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tv   Beyond 100 Days  BBC News  September 24, 2019 7:00pm-7:31pm BST

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the happened at the highest court in the uk, we are now going tojoin my colleague andrew neil for a bbc news special. politics in crisis. to have broken the law when he shut down parliament at a time of national crisis. the court is bound to conclude, therefore, that the decision to advise her majesty to prorogue parliament was unlawful. mps celebrate outside court, and the speaker announces that the house will resume sitting tomorrow. borisjohnson, meeting president trump in new york today, says he strongly disagrees with the ruling but will respect it. jeremy corbyn adds his voice to the calls for the prime minister to resign, but there's no sign of him tabling a vote of no confidence. so what happens now, and away from the drama at westminster, what do voters make of it all?
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good evening. welcome to this bbc news special on the day britain's constitutional crisis came to a head. on the matter of the government suspending parliament for five weeks, the english high court had decided it was a political matter and none of its business. scotland's top court ruled it was very much its business — and unlawful. today the country's supreme court made the ultimate judgment. nobody knew for sure which way it would go. few anticipated it would be this bad for the prime minister. the decision to advise her majesty to prorogue parliament was unlawful. it had the effect of frustrating or preventing the ability of parliament to carry
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out its constitutional functions without reasonable justification. westminster in shock as 11 justices of the supreme court unanimously ruled the prime minister should not have suspended parliament. the most senior court in the land said the prime minister had acted unlawfully. the effect on the fundamentals of our democracy was extreme. no justification for taking action with such an extreme effect has been put before the court. our democracy lives! no sooner had parliament returned from its long summer recess in early september than boris johnson suspended it for five weeks. the supreme court says this had the clear effect of stopping mps from scrutinising the government in the crucial run—up to brexit. the prime minister, in new york for the un general assembly, said he accepted the decision. obviously, this is a verdict
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that we will respect, and we respect the judicial process. i have to say i strongly disagree. i invite borisjohnson, in the historic words, to consider his position! amid the uproar, jeremy corbyn brought forward his annual keynote speech to the labour party conference from tomorrow to this afternoon. he used it to call for the prime minister's resignation. this unelected prime minister should now resign. speakerjohn bercow said parliament will resume sitting at 11:30 tomorrow morning. so parliament is back, though to do what isn't quite clear. a seriously wounded prime minister will soon be back from new york — not to resign, but for how long can he preside
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over a lame—duck government? meanwhile, the little matter of brexit remains unresolved. a constitutional crisis is taking westminster into uncharted and stormy waters. nobody — repeat nobody — knows how this is going to end or when. i'm joined now by our political editor, laura kuenssberg. laura, the prime minister is getting ona laura, the prime minister is getting on a plane tonight, coming back early, in time for the opening of parliament tomorrow. do we have any idea what his strategy is now to deal with this? i idea what his strategy is now to dealwith this? i think, idea what his strategy is now to dealwith this? ithink, as idea what his strategy is now to deal with this? i think, as things are tonight, and it could change extremely quickly, it is to carry on regardless, and carry on with the strategy that saw him into number ten in the first place, which is to say to his party and to people who voted leave and to the country that he will do anything in his power to ta ke he will do anything in his power to take us out of the european union, with or without ideal, deal, by halloween. the question, however, is as he keeps getting himself into
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these very serious predicaments which his supporters might try to laugh off as a scribe or a blunder, it is not a sustainable approach to carry on like this, not least because he has no majority, and that is before you consider the reputational damage of a serious judgment like this from the supreme court. and by any normal comparisons, this would be a moment of great perilfor comparisons, this would be a moment of great peril for the prime minister. but we are not in normal times, and there is a very strong belief in number ten that many of oui’ belief in number ten that many of our viewers, belief in number ten that many of oui’ viewers, many belief in number ten that many of our viewers, many people around the country, we look at him and think, he has done everything he can get brexit done, and we are fed up of it and we want him to keep going. but my goodness, this is a high wire act, and it is a long way down if they fall off it. and he now has, as he regards it, the inconvenience of having to deal with parliament. we had hoped there would be a long period, five weeks, of getting on with things. the supreme court has said no. it doesn't change the substance, but he will be subject to
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guerrilla warfare. no question, and remember he doesn't have a majority, the government is about a0 down, so we can't get his way in parliament, and there is no question that the rebel alliance, opposition parties and former tories, like ken clarke, pa rt and former tories, like ken clarke, part of this rebel alliance, they have the numbers to take control of every day in parliament that it sits. but it is also the case that they do not agree amongst themselves on what to do next. some of them wa nt on what to do next. some of them want another referendum, some of them want to have a compromise on them want to have a compromise on the deal, some of them frankly are not quite sure, hour by hour, what they would like to do next. where they would like to do next. where they are united is that they want to tie up boris johnson they are united is that they want to tie up borisjohnson as tightly as they possibly can to make sure that he doesn't open the pandora's box of leaving without a deal. and in a funny way, andrew, the court has made history today, but our politics are in almost exactly the same place they were this morning. thank you very much for that.
