this is bbc world news, the headlines. a declassified us intelligence report says saudi arabia's crown prince, mohammed bin salman, approved the murder of the exiled journalist jamal khashoggi in istanbul in 2018. the saudis say those responsible acted independently, and have been punished. police in nigeria have begun a search operation after gunmen abducted more than 300 girls from a boarding school. a study of health care workers in england suggests that a single dose of the pfizer covid vaccine does appear to slow the spread of the virus. it also seems to prevent people who get infected from becoming seriously ill. the uk's supreme court has ruled that shamima begum,

a woman who left to join the islamic state group in syria when she was a teenager, does not have the right to return to fight against being stripped of her british citizenship. at ten o'clock. .. we will be here with a full round up of the days news. first it's the media show — a spat between the australian government and facebook resulted in the silicon valley giant blocking every news organisation from their platform in australia. but what does this display of might from facebook mean for other countries preparing to take on big tech? plus the boss of new station boom radio on whether niche, age—based services are the future of radio. hello. down with this obsession with youth. how about we obsess over

older people instead? baby boomers, for instance. after all, there in the habit of actually watching and listening to linear tally in radio. and some of them even have money to spend after watching or listening to adverts. so goes the thinking behind a new radio station. no, not a digital platform available by smart devices, this is a real, actual radio station on dab. it's called boom radio, it's aimed at boomers and it's founderjoins us live. meanwhile, last week there has been a massive beef between australia's government and facebook. leading to the social media giant blocking every news organisation from their platfrom in australia. but what does this display of mite from facebook mean for other countries readying themselves to regulate big tech, including britain? that's all in today's media show. let me introduce you to our guests. david lloyd is the brains behind

boom radio he's also a presenter on the stage and and is been in an executive in the commercials sector for years. executive in the commercials sector foryears. david i executive in the commercials sector for years. david i should say congratulations for getting a radio station off the ground in a pandemic how did you manage to do it? just cra . we how did you manage to do it? just crazy- we are _ how did you manage to do it? jut crazy. we are running on a handful of people and were sitting in the heart of the radio station for. this is where my sock drawer used to be. without presenters in their attics and bedrooms. we've done it here we've got this new radio station on air serving people who are over 60. you are in your bedroom right now the beating heart of boom. yes. my husbands three _ the beating heart of boom. yes. my husbands three rooms _ the beating heart of boom. yes. my husbands three rooms away - the beating heart of boom. yes. my husbands three rooms away cables l husbands three rooms away cables dangling over this is running. haw dangling over this is running. how bi is a dangling over this is running. how big is a station _ dangling over this is running. how big is a station you've got off the ground in a pandemic was back in terms of audience, in terms of the number of people you've got working on a? we number of people you've got working ona?~ ,, ., number of people you've got working on? ,.,,,_ ., ' on a? we probably got about 15 presenters _ on a? we probably got about 15 presenters working _ on a? we probably got about 15 presenters working from - on a? we probably got about 15 presenters working from their l on a? we probably got about 15 i presenters working from their own homes. itjust been great because some of these presenters were still

doing some work. 0thers weren't. 70, 80—year—olds probably at their finest as authentic communicators. but actually weren't doing any work. there was one we are trying to get sorted out, we installed the kid hadn't had a computer in the house was up we got the set up, they did the dry run and i rang them to say that was grateful that they burst into tears and said you don't know how much that means to us. this story is notjust a story about how much that means to us. this story is not just a story about the listeners. it's a story of us, a group of near pensioners getting together and doing the sort of great marigold hotel and say come on, we can have our own radio station, surely. can have our own radio station, surel . ., i. can have our own radio station, surel . ., _, ,, g, surely. good on you. quite an achievement. _ surely. good on you. quite an achievement. congratulationsj surely. good on you. quite an i achievement. congratulations on getting it off the ground. that that exhalation wasjulian reynolds. a legendary figure in the world of radio and with good reason for that she spent seven years as the radio critic at the guardian put up a mere 42 years at the daily telegraph and not so long ago approached by the sunday times. what have you been

listening to this week? j sunday times. what have you been listening to this week?— listening to this week? i been listenin: listening to this week? i been listening to — listening to this week? i been listening to an _ listening to this week? i been listening to an awful - listening to this week? i been listening to an awful lot - listening to this week? i been listening to an awful lot of. listening to this week? i been i listening to an awful lot of music radio_ listening to an awful lot of music radio because david didn't like what i wrote _ radio because david didn't like what i wrote about his radio station. so i wrote about his radio station. so i thought— i wrote about his radio station. so i thought i— i wrote about his radio station. so i thought i will be fair to him, i will lune — i thought i will be fair to him, i will tune around. i tuned around. i listen _ will tune around. i tuned around. i listen to— will tune around. i tuned around. i listen to an — will tune around. i tuned around. i listen to an awful lot of music radio— listen to an awful lot of music radio this _ listen to an awful lot of music radio this week and i'm still pondering it. but i want to congratulate david for having got himself— congratulate david for having got himself onto the dab. because i couldn't— himself onto the dab. because i couldn't hear you on any of the dab radio— couldn't hear you on any of the dab radio sets — couldn't hear you on any of the dab radio sets i— couldn't hear you on any of the dab radio sets. i have them all around my house. — radio sets. i have them all around my house, my flat. i could only get you on— my house, my flat. i could only get you on my— my house, my flat. i could only get you on my oldest tuner. and today up you on my oldest tuner. and today up you came _ you on my oldest tuner. and today up you came on — you on my oldest tuner. and today up you came on the radio dial.— you came on the radio dial. great. we've been _ you came on the radio dial. great. we've been there _ you came on the radio dial. great. we've been there all _ you came on the radio dial. great. we've been there all the - you came on the radio dial. great. we've been there all the time. - you came on the radio dial. great. we've been there all the time. noj we've been there all the time. no ou we've been there all the time. no you haven't. ithink we've been there all the time. no you haven't. i think you we've been there all the time. no you haven't. ithink you must we've been there all the time. no you haven't. i think you must of rushed — you haven't. i think you must of rushed out— you haven't. i think you must of rushed out and paid the rent. if you cu s are rushed out and paid the rent. if you guys are going _ rushed out and paid the rent. if you guys are going to — rushed out and paid the rent. if you guys are going to have _ rushed out and paid the rent. if you guys are going to have an _ rushed out and paid the rent. jt gm. guys are going to have an argument saveit guys are going to have an argument save it for about seven or eight minutes from now for that will get to talk about facebook in australia and will come back to your good nature story it later. people around the world have watched on in astonishment as facebook has blocked

