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tv   Dateline London  BBC News  March 23, 2019 11:30am-12:00pm GMT

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this is bbc news, i'm shaun ley. to dateline the headlines at midday... american—backed kurdish forces claim they have captured islamic state's last remaining stronghold in eastern london, the programme which brings together some of the uk's leading commentators with the foreign correspondents syria. who file their stories for the folks back home under the dateline, london. the countdown to brexit — this week, theresa may puts theresa may warns mps a third herself on the people's side against parliament, meaningful vote may not take place but where does that leave brexit? next week if it doesn't and 52 years after israel occupied get sufficient support. two thirds of syria's golan heights, does it matter that donald trump a 17—year—old is stabbed to death thinks it's time to recognise following a fight outside a block the facts on the ground? of flats in west london. our dateline panel this week: the broadcaster brian o'connell, who reported the london beat us special counsel robert mueller submits his report into alleged russian collusion with for ireland's rte for more president trump's campaign during the 2016 presidential election. than twenty years, an—yes poirier, who writes for the french news the al—noor mosque in christchurch magazine, marianne, has reopens one week on from a mass shooting in which 42 people published a book about art and passion on the left bank were murdered there. of the seine, ned temko was editor of the jewish chronicle, a sterling performance and now writes regularly from raheem at wembley, for the uk's observer he scores a hat—trick, newspaper, john fisher burns as england thrash the czech republic is a pulitzer prize—winning foreign correspondent, and former london bureau chief for the new york times. theresa may has experienced two gruelling years negotiating the uk's exit from the european union, and endured two humiliating
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parliamentary defeats on her brexit deal. on wednesday, something snapped. during prime minister's questions she accused mps of indulging in naval gazing rather than getting on with thejob. later that evening, she declared herself on the people's side in what she framed as a conflict between people and parliament. but hang on a minute. it was mrs may who fired the starting gun, laid down red lines for the negotiations. her first brexit secretary complained he was sidelined, her second was ignored, and the present one voted against her policy. brian, did it succeed, if the objective was to galvanise her troops, get them out of their torpor and get them into the last heave for brexit to push it over the line, did it achieve that objective? the most interesting thing about this week and to resent me spreading the blame. in terms of leadership, if
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you compare what she did on wednesday night when she made that podcast from downing street to jacinda at herne and what she said after that attacks in christchurch, i think that tells you all you need to know about real political leadership. i think to may, her time is measured in days if not weeks in terms of remaining in downing street thatis terms of remaining in downing street that is for sure. i do not think there is any realistic chance after those remarks that any mp5 who might have been wavering might come down oi'i have been wavering might come down on her side rather than the other. i think a deal has had two goals and is dead in the water. you come to indicative votes, and up who wants an norway style option, i do not see any chance of any of those getting a majority. that is the baffling thing, they are going to have these
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indicative votes, we are told they are going to have which somehow involves government putting the motion on the order paper or a collection of mps doing it at the government standing back? that is talking about stage two, the trading arrangement. we have not even completed stage one, the actual leaving. i wonder first before we get to that, but i have to say about mrs may and the counter—productive remarks she made about parliament. it seems to me as a schoolboy, were used to talk about piling on. there has been a good deal of piling on in respect to mrs may. goodness me, could be not allow hurt some frustration after weeks, months, even frustration after weeks, months, eve n years frustration after weeks, months, even years of suffering errors of intolera nt even years of suffering errors of intolerant extremists? on all
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parties and the insults they slung at each other, can we not allow her the indulgence of saying something which is basically true? she, like david cameron, has put party before it national interest. she is the architect of her own downfall. it national interest. she is the architect of her own downfalllj ta ke architect of her own downfall.” take a different view of that, i think she came to the office in the most vexed circumstances possible. she was a remainer charged by the referendum as finding a way out of europe but she has been boxed in from the beginning. bite the contending wings of our own party and by the intransigence of the european union. if i may, and by the intransigence of the european union. ifi may, this is an indicative vote middle way attempt here. go for it. one of mrs may's strength is not collegiality and
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alliance building and i think that has been a failure. she had an untenable position. it did not help that she unnecessarily called a general election and ended up with a minority government but all that having been said, this is a backwards process. there is an argument andl backwards process. there is an argument and i think it was made at the time by some that rather than burnish your leave credentials which was the point she was trying to make, by saying we will do article 1512 seconds after i get into power then figure out what i will do, there is it's a common—sense argument that you should have done some of the spadework. she simply would have run into the same intransigence both in brussels and here at home. i think we will have plenty of time. let us not smash any
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windows. we might smash it you outfits but never windows. is it right for parliament to be taking control of this process if that is what they do next week as they are threatening? yes, it is. clearly it isa threatening? yes, it is. clearly it is a system not to have a government doing it? the eu is doing that, throwing a lifeline to british democracy. what is going to happen is theresa may stays as pm. i don't think she will be next saturday. the house of commons needs to take over because if she is, ifjohn bercow allows her to put for the third time her deal, it is most probably going to be rejected so now, you know,
