fihey south africa. foreigners, they take... people are taking our land. the attacks on africans from countries such as zimbabwe, mozambique and nigeria are more accurately described as afrophobic because it was specifically people from the continent who were targeted. their businesses, like this one, were looted and burned, leading to inside south africa itself. they don't like foreigners, i don't know. we are here to make a living, we're not taking anybody‘s jobs. no african is a foreigner in africa, you know? it doesn't matter whether they come from zimbabwe orghana or matter whether they come from zimbabwe or ghana or whatever. this is home. there were anti- south african demonstrations gci’oss south african demonstrations across the continent. the south african authorities tried to dampen down on tensions and said the violence was perpetrated by criminals. but some believe there is resentment at foreigners doing

well in a country is still beset by mass unemployment, grinding poverty and rising crime 26 years after the end of apartheid. signs of separation are everywhere... africans have to stand and wait for their bossesin to stand and wait for their bosses in the sun. an empty seat may be a few yards away. they cannot sit on it. the violence last october in johannesburg was one of many periodic flareups in the last decade or so. in 2008, 62 people died when mobs beat foreigners and set buildings alight. afrophobic attacks sparked outrage in africa, but the country which had been supported by fellow black africans during the apartheid era could now be home to such sentiment. so, is south africa afrophobic? if it is, what is

fuelling this, and is enough being done to ensure that such attacks never happen again? so, a brief background to the topic we are discussing. let's meet our panel. khulu mbatha is special adviser to president cyril ramaphosa, who of course is leader of the ruling party, the anc. khulu mbatha was a special envoy for the president to several african countries at the end of last year, trying to reassure them after the latest bout of attacks a few months ago. lindiwe mazibuko was parliamentary leader for the democratic alliance, south africa's official opposition. she was the first black person in this role, and is now active in politics at the grassroots level. trevor ncube is a zimbabwean newspaper publisher and businessman who's built a very successful career in both south africa and zimbabwe, and he was a prominent critic of the former president robert mugabe. and adetu nji omotola is a nigerian journalist and media personality.

he's lived in south africa for nearly 20 years and works in the community with expatriate africans living in this country. that is our panel. please give them a warm round of applause. applause. and before we go to our first question, remember, you can join the conversation. it's #bbcgiobalouestions. alright, without further ado, let's go to our first question. jean—marie, and you're originally from the drc. jean—marie, your question please. my question is addressed to dr mbatha, but also to the rest of the panel. the question is, why are black africans always a soft target of xenophobic attack in south africa? dr khulu mbatha, straight to you. thank you.

they are soft targets because of the area in which they live. this is not happening in hospitals, where we have doctors from all over africa. it's not happening in suburbs like sandton, where we have a lot of businesspeople coming from the african continent. it's happening in the townships, where there are scarce resources, and foreigners become easy targets because the rule of law in such areas is very much difficult to implement. 0k. lindiwe, why are black africans always the soft target of every xenophobic attack? i mean, i think we underestimate the extent to which the system of apartheid in this country, which categorised people based

on their skin colour, to within an inch of their identity — penciltesting, dividing families along colour lines — engendered in people's minds the idea that there's a hierarchy of race. and i think for many black south africans, to find themselves, post—apartheid in democratic south africa, with a lack of access to economic opportunities, they're looking for who is lower down that totem pole to victimise. and racism is so fundamentally embedded in the fabric of south africans' identity, i think as black south africans, we battle with issues of low self—esteem as a consequence of our history. you call it racism, though — black on black? absolutely, black—on—black racism. but these are people you can't even tell the difference between how they look. but black south africans, out of a system that really worked hard to thin—slice people into categories, look for that category that they perceive to be lower down the totem pole, more vulnerable, and less entitled to access to resources. i think it's something that's embedded in our history,

in our psyche, and it's a consequence of trauma that we haven't properly addressed. adetunji. and the reason why that is the case is, my sense is, i've been in this country for about 20 years, and when i first arrived here, even at the highest levels, people when i called them to try to sell them insurance, once they hear that i'm a nigerian, automatically they switch off or they tell me face—to—face, do i have drugs to sell? so there's a narrative, especially in south african media, that has now been taken on by politicians who are looking for short term gains, especially around elections, there is a narrative that crime in this country is committed by other africans, in spite of the fact that we know that most crimes in this country are committed by africans. and as a result of that, a lot of south africans have a deep—seated anger towards particularly groups like nigerians or zimbabweans, and that's what we saw a few months ago play out on a massive level. and even people like a gentleman i don't want

