hello. it's wednesday, it's 10 o'clock, i'm victoria derbyshire. a rape survivor tells us exclusively she feels "revictimised" after she says herjailed abuser was invited by a council to seek custody of her son. sammy woodhouse, has waived her right to anonymity to speak to us. rotherham council gave the man that raped me and was convicted and sentenced to 35 years for what he did to me and other children, they have offered him to apply for custody of my son. she claims there are many other rapists getting custody of children conceived through abuse across the country and she wants a full investigation. we'll bring you her interview in five minutes. medics are warning that tens of thousands of women are so traumatised by giving birth that they are left with ptsd. let us know if tyou had a traumatic birth. is it time to shake up the checks which new mums have in the weeks and months after birth?

protecting our children online. earlier this year the bbc went undercover, posing as a 14—year—old girl, to expose the online sexual predators using kik — a messaging service popular with children. a grown man would be on here talking to a 14—year—old for one reason and one reason only. it is nothing innocent at all. now the same bbc team have developed a bot — an automated programme — to warn users of kik about the dangers of online grooming and provide help. so, if the bbc can do it, why can't the big tech companies? hello. welcome to the programme. we're live until 11 this morning. anxiety attacks and vivid flashbacks — some of the symptoms of post traumatic stress disorder; and they're symptoms reported today not by veterans returning

from conflict zones, but by some women after giving birth. if you had a traumatic birth, let me know what happened; use the hashtag victoria live. if you're e—mailing and are happy for us to contact you — and maybe want to take part in the programme — please include your phone number in your message. here's annita mcveigh with a summary of the day's news. the government will publish its assessment of how the various scenarios for brexit will occur for the next few years. the prime minister was in wales and northern ireland yesterday and will continue her campaign in scotland later to secure public support for her brexit deal. the chancellor philip hammond meanwhile says he accepts that remaining in the us the best thing for the british economy. if the only consideration was the economy, then

the analysis shows clearly that remaining in the european union would be at that outcome for the economy but not by much. the prime minister's deal delivers an outcome thatis minister's deal delivers an outcome that is very close to the economic benefits of remaining in while having all the political benefits of being out. clearly people do not only look at the economy, they also look at the political and constitutional benefits of exiting the european union. that is what drove the decision in the referendum vote. the uk's worst performing mental health trust has been rated inadequate for the third time that the care quality commission said bosses at the norfolk cancer that nhs foundation trust repeatedly failed to protect patients. inspectors said concerns from 2014 we re inspectors said concerns from 2014 were yet to be addressed. it was described how patients had self

harmed and taken overdoses due to a lack of self care. of ireland storm has swept through sydney and surrounding areas causing power cuts and transport delays. —— a violent storm sydney had its average monthly rainfall in two hours. a 14—year—old boy died in an accident on his way to school. a preliminary report into last month's deadly indonesian plane crash has found the jet involved was not a worthy. the boeing 737 operated by lion air nosedived into the java sea killing everyone on board. the indonesian transport safety commission noted that pilots experienced similar technical problems to those on its final journey. the telecoms regulator has capped the cost of calls to directory enquiries at £3.65 for 90

seconds. 0fcom said it was responding to a steep rise in prices. the popular service 118 118 charges £60 for a call. that is the latest bbc news. thousands of women are believed to have undiagnosed ptsd following birth. we will talk about at 10:30am. send us an e—mail. use the hash tag victoria live on twitter and there is facebook and whatsapp as well. a rape survivor has told this programme she wants a full investigation after she says herjailed abuser was invited by a council to seek custody of her son. sammy woodhouse has waived her right to anonymity

to speak out about the case. she was groomed and sexually abused by arshid hussain who's serving 35 years injailfor grooming dozens of young girls in rotherham. she says what the council have done is "outrageous" and claims other rapists are being consulted about the future of children across the country. she told me more about the action rotherham council had taken. rotherham council gave the man that raped me and was convicted and sentenced to 35 years for what he did to me and other children, they have offered him to apply for custody of my son. not only have they done that, they've done that without my permission. they didn't tell me. but even though i've proved that he is a danger to himself, to children around the country and to my son as well. and is it custody, or is it access to your son? no, they asked him to apply for custody so then he could make all the parental decisions.

so how about woodwork as he's in prison for 35 years, he would decide where my son would live and make all the decisions and then my son would go and visit him in prison, which is just absolutely outrageous. and i'm not the only person that's going through this, there are women all over the country that have to share access with their children to the men that raped them. they have to see them, they are cross—examined by them, they have to ask their permission for things. you know, i even tried to apply for a passport for my son to go on holiday and they got back in touch and said i needed to ask his permission. now, not only is this man, you know, he's not on the birth certificate, i was never married to him, but he is a danger to me and my son. mmm. and you have courageously spoken to our audience before on this programme, sammy, to explain that when you were a teenager, when you were 15, this man who you're referring

to who's now in jail, arshid hussain, raped you. you became pregnant as a result. how could anyone think it appropriate to consult hussain about your son's care? well, i'd like to know the answer to that as well. and, you know, i'm still trying to find out answers. rotherham council are saying that, actually, they've worked within the law and they have to do that. the ministry ofjustice is saying, well, actually, no, you don't. legally, i have no idea what my rights are, just like many women don't. there's no support for people like myself in dealing with these kind of situations. you know, everything isjust pretty much up in the air. nobody seems to know what the law is. and for me, whether this is something that the law says they have to do or not, it's wrong because of what has happened, what he's done to myself, what he's done to my son, to other people. we're constantly being re—victimised.

