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tv   Ask the Leaders  BBC News  November 22, 2019 12:30am-1:01am GMT

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look at ford and tata. i teetering. look at ford and tata. i wa nt to teetering. look at ford and tata. i want to see the wealth of —— walsh economy rising. we are at the bottom of the economic league table at the moment but we don't have to accept that, we can accept in the skills of oui’ that, we can accept in the skills of our leader and invest in infrastructure. we can be at the forefront of the green industrial revolution just like we were a few hundred weak years ago but all of that will be so much more difficult if at the start of the decade we have a brexit deal whether it's labour or conservative which will cause untold damage to our economy and the party of wales is to defend wales and we must be honest. launching this general election campaign, you said you wanted to heal a broken country. how can you bring a country together by ignoring the majority of the voters in the referendum? i don't think anyone
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should ignore that leave vote, and it's only the people that can actually change that mandate, and that's why i feel... what are you doing to reach out to leave voters? and i think that that leave vote, eve ryo ne and i think that that leave vote, everyone will have a different reason personally for the leave vote, but i think much of it was a sense of exasperation. wales has seen sense of exasperation. wales has seen intergenerational poverty, decade after decade, we have been neglected, there is deep poverty within our society and i think people who voted for brexit, many of them because they want to change. u nfortu nately, them because they want to change. unfortunately, this change, the brexit that is on offer will not deliver the kind of improvement that we need. these voters were wrong? and all your target seats more or less, they are in leave areas. you are trying to rule voters by telling them they were wrong, how does that work? and i think that people
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respect politicians that are clear and honest. i don't think that you can go into the selection asjeremy corbyn is doing by refusing to say where he stands on the single most important issue at the heart of the election. i think that we can respect each other while we sincerely disagree, but i have to be honest. i have to say it as a belief is. i didn't go into politics to tell people what i thought they wa nted tell people what i thought they wanted to have. i went into politics to say clearly and honestly what i'd believe, and it is then for the people to decide if they agree. 0k, the gentleman in the back? you say you are representing wales interests but you are conspiring with other parties do not stand in certain seats. can you call yourself a party of wales when you are just trying to stop us from leaving the eu, you are more like the party of brussels.
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isn't the rest of the world a big enough platform to sell our goods and our skills? and in the front here? you are making the economic argument, the failed arguments of 2016. with some troubles over the economy, but what about the political fallout that is going to happen if you don't respect referendums? you have believed the evolution of referendums have been sacrosanct. why has this been so easily cast away? i'm sure we will come onto packets later, but this point here the gentleman in the back? i think there was a fatal flaw at the heart of the 2016 referendum, because, partly because it was put forward by a conservative prime minister that didn't believe in the proposition, the proposition to leave at the heart of the referendum, and so there was no plan behind at. the work hadn't been done, andi behind at. the work hadn't been done, and i think much of the chaos and the going round in circles over the last three and a half years stems from that fatal flaw. there
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was no precise version of brexit, and there were very many different versions, and in the selection, we even have nigel farage as an ultra brexiteer, might have done a u—turn since, thank since the beginning of the campaign that the brexit deal on offer was almost worse than remaining in the european union the only way to resolve this is to put the deal that is on the table back to the people because then it is clear what the people are choosing. the precise terms of the brexit deal on offer versus the alternative which is remaining in the european union. the only way to test whether public is on that question now is of course taking it back to the people in the final referendum. somebody mentioned a
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packed hair, let's take a second question... i'll address this question... i'll address this question... very briefly, then we need to move on. i understand, and a respect people who sincerely want wales to have a different relationship with the eu, and when we are an independent country in the future, the people of wales can decide that. what i would urge people is, do we really want to take power from brussels and people is, do we really want to take powerfrom brussels and put people is, do we really want to take power from brussels and put it in the hands of westminster politicians? what have they ever done... was at brussels that closed the mines that my father used to work in? it was a westminster government, that don't actually care anything about wales. applause we seriously want to give all of that power and put it in the hands of westminster government that don't ca re less westminster government that don't care less about wales. thank you