to mention his name, a lawyer who goes on television and castigates nigerians, and it was a massive programme that was watched by all south africans. so i think the media have done a lot of damage, and i think that's the reason why the thing went viral so quickly. 'cause they keep reporting about negatives about africans, all the time, and that is very tragic. all right, thank you for that. trevor. i think apartheid told black south africans that they might have been oppressed and poor, but they were better than the africans in the north of south africa. so, when they see other africans within their locality, they look down upon them and they think that they are superior. much more importantly, i think it's important to realise that xenophobe — afrophobic attacks are never spontaneous.

they are instigated by people, politicians, with something to benefit from these afrophobic attacks. they are in the townships, where the common people are used as pawns in a big political game. it's like starting a war so that you draw attention away from the problems that you have within your domestic — within your backyard. applause. we got this via social media. as i say, you can follow this conversation on social media, and one viewer says i would like to know what criteria makes an altercation between foreign nationals and local people xenophobic. how do you know it's afrophobia? the optics are very visible.

i've never seen a single white person that has been subjected to such barbaric attacks. so it's very obvious, whether it's 2015, whether it's the rosettenville attacks, whether it's in alex, whether it's in langa... so it's notjust — there aren't just altercations, as this person is asking, which are not necessarily afrophobia? lindiwe. i think it's tempting for political leaders, for governments, whether they're instigators of this violence or whether they're trying to paper over it, to sort of call it criminality, in an effort to not project such a bad image of the country. but i don't think that you can solve a problem, i don't you can solve it effectively, without first identifying it. and i really do think — i appreciate the fact that you've honed in on afrophobia as opposed to xenophobia, because i don't think what we experience in this country is experienced by europeans, or australians, or north americans. it is exclusively black africans who are targeted, and that's an issue in need of addressing. zeinab, let mejump in there and say... trevor. for me, i've had specific, direct, one—on—one conversations with one of south africa's most powerful millionaires, saying to me, we know you people. we see what you do. don't think that we don't see what you do.

and don't think that this is spontaneous. there's political gains that come out of this. all right, and he said that specifically about zimbabweans, or just non—south africans? it's about africans driving big cars in sandton, to start off with. it's about the africans in soweto, who are thought to be doing well, who are supposed to be having businesses and that kind of stuff. so it's very clearly targeted at black africans. and particularly rich black africans, such as you? do you feel it more that they think, what is this guy... ‘cause you lived here for 18 years. well, let's be clear about this. afrophobia is present in corporate boardrooms in south africa. afrophobia is present strongly in government corridors in south africa. applause.

i went iwent and i went and spent some time in soweto. and they said why would we want to be mad at the person who brings a spread? it is only when they tell them that person is my enemy that they attack them. well, let's go to our next question, please. your question, please. this question is for all the panellists. do you think the south african government acknowledges that there is a strong current of afrophobia in the country? canl can ijust can i just ask you, quickly, can ijust ask you, quickly, do you think they are in denial? is that your personal view? yes. they are in denial. i

don't agree that what you say is afrophobic is correct. you are at the highest upper echelons of the anc authorities. you're adviser to president cyril ramaphosa. why is the government in denial about the state of afrophobia? it is criminal, it is where there is a fight resources. and there is a fight resources. and the black majority was repressed and they will be the first ones to feel there are scarce resources , first ones to feel there are scarce resources, absence of jobs, and so on. you give

reasons. does the government accept that there is... you know, the question is, why would the south african government not acknowledge that there is a strong current of afrophobia? you won't acknowledge it. no, i won't acknowledge it. all right, so what would you say to dr khulu mbatha? i would have to agree. i think the government is in denial. i do think that there have been attacks on african nationals, and they... i think it's quite frightening and disappointing that they're not acknowledging these attacks. applause. let me say this. yep, do respond to her. yes. we — south africa is the only country in africa with a constitution that allows and gives rights to all people who live in south africa, including — including asylum seekers and refugees. jeering.

