make sure, in the workplace have to make sure, in order to... in the workplace have to make sure, in order to. .. professor, we will do that. we are going to be speaking to business leaders and in unions and subsequent sections of the programme. professor, thank you so much forjoining us. thank you. this is bbc news with the latest headlines for viewers in the uk and around the world. the prime minister borisjohnson outlines his road map to lift the lockdown in england — in an address to the nation — but the fundamentals won't change. no. this is not the time simply to end the lock down this week. instead, we are taking the first careful steps to modify our measures. in england, those working in the construction industry and people who can't work from home are now encouraged to return to work from tomorrow, but maintain social distancing. there's a lifting of restrictions for outdoor activity from wednesday — as those living in england are told

they can spend time outdoors for leisure purposes but only with members of their own households. and there could be a phased reopening of schools in england — starting with primary school pupils, beginning on ijune at the earliest. also today: the call to "stay at home" is replaced with "stay alert" — but leaders in scotland, wales and northern ireland say they won't be adopting it, and labour call it confusing. what the country wanted tonight was clarity and consensus. and i'm afraid we got neither. this statement raises as many questions as it answers. and we see the prospect of england, scotland, and wales pulling in different directions. two of the countries that had begun easing their restrictions — germany and south korea — have reported an increase in new infections.

good evening. borisjohnson has set out what he described as "the first sketch of a road map for reopening society" in england. in a televised address this evening, the prime minister thanked the public for putting up with the hardships of social distancing and said their efforts and sacrifice had helped stop the spread of the coronavirus, saving thousands of lives. he confirmed a new slogan — "stay alert" — but the leaders of the uk's devolved nations have said they would not drop their current message — to stay at home. mrjohnson said he would not lift the lockdown this week, but he did announce some easing of the current measures. the uk government is actively encouraging people in england who can't work from home, to go back to work if they can, from tomorrow, but not to use public transport where possible. that's step one of a 3—step plan. from wednesday in england, people will be allowed unlimited amounts of exercise, or to sit in the local park,

or to drive to other destinations, but only with members of their own household. in step two, from onejune, there will be a phased reopening of primary schools in england, initially reception, year one and year six. shops will also start to open. it's hoped that secondary school pupils taking exams next year will get some time with their teachers before the summer break. in step three, byjuly at the earliest, some parts of the hospitality industry will reopen, along with some public places, provided they are safe. and the prime minister said there would soon be some kind of quarantine, for everyone arriving into the uk by air, but there's no date on that yet. here borisjohnson is speaking at downing street a short while ago. the first step is a change of emphasis that we hope that people will act on this week. we said that you should work from home if you can and only go to work if you must.

we now need to stress that anyone who can't work from home — for instance, those in construction or manufacturing — should be actively encouraged to go to work. and we want it to be safe for you to get to work, so you should avoid public transport, if at all possible, because we must and will maintain social distancing and capacity will therefore be limited. so work from home if you can, but you should go to work if you can't work from home. and to ensure you are safe at work, we have been working to establish new guidance for employers to make workplaces covid—i9 secure. and when you do go to work, if possible, do so by car or even better by walking or bicycle. but, just as with workplaces, public transport operators will also be following covid—secure standards and from this wednesday,

we want to encourage people to take more and even unlimited amounts of outdoor exercise. you can sit in the sun in your local park, you can drive to other destinations, you can even play sports, only with the members of your own household. in step two, at the earliest byi june, after half term, we believe we may be in a position to begin the phased reopening of shops and to get primary pupils back into schools. in stages, beginning with reception, year one and year six. and step three, at the earliest byjuly and are subject to all these conditions and further scientific advice, if and only if, the numbers support it, we will hope to reopen at least some of the hospitality industry and other public places, provided they are safe and enforce social distancing.

we have been through the initial peak, but it's coming down the mountain that is often more dangerous. we have a route and we have a plan, and everyone in government has the all—consuming pressure and challenge to save lives, restore livelihoods and gradually restore the freedoms that we need. boris johnson speaking a short while ago. well, the labour party leader sir keir starmer has been reacting to the prime minister's announcement, saying it raises more questions than it answers. what the country wanted tonight was clarity and consensus, and i'm afraid we have got neither. this statement raises as many questions as it answers, and we see the prospect of england, scotland and wales pulling in different directions. it's a big gap here for the government to make up. look, i have always accepted there would be some conditions on this. i accept that, that you can't answer everything now, but the main strap message needs to be clear. "stay alert" isn't clear.

most people have been saying, "what does that mean?" so there is a very basic issue here about communications. but we are rushing into tomorrow, asking people to go back to work. that is millions of people, tomorrow morning, back at work — without a clear plan for safety, without clear guidance as to how to get there without using public transport. with me now is our chief political correspondent vicki young. he made it clear he was speaking as the prime minister of the united kingdom in his speech. but is it simply that he is the leader of england given the fact of the other three nations don't want to obey the measures he wants to announce? depends which areas were dashed you're looking at. some of these are devolved to the other nations so they can make their own decisions, for example things such as a possible quarantine on people arriving in the uk, and ports and airports. that would be likely something that is uk wide. if you