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very much, we need to move onto a second question. hello, good evening. a packed with other remain parties means that you will be standing down and a number of the. where does that leave voters who don't want to vote for a unionist party? i understand, it was a very difficult decision for us to make andi difficult decision for us to make and i understand the sacrifice that was being asked of our members or candidates and indeed our supporters and those seats. we came to the conclusion that exceptional times call for exceptional actions. it is not something we would have done lightly. it is important to point out that in seven of those seats, the unionist party is standing down in favour of applied and that gives us an
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in favour of applied and that gives us an opportunity to have the highest number of plaid mps, so let's grasp that opportunity, which is an incredibly important one at such a historicjohnson. ultimately, plaid cymru, what does it mean? we a lwa ys plaid cymru, what does it mean? we always put wales before our party. wales's interests, the national interest, which at this time we believe strongly that it is so important that we grasp every opportunity for wales to stay in the european union, and if working together with the other pro remain parties maximises that opportunity for wales, then that the right thing to do, because... what about the one pa ct to do, because... what about the one pact that you know that could prevent brexit, which is doing a deal in the event of a hung parliament and supporting jeremy corbyn's bid to get into downing street. would you do that?“ corbyn's bid to get into downing
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street. would you do that? if you do wa nt wales street. would you do that? if you do want wales to remain in the eu, there is only one way that that is going to happen, and that is if we elect the strongest, and wales' case, the highest number of plaid cymru mps across the uk, we need to have a big third block of mps from the pro— remain parties. that's what's going to make the difference. would you prefer to seejeremy corbyn in downing street than boris johnson? you know with the best luck in the world you are not going to get this to be so who can stop brexit? i think it's the people, if they choose to support the pro— remain parties. but boris johnson is leaving at the end of january... jeremy corbyn would buy time, maybe another referendum, but he is the one that can stop your hated brexit, as you put it. i'd disagree, i'm afraid i don't have any confidence
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injeremy corbyn on this issue. afraid i don't have any confidence in jeremy corbyn on this issue. so you wouldn't do a deal? because he himself has repeatedly refused to say whether he is even in principle in favour of remaining in the european union quite so you are willing to hold your nose, if you like. her price would be a second referendum. would you put a price on, let's say he is four short, what would be your price. i don't think that the labour party or a labour government is going to solve all of wales' problems. labour as part of the problem... so it's better to have boris johnson? it's a false choice. we have had conservative government, we have had labour government, we have had labour government, they have all letters done stopping the people of wales have put their faith done stopping the people of wales have put theirfaith in done stopping the people of wales have put their faith in the done stopping the people of wales have put theirfaith in the labour party, that is not how wales is going to deliver change. they talk
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about a green new deal and a clean airact, about a green new deal and a clean air act, the welsh labour government was taken to court because of its failures over pollution, 2000 people die and wales, 200 and the city, because of the fails of a labor government. they talk about banning zero hours contract. the labour government voted against plaid cymru's bid to stop zero hours contract. what we are prepared to do its work on a case—by—case basis. ui will work with anyone to advance case of wales and whether it is on the question of a referendum or any other issue, sending the strongest group of independent mps from wales, being our champions nationally and locally, that's how we deliver change for wales, not putting our faith... the question was about pacts... 0na faith... the question was about pacts... on a case—by—case basis, you would look at the potential of working with mr corbyn in the event ofa
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working with mr corbyn in the event of a hung parliament? absolutely, anyone who knocks on our door, we would want to see how we can advance case of wales, not by backing them, but by standing up for wales. on a case—by—case, deal by deal? absolutely. that is how we get leverage, by sending the strongest group of plaid cymru's mps, we can get wales on a landscape that hasn't happened for generations. i'm happily retired and i've got nothing better to do than to watch the political programmes and to read the newspapers. what's become clear to me is the message you are giving tonight, one which they wholeheartedly support because they think it's reasonable, and it's well thought out, is completely absent from the daily news programmes. it's either corbyn or boris johnson.