and as a rape victim, i'm constantly told, well, actually, he's got his human rights. well, what about my human rights, what about other people's human rights and our children and our fight to constantly have to keep our children safe? and my kind of main issue as well is, i have to fight every single day for something and what that all boils down to is just to be treated like a human being. so does what rotherham council have done, does that re—victimise you? yes, it does. i mean, i've had a while for this decision to kind of digest and to deal with it, but i'm just still in shock. i'm still kind of asking myself, how is this possible? look at everything that rotherham council have done in the past. they've allowed and neglected and covered up thousands of children being raped. we hear the famous line, lessons have been learned. clearly, lessons aren't being learned. you know, what they should have done is, if they thought this was in the law, it is to fight that law and say, well, actually, we know that he's a danger to this child. because they do know

because i've got it in writing. and they should have fought for that child, and they haven't done that. what they've done is, you know, handed my son over on a plate to a rapist and said, there you go. i mean, you know, we note that hussain is in prison for decades. we know he's ruined the lives of dozens and dozens of children and young teenagers, like yourself. apart from anything else, it's a safeguarding issue. itjust doesn't make sense, does it? exactly. and as i say, this is something that's notjust happening to myself, i'm speaking to women all the country. their rapists are getting custody. as well, when these rapists are getting custody, the mother is only allowed to see the child a few times a year. so, you know, it'sjust absolutely horrendous. i find it really difficult to actually put all this into words, i really do. mmm. does your son want anything to do

with arshid hussain? my son has given me permission to speak out. he's saying that the man that he doesn't want anything to do with him. —— at the moment. it's in the past, he wants to move forward. and what i found really... what's your message to the ministry ofjustice, to the government? i want a change in law to ensure that no rapist can access children conceived through rape and abuse. i want a full investigation notjust on to what's happened in my case, but a national one. a way for mothers like myself to come forward and say what's happening in the family courts. now, the family courts, you're not allowed to speak about anything until the child is 18. so, not only is this happening, but it's happening in secret. you know, i want better rights for people like myself and i want us to be treated like human beings. sammy, thank you very much for talking to us. we appreciate your time, thank you. thank you. we of course approached rotherham council for comment on this story.

they have not yet responded. however, a spokesman for the council told one newspaper that he was not allowed to discuss individual cases in the family courts, but "like all councils we must comply with legal requirements and that would include giving notice of proceedings to parents with or without formal parental responsibility". sarah champion is the labour mp for rotherham and a leading campaigner on child sex exploitation. good morning. what is your reaction? utter disgust and incredulity. it is another example of how victims are re—traumatised again and again by the system designed to protect them. i have got to the point where i wonder if the law does favour perpetrators rather than the big

teams because this sort of thing keeps on happening. does it? —— the victims. family courts are used by perpetrators to get access to victims and re—traumatised them. it has become a lot worse since legal aid almost completely disappeared because the actual perpetrators are able to cross examine the women they have traumatised. in no other court situation does that happen and perpetrators know this and exploit it. sammy's case isjust perpetrators know this and exploit it. sammy's case is just an abomination of what has gone on. whether it is a grotesque error on the part of the council or whether they are acting within the guidelines, i havejust read the statement. it would suggest they believe they are acting within the guidelines but we also have a statement from the government that says, existing court rules are very clear that applicants in care proceeding should only ever notify people with parent or responsibility

for the child. could that include a rapist? that is the question. could it? that is the question social workers and councils are having to come to a conclusion on. it should be absolutely black and white. my frustration is that guidance is a simple thing. a minister by the end of today could sign of new guidance on this that makes it crystal clear that any rapist, any abuse, anyone who is an ongoing risk to a child does not have the right to comment on theirfuture. does not have the right to comment on their future. they could do that today and made do not. they shudder out to the council is to make their interpretations. —— they shove it out. you should not be about interpretation, it should be black and white. i do not understand it from a safeguarding point of view cause if you're a jailed sex offender you have read dozens of young girls. there is a possibility

young girls. there is a possibility you might be a threat to any child conceived through that abuse. you might be a threat to any child conceived through that abuselj would say it is more than a possibility. i would say it is a probability that you will and therefore, if social workers are looking at the best interests for that child from the point of view of safeguarding alone, this should never have happened. sammy has gone through the most horrendous thing for decades now. she chose to wave her anonymity and come forward about this specific think they're specifically to prevent it happening to other children and other women but she should not have to. we, as a country, need to go through all the legislation and guidelines to make sure victims are not being consistently re—traumatised. sammy is amazing but she needs to be able to live her life as well. i know she does all of thisjust to live her life as well. i know she does all of this just to prevent it happening to other people but we need to rally behind her and give her support now. she is incredible.

