50 so much, we are them. thank you so much. we are auoin to them. thank you so much. we are going to watch _ them. thank you so much. we are going to watch the _ them. thank you so much. we are going to watch the debates - them. thank you so much. we are going to watch the debates right l them. thank you so much. we are i going to watch the debates right now because it's about to start and the wales debate. let's listen in. good evening and welcome to the bbc wales leaders debate. tonight, exactly one week before wales goes to the polls, we hearfrom exactly one week before wales goes to the polls, we hear from the exactly one week before wales goes to the polls, we hearfrom the main parties in the senedd election. i'm joined by the leaders of the welsh conservatives, the welsh liberal democrats, plaid cymru, welsh labour and abolish the welsh assembly as they debate the issues that matter to you. we also joined by a virtual

audience made up of a cross—section of voters and ready with their questions. laterwe'll of voters and ready with their questions. later we'll hear from leaders of other parties, with nick servini. , , ., . ., ., servini. this is an election that may leave _ servini. this is an election that may leave the _ servini. this is an election that may leave the balance - servini. this is an election that may leave the balance of- servini. this is an election that| may leave the balance of power servini. this is an election that. may leave the balance of power in the hands of a number of parties. later i'll be here with the senior figures from ukip, the greens and reform reform who hope to do enough to make you vote for them. iii you to make you vote for them. if you want to join _ to make you vote for them. if you want to join the _ to make you vote for them. if you want to join the discussion - to make you vote for them. if you want to join the discussion on - want to join the discussion on social media, joined the debate using the hashtag. where going to start with opening statements from the party leaders. 30 seconds each to set out their stall. 0ur production team drew lots earlier to decide the order and first up, the leader of the welsh liberal democrats, jane dodds. leader of the welsh liberal democrats, jane dodds. thank you. toni . ht democrats, jane dodds. thank you. tonight it's — democrats, jane dodds. thank you. tonight it's about _ democrats, jane dodds. thank you. tonight it's about you, _ democrats, jane dodds. thank you. tonight it's about you, it's - democrats, jane dodds. thank you. tonight it's about you, it's about. tonight it's about you, it's about your hopes and aspirations as you vote in the senedd election. i make

one promise to you. that the welsh liberal democrats will put recovery first. recovery of our economy, recovery of our mental health and recovery of our mental health and recovery of our planet. we want a wales that is stronger, fairer and greener. a wales where people and planet are at the forefront of everything we do.— planet are at the forefront of everything we do. thank you, very much. everything we do. thank you, very much- next _ everything we do. thank you, very much. next for _ everything we do. thank you, very much. next for welsh _ everything we do. thank you, very much. next for welsh labour, - everything we do. thank you, very. much. next for welsh labour, mark much. next forwelsh labour, mark drakeford. much. next for welsh labour, mark drakeford. , . ., , ., drakeford. every election is a choice. drakeford. every election is a choice- in _ drakeford. every election is a choice. in this _ drakeford. every election is a choice. in this election - drakeford. every election is a choice. in this election a - drakeford. every election is a choice. in this election a vote drakeford. every election is a . choice. in this election a vote for welsh _ choice. in this election a vote for welsh labour is to make that choice for trust _ welsh labour is to make that choice for trust and ambition. trust because _ for trust and ambition. trust because of the way we've worked together— because of the way we've worked together to keep wales safe during this pandemic. but ambition, too. welsh _ this pandemic. but ambition, too. welsh labour is ambitious for our future _ welsh labour is ambitious for our future for— welsh labour is ambitious for our future for a _ welsh labour is ambitious for our future. for a wales in which everybody has a part to play. a wales — everybody has a part to play. a wales where nobody is held back. and where _ wales where nobody is held back. and where everybody is able to make