think about things like the economic measures, the furlough scheme which is paying some people who are unable to work at the moment — that is uk wide. but in other areas, as we heard today, nicola sturgeon can make decisions in scotland. she thinks the transmission of the disease might be slightly different in scotland, and similarly things may be different in wales too. yes it applies to england, but he didn't go into all of the details. government officials have tried to clarify some of those for us. so for example, clarify some of those for us. so for exa m ple, lots clarify some of those for us. so for example, lots of parents watching this will be wondering about schools, talking about at the earliest, the beginning ofjune, they will try to get some of those primary school pupils back. but there are currently no plans for secondary school pupils to go back to school before september in england, although what they do want to do is give those who have exams next year, year 10—12, some

face—to—face time with teachers to review their progress because eve ryo ne review their progress because everyone knows that schooling at home is very different. so these are the kinds of details, we will get more of those when this 50 page document will be published in the house of commons tomorrow. mps will be questioning the prime minister on all that, so people have lots of questions about what all this meant. the prime minister did go into all those details, but government officials are trying to explain some officials are trying to explain some of those. so more leisure activities will include golf, you'll be able to play tennis, water sports with those in your own household, and you will be able to meet up with one other person in the park, for example, as long as you socially distance. and this is all very cautious. social distancing will remain wherever you are, andi distancing will remain wherever you are, and i think that is the crucial point here. some relaxation and restrictions, some further down the road if all of those other things are met, all those other tasks about the virus not transmitting. vicki,

borisjohnson said his government had been working with employers to figure out a route back to work. can we expect to hear more about that on monday? i think there's been lots of talk with employers and of course the unions, very anxious about how all this is going to work. because if we talk about social distancing in the office, then that is easier in some places than others. now people have already gone back to work, they can see that desks will be moved apart, if you can do that people will be told to sit further apart. restrictions for example in a communal kitchen area, one of you going in at time for example. all these things have been talked about for a while with employers to make sure that it is a safe dashed as safe as possible for people to return to work. this is all about minimising risk, the prime minister was clear it won't go away completely, this virus is still out there, and people will have to take some decisions themselves. shielding, for example, those people who were sent messages to say they should stay at home for 12 weeks —

that hasn't changed in england or anywhere else, they still have to be extremely careful and cautious, but you can just see the slight relaxation of some rules in some areas, but certainly wanting to encourage people back to work if they can do so safely. vicki young, thank you so much. the prime minister said that it was thanks to the public‘s "effort and sacrifice" that the spread of the disease had been slowed and the death rate was coming down. with me now is our health correspondent catherine burns. part of the government's thinking today is based around how quickly what should those most at risk take from the prime minister's statement was yellow nothing has changed for them. if you look at the changes, they are baby steps. boris johnson was clear they have these five tests to see what they had to do to open up to see what they had to do to open up lockdown. and he says, "we have by no means fulfilled all of them." so for most of us, the advice is the same. there are small tweaks to

being able to exercise a bit more, but right now nothing changes. the people who talked about the shields of people, the same situation applies. right now, their advice is to just stay put. for everyone else, they are moving these steps 2—3, but essentially very little has changed for most people stop what he talked about the r rate being 0.5— 0.9. can you explain for our viewers the difference between 0.9 and 1.1 in practical terms? the r rate makes so much sense. before lockdown, the r rate was about three. that meant eve ryo ne rate was about three. that meant everyone who had the infection were going to infect three people, and those three people would affect another three. therefore the infection rate was going to grow exponentially. if we can keep the r below one, that means every person who gets it will only affect one other person. so there won't be the

surge in numbers. so we've heard a lot about the r rate, expect to hear more and more about it because it will really be key. in this new cove alert system, they will look at new cases and they will look at the r. the thing about the r is it is a guess. it's a guesstimate. we don't have the exact numbers, this is a range of where we think it is at. so we think it is up to 0.9, those are the figures being bandied about. but we don't know for certain yet. this is at best educated guesses.|j we don't know for certain yet. this is at best educated guesses. i don't know if you've had a chance to speak to many doctors or co—workers in the last half hour or so. i wonder what there's reactions might beat to the steps, which are designed to protect the capacity of the nhs casilla nhs organisers is an organisation topic they've spoken about this, saying they've spoken about this, saying they won a balanced approach that is

clearly communicated. they have to help the nhs and save lives, but the restrictions we've had have also caused sacrifice and hardship. so they welcome the fact that there was lots of emphasis on testing, but they said, "we don't see that there isa they said, "we don't see that there is a detailed and developed approach for that in the moment, and we need it now." catherine, thank you so much. let's get the perspective of rain newton—smith, the chief economist at the cbi. hello, thank you forjoining us. the prime minister said in the statement, "we've been working to establish new guidance with employers to make workplaces secure." do you know what that guidance is? yes, look, the government have been consulting with business on how to draw up guidance across different sectors, different types of work. so that businesses, more and more businesses can open safely. and that is really about what this next phase is about, how

can we reopen our economy safely across a range of sectors? and the prime minister set out one of the first steps in that road map, and i think in the coming days and weeks, we will see more detailed guidance for employers as to how they can reopen safely and how we can get the nation back to work safely. who judges whether or not it is a workplace to open? doesn't an employer have complete discretion about when they can open? these are one of the areas that are absolutely being worked through. and i think what you need to see is both employers having confidence that they can open safely, but of course that their employees feel safe. and absolutely, the two will be talking together to determine that. but i think we also need a role for independent assessment. so in the uk, we have the health and safety executive, we need to make sure they