would you back her call for a full investigation into what she says has happened to her and potentially a change in the law? what she is asking its very modest compared with the trauma she is going through and women up the trauma she is going through and women up and down the country are going through. i been on the phone to the home office and spoken to the council. the oj is proving a little more difficult but if there is the will and please, god, there has to be the will now, this can get changed really quickly by changing the guidance. neville says on e—mail, i do not know what rotherham council is thinking of to even think of giving custody to a rapist. that is ridiculous. johnny on twitter says could just when you thought things could get no worse, what is going on in rotherham? sammy woodhouse should never be going through all of this. it is unacceptable. sarah champion said it is proving more difficult to get through to the ministry ofjustice.

we are talking to a ministry of justice minister about no—fault divorces before the end of the programme. we will see her response. we will also talk to parents about that. there are suggestions it could have a massive detrimental effect on children's mental health and academic performance. the mental health charity, mind, is calling for england's health secretary to step in and take action over the uk's worst performing mental health trust. the regulator, the care quality commission, gave norfolk and suffolk nhs foundation trust weeks to improve safety. inspectors said concerns from 2014 had yet to be addressed. the report described how patients had self—harmed and taken overdoses because of a lack of care. let's talk to sue willgoss, whose son daniel took his own life this summer aged 25. daniel had severe mental health issues. he'd been getting treatment from norfolk and suffolk nhs trust. anne humphrys is from the suffolk parent carer network.

her daughter was treated by the trust and has since made a good recovery and norman lamb, a former health minister and lib dem mp for norfolk north. welcome to all of you. thank you for coming onto the programme. sue, your son always had complex mental health needs but really faced a crisis in march when he split from his girlfriend. you were calling the trust. what kind of help were they offering? very little. my first call to them. after to weeks i ended up calling again to get a response. he ended up with a very —— with very shortly afterwards us having to call the police to keep him safe because he had gone into deep crisis. he wa nted he had gone into deep crisis. he wanted to die. he thought suicidal

thoughts every day but that night we ended up calling, having to call the police because we had called the crisis team and they had refused to come out and let us take him over. they refuse to give us access to his ca re they refuse to give us access to his care plan. is this the time when he was smashing windows were cutting his arms and so on and so forth? he had smashed his way through an internal door window to cut his arm. he had tried tojump out of internal door window to cut his arm. he had tried to jump out of the window upstairs. the next day he did not remember any of this book when he went into that kind of episode he needed keeping safe. unfortunately he ended up in a police cell and ended up being charged. it is... following on from that we did eventually have a visit from a

member of the youth team. although i had warned he probably would not meet with this person because he was unfamiliar to daniel. he still came but daniel would not come out of his room to talk to him. to or three weeks later we then eventually got another visit from somebody who daniel had seen before and during the discussion in that meeting with daniel and myself he was actually offered a phone app of mindfulness and he's said, no, no, i don't need that, i need proper help. he explained he needed something specifically for him will stop because of his autism things had to because of his autism things had to be adapted and modified because of his needs. i got in touch with the trust again, or with the team again, andi trust again, or with the team again, and i said he really does want some i waited and he did not get a call

back. within a week daniel had taken his life. 0h, back. within a week daniel had taken his life. oh, my goodness! i am so sorry. his treatment over the years has fallen short badly for what he needed. how do you respond to what has happened to sue and daniel? we know sue and we are so desperately sorry for her loss and the trauma herfamily sorry for her loss and the trauma her family has gone through. unfortunately it is not unusual. this is not an unusual experience. families are going to extremes and being told young people are not ill enough yet to access a service. they are being forced to become more ill and make attempts on their life and even then they are not accepted into services. i can hear you agreeing with that you have come across that as well. i have. i heart goes out to

sue. deep condolences to her. when you read the report you hear there has been a practice of downgrading urgent referrals to a phone call a month later. if you think about it, those urgent referrals may be of people who are at risk of losing their lives. my fear with this whole process is doing more of the same, beating them over the head even harder... this would be the first time this has failed. -- the third time. the secret of any organisation are the people who work in it. the caring rate is good. i was with someone caring rate is good. i was with someone for the —— from the brilliant perinatal team yesterday. imagine the morale of them being told they are useless. when you read the report time and again it says that staff are disempower do not listen to buy the senior management

team. we need inspiring leadership for people in an organisation. this is what the current leader says, the chief executive of the trust. we are disappointed with the findings of the care quality commission but we accept their recommendations. we recognise the actions we have taken so far have not resulted in the rapid process which the sea qc and our trust had hoped for. -- sea qc. a new plan has been prepared by the leadership which has not involve ca re rs leadership which has not involve carers and people who use the service. that is a fundamental mistake that we have to work with the people you are serving. the mental health charity, mind, is calling for the health secretary to step in. would you back about? definitely. something radical and pretty quick needs to happen. otherwise there will be a lot more people like daniel and that must not

