hello, welcome to dateline at london. this week, a second wife in august might threaten more than summer august might threaten more than summer holidays. trump watchers weigh a bid to postpone november's presidential election. and the name's moore, richard moore — what does it take to lead a secret service in 2020? my guests, on socially distanced screens, political analyst eunice goes and henry chu of the los angeles times. and here in the studio, bbc newsnight‘s diplomatic editor, mark urban. welcome to you all. virus spikes, flight cancellations and a new recession low for the eurozone. it's more grim news for a continent whose leisure and tourism industries hoped to salvage a small something from august's holiday high season

after a ruinous first half to the year. that is, i think, takes us to you, what is your assessment of the worries in many european countries that were bound for a second wave? you're talking about a second wave when in reality where perhaps witnessing the continuation of the first wave and not really a second wave. in southern europe, governments are extremely worried. i think spain and france are very concerned with the recent rise in cases, and it's been quite a dramatic rise in cases. at the same time, where they are trying to manage the tourism industry, which plays a very big role in their economies in the case of spain, it's over 10% of spanish gdp, which is now suffering tremendously because britain, france, many other european countries, are imposing bans, so not

establishing air bridges with spain. that means a lot of economic worries. it is very worrying and i think the european governments, it is very challenging, because they have to manage with one hand it covid—i9 and a threat to public health, and it's a massive threat to public health, but also the impact on the economy. and we've already seen on the economy. and we've already seen that so far, covid—i9 is had a catastrophic impact on all world economies, the eurozone in particular. the european union was much bigger contraction than it was initially forecast. and we have to manage those risks, because, we can be protecting public health from covid—i9, but the public health systems will not be able to respond to the challenges if countries are suffering really serious economic depressions. turning back to this

question of summer vacations spreading a virus, it looks like thatis spreading a virus, it looks like that is a problem in the us as well? there definitely has been another surge in coronavirus infections in the us, and we have seen the death toll rising as well. it has been fuelled by a lot of the southern states in what we call the sunbelt, california, texas, arizona, florida. though i would say it is not from summer vacations though i would say it is not from summer vacations yet, really, though i would say it is not from summervacations yet, really, in many of these states, it was because of aggressive reopening is by republican governors allying themselves with president trump's code to liberate their states, and now they are bearing the fruit of that is, unfortunately, with greater rise of coronavirus caseloads and many of these states and they are having to roll back some of the lockdown easing that they had already instituted about maybe a couple of months ago. so we're seeing that they are reaping the whirlwind is in many ways.

particularly florida, where on thursday, i think you had to death toll of ten people every hour. there is some good news, which is the nationwide caseload seems to be levelling off. there is about 60,000 caseload per day, which in the us is not bad, given the population of over 350 million people. what that means is that it's masking where they coronavirus caseload is still rising in some states. it has no hopscotch from those southern, sunbelt states, to the midwest. so we have the wave of infections that really hit the east coast hard, particularly new york, that is what we saw first. then it started spreading and searching amongst the southern states and it has now moved to the midwest. so there is no room for complacency and many states are thinking about re—instituting lockdowns and many southern states, such as alabama, have reissued mask

wearing orders, which they thought they would be able to avoid up to now. and is coming to the uk, we learned this past week that what many had been saying for a while, that england had the highest number of excess deaths between february andjune in of excess deaths between february and june in europe. obviously, boris johnson has taken a firm and fast approach at the moment in terms of slowing down the easing of lockdown, but is carrying the country with him? i think what we've learned in the last 24 with these changes that borisjohnson made, there does not seem borisjohnson made, there does not seem to be any political penalty to caution in this. i think he's observed what happens in the early phases, when a lot of people believe he was too slow to lock the country down and he's also seen how diligence of our default governments in the uk, in scotland, northern

ireland and wales, by taking a more cautious approach, have reached political benefit. the fascinating thing yesterday is, when he announced he was pumping on the brake pedal, as he put it, to slow down the easing of certain restrictions and parts of north west england are now under tighter social—distancing rules again, it was interesting that essentially, the leader of the opposition, kier starmer come almost immediately came out and said, we supported this. it just didn't catch fire in the sense of any real political debates. sol think he's discovered through hard—won experience, that taking a cautious line has both public and political support. and just before we moved back to europe on a desk, about the demographic in terms of the younger, because it's a lot of focus now on young people in spain, the hashtag, don't chuck it all away, the suggestion that young people are increasingly spreading the virus with summer parties and so

