this is bbc news. the headlines: china is denying an accusation by britain's foreign secretary that it's carrying out human rights abuses against its uighur population. it comes amid a rise in diplomatic tension between the two countries over a new national security law in hong kong. president trump has defended his handling of the coronavirus pandemic, incorrectly telling fox news that the us has the lowest mortality rate in the world. the number of people who have died with covid—19 has now passed 140,000, almost a quarter of the global total. the mayor of the us city of portland has accused federal troops of abusive tactics against protesters, saying they are "sharply escalating the situation." protests have been ongoing in the us state of oregon since the end of may following the death of george floyd.

now on bbc news, it's time for hardtalk. welcome to hardtalk. i'm stephen sackur. the international reach of the black lives matter movement has put a new focus on racism in sport. my guest today is an athlete who made a stand. adam goodes was a star in aussie rules football, one of the greatest ever players of aboriginal descent. he quit the game after years of racist abuse. a movie has been made of his story. what can australia and the wider world learn from it? theme music plays adam goodes in new south wales.

welcome to hardtalk. thanks for having me, mate. adam, you quit your sport, aussie rules football in 2015, having made a stand against racism. five years on, racism and racism in sport is top of the agenda with the black lives matter movement making it such a theme right across the world. how much do you believe has changed in the past five years? i think the biggest thing that's changed for me is that i'm not putting myself in a situation for that abuse to be put on me every time i went to work. so that's the biggest thing that's changed for me and i'm incredibly more happier during that period and i've definitely moved on from that part of my life, and i think, if you think globally about what's changed,

i think lot more people are woke now to racism, especially casual racism. that's the biggest thing about racism that i think people are learning about and having a little bit more empathy and having a little bit more education about other people's race, beliefs, to be a little bit more tolerant of each other. you have made a very moving documentary film, the australian dream, which portrays exactly what happened to you. in many ways, it is a very unhappy story. it shows your deep depression and unhappiness as you confronted the race issue. it also suggests a nation, australia, that was deeply polarised by the issue. has that changed 7 it's hard to say. i think we want as many people across the world to see this documentary, and it isn't just a football documentary, this is a documentary about the decisions and choices

that i've made as an indigenous person in australia but it's also a documentary about the history that's played a part in our country in the choices that i've made. since colonisation of the british empire some 200—odd years ago, you know, where they came and claimed our land as terra nullius and saying that there was no people living on this continent, which we obviously know was a lie, and we're still not written into our constitution here in australia, we're the only country part of the commonwealth that hasn't got sovereignty with its first people. so there's lots of issues in this documentary that we talk to which have affected me on myjourney and me finding my voice as a strong indigenous person. interesting you say that — finding your voice. i want to take you right back to childhood. you were born of an indigenous mum

and a dad who was actually an immigrant, i believe, from great britain. i wonder, actually, whether you did, as a kid, identify as aboriginal and whether that was an important part of your upbringing. yeah, it's a little bit harder to identify with my british ancestry with the colour of my skin, and for me, it was very clear that i didn't fit, that i was a minority. i wore my colour of my skin as a badge of honour and i knew that i was aboriginal from a tribe called adnyamathanha, which means rock people from the flinders ranges in south australia, and my whole life was a journey about learning more about my culture and why i didn't grow up knowing, speaking that language, and the regret that came with that as well. were you bullied at school?

were you facing day—to—day discrimination and worse as a kid? not every day. i think what made it easier for me, you know, i went to six different primary schools, two different high schools, just as we moved around, as a lot of indigenous families do, to try and find their place. 0ur mum raised us three boys by herself, and i think for me, the bullying came and it obviously was directed at the colour of my skin, but i had some really good friends from different schools and i think what made it a little bit easier to break down those barriers is that i could kick a ball, i could catch a ball, i could throw a ball, icouldjump high, i could run fast and those sort of attributes made it easier for me to fit in over time. i'm just very mindful that the guy you collaborated with on the film, the australian dream, stan grant, who wrote the film, is a big part of the film,

he talked about, as a young person, growing up with such a sense of shame. he said, "to be aboriginal in my youth was to be ashamed, "ashamed of our poverty, ashamed of the secondhand clothes, "the secondhand lifestyle, the broken glass, "the constant movement, " and yet you then became a standout athlete. how difficult was it to have a foot in both worlds? we still have a foot in both worlds, steve. i think most indigenous people live in two worlds. the western world and a culture, spiritual world of the indigenous ancestry that we have which has a lot of trauma and baggage and hopelessness, disadvantage that's been passed on from generation to generation. so what we tend to do is create role models and be able to break down