0k, iagree. you are here in south africa because south africa is different from the countries where you come from. jeering. you are here in south africa. we have asylum seekers and we have refugees. i'm not — most of the people are coming here because there are more opportunities of getting jobs. all right, lindiwe — lindiwe. so i think this is a common problem with government at the national level. we've experienced with this gender— based violence, right, a sort of a reluctance to say there's a pattern of criminality, that the criminality isn't arbitrary, that it happens to a certain targeted group. gay women in informal settlements who are correctively raped, women who suffer from gender— based violence, and now here, afrophobia that targets black african foreigners. applause.

i don't think it diminishes us as a society to acknowledge that these are problems. it empowers us to cauterise them, identify them, identify who the ringleaders are when these things are organised, educate our people, and do what we can to, from an education and from a crime prevention perspective, stem this tide. i think denialism only has the effect of exacerbating the problem. applause. trevor, you wanted to come in here, and then adetunji. i think, for me, what is sad is that we have a generation of the anc and the pac that spent time physically on the continent, and have an experience

of what africa and africans are like, in terms of being welcoming and supporting the liberation struggle. but the point that i want to say is that let's reflect back. every time there's an afrophobic attack, prior to that, there's a big politician who says something which stirs up things, and after that, there is a reluctance in terms of the speed with which to contain the violence that flows out of that. for me, that says, one, there's a denial to admit that this issue exists. the criminality thing is a bit problematic. it's afrophobic, period. it needs to be dealt with like that. adetunji. for this kind of scenario, i like to quote my late father, who says that one must accept that they are part of the problem and they are part of the solution. the government of south africa is indirectly creating an environment where south africans who are poor find expression of their frustration attacking other africans. but what is also important

is that, if you look at south africa, they say nonracial, nonsexist, so it would be very, very worrying for the government of south africa to accept that south africans are afrophobic. but not only that, south africa's interests around africa, for example nigeria, there's a huge interest that south africa has. so it's very difficult for the government be able to accept that they are — the citizens are afrophobic, because there could be counter reactions or reprisals, as we saw in other parts of the continent. just very quickly, khulu mbatha, when you went and visited all those african presidents at the end of last year as a special envoy for president ramaphosa, did the presidents like buhari of nigeria, macky sall in senegal and nana akufo—addo in ghana, there was a lot

of anger across the continent. did they say to you, we think south africa is afrophobic? no, not at all. in fact, they were more appreciative of the fact that south africa's democracy is still new, 25 years. actually, almost all of them have said to us, they grew up in their own struggles, having the ideas that originated from south african leaders, because the african national congress is the oldest political organisation. in fact, some of them even identify themselves as founding members of the anc. so they weren't hostile in their views by saying... they were not hostile. they understood. all of what they said, they emphasised the fact that rule of law must apply. so the presidents... the police must do their work, which we admitted that police have not done their work. yes, dr khulu, i find that hard to believe. well, he's telling you that the presidents told him.

the president of nigeria, macky sall from senegal, they all left the world economic forum in cape town, following the most recent attacks. they all boycotted that meeting. last year. because of a feeling of unwelcomeness in our country. ok, let's go to our next question. sean, your question please. south africa has experienced an extended period of challenging economic conditions. do such economic conditions have apart to play in occurrences of xenophobia? khulu mbatha. south africa is facing a lot of problems in terms of creating jobs, the economy, because of its nature. it has been affected by what has been happening internationally. it has not grown to — the promises of growing the economy at a rate of 6%,

it has not happened. this as a result, therefore, is reflected both socially and otherwise in the way life is experienced by ordinary people. and we can agree, it's not experienced the same at all levels in all communities of south africa, but it's felt worse in the townships. trevor? well, the economic crisis that i am experiencing, but south africa is experiencing, does play some role in this afrophobia thing. but it is also used by politicians in terms of pointing out, if those foreigners were not there, you would have the jobs. if they left, you would have the jobs.

but it is... but that is actually not true. in certain instances, yes, but in certain instances, some of these people are either... they have become entrepreneurs, some of them have skills that south africans do not have. so there is a political class that is exploiting the circumstances that south africa faces at the moment to benefit themselves, in terms of whipping up emotions to get support using foreigners. is that the case? i have spoken to a highly educated women here in south africa he says that the woman who does her washing says, i can't get enough work because all these migrants come from other parts of the continent, they are undercutting me. they will work for much less. i can barely survive. well, that could be... that does happen. that could be true, but i think the other thing that is important for us to emphasise is that there is a real hatred for africans. know, butjust address that point that has been put to me. it does happen, doesn't it? they are undercut. before we admit to that,

