us democrats have introduced a resolution to impeach president trump, with a single charge of "incitement of insurrection", for his role in capitol hill attack last week. the speaker, nancy pelosi, said mr pence should respond to their demand within twenty—four hours. the head of the national guard is authorized to deploy up to fifteen thousand troops in washington, to bolster security forjoe biden‘s inauguration on january the twentieth. the fbi says that armed protests are being planned. uk officials have vowed to vaccinate their "way out" of the coronavirus pandemic. they plan to jab tens of millions of people by the spring and the whole adult population by autumn. a huge search operation in indonesia is attempting to recover the black box flight recorders from the boeing 737 aircraft that plunged into the sea on saturday. it's hoped the recorders will identify the cause of the crash.

now on bbc news. hardtalk welcome to hardtalk i am stephen. the coronavirus is a durable and evolving enemy. nowhere is the more evident than in south africa, the ha rd est than in south africa, the hardest hit nation in africa, now grappling with a highly transmissible new strain of covid—i9 that is causing international concern. my guest is barry, chair of the south african government and advisory committee on covid—i9 vaccines. what does south africa's covid—i9 crisis mean for the world wide effort to in the pandemic? world wide effort to end the pandemic?

professor barry schoub in johannesburg, welcome to hardtalk. good afternoon, stephen sackur. how bleak is the covid—i9 picture in your country of south africa right now? it is bleak, we are well into our second wave, which is really manifesting quite more seriously than our first wave. we are averaging about 18 to 20,000 new cases per day. the highest peak in ourfirst 20,000 new cases per day. the highest peak in our first wave was 14,000. so, it gives you some idea that we are on a steep upward trajectory and so it is very worrying and weird

moving to our province, which johannesburg is situated and it is probably going to expand and it isa is probably going to expand and it is a worry. the language that we use about this pandemic and right now, it is in south africa and out of control? you know, we try to control it and we do not have a vaccine control, but we do have other infection prevention controls and that could, to some extent and that could, to some extent and a significant extent, control it. certainly, it is expanding, but can be controlled, it can be mediated yes. you in south africa have a new strain of coronavirus of various seemed described as variant one mutation it for k, i'm no expert but whatever you call it, it is clearly highly

transmissible, not necessarily in itself more dangerous to any animal that has it, but definitely more transmissible. is that why south africa is in the middle of this crisis? steve, the answer, it is a combination. it is human behaviour because certainly human behaviour triggered the second wave and we have a super spreading event in the country of stu d e nts spreading event in the country of students going on musical festivals. that's prohibited in the triggered it. in the variant which is just a is considerably more infectious is also contributing to it. i think it is a combination of both. i think one of the big problems that now in a second wave, people are tired of this infection prevention measures in the first wave, people were not able to because there were not able to because there were not aware. but with the second wave, u nfortu nately not aware. but with the second wave, unfortunately people are not totally, not significantly even sticking to what they

should be sticking too. so that toa should be sticking too. so that to a large extent describing it and also help it along. the president said that we have let oui’ president said that we have let our guard down and in late december, new national restrictions which some are calling it a de facto lockdown and it is an odd one because it is very draconian. you have a night—time curfew which lasts up night—time curfew which lasts up to nine in the evening till six the following morning which few other countries actually have a full on curfew and in other ways, it is not draconian at all because of until early evening, he could still get a meal ina evening, he could still get a meal in a restaurant indoors and you could still gather outside venues, has south africa got this wrong? no, i do not think so. i think the problem is balancing keeping the economy going and the economy is not in great shape, to put it mildly and to impose

restrictions which would affect the economy i think would be very harmful to the country. so, ithink very harmful to the country. so, i think the government is faced with the problem. you saying that more important to keep the restaurant industry alive than it is to keep thousands of people alive were going to die of covid—19 because they are going to catch it in restaurants in the mid afternoon and early evening? that is of a trick question, stephen. i think you had that is of a trick question, stephen. ithink you had it, one how many people would get infected in the restaurant, i do not think there will be a significant number. i think it's the major gatherings i think the suspension scientifically very recently the publications of sean this is that gatherings of the festival types really, restau ra nts festival types really, restaurants do have strict rules about who was coming into the restaurant, taking your mask off while you're eating but avoiding the mixing and the waiters were masks, the hand sanitisers. the precautions are