happen. we are asking for his intervention as well. mental health services in suffolk and norfolk are broken. we do not believe the trust can broken. we do not believe the trust ca n recover broken. we do not believe the trust can recover and we believe there needs to be some intervention in terms of leadership, putting the trust into special administration and bringing new leadership. fundamentally we need to design a different way of services. fundamentally we need to design a different way of serviceslj fundamentally we need to design a different way of services. i think you need a fresh start, absolutely, but you need to address the culture of the organisation. worcester hospital is doing that. they are looking at the whole way in which people work in the organisation from the very top to the bottom. this trust needs to adopt that approach. would you back the health secretary stepping in? i would. i think we need a fresh start now. and if you've been affected by any of the issues we've been talking about, please do visit the bbc action line website, where you can find details of organisations you can contact for information, advice and support.

plenty of us are worried about what our children are exposed to online — each month there seems to be a new "must have app" for our kids, that turns out to be a magnet for predators seeking out the vulnerable. the nspcc calls it the "wild, wild web" and reported more than 3,000 grooming offences last year. 0ur correspondent, angus crawford, has been inviestigating one particular messaging app called kik, which claims to have 300 million users worldwide. it is popular with teenagers, has many anonymous accounts and is easy to sign up for using false details and the bbc‘s investigation earlier this year found that the app has featured in more than a thousand child sexual abuse cases in the last five years. frustrated by what seems to be a lack of action by big tech companies, the bbc got busy themselves to see if they could create a tech solution to the problem. this is kik, a messaging app with 300 million users —

loved by teenagers, but a magnet for predators. a bbc investigation, a fake account and, within seconds, this. grooming. obscene requests and pictures. we reported on it, but then decided to do something about it. with the help of kush, an internet safety campaigner. she's an adult, but posed as a 14—year—old on kik. we filmed the results. these are just some of the messages she received. and he asked, "are you a naughty 14 year old?" we turned her experience into a bot, bbc chat safe, an automated programme that we then put back onto kik. click on the bot, it tells

you about the dangers of chat and plays hard—hitting videos. giving advice to young people, showing them where to get help and warning predators that what they're doing is harmful and illegal. a grown man would be on here talking to a 14—year—old for one reason and one reason only. it's nothing innocent at all. the bbc chat safe bot, there to protect children. if we can do it, why can't big tech? angus is here. why did you come up with this bot? really a sense of frustration. for the last four or five years i have done numerous reports about the problems with facebook, lively and

then kik. we would do reports and discover something disturbing about access to predators for young people on smartphones via their bedrooms, for example. the report would go out and lots of people would get upset and lots of people would get upset and we would not see any major changes in tech. i thought, i wonder if we could try and use big tech to try and intervene for that my colleague tony smith said why don't we create a bot, an automated programme, plays it back into this particular messaging app, kik. with a tiny budget and knowing nothing about programming and software, we created this... it is very primitive, not a magic bullet. we placed into kik. it has groups in which you can chat. we have been placing it manually in there and seeing what happens. people do not like it. when you say people who do

you mean would—be predators? like it. when you say people who do you mean would-be predators? we have been searching for groups with very obvious names. we place in and all ofa obvious names. we place in and all of a sudden it goes very quiet. people leave the group in droves. it isa people leave the group in droves. it is a very simple intervention. it does not solve anything, it is very blunt and analog. it is not working on al, looking for patterns of behaviour and connections or children may be making, patterns of speech, potentially risky selfie. it is not where we would want to be, where you would want to spend a huge amount of money and use ai where you would want to spend a huge amount of money and use al to track past behaviours to predict future behaviours. because you have been able to do this on a tiny budget without being experts can of course that means that tech companies could absolutely do something sophisticated to disrupt would—be predators. they can. i would not wa nt to predators. they can. i would not want to say they are not doing anything. some of them are doing a certain amount. facebook has

improved its algorithms, it has a lot of human moderators. the government has really committed to this. there is a lot more they can do. the scale of the problem is huge. that is one problem. verification of children online, who is who they say they are is a big problem. the key thing is willingness. if we live in an era of data scraping, if you like capitalism by surveillance, which essentially this is what it is, anything that gets in its way will bea anything that gets in its way will be a problem. kik did respond the last time we did this report, they have not responded to this most recent bot. they said they take on mine safety very seriously and are co nsta ntly mine safety very seriously and are constantly assessing and improving trust and safety measures and will provide resources to parents and strengthen relationships with law enforcement. thank you. we will talk more about this. let's talk to deepa tewari, who has created the world's first artificial intelligence—powered online safety assistant

for children. it's called 0yoty. and dr rachel o'connell — an internet safety expert who was formerly chief security officer at bebo. deepak, what do you think of the bbc‘s own bot? bbc chat safe? yeah ? the service the bbc is planning is quite phenomenal, it's probably the first service done at scale which will empower kids to be in command and it's a huge step in the right direction. what do you think? i think it's highly laudable and something the internet industry should engage with, and we should equip people with the ability to leverage technology to protect children on line and that will push people to come to the table ?

