and yasmin alibhai—brown, who is a journalist and author. let's look at tomorrow's front pages then... the i focuses on the uk prime minister's message earlier today — he thanked the nurses who cared for him during his week in hospital. as does the times, the pm will now continue his recovery the telegraph, too, looks at borisjohnson‘s release from hospital — as he says "it could have gone either way". as does the times, the pm will now continue his recovery at his official residence with his fiancee carrie symonds in chequers. meanwhile, the daily mail looks at the growing row in the uk over personal protective equipment as an nhs boss reveals delivering the kits to the frontline has become "hand to mouth". the daily mirror's headline reads "uk worst in europe", as the death toll here exceeds 10,000 people. meanwhile, the financial times reports the 620 group of nations looks set to agree a deal to offer low—income countries a freeze on loan repayments in the wake of the pandemic.

so let's begin... we have got both of our guests and we are going to look at our first paper which is the independent. 10,000 deaths. the uk faces the worst total in europe. yasmin, sometimes the papers choose not to go with the death toll on their fan page and i would imagine this time it was a fairly easy decision. it was unavoidable. it is a marker and summer was unavoidable. it is a marker and summer is probably not even an adequate word although i know what he is saying. numbers are funny things, we got used to 600 dead then 700 dead and it went up to 900 and that kind of shook us up. 10,000 says something quite big, i think. you know, it is not a time to blame

anybody, absolutely, for everything thatis anybody, absolutely, for everything that is going wrong, but we do have to think about why we are getting these numbers. yasmin, i am going to spain, we will carry on with you until we establish really good communications with lucy and we will press on with you. when you see the picture of boris johnson, press on with you. when you see the picture of borisjohnson, he is in his tie, he is well, he has recovered and he says it could have gone either way, did you see the five minute video message he released? i did, i did. i have never knowingly said a single good word about boris johnson in knowingly said a single good word about borisjohnson in all my life, but last week i did say that this is not the time to pick on people, even if they are the prime minister. actually, today for the first time, that was some genuinely felt, there we re that was some genuinely felt, there were those genuinely felt words, and

i think were those genuinely felt words, and ithinka were those genuinely felt words, and i think a lot of people were kind of moved by it and i was. ifind it ha rd to moved by it and i was. ifind it hard to say that, but i was.” moved by it and i was. ifind it hard to say that, but i was. i think that situation he was in did change many things and i wonder if we have communication with lucy, we do, are you there? yes i am. i don't know if you there? yes i am. i don't know if you are able to hear us, we were talking about the front page of the independent and their decision to lead it with a 10,000 deaths, that's number number as the government says. it is a desperate number and i don't think the journalist could have chosen any other story. it is a landmark figure and i was going to say we we re landmark figure and i was going to say we were inching towards it but of course we have been accelerating towards it in the last week. the problem is we have also seen this happening in other countries, we have seen the way in which the deaths have really mounted and what we all want to know is is the actual rate of increase slowing down? is it

in fact reaching a plateau? it is a shocking number and behind every single number is a grieving family that has lost someone really dear to them. in statistical terms, that has lost someone really dear to them. in statisticalterms, we that has lost someone really dear to them. in statistical terms, we want to know whether this is actually the peak, because other things lead on from that, not least whether the government is going to decide to lift the lockdown. it is a desperately sad day, really awful figure, but at the same time does this herald some movement in the lockdown arrangements for this country? we will look at the daily mirror now, which also marks that moment, experts warn as the death toll goes over 10000 makes it front and centre, uk the worst in europe following an interview with sir jeremy farrar which suggest that the uk might do worse than its european counterparts. lucy, there is a temptation to want to compare britain to other countries which

appear to have manage better in this early stage like norway, austria or even australia. statistically, is that right? i don't think it is very helpful and of course the quote is that we could be the worst in europe, it is not a definitive statement. i think it is very dangerous to look at all the other countries in the world and that purely at the figures and say they have fewer figures than us or they have fewer figures than us or they have got a different trajectory. different countries have different populations. we have a very tightly, very densely populated country, whereas a country like australia or some of the nordic countries, they have much lower populations and arguably much more space. if you look at a country like singapore, which everyone lauded as a country that was managing things really well, they also have a really

densely populated country and they we nt densely populated country and they went into lockdown last week because they recognise that some of the things that people are crying out for our government to do weren't actually working in terms of testing and tracing. it is hard to point the finger of blame at our government and say you have been doing itjust like that country, look at france, francis got a similar population and it is twice the size of us. we have got some certain constraints around oui’ got some certain constraints around our population that unfortunately has made transmission of the infection probably greater. nevertheless, i will move to yasmin. we are all going through this at the same time around the world. some countries a few weeks earlier than others, so comparisons, sober comparisons, are surely part of the argument and the information that eve ryo ne argument and the information that everyone needs? absolutely. i don't think, i really don't think and i understand where lucy is coming from, but i think one of the problems for us is, that there is a

kind of culture of exceptionalism. there has been here since the second world war. we need to learn from other people. it is not necessarily saying and actually the government is to blame for some of theirs. my daughter works for the nhs and the testing and equipment there is coming through that was poorly organised. we cannot expect, as someone organised. we cannot expect, as someone said, people to do this without absolutely the maximum protection you can give them an borisjohnson has seen that for himself now. i think the question is not whether we are better or worse, but what can we learn and the population point can't apply to germany, for example, which has some cities which are as densely populated as birmingham and london, which are big spots for us. so, i think, if only we could learn from