in place to try to limit the spread. on the other hand, the depths, and our country, if you have draconian measures, it does affect other health issues. if there is a shutdown, people stay at home, it is shown quite clearly in numbers that other health problems, hiv therapy, all of these things to suffer. you do have to balance with the restrictions and the cost of the restrictions economic and health costs versus from a public health point of view in terms of covid—19 spread. juggling act isa covid—19 spread. juggling act is a fine act and it is based on the science. very often it does sound to some extent contradictory and may be to some extent, has been lampooned, but i think it has been more or less worked out. keep the economy and other health sectors, make them ok,

and the curfew, for example is and the curfew, for example is a limited damage to the economy. but it does limit, for example, alcohol drinking. alcohol is bad as well, trauma which can overload the hospital system, etc. in brief, the president is clearly on the cusp of extending the lockdown restrictions, at least another month, but there is a bit? about whether it's going to make them tougher. as you're leading virologist. you think they should be tough right now? i think we're in a very precarious position and its expanding rapidly as mentioned earlier and certain restrictions do need to be tightened, some need to be prolonged and i don't think

personally that we need to go into a hard lockdown. i think a heart lockdown is a weird locked on five and damaging to the economy and health issues. something that really puzzles me, across the continent of africa, most countries are giving us readouts of official stats on coronavirus, which says the been hit much less ha rd says the been hit much less hard than for example the united states and most of western europe, and get the most prosperous country in the entire continent and with the best health care infrastructures and the most modern and sophisticated economy in africa is the country where coronavirus has impacted hardest and the many ways, counterintuitive, what is it that has led south africa,

toa it that has led south africa, to a european—style experience with coronavirus and the rest of africa, thank god, has appeared to escaped more rightly. everything else is a combination of factors. very highly urbanised country, and industrialised country and that goes with the spread of coronavirus. because that facilitates people coming together in environments that facilitates the spread of a virus. and for europe, particularly in your country, the united kingdom, much more so than in south africa because that kind of industrialised environment does promote the spread of the virus and is obviously a much more industrialised country than any of our neighbouring countries and that is the one factor, the second factor is immunisation. a lot of these countries are largely rural in these rural environments or people were much more spread out in an outdoor environment and also decreasing the spread of the

virus. many are tropical countries and a lot of outdoors and so on and decreases and possibly a very significant extent is the degree of reporting. the significant amount of underreporting of cases and under reporting of mortality to the countries in the north of us. we have a pretty good reporting system, certainly much better than our neighbouring countries. the also have deep inequalities in south africa. one extraordinary statistic in the cities hit ha rd est by statistic in the cities hit hardest by covid—19, the recently 59 people on ventilators and hospitals. 57 of the 79 were an expensive private hospitals and only two in public hospitals. if you are poorin in public hospitals. if you are poor in south africa today and you get covid—19, your chances of being hit very badly and of

dying are way higher. are they not? you are right, that is one of the problems. one of the things we do have to improve on and that you mentioned, particularly deprived part of country and i don't think that will apply as much in johannesburg or cape town. i do not think that is quite as, you are not think that is quite as, you a re fortu nately not think that is quite as, you are fortunately picking the worst example, but you are correct. there is that of quality and data quality needs to be addressed as quickly as possible. does south africa need to be isolated from the rest of africa. we know the people are still flowing across the bridge border with zimbabwe, which can ill afford the kind of infection rate that south africa has today and one can argue many other

neighbouring countries too. should south africa be cut off from the rest of the african continent? you know, but the problem with that expression, cut off doesn't really work, u nfortu nately. cut off doesn't really work, unfortunately. it has been tried with other infectious diseases. these infections are going to go across the borders no matter what precautions you put in. but having said that, there are precautions in place and all the land border crossings so those across from south africa to zimbabwe, and neighbouring countries, they do have to have a covid—19 tests that are negative and only if there are negative for the allowed across the border. this causes problems. big pawn shops and traffic stops, but it has beenin and traffic stops, but it has been in place for a while, still. the question of vaccines rolling out the vaccines which is very mature domain is a virologist and also as a guy who is sharing the advisory committee telling the

government how to handle its vaccine strategy. there are many critics in your country who think that the government has already botched this. i only have 1 has already botched this. i only have1 million has already botched this. i only have 1 million vials of vaccine that are due to be in south africa through this month and half a million coming in february. for a country of having 60 million plus, this is disastrous. i think disastrous isa disastrous. i think disastrous is a bit of an exaggeration, with all due respect. at the end of this month, half a billion coming at the end of next month. the highest priority for the health care workers. there is extensive negotiations going on with manufacturers to have a vaccine roll—out and the department of health and the minister of health is confident that we will be immunising the entire two thirds of the population