all news pages in australia, briefly from last thursday until tuesday of this week. facebook users in australia couldn't use her view pages on the sensorimotor harrow, the guardian or any other news organisation. that banner blackout has now been reversed after a deal was reached. 0ur has now been reversed after a deal was reached. our regular contributor with tycho borg but is based here in london for. good to see you again. could you just explain the contact please for this rather complicated story for top what is it that facebook and the australian government were arguing about? the australian government has been trying _ australian government has been trying to— australian government has been trying to introduce _ australian government has been trying to introduce a _ australian government has been trying to introduce a code. - australian government has been trying to introduce a code. it's. trying to introduce a code. it's basically— trying to introduce a code. it's basically legislation— trying to introduce a code. it's basically legislation that - trying to introduce a code. it's basically legislation that is - trying to introduce a code. it's. basically legislation that is gone for the — basically legislation that is gone for the parliament, _ basically legislation that is gone forthe parliament, it's- basically legislation that is gone for the parliament, it's going. basically legislation that is gone for the parliament, it's going to| basically legislation that is gone i for the parliament, it's going to be rubber—stamped _ for the parliament, it's going to be rubber—stamped tomorrow- for the parliament, it's going to be i rubber—stamped tomorrow morning. what this— rubber—stamped tomorrow morning. what this code — rubber—stamped tomorrow morning. what this code would _ rubber—stamped tomorrow morning. what this code would have _ rubber—stamped tomorrow morning. what this code would have done - rubber—stamped tomorrow morning. what this code would have done is l what this code would have done is allow— what this code would have done is allow the — what this code would have done is allow the australia _ what this code would have done is allow the australia government. what this code would have done is allow the australia government to| allow the australia government to designate — allow the australia government to designate a — allow the australia government to designate a tech _ allow the australia government to designate a tech company. - allow the australia government to designate a tech company. we - allow the australia government to| designate a tech company. we are only talking — designate a tech company. we are only talking to _ designate a tech company. we are only talking to companies - designate a tech company. we are only talking to companies air- designate a tech company. we are| only talking to companies air force google. _ only talking to companies air force google, facebook. _ only talking to companies air force google, facebook. what _ only talking to companies air force google, facebook. what that - only talking to companies air force google, facebook. what that code | google, facebook. what that code would _ google, facebook. what that code would have — google, facebook. what that code would have allowed _ google, facebook. what that code would have allowed the _ google, facebook. what that code would have allowed the australian| would have allowed the australian government —

would have allowed the australian government to _ would have allowed the australian government to do _ would have allowed the australian government to do is _ would have allowed the australian government to do is force - would have allowed the australian government to do is force those . government to do is force those companies _ government to do is force those companies into— government to do is force those companies into negotiation- government to do is force those companies into negotiation with government to do is force those - companies into negotiation with the established — companies into negotiation with the established media _ companies into negotiation with the established media companies. - companies into negotiation with the established media companies. for. established media companies. for example. — established media companies. for example. my— established media companies. for example, my masthead _ established media companies. for example, my masthead is - established media companies. for example, my masthead is ownedl established media companies. for. example, my masthead is owned by a television _ example, my masthead is owned by a television channel— example, my masthead is owned by a television channel nine. _ example, my masthead is owned by a television channel nine. 0ne - example, my masthead is owned by a television channel nine. one of- example, my masthead is owned by a television channel nine. one of the i television channel nine. one of the bil television channel nine. one of the big players— television channel nine. one of the big players in— television channel nine. one of the big players in the _ television channel nine. one of the big players in the australian - television channel nine. one of the big players in the australian media| big players in the australian media landscape — big players in the australian media landscape is— big players in the australian media landscape is rupert— big players in the australian media landscape is rupert murdoch - big players in the australian media i landscape is rupert murdoch snooze core _ landscape is rupert murdoch snooze core at _ landscape is rupert murdoch snooze core at first — landscape is rupert murdoch snooze core. at first google _ landscape is rupert murdoch snooze core. at first google and _ landscape is rupert murdoch snooze core. at first google and facebook l core. at first google and facebook both threatened _ core. at first google and facebook both threatened to _ core. at first google and facebook both threatened to —— _ core. at first google and facebook both threatened to —— news - core. at first google and facebook both threatened to —— news core. i both threatened to —— news core. rather— both threatened to —— news core. rather than— both threatened to —— news core. rather than preach _ both threatened to —— news core. rather than preach what - both threatened to —— news core. rather than preach what they. both threatened to —— news core. | rather than preach what they said was their— rather than preach what they said was their business _ rather than preach what they said was their business model- rather than preach what they said was their business model and - rather than preach what they said was their business model and the | was their business model and the open _ was their business model and the open internet _ was their business model and the open internet. google _ was their business model and the open internet. google eventually| open internet. google eventually came _ open internet. google eventually came to — open internet. google eventually came to the _ open internet. google eventually came to the table _ open internet. google eventually came to the table and _ open internet. google eventually came to the table and struck - open internet. google eventually. came to the table and struck some one-on-one — came to the table and struck some one—on—one deals— came to the table and struck some one—on—one deals with _ came to the table and struck some one—on—one deals with my- came to the table and struck some . one—on—one deals with my company, with new— one—on—one deals with my company, with new score — one—on—one deals with my company, with new score and _ one—on—one deals with my company, with new score and seven _ one—on—one deals with my company, with new score and seven west - one—on—one deals with my company, with new score and seven west our. with new score and seven west our arrival~ _ with new score and seven west our arrival~ and — with new score and seven west our arrival. and facebook— with new score and seven west our arrival. and facebook was - with new score and seven west our arrival. and facebook was playing. arrival. and facebook was playing footsie _ arrival. and facebook was playing footsie with — arrival. and facebook was playing footsie with the _ arrival. and facebook was playing footsie with the companies. - arrival. and facebook was playing footsie with the companies. it - arrival. and facebook was playingl footsie with the companies. it was negotiating — footsie with the companies. it was negotiating all _ footsie with the companies. it was negotiating all the _ footsie with the companies. it was negotiating all the time _ footsie with the companies. it was negotiating all the time up - footsie with the companies. it was negotiating all the time up to - footsie with the companies. it was negotiating all the time up to the| negotiating all the time up to the minute — negotiating all the time up to the minute where _ negotiating all the time up to the minute. where it _ negotiating all the time up to the minute. where it said _ negotiating all the time up to the minute. where it said no, - negotiating all the time up to the minute. where it said no, we're. minute. where it said no, we're going— minute. where it said no, we're going to— minute. where it said no, we're going to pull— minute. where it said no, we're going to pull out _ minute. where it said no, we're going to pull out of _ minute. where it said no, we're going to pull out of australia. . minute. where it said no, we'rei going to pull out of australia. as of this— going to pull out of australia. as of this morning _ going to pull out of australia. as of this morning i— going to pull out of australia. as of this morning i still— going to pull out of australia. as of this morning i still can- going to pull out of australia. as of this morning i still can post i going to pull out of australia. as| of this morning i still can post on my facebook— of this morning i still can post on my facebook page _ of this morning i still can post on my facebook page and _ of this morning i still can post on my facebook page and eat - of this morning i still can post on my facebook page and eat newsl of this morning i still can post on - my facebook page and eat news links was up _ my facebook page and eat news links was up so _ my facebook page and eat news links was up so facebook— my facebook page and eat news links was up so facebook i _ my facebook page and eat news links was up so facebook i come _ my facebook page and eat news links was up so facebook i come back- my facebook page and eat news links was up so facebook i come back to i was up so facebook i come back to the government— was up so facebook i come back to the government and _ was up so facebook i come back to the government and said _ was up so facebook i come back to the government and said if- was up so facebook i come back to the government and said if you - was up so facebook i come back to l the government and said if you make some _ the government and said if you make some minor— the government and said if you make some minor changes— the government and said if you make some minor changes to _ the government and said if you make some minor changes to this - the government and said if you make some minor changes to this code - some minor changes to this code which _ some minor changes to this code which is — some minor changes to this code which is basically— some minor changes to this code which is basically more _ some minor changes to this code |