have the resources to make sure this is happening appropriately across different businesses and sectors. and of course, you need to have a way that if an employee does have a concern, way that if an employee does have a concern, of course they should raise that with their place of work first, but if they don't feel satisfied, they need to have somewhere where they need to have somewhere where they can raise concerns. i think it is only by discussing this openly that we can all have confidence that we can all get back to work safely. and of course, one of the other important messages that the prime minister was keen to reemphasize was where you are able to work from home, you should continue to do so. these are looking at businesses where you are unable to operate fully where you are —— your staff are working from home. you've talked about a range of conversations that need to be have between employers and employees, assessors and the government. how long will this all take? what you must remember is that these conversations have already been happening. we know from our own

surveys and talking to businesses that around four head out of ten businesses had to close their doors at least for some period over the past few weeks. but more and more are starting to open where it is safe to do so. so manufacturing some of ourcar safe to do so. so manufacturing some of our car producers have been looking at their production lines, making sure people are staying apart by more than two metres. so they are able to continue operating. that's always been the case, if you can't work from home and it is safe to do so work from home and it is safe to do so in the workplace, those businesses have been able to open up. apart from the nonessential retailers, there's been a list of very specific businesses — our pubs, cinemas, other places that have needed to shot. but i think as we get more guidance, we will see more businesses having confidence that they can do this safely.|j businesses having confidence that they can do this safely. i wonder if one of the problems is not people being at work, but people getting to

work, and that potential crush on public transport for those who don't have access to ca rs or public transport for those who don't have access to cars or those who simply cannot walk for miles or miles. solving that problem of getting to work it's surely a priority? yes, and there are two really important building blocks for us really important building blocks for us all being able to reopen fully and safely. and one is absolutely about transport, and the other is about transport, and the other is about schools and how we continue to protect vulnerable people. and so i think on transport, the message is absolutely "don't jump on those trains and buses first thing tomorrow morning." we need to preserve those for key workers and people who can only get to work via public transport. i think the message was absolutely, you need to think about how your employees get to work. if they have to get on public transport and it is safe for them to continue to work from home, thatis them to continue to work from home, that is why the messages to work from home. they are absently putting

in plans, we know transport for london, many of the other bus providers are looking at how they can make sure we have the capacity at peak times. another big part of it, of course, is varying hours that everyone isn't trying to get to work for 9am. we will need to see extensible phasing for this to work properly, as we very gradually start to open up more and more of the economy. i totally understand you are not a spokesperson for every single birth, her business, but if i could ask about some retail businesses. nail salons are all instructed to shut down because there was no way to operate safely. do you know if they'll be investigating ways on their own to reopen and to be able to reopen?” know many are, i know from talking to hairdressers that try to think, "how can we do this safely?" lots in the cosmetic business are wondering how they can give advice to people on that safely. i think the prime

ministerdid give on that safely. i think the prime minister did give some indications that perhaps from june, we would see more of those nonessential retailers being able to open. and i think we've seen some good being able to open. and i think we've seen some good news being able to open. and i think we've seen some good news already that garden centres will be able to openin that garden centres will be able to open in england over the course of this weekend in wales tomorrow. thank you so much. thank you. most of the prime minister's statement tonight applied to england only as the devolved governments in scotland, wales, and northern ireland have exercised their right to follow their own approach. we're going to talk to our colleagues in glasgow, cardiff and belfast. and we start with our scotland editor sarah smith. the slogan and england, "stay alert" secular nicola sturgeon was pretty scathing about borisjohnson's choice of a new slogan for england. she's not change the advice here. she's not change the advice here. she thinks it is unclear and

confusing, both have different m essa g es confusing, both have different messages in different parts of the uk, but she thinks the slogan itself is confusing, so much so that she's asked the uk government not to run their "stay alert" advertising campaign in scotland. here's what she had to say earlier. for scotland, right now, given the fragility of the progress we have made, given the critical point that we are at, then it would be catastrophic for me to drop the stay at home message, which is why i am not prepared to do it. and i'm particularly not prepared to do it in favour of a message that is vague and imprecise. i feel very strongly that, and it's a responsibility i bear and feel very heavily, i am asking all of you to do things right now that are not normal in everyday life. is all this about health, or other continuing political differences between smp and the conservative led government in london part of this ——

snp? there's a number of differences. one of them is that nicola sturgeon says that the r rate is slightly higher in scotland, so that it would be more dangerous for people to go back to work. she's not saying that, although the premise or a saying that nonessential workers should return in scotland, but the advice is still to stay at home, work from there if you can. if you cannot, then don't go to work. so there's clear divergence between what is happening across different parts of the uk, even though politicians talk about this for a nations approach, and how would be different if all parts of the uk operated under the same broad rules. they're going in there directions where they feel it is necessary in making a strong statement, saying, nicola sturgeon is in charge of the rules in scotland, she will do what she considers necessary. the prime minister can do whatever he believes is right for england, but she believes if she were to start loosening resurgence here, she says pretty bluntly that people could die unnecessarily. sarah smith, thank you so much. let's get reaction from our wales