eve ryo ne people to come to the table ? everyone knows it's possible, everyone. this is true, but up until now industry has said, back in the late 19905 and the 2000 applause industry said and i know because i was an industry person, you would see the light of legislation was so rapid, we will self regulate and tell you how we are doing. that meant there was no impetus to deploy resources and money toward5 technological innovation and i think in the recent months and since the general data protection regulation came in, there are rules now, companies will process the data of anyone under the age of 16 who must obtain parental consent and are complicit in that it is age czech children under the age of 16. bu5ine55e5 know the age band of the children and then they can create 5afer digital 5pace5 so we are at a inflection point and it's fantastic that bbc is urging the government to

do more. you have developed 0yoty which urges apps to recognise risky selfies, risky connections and possible grooming, briefly and concisely explain how it works and how reliable it is? 0yoty is one of the applications we have is a demonstrator of a larger underlying technology which is inaudible that children might experience in real—time and online, the idea being that with all of this identified within their phones in a very private manner, the children can then be offered interventions both technical and educational. the example is if someone has taken a selfie inaudible could see do you want to share this because this is what could happen and show them a scenario in terms of

what other kids have faced, similar situations, it becomes a way to rethink. is it working, do you have evidence that kids are having second thoughts for example? evidence that kids are having second thoughts for example ?|j evidence that kids are having second thoughts for example? i can give you the inaudible we did trials of about inaudible is also the basis for interaction you have with larger platforms so i can tell you you will probably find the same technology growing into other platforms as well. so it definitely does work. and it's in the same theme as what will go out in the bbc service at scale, so to say, in the same measure and it definitely works. the best thing is during ourfirst definitely works. the best thing is during our first inaudible we were able to identify more than 300 pieces of inaudible

shared online which were definitely not meant to be shared online. shared online which were definitely not meant to be shared onlinelj will policy because the line is really bad but i am getting everything you are saying it's just everything you are saying it's just every other word is cutting out, but i understand what you have told us. rachel, in terms of the cost for big tech companies introducing the technology just described, tech companies introducing the technologyjust described, is it a big deal, even though the scale we know is massive of predators online? the companies i found it conduct those checks, we verify that you have parental responsibility for these children and tell the company these children and tell the company the age band the children fall into. it is talking iced, so the cost is minimal, absolutely minimal. and the average minimal, absolutely minimal. and the ave rage revenue minimal, absolutely minimal. and the average revenue per user for netflix for example is $44 per month, from advertising, so they have the money to afford it, money should not be a barrier to keeping children safe

online. thank you both very much. later in the programme... we speak to a woman who was left so traumatised by childbirth that it gave her ptsd. medics says she is one of tens of thousands who experience extreme birth trauma every year and tests for young mums need a shake—up to provide more help. and we'll speak to parents about a campaign to make divorce less acrimonious — as research seen by this programme suggests it could have a massive detrimental effect on children's mental health and academic perfomance. anxiety attacks, a fear of death, and vivid flashbacks. those are just three of the symptoms of post traumatic stress disorder; and they're symptons reported not by veterans returning from conflict zones, but by some women after giving birth. exclusive new research seen by bbc yorkshire estimates one

in every 25 women who has a baby experience some of these symptoms — but they're not getting the help and support they need. researchers at city university in london looked at data from almost 35,000 women — some of it included questionaires where they describe symptoms of ptsd. in many cases it isn't diagnosed or is confused with post natal depression — something campaigners say isn't good enough. they say more more training is needed to spot the signs of ptsd and get women the help they need. dr rebecca moore is a consultant perinatal psychiatrist. she's from the royal college of psychiatrists who say more needs to be done to get ptsd diagnsosed properly. and sophie sanchez is in cardiff this morning. she gave birth almost five months ago. she has herfirst session of therapy for ptsd next week. sophie, tell our audience why you

are having therapy for ptsd?” sophie, tell our audience why you are having therapy for ptsd? i had quite a difficult pregnancy and then bath and after that there was quite a serious medical complication and at that time i genuinely believed i was going to die. and after that happens i could not get over that so even when i was back at home i was so convinced i should have died that i thought my being alive was hindering my daughter being alive. soi hindering my daughter being alive. so i was having extreme nightmares, vision is that she had died, screaming vision is that she had died, screaming every vision is that she had died, screaming every time i thought they we re screaming every time i thought they were going to take me away and operate on me and i was not going to see her again. extreme anxiety, i still cannot leave my daughter which is why i am on skype because i had to have her in the same room as me because i am so frightened of leaving her even for a minute that i

think something is going to happen to her. goodness. how long is your labour? it was 54 hours of active labour? it was 54 hours of active labour and then labour? it was 54 hours of active labourand then an labour? it was 54 hours of active labour and then an eventual c—section. that part was actually 0k, immediately after the birth, although it was dramatic and horrendous they gave me the baby immediately afterwards on the operating table and i cried with happiness. but then i started vomiting and they took her away from me and! vomiting and they took her away from me and i did not get to hold her again forfour days after me and i did not get to hold her again for four days after and it was that full day period when there was just more and more complications going on with me that ijust, that's the part i could not get over. i did not know what was happening to me. it was not getting the initial bonding, i could not feed her and i was so bonding, i could not feed her and i was so frightened. how did midwives, health visitors and your gp respond to what you are telling them about