their— where everybody is able to make their contribution.— where everybody is able to make their contribution. thank you. next, their contribution. thank you. next, the welsh conservatives, _ their contribution. thank you. next, the welsh conservatives, andrew i their contribution. thank you. next, | the welsh conservatives, andrew rt davies. ~ . , , . the welsh conservatives, andrew rt davies. ~ ., , , ., , ., the welsh conservatives, andrew rt davies. . ., , , ., , ., ., the welsh conservatives, andrew rt davies. . ., , , ., ., davies. wales is a brave and bold country with _ davies. wales is a brave and bold country with huge _ davies. wales is a brave and bold country with huge ambition - davies. wales is a brave and bold country with huge ambition and l country with huge ambition and untapped — country with huge ambition and untapped potential. _ country with huge ambition and untapped potential. after- country with huge ambition and untapped potential. after 22. country with huge ambition and i untapped potential. after 22 years of labour— untapped potential. after 22 years of labour running _ untapped potential. after 22 years of labour running wales _ untapped potential. after 22 years of labour running wales we - untapped potential. after 22 years of labour running wales we can i untapped potential. after 22 years i of labour running wales we can make a change _ of labour running wales we can make a change on _ of labour running wales we can make a change on may— of labour running wales we can make a change on may the _ of labour running wales we can make a change on may the 6th. _ of labour running wales we can make a change on may the 6th. you - of labour running wales we can make a change on may the 6th. you can- a change on may the 6th. you can make _ a change on may the 6th. you can make the — a change on may the 6th. you can make the difference _ a change on may the 6th. you can make the difference by— a change on may the 6th. you can make the difference by voting - a change on may the 6th. you can make the difference by voting for| make the difference by voting for change — make the difference by voting for change we — make the difference by voting for change we can— make the difference by voting for change. we can have _ make the difference by voting for change. we can have a _ make the difference by voting for change. we can have a better- change. we can have a better education _ change. we can have a better education system, _ change. we can have a better education system, a - change. we can have a better education system, a health. change. we can have a better- education system, a health service that responds _ education system, a health service that responds to _ education system, a health service that responds to waiting _ education system, a health service that responds to waiting times, - that responds to waiting times, create — that responds to waiting times, create an— that responds to waiting times, create an economy _ that responds to waiting times, create an economy lifting - that responds to waiting times, | create an economy lifting wages across _ create an economy lifting wages across the — create an economy lifting wages across the whole _ create an economy lifting wages across the whole of— create an economy lifting wages across the whole of wales - create an economy lifting wages across the whole of wales and l create an economy lifting wages - across the whole of wales and makes across the whole of wales and makes a difference — across the whole of wales and makes a difference. what's— across the whole of wales and makes a difference. what's the _ across the whole of wales and makes a difference. what's the problem - a difference. what's the problem with wales — a difference. what's the problem with wales is _ a difference. what's the problem with wales is in _ a difference. what's the problem with wales is in the _ a difference. what's the problem with wales is in the people - a difference. what's the problem with wales is in the people of. with wales is in the people of wales, — with wales is in the people of wales, it's _ with wales is in the people of wales, it's the _ with wales is in the people of wales, it's the government . with wales is in the people of| wales, it's the government of labour, — wales, it's the government of labour, played _ wales, it's the government of labour, played and _ wales, it's the government of labour, played and liberals i wales, it's the government of. labour, played and liberals over wales, it's the government of- labour, played and liberals over the last 22_ labour, played and liberals over the last 22 years — labour, played and liberals over the last 22 years we _ labour, played and liberals over the last 22 years. we can _ labour, played and liberals over the last 22 years. we can make - labour, played and liberals over the last 22 years. we can make the - last 22 years. we can make the difference _ last 22 years. we can make the difference and _ last 22 years. we can make the difference and you _ last 22 years. we can make the difference and you are - last 22 years. we can make the difference and you are the - last 22 years. we can make the . difference and you are the people last 22 years. we can make the - difference and you are the people in power— difference and you are the people in power on _ difference and you are the people in power on may— difference and you are the people in power on may he _ difference and you are the people in power on may be sick. _ difference and you are the people in power on may be sick. the - difference and you are the people in power on may be sick.— difference and you are the people in power on may be sick. the leader of plaid cymru, — power on may be sick. the leader of plaid cymru, adam _ power on may be sick. the leader of plaid cymru, adam price. _ power on may be sick. the leader of plaid cymru, adam price. over- power on may be sick. the leader of plaid cymru, adam price. over the l plaid cymru, adam price. over the last few weeks _ plaid cymru, adam price. over the last few weeks i _ plaid cymru, adam price. over the last few weeks i spoken _ plaid cymru, adam price. over the last few weeks i spoken to - plaid cymru, adam price. over the last few weeks i spoken to the - last few weeks i spoken to the homeless and jobless and those who had no heart and hope. i'm standing here tonight for you, i'm standing here tonight for you, i'm standing here because 50 years ago being a child was no bar to achievement. i

