the democratic presidential candidate, joe biden, has choosen senator kamala harris as his running mate for november's us election. the former prosecutor and california attorney general is the first black woman on a major presidential ticket in american history. they will take on donald trump and mike pence in three months‘ time. ceremonies have been held in the lebanese capital, beirut to mark the moment a week ago when the city was hit by a devastating blast. there was also a minutes‘ silence in the port area. many groups held pictures of those who died in the disaster. the main opposition leader in belarus has fled the country after disputing the re—election of president alexander lu kashenko in last sunday's poll. nationwide protests have continued against a result widely regarded to have been tainted. the police have blocked off city centres and thousands of opposition supporters have been detained.

it is 4:30am in the morning. now on bbc news, hardtalk. welcome to hard talk, i'm stephen sackur. after the unimaginable horror of the beirut blast, the people of lebanon are now living with a zombie government, dead but still in place. my guest today is the minister of economy and trade, raoul nehme. he has resigned but he is still in office until new ministers take over. the outgoing prime minister says the catastrophic situation is the result of endemic corruption. so is lebanon a country now beyond rescue?

minister raoul nehme in beirut, welcome to hard talk. thank you, thank you. your country is going through an unparalleled crisis. and i have to ask you, a very simple question, does lebanon have a government today oi’ lebanon have a government today or not? lebanon has a caretaker government, which means that the council of ministers cannot meet and take any decisions. there are very few exceptions, basically if there is an emergency, and if take, and they need to take some decisions that yes we can do it. each minister on his own can take only basic decisions, administrative decisions, and not spend money and not engage the government in the long—term and so on. it is really only a ca reta ker and so on. it is really only a caretaker government. if i may say so, minister, this is a zombie government. technically

alive but in every real sense, dad. yes, practically, it is almost a zombie. i wouldn't say zombie but almost because we can still do a lot of things. to have even this critical situation. for example, this morning i was at a program at the tripoli port to see how we can use that port and bring assistance to bring green, all types of grain and cattle feed and animal feed and types of grain and cattle feed and animalfeed and wait as well using the tripoli port. —— grain. yesterday i was examining the beirut port to do the same. the great news is that beirut port container terminal will practically be fully operational within a few days. if the crisis in your country so days. if the crisis in your country so severe, days. if the crisis in your country so severe, notjust days. if the crisis in your country so severe, not just all of the impacts of the terrible explosion but also the covid—i9 pandemic putting an enormous strain on your healthcare

system, the un saying that 50% of your population may very soon be going hungry with 75% reliant on aids, in that context with every hour, so urgent, why did you and all of your colleagues in government choose to resign and walk away? 0k, choose to resign and walk away? ok, let's be clear that a few things. number one, even before this last in beirut, the world bank estimates were that we we re bank estimates were that we were around 50% poverty level and that by the end of the year we would reach 60% poverty level. of course, this blast is going to worsen the situation and covid—i9, with this blast again, people have priorities to ta ke again, people have priorities to take care of their houses and their windows and so on. as you say, we have around 6000 wounded and at this point in

time, we are around 160 people dead. what it really resigned, because we found out and confirmed and were absolutely convinced that practically, we we re convinced that practically, we were not able any more to operate and operate correctly. in fact, i can give you an example as far as i'm concerned, in any case, i would have resigned because without the imf, we cannot get out of the imf, we cannot get out of the mess we are in. and imf is requesting a number of things. they are questing a consensus between politicians that we don't have. they are requesting capital control and we have been working on it for months now. and it didn't go through, the other parties has been blocking it. and so on and so for. but i want to stick with this notion on what on earth is going on at the top of politics in your country. the prime minister announcing his resignation talked about the

disaster being the result of chronic corruption, corruption he said is greater than it the state. did you agree with him? this blast is really more than just corruption, it is criminal, it is a criminal act. these products have been in the port since 2014, in fact, 2013 they were on the boat and then 2014 they were brought into the warehouse. these very dangerous products. also, the managers of the port that are now under house arrest, as well as the ministers of that time were aware of it and they didn't do anything about it. and this is really a criminal thing. and this is precisely... yes, yes oui’ this is precisely... yes, yes our country is plagued by corruption. it is played by corruption. it is played by corruption. but minister, this issue gets to the heart of the question of accountability. i noticed you were piling the blame on governments before

