this hello, it's friday, it's 10 o'clock. i'm joanna gosling. the postmortems start on the bodies of some of the 39 people found dead in a lorry in essex. they are believed to be chinese nationals. i'll be talking to the chief police investigator in the morecambe bay tragedy where 23 chinese cockle pickers drowned. i'll also be asking a human rights lawyer about her experiences working with victims of trafficking. after promising that we'd leave the eu, do or die, on october 31st, the prime minister now admits we won't be and that he wants an election on december 12th. will the opposition parties give him his wish? we have to accept we won't be able to leave on october the 31st because

parliament has requested an extension. some people are being forced into sex work because the new credit system leaves them without enough money to cover their most basic needs. that's what mps have found and they are calling for urgent action. many women become stuck in the cycle of needing to continue to sell sex to keep a roof over their heads, because the cost of living has become so high and benefits so frequently fail to cover it. imagine being able to be in two, three or even four places at the same time. with your own realistic human avatar that's now possible, if but what will this mean for society and especially women? sake i'm a ceo and a mother and an adviser and an investor. i have a lot of roles and i think that if i could send my avatar off to have fun and party on my behalf, that would be a great thing.

hello... welcome to the programme. we're live until 11 this morning. josh hanson was stabbed to death four years ago by a man called shane o'brien. mr o'brien immediately went on the run, leaving the country and evading police for three and a half years. he was finally caught earlier this year and brought back to the uk. this week, he was given a life sentence. josh's mother and sister, who've been on the programme several times, will be here this morning to talk about finally getting justice for him. first carrie gracie has the news. postmortem examinations are due to be carried out on some of the 39 people found dead in a lorry in essex. police believe the eight women and 31 men were chinese. lorry driver mo robinson, from county armagh, continues to be questioned after police were granted an extension. more on this story later in the programme, when we will be hearing from the dective who led

the investigation into the morecambe bay tragedy, where 23 chinese cockle pickers drowned when they were trapped by rising tides. borisjohnson will spend the next three days trying to persuade mps to back his plans for a general election on 12th of the december. meanwhile, eu ambassadors arejoining their chief negotiatior michel barnier to discuss how much longer they should give the uk to achieve brexit. they're expected to delay their final decision until they know if the election is going ahead. most eu states are understood to favour a three—month delay, but france has argued for a shorter extension. britain's biggest remaining payday loan provider, quickquid, is to close, with thousands of complaints about its lending still unresolved. its american owners said it was exiting the uk market because of what it described as "regulatory uncertainty". there are around 10,000 customers who say they were given loans they could not afford to repay. if their claims are upheld, those affected may only receive

a fraction of their compensation. the nhs system for reminding parents in england when to vaccinate their children is "inconsistent", according to the national audit office. it says there should be a greater push to identify vulnerable and underserved groups, like travellers. since 2012, there has been a fall in uptake of nearly all pre—school vaccinations, such as mmr. nhs england says it is bringing health professionals together to take action. mps are calling on the government to take action after new evidence that women are turning to sex work because of problems and delays with universal credit payments. a report published today also warns more people will be driven into so—called "survival sex" if benefit payments fail to match what claimants actually need to live off. the government said it was taking the evidence "very seriously". later, we will be hearing from an mp who quit the conservative party

criticising their roll—out of universal credit, and from a group that campaigns for sex workers‘ rights. schools are failing to diagnose at least 80% of pupils in england who have dyslexia, according to a new report. it said families were paying up to £1000 for private assessments. charities and mps are now calling for every school to have a specialist teacher to help pupils with the condition. the government has launched a review to improve services. crowds of people are hoping to climb australia's uluru, which was formerly known as ayers rock, before a permanent ban on scaling it takes effect tomorrow. hundreds queued to make the ascent, but dangerous weather delayed the start for many. the ban follows indigenous people calling for tourists to stop climbing the ancient sandstone rock because of its spiritual significance. thatis that is a summary of the news. now back to joanna for the rest that is a summary of the news. now back tojoanna for the rest of that is a summary of the news. now back to joanna for the rest of the

programme. postmortem examinations are due to start today on some of the 39 people whose bodies were found in a refrigerated lorry container in essex. 11 of the victims were taken by private ambulance to a hospital in chelmsford last night. the chinese ambassador to the uk says he has sent a team to essex to help police verify the identity of the victims, but that their nationality was yet to be confirmed. detectives have been given an extra 2a hours to question the driver, a 25—year—old man from northern ireland, who was arrested on suspicion of murder. let's now talk to former detective superintendent mick gradwell, who led the investigation into the morecambe bay tragedy, where 23 chinese cockle pickers drowned when they were trapped by sweeping tides. emily kenway is an advisor for focus on labour exploitation which works to end human trafficking for labour exploitation. and human rights lawyer shalini patel, who specialises in immigration.

