary, by the current minister in italy. similar languagelj in hungary, by the current minister in italy. similar language. ithink the word infested... i think he knows what he is doing. it is extremely dangerous.” knows what he is doing. it is extremely dangerous. i am not supporting this kind of language, it is inadmissible. let's come back to the basic argument whether any country has a right to wonder how much more immigration can you accept
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in order to continue to cope with oui’ in order to continue to cope with our own national endeavour? you talked negatively about fortress europe and wanted to warn about it, but ina europe and wanted to warn about it, but in a sense i am saying something controversial, there's nothing wrong with europe trying to dig around how to cope with this enormous exodus. question countries have to think carefully about the impact of their foreign policy. as long as we will be creating more and instability in the developing world, insisting on international trade regimes that are incredibly disadvantageous to developing countries, we will continue to see loads of migration coming... there is a significant difference between the european response of european community is to migration and america. america is a nation of immigrants. there are
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provincial places particularly in europe where people's families have lived for ten generations. the idea ofan lived for ten generations. the idea of an influx of outsiders does have a significant impact on communities. to treat that with contempt or derision, to imply that people are against because communities are being disrupted in this way is unfairand a very being disrupted in this way is unfair and a very important political lesson for europe to take in. it seems incapable of doing that. at the brussels commission level. national governments are having to take it in because they are elected and accountable. we will move on for now. we could film many hours on this topic alone. we will see imminently whether thomas is right on whether much will be achieved by this mini summit this weekend. here in the uk, let's talk about events here this week. here in the uk, no sooner did prime minister theresa may survive a parliamentary vote about brexit — after a torrid time
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just the week before — than several major companies, including the aerospace giant airbus, started ringing very loud and very public alarm bells about the risk of britain leaving the eu without a transition deal. airbus, which directly employs 14 thousand people in the uk, said it might stop manufacturing here in the event of no deal — which would be ‘catastrophic‘ for its business, it warned. janet, we're meant to leave in nine months‘ time, not much has been agreed? could ijust say a word about our bus. they said if we didn'tjoin could ijust say a word about our bus. they said if we didn't join the euro, back in the day, they would pull out of the uk. and they said if leave one, they would pull out of the uk. it is getting boring. our relationship with europe is dubious. they given all. of money —— get relationship with europe is dubious. they given all. of money -- gal a lot of money in subsidy from europe. what they're saying is consistent with the majority... business hates
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uncertainty, obviously. in a free—market economy, particularly in a world going to free trade, flexibility and adaptability of the name of the game. if you can't adapt, you can't survive. that is the whole point of a capitalist economy as opposed to a totalitarian communist economy. can we get onto the political question of theresa may and surviving? this has been an extraordinarily exasperating period. people who write to me almost —— to almost any commentator asking why we can'tjust get almost any commentator asking why we can't just get on with it. almost any commentator asking why we can'tjust get on with it. the problem for theresa may is she has been presiding over a divided party. the significance of those defeats and successes for her, the did the remainers in the house of commons, was very important. it means that in future she can actually... from my
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private feelings, the war is over. i think the commons lobby remain has finally ever not. the war in her party? yes. the significance of that climb—down was much greater even thanit climb—down was much greater even than it appeared because i think there was tremendous pressure being put by those mps's constituencies. and public opinion, which is getting fed up with obstructionism. even people who voted to remain apparentlyjust people who voted to remain apparently just want this people who voted to remain apparentlyjust want this to be over, to get on with it. the polling berries. the country is still divided. but the obstruction isn't bya divided. but the obstruction isn't by a particular co—ordinated campaign which seems to be in league with brussels. there is not going to be no deal. there is going to be a deal. how do you know? but we still
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don't know what it is. with only nine months to go. the need to threaten to walk away, to say no deal is better than a bad deal, it is still logically absolutely imperative. as soon as you sent down your minimum requirement, they become maximum requirement will stop does theresa may need to, bluntly, just say that? she has been trying to since the beginning. the results are not very good because the british government has conceded throughout this 18 months or so, conceded every demands made by brussels. as a bluffing strategy, it hasn't worked very well. brussels know very well but they have far more cards to play than britain has. asa more cards to play than britain has. as a negotiating strategy, it hasn't worked. that point about capitalism being good to adapting, should
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adapt, that's what our bus is doing. they are saying that this is what capitalist companies have that. you do not authorise the conditions in which we want to do business, we go elsewhere. the problem is thousands ofjobs are on the line. they elsewhere. the problem is thousands of jobs are on the line. they have made that threat three times now. once you make threats, you don't carry it through, it is less convincing you make it again. your point is there are other companies doing this. this is fundamentally different than the previous example. this is a major change in the trading relationship. there are concerns echo countless other companies who have been lobbying the government in public and private that they no deal scenario would be catastrophic for business. and for jobs. i think we will see in the coming months companies with gloves
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off, they have been quiet, been diplomatic until now and it is crunch time for top and that will focus minds on what brexit will really cost the country. on top of that, we have seen news this week that, we have seen news this week that the us and sintering imposing visa requirements on uk said. i don't think they will but these are the kinds of negative news that will come out in the run—up to the withdrawal treaty being presented before parliament, if it ever gets to that point. —— imposed on uk citizens. re—going to spend a0 billion on this? what does this mean? you have to look at the political dimension of this. the big corporate businesses you were making these threats, the public is already alienating and many politicians alienate it because they feel that the interests of that kind of global corporate industrial structure is not sympathetic to the needs of the