the trauma ? to what you are telling them about the trauma? they responded differently. my community midwife newly before the birth and recognised immediately that i was obviously suffering. when she came to see me i was screaming and crying, i thought people were trying to kill me. and because she knew me before she instantly realised something was going on and referred me. however the problem was that sort of information was not getting passed on so every time i was put into a new ward when i was discharged to see a new person they did not really realise the seriousness. when i have been to see doctors and gp polls since because i don't have postnatal depression, some people with ptsd do but i don't so some people with ptsd do but i don't so i'm not having any of those symptoms. because i am able to rationalise it when i'm not in crisis i was dismissed as having

baby blues, normal new mum anxiety and they did not realise. at one point about five weeks ago it got so serious that i told my husband i would take myself to a psychiatric hospital because i was so scared no one was paying attention to me then luckily i saw an amazing gp who has sorted me out. that's brilliant to hear, at that point i will bring in doctor rebecca from the royal couege doctor rebecca from the royal college of psychiatrists. first of all what is your reaction to what happened to sophie? it's absolutely awful to hear that, i think it's a story i hear every week from women, that they are, a lot of women are currently being traumatised by birth in the uk. that are shocking, nicola says i was 17 when i had my son, it was a difficult pregnancy and after being in labour for 17 was a difficult pregnancy and after being in labourfor 17 hours i was left in crippling pain which is difficult for anyone to deal with let alone a mum at 17. one day after

giving birth i was sobbing in my hospital bed and a midwife came in and ina hospital bed and a midwife came in and in a judgment away looked at me and in a judgment away looked at me and said why are you crying, what is wrong with you? any time you try to speak about it it's as if you are told to stop complaining and get on with it and you are being selfish because you have someone else to think about. i mean, in terms of medical professionals recognising symptoms of ptsd it's obviously not happening is it? i don't think it is widely enough and that is why one of the campaigns we are pushing for is that there is not the awareness of how severe birth trauma can impact someone how severe birth trauma can impact someone and their whole life. we commonly have people contacting us from all around the uk, this is happening everywhere, we have women contacting us 20 years after their birth experience that have never had a diagnosis. we are pushing for mandatory training for everyone involved in every profession, g's

health visitors, midwives, because until we can properly diagnose birth trauma then we cannot go on to provide proper treatment and we know that many women as has been illustrated so clearly here are being told they are depressed when actually they are not. they have a trauma or ptsd. when you are a new mum you get seen at six weeks, you're supposed to be seen at six weeks by a health visitor. i remember the health visitor asking ifi remember the health visitor asking if i thought i was depressed and i saidi if i thought i was depressed and i said i did not think so and that was literally at. so what should happen if you are now saying professionals have to look out for symptoms of potential ptsd? in reality it's quite easy and quick to do but often we don't ask when and how was your bath and give them a space to tell the story of the birth. commonly people will say no one has asked me about this and in terms of screening we effectively screened for depression at the six week check. we effectively screened for depression at the six week checkm was not particularly effective in my case. i think it has changed and

there is more of a focus on making ita there is more of a focus on making it a better experience for women but we are told some women don't have a six week czech or to tick box exercise. we need to look the key symptoms and empower who is doing that check to have an awareness of trauma and be able to ask questions sensitively. you have explained that you are there rather than alongside us in the studio because you cannot leave your baby daughter for a second. that's not sustainable, is it? no, and that! second. that's not sustainable, is it? no, and that i think has made these last four and a half months really, really ha rd these last four and a half months really, really hard for me because i don't want to be like this. i see women in coffee shops talking to one another and having a nice time and it makes me so upset because even though i can do those things i am co nsta ntly though i can do those things i am constantly checking my baby is breathing, looking at her all the time, i cannot go to the bathroom without her. it's taken away a lot of the fun i should be having with

her in these last few months. how do you feel about the future? well, you know, i am trying really hard not to think about returning to work. my initial plan was to return in january but that's not happening. i don't really know. i try really hard not to think about it because it's one of those, it's a trigger. i will lie in bed and think oh my god, i have to leave her next month to go toa have to leave her next month to go to a wedding or next year to return to a wedding or next year to return to work and i just want think about it. just deal with the day in front of you? yeah. thank you very much sophie and thank you for being so honest, it's a real help because other people will be watching having experienced something similar and they might not have recognised it was ptsd and can now do something about it so you have really helped. more messages, lisa says i suffered a traumatic labour which ended in my