yours because you and your collea g u es yours because you and your colleagues formed your government in january 2020. colleagues formed your government injanuary 2020. you are only responsible for the last eight months but already we're seeing news reports, for example from reuters, saying that security officials in want your prime minister, hassan diab, and the president only last month in july diab, and the president only last month injuly that diab, and the president only last month in july that these 2700 tons of ammonium nitrate we re 2700 tons of ammonium nitrate were being stored dangerously in the port and could destroy the capital if there was a fire and an explosion. so your government to is culpable. number one, if anyone in our government is culpable as you say, we need full transparency. the letter you are referring to brought up by reuters you are referring to, is not very correct unfortunately. this letter contains two sentences. the first sentence is please be

aware that people are not paying their dues. of course, this is the most important. and a second sentence this is the most important. and a second sentence says there is a second sentence says there is a boat in the port that contains nitrate ammonia which isa contains nitrate ammonia which is a very dangerous and explosive product. it was the second sentence, it was in a boat, not in a warehouse. so it was really imprecise. and in one of the letters that i have, it arrived to the minister of transport and public works on the fourth of august, sent on the fourth of august, sent on the 27th ofjuly, and arrived at his office on the fourth of august just before at his office on the fourth of augustjust before the blast. i don't have a copy of the letter sent to the president by the understand is exactly the same letter sent at the same time. soi letter sent at the same time. so i don't think that between the 27th ofjuly and the fifth of august, a lot of things could have been done. but the investigation going on, and i

think this is very important frankly, whoever is guilty, however it is, whoever, whoever, of this thing has to be punished. crosstalk but the point is the lebanese people wa nt to point is the lebanese people want to know that the investigation is truly independent. they want international observers and participants inside the investigation. president michel aoun has already rejected that. are you, as minister of economy and trade, saying to your people that you believe there should be an international element to this investigation and that everybody, however close to power, who should be held to account, will be held to account? i say that and i have said is repeatedly in the council of ministers. but you have to know that there is already, there are already specialists, internationals nationalists on the ground assisting in the investigation

—— specialists. some people have some reservations about is to have an international court like the wind that has been going on since 2006, after the assassination of president hariri. that is cost millions of dollars and we're still waiting for the verdict. we have to know as lebanese, i am one of the lebanese people, we need to know what happened. we need to know what happened. we need to know if yes or no was anything else other than that nitrate ammonium in the warehouse. people are saying that it warehouse. people are saying thatitis warehouse. people are saying that it is a blast coming from a missile from israel. we need to know if that is true or not. 0ther to know if that is true or not. other people are saying it contained weapons were hezbollah. we need to know whether that is right or not. whatever happens, we need to know and whatever means we need to have in order to know what

happens and what was in that warehouse, we need to know it. so isn't their time at this moment of deepest crisis in lebanon to be honest about the com plete lebanon to be honest about the complete dysfunction of your system. is it not the truth that those names we are now familiar with in lebanon, like the leader of hezbollah, michel aoun the leader of one christian sect, one of the sunnia leaders and the due leader. these guys with their fiefdom and their clients are the real power in lebanon, not ministers like yourself. isn't that the truth? this is part of the reason why we resigned because we are a government of technocrats and we were supposed to make decisions that we re supposed to make decisions that were technocratic and will not be able to do it. so you are powerless ? be able to do it. so you are powerless? we had laws, every time we have something important, we were hitting walls. i will give you an

example, again, on the capital control. capital control was a lwa ys control. capital control was always prevented by the minister of finance and then removed from the agenda by the same minister of finance at the request of his party. so basically, yes, these political system in lebanon has to change entirely and in order to change entirely, we need to change this type of accord. the accord is very bad for the country. we need to entirely change the political system. the way it is working... it cannot be fixed, it has to change. crosstalk people will not be familiar with the accord but that was the 1990 agreement which obviously brought the sectarian civil war to an end and gave common patronage powers to the leaders i have just common patronage powers to the leaders i havejust mentioned. how on earth is lebanon going to move away from that system when there are so many vested interests who make a great deal

of money from maintaining the system ? of money from maintaining the system? by the reforms that we have to do, for example with banking secrecy. i was asking you —— you are asking me about all these politicians. i have to say that this politician or that politician is corrupt without having proved. in order to have proof, we have to have a waiver of banking secrecy in lebanon and outside of lebanon because if any politician is getting kickbacks or so on, he is not necessarily going to get them in lebanon. waving the banking secrecy is the first thing to do in order to know who stole the money of the people in lebanon. and this is what we're trying to do. let me stop you crosstalk only people on the street now by doing what is necessary but not in violence, not in violence. in 2005, we got the syrians out without shedding blood stop

