mobile, globalised world. is this progress or a source of tensions? well, now i'm here right by the historic harbour bridge and the iconic sydney opera house. absolutely gorgeous, aren't they? and i've got my panel here and also our terrific audience. and if you wa nt to our terrific audience. and if you want tojoin our terrific audience. and if you want to join the conversation, don't forget you can, it is too. we have got a veteran senator for the ruling conservative liberal party, the daughter of italian immigrants. she

has previously served as minister of international development and assistant therefore multiculturalism. mark latham is leader of the right—wing first nation —— one nation party in new south wales, including sydney. and he's the advocate of bring back australian values. we are joined by jenny lyon, the local mp for the greens party in new south wales and she's worked in the past for amnesty international. and sami schar moved from his native pakistan about seven yea rs from his native pakistan about seven years ago, an award—winning comedian and radio show host and also champion of free speech. that's our panel. audience, please give them a warm round of applause. so, for we take ourfirst so, for we take our first question we wa nt so, for we take our first question we want to bring you this brief

background on multiculturalism. —— before. the la kemba the lakemba district of sydney, where nearly half the population is muslim. one of the many places that shows just how multicultural australia is. communities that bring a rich mix of cuisine, language, fashion and lifestyle. australia is a nation of immigrants. half the people here were either born overseas or have a parent who was. until the early 1970s, australia had a whites only immigration policy. if you weren't white, you won't welcome. in the following decades, especially as globalisation gathered pace, millions of immigrants were welcomed from africa and asia. two yea rs welcomed from africa and asia. two years ago, the then prime minister, malcolm turnbull, described

australia as the world's most successful multicultural country. we live in the most successful multicultural society in the world, and our success is on a foundation of mutual respect. we have one of the most successful immigration programmes in the world. we are a migration nation. who could claim to have a better one? now governments are increasingly questioning whether multiculturalism does indeed lead to shared values. under the doctrine of state multiculturalism, we've encouraged different cultures to live separate lives apart from each other and apart from the mainstream. this multicultural approach, saying that we simply live side—by—side, and are happy about each other, this approach has failed, utterly failed.

and some blame the failures in multicultural policies for the rise of the far—right, populism and extremism. the word recoiled in horror when a self—proclaimed australian white supremacist shot dead for flea muslims australian white supremacist shot dead forflea muslims in march australian white supremacist shot dead for flea muslims in march ‘s. -- 15 dead for flea muslims in march ‘s. —— 15 muslims. this has revived the debate about how diverse muslims, like these in sydney, can best live together. we should welcome anyone of any background who wants to live in peace. but for those who don't plan to integrate in our culture and laws, we need to protect our borders and keep them out. ina and keep them out. in a world that's on the move, what does multiculturalism mean, and is it failing?

there we are, little bit of background for all of you there. without further a due, ourfirst question from anna. does multiculturalism weaken patriotism and in doing so we can our collective identity, leaving us more vulnerable as a society? mark latham. not necessarily. most migrants icepick to love it for the things it offers them and their children, their freedoms, offers them and their children, theirfreedoms, economic opportunities, love of country is a very important australian value. in all these debates are depends on how you define the term multiculturalism. if it is to mean a blender, integrated society, and pa rt blender, integrated society, and part of the integration is to accept the strength of australia my love of australia to be patriotic about our country and its future. so why don't necessarily find out. ironically, in the current debate, you are more

likely to find someone of a non— migrant background, an anglo background, perhaps down at the abc, who was perhaps hating australia not liking the country and finding a myriad of is that normal people can't see. so that is one of the paradoxes. but if multiculturalism is to be a force for unity it obviously needs to be grounded in australian values and one of those is to love our country and if you don't love the country what are you doing here? right. jenny leong. i think the idea of patriotism often is used as a way to exclude. so when we are talking about a love of country and appreciation of those things, so often it's used as to exclude other people or to other peoplejudge for not exclude other people or to other people judge for not respecting a certain way or a certain approach. i think when we are looking at multiculturalism we need to recognise the complexity of that, the complexity of the fact that migrants coming from another place are actually doing so with a love and a respect for the country that