want every child in wales to have the chances i was given. i want my parents's generation to receive the dignity they deserve. now is the time to demand a better future, not to defer it, not to delay the new wales for five more years but to begin now to build it. we can, we will, we must on maybe six. thank ou. the will, we must on maybe six. thank you- the final— will, we must on maybe six. thank you. the final opening _ will, we must on maybe six. thank you. the final opening statement | you. the final opening statement from richard suchorzewski, leader of abolish the welsh assembly. if the other -a abolish the welsh assembly. if the other party leaders _ abolish the welsh assembly. if the other party leaders attack - abolish the welsh assembly. if the other party leaders attack us - abolish the welsh assembly. if the other party leaders attack us it's because — other party leaders attack us it's because they know what we have about _ because they know what we have about the — because they know what we have about. the loss of theirjobs and a cushy— about. the loss of theirjobs and a cushy little — about. the loss of theirjobs and a cushy little number. by abolishing the welsh assembly we shall not only have a _ the welsh assembly we shall not only have a better health and education service, _ have a better health and education service, but we will also prevent the break—up of the union. in the words _ the break—up of the union. in the words of— the break—up of the union. in the words of sir— the break—up of the union. in the words of sir tom jones, we are stronger— words of sir tom jones, we are stronger together as part of a united — stronger together as part of a

united kingdom.— stronger together as part of a united kingdom. stronger together as part of a united kinudom. . ,, ,, , . united kingdom. thank you very much. so, len united kingdom. thank you very much. so. plenty to — united kingdom. thank you very much. so, plenty to discuss _ united kingdom. thank you very much. so, plenty to discuss tonight _ united kingdom. thank you very much. so, plenty to discuss tonight and - united kingdom. thank you very much. so, plenty to discuss tonight and i - so, plenty to discuss tonight and i think we can all agree we want to have a constructive and respectful debate. 0urfirst question have a constructive and respectful debate. our first question comes from paul hicks. fik. debate. our first question comes from paul hicks.— debate. our first question comes from paul hicks. ok. how as first minister would _ from paul hicks. ok. how as first minister would each _ from paul hicks. ok. how as first minister would each of _ from paul hicks. ok. how as first minister would each of you - from paul hicks. ok. how as first. minister would each of you balance the different— minister would each of you balance the different demands _ minister would each of you balance the different demands on - minister would each of you balance the different demands on the - minister would each of you balance i the different demands on the health service _ the different demands on the health service and — the different demands on the health service and rebuild _ the different demands on the health service and rebuild the _ the different demands on the health service and rebuild the mental- the different demands on the health service and rebuild the mental and i service and rebuild the mental and physical— service and rebuild the mental and physical health _ service and rebuild the mental and physical health of _ service and rebuild the mental and physical health of the _ service and rebuild the mental and physical health of the people - service and rebuild the mental and physical health of the people of. physical health of the people of wales? — physical health of the people of wales? ., , , wales? there we are, then. pressure is on the health _ wales? there we are, then. pressure is on the health service _ wales? there we are, then. pressure is on the health service after - wales? there we are, then. pressure is on the health service after the - is on the health service after the pandemic. andrew rt davies. what's really important _ pandemic. andrew rt davies. what's really important is _ pandemic. andrew rt davies. what's really important is we _ pandemic. andrew rt davies. what's really important is we focus - pandemic. andrew rt davies. what's really important is we focus on - really important is we focus on waiting times and staff morale in the health service. the staff have been the pinnacle of delivery through the covid crisis and we owed them so much which is why we've committed to put an nhs covenant in place so that in law will be making commitments to the nhs over workforce practices, making sure we retain as many people in our nhs and recruiting 1200 doctors, 3000 nurses