welcome, all of you, mick, from what you learned about that notary is case several yea rs you learned about that notary is case several years ago now but still, obviously, a lot will have been learned about the potential routes for getting people here, what would you expect about how those 39 ended up, if it is found they came from china, to be here in that trailer. basically, if they are from china, they will probably have gone toa china, they will probably have gone to a snakehead can in the province they have come from and if they are in the back of the trailer, the chances are they have paid the snake had gone to traffic them through mainland europe, through various routes, in various safe houses along the way and they will have been paid to have been met in the uk to meet people who will have then tried to provide them with accommodation and jobs and that is roughly how the system works. obviously, you have talked about what you think might happen. we literally don't know at

this stage. investigations are under way. you mentioned the snakehead gangs that would have been involved in cases like this. in terms of getting this far in a trailer, without having been discovered at any of the checkpoints through which the trailer and those people would have come, it is hard to imagine how that could be the case. it is but obviously, they may not have come that far in that particular vehicle. they can be trafficked over long distances via a variety of routes, even train services or buses but the place where they really need to be concealed is when they come through a border and that is what went wrong with the case in dover some years ago, the driver cut off the ventilation to try to hide the noise as they came through security. it may just be as they came through security. it mayjust be that these people have beenin mayjust be that these people have been in that refrigerated lorry for a short period of time but hopefully the investigations will reveal when these people got in there. emily, 31

men and eight women, is that unusual. it is actually not unusual. most people tend to think of women when they think of victims of trafficking but in the uk last year, more chinese men were identified as potential victims of trafficking than women. that is because trafficking happens in all sectors. it is notjust a sex sector thing. it is notjust a sex sector thing. it is notjust a sex sector thing. it is in factories, farms and fishing, as we saw with morecambe bay. that is really an issue of lack of regulation in the loft of our labour sectors and also the criminalisation of undocumented people in the uk, meaning that exploitative bosses can purposefully use them so they don't have to pay as much as they would to somebody with the rights that we would all hope to have. so they are people who wa nt to hope to have. so they are people who want to come here for a better life. precisely. and they pay heavily to be able to do that. the vast majority of trafficking victims worldwide are people who wanted to

move in the first place, they have not been kidnapped or abducted. some people have but that is a real minority. we are talking about people who are absolutely desperate to get to another country to help their families survive back home and their families survive back home and the only way they can do that is through this terrifying and risky route on arrival, had they survived, unfortunately, they are likely to have been exploited. shalini, what have been exploited. shalini, what have you encountered in the cases you have worked with, working with chinese women who are victims of exploitation? the majority of my clients end up in debt to loan sharks or snakehead gangs in china. they accrue vast amounts of debt and then the snakeheads exploit that because they cannot pay it back. they then tell them there is an offer of a job abroad. they don't always know it is going to be the uk. the snakehead will sort out their visa and they will end up in their visa and they will end up in the uk, the majority of the time, yes, these women agreed to go to another country but that is because

they are from rural, poor villages. they don't know any different. they are offered vast amounts of money. they take up the other. they then can't pay it back. they arrive in the uk and that is when they become victims of trafficking because they are sexually exploited, they are working in massage parlours, brothels, restaurants, most of the time, not paid. they are locked up for months and years on end this or any help is found. it is not always any help is found. it is not always a sexual exportation. you think there may be tens of thousands of victims of trafficking in this country, presumably, they are people that we may well be coming across in our daily lives. where might we be encountering these people? well, in any of our communities and workplaces, to be perfectly honest. but the sectors where it is most common, aside from domestic servitude which is isolated people in somebody's house, doing the cleaning or being a nanny. aside from that, it is any sectors where

there is very low pay, agency work, temporary work, lots of subcontractors so nobody quite knows who is really employing that person or checking where the pay is going. there is a kind of total under regulation and lack of being sure that these people understand what their rights are, who is paying them and who they can go to for help? shalini when somebody comes to you, what can you do for them? most of our referrals will be cases of historic trafficking where they have been encountered by the police or immigration enforcement and more often than not ended up in detention centres. at that point in time, i step in and try to get them released from detention because it is not a suitable place for such vulnerable individuals and i will refer them to the national referral mechanism and see them through the trafficking process until they are given some kind of leave to remain in the uk and recognised as victims of trafficking. nick, in terms of actually using cases where they are

found to try to stop this exploitation, is any progress being made or are the numbers just getting worse? it is difficult to say what is happening. i think there's been a lot of developments in the last 15 yea rs. lot of developments in the last 15 years. more people are aware of the problems with human trafficking and modern slavery but the problem is, while you still have poor and deprived people in the world, they will always try to get to a better economic opportunity. if they want to get to this country or anywhere else, there are always people who will help them. you have to make it as hard as you can, or you can try, but it is not something you will ever stop. and those 23 chinese cockle pickers who died in morecambe bay in 2004, it is 15 years ago but it is something that i am sure anyone who was aware of that case then will remember because it was as shocking as this one. what stays with you from that, having been involved in the investigation?m with you from that, having been involved in the investigation? it is the sadness of it but it is the

impact of seeing that many dead bodies. i do understand and feel for the officers and all the other agencies that arejust the officers and all the other agencies that are just seeing that level of loss of human life and there's a lot of hard work to be done to identify those people and then to try to bring to justice a whole array of people who are responsible for the death and trafficking of those individuals. and just a final thought, emily, we understand these victims are from china but it is not yet actually com pletely china but it is not yet actually completely confirmed, what proportion of trafficked individuals are coming from china? welcome in the uk last year there were nearly 7000 overall people identified to be possible victims of trafficking and of those, just over 400 where chinese nationals. it is the fourth highest prevalence nationality, so it is not the most but we do see it substantially. thank you forjoining us. substantially. thank you forjoining us. and those postmortem examinations will begin today. still to come.

ministers are facing renewed calls to slash waiting times for universal credit payments after mps heard from claimants who have turned to "survival sex" to make ends meet. we'll look at why some people might be so desperate that they turn to sex work to meet their basic needs. is the future a world where hyper—realistic avatars do everything humans can do? on the 11th october, 2015, josh hanson went for a drink at a bar in west london and was stabbed to death. his killer was a 31—year—old man called shane o'brien. he evaded police for three and a half years. detective chief inspector noel mchugh takes up the story. you see, josh is in the bar with his girlfriend and with friends. shane o'brien is with his group.