and what we need to get to forgetting herd immunity. we need 67%, and two thirds of the population to get the herd immunity and that's around 40 million of the adult population and he's pretty confident that we're going to get to that. you talk about immunising people to get to some sort of collective immunity that 80 million doses of vaccine, because everyone needs to doses, you're telling me that you've only got on order one and a half million doses you're telling me that this is not disastrous ) doses you're telling me that this is not disastrous) on it sounds terrible. some of the most eminent scientists in africa slammed the vaccine situation saying that it beggars belief that south africa, against all reasonable expectations finds itself in the group of porous most vulnerable countries dependent on the international programme

for access to vaccines and yet when africa are not a poor country. that is an u nfortu nate, country. that is an unfortunate, i do not want to use to stronger term, i do not wa nt to use to stronger term, i do not want to use the term eminent science. i think they are interfering with the truth as well. but what is wrong with their analysis in the face of africa is very much a middle income country that has massive resources in yet, it is as vulnerable right now to the lack of supply of vaccines and the poorest countries earth?” can explain if you let me. i think the one half million is what is on its way and the vaccine which unfortunately, the nondisclosure agreement which will assure the country ofa which will assure the country

of a vaccine for the entire year. that is negotiation that is taking place in the minister as mentioned that our eminent collea g u es as mentioned that our eminent colleagues ignored that and they might have another agenda which is causing them to go on a rampage, literally a rampage to criticise and it is interesting, if you look at the covid—19 epidemic. it has three consequences. conspiracy theories, miracle drugs, such as vaccine and also the blame game and unfortunately the blame game is taking up by the scientists and it's unfortunate because it is undermining trust. in the government and authorities get out the fiction control procedures and social distancing and it is undermining the trust of these

reports going on. i read your article with great care and when you say other people are playing the blame game, sounds like you're playing the blame game too. you're blaming people ran certain trials, certain vaccines because those people should have made sure when they agreed to the trial work that day god supplies the vaccines after the trial. so you are blaming other people, not to suffer that and you're also blaming the rich countries of the world and you say that they have been indulging in what you call, a vaccine grab, covering up call, a vaccine grab, covering up most of the available vaccines coming out of the pharmaceutical companies. on both counts, you are the blame game or. i tell you why am blaming. iam game or. i tell you why am blaming. i am blaming the system. i am blaming the system because vaccine should be treated not as other commodities, vaccines need to

be taken out of the market economy because vaccines are different to other commodities andi different to other commodities and i think that is the crux of the problem. because when profit drives the purchase of vaccines, this is the casualty andi vaccines, this is the casualty and i think it is unfortunate because it's not just and i think it is unfortunate because it's notjust a social responsibility, its responsibility, its responsibility for when you have a pandemic that the entire world in low income countries and middle income countries in high income countries, get access to vaccines, you cannot deny it, stephen. the worlds population have pre—bought 51% of the productions. the worlds richest, the riches have brought up a lot of the vaccine was available. exactly. it's not only social responsibilities, it's actually sensibility. because pandemics

do not recognise porters, they spread across borders. and if you have a country or region, evenif you have a country or region, even if your country is protected by vaccines, it can never be protected like that. this high income countries, thatis this high income countries, that is one problem. the other problem, the second problem is the virological problem. if the viruses circulating in one part of the world, that is where it's going to pick up these mutations, which is going to threaten the rest the world.” totally understand the point that you're making, the interconnectedness of it all in the nature of the system that you want to see, but coming back to this one point, you the quy back to this one point, you the guy who was the chief adviser to your government of vaccines. yours is not a poor government. was it not your national duty asa was it not your national duty as a south african to tell the government that they should be buying up substantial amounts of vaccine months and months ago when the uk government was

doing to, the uk government, the us government was doing it. and you chose not to do it and these eminent or not eminent scientists have accused you of being asleep at the wheel. no, but the reason for that is, let me correct you. we are not a wealthy country, we are a middle income country. we have severe economic woes. it is very easy to go now and retrospectively look at these factors. but at the time, we are putting down 2.4 billion rent, south african renn, which is the substantial amount of money, nonrefundable deposit during the vaccine trials which we did not know if they would work or not. the high income countries could afford to do that because if it did not pan out for their registration authorities, that money, that deposit would not affect the economy in the same way. our