they have left behind, as well as a respect for the communities that they live in. the idea of setting it up they live in. the idea of setting it up as they live in. the idea of setting it upasa they live in. the idea of setting it up as a centre patriotism when you can only have a level of honour and respect for one country i think really undermines and undervalues the complexity of almost everybody that lives in our society here in sydney, in australia, and across the world. but, jenny, you must love australia. i don't have a view that says... you don't love australia. i love fa rella. i says... you don't love australia. i love farella. i love the community. but when icy people waving an aussie fly, but when icy people waving an aussie fly, when they get on a train, there are times that feel nervous that it will mean that i will be inflected toa will mean that i will be inflected to a level of racism or fear. that isa to a level of racism or fear. that is a real reality of people living at that level is a privilege just cannot understand. i absolutely respect so much about this... but you don't believe in patriotism, is what you're saying. nationalism and patriotism is often used to exclude people. the question is does multiculturalism weaken our collective identity, was the

question, leaving more —— study more vulnerable as a society full topic and strengthen it depending on the diversity of he was brought in and who comes to this country. sami shah, you moved quite recently to australia, seven years ago, from your native pakistan. what you make of the question? it is interesting because one of the things that is, and most of the countries you go to now, appreciate these days the way the debates are going, is patriotism is one of those buzz words that eve ryo ne is one of those buzz words that everyone likes inflicting upon one another. so it also matters what does patriotism mean to you, for example, does just mean accepting the country you live in has problems, is great, isn't great, and, you know, you are happy to live there versus other places, then, yes, any people are patriotic. at the same time it also ends up becoming a weapon you are using as others. for example, when mark asked jenny right now do you love australia, i rememberi jenny right now do you love australia, i remember i was in pakistan and i was going up and one

thing religious parties used to do would say do you love islam? and if you had any questions or any pause in that answer then all of a sudden you are the bad guy. but do you love australia? i live here. they have to. absolutely. you have to. you don't want to love australia?” chose to come here. they are busily love australia. in fact, you are more likely to find immigrants loving australia, they agree with marco here, than people who are born here, because they have had more time to develop a more complex relationship. they get us that a lot. do you love australia? there is a certain aggression to the question that warrants a push back. content are of anti—2 wells, your answer? that warrants a push back. content are of anti-2 wells, your answer? my pa rents are of anti-2 wells, your answer? my parents came to this country in the 19505 parents came to this country in the 1950s like millions of other migrants to build a better life for themselves and their children. that is basically what we are we are a country of migrants. migration was pa rt country of migrants. migration was part of our past. it is part of our

today and it will be a part of our future. let's not forget that since world war ii we have welcomed 7—.5 million migrants to this country, including about 850,000 under our humanitarian programme. and that means that today, when we talk about multiculturalism, it means different things to different people. but given what it means to you, does it, just to answer the question, does it wea ken just to answer the question, does it weaken collective identity?” just to answer the question, does it weaken collective identity? i don't believe it does. because australia has one of the highest uptakes of citizenship in the world, according to 0ecd citizenship in the world, according to oecd studies. and that means that somebody who comes to australia wa nts to somebody who comes to australia wants to come to australia. they came here, they made a conscious decision to leave everything, and so therefore i think that they do so because this country has given them a lotand, because this country has given them a lot and, in

because this country has given them a lotand, in return, because this country has given them a lot and, in return, they want to abide by the values and beliefs of this country and so a do you believe that it has strengthened our commitment to this country. so it doesn't weaken patriotism ? commitment to this country. so it doesn't weaken patriotism? just quickly, going back to anna who posed the question, do you believe multiculturalism does weaken patriotism is yellow i'm concerned that there are instances more on a national security level that it might impact in regards to maybe dual loyalty or if australia was threatened in a security situation, where a lot of people in this country would feel like they were really willing to stand up and fight. you are worried about your loyalty. do you have dual loyalty, sami? pakistan and australia? she is worried about that. you can have multiple children and you love them all equally. you have to parent, you love them as well. if you do you can have a certain commitment to australia and to the country left behind to come here. and if people

over there asked deila pakistan i will always say yes and if they ask you love australia always say yes. ina wartime you love australia always say yes. in a wartime situation in pakistan and australia go to war, outside of the cricket field, who would a vote for, who wadeye roof? i'm pacifist, i would probably just for, who wadeye roof? i'm pacifist, i would probablyjust a step back and less obvious to the fighting any weight —— who would you root for. the next question, cindy tan. your question, please. as the values argument legitimate in the motion of the multiculturalism debate or is it really just a proxy for racism through fear? if so, how do we address something like fear and what are these values that we feel are being threatened? jenny. the concept of australian values is one that i think really needs to be questioned. i'm in, we're sitting here with the beautiful backdrop of city behind us. we acknowledge that it is actually out of the land. australian values, are we talking about aboriginal values, are we talking about his land we are on. that is