those barriers that i keep talking about for our future generations to understand that it does take hard work to be successful and you're going to have to work harder than non—indigenous people if you want to be successful because of the barriers that might stand in your way. from the very late ‘90s through the 2000s, you became a really top talent. you played for the sydney swans, you won all sorts of personal and team awards and cups and championships and then came one extraordinary moment at the height of your career in 2013, which arguably changed your life. we've got a little clip of the film which gives a sense of what happened. let's just have a look at that right now. adam goodes voiceover: ijust remember running down collingwood's end, and i grabbed the ball right near the boundary and i get pushed closer to the fence. and hear from the crowd,

"goodes, you're an ape." time just sort of stopped in my head and i was like, whoa. and ijust turned around and i said to the security guard, "i want her out of here." now, when i looked at the person, i could see it was a kid. commentator: is adam goodes having a word to somebody in the crowd, do you think? he definitely went back and pointed at someone at the crowd, something has happened there. he's definitely not happy about something. adam, that is an extraordinary moment. i'm just wondering at what point did you realise that that horrible abuse that you had heard had come from a child? yeah, so it's. .. you gotta sort of put this moment in time in a bit of context as well. so that week of the round where we were playing on the friday night at the mcg was the start of indigenous round where we celebrate indigenous

people, players and culture over this weekend, and the contribution that indigenous people have made to the game. i also, during the week, did a photograph emulating the great nicky winmar, who's in the documentary as well, because it was the 20—year anniversary to the week when nicky winmar stood up in a game and lifted his shirt up at the end of it, pointing to his black skin, saying, "i am black and i am proud." now, i did that and they printed that the morning of our game, so this was a pretty big built—up game and we were playing against a team that i used to barrack for in collingwood on the mcg, and ijust so happened to have a day out that game and it was late into the quarter when that incident happened and i just absolutely could not believe it, and by the time i turned around and pointed, it was a young female and it wasn't until the security

guard came over and i pointed that i walked away and the collingwood team—mate was actually — the collingwood player who was right near me was darrenjolly who i had won a premiership with at sydney in 2005. he came up to me and goes, "what's wrong, mate?" i said "mate, she's 13 or 1a years old, "i can't believe it" and he's like, "what are you talking about? what are you talking about?" and ijust ran to the bench and ijust couldn't believe that it was such a young person calling me an ape from the boundary line. there was a huge amount of sympathy for you, but there was also, from more conservative australians, a real backlash. some accused you in the way that you pointed at her, then the way the security escorted her from the stadium, and the way you talked about it afterwards, talking about the face of racism in australia. they said you, in essence, were unreasonably bullying a 13—year—old girl. did you pause to consider

whether they might have a point? i spoke to her after the game, her and her sister. i had a really good conversation with them about what it was that they called me. she said, "look, i'm so sorry, "i had no idea that ape was a racial term." it was good to have a conversation with her and her sister because to my point of this whole conversation was these girls don't know what they were saying. they were copying people in the crowd who obviously knew what they were saying by calling me an ape and these young girls were copying that. that's the environment that these young girls are being educated in. so, this whole conversation was about educating our young people, but educating people who do say those things in those public arenas, that people are listening and people are observing and they're thinking that it's ok, if you can say it, then i can say it as well.

what's interesting in the documentary that you've just made, which reflects back on that incident, because it was a turning point in your life and maybe in the debate in australia, it's interesting that you give a voice to conservatives who criticise you and who, in essence, say that you have been provocative in your career. you, for example, at one point after that, when you were being booed constantly by some of the fans in the stadiums, you did what is an aboriginal war dance after scoring a goal. you, according to them, made matters worse. and you allow their voices to be heard. is that because you want to expose them? do you feel those voices are themselves racist? you work in the media, steve. these people are the people who work in the media. everyone has a voice and everyone deserves to have a voice. it's then about how do we make people accountable for that voice

and, you know, ijust wanted to go out there and play the game. now, when i did that indigenous a warcry, this was once again, indigenous round, where we're supposed to be celebrating indigenous people, indigenous culture. and that round, i was wearing the sydney swans guernsey, which was designed by my mother with indigenous design on it. so if that wasn't the moment to do an indigenous a warcry, being indigenous round and i'm an indigenous person with an indigenous design guernsey by my mother, i just don't know if indigenous culture should ever be expressed on a football field. i want to think about the way in which sportsmen handle racist abuse today, because, as you're probably aware, in football, for example, soccer as you may call it, there are now protocols in international games and we've seen it with england players,