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now, we did ask the government for an interview with any of its ministers, but we've been told that they are not doing any interviews this evening. despite these momentous events, we will not be able to speak to a representative of her majesty's government. i'm joined now by the former labour turned liberal democrat mp chuka umunna. welcome to the programme. evening, andrew. you said boris johnson is unfit for office, when you see is the first opportunity to support a vote of no confidence to bring him down? we have said he should resign, he is unfit for office, as you have said, but he has said he will not resign, and the only mechanism therefore to remove him is through a vote of no confidence tabled by the leader of the opposition. he has indicated he will not table that vote of no confidence until we can be certain that we have secured an extension to the article 50 process, such that we don't fall out of the european union without a deal. and for us, the liberal democrats, the
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biggest and strongest remain party, we wa nt biggest and strongest remain party, we want to stop brexit altogether, and that is our ultimate aim, but we absolutely believe it is vital to stop a no—deal brexit. absolutely believe it is vital to stop a no-deal brexit. that is more important than a vote of no confidence? ifjeremy corbyn were to move a vote of no confidence, would you support it? he has said he won't. but would you support it? not if it would mean that we would end up, through the course of the resulting election campaign, falling out of the european union without a deal, that would be catastrophic. you could tie that up before we went to an election, mrjohnson doesn't control the house, you could put any guarantees in place you want before an election, you and your rebel alliance control the house. we do, some would argue, but the issue is how you get the extension. in order to getan how you get the extension. in order to get an extension to article 50, it does require the prime minister to send a letter to the eu council president. you have got an extension, you have got the act that
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forces the prime minister to ask for an extension in the event of no—deal. why don't you go to the country with that? we cannot be confident that this prime minister will comply with the law. he has said he will. got the biggest example of him not complying with the law is unlawfully seeking to prorogue parliament, and you say that he said he would comply with the low, but the only reason we are resuming business tomorrow is that the instigation of the speaker, so it is important that parliament is sitting to use all the tools at its disposal to make sure that we don't fall out of the european union without a deal. but you have accused mrjohnson of a trump like authoritarian power grab, and yours you don't want to remove him now? the issue is of timing, and ultimately we have got to have in oui’ ultimately we have got to have in our minds are stopping a catastrophe, and we have seen from
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the yellowhammer documents, which we have not had full disclosure of yet, we have not seen that, and it is one of the things we need to return to tomorrow. i come back to the point that people like you now control parliamentary business, not the government. this is a zombie government. you are running a campaign, you tweeted again today, to sack borisjohnson, you invited the british voters to sign up to sack borisjohnson. the british voters to sign up to sack boris johnson. and the british voters to sign up to sack borisjohnson. and you yourself are frightened to sack him. we are talking about a matter of about three and a half weeks. 0nce talking about a matter of about three and a half weeks. once we get into the middle of october, we know the prime minister is required by law to request an extension to article 50, and in particular at the eu council, but we cannot be confident. he keeps telling you, the bbc, and others that he will have us leave do or die on the 31st of 0ctober, so in essence he is saying he will not comply with the law, and thatis he will not comply with the law, and that is why we cannot afford to have
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parliament is not sitting during that period. replace him now, you could have a vote of no confidence and replace him. as i said, we are not the official opposition, that is in the gift ofjeremy corbyn, and we have said you could do a vote of no confidence and put in place a ca reta ker confidence and put in place a caretaker prime minister... would you back that? absolutely we would. would you back jeremy you back that? absolutely we would. would you backjeremy corbyn as a ca reta ker would you backjeremy corbyn as a caretaker prime minister? a gap that has no majority for that. we have put forward two proposals, harriet harman, the mother of the house. we are not too sure if he attempts to form a government whether he would not support an alternative. we have also put forward the father of the house, ken clarke. they are the most senior members of the house of commons, so absolutely we have put that forward. it should be only natural that if the prime minister loses the confidence of the house,
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the leader of the opposition has a shot at having the confidence vote. and we can't stop that. you wouldn't support it. it depends. if he supports a caretaker prime minister who can command a majority, of course. but he doesn't have the numbers... we end up without prime ministerjohnson or the leader of the opposition, you are outlining a recipe... we think we are in a crisis now, this would be constitutional chaos! let's be clear why we are in this position we are in because brexit in the form that was promised to the british people by borisjohnson was promised to the british people by boris johnson and was promised to the british people by borisjohnson and others has proved impossible to deliver, because there was a litany of fa ntasy because there was a litany of fantasy promises and lies that were made several years ago, and since then parliament has been trying to square the circle, and it can't. then parliament has been trying to square the circle, and it can'tlj square the circle, and it can't.|j understand, but that is the case for a new parliament. let me ask you this. is it wrong for downing street to criticise supreme courtjudges? yes. why is it right for your