millions of lebanese went into the streets and the syrian army went out of lebanon. so this is the solution. minister, there is proof, for example, i'm sure you know him well, the director—general who resigned of the public finances a few weeks ago who said that he knew that bankers had smuggled six billion dollars or more out of lebanon since october, getting around the capital flight controls that were imposed. if he knows that, you presumably know it too because used to be a banker. i was a banker at that time but what is very u nfortu nate that time but what is very unfortunate is that there was no capital control. so the lord didn't forbid anyone to tra nsfer didn't forbid anyone to transfer money outside stop so anyone could transfer money outside. it was a self—control where the banks were left out of the blue trying to manage

the liquidators they had outside of lebanon. 0k, he says, this is the number and i don't have precise numbers personally but i can tell you what is unfortunate is that if we did have capital control, this would not have happened. there will be lebanese people watching this you're saying, here we go, another government minister who is blaming others rather than taking responsibility himself. in the spirit of asking you a direct question. i take full responsibility. i was still full responsibility for everything i did. in the spirit of transparency and full disclosure, you say you want much tighter financial controls, the people have taken money out of lebanon, billions of dollars. let me ask you is a former banker, part of the financial system you are supporting yourself, how much money have you taken out of lebanon? we have taken out a lot of money outside of lebanon because in september, not october, in september at the end of september and these

statistics are available in the public, banks had outside of lebanon $9.8 billion. public, banks had outside of lebanon $9.8 billionlj public, banks had outside of lebanon $9.8 billion. i am talking about yourself and your family. crosstalk i'm arriving to it, you have to have a full picture. $9.9 billion outside of lebanon over $9.8 billion so the net amount of money that the net amount of money that the banking system had outside of lebanon was $150 million dollars. so basically the whole banking system in lebanon didn't have money what was due outside of lebanon. and we did pay our dues, we have to pay our dues. we have commitments with our international. but answer my direct question, you and your family, but answer my direct question, you and yourfamily, how much money have you taken out of lebanon? me? zero. zero? in

fa ct, lebanon? me? zero. zero? in fact, no, around $27,000. so you say you have not cast discussions on others. but we know for example the waste management system has been run by cronies of the political elite and they have taken millions and millions of dollars out of that system for themselves, the same goes for electricity. the bank i was in, we did not transfer any money for any politician. but you know the people taking money out of the rubbish, garbage, waste management system. you know people who have made millions and millions of dollars out of the energy sector and it's so dysfunctional in your country, why won't you name names?” cannot name names if i am not sure. whenever i am sure of a name, i will give it to you. the imf wants to work with lebanon. they know that lebanon

‘s public finances are com pletely ‘s public finances are completely collapsing. you defaulted on loans in march i believe, you have $90 billion of state debts which simply are unplayable in the current circumstances but the imf says it does not see any real commitment to structural fundamental reform. when is it going to come? have to come and it has to come very quickly. let me tell you again my part. my let me tell you again my part. my part, i have to do a number of things as minister of the economy for the imf. number one, i have two music competition law. the competition law. the competition law. the competition law i'm working on it with the world bank and it is about two weeks have been completed and i will still, as a caretaker, i continue preparing and putting on the desk for the next minister. i have to do consumer protection law, it is completed and i wa nted law, it is completed and i

wanted to send it to the next council and minister, it is on my desk and unfortunately now i cannot do it anymore and i will give it to the next minister. i am working on the intellectual property law conventions that we have to sign in order to protect intellectual property. 0ne protect intellectual property. one of them is already at the council of ministers and on the agenda and another three are being printed to be put on the desk to go to the council of ministers. minister, u nfortu nately, ministers. minister, unfortunately, hang on. . .. u nfortu nately, unfortunately, hang on. . .. unfortunately, when these are approved to go to parliament they will not be accepted because for example, in the competition law, i want to remove the exclusive agencies and the same people in the parliament have friends and have exclusive agencies representatives for products and someone so it will not be easy for them to vote these

laws quite that is an understatement because you have explained to me that you have a zombie government, the council of ministers cannot properly function. and beyond that, you have no sign that a new government is coming down the track. there is no sign of a leader capable of moving beyond the current, utterly dysfunctional corrupt system and pushing through fundamental reform. where is that new leader? in fact, i have to agree with what you say. i do not see that leader because it looks like what i am hearing, we willjust get the same back andi we willjust get the same back and i don't know what will happen. we are a caretaker government. i hope we will not be for a very long time a ca reta ker be for a very long time a caretaker government because the government needs a real government to move on and resolve the crisis. if not, it is really catastrophic. we cannot wait indefinitely. we do not have enough resources, and the means to continue importing