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community. the real people. it is amazing the consistency with which public opinion manages to say, first of all, it was project beer and then protect the part two and then part three. these people are not really interested in my future, interested in their profits, as you... they provide thejobs. in their profits, as you... they provide the jobs. workmanship in their profits, as you... they provide thejobs. workmanship is very nice to talk about but we can ship results in a situation where i call up your arguments of flexibility. —— brinkmanship. we have discussed the trade elements, more of that to come. while you are here, you talk about the soundings you take from people inside west integer. you're due this week as to theresa may herself? ——
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inside westminster. she will carry through with the negotiation period because i couldn't switch horses in midstream. i don't think she will carry on until the next election. my tip is to who will be the leader of the conservatives in the next general election, i would say sergei javits who has played out a blinder. -- sajid javits who has played out a blinder. —— sajid javid. his moves to make that extraordinarily open and generous offers you use citizens leaving britain... he is home secretary, yes. he has made an offer to eu citizens which has wrong—footed brussels as they have made no compensatory offer, no similar offer to british citizens living in de you. that was not only very civil and generous but also tactically brilliant. —— living in the european union. it is now
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morally obliging to brussels to make a similar offer. if they don't, that will be a really seriously bad mark. people used to say that about britain and yet she was criticised, the government criticised for not having made that the civic offer. he has made the offer, made it clear that he will have to answer three questions, have you committed a criminal offence? have you lived here five years? do you have a permanent address? and you will have the right to move here for top a brilliant little move. he looks like and is the future of the party. he would take all these corbin boxes as well. he is generous towards europe while britain is out, the immigrant
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unity, a british obama, as it were. and comes from a working—class background. his father was a pakistani bus driver. the baxter reid to die for, politically. that would have enormous electoral appeal. —— the back story. would have enormous electoral appeal. -- the back story. boris johnson is too divisive. sajid javid would unite. boris johnson looks like the past. we still have to exit the eu with a deal or not. i wonder ifi the eu with a deal or not. i wonder if i have time to ask for your quick thoughts, we talk so much about the no deal, what would that look like actually for the rest of europe? no deal, what would that look like actually for the rest of europe7m would be catastrophic, in a sense. europe has trade relations with britain, she is a major trading partner. i don't think we could easily see her leaving the fold and
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threaten the business. more than that, it would threaten the cohesion of the eu, when a major power like britain leaves the club. and for germans it would be terrible, they would be left alone with the french! complaining all the time. they are really not the partner we once. written as a natural partner for germany. she is into free—trade, has democratic institutions which rival and mirror our own. democratic institutions which rival and mirror ourown. —— democratic institutions which rival and mirror our own. —— britain is. we would be terribly upset. angela merkel i imagine would be at the forefront of making it possible for britain to continue to have a working relationship with the eu. thoughts, of possible positivity! i hesitate to use that word. much more to discuss this —— this time next week. i hope you canjoin us again next week. thank you all for being with us.
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bye for now. hello. a glorious weekend weather ahead for many parts of top paying dry and warm. this morning, this taken by a weather watcher intense. this guy and sunshine but some cloud around full top many parts seeing high clouds turning the sunshine hazy. but mainly dry and fine. the continuing to warm up through into tomorrow. looking at the air mass, the yellow colours shows warm air in place. particularly into next week,
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you can see the russet tones coming onto the map. really warm air drifting in from the continent. a fresh start to the morning but things looking fine and dry through the afternoon. a few spots of rain for the northern ireland, western isles and highlands in scotland. breezy and cloudy. further south, some high cloud, fairweather ploughed doubling up. but winds lighter than recent days, so it will feel warmer. temperatures in the north around 17 to 19 degrees. further south, highs of around 2a of these will stop some fine evening sunshine to be enjoyed. overnight, dry and clear with cloud still for northern scotland. down the east coast as well. not as chilly and fresh as recent mites but still temperatures getting down into single figures. not too uncomfortable. and i will get warmer later in the week. high—pressure staying with us into the second half
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of the week. keeping weather fronts that day, just clearing away from shetlands. drying up here. more sunshine widely across the country compared to today. a sea breeze developing, keeping things cooler and cloudy or around the coast. temperatures up to around 25 degrees in august. 20 degrees inland. monday will be warmer with more sunshine. light winds, dry, beautiful midsummer ‘s weather. if that is how you like it. temperatures into the high 20s by monday. if you like vicky, it will continue to warm up and stay pretty sunny through next week full. we could see 30 degrees in one or two spots. —— if you like the heat. rapper suncream. in one or two spots. —— if you like the heat. rappersuncream. goodbye for now. —— grab the sunscreen. good afternoon. two years after the brexit referendum, thousands of people are gathering in central london
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to demand what they call a ‘people's vote' on the outcome of the negotiations with the eu. it comes as the german engineering firm siemens, which employs 15,000 people in the uk, called on the government to remain closely aligned with the single market. senior cabinet ministers have again said the uk is prepared to walk away from the negotiations, rather than accept a bad deal. our political correspondent nick eardley reports.
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