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leader, jo swinson, to tweet several times how much love she feels for lady hale this afternoon?” times how much love she feels for lady hale this afternoon? i think the reason that she was saying she felt love for lady hale, because she isa felt love for lady hale, because she is a fantastic role model for women, she is the first female... come on, she is the first female... come on, she liked the decision! so it is right forjo swinson to fall in love with her, it has to be right for downing street to criticise her. with her, it has to be right for downing street to criticise herlj think if you emoji were used in that tweet. several tweets. the thing think if you emoji were used in that tweet. severaltweets. the thing is this, do you have a situation where, with separation of powers, it is right for ministers of the crown to attack thejudiciary, right for ministers of the crown to attack the judiciary, fundamentally important to upholding the constitution and our laws. that is wrong, we do not live in a dictatorship, we should respect the institutions that protect our democracy, and frankly that is what the supreme court has done, a good day for democracy. we are not in a dictatorship, we comply with the law. we are out of time, thank you. all this week, the bbc is focusing on stoke—on—trent to find out more about the city
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where people voted overwhelmingly to leave the european union. robert hall is there for us this evening. we are at a place which celebrates this potteries historic past on a day when people are looking with uncertainty at the immediate future. it is fairto uncertainty at the immediate future. it is fair to say there was a collective sigh of resignation here when the news broke. but let's take the temperature with my guest. sophie calvert, give me a sense of what people have been saying? strong feelings on both sides, some still believe boris johnson did feelings on both sides, some still believe borisjohnson did the right thing, others say borisjohnson should resign and if not, he should be forced out. the main thing i have been hearing the whole time is that people just want something done. they're fed up of hearing about it and they want something done. 69% of people voted to leave from stoke on trent in the referendum and that is
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what they want to see happen. they feel it has been frustrating. local businessman, you voted remain. how did you view the events of this morning? you can't put parliament on the lock down and i would say that it was democracy dying. where do we go from here, we have five weeks to go. we have to go back to people. i don't think in these circumstances we won't be able to make an exit. you work in a local supermarket and used to work in the potteries, a staunch leaver, what do we do? just let him get on with it. at the end of the day, they were targeting borisjohnson even of the day, they were targeting boris johnson even before of the day, they were targeting borisjohnson even before he became prime minister, saying we will do everything we can to get him out and get the tory government out. give him a chance. let him get on with it. see what he is going to come up
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with. we have got until the end of october. that date is firm? as far as i'm concerned, october is when we are going to be out. we should have been out in march. it didn't happen. october we should be out. deal or no deal. i don't care. it won't affect us. deal. i don't care. it won't affect us. we have done it before, we can do it again. thank you very much. i mean we are going to hearing more, the road show we are stoke is here for the week. i expect it to be a busy couple of days. back to you. thanks, robert. joining me from brighton now, where labour are holding their conference, is the shadow cabinet minister dan carden. labour has called on borisjohnson to resign, he has made clear he is not going to do that, when can we expect, now that parliament is back, a motion of no confidence from labour? hi, andrew, it is good to
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talk to you from brighton, what borisjohnson should do now is seek the extension from europe to article 50, so we can have the general election and that is whatjeremy set out in his speech, if borisjohnson gets the extension, so we can guarantee we don't crash out of the eu at the end of october, we will have that general election. eu at the end of october, we will have that general electionm eu at the end of october, we will have that general election. if he doesn't, when will labour move a motion of no confidence in the government? we have always said we will move it when we think it will be most effective. there will be talks going on between party leaders over the next couple of days, but really boris johnson over the next couple of days, but really borisjohnson has said he wa nts a really borisjohnson has said he wants a general election, so there is an easy way to get that, get to europe and have the extension and have a general election. what could bea have a general election. what could be a more appropriate time than now foran be a more appropriate time than now for an opposition that wants to replace the government? this government has had more incoming