you get told this over and over again, zeinab, that you are where you are because of the foreigners. you believe it. in actual fact, when it's actually not true. and that's what the politicians are using. 0k. adetunji. look, i believe that there was a time when there was a boom in south africa's economy, and everyone was happy, and south africans were drinking a lot of champagne, competing with nigerians. now that the economy has gone to low growth, we see in more and more frustration, what they say, rising expectations is a rise in frustration. there's a lot of south africans who are now seeing as competing forjobs. some foreigners are doing crime, and so as a result, they are scapegoating them. but the fact is that there are many poorer countries in africa. nigeria is the poorest people on earth, but we don't see nigerians going to attack other foreigners,

african foreigners. there's a lot of south africans. i think the last count there were 31,000 south africans working in nigeria. so the reality is that, i think the general feeling about africans is that they are taking jobs, they are taking women, and they are doing crime, and that's why they see the attacks. 0k. if i may, would you say that is a majority of black south africans? look, my own experience is unique. i used to work for a very big insurer, so i had racism on the left, because it was white controlled, and i had xenophobia on the right—hand side. and the reason why my black mothers and sisters were jealous of me was because i used to go out every single day and network, and i was top of my branch, and they didn't like me for that. they were scratching my car and writing all sorts of things on it. so my personal experience about xenophobia, even at the highest levels of this country. but the advantage i have got is that i have lived in europe before, so i have been able to cope with racism.

otherwise, those who haven't had racism like i have done, they can't cope. so do you discount the economic conditions as well? so i don't, i don't at all, and i think that economic conditions all over the world are making people vulnerable to xenophobic ideas. you know, you alluded to making south africa great again. i think the same has happened in countries like the uk, parts of europe, where immigrants, refugees, migrants, economic and otherwise, our scapegoats for economic problems domestically. so as much as we may say black african foreigners are soft targets for violence in this country, black south africans who are unemployed and struggling economically are soft targets for nonsense politics around staring up afrophobia. we need to acknowledge people's lived experience, and we need to acknowledge the economic difficulties that are making them vulnerable to these kinds of messages, and making violence easier to spark in our communities. thank you, all right. applause. trevor, i hear you. we have a population of almost 60 million people stop of these 60 million people, we have minorities, whites, coloureds, and indians, they don't come up to 10 million.

so we have about 50 something million black people. we have 188,000 asylum seekers. we have 78,000 refugees. would you say 50 million black people hate other africans? i can't accept that. i think it would be unfair to say the entire 50 million black south africans are afrophobic. the victims of these attacks are black people and that is what makes us angry, black people and that is what makes us angry, that is what puts shame on us us angry, that is what puts shame on us is south africa. i cannot say that these 56 million people, all of them, hate africans. could ijust jump them, hate africans. could ijust jump in... you can afterwards, but

it was addressed to trevor. i think it would be unfair to say the entire 50 million black south africans are afrophobic. nobody is saying that. there are south africans who are pan african, who love their african brothers, and so forth. we're talking about the major narrative. the trend that we are seeing. remember, we've seen south africans marching against the afrophobic attacks, so there is a body of south africans who are not afrophobic. but there is a bigger body of south africans who are afrophobic, and who are out on the streets and marching and killing people and burning people. those are the pictures that are out there. that's the reality that people are living. i'm happy you are making it relative, because you are talking in absolute terms. lindiwe. we have to generalise this problem in order to solve it. if i say there is a gender—based violence problem in this country, i'm not saying every single man

in this country as a wifebeater or a rapist. i'm saying we have a pervasive problem amongst men that needs addressing. and i don't think that undermines us as a country. i think it empowers us to solve that problem. so that the minority who are doing these things don't start to represent us as a country. so you say quite clearly a minority. adetunji, do you think it is a minority? because that is the point that is being made here. khulu, my own take on this is very simple. and that's why we set up the xenophobia victim support fund. if the majority of south africans are not afrophobic, why is it that when there's these attacks, in the aftermath of these like the 501 nigerians who had to be evacuated, the suffering, the level of suffering of those women, mostly women and children, i didn't see a lot of south africans try and weigh in and support them. i didn't see the gift of the givers running to the nigerian consulate. so it's a way that the government responds to this pain and misery of so many africans that will give us the feeling that maybe, perhaps, it's a widespread narrative.

