tv BBC News Special BBC News December 12, 2018 8:30pm-9:01pm GMT
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will v“ 5 ‘ur v“ war fit 5:th will bring it back on a bbc news we will bring it back on a bbc news special which will be hosted by my colleague andrew neil, which starts now. for british politics, as conservative mps vote on the future of prime minister theresa may. she's fighting to stay in herjob to deliver her brexit deal. but there are tories who want her to go now, and for a different leader to deliver a different deal. tonight, the fate of the prime minister is in the hands of her own mps. we'll be live in parliament for the result. good evening and welcome to this bbc news special on theresa may's fight to stay as leader of the conservative party and prime minister of the united kingdom. early this morning, it was revealed
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that there were enough tory mps disillusioned with mrs may's leadership to trigger a vote of no confidence in her. it's a vote in which only tory mps have a say and it's been taking place in a commons committee room tonight. the moment mrs may knew it was on, she came out fighting. sirgraham sir graham brady has confirmed that he has received 48 letters from conservative mps, so there will now bea conservative mps, so there will now be a vote of confidence in my leadership of the conservative party. i will contest that vote with everything i've got. the votes are now being counted. we expect the result around nine o'clock. earlier this evening, the prime minister made her pitch to conservative mps. in a major and emotional concession to her critics, she said that, though she dearly wanted to, she would not lead the tories into the next general election. so, whatever tory mps decide, the conservative party
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tonight is on the brink of a new leadership contest. the bbc‘s deputy political editor, john pienaar, joins us now. in advance of the results, john, this is the big news of the night, she won't lead the tories into another election — does that suggest to you that her position was weaker than we thought? i think it is an acknowledgement of the weakness of her position. i think behind the scenes at westminster, around the conservative party, it has been held for a long while, perhaps ever since the rather disastrous victory of the snap election last year, that they did not want theresa may to lead them through another election and he was always on borrowed time. it was not clear that theresa may saw it that way, but now it is clear that she does agonise that and she is effectively saying that if we can get to the next stage of negotiations, it won't be me, it will be someone else. we have seen motions of no confidence in governments on the floor of the
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house of commons, where everybody gets a chance to vote and when they lose, governments can fall as a result, but this is not one of these, this is no confidence triggered by her own side, in which only tory mps vote, how has it come to this? the no confidence vote was driven by essential if hardline brexiteers who detested theresa may's compromise plan with brussels from the outset and then came to be frustrated and angry that there was no sign whatsoever of theresa may stepping back from it. wherejust a few weeks ago you would hear brexiteers saying, we want to change the policy not the person, they're now saying, we want to change both. if the estimates of our crack research team are correct, it looks as if theresa may may well be hanging on. but if she loses, she remains prime minister tonight and tomorrow and in the days to come, who i assume, but only until the conservatives have picked a new leader? yeah. they will choose a new
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leader? yeah. they will choose a new leader and the odds would be it would be either a card—carrying brexiteer or maybe a former faggot over who is really in the business of trying to please the brexit side of trying to please the brexit side of the party union membership who are if anything even more brexit in their thinking on the mps. the way to do iti their thinking on the mps. the way to do it i think would be offering the kind of things which these people want to hear. and if she has won, then clearly it is a victory for those... it is vitriol for those who were trying to get rid of her but she had to withdraw her motion because she did not have the votes in the commons and now she has had to undergo an internal insurgency from her own side, and she says she won't fight the next election, and all that up and it is a weakened prime minister? i think it's true that the hardline brexiteers, if the prime minister ends up winning, they end up rather weak and, because they did not go into this for some sort of show, they went into this to get
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rid of mrs may. if she is still there, they will have failed to do that quite conspicuously. it does not necessarily do much for theresa may, quite apart from anything else, there are more than enough of them to defeat her brexit plan. talking about whether it will be 80 or more voting against her, you need a small handful to defeat this plan and with the dup dead set against it, which they are, that handful is there, and many more besides. so the deadlock, the position of weakness, it is all very much there. . we can speak now to the bbc‘s chief political correspondent, vicki young, who is in central lobby in parliament for us. tell us more about this concession tonight by the prime minister that she will not lead the tories into another general election, what exactly d id another general election, what exactly did she tell her back and she mps? well, andrew, this is intriguing. i have spoken to several people who came out of that meeting andi people who came out of that meeting and i have to say to you, they are