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occasionally you get a comment from northern ireland. virtually nothing from wales. and the same with the newspapers. sunday times, nothing, nothing about wales at all. whether it's a brexit wales or a labour wales or a tory wales or a lib dem wales, we don't hear their views at all. and i wondered how you propose to actually get your view that you've expressed tonight over to this great number of brexit individuals who voted for brexit and wales. how are you going to get it over if really... we're live on bbc one the moment, so... wales isn't even a blip on the political radar u nfortu nately for even a blip on the political radar unfortunately for the westminster parties and indeed for the media
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stopping is another debate on and other tonight, and nobody will be watching that either, they will be watching that either, they will be watching the football. will wales even be mentioned in that debate? i don't know. the only way that we can actually become a priority as if we find our own voice. look at the difference since scotland started voting numbers for the snp, then it became a key issue... ok, let's take a few questions from the audience. a gentleman here. i will loudly and proudly say i've voted leave, i will say this with passion right now. people that voted remain imply that we are fascist and right—wing and uneducated, and you argue that we didn't know what we voted for, and i know exactly what i've voted for. what they want to ask you, and jo
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swinson if she is watching. if you are going to defy the will of 17 million people that conclusively, democratically voted to leave the corrupt, self—serving eu, doesn't that make you a fascist? let's take another point. adam, you have talked about labour being part of the problem and wales, and we have had some of the stuff about the media, so some of the stuff about the media, so it seems to be a theme of the devolution settlement at the moment that it's basically finger—pointing down the m4 between cardiff bay and westminster, how do we increase accountability so that people understand where these decisions are being made? well, i think this is critical. we either accept that it is inevitable that we stay where we are, bumping along at the bottom of the economic
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league table or wales is for us to ta ke league table or wales is for us to take responsibility the solution is ultimately are not going to come never have the solutions will only come from wales. there is no problem, i have leave supporters in my own family and friends and we can agree to disagree and we are a divided country on that question i think but i think we and a better wherever we disagree on that question, we should not accept the inevitability of our poverty as a country, that has been our legacy of putting faith in those westminster political parties. there is nothing inevitable about it. you can change
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wales but starting to believe in ourselves, having self—confidence and getting those economic powers. infrastructure, transport infrastructure. have you tried to get it even into work on trains, it's an odyssey. we can change it but we can't if we don't have the power to invest and borrow. the westminster government only allows us westminster government only allows us to borrow £1 billion at a time. we could massively be investing in our infrastructure to give us the form to be a successful country that i know we can be. thank you very much. our next question from vicki newsome. the uk has never been more divided or fragile. is nationalism the answer? before you answer, adam, how do you view nationalism?”
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the answer? before you answer, adam, how do you view nationalism? i want a better future for wales. that in terms of investment, prosperity, wales having a greater say over its future but wales like the rest of the uk is very divided and i look at nationalism and other countries like the us, france, even over in england and nationalism doesn't bring divided communities together, it stokes hatred and increases division so stokes hatred and increases division so yes, i want to better future for wales but i also want to wales that is tolerant, inclusive and welcoming survivors going to lend my support for any party, it would have to be a plan but we have both of those things. it's a great question. it goes to the core of the moment we are going through and in some ways, it's been a dark time in politics. i see the kind of vision that we are trying to propose because i think politics is about tactical dreams.
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people need a bit of inspiration at the moment. it feels like a second winter of discontent, the selection stop but even in the midst of these dark nights, of the selection, we can inspire people with a different vision of a wales that is prosperous, outward looking, inclusive, that celebrates all the talent of everyone that lives here. i think there is a very, very different asian of the future in the conservative party, the brexit party, which is the opposite of that. backward —looking, insular, looking back to a golden age that never existed. i think we can create an exciting idea which is of an independent wales but excitement about what we could achieve with that independence. we could become a socially just nathan given that independence. we could become a sociallyjust nathan given to where we have always been, behind the
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curve, we have always been, behind the curve , we we have always been, behind the curve, we could be at the meeting edgein curve, we could be at the meeting edge in terms of the green industrial revolution. some might not know but we have around the welsh coast with dean % of all europe's marine energy. but we are not tapping into that potential at the moment. because we don't have the moment. because we don't have the power to invest in it but we could get in there and be there at the ground level of the great green industrial revolution across the globe. it's an exciting idea, i think, because if we think about what wales could be, prosperous, independent, sociallyjust country, people will think all the things that we thought were normal in wales growing up, the last 40 years, we don't have to accept them. we could abolish homelessness. we could abolish homelessness. we could abolish child poverty. 200,000 of our children who live in poverty and we could start now. we could
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introduce a welsh child payment next year that would lift 50,000 of our children out of poverty as a down payment on the kind of country that we want. everybody would agree that leaving one union is taking a lot of time, more than someone. what do you wa nt time, more than someone. what do you want independence within ten years or of random? we have an economic plan for closing the prosperity gap. we can be much more ambitious than the kind of approach that we've seen from the existing welsh labour government. we can begin to put the foundations there and inspire people with possible and over the of that decade, show what is possible within the existing powers, albeit limited, and arrive at a point where we have and arrive at a point where we have a conversation as a nation as to where we want to be and we want to
