cathedral will be rebuilt within five years after it was devastated by fire. a number of companies and business tycoons have so far pledged almost $1 billion towards the reconstruction efforts. voting is underway in indonesia's presidential and parliamentary elections, where almost 200 million people are eligible to vote. the incumbent president, joko widodo, is running against an ex—general prabowo subianto seen here voting in a race which correspondents say has seen both embrace hardline islamic allies. the president of ecuador has made renewed allegations about the behaviour of the wikileaks founder, julian assange, during his seven year stay at the ecuadorean embassy in london. lenin moreno told the bbc that mr assange had insulted his country and had even smeared faeces on the embassy‘s walls.

now on bbc news: hardtalk. welcome to hardtalk with me, zeinab badawi. events have moved a breathtaking speed in sudan and the past few days. omar al—bashir is no longer president and is under arrest. a new military lead council is running the country and says it will stay in place for two years. the african union is demanding handover to a transitional civilian administration in days. at the pretorius are saying they won't give up pretorius are saying they won't give up until that happens. —— under protest. the demonstration is let —— led by young professionals who want links with the muslim and islamist possible stop ghazi salahuddin atabani, the chairman of the reform. until 2013 he was a keen advisor of

the president for a quarter of a century and was associated with the leadership of the is lumbering in the governing party. our politicians like him now irrelevant? —— our politicians? ghazi salahuddin atabani in khartoum, welcome to hardtalk. one clear outcome of the protests in the revolution is that the old guard such as yourself are now politically irrelevant. is that right? us being circulating among the political class in general, i don't think it's

true. i think we have a growing upcoming generation which is becoming relevant. it's becoming releva nt becoming relevant. it's becoming relevant everyday to our politics. but we still have the older rule, we still count. why do you still count? because i tell you something that one of the general said at a televised news conference on the 12th of april that the national congress party would be excluded from talks because it was responsible for what happened. that is true and you were once a member of the ncp so that means people don't want to in the picture. there is people, let them decide. that's what we say. we maintain our releva nce what we say. we maintain our relevance in different walks of life and that's why we are asked our opinion. and sometimes, we form coalitions which are really effective in sydney's politics.

maybe we are doing at the old way but i think we still get good results. coming to what you are now offering the sudanese, i have to ask you about your own credibility at the moment. because you have been tainted by association with the president. you are cabinet mr, a key advisor, the ultimate insider. you lead the national congress party in parliament. are you not to links to that? i am quite clear about my position. i think i had to reach a certain tipping point before i left the party. for that, certain tipping point before i left the party. forthat, i certain tipping point before i left the party. for that, ithought certain tipping point before i left the party. for that, i thought i would be doing better if i try to reform. it's something that many politicians have done around the world, and the fact that i haven't succeeded, it does not mean i was

wrong in my choice. i don't feel that i have two apologise for what i have done. i'm still trying my best and ina have done. i'm still trying my best and in a way i'm producing results. these are troubled times in sudan and they're these are troubled times in sudan and they‘ re not these are troubled times in sudan and they're not anything to judge by. the outcome of the protests, the results might look shocking to some people. and i don't think we should rush to condemn those who are behind the present situation protests. nobody is rushing to contempt the protesters, one thing that they have said consistently, particularly the sudan professional association, the young professionals behind the protests is that they want to recycle arise the sudan. can i ask you whether you are still sticking to your political islamist views, because you are very much from that

wing of the ruling ncp when you were with them up until 2013? do you still want for the dickel islamist? —— political. even in this place, there was a kind of religion —— revision of islamist groups around the country. we need a new definition of religion, and i think thatis definition of religion, and i think that is still valid. we don't want to fall in the trap of these dualisms, secularism, capitalism, socialism, et cetera. was a things of the past. i don't like to characterise our thinking and introspection and dialogue is one tween islamist man secularism. do you think you have passed the stage