and making investment in hospitals all over wales with five new hospitals or upgrades. with one on five people on a waiting time and the mental health pressures we need to make investment in the nhs. you said that we — to make investment in the nhs. you said that we owed the staff so much. what sort of pay rise would you give them? 1%? what sort of pay rise would you give them? 196? ~ �* .., what sort of pay rise would you give them? 196? ~ �* _, ., them? 196? we're committed to deliverin: them? 196? we're committed to delivering on — them? 196? we're committed to delivering on the _ them? 196? we're committed to delivering on the independent l them? 196? we're committed to i delivering on the independent pay delivery review body recommendation and that's the proper way to do it. your colleagues in england are saying 1%. is that enough? your colleagues in england are saying 196. is that enough? weight imlement saying 196. is that enough? weight implement what _ saying 196. is that enough? weight implement what the _ saying 196. is that enough? weight implement what the independent l saying 196. is that enough? weight i implement what the independent pay review body would recommend. we don't accept 1% is enough for dedicated staff who have performed in this covid crisis and we wouldn't be coming out of it if not for their efforts. a .. be coming out of it if not for their efforts. ,, , ., ,, ., be coming out of it if not for their. efforts._ repairing efforts. mark drakeford? repairing and restoring _ efforts. mark drakeford? repairing and restoring the _ efforts. mark drakeford? repairing and restoring the health _ efforts. mark drakeford? repairing and restoring the health service . and restoring the health service will he — and restoring the health service will be the work of the next senedd. we'll need _ will be the work of the next senedd. we'll need to find money for it at my party— we'll need to find money for it at my party has already said we would find £1_ my party has already said we would find £1 billion over and above what would _ find £1 billion over and above what would otherwise be invested in the health— would otherwise be invested in the

health service. we need to increase the number— health service. we need to increase the number of doctors and nurses and other— the number of doctors and nurses and other staff— the number of doctors and nurses and other staff we have in the nhs in wales— other staff we have in the nhs in wales to — other staff we have in the nhs in wales to go on doing that job. other staff we have in the nhs in wales to go on doing thatjob. when devolution _ wales to go on doing thatjob. when devolution began there were fewer than 60,000 people employed in the nhs in _ than 60,000 people employed in the nhs in wales. today it's nearly 90.000 — nhs in wales. today it's nearly 90,000. �* nhs in wales. today it's nearly 90,000. r , nhs in wales. today it's nearly 90,000. , , 90,000. but yesterday the royal radiolo . ist 90,000. but yesterday the royal radiologist said _ 90,000. but yesterday the royal radiologist said they _ 90,000. but yesterday the royal radiologist said they needed - 90,000. but yesterday the royal radiologist said they needed 3096 | radiologist said they needed 30% more consultants. you've been in charge for 22 years and haven't tackled that. i charge for 22 years and haven't tackled that.— tackled that. i said to you that when we came _ tackled that. i said to you that when we came into _ tackled that. i said to you that when we came into power - tackled that. i said to you that. when we came into power there tackled that. i said to you that - when we came into power there were 60.000 _ when we came into power there were 60,000 people in the nhs and today it is nearer— 60,000 people in the nhs and today it is nearer 90,000. that does include — it is nearer 90,000. that does include more radiologists but we also need — include more radiologists but we also need innovation. scans in wales are read _ also need innovation. scans in wales are read in— also need innovation. scans in wales are read in other parts of the world — are read in other parts of the world we _ are read in other parts of the world. we don't need to rely on old ways— world. we don't need to rely on old ways of— world. we don't need to rely on old ways of doing things. 0ur world. we don't need to rely on old ways of doing things. our staff have responded _ ways of doing things. our staff have responded fantastically in the pandemic with imagination and we'll have to _ pandemic with imagination and we'll have to capture that so the health service _ have to capture that so the health service we — have to capture that so the health service we create beyond the pandemic is one that continues to innovate —