which is basically more mediation time _ which is basically more mediation time then— which is basically more mediation time then we _ which is basically more mediation time then we will— which is basically more mediation time then we will restore - which is basically more mediation time then we will restore news i time then we will restore news pages — time then we will restore news pages and _ time then we will restore news pages and so _ time then we will restore news pages. and so that _ time then we will restore news pages. and so that is- time then we will restore news pages. and so that is the - time then we will restore news - pages. and so that is the situation at play— pages. and so that is the situation at play now — pages. and so that is the situation at play now i_ pages. and so that is the situation at play now. i should _ pages. and so that is the situation at play now. i should just - pages. and so that is the situation at play now. i should just trust - at play now. i should just trust that _ at play now. i should just trust that under— at play now. i should just trust that under this _ at play now. i should just trust that under this code, - at play now. i should just trust that under this code, if- at play now. i should just trust that under this code, if the - at play now. i should just trustl that under this code, if the tech companies _ that under this code, if the tech companies don't _ that under this code, if the tech companies don't negotiate - that under this code, if the tech companies don't negotiate their that under this code, if the tech - companies don't negotiate their own deals with _ companies don't negotiate their own deals with the — companies don't negotiate their own deals with the media _ companies don't negotiate their own deals with the media companies - companies don't negotiate their own deals with the media companies it . deals with the media companies it would _ deals with the media companies it would go — deals with the media companies it would go to— deals with the media companies it would go to arbitration. _ deals with the media companies it would go to arbitration. so - deals with the media companies it would go to arbitration. so the - deals with the media companies it. would go to arbitration. so the tech companies — would go to arbitration. so the tech companies will _ would go to arbitration. so the tech companies will be _ would go to arbitration. so the tech companies will be forced _ would go to arbitration. so the tech companies will be forced to - would go to arbitration. so the tech companies will be forced to it - would go to arbitration. so the tech companies will be forced to it not . companies will be forced to it not 'ust companies will be forced to it not just pay— companies will be forced to it not just pay sums _ companies will be forced to it not just pay sums of— companies will be forced to it not just pay sums of money, - companies will be forced to it not just pay sums of money, the - companies will be forced to it not i just pay sums of money, the actual song _ just pay sums of money, the actual song would — just pay sums of money, the actual song would be _ just pay sums of money, the actual song would be specified _ just pay sums of money, the actual song would be specified by- just pay sums of money, the actual song would be specified by an- song would be specified by an independent _ song would be specified by an independent arbiter. - song would be specified by an independent arbiter. so - song would be specified by an independent arbiter. so this l song would be specified by an| independent arbiter. so this is song would be specified by an- independent arbiter. so this is huge interventionist— independent arbiter. so this is huge interventionist policy. _ independent arbiter. so this is huge interventionist policy. and - independent arbiter. so this is huge interventionist policy. and it - independent arbiter. so this is huge interventionist policy. and it is - interventionist policy. and it is basically— interventionist policy. and it is basically tryihg _ interventionist policy. and it is basically trying to _ interventionist policy. and it is basically trying to address - interventionist policy. and it is basically trying to address the | basically trying to address the monopoly that _ basically trying to address the monopoly that google - basically trying to address the monopoly that google and - basically trying to address the - monopoly that google and facebook have had _ monopoly that google and facebook have had over— monopoly that google and facebook have had over advertising _ monopoly that google and facebook have had over advertising revenue. julian. _ have had over advertising revenue. julian. did — have had over advertising revenue. julian. did i— have had over advertising revenue. julian. did hust— have had over advertising revenue. julian, did ijust hear— have had over advertising revenue. julian, did ijust hear you _ have had over advertising revenue. julian, did ijust hear you exhale i julian, did ijust hear you exhale briefly over at the thought of what she is saying. j’m briefly over at the thought of what she is saying-— she is saying. i'm very impressed because it's _ she is saying. i'm very impressed because it's about _ she is saying. i'm very impressed because it's about time _ she is saying. i'm very impressed because it's about time someone | she is saying. i'm very impressed - because it's about time someone took them on _ because it's about time someone took them on. monopolies in any markets are not— them on. monopolies in any markets are not a _ them on. monopolies in any markets are not a good thing. it�*s are not a good thing. it's interesting _ are not a good thing. it's interesting you _ are not a good thing. jt�*s interesting you should say that because as you can imagine this incredible news blackout on facebook is being very closely watched by politicians and regulators around the world. in the uk the people that take our monopolies the regulator most likely to do so is the

competition and markets authority. and economists originally from parma in italy is its chief executive. and on tuesday i asked him what his reaction was to facebook pulling the plug on news from australia. j plug on news from australia. i thought it was a symptom of a number of the problems that myself and others think that they are. in the sense that you cannot read monopoly like power to feel confident that you can take the approach. first of all, it's important to bear in mind this is a democratically elected parliament. following due process and trying to introduce specific legislation. so it feels to me the barfor legislation. so it feels to me the bar for a legislation. so it feels to me the barfor a company legislation. so it feels to me the bar for a company to legislation. so it feels to me the barfor a company to decide legislation. so it feels to me the bar for a company to decide to go against the democratic elected parliament in this way is pretty high. and certainly i would be worried if something that this happened in the uk. secondly i think you need to feel pretty confident that your customers cannot have

anywhere else to go. in a sense, that was backlash in australia can assume a number of people feel very strongly about it. the reality is there are systems today and facebook and instagram that is such it's very difficult to people individually to switch away. because all of your friends and family are there. and unilaterally it it's very difficult to see, i'm so unhappy about this particular action that i'm going to take a stand and do something different. for me it's a signal that it's even more urgent, what we are saying that we need to deal with this economic power. because in many ways i think this is now also indicative of the degree of comfort a powerful tech platform send people traffic they also donate to charitable.— traffic they also donate to charitable. ~ ., , ., charitable. would be from the competition — charitable. would be from the competition point _ charitable. would be from the competition point of- charitable. would be from the competition point of view - charitable. would be from the competition point of view if i competition point of view if technologies paid publishers much more? . �* .

technologies paid publishers much more? . �*, ., , ., more? yeah. it's not 'ust a competition * more? yeah. it's notjust a competition argument - more? yeah. it's notjust a competition argument was| more? yeah. it's notjust a - competition argument was obviously there is much more aboutjournalism, democracy i think some of the things we all witnessed the last 12 months. i have given us pause for thought. i think a number of governments and parliaments in major democracies are struggling with this question. which is that the business model for high quality independentjournalism has been struggling for a number of years and this has worsened in recent years. a number of people argue that they are getting power of the platforms is extremely strong against publishers, creating a number of distortions. i personally am in favour number of distortions. i personally am infavour of number of distortions. i personally am in favour of mechanisms that try to think about what is the right balance. it's complicated. i think the australian approach is a sensible one which is try to force the companies into proper commercial negotiations with the backstop of possible intervention by regulators.

that's when way of doing it. as you probably know, the french are also dealing in a different way they used in the copyright directive. i think a number of people are struggling with the same problem trying to come up with the same problem trying to come up with different solutions. in my view it's very much that the platforms need to be part of the discussion. and this type of approach this is clearly not helpful. and certainly symptomatic of why there are problems. just helpful. and certainly symptomatic of why there are problems.- of why there are problems. just to be really clear _ of why there are problems. just to be really clear because _ of why there are problems. just to be really clear because this - of why there are problems. just to be really clear because this is - be really clear because this is complex for most people don't spend every day think about these issues and don't necessarily follow it. you say the australian approach is sensible. can you explain what is it about the australian approach that you think is sensible. jt’s about the australian approach that you think is sensible.— you think is sensible. it's trying basically to _ you think is sensible. it's trying basically to create _ you think is sensible. it's trying basically to create a _ you think is sensible. it's trying basically to create a backstop i you think is sensible. it's trying | basically to create a backstop of mediation and arbitration. if the commercial negotiations fail. it's very much trying to convince the platforms and the publishers to try to find a win—win agreement. where there is a fair exchange of money