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interpreting it in different ways. she apparently said to them that in her heart she would have wanted to lead the party into that election in 2022 but she was accepting that not all colleagues felt the same way. interestingly, when people came out from it, there were some who said she was making it clear she will step down in 2021, she fully intends to be the person who is in charge of those negotiations about the future relationship. others, though, saying she is going to be gone by april. so i think this is going to be a problem, even if she gets through tonight, it is storing up a problem for her in the future. one minister said to me there is going to have to be much more clarification about that in the coming days. a sense, i think, of worrying amongst many mps, many ministers, who fear that if 60-80 many ministers, who fear that if 60—80 vote against her, even if she gets through tonight, they have got all of this legislation to get through and one mp said to me that he wasn't even sure if the party could be led at all. the voting has stopped, they were voting between
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six o'clock and eight o'clock i think tonight they are now counting the votes, they may well have furnished, tell us what happens now? well, i know thatjournalist collea g u es well, i know thatjournalist colleagues have been called into the room for the announcement, but we're being told it won't be until nine o'clock. earlier, sir graham brady, the man in charge, said that three of them would be counting the votes, there would have to be the recursion —— verification of some kind. we know that it was a 100% turnout, the chancellor philip hammond was asked how he was going to vote when he went in and he said he was voting conservative. that result will come, sirgraham conservative. that result will come, sir graham brady will say the result of it, followed by the numbers. with all of these things, there are cabinet ministers going around saying a win is a win. if she wins by one i don't think many people would think that. i bumped into somebody from the downing street tea m somebody from the downing street team earlier and they were more nervous than i was expecting. i have not found many mps who think she's
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going to lose tonight. as ever, nobody really knows, the range of predictions is that she might win by 20 or as many as 150. so that tells you that nobody knows for sure. i'm joined now by james cleverly, deputy chairman of the conseravtive party. james cleverly, why has the prime minister said she won't fight another general election? well, i think she made a number of points during the address that she gave to the 1922 committee. and she said she recognised the concerns that people had about the backstop, about the relationship with the dup, about the way the party wanted to... sure, but why is she not fighting another general election? well, that is a decision she has made. why? i don't know, you would have to ask her. the point that she made when she addressed the 1922 committee was that she recognised the concerns, she knew what she had to address both in terms of the backstop, the
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relationship with the dup and how we go about delivering brexit. she said she was going to focus on that. it was about delivering what we promised the british people and what happens in the future is in the future. if she has won tonight, lets assume she has, buy a decent majority, for the sake of this question — how does that help get her brexit deal through the commons? what it does, it gives her the opportunity to get back to work. she had to cancel meetings today with european leaders. she has committed to fight for movement on the backstop, where she knows there are concerns. this is keeping the northern ireland border open. absolutely. and that backstop is also part of building the relationship... but how does this help? i would prefer we were not going through this process at all, i would prefer she was focused on the job, she was not distracted by... what i am asking is, if she has lost it isa what i am asking is, if she has lost it is a whole new ballgame and we will be looking at a new prime
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minister quite soon... but if she has won, her challenge is still to get this brexit deal through the commons, so how does this happen? you are spot on. and there are certain realities that do not change based on this result. the simple fa ct of based on this result. the simple fact of the matter is, as it stands, this deal is uncomfortable with lots of parliamentarians, the bill needs to change. it's obvious that we need to change. it's obvious that we need to do some work rebuilding the relationship with the dup. these are the ulster unionists, dumb card unionist party, on which mrs me depends to govern for a majority, she has lost over her brexit steel, they have said they will not vote for anything which has this backstop in it, how does she get them back? well, she's speaking with arlene foster and nigel dodds, the leader of the party... but they don't want this at all? they said they don't like this deal, the prime minister is making it clear that she needs to
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renegotiate the backstop. and there are huge challenges. hold on, the prime minister has been to germany, she has been to holland, she may know go down to ireland if she wins tonight, can you give me any indication that the europeans are prepared to renegotiate the backstop? well, they've said they're not prepared but actually, throughout this whole process, what they've said publicly and what they've said publicly and what they've done actually in the negotiating room has been subtly different. so the prime minister is giving it her all get some movement on the backstop, which is where we know the concerns are. the point i'm making is that there are a number of realities which don't change even if we change leader. these are challenges, they're not easy, she is working on them and focusing on delivering brexit for the british people. what happens if she doesn't get any major changes to her brexit steel, what happens? we can speculate, because actually i think a lot of people will recognise that