was because one thing that has striking about the protest is the root of women. you've got one young woman, who has become the symbol, the iconic symbol of the revolution. you've seen the young unmarried women going about the streets. right in the vanguard of this protest and yet, under 30 years of resident —— the president ‘s rule, we saw the rights of women deteriorated significantly. and you are part of it. until five or six years ago. significantly. and you are part of it. until five or six years agolj think deteriorated is not a fair description because on the other side you can see a different role for women. in parliament, for instance, in public service, everything. if i them everywhere you go. and there are certainly much

more liberated than they used to be in the past. so it's unfair to draw a conclusion. there are problems relating to the role of women in society, it's something to be recognised. but the situation of women is getting better. if you compare it to 30, 40, 50 years back. it's definitely better. the former british ambassador to sudan and then after, special eu envoy for sudan who said that women's rights had deteriorated significantly in 30 yea rs of deteriorated significantly in 30 years of the president ‘s role. she is also said that the scale of female participation is unprecedented. sudanese women have become aware of their power and their role. whatever happens now, nothing is going to go back to how it was before. you can't turn the clock back. i don't see why we

should comment on the gains and achievements. if you come and see the streets of sudan, our attention on certain issues relating to the heavier issues, like we have a many other countries. in essence, the movement of women and their achievements are forward—looking. 0k, achievements are forward—looking. ok, but on this issue, of the issue —— on the nature of the protest. your purchase out of touch. this is a young revolution, my understanding is that when you, yourself, wanted tojoin the protest, you are prevented from getting out of your car. people didn't want you to jump on the bandwagon. that is absolutely not true. i was faced with the revolutionaries they demanded that i

salute, and i passed on. these are interpretations put on the true story. i'm here, i came all the way from my house to the studio having —— without having been attacked or pushed and shoved by anyone. i live my life as i did before this protest took place. the general is now the leader of the transitional military council. he has invited, as he says, all spectrums of sudanese people for dialogue was a puppy but invited?“ they send debit asians, they would send us one because we are a registered party by law and according to the constitution which is still valid, we have legitimacy

to be invited to these official events. so the protesters are calling for a civilian led transitional government now, perhaps just limited representation. the african union is given the military council just about two weeks. to hand over to a civilian administration. what is the likelihood of that happening. administration. what is the likelihood of that happeningm administration. what is the likelihood of that happening. in the past experiences, the african union, the period of required and which they should take action and have elections, we have seen this in other parts of africa. i don't think the country of sudan would be much affected by this decision if it were in the right past or officially launch a dialogue reinstituting

democracy in sudan. on past experience, being cut off by the african union for 15 days did not prevent the country from surviving. and one can quote the number of... there are countries that want to see sudan succeed. the united kingdom, the british foreign secretary has treated that we need to see a swift mood to an inclusive representative civilian leadership. uk is budging to help sudan write off its 50 odd early in dollars of external debt and so on. sudan needs friends i uttered this critical time. it should here what they are saying. absolutely. i completely agree with you and i think this is the right decision and taking the right position in the respect. ultimately,

we have to reach a conclusion, the sudanese will have to reach a conclusion of resolving our differences. having said that, the fa ct differences. having said that, the fact that —— the fact of the matter is, since sudan signed the peace agreement, it hasn't been redeemed. it hasn't been rewarded adequately for the sacrifice it has made. so, most of the blame falls on the shoulders of other countries who have promised a lot and given very little. there's going to be a new situation in the sudan now so i suppose it will have to see how many things the community will extend. let's go back to what's going on 110w. let's go back to what's going on now. there is no centre of power with which to negotiate. the power struggle within the security cabal that took power is just beginning.