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they will revoke article 52 reset they will revoke article 52 reset the whole thing and another referendum or perhaps what british democracy was, are used to be admired throughout the world for doing, having a debate, not thinking about politics, the wayjeremy corbyn is doing. the opposition leader is not thinking about the controversy, he he is thinking the tories have collapsed and disintegrated so he can go to power. you think that would be a victory? well, it would and why does the house of commons not to discuss what they want? perhaps it is norway, perhaps it is canada, perhaps it is remaining, ithink perhaps it is canada, perhaps it is remaining, i think about what is best for the country. i think the eu has been incredibly intelligent and creative and sorry john, has been incredibly intelligent and creative and sorryjohn, generous actually, because britain is our friend. jean claude young ko said, i
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do not know i had so much patience —— juncker. do not know i had so much patience -- juncker. that is not the european union i have been watching for some time andi union i have been watching for some time and i am old enough to belong toa time and i am old enough to belong to a generation where our fathers and grandfathers left the shore of this country to fight for liberation. for which we will be eternally grateful. there's not been a sign of that and there is a certain individuals, the former prime minister of belgium, who was in as entrance event and as unpleasant —— as in transient and as unpleasant —— as in transient and as unpleasant as many of the principal leaders of this. i find myself unfashionable in thinking is that no legacy of understanding and gratitude for this country which more than once in its history has stood alone and has embattled, and
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come and found despite its instincts to steer its own course, has always found destiny with europe? where is the resonance for all of this in the wa ke the resonance for all of this in the wake europe had treated mrs may? whether or not you believe the eu has been intransigence, to go back to what is going to happen in the next couple of weeks, the one thing thatis next couple of weeks, the one thing that is not going to change is the withdrawal agreement as it stands fiow. withdrawal agreement as it stands now. there are not going to reopen that. so it is that or it no deal? it is basically you take this withdrawal agreement or there is no deal, or you go for a longer extension to either have eight general election or a second referendum, and if you do that you have to have a party in the european elections and i would be a disaster. have we not now got to the point, andi have we not now got to the point, and i wonder if there is any consensus, where actually eat
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no—deal brexit, a process of departing from the european union, since we have already agreed we are leaving and the eu had planned for us leaving and the eu had planned for us leaving, celebrate the no deal planning, agreeable sides there will be no additional tariffs and taxes on imports and exports, and to try and get to the second stage of the process of agreeing to check trading relationships? would that not be the sensible option rather than collecting fully —— collectively banging our heads? it would be the least bad option but it would be incredibly disruptive. haven't the last two years been incredibly disruptive? it would be worse economically, a disaster for this country. checking opinion pulls over 50% of leavers favourite it no deal over other options, and 25 or 26% depending on which port you look at,
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about a quarter of the entire electorate are also in favour. isn't that picking up the point, the most interesting thing about all of this is this process has corroded trust and the relation? it is kind of like, to help with it! —— to hell with it? the british media, some of the best selling newspapers, have undermined that. there's not a lot of intelligent comment in the papers about that now. media people do thrive sensation, confrontation. i think everybody needs to calm down. lam reminded think everybody needs to calm down. i am reminded of something my father said, a south african who used to fly aeroplanes, he used to say this
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during the apartheid, it will be settled peacefully because it has to be because the alternative is too ghastly to contemplate. there seems to bea ghastly to contemplate. there seems to be a solution here, there will be after a lot of blood has been spilt. after everyone is totally exhausted there will be a settlement and it is likely to be something close to what mrs may has put to parliament. i say when other thing at the risk of being deemed as a reconstructive imperialist, this country has faced crisis much greater than this even in my lifetime, and in the greatest of those crises, 1940, we had a conservative prime minister who was held in contempt by much of his own party who cannot win support of his owfi party who cannot win support of his own party for his place in parliament and had to rely on the labour party to come to his rescue, and we know what became of the
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history of that man, winston churchill. i am history of that man, winston churchill. lam not history of that man, winston churchill. i am not suggesting mrs may is churchill but i think she will prove to be a lot more appealing in hindsight than everybody is prepared... appealing in hindsight than everybody is prepared. . ” appealing in hindsight than everybody is prepared... i do not think it makes any difference you is the next leader of the conservative party, it will not change the next couple of weeks. it is going to be the same problem. for more than half a century, since the six—day war in 1967, the western two—thirds of the golan heights has been occupied and administered by israel. despite its annexation by israel four years later, many countries see the israelies as illegal occupiers. yet on thursday, donald trump announced on twitter that, "after 52 years it is time for the united states to fully recognize israel's sovereignty over the golan heights, which is of critical strategic and security importance to the state of israel and regional stability." the language used about the territories has changed but the state department says the policy on the status of those territories has not.