pandemic is one that continues to innovate and deliver on the services on which _ innovate and deliver on the services on which we — innovate and deliver on the services on which we all rely.— on which we all rely. adam price. mark, on which we all rely. adam price. mark. you _ on which we all rely. adam price. mark. you must _ on which we all rely. adam price. mark, you must accept _ on which we all rely. adam price. mark, you must accept that - on which we all rely. adam price. mark, you must accept that the l on which we all rely. adam price. - mark, you must accept that the issue of shortages that we heard with radiologists. we've got a gap of 40% compared to what we need and that is repeated so many other areas, paediatric consultants, 42% gap. we have fewer gps now than we had ten years ago, and that's repeated across the nhs. that's part of the reason there has been huge pressure on the nhs. we thank the nhs and care staff. 0ne on the nhs. we thank the nhs and care staff. one of the absolute priorities has to be plugging the shortages that have been there for too long. ten years of a lack of investment, i too long. ten years of a lack of investment,! while you were health minister and first minister as well. we have to make that the priority. in terms of mental health, that needs to be given a higher priority in the overall spending. 23% of sickness in wales is mental health

and it only gets 13% of the budget so we have to close the gap. because of the epidemic among younger people in particular, we want to create a network of well being hubs for mental health in every... flan network of well being hubs for mental health in every... can you talk about — mental health in every... can you talk about the _ mental health in every... can you talk about the pressures - mental health in every... can you talk about the pressures on - mental health in every... can you talk about the pressures on the i mental health in every... can you - talk about the pressures on the nhs, and yet your big idea is to merge social care and the nhs. in the aftermath of a pandemic is that really a priority, a huge reorganisation?- really a priority, a huge reorganisation? really a priority, a huge reoruanisation? v . �*, reorganisation? it's critical, it's delivering _ reorganisation? it's critical, it's delivering the _ reorganisation? it's critical, it's delivering the original- reorganisation? it's critical, it's delivering the original vision . reorganisation? it's critical, it's delivering the original vision of| delivering the original vision of bevan — delivering the original vision of bevan because it's bringing social care into — bevan because it's bringing social care into the nhs family, to make social— care into the nhs family, to make social care — care into the nhs family, to make social care free at the point of need — social care free at the point of need. especially in a situation where — need. especially in a situation where sadly with long covid more people _ where sadly with long covid more people will have chronic conditions. if you _ people will have chronic conditions. if you have — people will have chronic conditions. if you have a chronic condition where — if you have a chronic condition where does your health—care need and add your— where does your health—care need and add your social care need begin? it should _ add your social care need begin? it should be — add your social care need begin? it should be free and we need to bring care workers onto the same pay rates as the _ care workers onto the same pay rates as the nhs, _ care workers onto the same pay rates as the nhs, which need a significant meaningful rise because we had

10-15%— meaningful rise because we had 10—15% real terms cut. jane meaningful rise because we had 10-1596 real terms cut. jane dodds. thank ou 10-1596 real terms cut. jane dodds. thank you for— 10-1596 real terms cut. jane dodds. thank you for the _ 10-1596 real terms cut. jane dodds. thank you for the question, - 10-1596 real terms cut. jane dodds. thank you for the question, an - thank you for the question, an important one. the welsh liberal democrats would ensure that there was parity between mental health and physical health. we must ensure that our mental health systems and our responses to people who suffer from them are absolutely the same way as physical health. we also want people with mental health not to bejudged. in terms of physical health we want to see a much better diagnostic system within the community, with pharmacists and gps. we need to move the dial from crisis and pharmacists and gps. we need to move the dialfrom crisis and emergencies over to how we're going prevent health issues, and that would be a priority for the welsh liberal democrats.— priority for the welsh liberal democrats. . ., ,, . ., democrats. richard suchorzewski. the last 22 years — democrats. richard suchorzewski. the last 22 years has _ democrats. richard suchorzewski. the last 22 years has seen _ democrats. richard suchorzewski. the last 22 years has seen a _ democrats. richard suchorzewski. the last 22 years has seen a total- last 22 years has seen a total mismanagement of the health service in wales _ mismanagement of the health service in wales. before the pandemic we had