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make the case for wales becoming an independent country. and it's not about putting up orders or closing ourselves. my mother is english. i love england. we want to be good neighbours. i think what we're talking about is creating a new britain as well. because... a bit of detail here missed price. you say no borders between know how difficult exit is proving be in negotiation. another withdrawal agreement, another political declaration. are you talking about a process to undo ourselves from that union similar to the process. trade agreement, tariffs. a national commission which is looking at these detailed questions and people have legitimate questions. as we move from
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inde—curious to confident, we need to see the plan ready so people can make an informed choice but i think we can do things different. what we need to do is create a different relationship or partnership on this island and across the whole of europe. it's not about separatism cutting ourselves off, it's about creating a new partnership of equals rather than what we have at the moment. on the details, are you saying no details, will there be checks on the border? how do you envisage? we have such a long, porous border. it's a hypothetical within a hypothetical because i still hope we would stay within the european union. i want england and scotland. it's a key question of the selection. i want all the nations of
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this island to stay within the european union. that creates a relationship where we are in... i'm not a defeatist. i still think we can win this argument. we've seen the shift in support for remaining wales more than any part of the uk so we can win this argument and in that context, england, wales, scotland, ireland, will be partner nations but it will be on the basis of the future, not the united kingdom so—called which is based on a concentration of power in one nation. lady in the front. so i understand from what you've just told me that your father was a minor so told me that your father was a minor so that means that i can suggest that you are probably familiar with the minor plasma canary which was a test as to the air quality in the minds. it's been said that the black
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individual is comparable to the miners canary and actually shows the deficits in a civilisation, in a society. and i'm actually coming from what was asked previously actually which is how do you mitigate the problems that come with the vision? because if you look at the vision? because if you look at the black individual almost as if they are the miners canary, what they are the miners canary, what they are the miners canary, what they are showing you so far is that ethnic people, black women particularly are more likely to die after pregnancy, in comparison to other people from other ethnic minorities and backgrounds. we are showing we are more likely to going to prison and be arrested. there are more stop and searches on black individuals. that is a problem that is born out of one of the most historical forms of division. how
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when you can't even mitigate those issues currently in this present time due plan on ameliorating the issues that will come out of becoming independent?” issues that will come out of becoming independent? i think that's a great question in my own partner isa a great question in my own partner is a person of colour and so indirectly, i see the effect that racism in all its forms has in our society. we only recently saw wales not only has one of the highest imprisonment rates of any country in western europe, in terms of bane, it has one of the most on their levels racially of incarceration. we have unresolved questions. we have to face up to our own difficult questions of our own relationship with and our own history, our own
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culture and society, in terms of racial justice. the culture and society, in terms of racialjustice. the reason i believe in independence ultimately is what it could do on the whole host of issues in abolishing poverty as i said but also we could be a beacon of justice said but also we could be a beacon ofjustice in said but also we could be a beacon of justice in the said but also we could be a beacon ofjustice in the world in terms of our racial integration. we've got a lot of work to do, we've got a lot of detailed work to do in all these areas but we could be that clean slate on which we could write the words of a better future. that's why i'm inspired because people are looking for a change project, right? this is the change project. that the next generation could dream the kind of wales we have dreamt of. i was born into a labourfamily. i ended up born into a labourfamily. i ended up in plaid cymru because i became frustrated, i wanted to see change.
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i was given one of the best chances in life, one of the last generation to get a full student grant. could young people today, they are not hitting that support. we could write that wrong in the best way to do it in the best way to write all of the wrongs wales and to make a contribution to globaljustice as well is for us to take responsibility for building the nation we want to build stop on that note, we have to leave it. thank you very much. our time is up. thank you to adam price and the audience here in cardiff and to you forjoining us. a reminder that the full list of candidates standing in the selection is available on the bbc website: the next phase questions will be nigel farage. join fiona bruce from peterborough tonight on bbc one. i will be back tomorrow night with
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wales live stop good night and nos da. well, there's a lot of damp weather out there at the moment. the rain for most of us isn't particularly heavy but drizzle, low cloud, grey skies, that sort of thing. in the north of the country, the weather is actually driest. so i think not much rainfall at all here in western scotland degrees i think on the south coast of england early on friday morning. tgeb through the day, you can see where the rain is, there's some rain in the south, a little bit of rain across northern england, nudging into south—east scotland, for example, maybe northern ireland too but the rain turns heavier later in the day, in south—western england,
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wales and parts of the midlands but you can see the south—east abd eastern areas there, a bit dry. probably some sunshine around in places like london and norwich. now, as far as the weekend is concerned, out of the two, saturday is the wetter today and then comes sunday. i think it'll be a little bit drier.
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welcome to newsday on the bbc. i'm mariko 0i in singapore. the headlines: israel's prime minister is indicted for bribery, fraud and breach of trust — he responds angrily. this evening we witnessed an attempt to carry out a coup d'etat against the prime minister on false allegations in an investigation process that was biased and contaminated. firefighters battle hundreds of blazes across australia and warn it's too late for some to evacuate. i'm ben bland in london. also in the programme: at the trump impeachment inquiry, a former security official says the president promoted a false narrative.

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