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missiles than saddam hussein. he is on the wrong end of supreme court, he has lost his majority in the house of commons and lost control of brexit, how weak does he have to be before you move against him?|j before you move against him?” couldn't agree with you more, but you know because of the threat of crashing out of the eu with no deal, at the end of october, because this isa at the end of october, because this is a prime minister that is totally dupe lis us to and we cannot trust a word he says, the only way to get that general election is for him to get the extension. be you now know... get the extension. be you now know. . . the get the extension. be you now know... the vote of no confidence wouldn't sort the problem of crashing out of the eu. you know he is not going to ask for an extension and you know the reasons why, he would probably rather resign than call for an extension. so you are now ina call for an extension. so you are now in a situation where if he called for another general election
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in the house of commons, would you vote for it? as i say, we have to ta ke vote for it? as i say, we have to take the risk of crashing out of the eu off the table. so borisjohnson is playing games, he is in america with donald trump, he is playing game, pretending he is some man of people when he is cosying up to this american president and what he should be is back here in parliament. he is coming back. he will arrive tomorrow. what does he have to do, given he won't seek no deal himself, what would he have to do, what would the house have to do, because you're now in control of the house, why don't you just put something before the house that would make it impossible for boris johnson to leave on no deal on 31st october? well those talks are going on between the party leaders. i know they will convene tomorrow, but people are having telephone conversations today and absolutely we have to look at every single
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possibility of coming together to get rid of this rotting government. todayjeremy corbyn set out our policies for the next general election, we are ready, we want that election, we are ready, we want that election, but unfortunately with this prime minister, we can't trust him to keep his word. so he is a duplicitous prime minister, but you're not moving to get rid of him. explain the logic of that to our viewers? i would like to see a vote of no confidence, but we have to move that at the right time when all the parties have spoken and have agreed a strategy. so you know, things are complex in parliament, as you will know, the numbers are more unusual, we have conservatives becoming liberal democrats and lots of independent mps, really the only way to solve this problem is to have a general election, that is when we get to talk about the real issues. you keep on saying that, you don't use the mechanism that would bring
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it about, you can't keep saying to people, we want a general election andi people, we want a general election and i understand why you do, without then using the mechanism that could bring that about. andrew, we will use the mechanism of a vote of no confidence when it is the best time to do so. i'm not privy to any knowledge of when that might be, but we will be back in parliament tomorrow and the conversations will ta ke tomorrow and the conversations will take place. but you can be assured that the labour party want that general election. why did you want the house to come back if you don't wa nt to the house to come back if you don't want to move a motion to bring the government down? what is the point? that is not actually what happened, what happened is the supreme court said the prorogation was null and void and unlawful. you wanted the house to come back... the prime
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minister acting unlawfully means that parliament is now still sitting. so yes we will be back tomorrow and working with other political parties to see how we can bring this disastrous government to an end. if you come around in the end to a vote of no confidence, at your time end to a vote of no confidence, at yourtime and end to a vote of no confidence, at your time and choosing, would jeremy corbyn expect to form a care taker government? well that is obviously a possibility. it would be forjeremy to seek to get parliament's support and one way of getting that extension is forjeremy to win the support of parliament, become prime minister... what over possibility would there be for the opposition?” don't know... you said it was a possibility. do you guarantee... jeremy corbyn did form a care taker government he would only be for a couple of weeks to stop no deal, and call an election? no, i don't know
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what plans there would be. i don't know what talks are going on between the different political parties. well you're in the shadow cabinet. gers mrooejeremy well you're in the shadow cabinet. gers mrooe jeremy couldn't well you're in the shadow cabinet. gers mrooejeremy couldn't have been clearer. —— jeremy couldn't have been clearer. the talks will be going on over the next couple of days. if you get the talks, do you guarantee if mrjohnson is forced to resign because he loses a vote of no confidence and jeremy corbyn is able to form a care taker government it will only be for a couple of weeks to make sure no deal doesn't happen and to callan to make sure no deal doesn't happen and to call an election? can you give the viewers that guarantee tonight? no, it is not for me to give that guarantee. there will be discussions going on between the different political parties and independent mps going on. i know it isa independent mps going on. i know it is a fascinating time and all the machinations of what could come, but it will be jeremy corbyn machinations of what could come, but it will bejeremy corbyn in a situation like that who steps
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forward and seeks to get the support of parliament. but you know our message is clear let's get the extension and get the general election. thank you. i'm joined now by the brexit party mep belinda de lucy. you described today's ruling as a grave injustice and a continuation of the resis taps to brexit —— resista nce of the resis taps to brexit —— resistance brexit. are you saying thejudges were in resistance brexit. are you saying the judges were in favour of brexit. idid say the judges were in favour of brexit. i did say i have the utmost respect for our courts, it is one of reasons i voted brexit, because i want our laws to be interpreted by british judges, i was talking about obstacles. you believe ourjudges are not biased and this was an independent decision taken based on law? i believe it is dangerous territory when ourjudiciary