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actually there is no parliamentary majority for a brexit on wto terms. so the fundamental, big choice that parliamentarians who want to respect the referendum outcome have to ask themselves is, what do they want? do they want an imperfect deal delivered or do they want to put a question mark over whether brexit happens at all? delaying or distorting or stopping brexit altogether i think would be a catastrophe. even if the prime minister wins tonight, she is now walking wounded, isn't she? well, it is never great having a vote of confidence. can i take that as a yes? 0 on the bottom line is, these are tough and unprecedented times, she has shown a degree of robustness that i think anybody would envy. it is tough, it is not going to get very much easier, but she is going to focus on what really matters, delivering brexit and getting on
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with work. thank you forjoining us on this historic night. let's go now to maidenhead, the prime minister's constituency, where sarah campbell is getting reaction for us. yes, indeed, there's a very close fought contest here at the bowling clu b fought contest here at the bowling club in the centre of maidenhead behind me, but everybody has got one eye on the television as well, because this has been theresa may's constituency for the best part of 20 yea rs. lots of constituency for the best part of 20 years. lots of people here know her personally and have worked with her, including the president of the conservative party association. first of all, what do you make of what her colleagues have done to her today, calling the days vote of no confidence? i'm very disappointed, i think the timing was wrong. they tried it a few weeks ago and it did not work then. i just hope tried it a few weeks ago and it did not work then. ijust hope it doesn't work this time. how do you think she will be feeling, what kind of person is she as you have seen her? she is an extraordinarily
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resolute person and when i heard her this morning i was fine and then i saw her face, that bravery, she is extraordinary, she is resolute and amazing and i'm sure she will try off tonight. and walshy the right person to lead brexit? the maidenhead constituency was fairly split, was she's the right woman to lead the party? yes. she came in after david cameron left and she has got the win it to do this and if you know her well, she sticks at it and she knows her facts extremely well, she knows her facts extremely well, she is a very good negotiator, and she is a very good negotiator, and she was before she even became a number of parliament. she is a very good person for negotiating, yes. donna, we have heard this evening she has said she is not going to lead the party into the next election, how did you react to that? she is a fabulous mp so if that means she will not be mp for maidenhead, that's terribly sad for all of us, but what can we do? both of you, thank you very much. many
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people here in maidenhead, eagerly awaiting the results of the ballot. i've been joined by the conservative backbencher bernard jenkin. he isa he is a staunch brexiteer. these people we just heard from, the heart and soul of your party who do all the hard work to get people like you are elected, they are appalled you have called this election at a time when the government is in the middle ofa when the government is in the middle of a major negotiation about the future of the country and you call a leadership election? we have offered conservative mps a choice as to whether they want one 01’ choice as to whether they want one or not. it may well be that they have decided they don't want a leadership election. there were some very serious issues to consider in this. the prime minister's authority has ebbed away very substantially, she could not even bring her deal to the house of commons even if all the conservative mps in the house of commons support of that deal, she would not have got it through
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because of her relationship with the dup. she has been touring europe trying to improve the deal, make it more acceptable to the house of commons, maybe not people like you that people who might be prepared to move if she gets a movement. why would you interfere with that process at this crucialjuncture in the brexit deal? this has been rumbling on for quite some time. personally, when i put my letter in i thought, it has to stop, we had to bring it to a head. the latter mps had to send to trigger a no—confidence motion?” latter mps had to send to trigger a no-confidence motion? i was not campaigning for this but i am clear in my mind that the prime minister has not been trying to improve the deal sufficiently such that the dup might support it, and without their support we have not got a government, that is how desperate it is. if she wins tonight and does her best to try to improve the deal, as she would see it, and part of the