towards the end of the evening, shane o'brien stands up and he uses words to the effect of, "what's your problem?" at which point you could seejosh was really quite surprised and shocked. shane o'brien has reached into his pocket, he's taken out a stanley knife and he has cutjosh from his ear across to his chest. he then turns around and calmly walks out of the bar and we would see that he was drinking from beakers we recovered fingerprints. we know it is shane o'brien. he was wearing a canada goose jacket. on thatjacket, there were spots of blood, josh's blood. shane o'brien later boarded a private jet, left the country and evaded police for three—and—a—half years. he became one of britain's most wanted fugitives. earlier this year, police tracked him down in romania and brought him back to the uk to face justice. on wednesday, he was given a life

sentence at the old bailey. throughout this time, josh's family fought to raise awareness of the case, to keep pressure on the authorities looking for his killer and to keep pressure on o'brien to return. we've spoken tojosh‘s mum, tracey, and his sister, brooke, a few times on the programme, and we're going to be speaking to them again in a minute. but first, we're going to play you a clip of the first occasion they came on the show, months afterjosh‘s death, when tracey started by explaining what happened on the night her son died. in the early hours of sunday morning, on october 11th, josh was with his girlfriend for a very short period of time when he was stabbed in the neck. i received a phone call in the early hours of the morning to tell me that josh had been stabbed. brooke and i made our way to the re bar. and that was confirmed to us by the police officers there.

total shock, total dismay. overwhelmed, obviously. trying to process that information and then finding out three days later that there was a suspect that the police would like to speak to in connection withjosh‘s murder. and since that day, really, we have been sharing our grief alongside a murder investigation. and we are here today to ask for the public to come forward if they know anything. anyone, anywhere who may have any information as to the whereabouts of shane o'brien, or indeed himself, to make contact with the police. tracey and brooke are here with me now. welcome. that was just a few months after josh‘s welcome. that was just a few months afterjosh's murder and welcome. that was just a few months after josh‘s murder and when welcome. that was just a few months afterjosh's murder and when you started watching thatjust then, i heard you say to yourself, "that

feels like yesterday". it absolutely does come it is quite surreal watching myself back. trying to connect with how i felt back then, which was desperate, you know, pleading for help, any kind of help we could get which would get us justice. as you know, it has taken four years to get there and it's been nothing short of a living nightmare. do you feel that if you hadn't pursue things in the way that you did, i mentioned you have been on the programme several times because you wanted to keep the pressure up and the momentum going, do you feel that if you had not have done that, things might have been different? i've got no doubt in my mind whatsoever. that is notjust me saying, "i've done this, we've done that". it is feedback that i have had from, indeed, the lead on the case, dc noel mccue and his team, the national crime agency, lots of other people have given us very

positive feedback. i just other people have given us very positive feedback. ijust knew other people have given us very positive feedback. i just knew that we had to do something to help assist the police and to make sure that what happened to josh assist the police and to make sure that what happened tojosh did not go away. we will do whatever we can to help others, if they find themselves on this journey, all those that still don't have justice, to doing sadly that as well. shane o'brien said in court, it emerged in court that he had seen interviews that you gave, had he? he said in court, well, his defence barrister said in court that... no, it was him who said it, wasn't it? i beg your pardon, you are right, he said that having seen my appeal with brooke, our appeal, that made him want to get in touch. how did that make you feel, then, brooke? it is really ha rd feel, then, brooke? it is really hard when you are in the courtroom and you are going through the trial,

everyday is really challenging and it is actually a really scary thing, there, with the person who took your loved one's life, even saying their name is really difficult to cope with. it is quite, again, it is close to home, especially when he mentions my mum's name in the interview, and the appeals. it makes you feel quite angry as well that someone you feel quite angry as well that someone who has been on the run for three and half years is actually sitting there, watching us on tv. yeah, it is quite a surreal feeling, really. how did you feel about it, tracey? before he said that, he kept on referring to josh tracey? before he said that, he kept on referring tojosh by his name which i found really difficult to ta ke which i found really difficult to take on board. i much preferred him to refer to my son as mr hansen, he was not his friend, he did not know him, they had never met before, and then to lead with that and to mention me as well, it was almost trying to, i don't know, if it was for the benefit of the jury but may

be to personalise and humanise the situation, which, there's no way that could actually happen, and thank goodness for the jury, who obviously have to reach a verdict based on the evidence that is brought to them and what they see and you have shown the cctv this morning. it speaks for itself. so, yes, as brooke said, it is hard to sit in that environment where you have to maintain your emotions, you can't speak or show any... you know, no emotion whatsoever because you don't want to be accused of swaying thejury don't want to be accused of swaying the jury trying to intimidate the defendant. we chose to sit way back, actually, so we could never be accused of that. so many other families who have been through this process have indeed been accused of those kind of things which is horrific. he has been given a life sentence and he will serve a minimum of 26 years. it has onlyjust