correspondent hywel griffith. ifi if i want to drive to newcastle in london, i can do so. and if you want to drive up to you for a friendly chat in cardiff, i cannot do that, and that is because of the difference between the rules here in england and the rules in wales. is that right? absolutely, the rules in wales are different from when it comes to travelling for exercise. basically you cannot drive to exercise in wales. you are meant to stay within walking distance of your home. now that has been ok, we've not heard about too many transgressions in wales and the last few weeks. but with things evolving in england at a slightly different pace and the prime minster this evening actually talking about people getting in their cars to go and exercise, what happens now with people deciding to drive over the border? for some people it is only a couple of miles. they regularly make that journey couple of miles. they regularly make thatjourney potentially couple of miles. they regularly make that journey potentially for work couple of miles. they regularly make thatjourney potentially for work or to go to the nearest supermarket. if they want to go for a walk on the brecon beacons, they could find

themselves in a lot of trouble with themselves in a lot of trouble with the police because it is still an offence here in wales to use a vehicle to go in exercise. so i'm sorry, you won't be able to come see me atany sorry, you won't be able to come see me at any time soon. i'm sorry about that. does the government in cardiff feel political pressure from the uk white government to have a uk single approach? or as we've seen, are the government in cardiff determined to do simply what it feels is best for those in wales regardless of the rest of the uk? very much the second, if anything it has been the welsh government trying as much as it can to put the political pressure on borisjohnson. it can to put the political pressure on boris johnson. we it can to put the political pressure on borisjohnson. we saw that two days ago with mark drakeford, the first minister and leader of the welsh labour party, giving his plan for wales on fridays and the people here knew what minor, minor changes come into effect tomorrow. he's been reiterating that today ahead of borisjohnson on the airwaves, saying that to stay at home in wales and not just be saying that to stay at home in wales and notjust be alert. and although

things will change in england, they are determined that wales decides what happens here because that's the power they have of devolved government, but too it's a response ability that it has when it comes to the impact of coronavirus, and they will be responsible for these decisions for years to come. so the fa ct decisions for years to come. so the fact that they have the political difference to westminster really doesn't mean too much at the moment. they are focusing, they say, on what matters for the people and the lives of the people in wales. thank you so much. and our ireland correspondent emma vardy is in belfast. northern ireland is another of the stay at home nations? it is, just like scotland and wales, they are sticking with that and more cautious line, the northern ireland executive saying that it will not change. we saw the first minister irene foster getting her voice on the airwaves, giving various interviews this morning doubling down on that

message, saying we won't stray away from the regulations as they been the last few weeks. there might be a few possibilities like opening up prayer spaces and garden centres, but certainly taking a more cautious approach. although foster was not as critical as nicola sturgeon has been, but we did see the stl p leader here in northern ireland really taking a swipe of the prime minister today, saying this new "stay alert" slogan, he doesn't think people understand it, even going so far as to say he told boris johnson himself it was nonsense. so criticism coming from here in northern ireland just as you've heard in scotland, and yet "stay at home seems to be the message here. northern ireland doesn't share a land border with the other uk nations, but it does share one with her republic of ireland. of course northern ireland has to listen exactly to what dublin is doing, and what dublin is doing. part of the

conflict throughout this lockdown has been over points of contention over whether you should follow what dublin is doing or what london is doing. so shouldn't there be an all island approach to a public health crisis such as this, people wonder? at the moment it seems the dup and sinn fein, the two adversaries here seem sinn fein, the two adversaries here seem to be on the same page of the moment with sticking to the stay at home message. but the republic of ireland has been much clearer with its plan at the moment. over a week ago, the republic of ireland published this phase plan for the gradual unlocking of public amenities over the next few months. so we can see what their road map looks like. northern ireland has held back a bit, the executive was going to publish its planned this week, then decided it wanted to hear what boris johnson had week, then decided it wanted to hear what borisjohnson had to say tonight. we can expect northern ireland's road map to be published on monday or tuesday. but the executive has already said it will be more around criteria, still with a cautious approach particularly over the next three weeks, where

lockdown will look pretty much as it has done since it began. emma in belfast. thank you all so much. there's been an increase in infections in two of the countries that have already begun easing their restrictions, south korea and germany. let's speak live to our correspondent, damien mcguinness who joins us from berlin. tell us about this rise in infections? yes, so this is the r number, the reproduction rate we've been talking about so much over the last few weeks. what that means is the number of people that each infected person then passes the virus on to. in germany it has now risen to over one. that is crucial because if one person is affecting one of the person, the aim really is to keep the level below one, which means the virus is being contained. yesterday and today, that r rate has just crept over one, in that sports

worry that the restrictions as they are being used, and the frankly more relaxed attitude that we are seeing on the streets in germany is possibly leading to a rise in infections. we must be careful about this rate, because it varies wildly. also, we are talking about something that happened a week or two ago, so the rate we are seeing right now has no impact, no relation to the restrictions we are seeing opening this weekend. so it is quite a complicated estimated figure. but i think what we're seeing in germany, officials will be watching this figure over the next few days, and seeing if the restrictions as they are being loosened have an impact and do raise the risk of a spread of infection. because germany is really getting almost back to normal so far, shops are now open, some schools are taking children back, we are also seeing hotels or opening,