son suffering a severe brain injury, i was told i would be offered priority counselling which three yea rs later priority counselling which three years later i'm still not had, i ended up finally paying privately andi ended up finally paying privately and i was diagnosed with ptsd. this e—mail so is my son and his wife had their first baby recently and he is finding it hard to cope with what he experienced during the traumatic birth, not being prepared for it at all and birth, not being prepared for it at allandi birth, not being prepared for it at all and i don't know how to help him. what would you advise? we know dads can be affected as much as mums so dads can be affected as much as mums so the first protocol is try to speak to your so the first protocol is try to speakto yourgp so the first protocol is try to speak to your gp or look online, we have resources for fathers and we are mapping out a national map of birth trauma services for families, not just birth trauma services for families, notjust mums, birth trauma services for families, not just mums, mums birth trauma services for families, notjust mums, mums and dads. another one, for now, there are so many, this text says i am traumatised by my delivery in september, i developed pre—eclampsia with a soaring blood pressure which requires painful treatments and lead toa requires painful treatments and lead to a c—section at 28 weeks. my son is still in hospital in special care

requiring oxygen nine weeks later. i have been frightened beyond anything i had have been frightened beyond anything ihad imagined. have been frightened beyond anything i had imagined. iam sure many women are similar but i was telling a friend a few weeks ago that i thought i may be high had some symptoms of ptsd. gladly the level of distress is mildly damning with the passing of time. thank you for yourtime, the passing of time. thank you for your time, thank you for coming in. the impact of divorce isn'tjust felt by the separating couple. it can hit children particularly hard. research seen by this programme suggests four out of five people think the fallout from a divorce has a detrimental effect on children's mental health. the study has been carried for resolution — which represents more than six thousand family lawyers and professionals. they found that 71% of people in this country want the law changed to make divorce less acrimonious — a change the government are currently considering. campaigners and divorce lawyers say the law as it stands forces people either to stay in unappy relationships or look for blame where there is none. a group of them from resolution are going to westminster today to brief mp5 on their proposals for so—called "no fault" divorce.

let's talk now to victor trykush who has been going through a divorce for the last five years. mark taylor and dilly 0rme who have just got divorced using a service called amicable and are still — obviously — on speaking terms. and lucy frazer — the conservative ministry ofjustice minister responsible for family law. thank you all for coming on the programme. i would like to start with you if i may, recently divorced, how did the current law affected the way you two decided to separate? we were actually separated for two years separate? we were actually separated for two yea rs before separate? we were actually separated for two years before we went through the divorce process. so we didn't have to apportion blame. 0ur overall approach was to keep things as harmonious as possible for our

family, that was important to us. we have two mac teenage girls and we just wanted things to be as easy as possible for them, really. was it a convenience thing that you had been separated for two years or did you separated for two years or did you separate and think we have to wait two years to get the divorce? separate and think we have to wait two years to get the divorce ?m separate and think we have to wait two years to get the divorce? it was not planned in that sense but a certain amount of time had elapsed and there came a point that it became natural to progress to divorce but it just became natural to progress to divorce but itjust so happened that was after the usual period. and you used amicable, what is that? it's an online service, the way we worked things out was that we arranged our finances between ourselves with a lot of support from my dad i have to say. was he the accountant? just a caring father? he wasjust

incredibly supportive. he spent a lot of time talking at all through with me. so we didn't have mediation, we set our finances between ourselves and then amicable put things in place for us as far as the paperwork and everything was concerned. when we worked with them we had an exact idea of what the process was going to be and also the cost, what the costs were going to be. victor, hello. how are you? i am 0k, be. victor, hello. how are you? i am ok, thank you. be. victor, hello. how are you? i am 0k, thank you. you are still trying to divorce your wife, it's been going on forfive to divorce your wife, it's been going on for five years i understand, and it began when your twin daughters were not yet one—year—old, what impact is this having on you, your partner, your children? it's twins, a boy and a girl but that is ok. we live in a small community in gloucestershire so small community in gloucestershire so it impacts the community,

bringing it into us. you know, in the early days people, well meaning people took sides, give advice which in some cases inflame the situation and you find yourself in a situation where in order to defend yourself you say things and then someone else or something back and itjust prolongs the agony. i had to get through it as peacefully as possible but once the accusations start flying i may need to be investigated through the courts that is what has prolonged it up until this point. saw the current legislation, is that, how would you describe it through the prism of your own family? i take consolation from the fa ct family? i take consolation from the fact that it's better now than what it was but five years down the line

here we are. it cannot be having a beneficial effect on any of you can it? no, the consolation is that for the children a family member has two mac homes and they have grown up to believe that living in two are three homes is an ok thing and they have carved their way through it nicely. but of course the whole time my concern is for them, how do we protect them and shield them from any unnecessary pain and suffering? mac with a no—fault divorce have been better for you if mac with a no—fault divorce have been betterfor you if it mac with a no—fault divorce have been better for you if it was available? i think so, been better for you if it was available? ithink so, if been better for you if it was available? i think so, if you start on an equal footing, there is no blame, you are two people who once upona time blame, you are two people who once upon a time loved one another and no longer love one another. you've got to find a way to separate and go your own ways. the simpler we can make that the better. pelissie thank you for coming on the programme, responsible forfamily