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commons want, would you get behind her? i have always supported her until this moment. you her? i have always supported her untilthis moment. you put in a no—confidence attempt. untilthis moment. you put in a no-confidence attempt. until this moment i have supported her, if she wins the ballot than all conservative mps will wish to give her support, but that does not mean we can support the agreement. if the agreement does not deliver leave, leaveis agreement does not deliver leave, leave is a pretty unambiguous words. if we will still be in the customs union and the court ofjustice and we can't get a deal that we can leave subject to an eu veto, that is still a problem. it may not be the deal that you wanted, but it is a brexit, and although it is a struggle to get a majority for it, as we have seen, there is no majority in the house of commons for the harder brexit you wanted. this is one of the difficulties,
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there are a few in the house of commons, rather less than 52%, who represent the 52%, even though 400 01’ more represent the 52%, even though 400 or more constituencies voted leave, most mps did not, and you have a mismatch between those who say they represent the people and what the people want. does that mean we should not stick up for what the people voted for in the referendum? the people voting tonight will want the government to get on with it in some way. there is a struggle for the prime minister, first of all, to get a majority to continue to lead her party, but also to get a majority for the deal she has negotiated on that. why not let her continue to try to do that. if she can improve it, there could be a majority for that, there is no majority for that, there is no majority for that, there is no majority for what you want, no deal 01’ majority for what you want, no deal ora hard majority for what you want, no deal or a hard brexit. if she wins, we will have to make more compromises. people like me have made many compromises. we are prepared to accept a deal that costs £39 billion even though we are not getting much
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in return, we are prepared to accept an horrendous implementation period where the eu will continue making our laws and we will have no say over them. we are prepared to accept a lot of compromises, so long as we get to the end of this and we leave and are an independent, sovereign state, because above all the british people wa nt to because above all the british people want to leave. they might be disillusioned with brexit at the moment but they would not have voted to leave if they did not want to. are you happy that mrs may say she will not lead the party into another election? i was saddened by the way she presented that, obviously it was an attempt to appease hostility. i don't think anybody seriously believes she would leaders into an election, but she had to say that. it underlined the kind of problem she has the kind that will still persist, in the end, herfuture... it is being decided as we speak. even that the conservative continues
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to vote on the floor of the house of commons, she has problems, she has a minority government and she has alienate it a coalition. as bernard jenkin said, the prime minister's future is being determined as we speak, not by a motion of no—confidence in the government in which labour and the scottish nationalists, the greens plaid cymru get to vote, this is her own mps deciding if they have confidence or not in her. this has rarely happened before and if she loses tonight she will not long be prime minister, and she wins, we don't know how much power she will have and how it will change things. so there is a beautiful picture of parliament, in these rooms that you see, that is where the count is going on, i assume, since it is only 317, that they will have completed the camps by now. it
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is cold, their hands might be cold, but it should not take that long. if it is close there will have to be a recount. we will hear from graham brady at about 9pm, he is the chief shop steward of the conservative backbenchers and will give us the result as to whether a majority of mps have confidence in the prime minister, in which case she continues, or they have no confidence, in which case she will not long be prime minister and the conservatives will choose a new leader. not long to go for the results. i'm joined now by the telegraph's camilla tominey and the daily mirror's kevin maguire. a quiet night here in westminster. quiet day at the office generally. how do you read things? very, very close to call. i have been outside the committee room for a couple of hours with kevin and there is a sense. . . hours with kevin and there is a sense... the brexiteers are feeling quite emboldened by this idea that because she did not address the backstop issue in her address to the 1922 it has not helped to allay
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doubts, equally her loyalists are coming out and saying she delivered a very honest, heartfelt and humbled address and she has just about pushed it over the line and saved herself. it has become this divide between those who want to support her because they do not want a hard brexit, and ver g members... the eurosceptics. who want her roads because they think she is the main obstacle with her cheek —— tweaked withdrawal agreement. —— and the's remembers. i remember when tony blairsaid he remembers. i remember when tony blair said he would not fight the next election, you could see the power sucking from him. angela merkel, the german chancellor, she has said she will not fight the next election and is already a much diminished figure. it is quite remarkable what the prime ministers has had to do. it is pretty humiliating and leave so we go. her camp are confident they will win but