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do you think there is substance behind the semantics? is it just words? is itjust words? there is politics behind it and both domestically and in the united states there is a huge reliance on christian evangelical support in the republican party and for a support in the republican party and fora trump support in the republican party and for a trump personally. there is the small fact, although trump amazingly said he was not aware that there is an election in israel when he made this. that is right. there is a french term that anyway... he is aware. this bromance between donald
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trump and netanyahu is what is behind it. golan heights is the lowest priority behind any arab states but it means for instance that whatever efforts we are putting in ukraine, it is fine for putting in the next climate. and what about the west banks? palestinians well think, are we next? the us has already moved its embassy and now golan heights, and the international community was quite happy to leave that ambiguity about the golan heights, it would not recognise it, but israel was doing its thing because it was about security and iran and has the love. suddenly it
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is brought on the plate and it is not going to change anything except making the us look even less of an important player in the region. on the basis of thatjohn, it will not change anything in materials terms and there is no belief israel will willingly give up this territory because of what it sees as protecting its flankers. not now it won't but one of the great ironies is that none other succession of israeli prime ministers not only would have done but are involved in secret talks. this is part of the deal and that is the point i wanted to raise, whether what we are seeing isa to raise, whether what we are seeing is a little elements, both the embassy, now this of what will eventually be some kind of proposal oi’ eventually be some kind of proposal or plan for the trump administration, long promised, supposedly designed by jared kushner, but these might be elements
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of that and something is coming. reference is made to the israeli election which mr trump may indeed be unaware of, i do not think it is folks in tel aviv to jerusalem be unaware of, i do not think it is folks in tel aviv tojerusalem he is concerned about, i think it is his own political situation which is going to become more complicated with the publication of the mother report sometime this week and that is what he has got his eye on. —— muller report. the attitude he took to as the murder ofjamal khashoggi, what was that about? i think it had something to do with jared kushner, because watch of what trump has done in foreign and domestic affairs does not make much sense on its face. to begin to deconstruct so much of the security architecture that has been
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built up with the united states at the centre of the last 50 or 60 yea rs the centre of the last 50 or 60 years makes no sense at all unless you think of trumps vexed political situation at home. france was explicit in saying it does not recognise golan heights as its real territory and we respect what the security council has said and the eu resolution going back to our three decades. the jordanian foreign minister said there is no possibility, unless israel withdraws from al arab territories it occupies, for there to be a final settle m e nt occupies, for there to be a final settlement of the israel palestine dispute. this is why it is not going to go anywhere. on that basis doesn't even matter? act exactly! in that sense there is tweets and it unnerves everyone but it is not going to go anywhere. we do not want to open the golan heights canon debate at the un because it is going
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to heighten tension and again, we will be sterile. i think the state department would like this to remain a tweet and move on and strategically this is about iran, his brother and so on. same act because this is about iran which worries trump, there is not going to bea worries trump, there is not going to be a pushback of a deep west bank, particular from the saudis.” be a pushback of a deep west bank, particular from the saudis. i am not sure we can assume this is a tweet because we might have thought that when we started talking during the election campaign, moving the embassy to jerusalem and election campaign, moving the embassy tojerusalem and more often than not he has astonished us, not so than not he has astonished us, not so much by promising he is going to do this or that by actually doing it. i think you might actually do this and the consequences could be
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very severe indeed, and not alone in terms of dealing with putin and crimea. we might run into similar problems if the russians became aggressive in the baltic states and claimed sovereignty. considering the large russian populations in estonia, latvia and lithuania. where would we be if we had sanctioned occupations in israel and the golan heights? the un is not going to take any action but it does not mean to say he agrees with it. it is donald trump ignoring the rules —based world order. putin has done it, the a nswer world order. putin has done it, the answer is he has done it and nobody has done much about it. that is the
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output. it is all very well saying we should not legitimise what has happened in crimea, but it has happened in crimea, but it has happened and nothing has been done about it. these structures like the inadmissibility of territory by force a re inadmissibility of territory by force are crucial and john is right. there is an entire post—war architecture of european diplomacy and diplomatic usage that can be undermined bya and diplomatic usage that can be undermined by a tweet. that architecture will survive trump, putin and others. one hopes. that depends on the surviving of trump himself and we have to assess that this week. indeed, the mueller report was handed over in washington on friday. in terms of the mueller report the white house must be breathing a little easier over this weekend as it was made clear that