five of— in wales. before the pandemic we had five of the _ in wales. before the pandemic we had five of the seven health boards in special— five of the seven health boards in special measures. betsy cadwallader in north— special measures. betsy cadwallader in north wales was in special measures for five years. we need to put our— measures for five years. we need to put our nhs — measures for five years. we need to put our nhs back together, and we can only— put our nhs back together, and we can only really do that by having one nhs— can only really do that by having one nhs for all, and that is putting it under— one nhs for all, and that is putting it under the guidance of the united kingdom _ it under the guidance of the united kingdom government. 0k it under the guidance of the united kingdom government.— it under the guidance of the united kingdom government. ok but do you acknowledge — kingdom government. ok but do you acknowledge there _ kingdom government. ok but do you acknowledge there are _ kingdom government. ok but do you acknowledge there are problems - kingdom government. ok but do you| acknowledge there are problems over the border in england? looking at shrewsbury, kent, maternity issues. it's not the land of milk and honey, is it? �* ., it's not the land of milk and honey, isit?�* ., �*, it's not the land of milk and honey, isit? ., . is it? i'm not saying it's perfect but there _ is it? i'm not saying it's perfect but there waiting _ is it? i'm not saying it's perfect but there waiting times - is it? i'm not saying it's perfect but there waiting times and - is it? i'm not saying it's perfect - but there waiting times and waiting lists are _ but there waiting times and waiting lists are half those of what they are in _ lists are half those of what they are in wales. richard pugh, head of the macmillan cancer support in wales— the macmillan cancer support in wales said, and i'd like to quote him, _ wales said, and i'd like to quote him, unfortunately we are top of the leagues— him, unfortunately we are top of the leagues all— him, unfortunately we are top of the leagues all the time. give him, unfortunately we are top of the leagues all the time.— leagues all the time. give us some details, leagues all the time. give us some details. how _ leagues all the time. give us some details, how would _ leagues all the time. give us some details, how would you _ leagues all the time. give us some details, how would you tackle - leagues all the time. give us some details, how would you tackle the. details, how would you tackle the waiting lists? you aren't going to abolish the assembly overnight, how

would you tackle waiting lists if you were in power in may? in reality if we were able _ you were in power in may? in reality if we were able to _ you were in power in may? in reality if we were able to get _ you were in power in may? in reality if we were able to get rid _ you were in power in may? in reality if we were able to get rid of - you were in power in may? in reality if we were able to get rid of a - you were in power in may? in reality if we were able to get rid of a tier i if we were able to get rid of a tier of unnecessary politicians we'd save 65 million — of unnecessary politicians we'd save 65 million. we'd work together with the uk _ 65 million. we'd work together with the uk government because at the end of the _ the uk government because at the end of the day— the uk government because at the end of the day they are the ones ultimately who are going to find this operation. 30 ultimately who are going to find this operation.— ultimately who are going to find this 0 eration. ,, , ., i. this operation. so your plan in your oli this operation. so your plan in your policy document — this operation. so your plan in your policy document seems _ this operation. so your plan in your policy document seems to - this operation. so your plan in your policy document seems to be - this operation. so your plan in your policy document seems to be to i this operation. so your plan in your l policy document seems to be to send patients to england? brute policy document seems to be to send patients to england?— patients to england? we will treat atients at patients to england? we will treat patients at the _ patients to england? we will treat patients at the point _ patients to england? we will treat patients at the point of _ patients to england? we will treat patients at the point of need, - patients to england? we will treat patients at the point of need, and | patients at the point of need, and if that— patients at the point of need, and if that means they have to go to hospitals — if that means they have to go to hospitals in england, so be it? the problem _ hospitals in england, so be it? the problem we have at the moment is that a _ problem we have at the moment is that a number of hospitals in england _ that a number of hospitals in england are actually rejecting or lower— england are actually rejecting or lower prioritising those patients because — lower prioritising those patients because we aren't paying the bills. paul: _ because we aren't paying the bills. paul. what— because we aren't paying the bills. paul, what do you think of what you've heard? i paul, what do you think of what you've heard?— you've heard? i think it's interesting _ you've heard? i think it's interesting that - you've heard? i think it's interesting that a - you've heard? i think it's interesting that a lot - you've heard? i think it's interesting that a lot of . you've heard? i think it's- interesting that a lot of people have _ interesting that a lot of people have focused _ interesting that a lot of people have focused on _ interesting that a lot of people have focused on the _ interesting that a lot of people have focused on the issue - interesting that a lot of people have focused on the issue of. interesting that a lot of people - have focused on the issue of waiting lists, _ have focused on the issue of waiting lists. but— have focused on the issue of waiting