you for coming on the programme, responsible for family law, when you for coming on the programme, responsible forfamily law, when is the long change going to happen? we are doing a consultation at the moment and we need to look at the consultation and we would like to bring things forward as soon as possible, hearing everyone today this is exactly the reason why we are doing it, marriage is an important and valuable part of society and we value it but once a couple decides to get divorce we wa nt couple decides to get divorce we want to take the acrimony out specifically for the children. we think it's important to minimise blame, conflict and that is why we are doing this. why is it taking so long? we have acted quite quickly ? it is all relative. we mac this legislation has been through the house before but we've acted quite quickly, we are in the middle of the consultation and we would like to bring it forward. what you see two

opponents who say this is going to undermine marriage, it makes it too easy? we absolutely don't want to undermine marriage, children who grow up in a marriage, statistically have better outcomes. we need to support marriage but this is about taking the acrimony out of divorce once people have decided to end it. people don't think about what is the legal process, it's quick so i will do it. nobody sat here today thought about the legal process before they started on that journey. is that true? yeah. even in a situation like ourselves where we had reached an amicable agreement around the divorce process, then it took months and months because the process does not support the idea of no—fault divorce, the idea of? sorry to interrupt but the argument is that

knowing, if the legislation is changed and it looks like it's going to be, knowing you can have a no—fault divorce makes it quicker and easier and that undermines the institution of marriage. we have seen institution of marriage. we have seen internationally that it does not, in scotland the law changed to one year wait and there was a spike initially when those people who are waiting to get divorced, the numbers we nt waiting to get divorced, the numbers went up but after that the numbers will remaining constant. so there is not evidence to show if you change the process it affects the divorce rate. i think the reality is the separation and divorce is an enormously traumatic experience and there is no reason the law should exacerbate something which is emotionally so difficult anyway. understood. before the end of the programme if i may ask you as a ministry ofjustice minister responsible forfamily ministry ofjustice minister responsible for family law about the case of sammy woodhouse who was on a programme, she said her counsel,

rotherham council have invited a child abuser to seek —— her abuser who is injailto child abuser to seek —— her abuser who is injail to seek child abuser to seek —— her abuser who is in jail to seek access to her son, what do you think of this? it's a terrible case, she has been through a terrible time and this is dramatic, the ministry ofjustice is looking into this particular case. it isa looking into this particular case. it is a question of whether rotherham council have made a mistake, they say they are going by the guidelines are whether this is permissible under the current legislation. it has the power to apply to court but not to contact oura parent apply to court but not to contact our a parent but we are looking at the facts of this particular case. do you think it is appropriate?” completely feel that what sammy has gone through must be dreadful and i feel very sorry for her. thank you

very much for talking to us. the conservative ministry ofjustice minister responsible for family law. i want to ask you finally recently divorced, in terms of your teenage children, how are they? they are in good spirits i think. i think with teenagers they are embarking on their own lives so it's quite difficult to instil set rules of when they will see mark, so for example we keep things quite fluid. seeing him in a constant way and not restricting too much, again we've just worked it all out between ourselves. i think the reality is they have not seen us going at it hammerand they have not seen us going at it hammer and tongs they have not seen us going at it hammerand tongs and they have not seen us going at it hammer and tongs and i think that can only be a good thing. absolutely. it is refreshing to hear this, that you are looking for ways to build bridges rather than fire

bullets which is often the case in separation. i am gratefulfor bullets which is often the case in separation. i am grateful for all of you talking so honestly, thank you for your time, we appreciate it. thanks for your company, we are back tomorrow at ten and bbc newsroom light is next, have a lovely day. some very strong winds buffeting the uk today with the strongest of them targeting the western side of the country where we could see gusts up to 60-70, country where we could see gusts up to 60—70, likely to be some transport disruption out and about, we could have power supply problems as well. outbreaks of rain spreading to most areas, at its heaviest across northern ireland into scotla nd across northern ireland into scotland where it could cause issues but the gales will be widespread, so a very blustery working day. the

strongest winds targeting scotland as we go through the afternoon and for the evening rush hour so conditions will be pretty bad here on the road but overnight for the northern isles it could be stronger gusts up to 75. it will be blowing nationwide with the heavy rain causing impacts across scotland, the rain cleaving from northern ireland followed by showers but it will stay blustery and there are plenty of showers across western parts of the uk as well, staying windy, some strengthening of the winds but not as strong as the winds that bit further west. you're watching bbc newsroom live, it's11am and these are the main stories this morning:

a rape survivor in rotherham waves her anoynymity to call for action after she says herjailed abuser was told by a council he could apply for access to the son conceived through the assault. i want iwanta i want a change in the law to ensure that no children conceived through rain are allowed access. notjust for my case, but a national one. notjust for my case, but a national one. the financial impact of brexit, the government's official figures on how leaving the eu will affect the economy are published today. unsafe and understaffed, england's worst performing mental health trust is given weeks to improve by inspectors. problems for the police, a new report says there are significant legal and ethical challenges with the use of facial