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there was no other criminal charges. we area there was no other criminal charges. we are a long way from russian dc andi we are a long way from russian dc and i could be wrong about this but when i read last night he had no more criminal indictments, the important thing was we knew that mueller has often given the opinion to attorney general is that under the constitution the president can be criminally indicted, so to say nothing in the report suggests he should be, is only to confirm his reservations but i am sure you will find material and that that is profoundly shocking and profoundly destabilising to the republic and the majority in the senate, which in the majority in the senate, which in the end is going to have to make up its mind about impeachment. is that a good thing about laying down the clarity because there has been ambiguity of this, that the president cannot face criminal charges? saying that it is not
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constitutional, it is an opinion from the legal office of thejustice department. it could be tested, it will not be. is that a good thing in some senses because a lot of this is political and with it —— but would it not be better it was dealt with? the other investigation is probably more damning so we are planning to seek the results and to read the evidence the facts and evidence is not important. there is so much politics going on, it is like brexit. not quite like it because it may not go on much longer. brexit with tweets which is even more fun. the final tweet story was in a single day last week the treasury secretary announced new sanctions relating to north korea and alleged
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chinese violations, and that evening the president himself tweeted and said, april's., i the president himself tweeted and said, april's., lam reversing the sanction and the white house spokesman when asked why this happened, andl spokesman when asked why this happened, and i quote, said the president likes him and he thinks the sanctions are unnecessary. we could be facing a situation with brexit and what is going on in washington, is two countries at the height of the western alliance being uncovered for the next year and a half. what would be the consequences? bad, economically bad, in terms of social cohesion and it is distressing to see that the great respect in which this country has been held for its democracy, for its civilised behaviour and world
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affairs is being seriously damaged as by the way, is the repetition of the united states by the current presidency. thank you all very much and it is worth reflecting it was donald trump junior, the and it is worth reflecting it was donald trumpjunior, the elder son of the president of the united states, who wrote an opinion piece ina states, who wrote an opinion piece in a british newspaper this week when he suggested british democracy asa when he suggested british democracy as a result of brexit‘s was all but dead will stop some people raised that challenge back at the united states. that's it for dateline london for this week — we're back next week at the same time. goodbye. hello, there.
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looks likely that we are heading for quite a quiet weekend. that's great news if you've got outdoor plans, but you will need a couple of extra layers because it's just going to be that little bit cooler than of late, particularly at night. but we will see some sunny spells. most of the showers this weekend are going to be into the far north and west. now, the reason for the change in emphasis with the story is this weather front that's been sweeping its way south, it's introducing cooler air. you can see tightly packed isobars to the north, that's where the strongest of the winds are likely to be. so there is a legacy of cloud as it clears its way south and east, and that cloud thick enough for the odd spot of or two of drizzle. but you can also see that it's well broken further north and we'll have a scattering of showers into the far north. now, the winds gusting to gale force for a time, easing slowly as we go through the day in scotland. elsewhere, some sunshine coming through, a dry story, perhaps the cloud just lingering into the far south—west. not as warm as it has been, nine to 13 degrees the overall high. now, as we go through the overnight picture we continue to see the cloud thick enough for a few
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showers across cornwall and devon, perhaps, clearer skies elsewhere and frequent showers continue and gather in strength, actually, into the far north—west by the end of the night. but sandwiched in between the two, well, with those clearer skies we could see some blue tones, and that emphasises that temperatures are low enough for a touch of frost. so low single figures, perhaps lower still, in sheltered rural areas first thing on sunday morning so it's going to be a chilly start, again, the emphasis is with this dry, settled story. the only exception into the far north—west, a line of more organised showers will continue to drift their way through scotland, turning increasingly wintry to higher ground. they will eventually push their way across the borders and into the north of england, perhaps just fringing with northern ireland for a time as well. but elsewhere it's dry, settled with some sunshine and highs of nine 13 degrees. now, although we have a few showers to contend with across northern england, the main emphasis as we go into next week, we'll continue with this dry, settled scene. high pressure builds across the country, a good deal
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of dry weather in the forecast. perhaps if we see any showers they will be up into the far north—west, but fairly isolated. so if you have got outdoor plans, this is your week ahead. dry and settled, a little warmer in the south—east by friday.
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