the president have kept the rivalries and oppression in check, his removal rings unregulated uncertainty. which faction in the security services, in the army, in the intelligence services is dominant at the moment? because there seemed to be several competing powers. the prime force in sudan is the army. that side wins. this has been thriving in the past and has succeeded in 64 and 85 and we had similar revolutions, slap a similar. 30 years have passed and a lot of changes have ta ken 30 years have passed and a lot of changes have taken place within those situations. because of the war

that was raging in the south and other things, this tended to shape oui’ other things, this tended to shape our lives in sudan. it very much affected us by military activity, confrontations and the south and other parts of the country. we need to get rid of that. the idea behind the compliance is to get rid of that and have normal political life. that's what i call a solution. we have tried that over the last 30 yea rs have tried that over the last 30 years and i don't have any guarantees are indications that it would succeed now, that's why the situation is precarious in my view. it's changing all the time, attend to think about the question of the vulnerability of the political system and the fact that it's changing ina system and the fact that it's changing in a way that no—one can predict the final outcome. so, i mean, what will happen then?

do you think that there will be a transitional government which will be severely and lead? or do you think that the army will stay in power? we hear various statements coming from them, you know, generals saying military leaders are not hungry for power, generals will be the protectors of the people. what exactly the protectors of the people. what exa ctly d oes the protectors of the people. what exactly does that mean? are the only going to quit the scene and allow the civilians to take over as the protesters are demanding? anything can happen. i just protesters are demanding? anything can happen. ijust would like to say that there seems to be no mentality, no method to this madness so far. i can't predict what will happen tomorrow, all i know is that the politics we are practising today and the last five days is unorthodox, is

unconventional, and therefore you cannot draw conclusions. people are panicking around the country believing that life might change to something completely different. so there is this kind of panic, you know, in the country, which no—one has any means to address. what do you mean panic? all we see, i don't know what you mean by panic. all we see is in khartoum and other cities in the sudan are young people, older people rejoicing that they have seen the end of a 30 year dictatorship and what they hope will be the end of army rule, it doesn't seem like panic. it seems like euphoria. it's euphoria, its panic in other parts. what i'm saying is i'm seeing a

division in the society. those past a certain age feel threatened and thatis a certain age feel threatened and that is very natural for them. it could affect their status in life et cetera. the young are, you know, looking forward to a different life from the one they are living and in the past 20—30 years. there is a clear generational gap here. one that can be identified easily, and is expressing itself through certain phenomena and statements by these protesters. these young people have a right to be vigilant, don't they, when they see that the national intelligence service still seems to be intact, you still have generals on the military — on this transitional council, you see the sudan rapid reaction force is also represented on the military council, so represented on the military council, so they think well, president omar

al—bashir may have gone but the system he presided onto so many yea rs system he presided onto so many years is still in place, we have to be vigilant, we have to maintain our voices. you can't blame them doing that? does mike on four.|j voices. you can't blame them doing that? does mike on four. i do not blame them. i am just stating the fa ct blame them. i am just stating the fact and the fact is that they feel threatened. they attacked the previous generation saying they were selfish, this has been common language for generations, now they have a chance to retaliate and to push back and they are doing it in a way that reflects inexperience. you sound very unsympathetic. sorry. you sound very unsympathetic. sorry. you sound very unsympathetic. sorry. you sound very unsympathetic, though these are recalcitrant youth somehow. the protest in december

last year were very dire, there was rampant inflation, widespread unemployment, a report by the institute of international finance on april ten shows that sudan continues to struggle with its balance of payments. you know, the situation was dire, these were not just naughty, young people as you seem just naughty, young people as you seem to suggest. no. no, they are not. but the way you are formulating the questions is a problem. sorry to say that. you put them in a very confrontational way, a situation thatis confrontational way, a situation that is confrontational. mostly confrontational. i'm just being critical. critical of myself and certain people within the nation. so i don't consider them to be naughty children, i think they deserve our sympathy, cooperation and guidance if they wish to have those things.