lists. but that — have focused on the issue of waiting lists, but that wasn't _ have focused on the issue of waiting lists, but that wasn't my— have focused on the issue of waiting lists, but that wasn't my thought . have focused on the issue of waiting lists, but that wasn't my thought ini lists, but that wasn't my thought in coming _ lists, but that wasn't my thought in coming up — lists, but that wasn't my thought in coming up with— lists, but that wasn't my thought in coming up with the _ lists, but that wasn't my thought in coming up with the question. - lists, but that wasn't my thought in coming up with the question. i- lists, but that wasn't my thought in| coming up with the question. i keep hearing _ coming up with the question. i keep hearing about — coming up with the question. i keep hearing about waiting _ coming up with the question. i keep hearing about waiting lists - coming up with the question. i keep hearing about waiting lists for - hearing about waiting lists for routine — hearing about waiting lists for routine surgery _ hearing about waiting lists for routine surgery and _ hearing about waiting lists for routine surgery and cancer. hearing about waiting lists for. routine surgery and cancer care hearing about waiting lists for - routine surgery and cancer care and so on, _ routine surgery and cancer care and so on. but — routine surgery and cancer care and so on. but in — routine surgery and cancer care and so on. but in my— routine surgery and cancer care and so on, but in my role _ routine surgery and cancer care and so on, but in my role as _ routine surgery and cancer care and so on, but in my role as a - routine surgery and cancer care and so on, but in my role as a mental. so on, but in my role as a mental health— so on, but in my role as a mental health nurse _ so on, but in my role as a mental health nurse working _ so on, but in my role as a mental health nurse working with - so on, but in my role as a mental health nurse working with young i health nurse working with young people. — health nurse working with young people. especially— health nurse working with young people, especially in _ health nurse working with young people, especially in early- people, especially in early intervention... _ people, especially in early intervention... not - people, especially in early intervention... notjust. people, especially in early. intervention... notjust that, people, especially in early- intervention... notjust that, but as a— intervention... notjust that, but as a friend — intervention... notjust that, but as a friend and _ intervention... notjust that, but as a friend and as— intervention... notjust that, but as a friend and as a _ intervention... notjust that, but as a friend and as a colleague, i as a friend and as a colleague, understanding _ as a friend and as a colleague, understanding the _ as a friend and as a colleague, understanding the impact - as a friend and as a colleague, understanding the impact and i as a friend and as a colleague, - understanding the impact and seeing the impact _ understanding the impact and seeing the impact that— understanding the impact and seeing the impact that covid _ understanding the impact and seeing the impact that covid and _ understanding the impact and seeing the impact that covid and lockdown i the impact that covid and lockdown have had _ the impact that covid and lockdown have had on — the impact that covid and lockdown have had on people _ the impact that covid and lockdown have had on people of— the impact that covid and lockdown have had on people of all— the impact that covid and lockdown have had on people of all ages- the impact that covid and lockdown have had on people of all ages in. have had on people of all ages in terms _ have had on people of all ages in terms of— have had on people of all ages in terms of their— have had on people of all ages in terms of their mental— have had on people of all ages in terms of their mental health - have had on people of all ages in terms of their mental health and j terms of their mental health and well-being. _ terms of their mental health and well—being, that's— terms of their mental health and well—being, that's my— terms of their mental health and well—being, that's my concern. l terms of their mental health and - well—being, that's my concern. what well-being, that's my concern. what would ou well-being, that's my concern. what would you like _ well-being, that's my concern. what would you like to _ well-being, that's my concern. what would you like to hear _ well-being, that's my concern. what would you like to hear on _ well—being, that's my concern. would you like to hear on mental health? you're there on the front line. what's needed? i health? you're there on the front line. what's needed?— line. what's needed? i think the main thing _ line. what's needed? i think the main thing i'd — line. what's needed? i think the main thing i'd like _ line. what's needed? i think the main thing i'd like to _ line. what's needed? i think the main thing i'd like to see - line. what's needed? i think the main thing i'd like to see is - main thing i'd like to see is parity~ _ main thing i'd like to see is parity i_ main thing i'd like to see is parity. i know— main thing i'd like to see is parity. i know that's - main thing i'd like to see is parity. i know that's been i main thing i'd like to see is - parity. i know that's been mentioned by a few— parity. i know that's been mentioned by a few people _ parity. i know that's been mentioned by a few people it— parity. i know that's been mentioned by a few people. it was _ parity. i know that's been mentioned by a few people. it was talked - parity. i know that's been mentioned by a few people. it was talked about| by a few people. it was talked about when _ by a few people. it was talked about when i _ by a few people. it was talked about when i started — by a few people. it was talked about when i started my— by a few people. it was talked about when i started my career— by a few people. it was talked about when i started my career 17 - by a few people. it was talked about when i started my career 17 years i when i started my career 17 years ago. _ when i started my career 17 years ago. about— when i started my career 17 years ago. about parity— when i started my career 17 years ago, about parity between - when i started my career 17 yearsi ago, about parity between mental when i started my career 17 years - ago, about parity between mental and physical— ago, about parity between mental and physical health — ago, about parity between mental and physical health i— ago, about parity between mental and physical health. ido— ago, about parity between mental and physical health. i do welcome - ago, about parity between mental and physical health. i do welcome the -