for what is exchange within the two but with a backstop that one of the two sides is unreasonable in the way they approach the problem, ultimately an arbitrator will decide against them. 50 ultimately an arbitrator will decide against them-— ultimately an arbitrator will decide against them. so he said facebook ”uttin out against them. so he said facebook putting out in _ against them. so he said facebook putting out in a _ against them. so he said facebook putting out in a way _ against them. so he said facebook putting out in a way it _ against them. so he said facebook putting out in a way it did - against them. so he said facebook putting out in a way it did and - against them. so he said facebook putting out in a way it did and its i putting out in a way it did and its behaviour was sorta symptomatic of its monopoly power. the chair of the select committee told the bbc he thought the facebook move was bullying. he said pulling the plug overnight represents the worst type of corporate culture. what overnight represents the worst type of corporate culture.— of corporate culture. what do you make of that? _ of corporate culture. what do you make of that? obviously, - of corporate culture. what do you make of that? obviously, there i of corporate culture. what do you i make of that? obviously, there are lots of commercial negotiations where people threaten to pull content. for instance in the us, as you know historically there have been disputes between content providers and cable operators. and there were blackout periods or at some point they couldn't agree and the content provider said well, that's it, i'm not going to give you my content for the next month. so this happens in terms of commercial

negotiation. i think the problem here is that this is in the context of parliament trying to deal with the problem for democracy and for society. in the approach that facebook decided to take was very much a commercial approach but in many ways against a democratic elected parliament. which is personally what i find problematic. well, that was a rather outspoken head of the competition and market authority. you can hear a much longer version of that pretty newsy interview in the media show podcasts for the applicant the bbc sound apps for the applicant the bbc sound apps for that. andrea because shelley suggests that facebook holds a monopoly position in the ecosystem. i seen a graph of the referrals that publishers were getting for social media after facebooks blackout. publishers were getting for social media afterfacebooks blackout. and they drop off a cliff. how reliant are australia's news organisations on facebook? where does the power actually like? j on facebook? where does the power actually like?— actually like? i know it my publication _ actually like? i know it my publication we _

actually like? i know it my publication we made - actually like? i know it my publication we made a - actually like? i know it my - publication we made a concerted effort _ publication we made a concerted effort a — publication we made a concerted effort a couple _ publication we made a concerted effort a couple years _ publication we made a concerted effort a couple years ago - publication we made a concerted effort a couple years ago when i effort a couple years ago when facebook _ effort a couple years ago when facebook announced _ effort a couple years ago when facebook announced at - effort a couple years ago when facebook announced at the - effort a couple years ago when - facebook announced at the cambridge analytic— facebook announced at the cambridge analytic scandal — facebook announced at the cambridge analytic scandal that— facebook announced at the cambridge analytic scandal that was _ facebook announced at the cambridge analytic scandal that was changing - analytic scandal that was changing its newsfeeds _ analytic scandal that was changing its newsfeeds away— analytic scandal that was changing its newsfeeds away from - analytic scandal that was changing its newsfeeds away from articles i analytic scandal that was changing. its newsfeeds away from articles and adds them _ its newsfeeds away from articles and adds them back— its newsfeeds away from articles and adds them back to _ its newsfeeds away from articles and adds them back to the _ its newsfeeds away from articles and adds them back to the original - adds them back to the original intent — adds them back to the original intent of— adds them back to the original intent of facebook. _ adds them back to the original intent of facebook. which - adds them back to the original intent of facebook. which wasj adds them back to the original - intent of facebook. which was people and their— intent of facebook. which was people and their friends— intent of facebook. which was people and their friends post _ intent of facebook. which was people and their friends post was _ intent of facebook. which was people and their friends post was up - intent of facebook. which was people and their friends post was up now- and their friends post was up now our traffic— and their friends post was up now our traffic fell— and their friends post was up now our traffic fell of— and their friends post was up now our traffic fell of the _ and their friends post was up now our traffic fell of the cliff - and their friends post was up now our traffic fell of the cliff then. i our traffic fell of the cliff then. so we — our traffic fell of the cliff then. so we made _ our traffic fell of the cliff then. so we made a _ our traffic fell of the cliff then. so we made a concerted - our traffic fell of the cliff then. so we made a concerted effortj our traffic fell of the cliff then. i so we made a concerted effort at that point— so we made a concerted effort at that point in— so we made a concerted effort at that point in time _ so we made a concerted effort at that point in time and _ so we made a concerted effort at that point in time and it - so we made a concerted effort at that point in time and it was - so we made a concerted effort at that point in time and it was part| that point in time and it was part of our— that point in time and it was part of our overall— that point in time and it was part of our overall editorial _ that point in time and it was part of our overall editorial strategy i of our overall editorial strategy anyway — of our overall editorial strategy anyway which _ of our overall editorial strategy anyway which was _ of our overall editorial strategy anyway which was that - of our overall editorial strategy anyway which was that actually| of our overall editorial strategy - anyway which was that actually what we want _ anyway which was that actually what we want our — anyway which was that actually what we want our subscribers. _ anyway which was that actually what we want our subscribers. because . we want our subscribers. because subscribers — we want our subscribers. because subscribers are _ we want our subscribers. because subscribers are loyal. _ we want our subscribers. because subscribers are loyal. they- subscribers are loyal. they appreciate _ subscribers are loyal. they appreciate our— subscribers are loyal. they appreciate ourjournalism,| subscribers are loyal. they- appreciate ourjournalism, they appreciate our journalism, they support— appreciate our journalism, they support our— appreciate ourjournalism, they support ourjournalism, - appreciate ourjournalism, they support ourjournalism, they i appreciate ourjournalism, theyl support ourjournalism, they are very— support ourjournalism, they are very engaged _ support ourjournalism, they are very engaged we _ support ourjournalism, they are very engaged. we have - support ourjournalism, they are very engaged. we have a - support ourjournalism, they are very engaged. we have a reallyl very engaged. we have a really engaged — very engaged. we have a really engaged readership. _ very engaged. we have a really engaged readership. and - very engaged. we have a really engaged readership. and that i very engaged. we have a really- engaged readership. and that model has served _ engaged readership. and that model has served us— engaged readership. and that model has served us very _ engaged readership. and that model has served us very well. _ engaged readership. and that model has served us very well. not - engaged readership. and that model has served us very well. not just - engaged readership. and that model has served us very well. not just to. has served us very well. not just to extend _ has served us very well. not just to extend this— has served us very well. not just to extend this battle _ has served us very well. not just to extend this battle but _ has served us very well. not just to extend this battle but also - has served us very well. not just to extend this battle but also in - has served us very well. not just to extend this battle but also in the i extend this battle but also in the pandemic — extend this battle but also in the pandemic so— extend this battle but also in the pandemic. so subscriber- extend this battle but also in the pandemic. so subscriber model. extend this battle but also in the i pandemic. so subscriber model and a focus _ pandemic. so subscriber model and a focus for— pandemic. so subscriber model and a focus for us _ pandemic. so subscriber model and a focus for us has _ pandemic. so subscriber model and a focus for us has been _ pandemic. so subscriber model and a focus for us has been a _ pandemic. so subscriber model and a focus for us has been a very- pandemic. so subscriber model and a focus for us has been a very good i focus for us has been a very good transition — focus for us has been a very good transition we _ focus for us has been a very good transition. we are _ focus for us has been a very good transition. we are quite - focus for us has been a very good transition. we are quite happy. focus for us has been a very good transition. we are quite happy to| transition. we are quite happy to see what— transition. we are quite happy to see what it's _ transition. we are quite happy to see what it's like _ transition. we are quite happy to see what it's like out _ transition. we are quite happy to see what it's like out there - transition. we are quite happy to see what it's like out there if- transition. we are quite happy to see what it's like out there if you don't _ see what it's like out there if you don't have — see what it's like out there if you don't have facebook. _ see what it's like out there if you don't have facebook. 50 - see what it's like out there if you don't have facebook.— see what it's like out there if you don't have facebook. so having a business model— don't have facebook. so having a business model based _ don't have facebook. so having a business model based on - don't have facebook. so having a business model based on lots i don't have facebook. so having a business model based on lots of|