happened so i'm sure it will take some time for that to settle in for you but how does that feel now for you, knowing he's behind bars? well, obviously, we have a sense of relief. we can grieve forjosh in peace which is something that has been denied us for four years. there's going to be a lot of adjustments to take place. but it means that also, this person can't cause any more harm to law—abiding citizens innocent people. josh was just 21, out with his friends, just enjoying a night out, well, actually, he was only in their 15 minutes. it is kind of bittersweet as well because there is no length of time that will actually be enough. well, there would, actually, a whole life term and for that to be spent, you know, going through processes of rehabilitation, doing whatever the government deems fit

foran whatever the government deems fit for an individual to do to get back to society in a positive way. so for us, really, and i think you'll ee, us, really, and i think you'll agree, don't you? yeah. josh would be 25 now, and shane o'brien has been sentenced to 26 years, one year short, josh would be 26 in february, would have been 26, so really, does my son's life equates to one year in prison per year? it is bittersweet but, you know... a sense of relief nonetheless. and brooke, how do you feel about your brother's killer now? it is hard to kind of get his face out of my head every day anyway. again, like we have always said, for the rest of our lives and for the rest of my children's lives and grandchildren, josh is always going to be associated with shane o'brien, which is really difficult.

but you know, we have got the message out there, we put the cctv out there, we agreed for it to be out there, we agreed for it to be out there, we agreed for it to be out there, for all innocent people and parents and siblings to watch the cctv. it is horrendous. but i am glad everybody knows without question now thatjosh glad everybody knows without question now that josh was a young, innocent man, and it can happen. it took five seconds. he did not even know what was coming his way. so for somebody like shane o'brien to be off the streets, it is another innocent person that can go home in the evening to their family. and you have been campaigning ever since for better awareness of the impact of knives on young lives. what for you, tracey, would be the legacy that might come out of this, if that is how you can look at it? dare i say it but we have had some very, some very moving it but we have had some very, some very moving success it but we have had some very, some very moving success stories are ready. you know, we have lots of young people who have reached out to

us young people who have reached out to us to say that because ofjosh, because we shared josh's story in schools, and over a three—week bird a couple of months ago, 4500 young got to knowjosh and we had feedback, lots of feedback from teachers and pupils, just to say that we had made a massive impact on their lives and so had josh. they are crying forjosh, not for us, we are crying forjosh, not for us, we are there to tell his story, this is josh's story and if we can raise awareness of the devastation that knife crime is having on innocent people, and this is not a gang thing, you know, ithink the government, the media and the press, this needs to stop, you know, we need to look at it objectively. it can't just fit into need to look at it objectively. it can'tjust fit into a box, it is not one size fits all. this can happen to anybody. that is what we need to do, we need to change some of the policies that are in place at the moment in parliament as well, we need a victims‘ law, we don‘t have one so

need a victims‘ law, we don‘t have one so victims get very little support. and, you know, there needs to bea support. and, you know, there needs to be a lot more intervention and prevention happening out there. thank you forjoining us. thank you for having us stop what you have beenin for having us stop what you have been in several times and i‘m glad it is resolved now. thank you very much. he said again and again, "do or die", he‘d "rather die in a ditch than delay brexit. " well, now the prime minister‘s pledge to leave the eu by october 31st has been...ditched. instead of getting brexit done by halloween, borisjohnson is now pleading with mps "to end this nightmare" by agreeing to an election on december 12th. in return, he would give them more time to debate his brexit deal. an election would need to be approved by two—thirds of mps so labour would have to vote for it, and it‘s unclear whether they would do that. here‘s whatjeremy corbyn said last night. take no deal off the table and we will absolutely support the election. i‘ve been calling for an election ever since the last one because this country needs one in order to deal with all the social injustices issues but no deal must be taken off the table.

we were expecting to hear today if the european union will give us that three—month extension that borisjohnson has asked for, but now we may not get an answer until next week. so at the moment, it‘s not yet clear what we‘re going to get: an election, a brexit deadline extension, another countdown to no—deal brexit on a new date, or the return of the brexit bill. or when we might get any, orall, of them. so what might the eu do next? the man with the answers is adam fleming in brussels. what is the answer? i'm glad you said mite rather than well. what is happening right now is that the emphasis on the 27 uni macro countries are having a meeting to discuss the legal text of the decision about an extension. in the text in front of them, the extension date is just three dots and they have to fill it in, and they were hoping to do that today, after donald tusk, the president of the european council, consulted eu leaders over the last few days, but

the hopes of there being a decision today are starting to dwindle, and have a listen to what michel barnier, the chief negotiator, said when he left for the meeting this morning. he does not sound like somebody going to make a decision. seeing us? yes! oh, thank you. no, i have no comment. just the 27 eu ambassadors will discuss a second time on the extension request of the uk. will there be a decision today or is it on monday? so he would not answer questions about whether the decision would be today on monday and after that, i asked him if he wanted an election in the uk and hejust said, "no comment". the reason this is proving to bea comment". the reason this is proving to be a tricky decision for the eu is there is a division. most countries including germany they should sign up to the deadline of the 31st of january next year because that was the deadline that was in the letter written by the prime minister, that he was compelled to write by parliament. they also think that means there is enough space there to get the deal through or to have an election. but

then on the other side you get emanuel macron of france saying, "no, the way to get the deal through parliament is to give the uk a really tight deadline, to focus their minds and that should be the 15th of november". then on top of that, you have got the added complexity generated yesterday by the fact we just don‘t know if there‘s going to be an election or what way parliament will vote when it comes to approving the election on monday. that is why there is plenty on the eu side saying maybe we should just wait a couple more days until the picture is clearer. of course, that means we will all come to work on monday morning and if there is no decision, we will be looking at the calendar, thinking, in theory, a no—deal brexit is on thursday, four days away, so it could get quite tense, the longer it ta kes for could get quite tense, the longer it takes for the eu to make a decision. thank you forjoining us. well, here, the chancellor of the exchequer, sajid javid, acknowledged defeat over the prime minister‘s do—or—die pledge for brexit to happen on 31st october. mrjavid is putting the blame firmly on labour. what we‘ve proposed is,