on, can we tell whether that is just a temporary problem which will go away or a permanent covid fatigue? your perspective on this on some degree depends which generation you're from. some epidemiologists have been saying, naturally, when restriction started to be eased, the younger working population, say people in their 20s or late teens, we re people in their 20s or late teens, were bound to be the one to introduce themselves back into society most rapidly. a lot of other people, and the shielding category, once going to do that. but i think there is also a fairly fierce intergenerational thing are building up intergenerational thing are building up here. i was talking it through with my son some of the restrictions on our concerns about the fact that we suspect he's not keeping to all the restrictions, and he just let rip with, this is all part of the older generation are pressing us, he said to me. i think that is quite a big factor, in many societies, that young people, almost as an assertion of their own rights and joie de

vivre, whatever you want to call it, their desire to be in life and with friends and two associates, want to challenge this as an assertion of generational identity. do you see that in europe? i do see that in europe and i sympathise with mark, my teenage daughter has also suffered tremendously from the lack of socialisation, because of lockdown. we need to sympathise and understand that the lies that young people are experiencing at the moment are a far cry —— the lives that young people are experiencing areafarcry that young people are experiencing are a far cry from what young people expected to live in their past. in europe, i think we see the rising spike, in france, in spain, to a certain extent in portugal, is associated with movements of young

people. the opening of nightclubs, the socialisation in beaches, parties and so on, it will mean that there's a much higher transmission rates. and the big worry is, this will continue once schools will open and some universities will open. so it is quite a bit concerned. it do you have a sense of where this fits into the global picture? because of thisjoie de vivre into the global picture? because of this joie de vivre language applies, presumably, to young people in the developed world, in the developing world, they picture is extremely critical for young people economically as well as their pa rents economically as well as their parents and grandparents are in terms of their life chances. just in terms of their life chances. just in terms of the global picture, we've also come in the last few hours that mexico is moving into third place in the overall deaths from the virus, give us the global picture in a nutshell? the global picture is

extremely grim. we are already in the middle of the greatest economic shock of the last 100 years. europe is facing a terrible economic crisis, unemployment is at the moment almost double what it was in january. and to the situation will get worse once the state programmes to support employment will close at some stage later in this year. so the economic consequences are going to be very dire and are going to be extremely dire for the younger generations, who are especially those who are graduating from university at the moment, or moving the school at the moment, because there is nojobs. and what we know from other periods of economic recession, if you are out of the economic ladder at one critical stage in your life, it is very

difficult to get back in. so this is a generation that is really in danger of being scarred for a very long time, for pretty much all their working careers. so i think young people are feeling, what are our chances? what kind of life, what kind of world are we going to wake up kind of world are we going to wake up to once all of this is over? europe is trying to respond to this. of the european union, a couple of weeks ago, agreed epic rescue plan to help the most struggling economies, those who have been most adversely affected by covid—19, but also those whose economies are suffering by the lockdown smack, those who rely a lot on and travel industries. but will this be enough? we do not know. we have been talking a lot about a transformational change to all of our economies. we've been seeing the state changing its role in the economy in a way that hasn't been seen in over 40 yea rs.

that hasn't been seen in over 40 years. but with the changes that have been introduced be long lasting, will they result in sustainable, greener and more productive economy is? we do not know. those questions will sustain at dateline london for years to come. yourfinal thoughts at dateline london for years to come. your final thoughts on this topic? this is the challenge for the government and the terms of tailoring its messaging. the coronaviruses hit different groups of people in different ways, so they need to be targeted with messages of resonant. for young people, young men in particular who are reluctant to wear masks, they need to hear particular messages that are directed at them. thank you for that very site points. ever since 1845, american presidential elections have taken place on the tuesday after the first monday in november. that puts the 2020 vote on the 3rd of november. president trump suggests a delay due to the risk of fraud via postal ballots. but key republicans have