restau ra nts are also seeing hotels or opening, restaurants opening, and those incredibly difficult businesses to restrict a virus in. you have to wear masks, etc, and the rules are very clear. the question is, and will be interesting for the rest of the world, is does it work was mike because can germany come out of the lockdown and not spark a second wave? a lot of people will be watching germany closely for the next few days and weeks. are people in germany pretty stoic about a re—imposition of restrictions? in germany pretty stoic about a re—imposition of restrictions7m depends who you speak to. the vast majority of people support in the main of the government's quite clear road map. and it has been very clear, angela merkel spoken quite candidly about what the scientists are saying, and given very clear instructions about what you can do, when, and how you can do it. that consensus though is starting to break down slightly. there've been some hefty rows between regional

governments, angela merkel‘s government. they come to a compromise but that has created a confusion for people. the other question, you have people on both ends of society. some are saying the restrictions shouldn't exist and that the whole thing is simply blown out of proportion, partly a result of the fact that the results have worked, and the infection rates have stayed relatively low, the daily death toll is still relatively low. so some protesters on the streets this weekend were wondering what the problem is. that is the minority opinion. the other extreme people are saying restrictions are being loosened too quickly. i would say the majority of people support the government's line. but what we are seeing is because the pandemic really hasn't hit german hospitals hard, and the numbers to look quite positive, people are getting a lot more relaxed. you see it on the streets, you see it with how people are wearing masks in shops and restau ra nts a nd are wearing masks in shops and restaurants and it is quite loose, really. so the question is, is this

relaxed attitude going to spark a fresh wave of infections? and i think what we're seeing right now across europe is really the end of the first stage of the pandemic. and i think that is why the experience of other european countries will be so interesting to watch to see how you come out of lockdown and how you do that without sparking another wave of infection. that is the question. damien, thank you so much. hello this is bbc news. the headlines: the uk prime minister borisjohnson outlines his road map to lift the lockdown in england in an address to the nation, but the fundamentals won't change. no, this is not the time simply to end the lockdown this week. instead we are taking a first careful steps to modify our measures. in england, those working in the construction industry and people who can't work from home are now encouraged to return to work from tomorrow, but maintain social distancing.

there's a lifting of restrictions for outdoor activity from wednesday,as those living in england are told they can spend time outdoors for leisure purposes but only with members of their own households. and there could be a phased reopening of schools in england starting with primary school pupils, beginning on june ist at the earliest. also today, the call to "stay at home" is replaced with "stay alert" — but leaders in scotland, wales and northern ireland say they won't be adopting it — and labour calls it confusing. what the country wanted tonight was clarity and consensus. and i'm afraid we got neither. this statement raises as many questions as it answers. and we see the prospect of england, scotland, and wales pulling in different directions. let's continue with reaction to boris johnson's statements. the national chair of the police federation of england and wales has responded to the prime minister's

statement. he continued: "police officers will continue to do their best, but... one of the big questions for the many parents schooling their children at home is when might schools reopen? this is what borisjohnson had to say on the issue. in step two, at the earliest byjune ist, after half—term, we believe we may be in a position to begin the phased reopening

of shops and to get primary pupils back into schools, in stages, beginning with reception, year one and year six. our ambition is that secondary pupils facing exams next year will get at least some time with their teachers before the holidays and we will shortly be setting out detailed guidance on how to make it work in schools and shops and transport. let's get reaction to that. our education correspondent, elaine dunkley, is in salford. elaine, have school said anything about this proposed timetable? yes, there is a huge may be hanging over all others and does this announcement tonight need the confidence test of teachers, parents and the teaching unions? there is a lot of concern about primary school children and how well they are able to socially distance in a classroom and this is a big concern for the

teaching unions, for teachers and for parents. well primary school pupils be able to maintain social distancing? will they be able to maintain the hygiene that is required? will they maintain the hygiene that is required ? will they be maintain the hygiene that is required? will they be able to go back to school safely? there is a huge concern at the weather that will be the case. and with fewer children in classrooms, of course, is that the space for this to happen? so there is a huge may be over all of this and a lot of the teaching unions are saying this is reckless and has not been fought out properly, and this causes huge problems for teaching, who are going to have to try to maintain this level of safety within the classroom, playgrounds and canteens. what we have to remember is this will usually change what a school environment is like for children, so there is huge concern there. the teaching unions are safe there needs to be more guidance, for example, in terms of equipment and on how children are going to deal with this new environment. you have got to look at the issues as well around if

a child comes to school and presents with symptoms, what happens to the school than? are the children sent home? in practice, putting this into reality is going to be quite different. in march, schools were told to carry on the lessons online if they could. we are now two months m, if they could. we are now two months in, has that worked? it has been very difficult and what it has highlighted is children from more poor and disadvantaged backgrounds and children who are from affluent backgrounds there is a difference. the affluent background children are able to do a much more of that. there has been a mixed response in terms of how well it is happening and there is a huge appetite for children to be back at school. the key has to be can this be done safely? at the moment there is a lot of concern around that. elaine dunkley, thank you for that. let's talk to frances o'grady, the general secretary of the tuc.