business model based on lots of referrals from facebook because mark zuckerberg could turn off the tap anytime you like. what has the public made of this in australia? what side are they on? it's a bit mixed — what side are they on? it's a bit mixed this— what side are they on? it's a bit mixed. this legislation - what side are they on? it's a bit mixed. this legislation is - mixed. this legislation is bipartisan _ mixed. this legislation is bipartisan supported. i mixed. this legislation is i bipartisan supported. there is thought— bipartisan supported. there is thought for— bipartisan supported. there is thought for the _ bipartisan supported. there is thought for the left _ bipartisan supported. there is thought for the left and - bipartisan supported. there is thought for the left and rightl bipartisan supported. there is. thought for the left and right for this code — thought for the left and right for this code in _ thought for the left and right for this code. in terms _ thought for the left and right for this code. in terms of— thought for the left and right for this code. in terms of the - thought for the left and right for this code. in terms of the publicj this code. in terms of the public it's really— this code. in terms of the public it's really interesting. _ this code. in terms of the public it's really interesting. there i this code. in terms of the public it's really interesting. there are| this code. in terms of the public. it's really interesting. there are a lot of— it's really interesting. there are a lot of people _ it's really interesting. there are a lot of people when _ it's really interesting. there are a lot of people when this _ it's really interesting. there are a lot of people when this blackout i lot of people when this blackout first occurrence _ lot of people when this blackout first occurrence and _ lot of people when this blackout first occurrence and while, i lot of people when this blackout i first occurrence and while, facebook is a better— first occurrence and while, facebook is a better experience _ first occurrence and while, facebook is a better experience was _ first occurrence and while, facebook is a better experience was i'm - first occurrence and while, facebook is a better experience was i'm not. is a better experience was i'm not sociality. — is a better experience was i'm not sociality. not— is a better experience was i'm not sociality, not from _ is a better experience was i'm not sociality, not from people - is a better experience was i'm not sociality, not from people who i is a better experience was i'm not. sociality, not from people who have clearly _ sociality, not from people who have clearly read — sociality, not from people who have clearly read the _ sociality, not from people who have clearly read the article _ sociality, not from people who have clearly read the article they- sociality, not from people who have clearly read the article they are i clearly read the article they are commenting _ clearly read the article they are commenting on. _ clearly read the article they are commenting on. it— clearly read the article they are commenting on. it than - clearly read the article they are commenting on. it than othersl clearly read the article they are i commenting on. it than others who were _ commenting on. it than others who were desperate _ commenting on. it than others who were desperate for— commenting on. it than others who were desperate for the _ commenting on. it than others who were desperate for the news- were desperate for the news engagement— were desperate for the news engagement that _ were desperate for the news engagement that they- were desperate for the news. engagement that they sought. were desperate for the news- engagement that they sought. finally facebook— engagement that they sought. finally facebook made — engagement that they sought. finally facebook made a _ engagement that they sought. finally facebook made a huge _ engagement that they sought. finally facebook made a huge binder. - engagement that they sought. finally i facebook made a huge binder. because it didn't _ facebook made a huge binder. because it didn't just _ facebook made a huge binder. because it didn't just turned _ facebook made a huge binder. because it didn't just turned off _ facebook made a huge binder. because it didn't just turned off news _ facebook made a huge binder. because it didn't just turned off news page - it didn'tjust turned off news page are turned — it didn'tjust turned off news page are turned off _ it didn'tjust turned off news page are turned off mps, _ it didn'tjust turned off news page are turned off mps, public- it didn'tjust turned off news page are turned off mps, public healthl are turned off mps, public health authorities— are turned off mps, public health authorities pages, _ are turned off mps, public health authorities pages, it _ are turned off mps, public health authorities pages, it turned i are turned off mps, public health authorities pages, it turned out i authorities pages, it turned out charities — authorities pages, it turned out charities so— authorities pages, it turned out charities. so it— authorities pages, it turned out charities. so it really, - authorities pages, it turned out charities. so it really, really- authorities pages, it turned out. charities. so it really, really over trees _ charities. so it really, really over trees and — charities. so it really, really over trees and it _ charities. so it really, really over trees. and it looked _ charities. so it really, really over trees. and it looked to— charities. so it really, really over trees. and it looked to the - charities. so it really, really over trees. and it looked to the rest. charities. so it really, really overi trees. and it looked to the rest of the world — trees. and it looked to the rest of the world and _ trees. and it looked to the rest of the world and to _ trees. and it looked to the rest of the world and to australians i trees. and it looked to the rest of the world and to australians thatl trees. and it looked to the rest ofi the world and to australians that a bil the world and to australians that a big company— the world and to australians that a big company and _ the world and to australians that a big company and silicon _ the world and to australians that a big company and silicon valley- the world and to australians that a| big company and silicon valley was bullying _ big company and silicon valley was bullying little — big company and silicon valley was bullying little old _ big company and silicon valley was bullying little old australia. - big company and silicon valley was bullying little old australia. whichl bullying little old australia. which is just _ bullying little old australia. which is just trying — bullying little old australia. which is just trying to _ bullying little old australia. which is just trying to make _ bullying little old australia. which is just trying to make and - bullying little old australia. which isjust trying to make and even. bullying little old australia. which. isjust trying to make and even kind

of go _ isjust trying to make and even kind of go of— isjust trying to make and even kind of go of supporting _ isjust trying to make and even kind of go of supporting journalism. i of go of supporting journalism. little _ of go of supporting journalism. little old — of go of supporting journalism. little old australia. _ of go of supporting journalism. little old australia. the - of go of supporting journalism. little old australia. the first i of go of supporting journalism. i little old australia. the first time australians ever been called little. this story is developing fast because former deputy prime minister and britain facebooks vice president of global affairs said in a blog today and i quote, facebook would have been forced to pay potentially unlimited amount of money to multi national media conglomerates without even so much as a guarantee that it is used to pay forjournalism let alone support smaller publishers. what does this episode, i mentioned in that episode what does this episode reveal about the power of rupert murdoch in australia today? this is a concern. although this is ordered _ this is a concern. although this is ordered across _ this is a concern. although this is ordered across the _ this is a concern. although this is ordered across the parliament i this is a concern. although this is. ordered across the parliament there has been _ ordered across the parliament there has been a — ordered across the parliament there has been a ventilation _ ordered across the parliament there has been a ventilation that - ordered across the parliament there has been a ventilation that this i ordered across the parliament there has been a ventilation that this is i has been a ventilation that this is 'ust has been a ventilation that this is just a _ has been a ventilation that this is just a stop — has been a ventilation that this is just a stop to— has been a ventilation that this is just a stop to rupert _ has been a ventilation that this is just a stop to rupert murdoch. i has been a ventilation that this is i just a stop to rupert murdoch. this is a conservative _ just a stop to rupert murdoch. this is a conservative government - just a stop to rupert murdoch. this is a conservative government that i just a stop to rupert murdoch. thisi is a conservative government that is putting _ is a conservative government that is putting this — is a conservative government that is putting this legislation _ is a conservative government that is putting this legislation through. i putting this legislation through. and the — putting this legislation through. and the critics _ putting this legislation through. and the critics of _ putting this legislation through. and the critics of that _ putting this legislation through. and the critics of that to - putting this legislation through. and the critics of that to say - putting this legislation through. | and the critics of that to say this is basically— and the critics of that to say this is basically to— and the critics of that to say this is basically to tech _ and the critics of that to say this is basically to tech giants - and the critics of that to say this is basically to tech giants who i is basically to tech giants who disrupted _ is basically to tech giants who disrupted the _