ancestral aboriginal land. and current. depending on how you view this. this is a country where the values that often purported to be the values were built on the colonisation of this country. so when we talk about the idea of australian values, markers not talking about me when he about australian values, despite the fact that i was born in australia. my dad came as an international student. but there are times in this country when people talk about australian values and it excludes me. that's why i have a complex relationship to that answer. so often people's version of australia is that a blonde head, blue—eyed server drinking a beer at bondi. if you go down to any of our beaches across this great land of ours, that diversity is everywhere you look. nobody is looking like that because thatis nobody is looking like that because that is what the society ‘s. the idea of setting it up to be these

australian values that you are either weather against is really a way of dividing us when we want to be doing is bringing people together. mark latham. you don't have blue eyes. i think any's main problem is she has excluded herself in that she has said she doesn't love the country and is only co mforta ble love the country and is only comfortable in the suburbs she lives in —— jenny's. why comfortable in the suburbs she lives in ——jenny‘s. why not comfortable in the suburbs she lives in —— jenny's. why not reach comfortable in the suburbs she lives in -- jenny's. why not reach out comfortable in the suburbs she lives in —— jenny's. why not reach out and love western sydney or central queensland or north queensland or western australia? queensland or north queensland or western australia ? undoubtedly queensland or north queensland or western australia? undoubtedly areas you are probably going to describe as racist. she is talking about australian values being the values of the blonde, blue—eyed australian, is what she said. where the inner city type can't engage with these things... you are setting up a storm is solely for the purpose of knocking it out. australia values aren't narrow. loving your countries had legs that does make exceptional. most people of the country. i would encourage people to love other countries where they have heritage was up there is nothing wrong with that. the alleys abroad and saying

respect the rule of law. leave a peaceful, cooperative life. —— values. speaking less so you can talk to your fellow australians. they are not narrow, prescriptive values, they abroad values that make a society function in a cooperative, cohesive way. and if you don't believe in that you believe in the separatism of staying in your little narrow suburban not reaching out to other australians who are wonderful people and share those wonderful values. those values are values of humanity. humanity, yes. that's why we're here. humanity. cindy's question was is this debate legitimate in the context of multiculturalism is at a proxy for racism? no, don't agree. some years ago a coach at a national conversation on citizenship. but we put out a paper where we outlined the very australian values that we are talking about, respect for the rule of law, freedom of speech, freedom of religion, freedom of

association, respect for men and women and the rights of men and women, all of these things, and what was very clear to me is i went around australia and as we had this conversation with australians, is that those values are very important, but they are notjust uniquely australian values. they are values that are universal. they are the very values that so many of our migrants came to australia for those very reasons, because they came from circumstances where they were, they may have faced persecution, and they came to this country and those values underpin not only their existence, but also underpinned the very existence, but also underpinned the very reason existence, but also underpinned the very reason why today we are one of the most culturally diverse, yet socially cohesive nations on earth. and therefore those values are very important, because they are the glue that bind us together. sami shah committee have any problem with the

values? --do you have any problems? none of the values are what you would get if you asked an average australian was if you go on the street and asked them what is an australian value? the ones most likely to be listed would be larrikinism, fading, fair go. these are all australian phrases and catchphrases that mean equality for all, have a sense of humour, those things. it is not relevant law, human rights, respect for one another, that is a human value, regardless of your national identity. why do think the way it is used sometimes, for example the people who draw on values the most are always politicians. which automatically turns into a weapon, because politicians don't talk about anything unless they can weaponising. for them to then say what australian values, someone is against australian values, if mark is australian and jenny is australian, then both of them have australian, then both of them have australian values, they may differ on those, which means the values are too nebulous to really be taken down