already dismissed the idea and a combination of virus, recession and civil unrest are making it hard for president trump to write the news headlines. henry, we surprised by how fast key republican squash this idea?|j henry, we surprised by how fast key republican squash this idea? i am always surprised when any republicans go against what trump says because many of them are afraid of alienating his fervent base and many of them are themselves up for election. i think that is part of the clue as to why some of them came out so quickly against him, because they're up for re—election have amassed more chess that they are now going through in terms of trying to campaign, —— amassed war chest. they are adverse to any further delay in the polls, and in a sense, by calling into question the american election date, which is set constitutionally, as you mentioned, that also calls into question the capability of america to have a

functioning democracy. it didn't surprise me as much as perhaps it might have on other issues for republicans to pylon. but i think we need to be clear eyed aboutjust what was motivating trump in terms of coming out with this tweet. i think he knows full well that he is, himself, as president, unable to effect such a change to the election takes. that power rests solely with congress, which right now, in the lower chamber, is controlled by democrats, so it's a complete nonstarter when it comes to an actual process of trying to change the date. however, he is also a master of political theatre and as we know now, his tweet came outjust in few minutes before the news emerged that the american economy in the second quarter had contracted by one third, which is the greatest contraction in the history of the measurement of the american economy. and also, as you mentioned in the lead up, his message was mostly about trying to cast doubt on the

validity of the male in the votes that we will see a much greater numbers in november. this was i think part of his planet to delegitimise the outcome, if it should go against him, and all the polls are showing it well. it's still early days, but guess. 20 yea rs still early days, but guess. 20 years ago, those of us who are old enough to remember, will remember hanging chance and fought in the supreme court having to decide the outcome of that presidential election. judging from what henry just said, you think there is a possibility that we are heading towards a supreme court decision again ifan towards a supreme court decision again if an attempt to delegitimise the vote is in prospect? everything i read from constitutional experts in washington, dc, and what henry said this underlines that, really, is it's quite hard for president trump to get to the area of doubt on this, because the constitution are so this, because the constitution are so clear about his lack of power to

set the election. i think it's very close election, of course, there are various scenarios in which he may attempt to cast doubt on the results. i see he has been suggesting that all the votes be counted and tallied on a single day, various ideas are now flying about. it could come to a legal intervention, but let's face it, the moment, the polls would suggest it isa fairly moment, the polls would suggest it is a fairly hefty defeat that he's heading towards, and then that lead to these interpretations about why is he doing what he's doing. is it purely the interest of the moment, as henry said, because of a terrible focus about the economy? se, some people are saying, just trying to put a brave face on the fact that he's probably going to lose in trying to come up with an expiration before the fax, or is it something darker, is he trying to provoke people, conspiracies are authors on the right, into disorder, which might provide a more intense disruption of voting? eunice, can

you talk a bit about the front runner? joe biden is still fairly quiet, but his choice of running mate is going to make a splash, what factors will he be weighing up? well, if the advisers ofjoe biden are very concerned that having someone are very concerned that having someone who will be a loyal vice president, there is over ten are potential candidates, but i think there are three main candidates. there is kamal harris, susan rice and elizabeth warren, i think they are the three leading contenders. in the debate is about what do they bring to the table, what are the important thing is forjoe biden? is its experience in foreign policy, the ability to come up with actions on russia and china, the ability to also help manage the pandemic. is it loyalty, is it whitening the electoral base of joe loyalty, is it whitening the electoral base ofjoe biden, because he's doing very well with floating

voters, although the typical centrist, democratic voter, and perhaps less well with younger and female voters, also african—american voters. so i think he's going to ponder around these kinds of issues. and i also think he is very worried up and i also think he is very worried up with having somebody with he gets along well. he had a very good working experience with president obama when he was his vice president, and i think you would like to see replicated the same type of experience. one interesting thing is, there's been in the last days, quite a big campaign amongst his donors against kamal harris on the grounds that she's not sufficiently loyal, which is a bit of a strange accusation made to a politician when they were all of them competing to be the democratic candidate to be the president, to run for the presidency. so we'll see. i think we'll know in the next few days, but