is basically to tech giants who disrupted the traditional - is basically to tech giants who i disrupted the traditional media model— disrupted the traditional media model coming _ disrupted the traditional media model coming along _ disrupted the traditional media model coming along and - disrupted the traditional media model coming along and being| disrupted the traditional media - model coming along and being forced by government — model coming along and being forced by government to _ model coming along and being forced by government to hand _ model coming along and being forced by government to hand over - model coming along and being forced by government to hand over money l model coming along and being forced| by government to hand over money to existing _ by government to hand over money to existing media — by government to hand over money to existing media conglomerates - by government to hand over money to existing media conglomerates that - existing media conglomerates that perhaps— existing media conglomerates that perhaps in— existing media conglomerates that perhaps in the _ existing media conglomerates that perhaps in the old _ existing media conglomerates that perhaps in the old days _ existing media conglomerates that perhaps in the old days might- existing media conglomerates that| perhaps in the old days might have seen as— perhaps in the old days might have seen as monopolies _ perhaps in the old days might have seen as monopolies and _ perhaps in the old days might have . seen as monopolies and gatekeepers of information — seen as monopolies and gatekeepers of information it _ seen as monopolies and gatekeepers of information it is _ seen as monopolies and gatekeepers of information it is news. _ seen as monopolies and gatekeepers of information it is news. there - seen as monopolies and gatekeepers of information it is news. there is - of information it is news. there is some _ of information it is news. there is some disquiet _ of information it is news. there is some disquiet. one _ of information it is news. there is some disquiet. one of— of information it is news. there is some disquiet. one of the - of information it is news. there is some disquiet. one of the empi l some disquiet. one of the empi detete — some disquiet. one of the empi detete back— some disquiet. one of the empi delete back mps _ some disquiet. one of the empi delete back mps has _ some disquiet. one of the empi delete back mps has been- some disquiet. one of the empi. delete back mps has been critical even _ delete back mps has been critical even though— delete back mps has been critical even though he _ delete back mps has been critical even though he supports - delete back mps has been critical even though he supports a - delete back mps has been critical| even though he supports a labour delete back mps has been critical- even though he supports a labour mp he was _ even though he supports a labour mp he was very— even though he supports a labour mp he was very well—informed _ even though he supports a labour mp he was very well—informed on - even though he supports a labour mp he was very well—informed on this . he was very well—informed on this and heat — he was very well—informed on this and heat makes _ he was very well—informed on this and heat makes this _ he was very well—informed on this and heat makes this point, - he was very well—informed on this and heat makes this point, he - he was very well—informed on thisl and heat makes this point, he says as of— and heat makes this point, he says as of today— and heat makes this point, he says as of today we've _ and heat makes this point, he says as of today we've got _ and heat makes this point, he says as of today we've got google - and heat makes this point, he says as of today we've got google and l as of today we've got google and facebook — as of today we've got google and facebook handing _ as of today we've got google and facebook handing over— as of today we've got google and facebook handing over tens - as of today we've got google and facebook handing over tens of i facebook handing over tens of millions— facebook handing over tens of millions of— facebook handing over tens of millions of dollars _ facebook handing over tens of millions of dollars to - facebook handing over tens of millions of dollars to these - millions of dollars to these companies _ millions of dollars to these companies. there - millions of dollars to these companies. there is - millions of dollars to these companies. there is so - millions of dollars to these companies. there is so far| millions of dollars to these . companies. there is so far no obligation— companies. there is so far no obligation and _ companies. there is so far no obligation and no _ companies. there is so far noi obligation and no transparency requirements _ obligation and no transparency requirements on _ obligation and no transparency requirements on those - obligation and no transparency requirements on those medial requirements on those media companies _ requirements on those media companies to— requirements on those media companies to state _ requirements on those media companies to state how - requirements on those media| companies to state how many journatists _ companies to state how many journalists they _ companies to state how many journalists they will _ companies to state how many journalists they will hire - companies to state how many journalists they will hire with i journalists they will hire with that, — journalists they will hire with that, how— journalists they will hire with that, how exactly _ journalists they will hire with that, how exactly they - journalists they will hire with that, how exactly they will i journalists they will hire with - that, how exactly they will spend that, _ that, how exactly they will spend that, whether— that, how exactly they will spend that, whether that _ that, how exactly they will spend that, whether that can _ that, how exactly they will spend that, whether that can be - that, whether that can be transferred _ that, whether that can be transferred and _ that, whether that can be transferred and right - that, whether that can be transferred and right to l that, whether that can be i transferred and right to lean that, whether that can be - transferred and right to lean back immediately— transferred and right to lean back immediately to— transferred and right to lean back immediately to shareholders - transferred and right to lean back immediately to shareholders or l transferred and right to lean back. immediately to shareholders or not. this is— immediately to shareholders or not. this is a _ immediately to shareholders or not. this is a tot — immediately to shareholders or not. this is a tot of— immediately to shareholders or not. this is a lot of criticism _ immediately to shareholders or not. this is a lot of criticism in _ this is a lot of criticism in australia _ this is a lot of criticism in australia for— this is a lot of criticism in australia for top - this is a lot of criticism in australia for top and - this is a lot of criticism in australia for top and it's i this is a lot of criticism in . australia for top and it's not this is a lot of criticism in - australia for top and it's not the case _ australia for top and it's not the case that— australia for top and it's not the case that everybody— australia for top and it's not the case that everybody thinks - australia for top and it's not the case that everybody thinks this i australia for top and it's not the. case that everybody thinks this is australia for top and it's not the i case that everybody thinks this is a good _ case that everybody thinks this is a good form — case that everybody thinks this is a good form of— case that everybody thinks this is a good form of regulation _ case that everybody thinks this is a good form of regulation even - case that everybody thinks this is a good form of regulation even as i good form of regulation even as facebook— good form of regulation even as facebook has _ good form of regulation even as facebook has misplayed - good form of regulation even as facebook has misplayed its - good form of regulation even as facebook has misplayed its own good form of regulation even as - facebook has misplayed its own hand. thank— facebook has misplayed its own hand. thank you _ facebook has misplayed its own hand. thank you so— facebook has misplayed its own hand. thank you so much _ facebook has misplayed its own hand. thank you so much for— facebook has misplayed its own hand. thank you so much for now. _ facebook has misplayed its own hand. thank you so much for now. david - thank you so much for now. david let's bring you end. this reliance

on silicon valley must be something that you thought about as you would get in your business plan together for boom radio. given that you are not on fm, presumably you relied quite heavily on amazon and google to play your radio on their speakers. to play your radio on their speakers— to play your radio on their seakers. ~ . ., x �* ., to play your radio on their seakers.~ . ., x �* ., speakers. we are on dab on monday. and several— speakers. we are on dab on monday. and several small _ speakers. we are on dab on monday. and several small scale _ speakers. we are on dab on monday. and several small scale manchester l and several small scale manchester and glasgow and a few other places. so dab is the principle way that people can consume radio these days was up at account certainly in a demographic we are targeting. the lion's share of that. increasingly people are going to they are smart speakers, laptops, phones fortheir radio stations. and that's going to be a graph that's only going to go out. we have had a few problems in getting easy smart speaker access for boom radio. you do feel a bit impotent because you can't found the person up at the transmitter site and say turn is on for top it's not and say turn is on for top it's not a simple design. it does pose challenges was on and we are no longer the gatekeepers always do however listeners can hear is up