my if they wish to have those things. my three sons participated in the demonstrations and have been for the last few weeks, this applies to many people within the system. so i don't think the problem is one of the military or denouncing their behaviour. that was the implication of what you were saying. that was the implication of what you, the tone in which you gave your answer. yeah, well, i'm sorry, then. you put it sometimes in a way that one can't avoid answering if coming from a different point of view, but i'm definitely sympathetic. all right. let's ta ke definitely sympathetic. all right. let's take a look at the wider picture in sudan, notjust the urban protest. there is a lot of instability in regions of sudan,

darfur, blue nile, is of a ceo or cot, a former south sedan diplomat does make sudan, said that a quick hand over might lead to a fight using the uncertainty to pursue secession, is that a danger in your view? it has been. it has been set aside, it has been for some time because of problems in other parts of the country. we hear, coming from those areas, are ready to splinter off from mainland sudan, which is troubling to us. everyone seems to be preoccupied with what's happening

in the capital. well, happening in the capital we understand that is where the former president is being held. here someone you got to know over many years, do you think he'll be reacting to old this and his house arrest and talk of him being tried in the sudan, perhaps under international supervision, how do you think he will be responding or feeling? he has done a lot of injustice to his own people and he should — he should be held accountable for that and if he can be tried, that should also take place according to normal procedure. but i think about what we should focus on is the way he conducted the country and manage the country, i

get the impression he was completely out of his dad. he had been advised several times by people does make out of his depth, there was initiative after initiative but he didn't seem to care. i don't think he had a real grasp of the situation he had a real grasp of the situation he was facing and he just messed it up. hejust he was facing and he just messed it up. he just messed he was facing and he just messed it up. hejust messed it up. thank he was facing and he just messed it up. he just messed it up. thank you very much indeed for coming on hard talk. hello there, good morning. as expected, tuesday was a cloudy day for many of us. rain and drizzle around as well.

and this was the scene, actually, in the north—west of england where it was quite a bit cooler thanks to that rain and drizzle and low cloud. but we had a taste of things to come in cornwall. the sun was out and it was a good deal warmer as well. and we're going to find more sunshine more widely as we head into the easter weekend. and as a result it will be turning warmer everywhere. now, still some cloud on the scene. this cloud is heading towards iberia to bring some cooler, wetter weather. this cloud brought the rain and drizzle earlier on. that it is tending to peter out all the while. it's a little bit damp across western scotland. further south, clearing skies means some mist and fog forming in wales, the midlands, and parts of southern england. that will take a little while to clear away in the morning. the drizzle won't last long in western scotland. the cloud breaks, the sunshine develops more widely. but we could bubble up a bit of cloud from east anglia towards the pennines and maybe squeeze out an isolated late shower. on the whole, it's a dry and a warm afternoon,

with temperatures getting up to 19 or 20 and the south—east of england. the only downside with all this warmth and sunshine — high pollen levels across england and wales in particular. but as we head into the evening and overnight, we've got to watch out towards the east to see some mist and low cloud coming in off the north sea. that will push its way further inland across northern areas. so a bit misty and murky in the hills and chilly around some rural areas. those are the temperatures in towns and cities. it will, however, get warmer as we head towards easter. really warming up, actually, across central europe. and this is where our air is going to be coming from, hence those rising temperatures on that south—easterly breeze. there will be some mist and cloud around to begin with on thursday. that cloud tending to break up. sunshine developing quite widely. south—easterly breezes. still a little bit cooler around some of those north sea coasts, eastern scotland, northeast england. but otherwise temperatures are continuing to rise, 20 or 21 is quite likely on thursday. friday, hardly a cloud in the sky.

a beautiful day, good friday. we'll see lots of sunshine. this light south to south—easterly breeze putting that warmth northwards. so 21 or 22 through the central belt of scotland. 22 or 23 from london through the midlands to the north—west of england. this is a flavour of what's to come over the easter weekend. the peak of the heat likely to be on saturday. northern areas turn more cloudy. maybe seeing some rain, particularly on sunday. but the southeast still dry with some sunshine.

welcome to bbc news, broadcasting to viewers in north america and around the globe. my name is mike embley. our top stories: president macron promises notre—dame cathedral will be rebuilt within 5 years. donations have already reached almost $1 billion. ecuador‘s president tells the bbc the shocking details that led to him ending julian assange's asylum. almost 200 million indonesians are heading to the polls, in what's being called the world's most complicated election. the push for power in afghanistan — how women's roles are changing in the deeply conservative country.