frances o'grady, thank you for joining us. i have a question for my business editor. he has asked what you make of the fact that people are being actively encouraged to go back to work, but not to use public transport? well, the tuc unions wa nted transport? well, the tuc unions wanted it to be safe to return to work, but i'm afraid the prime minister's statement tonight is a recipe for confusion and possibly chaos. with just 12 hours recipe for confusion and possibly chaos. withjust 12 hours notice, people are being encouraged to go back to work, but without any a nswe rs back to work, but without any answers on what happens on public transport, what happens if you have got children, what happens if you are supposed to be shielded. or vulnerable and some other way. and of course we haven't even had any guidance published or properly consulted on, so we have been saying there have to be tough new rules on safety a nd there have to be tough new rules on safety and on enforcement as well

because the health and safety executive and local authority's budgets have been cut to shreds. we have fewer inspectors, fewer inspections and fewer prosecutions. how can working people be confident? never mind the transport issue, how can working people be confident that they can work safely until they at least see what the government is proposing for their safety? can you define what a safe workplace should look like in his covid—i9 era? define what a safe workplace should look like in his covid-19 era? the number—one issue for us is that, by law, every employer with more than five employees are supposed to carry out a risk assessment. we are saying there has to be a risk assessment for these extraordinary circumstances that we are in. that must, by law, involve consultation with unions and health and safety reps, and we believe it should be published because we have got lots of good agreements we good employers, but rogue employers could put us all at risk if, as we have

seen put us all at risk if, as we have seenin put us all at risk if, as we have seen in too many warehouses, they are not operating safe social distancing, they are not even in some cases providing washing facilities or sanitiser. so it is a community responsibility and the community responsibility and the community has a right to hold business to account and make sure that real action is being taken to ensure that the workforce, their families and the whole community is safe. we know that bus drivers have been affected and of course medical workers. do you have any statistics to show how many and union members have been affected medically or have died through their work during the pandemic? we have seen really tragic clusters, including bus drivers, including that is, amongst key workers and of course in care homes as well. we have also seen many care

workers, on low pay and insecure contracts, without adequate ppe, and the only draft we ever saw of government guidance on safety at work for this didn't even include a mention of personal protective equipment. so of course people are worried and i am afraid that the prime minister is not dealing with those worries because the best way to encourage people back to work would be to guarantee that they will be safe, but there will be tough new rules on safety and that those will be enforced. just putting the other point of view, of course. there is risk in everything. there is risk in people staying at home from domestic violence, mental health breakdown, missing illness checkups. at some point, even if conditions are not perfect, there is surely a need for people to try to go to work as best they can in order to restart the economy? unions want to protect

people peoples' livelihood, but also protect their lives. that, to me, seem protect their lives. that, to me, seem something that should be a shared objective for government, business and trade unions. like the way to do that is to work together. to come up with sensible guidance thatis to come up with sensible guidance that is tough on safety and gives more resources to make sure it is enforced. we have already come up with really good agreements with many employers, but we know there are rogue ones out there and they will undercut the decent employers. but also, they will frighten whole communities if we don't crackdown on them. iam communities if we don't crackdown on them. i am worried that the government thinks it can make this announcement at 12 hours notice without even publishing basic guidance. i understand that and of course you did make that point in your first answer. i would just like to ask, who in government are you talking to? and how often are you talking to? and how often are you talking to? and how often are you

talking to them? so i have had conversations with various ministers, that i afraid not with the prime minister yet. i think this should be top of his in tray. if you wa nt to should be top of his in tray. if you want to guarantee a safe return to work, which we all want, we all want to get the economy back on its feet and we want to minimise any damage tojobs and and we want to minimise any damage to jobs and livelihoods, and we want to minimise any damage tojobs and livelihoods, but and we want to minimise any damage to jobs and livelihoods, but it can't be at the cost of safety. it is quite possible to do both at once. you can provide that confidence and real safe conditions at work as well as protect people's livelihoods. i think the prime minister needs to make that his twin objectives and consult us. i defer to experts on public health, but we are experts on health and safety at work and we can make it much safer ina very work and we can make it much safer in a very practical and pragmatic way, but we need to consult with us. and what is going to happen. the uk

of course is not the only country going through this and i wonder if you have had the chance to learn from the practices of other countries, similarly developed countries, similarly developed countries and see if their practices might work in the uk? absolutely, we have been looking very closely at international lessons because we can learn from other countries and should do. such as? all around europe and we have also learned what not to do in countries such as the united states. in ireland yesterday the business government unions have just come up with a really sensible, tough protocol on safety together, that guarantees workers' voices, tough enforcement as well. in germany they completed double the tests that we have completed in the uk. why can't we get that mass testing, tracing and isolating where necessary up and running so that

people can have confidence that we won't see a second spike? why can't we sort out this scandal of ppe? where we have still got care workers, dedicated workers, putting their own health at risk in order to look after our elderly relatives. it is not right and the government should... and of course these are points we put regularly to the government. frances o'grady from the tuc. thank you. as the summer approaches, people looked to the prime minister to give some kind of guidance on what travel might be allowed. mrjohnson confirmed that anyone who travels abroad will soon have to self—isolate for iii days when they get back home. so that makes holidays abroad very unlikely. but what about the state of the tourism industry here in the uk? our correspondentjon kay has been gauging reaction in weston—super—mare in somerset. well, most of us have had some lovely weather over the weekend, haven't we? the kind of weather that makes you think about the summer and what plans you might have, but where does this statement