let‘s take an extra couple of weeks. jeremy corbyn said he wanted more time. take a couple of weeks. let‘s get this bill through parliament, get brexit done, but then let‘s also have a general election, because this is a zombie parliament. it is dysfunctional. we must bring it to an end so the british people can get a government that they deserve. labour‘s front bench spokeswoman shadow home secretary diane abbott is at westminster. will labour supporter general election on the 10th of december? well, let‘s be clear that boris johnson is setting this election ha re johnson is setting this election hare running to distract from the fa ct hare running to distract from the fact that his do or die pledged to count by the 31st was worthless. sorry to interrupt. whatever your theory on why borisjohnson is doing it, what is your answer to the question on whether you will support it? the answer is, of course the labour party is up for an election. we have the money, we have the plans, we have over half a million members who want to have an

election. borisjohnson should not be allowed in powerfor a minute longer than is necessary. so on monday, if boris johnson longer than is necessary. so on monday, if borisjohnson puts a motion before the commons for an election, labour will vote for it? there are two things we need to know. we need to know what sort of extension the eu is going to allow, and we need to be clear that no deal is off the table. if no deal is really off the table, and given the sort of extension in the eu could allow, of course the labour party is up allow, of course the labour party is upforan allow, of course the labour party is up for an election. so if there is an extension to the 31st of january, then labour‘s position on monday will be that you will vote for an election on the 12th of december?” am not commenting on ifs. adam fleming in brussels were saying that the view over there is, let‘s see

what happens here. it is a stand—off and the brexit date is the 31st of october, next thursday. so we are getting perilously close. why not say exactly what you would do in the event of it being the 31st and then there can be some clarity?” event of it being the 31st and then there can be some clarity? i know what you would like me to say, but i have to repeat, until we have clarity on the eu‘s extension and until no deal is off the table, we have said over and over again, coming out the eu without a deal would be catastrophic for the british economy and the british people. so until we know those two things, we will not be able to say what we are doing about boris johnson and an election proposal. but if there is an extension until the 31st of january, which is what was put forward under the benn act, there can be no no—deal brexit before 31st of january and boris

johnson has said that if he supported an election, there would be debating time in the commons on his agreement until the 6th of november including discussing it through weekends if need be. it therefore sounds, with those elements in play, you have got everything you want. and no, there are too many ifs. what are they? well, what other are you going to say? you also can‘t believe a weatherjohnson sets. there is a reason why we haven‘t had a christmas election for over a century. —— you can‘t believe a word by sta nces century. —— you can‘t believe a word by stances has. there are worries about getting the votes. is this the reason you are worried about an election, you‘re worried about going to the polls? the labour party want an election. we don‘t want the british people to suffer from a borisjohnson government british people to suffer from a boris johnson government for a minute longer than is necessary. but we need to know explicitly that no deal is off the table and we need to know what sort of extension the eu is going to come up with. it sounds

like labour‘s position is that there will be no election until a brexit deal is agreed or article 50 is extended. is that they only copper bottomed guarantee that would entice you? we are open to a copper bottomed guarantee, but you can‘t believe anything that borisjohnson says. after all, he spent months saying he would come out, do or die, and that has proved to be completely false. we also need to know what sort of extension the eu would allow. talking of not being able to believe what people say, the labour mp kate hoey, a brexiteer, has said it would be very difficult for your party to win an election because you haven‘t done what you said in your ma nifesto. haven‘t done what you said in your manifesto. i have known kate hoey for yea rs manifesto. i have known kate hoey for years and i respect her. the truth is that she is no longer a labour party mp and she is not really in a position to speculate on what might happen in an election. the point is, you have said things

in your manifesto. you said you would deliver brexit. the tories have said things and these things have said things and these things have not been delivered. it comes down to trust, doesn‘t it? have not been delivered. it comes down to trust, doesn't it? at this point, there is very little trust in borisjohnson. he point, there is very little trust in boris johnson. he promised point, there is very little trust in borisjohnson. he promised people, he said do or die, we will be out by a particular day and it has not happened. what can he say now to convince you to say yes on monday to an election? i have told you. we need to know what sort of extension the eu is going to allow and we need to have a more explicit, not implicit, and explicit assurance that no deal won‘t happen. implicit, and explicit assurance that no deal won't happen. the polls put the tories upwards of 13 points ahead of labour. is that what is going on, you‘re worried about going to the country? we went into the election in 2017 with the polls having the toys 20 points ahead, and we narrowed that down. we almost eliminated the gap. so what the

polls are saying now will not be what the polls are saying at the end ofan what the polls are saying at the end of an election campaign. diane abbott, thank you. let‘s talk now to the conservative mp and leading brexit support andrew bridgen. the snp‘s deputy leader at westminster is kirsty blackman. and tom brake is the liberal democrats‘ brexit spokesman. andrew bridgen, no brexit on the 3ist andrew bridgen, no brexit on the 31st of october. let‘s listen to sajid javid. we can‘t hear from 31st of october. let‘s listen to sajid javid. we can‘t hearfrom him. but sajid javid did say this morning effectively from the government for the first time that there will be no brexit on the 31st of october. what is your reaction? well, it's not surprising. we have seen boris johnson bring back a deal in the face of all the critics who said he never could reopen the withdrawal agreement and that he couldn‘t get rid of the backstop. he has changed the political declaration. labour