i think if he is going to value above all experience in foreign policy and the ability to widen his electoral base and, of course, someone electoral base and, of course, someone with whom he gets along well. henry, presumably president trump watching closely, because there is one thing to say that sleepyjoe there is one thing to say that sleepy joe and painting there is one thing to say that sleepyjoe and painting joe biden as ado sleepyjoe and painting joe biden as a do nothing grandpa, but he's hard at the same time to present him as extremist. but if the choice of running mate is a progressive, that becomes easier? that's right. right now, everyone's hanging on this choice, which i think will probably bea choice, which i think will probably be a woman of colour, because at the moment we're living through, certainly in the us with the black lives matter movement, but also bite on's own commitment to civil rights and the advancements of black americans. but it's still three months to go anything can happen between now and then. biden has been relatively silent, broadcasting from his basement in delaware because of

the coronavirus crisis. we can forget he has also been prone to gaffes in the past, and with the african—american man he accused of being not black enough if he didn't support him. anything can happen out of biden's mouth that we need to be prepared for. trump could also pull off what we call an october surprise, even a military intervention somewhere, the conflict with china, the confrontation with china, are certainly ramping up. so i wouldn't discount anything happening between now and november. and a wild card really is the coronavirus. if a vaccine were to be found effective between now and then, that could alsojust found effective between now and then, that could also just throw the race into completely new territory with president trump claiming victory on that. we hear you, we'll be watching closely. britain's spies have a new c — that is, a new chief of the secret intelligence service mi6. the role made famous in the james bond series goes to richard moore — libyan—born, turkish—speaking, with interests including porcelain and cricket.

we don't know whether he prefers his martini shaken or stirred, but we do know we live in dangerous times. mark, what does it take to run an intelligence service? mark, what does it take to run an intelligence service ?|j mark, what does it take to run an intelligence service? i think they've got the perfect candidate given the workings of the whitehall machine at this particular moment. sao tome had a career as an m16 officer running agents, effectively. is that normal for someone to become an intelligence officer becomes an ambassador? it's unusual, actually, but had to say, when you talk to people in the service, they now say that a period outside and most re ce ntly that a period outside and most recently as political director of the foreign office, is very much a desired characteristic of someone who's got a run that service. they wa nt who's got a run that service. they want people to be known around whitehall and in that position, he clearly was. in downing street and

all the other key customers, as they see it, for secret intelligence, they want somebody who flits easily, who is not too ingrained in the culture of secrecy and tradecraft and with step blinking onto the stage of being a chief of the service. perhaps ill—equipped to ta ke service. perhaps ill—equipped to take on all the demands. in terms of his experience and portfolio, there's no doubt when we look at what's happened in the last couple of months in the uk, that reshaping intelligence around the chinese target is going to be critical. russia, of course, we heard last week about the russia reports in the sense that perhaps the intelligence services had been complacent, that was the accusation from the intelligence and security committee at parliament. and lastly, i think he's bound to bring a book is in mediterranean region. he is steeped in turkey as a culture, he speaks turkish extremely well, he tweets in turkish extremely well, he tweets in turkish as well as english, and he was ambassador there. he will be looking to see how far president

erdogan's recent assertiveness might threaten the peace of the region. henry, i want to take up the china point with you, making china the target is all very well, but there is very difficult to get any information out of xi jinping's china, or is it easierfor some people? certainly time has its own allies. in towards pakistan or north korea were talking about come out with whom china has a very close relationship, there is intelligence sharing going on all the time between those three. there was a period directly after the 9/11 attacks where the us and china seem to be ina attacks where the us and china seem to be in a better footing when it came to intelligence sharing, the overall relationship was better, and thatis overall relationship was better, and that is what we have to remember, that is what we have to remember, that intelligence cooperation is always going to be dictated by the overall state of diplomatic relations between states. right now, as we mess the us become increasingly confrontation with china and vice versa, also britain is becoming more and more assertive