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are nervous about the size of the majority. in 2006 there was an uprising of mainly mps supporting gordon brown against tony blair, he promised he would go, he is gone a year later but achieve next to nothing in that year because all those people who think they might be able to succeed him begin to circle, they will do the same with theresa may. few of us expected her to lead them into the next election, nevertheless it is a wholly different thing when the prime minister, begging, really, then to god for her, she has to go to a meeting and say stick with me, i will be gone at the next election —— begging them, really, to vote for her. she says, i know he wants something new and fresh. she has time—limited herself to save his skin now. and she gave herself a caveat, adam holler bohn said what if there is a snap election and she did not rule herself out of running about. she could do that, there was the from the pm's spokesman who said
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she will not stand in 2022, that was intended to allay concerns that she would be the leader for longer than after march, there is a bit of ambiguity. just a few seconds, the starting gun for the next tory leadership election race has started tonight? this does not solve any of the fundamentals, she has not a majority to get through parliament brexit plan, they can smell the blood in the water. she can win, but if you will have more than 50 or 60 conservative mps voting against you, more than are in the brexit group, you are in trouble. very well, we shall be that bad, not long to go. thank you both for tonight. —— very well, we shall leave that's fair. not much is happening in the committee room, but this is the
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committee room, but this is the committee room, but this is the committee room in the house of commons. as you can see by the green check others. graham brady, the chairman of what is called the 1922 committee, basically the committee of conservative backbenchers, he got all these letters from disillusioned tory mps saying they had no confidence in the prime minister any more, we want an election. in a few moments we expect him to come before the microphone and give us the result of this motion on mrs may. i've beenjoined by a member of the labour frontbench, shadow business secretary rebecca long—bailey. well come on this rather cold but quite historic night. today or tonight it was only conservative mps that got to vote because it was an internal party matter, why don't labour give the whole house of commons a chance to vote are no confidence in the government? we will wait to see to my‘s result, but
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it is clear theresa may has lost confidence in parliament already and if she wins by a margin this evening it will be difficult to see how she can push the withdrawal agreement through. in terms of the no—confidence vote, we need to watch what happens over the coming days and assess the support for a vote of no confidence across parliament, we have been in discussions with various opposition parties... the scottish national support her, the liberal democrats have said they would support her. it is tabling that motion at a time when we know it would be successful. having drama and parliamentary theatrics might make people feel slightly better but it will not secure the outcome we want, a general election and a changing government. is there a chance that labour will put a motion of no—confidence in the government, and therefore the prime minister, before the whole house of commons, christmas? we will have to watch very closely what happens over the coming days. before the whole
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house of commons, before christmas? evenif house of commons, before christmas? even if you had one and were not sure of winning, it could be close question we will wait and see. that seems to be the watchword of the night, we are waiting and seeing for the result. let's look at how westminster is seen here, that is the victoria tower at the house of lords end of the parliament. the lights blazing, the vote is not taking place there, or the counting, thatis taking place there, or the counting, that is further back to the east of the building the house of commons. our political editor, laura kuenssberg, joins us now. what a surprise, on a night like this! you sound so pleased to see me extra measure mug of eyes i am a lwa ys extra measure mug of eyes i am always pleased to see you. —— dusan —— you sound so pleased to see me!|j am always pleased to see you. my senseis am always pleased to see you. my sense is that the prime minister's
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supporters i have spoken to are sure she is safe, the microphone has come out in downing street, which shows she is ready to give her own statement to the country. one minister said to me i am not sure it will be as comfortable for us as we believe. in westminster, even though it might seem crazy, the number of votes by which she wins or loses will be really important, the dynamic which shapes events in the coming months. for people who might be turning on the television now, we have seen a be turning on the television now, we have seen a group be turning on the television now, we have seen a group of the prime minister's own mps try to get rid of her because they are so angry about her because they are so angry about her brexit compromise. we do not think they will have succeeded, but they are determined to make life as difficult as possible. the prime minister has indicated that even if she wins by one, it is 50% of who votes, tory mps, plus one, even if she wins by one, the politics of that aren't really realistic. there
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is graham brady, he has presided over this vote of conservative backbenchers and ministers, i think he will give as the result. let's go to the house of commons and we will hear the main confidence vote results. good evening colleagues, ladies and gentlemen, i'd like to thank the offices for their help especially... my offices for their help especially... my assistant returning and charles. the result of the ballot held this evening is that the parliament to
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