so you don't think it is just a minority, as lindiwe says. no, i think, look, i am suspicious of anything that gives the impression that it's not the majority, because the facts on the ground do not show that the majority address it. no, and let me be clear. it's a minority who are engaging in a surveillance that we saw on television. —— engaging in the acts of violence. that doesn't mean that we don't have a pervasive anti—african language and discourse in this country. so even as we've been talking today, we've been talking about africa like it this faraway place, like we're not in africa. we've been talking about africans like we are not africans, right? so... so even that mentality of thinking of black africans from other parts of the world as, like, different to us, and is living elsewhere, that's a pervasive problem in our language. it doesn't mean we're going out and doing violence, but it means we have a social problem that we haven't addressed properly. applause. ok, thank you very much indeed. let's go to our next question. good evening, everyone. i just wanted to ask, if this is specifically an african

tragedy, or are we experiencing it in the same vein in other parts of the world? trevor ncube. i think we are seeing a lot of xenophobia across the world. there's been a pushback with the fallout from globalisation, where people are beginning to get back to being more tribal and more ethnic than we have been before. but i think that difference is the degree with which violence is part of the afrophobia narrative in south africa. it's the sense that the south african government takes a backseat and does not take ownership and does provide leadership, the sense that somebody out there is stoking the fires. so the answer, the short answer to your question is, it's a global phenomenon, but it's the extent of the violence and the complicity of the officials in south africa which makes it look slightly different.

adetunji, you see this everywhere in the world, do you? we don't see anywhere in africa where we see black people going after other black people. so we need to situate this in africa first. and one of the cases that i want to bring to light is a young man who was killed on april 21 by a mob in rostenburg. the police watched the mob sat him alight, a nigerian guy, 31 years old who left a widow with two children. so we don't see a lot of that around the world, but we do know that we see yugoslavia, see all kinds of craziness going on, but the one in south africa is very worrying, especially when it gets widespread like the recent one that we saw. so it is an african tragedy. i mean, i would disagree slightly, not to diminish the level of crisis here, but you find in countries where hate crimes are at their highest levels since before

the second world war, right, where brown people were are targeted by anti—immigration sentiment. it is a pattern that's replicated all over the world, and it tends to happen when there is economic contraction, when people don't have access to jobs, where they feel like their likelihood of having a prosperous life is under threat. it becomes very easy to target brown people. again, this idea that you must look for the nearest person who is struggling more than you are, and attack and blame them for your challenges. because of the economic situation in the world, and because of what is happening in europe, a car mowed down more than ten people in germany, and they happen to be foreigners, so attacks on immigrants happen everywhere. you're referring to the attack... it does notjustify what is happening in south africa. what i'm trying to say,

it's an international phenomenon. ok, you're referring to the attack earlier this month just outside frankfurt, when a self—confessed far—right nationalist opened fire on a cafe frequented by people of middle eastern origin. ok, thank you. let's go on to our next question. hi, yes. i would like to ask dr mbatha a question, who's here representing the government. what steps is the government taking to, you know, fix the problems of afrophobia? for example, you said yourself there's188,000 asylum applications. research has found that this is a huge backlog, and will take many years to work through. and this leaves people vulnerable. so it's really difficult for people to get the proper documentation to work here, to live here, and to be allowed, you know, to prosper and thrive. and i would like to know what the government is doing to fix that and tackle that.

thanks. applause. first, i must mention that the un commissioner for refugees has been to south africa last year in septemberto meet with the president and to cement the infrastructures that have been created by the united nations in south africa. we have now a un co—ordinating body which works with civil society and the government. we've created agencies that will deal with the most, most affected, especially those who come with children, that they get houses and also get social grants. so there are structures that are being created to deal specifically with the issue of asylum seekers. asylum seekers, ok. and refugees. and specifically on the wider issue of afrophobia, which is also implicit in that question, what steps is the government taking to try to ensure that this doesn't continue to be a trend,

as trevor ncube has described it. yes, also government has also said that we need to realise that we have to take political education to the schools, so that south africans can teach other south africans that our struggle would not have succeeded without the support from african countries and the international community. applause. do you want to come back on that? are you satisfied with that reply? thank you, sir. i do think, however, that there is a duty on the government as well. so it's good to say that the un is coming here. but if you go to a refugee reception office tomorrow morning, you will find people who are waiting outside who are being bribed, being asked for bribes, put it this way, being asked to prove that they're gay, if they come and they say that they've actually fled a country because they're being persecuted there.