where if they are receiving racist abuse, and obviously we're talking about the black england players, then a warning is put out across the stadium. "if this continues, the game will cease." and we've actually seen it happen now in international matches where players have walked off the field because of racist abuse from the stands. looking back, do you wish that you and your team—mates had actually walked off the field when you experienced racist abuse? i don't think my teammates need to, you know, make such a big stance for me. if i can't create the type of action that needs to happen through me reporting that person post—game, them apologising to me, then me actually taking that apology on, you know, there is a due process. but unfortunately here in australia, what we're seeing now is social media is used as that tool to racially vilify our black players and athletes across our nation.

and it is truly unfair and these people use profiles that theyjust make up, and it's really hard to really capture who these people are. the abuse, you know, racial abuse that i've had at football fields, i've always been able to see the person who did that. so i was able to point them out and report them and have a conversation with those people on what it is and hold them accountable for what they have said. and unfortunately when you have a majority of the arena booing you, it's really hard to pinpoint those individuals who start it or whether or not they are booing me because i am a sort bloke or because of my race. but clearly, in that period, after 2013 through to 2015, it got to you to the point where — i'm quoting something you said,

"i felt like an absolute piece of —" well, it's a word i can't repeat on tv. you say, "i was an emotional wreck, i didn't want to go to training, ifelt like i had neverfelt like before in my entire career, i broke down." and then of course you literally walked away, you left sydney and you went back to your ancestral homeland in the flinders mountains. but was it also a metaphorical walking away? in a sense, looking back on it, do you feel that you were defeated by walking away? no, i think — and any person of colour and race that has ever been racially abused will understand how i was feeling during that period of time. and they can really connect with and i suppose that's why the documentary is having so much success internationally because a lot of people can connect to that feeling that i've been through and what they've been through in their life of being marginalised against.

v0: when you're in a dark place, it's like you've completely forgotten everything anybody has ever said to you that was good, or that you think of all the bad things that have happened to you, all you think about is the bad things people have said to you. and it's on a stereo playing at the loudest possible decibels in your head, echoing in your mind, "you're worth nothing, i don't even care about you, go away." to stand on the land and say 2,000 generations of my family are from here, i'm born out of this place, that feeling is not something that you can feel anywhere else. me choosing to walk away was me making a choice for my own mental health.

i needed to get away from this toxic environment which had, up until that point of time, been a safe place for me to just be the incredible player that i wanted to be and for me to learn to be the leader that i was. but here i had a choice to submit myself to this toxic environment or to get away from it and really reassess my priorities. and it was that trip away back to the flinders ranges that helped me to realign what my purpose was and that this was going to be my last year. and that i could get through the last six games of that season and be able to walk away from the game for good. what strikes me in this interview is that you speak so calmly both about the personal experiences we have discussed and the state of australia today. but you must be very angry, aren't you? look, steve, i think there's two ways you can be. you can be angry because it

is an angry situation, when you think of colonisation, terra nullius, and the white australia policies that sat in behind it. we have only been recognised in australia as citizens for the last 53 years. before that we were only seen as flora and fauna. so, you can focus on all of the negativity or you can be part of the positives. i've chosen to focus on the positives, i don't want to be angry, i don't want to, you know, i have a young daughter sleeping in the room next to me just here. i don't want her to be angry about our past, i want her to be proud about who she is as an indigenous woman. i want her to be proud of herfather for the way that he keeps on trying to be positive and focus on the good things in our community, and being part of the good things. whether it be around education, employment, for our people. but why is it, in your words, that new zealand, the country not so very far from you that

you're often linked to and compared with, is in your words, "light years ahead of us in australia when it comes to the attitudes towards the treatment of indigenous people." why? it's very simple. when the english went to new zealand, they signed a treaty with the local indigenous people. they have sovereignty of their own country. in australia, when the english came here and invaded us, they claimed terra nullius, that's the complete difference ...why they are light years ahead of us today. so, what to do about it? you have a prime minister, scott morrison, who recently claimed that there never had been slavery in australia. he defends captain cook, the british settler who you are referring to when you talk about this idea of brits landing