goods. we need to have a government yesterday before tomorrow and we need the government to do the reforms. this is why even during the ca reta ker, this is why even during the caretaker, i'm still working on preparing whatever reforms need to be done by my ministry in order to get them ready to be sent to the council of ministers, to the next minister coming on board. let me end, minister, if i may, giving you some bleak words by a man is to do yourjob, i'm sure you know him and he said that we have a corrupt political class and subservient policymakers and cronies are generated unprecedented misery, economic meltdown, the endemic corruption, negligence and competence — at incompetence have delivered the horses of the apocalypse upon lebanon. is that the way you see it? is lebanon headed towards apocalypse? for 30 years, the

governments have mismanaged everything, the resources of lebanon, the budget, the balance of payment, the economy, and so balance of payment, the economy, and so on balance of payment, the economy, and so on and this is what has taken us to where we are is an frankly, with 90 billion debt and the loss in the range of 85 billion and now probably more after what happened, i don't think this is called good management. any companies that would have been in that situation, i think, the shareholders would put the managers in prison. yes, what he is saying is correct and i'm sure that we will not have the same coming back, the same coming back but it looks like we will have a government again with the same people, doing the same thing. could talking of apocalypse, could lebanon fall apart because we know... . yes, yes! president emmanuel macron has been clear and the

international community has been clear. yes, lebanon can collapse. if we do not do what we have to do, which is, you know, i remember when i started banking in 2002, i started getting into the finance of the country and before that i was a businessman in lebanon and in the us and then in france. we ask for a view billions of dollars and got commitments, and we got the dollars and did not do the commitments. and then more leaders came and then they said this time, we will do it, and then they said they would do the reform and get the money and then that did not happen and now they are saying i have to get the imf and if you do not, you do not get $1. this is the right approach to resolve the issues in lebanon. we have to get imf and we have to get it quickly. we have lost already a lot of time. and if

you do not, it could be the end of your country? economically, yes. socially, it would be catastrophic, people will go into hunger and so yes, we have to have it, and we have to have it very quickly. people, politicians have to understand that. they have two stop thinking the way they are thinking the way they are thinking before, acting the way they were acting before. again, if our government is responsible, if i am responsible, if i am responsible, we have to be taken to court and judged. minister, raoul nehme, thank you very much indeed for joining me from beirut. thank you.

hello. there is quite a mix of weather on offer across the british isles just at the moment. the headlines are being made by the heat but, at times, some low cloud is running in to some of the coastal areas, making it a great deal cooler and then, when all that heat really powers on through, we get that possibility of some thunderstorms and that is the mix that will take many of us through wednesday. there is heat to be had widely across western europe at the moment. the moisture being fed around this low out of biscay, up towards the british isles, where we start wednesday on another really humid note. widely across the british isles temperatures in the teens if not the low 20s. the bulk of the morning thunderstorms to be found across the north—eastern quarter of scotland. these gradually drifting towards shetland by evening, and then leaving behind just the chance of one or two thunderstorms dotted around, but generally they will begin to gang up across parts of wales, the midlands, and central, southern england as we get on through the afternoon, where again the temperatures widely will exceed 30 celsius.

although, underneath the cloud and murk, around about some of the coast, you could be closer to 17—19, something of that order. through the evening and overnight, those showers just getting a little bit further north and a little bit further out towards the west, and the murk becoming ever more extensive across parts of northern and eastern scotland, and into the eastern side of the pennines, and again where it's going to be a very close—night again. widely temperatures into the teens to the low 20s. thursday gets off to a pretty grey start. the cloud more extensive than we have seen it of late but a really close—feeling day, and it is that mixture of heat and humidity again that will spark those thunderstorms widely across the southern half of britain. always that fraction fresher and perhaps drier too further towards the north. though if the sunshine pops out here, again, you will be off into the 20s. as you move towards friday, i think we're going to see again the low pressure very much the dominant feature. and always that risk of those torrential downpours affecting central and southern parts of the british isles. further north, again,

the onshore breeze is dragging some low—level cloud into the eastern side of scotland. most of the best of the sunshine for northern ireland and across western scotland. although those temperatures look as though they are dropping awayjust a touch, i think you will still feel pretty close and it is going to take quite a while before we get something a good dealfresher moving in from the atlantic to affect all parts of the british isles.

this is bbc news. i'm samantha simmonds with the latest headlines for viewers in the uk and around the world. making history — the black senator kamala harris is chosen as the running mate for the us democratic presidential candidate, joe biden. they'll take on donald trump in three months‘ time. his campaign team has already weighed in, saying americans will resoundingly reject the pair at the ballot box. protests over the disputed presidential election in belarus continue as the main opposition leader flees the country after challenging the result. new zealand's largest city goes back into lockdown after auckland records its first new coronavirus cases in 102 days.