and so i do think that there's a duty on the government to talk about how the broken asylum system will be fixed, and that people can get properly documented, and can be safe in south africa. thank you. let's go to our next question. what i would like to know is, how do you persuade south africans, in order to have a healthy society, that they have to embrace the whole of africa and all of africans, into making — in search of a healthier society? also these other stakeholders that play a part in the situation. thank you. adetunji, what would you suggest should be done? i think south africans are very lucky to have a president who is now

the chairman of the african union, and also the secretary general of the africa continental free trade area is a south african. he actually beat a nigerian lady to the job. i was telling khulu earlier how we always tend to fight, nigeria and south africa. we like fighting. let me just explain very quickly, the africa continental free trade area agreement, it was signed last year. and the idea is to remove about 90% of import tariffs, to encourage greater trade on the continent of africa. yeah, deeper regional integration. so the opportunity for president cyril ramaphosa — you were his advisor, you can take this to him. this year, there's17 african countries that will turn 60. cameroon, nigeria, benin, and so on — senegal. and so all those countries — because they got their independence in what they call the year of africa. so south africans would be well advised to rally round those countries, their communities, and do some kind of social cohesion engagement, not just in the month of may, that we see in africa month, but every single country of the 17.

but also zimbabwe will turn 40. namibia will also turn 30. so those are low— hanging fruit for south africans. but also the civil education or political education, it needs to start immediately. we want timelines. we don't want, "government will do this," and there's timeline. so i think that would help. but also what's important, the gentleman over there talked about people being able to have right of access, in and out. there's so many people that are trapped in this country, that cannot even go and see a loved one, they cannot go and bury their mother, because if they go out, they won't be able to come back in. that's a tragedy, in my view. so there are some of the things that the government should do. so you would like more open borders. exactly. well, not open—open, but controlled—open. i willjust i will just let trevor answer, because he's not really... i think it's important that the story of south africa's liberation is told in full, and becomes part of the curriculum in schools,

so that south africans understand the sacrifice that africa went through to help with the liberation of south africa. that's hugely important. for me, that's the beginning. that the leaders, the senior leaders in the anc, who lived in exile, tell of their stories, like was being told, of how they were — the hospitality that they received from africans, so that the young south african who's growing up realises the connection that there is between them and other africans. because there is, at the moment, some people that want to say, no, that happens in the past. it doesn't belong now. but, if you make that disconnection, you are denying the younger generation to understand why this country's the way it is, and the role that africa played in getting south africa

to where it is right now. khulu mbatha, i mean, we've mentioned the africa continental free trade agreement. there are benefits for south africans, aren't there? if they orientate themselves towards africa, the rest of africa, economically and so on, it's good and healthy for your society. before i come to that, let me explain that last year, president ramaphosa undertook state visits to various west african countries. and in these visits, there were issues of cultural links with west africa, cultural agreements. there were issues of waiving of visa requirements for special categories signed with nigeria, ghana, senegal, togo, and so on. this is to encourage the free movement of people and goods. and therefore, with the signing

of the africa continental free trade area, or agreement, then it's the area. it gives us an opportunity. to do what the founders of the oau and now the au had imagined. that africa will co—operate with africa in terms of trade, in terms of economy. we must know that this is not an easy road. i can speak about the many positives that go with that, but we must know that that is another struggle, because african countries have bilateral relations with their former colonisers. so we have to undo all that. but it's an initiative that our president has said we must

take and put as uppermost, because we must do away with all that that stops us from trading amongst each other. we must improve the infrastructure, the ports, the railway lines, the airlines. all these have to be addressed. but it's a noble aspiration, as far as the south africans are concerned. yes. very quickly. these are all incredibly important initiatives, and i think will contribute to an understanding of how we got to where we are today. but i think xenophobia and afrophobia will thrive on ignorance as long as ignorance persists. so one of the things we need to do is create more opportunities for south africans to interact with, on a daily basis, in healthy, productive ways, the culture, the music, the cinema, the history, of other african countries, so that they can own this continent. not as a place that's far away, but as a place that they reside in and that they contribute to, and that they are as much a part of as their fellow citizens in nigeria, in benin, et cetera. all right, let's go to our final question now. your question please.