on the "empty land of australia" — is the leadership in your country listening to you? you now run foundations, you're involved in business empowerment for aboriginal people, but are the people in power listening? i don't know if they're listening or not. there's other issues going on in our country that they think needs more attention. you have to remember, we're 2.8% of the population here in australia, so not much time and effort is put into working with us as indigenous people. and when i mean working with us, that means listening to us, taking our advice and creating good governance and policy behind it. we have some incredible indigenous leaders now in our government parties, which is great. we need more of it. for me, i will work with government, i will help them achieve their kpis when it comes to indigenous outcomes, but i don't have time to wait for them and

indigenous people don't have time to wait for the government to get this right. so we're working with corporates here in australia who understand it and see the value of working with indigenous people, whether it's through education, employment, or through philanthropic work. there are great opportunities here through corporates in australia and they really need to be acknowledged for the work they have been able to do in helping raise indigenous people's lives in the last 20 plus years when it comes to building capability for our people. a quick final thought, adam, you called your film the australian dream. do you believe in it or is it ironic? it's up to the people who watch the documentary. i think anyone who has been to australia has a completely different view of our country than what i do, that's for sure. and that any indigenous person has. but i think any person who lives in australia

and watches this documentary might change what the australian dream means to them. we have a lot of people that have come here on boats and planes who are living the australian dream, they've escaped war, escaped great depression. they've been pushed out of their countries by other invading countries and have come to australia and have been able to, in one or two generations, been able to live a better life than when they came here. unfortunately, for aboriginal and torres strait islander people, we are still yet to reap the benefits everyone else does when it relates to the australian dream. but i am hopeful and i think when you watch the documentary, there is that sense of hope, as you hear the indigenous voices during the documentary. we are all hopeful that we all can live that australian dream that we prosper to. adam goodes, it has been a pleasure to have you on hardtalk. thank you very much indeed.

thank you, steve, appreciate it. hello. temperatures by day this week will be close to average — high teens, low 20s — but we are starting the week with overnight temperatures below average. quite chilly first thing monday morning, and the temperatures will head up because there will be a fair amount of sunshine out there. this high—pressure settles things down, then, to start the week. although toppling around the area of high—pressure will be a few showers, more especially in scotland and a few from the word go, but these are the starting temperatures, then, for monday morning,

widely in single figures. these are town, city centres. cooler than this in the countryside. so mid to low single figures in the chillier spots. but again, those temperatures are going to be heading up in the sunshine. a lot of that to come first thing. some cloud is going to build. for scotland, it's a mixture of cloud and sunshine. most of the showers will be north of the central belt. northern ireland and northern england mayjust pick up a shower later but the bulk of england and for wales, will stay dry. lion share of the sunshine through wales and southern england so this is where we will see the highest temperatures, and some spots just creeping into the low 20s. now, as for the cricket, at old trafford, it is looking like not particularly warm monday to come, for the final day. that'll be a mixture of cloud, sunshine. just a slight chance of picking up a brief passing shower. now, as we go into monday evening, any of those showers that have formed, will tend to die away. they still will continue on and off through northern parts of scotland overnight, but for most of us it is going to be another dry, clear and chilly night going into tuesday morning. but again on tuesday, there will be a lot of sunshine to start the day. now, there's a chance of catching a shower again,

more especially across parts of scotland, but the odd one may be found elsewhere in northern ireland and northern england. and the cloud may well thicken in northern ireland to bring the chance of seeing some patchy rain, especially the further north and west you are, deeper on through the day. and temperatures, a few spots getting into the low 20s in some sunny spells, but most won't get that high. now, there is a weather system coming on tuesday night and into wednesday. these weather fronts move in. they will bring a spell of rain into parts of northern ireland and scotland. and perhaps on wednesday, also reaching for time for some of us into northern england. now for thursday and friday, the chance of a shower, and then into next weekend, looks like low pressure will come back. temperatures will come down a few degrees. the breeze picks up. and we will see a spell of rain spreading east. bye— bye.

this is bbc news with the latest headlines for viewers in the uk and around the world. president trump has defended his handling of the coronavirus pandemic, incorrectly telling fox news that the us has the lowest mortality rate in the world. i heard we have one of the lowest, maybe the lowest mortality rate anywhere in the world. do you have the numbers, please? because i heard we had the best mortality rate. after a very long weekend, eu talks on a huge coronavirus recovery fund are stretching into a fourth day. the mayor of the us city of portland calls on federal troops to leave, accusing them of abusive tactics