adviser did recommend, and this is published on our website to negotiate the bilateral negotiations and for whatever reason, the treasury of the department of the government, cannot afford a 2.4 billion rent and deposit at risk. very clear, it was about money and i get that message loud and clear. the uk, which as you pointed out, had a bigger covid—19 crisis in south africa right now. the uk has decided to ensure the maximum collective safety of the community is going to roll out the vaccine by prioritising first doses and not giving the second dose after three weeks, but using more of the available dosage forfirst dose but using more of the available dosage for first dose use and extending the period until the second dose as well as 12 weeks. we'll south africa do that as well to offer

protection to as many people as possible and as quickly as possible? we may do that, it's got pros and cons. the of course you've got a period of vulnerability, a two week period of vulnerability and so we need to evaluate how the vaccine is going to roll out. it is visible, it will be very advantageous as you mentioned. it is being rolled down the united kingdom and so we may well do that. we have to look at the population and how the vaccine is reaching out to particular parts the population and make that evaluation at a later stage stop by final question is people really want to clear answer to. the financial mutation. is it going to be more resistant to the vaccines that we currently have or not? basic terms, should we be deeply worried about the south african variation?”

be deeply worried about the south african variation? i was waiting for that question. this is an intensely researched thing, worldwide, we're looking at the variant, the brazilian variant, additional mutations to the united kingdom variant. at this stage, at this stage, it is looking good. but i must say it is preliminary. preliminarily evidence suggests that the vaccine will be effective and it is still being intensively researched. truly, you do not know. you're being optimistic with me but you do not know yet whether you're variant of covid—19 might be much more resistant to the international vaccines. it may not be resistant, but the jury is still out because the research is not been completed. barry schoub, we have to leave it there. thank you so very much forjoining me on hardtalk. thank you very much,

stephen sackur. hello there. we've got a battle of the air masses taking place across the uk during this week. on monday, it was pretty mild, breezy for most, but today, it is brighter and sunny but colder. for many of us, that is away from the far southwest which will remain quite wetand mild. that plume of cold air has been moving southwards overnight and into tuesday it will be across most of the country away from the southwest corner and where this weather front here will continue to bring outbreaks of rain. it is a cold bright icy start across much of scotland, northern england through the morning.

we will see wintry showers affecting northeastern scotland, perhaps some north sea coasts being blown in on a cold wind. south wales, southwest england stays rather dry, cloudy outbreaks of rain but mild here as you can see temperatures in double figures, much more northern ireland, scotland, for most of england and wales to the north east, it will be bright and much chillier as temperatures in the low single digits. as we head through tuesday night, a cold one across eastern areas, perhaps frost around, rain west continue to slowly work its way eastwards. it could be heavy in places, bumps in the cold air and likely to see some sleet and snow on its leading edge, quite a contrast in temperatures to start wednesday from east to west. a bit of a complicated story going on across the middle part of the week, real battle of the air masses, the wedge of milder air with outbreaks of rain will be slowly pushing east and bumping into the cold air to the east of the uk. a bit of a headache to where the sleet and snow will be falling. but it could be very across central and western areas with low flooding place in as air, sleet and sleet

and snow and particularly across the high ground of central eastern scotland and eastern england as well and the far north staying dry again in a real temperature contrast from west to east. through wednesday evening and overnight, we could see some disruption from the snow across central, eastern and northern scotland and eastern england, but further west, it'll be mainly heavy rain. we have to stay tuned to the forecast because of still some uncertainty with it. as we move out of thursday and into friday, that weather front fizzles away as the pressure builds in, but we see a return to the blue colours, it will be turning colder. so that rain slowly fizzles out on thursday and also some wintry in eastern areas, mild in the south and drier and brighter and cooler on friday.

this is bbc news. i'm mike embley. with the latest headlines for viewers in the uk and around the world. democrats in the us congress move forward with impeachment plans against president trump. the message is clear — he must be held accountable. securing the capital and stabilising a nation — the fbi warns that armed protests are planned for washington and state capitals around the us. uk officials vow to vaccinate their way out of the coronavirus pandemic. they plan to jab tens of millions of people by the spring. and struggles with a stammer: how the president—elect overcame his, and the challenges this poses for millions of sufferers.