let's talk about boom radio. you launched on _ let's talk about boom radio. you launched on valentine's day. you are aimed squarely at baby boomers generation barbie 28 9065 unst 1960 three there roughly generation barbie 28 9065 unst1960 three there roughly a0 million in have you got any indication of how many are listening? taste have you got any indication of how many are listening?— many are listening? we can say really because _ many are listening? we can say really because we _ many are listening? we can say really because we don't - many are listening? we can say really because we don't have i many are listening? we can say. really because we don't have any official numbers because nobody has at the moment and they will come through for some time. i could say certainly when we look at our streaming figures and we look at the response we would have had in my a0 mac years of radio i have never read such passionate response for a radio station that's barely a week old. response has blown us out of the water. passionate. passion is one of those funny words. it could be good, it could be bad. the those funny words. it could be good, it could be bad.— it could be bad. the number of complaints— it could be bad. the number of complaints probably _ it could be bad. the number of complaints probably about - it could be bad. the number of complaints probably about half it could be bad. the number of. complaints probably about half a dozen. the number of people who have written to us a couple of thousand. it's been phenomenal. they say you have created something that i have been missing. just on the figure certainly we had in our business plan and idea of the sort of streaming levels etc we blown them out of the water.—

out of the water. let's hear it. we mi . ht out of the water. let's hear it. we might risk — out of the water. let's hear it. we might risk hearing _ out of the water. let's hear it. we might risk hearing and _ out of the water. let's hear it. we might risk hearing and advert. - out of the water. let's hear it. we | might risk hearing and advert. this is a random blast of boom radio from this afternoon. music.— this afternoon. music. great song and before that _ this afternoon. music. great song and before that jerry _ this afternoon. music. great song and before that jerry and - this afternoon. music. great song and before that jerry and the - and before that jerry and the pacemaker and and before that jerry and the pacemakerand their and before that jerry and the pacemaker and their second number one, pacemaker and their second number one. i_ pacemaker and their second number one. i like _ pacemaker and their second number one. itike it~ — pacemaker and their second number one, i like it. gerry marsden leader of the _ one, i like it. gerry marsden leader of the pacemakers sadly died on the 3rd of— of the pacemakers sadly died on the 3rd ofjanuary for that but his music— 3rd ofjanuary for that but his music lives on. now time to blow the dust off— music lives on. now time to blow the dust off another one of these. it's david _ dust off another one of these. it's david hamilton.— david hamilton. that is a very particular— david hamilton. that is a very particular sound, _ david hamilton. that is a very particular sound, david - david hamilton. that is a very i particular sound, david hamilton david hamilton. that is a very - particular sound, david hamilton i'm not that a red legend again folks just did. you've got a very old—school radio jingles some singers that seem to walk straight out of that garden news. i want to rattle through your business idea very quickly before bringing jillian in. once the ownership structure,

who owns boom radio? it’s in. once the ownership structure, who owns boom radio?— in. once the ownership structure, who owns boom radio? it's a handful of --eole who owns boom radio? it's a handful of peeple who _ who owns boom radio? it's a handful of people who have _ who owns boom radio? it's a handful of people who have been _ who owns boom radio? it's a handful of people who have been in - who owns boom radio? it's a handful of people who have been in the - who owns boom radio? it's a handful of people who have been in the radio business a long time are actually tempted by this proposition. it's a handful of private individuals. myself and a few others. how much money did you have to raise? about a third of a million. _ money did you have to raise? about a third of a million. you _ money did you have to raise? about a third of a million. you got _ money did you have to raise? about a third of a million. you got news - third of a million. you got news bulletin, how much they cost you? just a few thousand foot up there from independent radio. fairir;r from independent radio. fairly nominal amount. _ from independent radio. fairly nominal amount. what - from independent radio. fairly nominal amount. what your. from independent radio. fairly nominal amount. what your unique selling proposition? irate nominal amount. what your unique selling proposition?— nominal amount. what your unique selling proposition? we are targeted at --eole selling proposition? we are targeted at peeple age _ selling proposition? we are targeted at peeple age 60 _ selling proposition? we are targeted at peeple age 60 to _ selling proposition? we are targeted at people age 60 to 75 _ selling proposition? we are targeted at people age 60 to 75 and - selling proposition? we are targeted at people age 60 to 75 and they - selling proposition? we are targeted at people age 60 to 75 and they are | at people age 60 to 75 and they are not addressed by... at people age 60 to 75 and they are not addressed by. . ._ not addressed by... greatest hits, coal, not addressed by... greatest hits, goal. radio — not addressed by... greatest hits, goal, radio to... _ not addressed by... greatest hits, goal, radio to... you _ not addressed by... greatest hits, goal, radio to... you heard - not addressed by... greatest hits, goal, radio to... you heard the . goal, radio to... you heard the sons goal, radio to... you heard the songs we _ goal, radio to... you heard the songs we played _ goal, radio to... you heard the songs we played this _ goal, radio to... you heard the | songs we played this afternoon. greatest hits is in a norm is offering. i've written to listeners saying if you think were a bit old tray greatest hits radio for that we go back 605 and 705 where we predominate a sprinkling of 505 and predominant material for the there is nothing quite like the mix we play. thousands of songs a variety but said in those key decades of 605

and 705. i but said in those key decades of 60s and 70s. ~ �* , but said in those key decades of 60s and 70s. ,, �* , ., but said in those key decades of 60s and 70s. ,, �*, ., ,., . and 70s. i think it's not so much the music— and 70s. i think it's not so much the music because _ and 70s. i think it's not so much the music because i _ and 70s. i think it's not so much the music because i defer - and 70s. i think it's not so much the music because i defer of - and 70s. i think it's not so much i the music because i defer of course to david's_ the music because i defer of course to david's greater expertise in this _ to david's greater expertise in this but — to david's greater expertise in this. but if you tune around you'll hear— this. but if you tune around you'll hear guite — this. but if you tune around you'll hear quite a — this. but if you tune around you'll hear quite a lot of the same music on caroline — hear quite a lot of the same music on caroline which is on dab. on greatest — on caroline which is on dab. on greatest hits, bit there. union jack, _ greatest hits, bit there. union jack, a — greatest hits, bit there. union jack, a better cross over there. i think— jack, a better cross over there. i think it's — jack, a better cross over there. i think it's in _ jack, a better cross over there. i think it's in the presentation. presentation, it's comfortable, he told me. — presentation, it's comfortable, he told me, it's radio like it used to be. told me, it's radio like it used to be where — told me, it's radio like it used to be. where people talk to you. they don't _ be. where people talk to you. they don'tiust_ be. where people talk to you. they don'tjust do link income a link out~ _ don'tjust do link income a link out~ whip— don'tjust do link income a link out. whip over to the competition. it's out. whip over to the competition. it'siust_ out. whip over to the competition. it'sjust more conversational. i think— it'sjust more conversational. i think that _ it'sjust more conversational. i think that is in a way what distinguishes, makes it warmer and people _ distinguishes, makes it warmer and people feel at home with it. like they felt, — people feel at home with it. like they felt, they haven't felt at home with radio _ they felt, they haven't felt at home with radio that you shall set you and stots — with radio that you shall set you and slots another dead skin. do you think the argument _ and slots another dead skin. do you think the argument which _ and slots another dead skin. do you think the argument which i - and slots another dead skin. do you