from the prime minister, and those statements across the uk today, where do those leave our summer plans? and where does that leave a place like weston—super—mare, which relies on tourism and hospitality? we have two guests with us this evening. we will talk to alison in a moment for the bigger picture, but first let's talk to nikki because you run a hoteljust across the sea front from here. completely shut at the moment. yeah. you wanted clarity from the prime minister. did you get clarity? no, not at all. i feel we are no further forward, we don't really know what is happening. my phone will be going tomorrow, guests will be ringing me, "can we come? "are we coming? "when can we come?" i really don't know what to answer to them. you know, it is just devastating. the fact that we have got a business there, a family run business, and we can't take any guests. so where does that leave you tonight? it leaves us with the fact that we have had to take out a bank loan, we have got the building that

still costs money to run, and like i said we are family run and we have got no income and i don't know when we are going to be opening again. i suppose the prime minister would say, look, i am dealing with a pandemic here. it is a really complex situation, it is a dangerous situation and we can't necessarily give dates at the moment. yeah, and i totally get the fact that obviously we are going through what we are going through, but i just felt that they could have been something a bit more with something, maybe a few guests starting withjust maybe room only, something so that we could just open up, start taking up a little bit of the staff back in, gradually turning over, while at the moment we are just, it is an empty, egg building. it is an empty, big building. let's turn to alistair. he represents tourism businesses right across the south—west region. he talked aboutjuly, possibly, if things go to plan. does that give you a route through? can you see the beginnings

of a return to normality? well, the first thought would have been the same thought for thousands of businesses all across the south—west, that's may, june and possiblyjuly gone, which will be a hammer blow for those businesses, an absolute hammer blow and without more help many of them will not survive. as far as a road map, it doesn't have enough details to do any kind of real planning, so any business needs to know when it can start taking income. that is the top line on any spreadsheet that i have ever done and that number is now zero for another three months at least. that is going to be a really painful thing for most businesses to try to recover from. and you represent all kinds of tourism businesses here. what sort of questions do you think they will have? because that is a range of different places, from open air attractions to hotels like nick nikki. from open air attractions to hotels like nikki. we have been trying to lobby for what we call a non—sectoral approach, which means that if a business could prove that it could open and maintain social distancing, and mitigate

the covid—19 risks, so i will give a couple of examples. you could have an outdoor stately home that you could go and wander around the gardens, you could have 100 families a day visiting it or something. or perhaps a pub with a very large garden. there are lots of ways small businesses could start to open. hotels could do limited bookings to try to get some revenue through the doors. what is killing these businesses is absolutely no revenue and no expectation of any revenue. thank you both indeed. it will be good to keep in touch with you over the weeks and months ahead. for now, thank you very much indeed. of course, there are some people who live in a region like the south—west of england who are very nervous about reopening and worried about the virus being brought into regions like this by visitors, so hopefully there will be some more answers and more details for businesses and for people who are worried for different reasons, as that is published by the government in the days ahead. let's get the european perspective to borisjohnson's statement — rachel donadio is the europe

correspondent at the atlantic. rachel donadio, of today in the uk we have been talking about a change in slogans run stay at home to stay alert. has thrown scott a slogan? has it sifted through several? well, when president emmanuel macron thus announced the lockdown on march the 17th to declare war against the coronavirus, and he has since backed away from that kind of war rhetoric because it is clear we are going to because it is clear we are going to be in this battle for quite some time. there is a slogan, which has been stay at home and save lives, that has been the going slogan for a while. starting tomorrow, here in france the lockdown will be leading and now it is just kind of, the cattle, take care of yourselves and we have to trust each other all to do the right thing, as the d consignment, as it is also called here begins. that is quite a long

slogan. i understand that france is breaking down the country into different zones. ? yes, red, and green zones. the red zone is paris and everything north of paris and the green zone is south—west of paris and more things will be opening up in the green zones than in the red zones, but still things are in the red zones, but still things a re pretty in the red zones, but still things are pretty much slowly going to be opening up, starting tomorrow. one of the big differences is that in paris, for instance, parks and gardens will still be closed, but the same rules are applied to different schools that are starting to reopen, starting with elementary schools, but with only 15 students per class. it is quite confusing, how this is going to work, that really the issue is that nonessential retail will open, starting tomorrow, so shops will be open, but cabarets and restaurants are still closed and the government is going to decide about that at the end of may and earlyjune. so it is

going to be gradual. and france of course has a boisterous tradition of complaining about the president. how what are they thinking of his measures? i would say there are some grumblings, and there are concerns about a massive mask shortage in france and ppe. this is something we have seen france and ppe. this is something we have seen across france and ppe. this is something we have seen across europe and in the united states, but there is a certain concern and i would say lack of confidence in the government and how it has been handling the consignment and the deconfinement. that said, president macron is more popular personally than he has been in the past and he actually began that announcing war and his reputation as jupiter, here that announcing war and his reputation asjupiter, here you know, he is very proud and speaks from on high, but at a certain point