say they don‘t want to leave without a deal. boris johnson say they don‘t want to leave without a deal. borisjohnson has come with a deal. borisjohnson has come with a tolerable deal and labour voted it down. that was a car crash interview from diane abbott, but what your viewers will have seen is that for those who don‘t want brexit, there will never be enough time to debate it. and for those who are running scared of the electorate and don‘t wa nt scared of the electorate and don‘t want a general election, there will a lwa ys want a general election, there will always be an excuse to avoid it. it is clear that those two views are not mutually exclusive. they are held by the same people. you can‘t run from the electorate forever. this is a zombie parliament. we have no majority and if not for the fixed empowerment act, we would already be ina empowerment act, we would already be in a general election. these are unprecedented times in the government is trying to get the most controversial bill, leaving the european union, through with a minority government. it is impossible. this parliament will never let asleep. we need a reset and a general election and so many people have left parties and joined other parties... let me hear from tom brake from the lib dems. is it

time for a general election? no, because we haven't got the clarity we need in terms of the length of the extension. if the extension is just one month, that would not be sufficient for a general election and it would not be sufficient for scrutiny of the bill. but the letter went on saying the 31st of january. so if we assume that is what is going to come, would you support that? let's see what we actually get. but why not say, we would support an election if we got that length of extension? the prime minister is offering us this date of the 6th of november for one reason only, because he knows that is the la st only, because he knows that is the last date on which he can hold an election before christmas. it is not because he thinks that is the right time to scrutinise the bill. it is an arbitrary point that he has chosen. but it gives mps that duration to scrutinise the bill which mps voted through the agreement that said, we don‘t like

the fact that there is not enough time to debate it. you would have it. the only reason he has chosen the 6th of november... the reason doesn‘t matter. the 6th of november... the reason doesn't matter. but it is not sufficient time to scrutinise the bill. it has got to go through the commons and the lords, where they we re commons and the lords, where they were also want to put this deal undera were also want to put this deal under a huge amount of scrutiny. ki rsty under a huge amount of scrutiny. kirsty blackman, do you want an election? absolutely. on the 12th of december? our priority is ensuring that the extension happens. we would would have clarity today whether we would have clarity today whether we would get an extension but that may have to wait until monday. we need the threat of no deal to be removed. if you look at the way that we are pulling just now, the snp are polling pretty well. so we are keen for there to be an election. but we cannot have a situation where boris johnson, the prime ministerthat

cannot have a situation where boris johnson, the prime minister that we don't trust, is allowed to create this general election so that he can try and ram this bill through in advance of the 6th of november. i believe that this bill he has put through in front of parliament is a bad bill and will be bad for people who live in scotland and the uk as a whole. andrew bridgen, you used the term zombie parliament. number ten‘s position is, if the election date is not agreed, all business .. we have just had a queen‘s speech that effectively, they are government wa nts effectively, they are government wants another election and if they don‘t get that, forget what was put through in the queen ‘s speech, they are not going to put anything before parliament. do you think that is a good thing? we have got to force a general election now so that we can deliver. but that is not going to force a general election. we will be voting under the fixed—term parliaments act for a general election every day, until labour and

the other parties see sense and deliver what the people want, which isa deliver what the people want, which is a fresh start. is that constructive politics? it is where we have been forced by the intransigence of the opposition, who claim that they respect the result of the referendum, but clearly don‘t. of the referendum, but clearly don't. tom brake, if that happens, what is your reaction? if the government are going to turn parliament into a zombie parliament, thatis parliament into a zombie parliament, that is their choice. it is the prime minister who is running away from bringing forward his bill, because he pulled it. parliament offered him the opportunity to bring it back. it is he who is not wanting to bring it forward. and we have had the queen's speech which theoretically sets out the government's programme of activity, which jacob rees—mogg was singing the praises ofjust a couple of days ago. and yet they don't want to bring any of that forward. a quick final thought from kirsty blackman. is this a masterclass for voters in

how to lose the trust of voters? the opposition parties have been saying for a long time, we want a referendum, we want an election, and all that people are hearing right now is, actually, not yet. we are still polling very well. people recognise that the snp have kept our heads through all of this and has made the sensible decisions at every opportunity. but boris johnson made the sensible decisions at every opportunity. but borisjohnson and brexiteers were all about taking control back, but actually, they refusing to give parliament control because the only present they want to have control is borisjohnson. because the only present they want to have control is borisjohnson! quick couple of comments from some of you watching. amazing how the media attacks labour without asking why our untrustworthy prime minister is calling for an election. keith says labour are so far behind in the polls, they will not go for an election despite their claims of boris not being honest. it is now labour telling lies, they know the public will not forgive them. scared? you

public will not forgive them. scared ? you bet. public will not forgive them. scared? you bet. keep those comments coming. some people on universal credit are turning, or returning to sex work, because of the long wait for their first benefit payment. they are being left without the money to fund their most basic needs. that‘s the finding of a committee of mps who released a report this morning urging the government to remove its policy of waiting weeks to make the intial payment. they‘ve described it as a "fundamental design flaw" with the scheme. universal credit merges six benefits into one payment and was designed to simplify the system and help people move into work. the report goes on to warn more people will be driven into so—called "survival sex" if benefit payments fail to match what claimants actually need to live off. this was the experience of one woman. it started when i broke up with my boyfriend. i moved into a shared house and after a few months, one of my housemates sexually assaulted me. that night, i left with nothing more than a backpack. i had nowhere safe to live. i suffer several weeks and