seriously, or pin down. a values proxy for racism? it is used that way, for sure, definitely. there is an element of australian political society that uses the phrase "valu es" society that uses the phrase "values" as a weapon against minorities, immigrants, and so on and so forth. and for them to deny that it would be obtuse. so for your commiei that it would be obtuse. so for your commie i think you have a comment on this topic. thank you, zeinab, and the panel, and the bbc. migration has worked well in the past in australia. like the senator, in the daughter of a migrant. australia. like the senator, in the daughter ofa migrant. if australia. like the senator, in the daughter of a migrant. if you learn the language, work hard, and contributed in the community eve ryo ne contributed in the community everyone benefited. now, due to relentlessly high levels of immigration, enclave have been created. many people are not learning our language and so are less likely to find work or integrate socially. let's go to my next question. steve. thank you,

zeinab. there are 1.2 million australians of chinese heritage. and i'm one of them. we assimilate quite readily in australian society. we participate in local community activities through various ways. we contribute to the nation's wealth. we happened to similar values and aspirations as the rest of australia when it comes to having a fair go, getting ahead in education, and equal opportunities in work and play for the sake of our adopted nation. yet, despite australia's egalitarian outlook, in some quarters of my local community, in the media, in politics, there is a sinister, underlying feeling that we are never going to be good enough to be fed

into, trueblue aussies. my question to the panel is, what does it take, once and for all, for australian chinese to demonstrate or even make australians appreciate our contribution? i'll come to you, mark. the likes of steve, members of the chinese community, good enough to be australian? steve, your community has been the great success story in western sydney, where i've lived for so long and happily represented and raise my family, in that the great lever for opportunity in fairfield, bankstown, campbeltown in western sydney has been the collect of school system, where you are set a test to gain entry to a government high school. i went to one in the distant past, it is now

95% and asian school, as most of the selective schools are so the opportunity where parents say study hard, do the tutoring, study hard and passed the test and become a doctor, scientist or engineer, this is the modern australian dream. no community has displayed stronger work ethic than the australian—chinese community you're talking about. universally people prays that immunity for their work ethic and their achievements in these professions. in australia, it is 10% asian chinese background, 10% of the doctor population come from that community so a high proportion from that community. that comes on the back of hard work and expertise. for our country it's a great opportunity to have asian students studying hard to become leaders, but

still have the cultural background with the growth opportunities. this can sustain australia if managed properly over the next 50 years for a great period of prosperity. i don't find the problem that you're talking about because the reality... he obviously feels it, doesn't he?” can't answer for every individual‘s feelings, but when i talk to a pa rent feelings, but when i talk to a parent at a selective school in western sydney that talks about education opportunities, they say the kid is going great, working hard and studying hard, things are going great, and i talk to the doctors and the business people, they are thriving on the australian experience and opportunity. are you telling him he is wrong? no, i'm not saying that to anyone, but in the places these communities have raced ahead, there's been an acknowledgement they have raced ahead stopping your father is chinese but your mother is white australian. it is baffling to me

that we hear someone... i hearyou say what you say, steve, and it makes me sad because i know what you mean, i know the reality, the idea that mark would say that's not his reality. surprise surprise, mark hasn't experienced that level of racism and discrimination because he'sa racism and discrimination because he's a white australian, you'll never feel that level of racism. do you have to be white to... they are 95% asian schools, where is the racism, where is the racism? you can invent any problem in this world, it doesn't make it real, jenny, it doesn't make it real, jenny, it doesn't make it real. mark, you're engaging ina doesn't make it real. mark, you're engaging in a discussion where people are trying hard and the idea that you will denigrate and put down and marginalise to the point...” did no such thing... to the point where we see the idea of people talking about trying hard and

working hard as a legitimate way julie del might delegitimise their cultural heritage and ancestry and position in society is not ok —— to try to delegitimise. working hard is not ok? thanks very much for that. ruth, your question, please. my question is to, panel, what set of rules should immigrants need to subscribe to to live in a liberal, western democracy in order to protect its core values? surely they can only come in if they sign up to our way of life? senator contra ativan yasi wells. when my parents came to this country, we were basically a manufacturing —based economy, so people got off the boats and they went to work at the steelworks or in the cane fields or wherever. today, it's a very

different environment. it's very much a technological based economy, so therefore the requirements for english is a lot more permanent than it was in previous years. therefore, the thing that was very clear to me when i did my conversation on citizenship was that english is the glue that socially binds this country. you've got to be proficient in english? not because that means that you can't be proficient in any other language. that's a skill, you now have new rules where you have to do is sign up to certain civic values. what are those values? for example, you set a citizenship test and that citizenship test asks a series of questions. —— sit. during our many years of being a migration country, the criteria has varied from time to time. now it's a