what are the ways of uniting the brothers, african brothers, living in south africa? so that's my point. thank you, what are the ways to unite african brothers, and sisters, i assume, living in south africa? trevor ncube. we need to have those person—to—person interactions, getting to understand each other at that level, and coming up with practical ways of how it is better — how it is easy for me to understand my brother from nigeria, my brother from ghana, my brother from zimbabwe, and so forth. we need to create those platforms. it needs to be encouraged. it needs to be cultivated. we need to realise that we are one people, we are all african, we belong together. the success of zimbabwe is the success of south africa. we belong together, at the end of the day.

adetu nji omotola. yeah, i believe in the power of celebration. i'm from a tribe in nigeria called the ijebu people. we have the best parties in nigeria. so we need to come together and celebrate what unites us. our culture is very vibrant, our music, our food. i'm sure you've heard of the jollof rice wars. between nigeria and ghana, we need to have more jollof rice competitions, amongst ourselves. and senegal. i like dombolo and mogodu, and kombu tea. but the irony is when you come to soweto, you can't even find kombu tea on vilakazi. so we need to celebrate what unites us, and also engage more with the communities that we come from, so south africans need to get into the nigerian community and we need to get into the gabonese community, and all of that, by extension. khulu mbatha. what president buhari of nigeria and president akufo—addo of ghana emphasise is the involvement of the youth. if we have youth and cultural

activities, youth that lives in nigeria and comes to south africa, and south african youth that goes to all the countries in africa, that way, we would have done — we have taken the step of uniting africa further. and lindiwe mazibuko. i think visibility is important. i think that leaders, community leaders, from other african countries in south africa need to be more visible, more engaged in the discourse. the media needs to not talk about africans from other countries without them being present in the discussion. and i think south africans need to be able to find role models and people with whom they identify who are not necessarily from the same country. so i don't think south africans or africans can see each other in an inspiring and admiring way until visibility and representation is improved.

thank you very much indeed. of course, that ends this edition of global questions. thank you very much indeed to our panel and to our audience here, and the rest of you, wherever you are watching or listening following us on social media, until the next time, from global questions, and whole of the team here at fox junction, johannesburg, from me, zeinab badawi, goodbye. applause. hello there. we've seen the rainfall from storm jorge compounding the flood issues. there are numerous flood warnings in force across the united kingdom, and storm jorge is still

producing some very large gusts of wind as well from these tightly packed isoba rs, and several more hours of that to come, really, through sunday morning. now, those gusts of wind are quite likely to cause some travel disruption, but could also bring down some powerlines or some trees as well. now, they'll still be with us through the early hours and into sunday morning. but, as well as that, we've got this curl of rain just affecting the northern half of the uk. but it's notjust rain, it's snow to modestly low hills — about 200 metres. so, with those strong winds, it'll be blowing around, so blizzard conditions. fewer showers further south, but they'll still be around, blown in by that very strong and gusty wind. temperatures largely just above freezing, but it's clearly going to be icy where we've got the snow in particular. and still that rain keeps coming for the northern isles, tending to ease a little bit through orkney as we go through the day. but that rain, snow, slowly meanders northwards. more of it around, i think, for scotland than we had on saturday, but tending to become more showery for northern ireland, for england and wales.

won't be a totally dry day, but hopefully there'll be more sunshine around, and the winds by the afternoon are starting to ebb away, just maintaining their strength a little bit for longer further north. but it'll make it feel chilly if you're out and about. for the start of march, barely double figures, even in the south. below par really, you might say, the temperatures, for the start of the meteorological spring. and then this area of rain is a concern through the night. as it comes across, we think, southern parts, it's falling into cold air, it could give a smattering of snow for the downs, for the cheltenhams potentially, towards rush hour, and certainly making things slippery. with a colder night on the cards, fairly widespread frost, as you can see, going into monday morning. so we clear that away, but it takes its time. as i say, could be a smattering of snow on the hills. and then the showers that follow, because it's still cold air, will be wintry as well over the hills, so only 6—9 degrees celsius. yes, the winds won't be as strong, however.

now, as we take that one area of low pressure away later on monday, we've got another one rushing in towards southern areas. that could be our next dollop of rain. potentially need to keep an eye on it. all through the week, it looks as if low pressure will dominate towards the north—west, and we may eventually see high pressure building, actually, towards the south. but for most of the week, temperatures will be lower than they should be, both by day and night, so some night frost. and it's a bit of a showery picture, with an occasional risk of some lengthier spells of rain. as ever, there are warnings out. they are on the website.

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a shock