used my overdraft to pay for a youth hostel. my universal credit payments didn‘t even cover half of the cost of the hostel. i started selling all my possessions. textbooks, my laptop, my my grandmother‘s jewellery, but it still wasn‘t enough. so eventually, i visited an online forum and responded to an advert posted by men who were using coded terms such as "older man seeking relationship with young woman for mutual gain". i met up with one man regularly. he paid me to go with him to sex parties. when i was there, i was expected to have sex with him and other men. he only paid me £60 a night. myjob was to do whatever the men wanted. sometimes that was sex, sometimes it was to let them hit me or let them spit in my face while they did other sexual things to me. as well as sex

parties, i occasionally visited individual men‘s houses. they paid mea individual men‘s houses. they paid me a bit more, but the experience was much more terrifying. ifelt incredibly vulnerable. i was at their houses. i knew they could do whatever they like to me, and no one would ever know. finally, eight months after all this began, universal credit agreed to pay my full rent and even backdated it. it was enough to live on and pay my rent, so i immediately stopped selling my body for sex. my experience of universal credit was terrible. the system was full of errors, delays, poor communication and benefit caps, which made it impossible for me to have enough money to live safely, let alone in any way comfortably. while my experience was traumatic, i feel thankful it wasn‘t worse. many women have become stuck in a cycle of

needing to continue to sell sex to keep a roof over their heads because the cost of living has become so high and benefit so frequently fail to cover it. let‘s talk now to laura watson from the english collective of prostitutes and liberal democrat mp heidi allen, whojoins us from cambridgeshire — she quit the conservative party criticising the government‘s roll—out of universal credit. heidi allen, how concerned are you by what you have uncovered here? heidi allen, how concerned are you by what you have uncovered here7m is awful, isn‘t it? i remember after our session where we heard from women, feeling physically sick. i can‘t imagine being so desperate. there were tales of going into a brothel for three days. you would earn £350 for three days work. but most of all, you get a roof over your head. it is just desperate and u nfortu nately, your head. it is just desperate and unfortunately, it is not commonplace but it happens far too often for very vulnerable claimants who have

not a penny in the bank and often hungry mouths of children to feed. and if the weight is too long for universal credit, you have no financial resilience and you need money now. there are very few options open to you. the government tries to say that advance payments are the answer, but an advance payment is a loan which has to be paid back out of the benefit that is not enough to live on anyway. benefit payments have not kept up with inflation. so what do you do? you literally run out of options. and this is directly linked to universal credit? there are many flaws in universal credit, but one of them was in some ways what should be the beauty of the system, that all the benefits are rolled into one, housing and child allowance or comes as a single payment. but if you can‘t wait for that payment, if you can‘t wait for that payment, if you can‘t wait for that payment, if you can‘t wait for five weeks, unlike with the old system where you might get your housing benefit and your child benefit separately, there was always cash dripping in. but

with universal credit, that is what is different about it. it is nothing at all until five weeks‘ minimum when your first payment comes in. and the government has all the time that you get advance payments if you are desperate, but people don‘t take those because they put you further into debt because they have no way to pay them back. this is the problem with universal credit. laura, is it possible to estimate how many people are doing this, and it is not just how many people are doing this, and it is notjust women, is it? it is mostly women and mostly mothers who are going into prostitution because of universal credit, but also because of the benefit cuts and sanctions generally. it is hard to estimate because obviously, prostitution is illegal, so women are underground and don't want to come forward and say that they are doing sex work. but we do know that because of sanctions, there have been massive increases all over the country. in doncaster, there has

been an increase in 60% and in sheffield an increase of 144%. been an increase in 60% and in sheffield an increase of 14496. heidi allen, the initial response from the government to your report was, your committee said, defensive, dismissive and trite. the government described the reports linking universal credit and survival sex as anecdotal and said the benefit system could not be robustly attributed as a sole cause of the issue. but since then, the work and pensions minister will quint has apologised and said there is a need for better understanding of the issue. has there been a shift in position? not at all. hats off to will. he‘d heard the evidence and sat quietly in the room and heard us read it. and that transformed his appreciation of the situation. i have no doubt that he is dedicated to making universal credit work for

the most vulnerable, such as women like this. until his boss and the treasury shift their position on universal credit and make that first payment on day one or even week one and nonrepayable so it is not a debt, until they do that for the most vulnerable claimants, we will continue to hear heartbreaking and sickening stories like this. the system sickening stories like this. the syste m d oes sickening stories like this. the system does not work if you have no financial resilience. if you have no friends orfamily financial resilience. if you have no friends or family to fall back on, we had an example in my constituency a couple of weeks ago where the universal credit payment had been messed up and they mum was going hungry with children. so my team are taking money around to her house or putting shopping on doorsteps. we shouldn‘t be doing this. the system works fine for you or i. if we lose ourjob, we have money in the bank. but if you have nothing, the system does not work for you. so will quince needs to go up to the treasury and say, you have to get rid of this five week wait because we are plunging vulnerable people