in one of his television addresses he said, we have had shortages of masks and ppe and he was quite direct and quite humble and i think that went over quite well because it was the least macron speech he ever gave. so he is more popular personally, but trust in the government is not terribly high. but i don't think we have seen at very high in many countries, frankly. with the exception of some of the scandinavian countries and germany. my scandinavian countries and germany. my knowledge of mythology isn't that great, but i don't think the originaljupiter ever admitted any mistakes. new colour italy as well. what is your comparison between italy and france? italy has been hit tremendously hard by this and as you know, lombardi, which is the economic engine of the country, is where they have been the biggest number of outbreaks. italy is already a bit back to political infighting. that being said, it lifted its lockdown last week and

things are slowly starting. but i actually think that people were, you know, italy handled this quite well actually. there is this reputation of, oh, the italians are not going to go by the rules and respect that, but actually they took the lockdown extremely said it seriously. it turns out that —— and the freighter thatis turns out that —— and the freighter that is quite a galvanising cause including italy. now what is happening that some businesses are going back to usual, which means that a certain amount of political infighting and controversy and there is also a lot of confusion. one thing that is the case in both france and italy is that schools are slowly opening in france, but they are not in italy, and so how do you actually go back to work if there is no place to send your kids during the day? this has become a huge issue in italy. a little bit less so in france because starting next week some schools will be opening, but it has just turned... france

some schools will be opening, but it hasjust turned... france is some schools will be opening, but it has just turned... france is a some schools will be opening, but it hasjust turned... france is a much more centralised state obviously, everything is from paris and it is live itoje, a colour take my fraternity. it is much more “— more —— liberte, egalite, fraternite. i just wanted to more —— liberte, egalite, fraternite. ijust wanted to ask what role it has the european union played in all of this? some role, but not all of a role. at the beginning, some countries shut their borders unilaterally. european union officials were saying, you really shouldn't do this and we need more collaboration. they issued a bunch of statement saying, here is what we think you should do, which is basically wash your hands and don't close borders unilaterally, but it hasn't been able to offer any kind of, it doesn't have the powers

together a lot of guidance from the top. it gives to directives and suggestions to the member states, but what it has been doing is trying to put together a package of southern europe because the economy is in spain and italy have hammered and so there has to be some kind of financial mechanism to help out. to help preserve the stability of europe. rachel donadio, from paris, thank you so much. for more reaction, i'm joined by thank you so much. for more reaction, i'mjoined by dr mike tildesley. for more reaction, i'm joined now by dr mike tildesley — he is associate professor in infection disease modelling at the university of warwick. with the prime minister's speech what you wanted to hear? that is certainly crucial, we have pretty good evidence, as the prime minister said in his speech, that the reproduction number is currently below one. there is still quite a

lot of uncertainty how far below one it is. our predictions would say it is anything from about 0.520.9. actually, the exact value is really crucial when it comes to lifting down measures because if it turns out that our reproduction number is relatively close to one, then we may see a resurgence as we start to relax. if the reproduction number is actually somewhat lower than that, it gives us a little bit more flexibility in terms of relaxation, so flexibility in terms of relaxation, soi flexibility in terms of relaxation, so i think it was a very important message and i think the key message going forward as well is that if we start to relax —— much as we start to relax lockdown, it must be done with social distancing and with necessary precautions in place because what we really want to avoid is driving the reproduction number back out and this has already been talking about, a second peak occurring. our entire life as a country now seems to be based on that r rate. how accurate is the

estimation of that rate that we need in order to make these huge decisions? well, of course, there is uncertainty around our estimation of the reproduction rate. you have to remember that we don't have information on every single infected individual any population because what we do have information on is those that we go out and we do manage to test. as we increase testing, we get much more of an understanding of how many people may be infected and of course as we get more data and the academic progress is, uncertainty around those values increases. and, as i said, it is really important that we continue to try to improve that certainty, particularly with relaxation because as we start to lift these measures, what we are really interested in is trying to see how close to the r we are currently on how that might change as we start to relax. as i

said before, if we drift above one we will start to the cases climbing again and some of these measures that have been relaxed may need to be reintroduced. i spoke to someone in france just now. be reintroduced. i spoke to someone in francejust now. i be reintroduced. i spoke to someone in france just now. i was struck by the fact that in france there are red zones and green zones, red zone cities, where they are crowded, and green zones in less crowded areas. we don't seem to be adopting that in the uk? we currently aren't and i think that is nor are they political than an epidemiological issue in terms of how we would manage this. we do know that generally we get larger infections where population density is higher and places that are more connected, so density is higher and places that are more connected, so very density is higher and places that are more connected, so very early on in the outbreak, of course, the majority of the cases were in london, before we saw spread throughout the united kingdom. it may be as we go down the line that we may need to start to consider some kind of regional interventions, particularly if we get into a stage where we start to see new clusters emerging in particular regions,

cases being driven up and local health services being overwhelmed. i think the very clear message from the start was, we are all in this together, which is why any kind of measure that was put in was on a national scale, but as we start to lift measures and may be started think about reintroducing them, some kind of bespoke local policies may need to be considered so that we can try to control these clusters locally as they emerge. dr mike tildesley, thank you so much. this is bbc news, with the latest headlines for viewers in the uk and around the world. the prime minister borisjohnson outlines his road map to lift the lockdown in england in an address to the nation, but the fundamentals won't change. no. this is not the time simply to end the lockdown this week. instead, we are taking the first careful steps to modify our measures. in england, those working in the construction industry and people who can't work from home are now encouraged to return