each other, and i think the point about singapore is right, everyone was holding singapore up as the country which was sorted and then this virus, i think it has come back or it didn't work or there was a second wave. it is a time for cooperation and modesty on all sides, i think. we could learn. we are going to go to the daily telegraph which again leads with that picture, i think it has been released by downing street which shows that borisjohnson either in the moments before or after he gave that video and it clearly shows a man who has been in hospitalfor a week and a man who is on the road to recovery, for 48 hours, he said things could have gone either way for him. lucy, the daily telegraph picks up the story of the two nurses that boris johnson mentioned picks up the story of the two nurses that borisjohnson mentioned in his speech, one from new zealand and one from portugal. yes, it was a really

powerful speech today, not least because it showed the prime minister not necessarily being prime ministerial but being vulnerable and very human and part of that story is about the other humans, the nurses, the doctors and the whole team around him who have supported him and by identifying them by name, by making them kind of living people for us to be able to sort of relate to, isa for us to be able to sort of relate to, is a very powerful part of his address, i felt. to, is a very powerful part of his address, ifelt. it to, is a very powerful part of his address, i felt. it also was that we see that one nurses by new zealand and the other from portugal and it reinforces this idea of how much the nhs in particular but maybe our nation as a whole has benefited from migration and the people that come here to work and work really, really hard, it is not about people coming here to sponge from the state, it is a reminderthata here to sponge from the state, it is a reminder that a lot of people have come here to improve their lives and

in doing so, they have improved our lives immeasurably. i thought it was a really beautiful touch in the address. yasmin, it is not in the papers but i found someone online who talked about this point and said a prime minister who nearly died, nothing will be the same after this crisis, our national debate about the contribution of migrant workers will change utterly. what you make of that? ijust will change utterly. what you make of that? i just want to thank lucy for saying what she said, because i feel it all very personally that all these years there has been this absolutely demeaning and insulting and sometimes quite frightening rhetoric about migrants and, you know, the ten doctors who died and nurses and it's really good to hear this, at last. will it last? i hope so, i can't everforgive this, at last. will it last? i hope so, i can't ever forgive matt hancock for making, standing on a

similar podium to where he now stands not that long ago saying, this is not the international health service, it is the national health service. i do hope he is eating his words now, because it is the international health service. i am very grateful to you, lucy, for saying that, actually. and more of us saying that, actually. and more of us need to be saying that, because of course there are still people, there are still people, who are going on and on on social media about migrants, especially migrants of colour, and yes, the prime minister has very powerfully led something important i knew in the way we talk about those people who came in, not to rip us off, but to make their own lives and make society better. we are going to move and stay with the daily telegraph, another story, rishi sunak one is about tipping point for the lockdown

and economy, find the right balance between the coronavirus and the economy. lucy, how might a government do this? well, it is going to be a question of balancing different trade—offs, unfortunately, which is sounding really hard—hearted, which is sounding really ha rd— hearted, but which is sounding really hard—hearted, but if we are going to have social re pair, hard—hearted, but if we are going to have social repair, which i think this particular corona crisis is really emphasising and disparities in society,, but you can only really get social repair if you get economic repair as well. i think what we have to recognise is that government has a massive part to play, but so has business, you know, let's not forget that businesses, landlords could be giving vent holidays, large companies could be paying bills much more quickly to smaller businesses and we could all bea smaller businesses and we could all be a little bit more sympathetic about the cash flow for each other. there are lots of things that are

not government intervention that could be taking place to improve the economy, but certainly in terms of how much money the government can afford to give us, most people are now talking about gdp being affected possibly by 20%. there was an interesting piece on the front page of the financial times about the 620 countries perhaps writing off some debt in some of the poorer countries, again, are we going to be looking at a similar policy by our government here to write off some debts. we will look at that a little later. 0n debts. we will look at that a little later. on to our final newspaper, the daily mail that says fiasco of nhs the daily mail that says fiasco of n h s safety the daily mail that says fiasco of nhs safety kit flights from china. yasmin. there's not enough in that story on the page for us to know much detail, but there is no doubt at all, at all, whoever you speak to, that the whole testing process

and regime, if you like, is deeply flawed. it came to light, if we want to open up the economy, we are going to open up the economy, we are going to have to start some really serious universal testing. i know there were promises made by 800,000 or it ever was, without proper testing, of knowing who is carrying the virus and who has had it, you cannot open up and who has had it, you cannot open up the economy. and i can't see how this is going to happen if it is such chaos, if some of the testing equipment is bad, you know, there is no serious coordination of this vital element of the fightback against this appalling virus. just very quickly, lucy, how did you manage to spend at your bank holiday lockdown weekend? manage to spend at your bank holiday lockdown weekend ?|j manage to spend at your bank holiday lockdown weekend? i organised an easter egg hunt and my husband

failed abysmally to find his easter eggs. yasmin? i was very tearful yesterday because it was my daughter was my birthday and of course, we could not hug. but fish pie. fish pie cheered me up today. belated happy birthday to her and thank you to you both. that's it for the papers this hour. lucy and yasmin will be back at 11:30pm for another look at tomorrow's headlines. coming up next, it's click.