further into poverty. a spokesperson for the department for work and pensions had said: it was "committed to providing a safety net for the most vulnerable in society" and had made improvements to universal credit, including extending advance payments, removing waiting days and allowing claimants to continue to be paid housing benefit for two weeks after moving on to universal credit. they said they were carefully considering the report‘s recommendations. laura watson and heidi allen, thank you. we already share so much of ourselves and our lives online, but what happens when our digital doubles can exist there too — doing things on our behalf, but controlled by someone else? new technology is allowing people to create realistic human avatars. but what will it mean for society, and especially for women? amelia hemphill was in los angeles to meet her digital twin. there are flashing images in this report. hello, i‘m siren and i‘m a digital human. a world where hyper realistic avatars do everything

that humans can do? when most of us think of avatars, we imagine a tall, blue movie character. but today they‘re being used in a very different way. avatars can be the digital copy of a human and they can be difficult to spot. from hollywood to the newsroom... avatars are going mainstream and our digital doubles could soon be working for us or maybe even replacing us. i‘m in la to find out how this futuristic technology is going to impact our lives. but to do so, i‘m going to need my own avatar. hello! this is luc from dnablock, an avatar creation startup. they‘ve made digital copies

of hundreds of celebrities and now it‘s my turn. how do we do that? the magic is behind here. so basically, all these cameras, they‘re going to take a picture of you at exactly the same time. and then we‘re going to use a process called photogrammetry to reconstruct you. and once we have that, we can do a lot of different things with it. these cameras are going to capture every angle of my body and face, down to the smallest pore. the photos will then be processed to make an exact replica of me. so what actually is an avatar? i think generally it‘s something that‘s like interactive or that, and that‘s three dimensional. so this is how i‘m going to live in the digital world. this is digital avatar, amelia happening now? it is, yeah. 0k. no pressure. don‘t mess it up. yeah! this new technology means amelia 2.0 can be puppeted in real time across different platforms

and by anyone without my input. while luc starts building my avatar, i‘m going to meet christine marzano, the co—founder of dnablock, to see what i can do with my avatar and if she can earn me any money. christine is a former model. so here she comes. i think i‘ve still got it. so i think i can probably win. she‘s given up modelling so she can build her tech company. but her avatar, christine 2.0, is still being hired to work the catwalk, modelling digital clothes forfashion brands. it‘s my body motion capture. so that is my walk. that is my stop. and it is my turnaround. so she really is sort of embodying me on the runway there. christine says the biggest growth markets for these hyper realistic avatars are fashion, advertising and personal assistants. but it‘s still early

days for the technology. with such seemingly limitless opportunities, it‘s no surprise that everyone is trying to cash in on this technology, including bitcoin billionaire crystal rose pierce, low, low tech, get down... crystal is so optimistic about the future of avatars that she‘s about to have an avatar wedding, where her guests attend live by virtual reality headsets. i reallyjust want to explore all the worlds that are being created. i love the idea of my avatar being able to do fantasy things as well as real world normal things. being a ceo and a mother and an adviser and an investor, i have a lot of roles and i think that if i could send my avatar off to have fun and party on my behalf, that would be a great thing. even her 6—month—old daughter, aurora, has an avatar. is she the first ever baby avatar? i think so. i think she‘s the first one that‘s gotten fully scanned. but we‘ll see if she can be a baby influencer.

but the use of her daughter‘s image without her express consent has made me think about who owns the rights to my digital self and who‘s regulating what these avatars can get up to online. one of the industries investing heavily in avatar technology is pornography. and i don‘t think i want to see amelia 2.0 finding her way into that virtual world. i‘m hoping jennifer powell, a talent agent who‘s just started to represent avatar influences, can give me some reassurance. social media used to be the wild west. this is now going... we‘re moving into the new wild west. i think that it‘s going to be up to us, the people that are at the forefront of doing this, to create some standards. do you feel like there are any ethical concerns around this? i think that we are going to have to be transparent about what is and what isn‘t an avatar. jennifer powell ending that

report by amelia hemphill. my avatar and me is part of the bbc‘s 100 women series, about some of the most inspirational women of 2019. for more from the award—winning 100 women season, head to bbc.com/100women , or follow @bbc100women on instagram, facebook and twitter. bbc newsroom live is coming up next. thank you for your company today. have a good day and a lovely weekend. bye—bye. it's it‘s going to be a rather unpleasant to 48 hours for many of us. we have some heavy rain moving in at the moment from the south—west, all linked into this weather system towards the atlantic. look at that sheet of cloud across the uk. and

with that, we have already got heavy rain moving on. that cloud is also the dividing line between cold air to the north and mild air towards the south. a real contrast in temperatures and how it will feel this afternoon. that rain is already moving in and it will turn heavy across wales into northern areas of england this afternoon. further north in scotland, some showers here, but the rain is a particular concern in south wales. there is an amber warning from the met office in south wales. on saturday, that rain will move towards the south and east but south—west england and wales, there will be a lot of rainfall over there will be a lot of rainfall over the next 24 hours. that could lead to problems with flooding and travel disruption.

this is bbc news, i‘m ben brown in westminster — the headlines at 11. borisjohnson says mps can have more time to debate his brexit deal if they agree to an early general election just before christmas — the chancellor admits next week‘s brexit deadline will almost certainly be missed. parliament has asked for an extension and the eu, although it hasn‘t formally responded, i think everyone expects an extension from them. when that happens, we won‘t be able to leave on the 31st and that is exactly why we have turned around tojeremy corbyn and said, "let‘s get brexit done". eu ambassadors are meeting in brussels this morning to decide whether to grant another extension to the uk‘s departure.