against china. the idea that they would actually be sharing intelligence, i think, would actually be sharing intelligence, ithink, is beginning to recede further and further. every state will share the intelligence that enfield suits them, that will say further their that enfield suits them, that will say furthertheiraims, china that enfield suits them, that will say further their aims, china is that enfield suits them, that will say furthertheiraims, china is no different. when it comes to matters of islamic terrorism, which they tried to paint under in xinjiang place, who are turkic speaking people, so people who the new mi6 director might have more of an income at that is a place where they might find common ground. but thing increasingly between the west and china, it is becoming more and more fraught relationship. eunice, give usa fraught relationship. eunice, give us a european's take on this, it is one thing to gather intelligence on societies like china or russia, but obviously, for chinese and russian agents inside open societies, whether the uk, europe or north america, these are much more porous and open places to gather

information, surely? europe is hardened its stance on china and russia just this week, the us issued sanctions against russia and china and north korea on cybercrime charges and other activities. and we've also seen that the hardening of sta nces we've also seen that the hardening of stances towards china since at least last year. the european commission, in its strategic review, defined china as a strategic rival. so there is a recognition that china isa so there is a recognition that china is a very important economic partner for europe but there is a great deal of awareness of the security challenges that it poses. and many european countries, france in particular, are getting increasingly impatient and angry with chinese interference and chinese activities in terms of cyber crime. data collection and so on. so we see a change of attitude. now, the way

that europe will deal with china will not be the confrontational manner of the united states, because i think all the economic stakes that are involved. but we've seen that hardening of positions. eunice, henry, mark, we have to leave it there, it has been a fascinating half hour, thanks to you for watching. that's it for dateline london for this week, we're back next week at the same time. goodbye. hello. yesterday's heat was just a one—day wonder and i'm sure many of you will be relieved that temperatures are considerably lower today, but not cold by any stretch of the imagination. yesterday topping out near 38 celsius at heathrow airport,

but it clearly wasn'tjust south—east england that had the heat, although northern ireland missed it. today's temperatures, well, 10 degrees or more lower, so cooler and fresher across the board. as this weather front has moved on through with the cooler air following on behind, we are left in a flow of air coming in from the atlantic, so it is cooler and fresher. still with a few showers tracking east as we go through the rest of the day. where you started with sunshine, some cloud increasing across eastern areas with a few showers moving on through. where you started cloudy in the west, it will be brightening up. we have some showery rain heading into northern ireland to end the afternoon and into the evening. very few showers towards east anglia and south—east england. and temperatures mainly high teens, low twenties, with a few spots reaching into the mid—20s in east anglia and southeast england. of course, a big weekend of sport. for the fa cup final this afternoon, i'm sure the players will appreciate something considerably cooler compared with yesterday — just topping out at 24 degrees with just a slight chance of a shower. into this evening, we have some outbreaks of rain in northern ireland, pushing in across northern england

and scotland as the night goes on. north wales seeing a bit of that too. south wales, southern england staying mainly dry with clear spells. overnight temperatures between ten and 14 degrees. after the heat of last night, that is easier for sleeping. a north/south split for tomorrow. northern england and scotland starting mostly cloudy, some patchy rain around. a lot of that will clear east during the day as it brightens up behind it. so after a bright start, some heavier showers moving into northern ireland. for the rest of england and wales, may catch a shower, most places won't. again, those temperatures mainly into the high teens and low twenties. of course, it's race day tomorrow for the british grand prix. just a very slight chance of catching a shower here. otherwise, it is looking like a dry day at silverstone. now let's take a look at the big picture. into next week, monday is mainly dry. tuesday, low pressure moving in, so a spell of rain for many of us. one or two showers on monday. on tuesday, it will be windier. there will be some rain around. temperatures for many of us just in the teens,

but after we start the week like that, with that chance of seeing some rain, it looks much warmer by the end of the week.

this is bbc news with the latest headlines for viewers in the uk and around the world. beauty salons, bowling alleys and wedding venues in england are facing at least another fortnight of closure following the government's plan to pause the easing of restrictions. one of the uk government's scientific advisers has suggested that england may have to consider closing pubs in order to re—open schools next month. the death toll from the coronavirus outbreak in mexico has overtaken the uk's. it's now the third highest in the world. companies in the uk whose staff have been receiving up to 80% of their salary through the government's furlough scheme will have to start paying some contributions from today. us president donald trump has announced he will be banning