requirement that you have to do certain things, which includes the citizenship test and a general understanding of what australia is, who we are and the basic things that make australia the country the way it is and i think that's understandable. ruth you want to come back on this? gender equality is the bottom line, that is the absolute core issue, yes? who is not accepting gender equality? well, certain cultures may restrict the activities, the freedoms of their females. there's women in melbourne, for example, afraid to walk at night because we've had a series of murders of young women in melbourne stopping the people who have committed those crimes, who also have domestic violence rates in the country, the amount of women murdered on a weekly basis by their partners, aren't from one culture. it's easy to say there is one culture that has a problem... which culture that has a problem... which culture is that? that's a more

universal problem. which culture are you referring to? there's a clause in the koran... patriarch e is the problem. i'm talking about the sexiest clauses in the koran, which i shoe you oppose any form of sexism. there are things in the bible. you can talk about that separately. shifting to another subject doesn't change what i'm saying, i hope you can appreciate that. we accepted that. and the need for women to cover up so only one man can view their flesh is a sexist practice obviously in our western society so it's helpful if islamic leaders can speak out about that institutionalised sexism just like christian leaders talk about problems in their holy book. and priests? all of those things, if we do them all and add them together then we become a more cohesive society. some say you single out

muslims. it would be helpful if islamic leaders talk about these things in the koran and say they shouldn't be practised stopping you are assuming that all muslims and islamic leaders are one homogenous identity stopping there there's diversity of opinion. when did i say that? i haven't spoken about other subjects stop you should have these debates based on what the other person is pointing out rather than thinking, oh, no, a dog ran over there and a cat ran over over there, i had better focus on these distractions. distraction is not truth. is someone going to speak about those clauses and say they are wrong? are you saying those clauses in the koran are wrong? i think my body of work speaks to the way i sit on religious issues, especially to do with islam and the koran.”

on religious issues, especially to do with islam and the koran. i can't apologise for any violence that a man has... i'm not responsible... at this point you asked jenny if she loves australia, you asked me if i hate islam. you're not the prosecutor of australians, you were not appointed that nor should you be allowed to consider yourself that. i'm not saying you're responsible for every islamic man who has read the koran and beaten up his wife, but i'm asking you to say the teachings are wrong. can you say that? are you going to apologise for every man who has beaten up a woman in this country. i can't get an a nswer in this country. i can't get an answer so my position is clear.” ask why you're asking that question. that's not how debates work. that's exactly how they work stopping the question was about sexism. why are you so scared of saying the provisions that authorise domestic violence and other forms of sexism are inappropriate? why is it so hard to say that? he is making a simple

point that perhaps it is not, as i said,... discrimination against women isn't something perpetrated just by muslims, that's the point jenny was also reinforcing. what do the audience think about values and whether immigrants in australia need to sign up to a set of values, including equality for women. yes, the lady, if you could stand and briefly comment? i think talking about values in western democracies and values of white anglo communities, i think we need to say that in the last 20 years, i guess, we've seen the most horrific evidence of widespread systemic abuse of children by our catholic and protestant churches anywhere in the world. everywhere in the world, in the white world, and we have to answer for that. this isn't muslims doing this, this is christians doing this, christians preaching everyday in the churches, so let's not have

the hypocrisy here about islam or the hypocrisy here about islam or the koran. let stand up and clean up our own backyard first, please! let's go to our next question and thatis let's go to our next question and that is from vic. vic? ido vic? i do not believe multiculturalism is failing. i believe the issue is it is we who are failing multiculturalism. simply glance around the world at the toxic absurdities of extremist parties in countries from greece, to turkey, to germany, and the polarising and destructive events in cha rlottesville, destructive events in charlottesville, christ church, pittsburgh, and it is clear that it is humanity failing the principle of multiculturalism and turning increasingly to bigotry —— christhurch. does the panel agree. a quick response? there is a foundation in australia that has for decades been doing work on this

issue and they ask the question, and it's usually about 50,000 respondents every time they do it... is multiculturalism supported, or in other words, do you support multiculturalism? generally the response has been between 53% and 83%, but there's one element that protocol and that is that multiculturalism is a 2—way street. it's about australia accepting migrants but migrants accepting australia. i think that is... applause . . . the reason why i come back to the point that i said at the beginning, yes, it is accepted here in australia because we are a country of migrants, but it remains a 2—way street stop humanity is multicultural.