think the argument which i hear - and slots another dead skin. do you think the argument which i hear a l think the argument which i hear a lot, this argument that local radio stations even radio two are now chasing a younger, more diverse audience and therefore has a the people that david is going after put up people that david is going after put up do you think that's fair? is people that david is going after put up do you think that's fair?- up do you think that's fair? is very interesting — up do you think that's fair? is very interesting lecture _ up do you think that's fair? is very interesting lecture to _ up do you think that's fair? is very interesting lecture to the - interesting lecture to the controller radio to about the music series~ _ controller radio to about the music series it _ controller radio to about the music series. it said why were the shows on soteit? — series. it said why were the shows on soleil? and the reply said because _ on soleil? and the reply said because we want to drive consciously older listeners to sounds. and it's absolutely — older listeners to sounds. and it's absolutely astonishing that this would — absolutely astonishing that this would happen. why? not everybody wants— would happen. why? not everybody wants to _ would happen. why? not everybody wants to listen to sounds. not everybody wants to go and find the service _ everybody wants to go and find the service. people want to turn the radio— service. people want to turn the radio on— service. people want to turn the radio on as _ service. people want to turn the radio on as a friend. the person you have _ radio on as a friend. the person you have in— radio on as a friend. the person you have in the — radio on as a friend. the person you have in the kitchen with you, the person _ have in the kitchen with you, the person you — have in the kitchen with you, the person you go to bed with. if you don't _ person you go to bed with. if you don't mind — person you go to bed with. if you don't mind me saying so. it's a different— don't mind me saying so. it's a different relationship. i don't mind me saying so. it's a different relationship.- don't mind me saying so. it's a different relationship. i think it's odd. and different relationship. i think it's odd- and how — different relationship. i think it's odd. and how easy _ different relationship. i think it's odd. and how easy do _ different relationship. i think it's odd. and how easy do you - different relationship. i think it's odd. and how easy do you think| different relationship. i think it's. odd. and how easy do you think it different relationship. i think it's - odd. and how easy do you think it is for a newcomer like david? it's

obviously a logistical challenge going in a pandemic when you get your how to david. how easy is it for eight newcomer to challenge big radio groups? it’s for eight newcomer to challenge big radio grows?— radio groups? it's very difficult. i would think. _ radio groups? it's very difficult. i would think. it's _ radio groups? it's very difficult. i would think. it's three _ radio groups? it's very difficult. i would think. it's three big - radio groups? it's very difficult. i would think. it's three big radio i would think. it's three big radio groups— would think. it's three big radio groups have it pretty much sewn up between _ groups have it pretty much sewn up between them. there is global which is all the _ between them. there is global which is all the capital stations, it's power— is all the capital stations, it's power which owns scarlett has a great _ power which owns scarlett has a great spread across things. and there _ great spread across things. and there are — great spread across things. and there are people i work for news core _ there are people i work for news core now— there are people i work for news core now have their own radio station — core now have their own radio station. virgin and times radio. it's station. virgin and times radio. it's very— station. virgin and times radio. it's very difficult to break into a market— it's very difficult to break into a market that has big money behind it and big _ market that has big money behind it and big buying power. and you can tell it _ and big buying power. and you can tell it by— and big buying power. and you can tell it by the adverts, actually. i think— tell it by the adverts, actually. i think if— tell it by the adverts, actually. i think if david person says maybe they'll _ think if david person says maybe they'll come along and ask him to sell to— they'll come along and ask him to sell to them. but i don't think that's— sell to them. but i don't think that's what you sell for. i think he's _ that's what you sell for. i think

he's found _ that's what you sell for. i think he's found an audience that feels under— he's found an audience that feels under loved. and don't forget, this baby boomers have been the dominant demographic ever since the 19605. and they've dominated everything. tasting _ and they've dominated everything. tasting close, style and achievement. if you like that kind of music— achievement. if you like that kind of music why not have a radio station — of music why not have a radio station for— of music why not have a radio station for a? me of music why not have a radio station fora? me it's of music why not have a radio station for a? me it's a bit tame. i'm station for a? me it's a bit tame. i'm more — station for a? me it's a bit tame. i'm more of— station for a? me it's a bit tame. i'm more of a soul girl. last word to our i'm more of a soul girl. last word to your david- — i'm more of a soul girl. last word to your david. brilliant. _ i'm more of a soul girl. last word to your david. brilliant. i - i'm more of a soul girl. last word to your david. brilliant. i think. to your david. brilliant. i think its programme brilliantly. i wrote about two years ago they are moving into a particular demographic territory to stop and think it's rather disingenuous to think that you can target where the mainstream music station at 35—year—old and also target people double that age. why is it disingenuous? i'm really into motown, i'm also into hip—hop. i agree, i agree. bit into motown, i'm also into hip-hop. i agree. i agree-— i agree, i agree. all the people who programme — i agree, i agree. all the people who programme radio _ i agree, i agree. all the people who programme radio stations _ i agree, i agree. all the people who programme radio stations will - i agree, i agree. all the people who programme radio stations will say l programme radio stations will say you actually need to focus. people who programme to the exact songs which chime best with their audience. if you look through radio

to 65—year—old listener the array of myths not music that radio to places not for them anymore. and we've got thousands of comments saying that our research as it as well. it's a great plan but it's not for them anymore. great plan but it's not for them an more. .. ., great plan but it's not for them an more. . i. �* anymore. the fact that you've researched — anymore. the fact that you've researched it _ anymore. the fact that you've researched it it _ anymore. the fact that you've researched it it seems - anymore. the fact that you've researched it it seems that i anymore. the fact that you've l researched it it seems that your argument a gap in the market suggest there are a lot of people who still love radio which is obviously a good thing. not that this show. thank you very much indeed for your contribution today. really appreciate if was atjulia reynolds the radio critic for the sunday times. david for boom radio. and the teacup from ——. thank you so much to john bowen today studio engineer and thank you to you for listening. goodbye. good evening. the start of meteorological spring

is only a few days away now. and today certainly felt a springlike sort of day. with some blue sky, some warm sunshine. for the weekend were looking at a mostly dry, settled spell of weather continuing. some sunshine by day but some chilly nights in the forecast too. we have got a weather front bringing in a bit more cloud and a few splashes of rain to northern ireland and scotland through tonight. england and wales clear and dry with some mist and fog patches and temperatures getting down a touch below freezing in a few spots. could be a bit of frosting is in a few fog patches around. especially in the south first thing. they should gradually clear away. this band of cloud will push out of scotland and northern ireland into northern england, brightening up the north for some sunshine later on to subside and he spells to the south of that too. temperature's about ten to 13 degrees doing quite well at this time in february for up into sunday and we are likely to see a dry date with light winds. maybe a little bit of fog and low cloud through the morning lifting into cloud during the course of the afternoon. top temperatures about nine

to 11 degrees on sunday. bye— bye.

tonight at 10 — scotland's formerfirst minster alex salmond launches a blistering attack on nicola sturgeon — accusing her of breaking ministerial rules. giving evidence at a scottish parliamentary inquiry he accused those at the top of the snp as well as the civil service and courts of conspiring against him. scotland hasn't failed, its leadership has failed. so the importance of this inquiry is for each and every one of us to help put this right. alex salmond and nicola sturgeon were close political allies for decades — but the two are now embroiled in a bitter war of words. we'll asking how much damage this row is doing to scotland's leadership. also tonight...

moving through the age groups — the over a05 will be