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law? i believe it is dangerous territory when our judiciary and unelected lawyers step into the sphere of politics, i wonder whether thatis sphere of politics, i wonder whether that is the right path to go down, when we have had very little consultation. but i have respect for oui’ consultation. but i have respect for our courts. you must be happy, the brexit party's case for leaving is to restore parliamentary sovereignty and the supremacy of uk law and you have both. job done? we believe the sovereignty lies with the people and thatis sovereignty lies with the people and that is the first and foremost point of brexit. you talk about sovereignty... david cameron said it was not for parliament to decide, they would implement what the people chose. was that a lie? no, we voted in good faith and we just want honesty and integrity and accountability. isn't that what borisjohnson accountability. isn't that what boris johnson wants and accountability. isn't that what borisjohnson wants and no matter the set backs, he stays committed to brexit. what more does he have to do to prove to your party he is
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serious? being committed to brexit is no longer enough, as we saw with theresa may's speech, she was committed to brexit at one point. but borisjohnson committed to brexit at one point. but boris johnson is committed to brexit at one point. but borisjohnson is different. committed to brexit at one point. but boris johnson is different. he isa but boris johnson is different. he is a brexiteer, so great. what don't you agree with him? we want results. until he comes back with a good deal, not a rehash of may's deal or leaving with a clean brexit, that we would prefer, a clean brexit is not necessarily what boris johnson is after at the moment. a rehash of may's deal is not what we support.l general election could be a close run thing. if you take enough vote 5 from the tories, the brexit party could scupper brexit. you say that, we made an offer, we put country before party and we would step down in areas where there could be brexit supporting mps. so the ball lies in
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boris johnson's court. supporting mps. so the ball lies in borisjohnson's court. if he wants to split the vote, the blame lies with him. you have no mps, he has lots of mps, he needs more to deliver brexit. you want him to deliver brexit. you want him to deliver brexit. you want him to deliver brexit. he is closer to you than theresa may ever was. in rhetoric. well also, it doesn't matter what hits him, he has still the same line as you, but you could be the people who stop him from delivering on brexit. that would just be a ridiculous position to find yourselves in. that is not how we see it. five million labour voters voted leave and a poll said yesterday said 23% of labour leave voters would switch to voting to borisjohnson on this one occasion on nigel‘s say so. 56% of wales and the east midlands would agree to vote for boris johnson,
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the east midlands would agree to vote for borisjohnson, if nigel instructed them that that was the way to deliver brexit. just instructed them? no if their main point is to deliver brexit, that is all we are about, we are a plain party, we can't be dishonest and spin anything. if they want brexit implemented and it means voting for the tory, 23% of labour voters said they would do that. thank you. that's it from me on this dramatic day in westminster. i'll be back tomorrow on bbc two at 7pm with the andrew neil show. and there's continuing coverage now on the bbc news channel and bbc world news. goodnight. this is a bbc news special with me,
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christian fraser. a damning verdict from the supreme court, the government broke the law when it suspended parliament. the court passed a unanimous verdict prompting demands for boris johnson passed a unanimous verdict prompting demands for borisjohnson to resign. the decision to advise her majesty to prorogue parliament was unlawful. it had the effect of frustrating or preventing the ability of parliament to carry out its constitutional functions. mps celebrate outside the court and will go back to parliament tomorrow. borisjohnson says he'll abide by the ruling but he's not happy about it. i have the highest respect, of course, for the judiciary and the independence of oui’ judiciary and the independence of our courts but i must say i strongly disagree with this judgment. our courts but i must say i strongly disagree with thisjudgment. the prime minister has been meeting with president trump at the un. two leaders facing similar pressures at home. democrats are meeting now to discuss impeachment after the
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president admitted he with held military aid from ukraine to force the ukrainians to investigate his political rival, joe biden. welcome to this bbc news special. it's difficult to exaggerate the importance of what happened today. the highest court ruling unanimously that the prime minister's position to ask the queen to suspend parliament for five weeks was unlawful. the ruling represents a devastating defeat for boris johnson, his cabinet and for those advisers involved in the original decision. thejudges advisers involved in the original decision. the judges said that the suspension was designed to prevent scrutiny of the government as the brexit deadline approaches. the house of commons will resume its business tomorrow morning. boris johnson, who is in new york for a speech to the un general assembly, said he strongly disagrees with the ruling. his opponents have called on him to resign immediately. the judges upheld the

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