there is no such thing as culture living in a static vacuum, the languages we speak, everyone of them happened because our languages were merged. the clothes we wear, the food we eat, one frustrating thing is the division between western and eastern when the entire history of humanity is a symbiosis of the two. there's no such thing as culture without multicultural and we don't need to think about the strength of multiculturalism stopping the people who say it is bad and failing, they are the ones who are frightened and there are always going to be frightened people in every generation but luckily for us human history shows they are blip and they can be ignored because sooner or later someone else will come with a ghost under the bed they are afraid of. it is hard to take tragedies in another countries as a reflection of australian multiculturalism. the reality in our country is the original model set out by whitlam and fraser in the 70s was a good one in that it was about a blended,

integrated society and governments initially work hard to make sure the things we spoken about, speaking english, work ethic, australian values, they were part of the multicultural policy. in recent time, it's a feature of left of centre politics, we've moved to a laissez—faire multiculturalism where if you say it's good for everyone to speak english, it is good for eve ryo ne speak english, it is good for everyone to know each other, migrants speaking english because you have a better chance of getting a job then you are a racist. here we 90, a job then you are a racist. here we go, this is the problem, you are pa rt go, this is the problem, you are part of the problem in that you're describing good things for our society as racism when they are just good things. he said everybody's port english in the schools. that's the point you're making. —— taught english. why are you yelling out? but what about people with a work ethic, you need a work ethic for

jobs. we have moved to this lace a fair multiculturalism where anything you say that points out problem, it is described immediately as a bit of racism —— laissez—faire. is described immediately as a bit of racism -- laissez-faire. your question was about the rise in extremism and you have said that problems has been brought from elsewhere, referring to christ church, brenton tarrant, the young australian man who sadly killed 50 people in christchurch in new zealand. you're taking that as a reflection of australian multiculturalism stopping that's not a reflection of australian multiculturalism. he lived over there for years and accumulated an arsenal of weapons you couldn't do in australia and described himself as an eco— libertarian, nutty people aren't a reflection on our country, they're not! this gentleman here, why were you objecting to what mark latham was saying?

i find it strange that people keep trying to say that migrants and their children don't fit in with australian society or that not speaking english is a problem in australia. it's such an advantage to speak english and to speak english well stopping the biggest problem is that for migrants learning english, it is now really expensive. governments could do a holland by making english learning cheaper, and, of course, for children who are migrants or children of migrants going through the australian school system, a better funded primary school system with more emphasis on kids having problems learning of course overcomes so many of kids having problems learning of course overcomes so many of the disadvantages that might depend on your family background if you don't get enough help on the community and the government. it makes the point that i was trying to emphasise. a government report last year showed 900,000 australians, a significant

number, with little or no english stopping the problem isn't people who are multilingual, the problem is people with with no english language skills. free education classes in english language! we must recognise 900,000 of ourfellow english language! we must recognise 900,000 of our fellow australians not speaking any english. crosstalk. it isa not speaking any english. crosstalk. it is a major problem for the reason that we can't get to know each other, we can't communicate. you are saying the means are not there. it isa saying the means are not there. it is a process problem. jenny will say it is not a problem, of course. being multilingual is a wonderful thing. i went zetas not a problem. i will say i don't think anybody would criticise you if you were being a strong advocate for increased free english education for australians. they are critical of you because you are constantly talking about all of the numbers of people who do not speak english and that appears to be holding up something as a problem to create division rather than offering what we would expect from our political leaders that's in your

mind and your mind only. applause . let us go to our next question. from robert. as humans go and develop, i think it is fair to say we explore, my submission is that multiculturalism is an inevitability. i think we're talking about australia being one of the beacons of that. so if you accept that surely the right question to ask is actually how do we work with multiculturalism, not is it failing? who wants to start on that? just look at australia today. you take the top 100 wealthy people in this country and you will see diversity at work. 30% of our small businesses are actually started by migrants. the second and third generation of our migrants today are right across the employment, the political, all different spectrums. that is our diversity at work stop millions of

people who have come to this country to build a better life for themselves and their children and, today, we see the product of their success. that is not to say that there isn't room for improvement or that there isn't changes or that there isn't a way that we can make our country a lot better. there is a lwa ys our country a lot better. there is always a scope for that. from mooresville and the united states,