physical health. i do welcome the appointment— physical health. i do welcome the appointment of— physical health. i do welcome the appointment of baroness - physical health. i do welcome the| appointment of baroness morgan, physical health. i do welcome the - appointment of baroness morgan, the increase _ appointment of baroness morgan, the increase in— appointment of baroness morgan, the increase in her— appointment of baroness morgan, the increase in her role _ appointment of baroness morgan, the increase in her role to _ appointment of baroness morgan, the increase in her role to include - increase in her role to include mental— increase in her role to include mental health— increase in her role to include mental health and _ increase in her role to includel mental health and well—being. increase in her role to include - mental health and well—being. but i 'ust mental health and well—being. but i just think— mental health and well—being. but i just think the — mental health and well—being. but i just think the gap _ mental health and well—being. but i just think the gap is _ mental health and well—being. but i just think the gap is so _ mental health and well—being. but i just think the gap is so huge - mental health and well—being. but i just think the gap is so huge and - just think the gap is so huge and they need — just think the gap is so huge and they need in— just think the gap is so huge and they need in terms _ just think the gap is so huge and they need in terms of— just think the gap is so huge and they need in terms of mental- just think the gap is so huge and - they need in terms of mental health has gone _ they need in terms of mental health has gone up — they need in terms of mental health has gone up and _ they need in terms of mental health has gone up and up— they need in terms of mental health has gone up and up in _ they need in terms of mental health has gone up and up in terms - they need in terms of mental health has gone up and up in terms of- they need in terms of mental health has gone up and up in terms of the. has gone up and up in terms of the impact— has gone up and up in terms of the impact of— has gone up and up in terms of the impact of covid _ has gone up and up in terms of the impact of covid.— has gone up and up in terms of the l impact of covid._ my impact of covid. mark drakeford? my decision to ask— impact of covid. mark drakeford? my decision to ask baroness _ impact of covid. mark drakeford? my decision to ask baroness morgan - impact of covid. mark drakeford? my decision to ask baroness morgan to . decision to ask baroness morgan to be the ministerfor decision to ask baroness morgan to be the minister for mental health in the cabinet was exactly to demonstrate what paul has said, the parity of importance between mental and physical ill—health. but the point that paul made is one that's been echoed to me time and time again by young people in particular when i've met them. what they want is early intervention services. they want the low—level services that give them an adult they can talk to to help them with the difficult business of growing up. mental health first aid, things front line workers are able to use to give them that reassurance, to give that guidance and to stop problems from

escalating. guidance and to stop problems from escalatinu. �* . guidance and to stop problems from escalatin-. . ., . guidance and to stop problems from escalating-_ 0ne - guidance and to stop problems from escalating._ one of - guidance and to stop problems from escalating._ one of the l escalating. adam price. one of the silver lining — escalating. adam price. one of the silver lining is _ escalating. adam price. one of the silver lining is from _ escalating. adam price. one of the silver lining is from this _ escalating. adam price. one of the silver lining is from this dark- escalating. adam price. one of the silver lining is from this dark year . silver lining is from this dark year has been — silver lining is from this dark year has been i — silver lining is from this dark year has been i think the focus on the importance of mental health and i struggled myself at times in my life and i think— struggled myself at times in my life and i think it's important if you are able — and i think it's important if you are able to _ and i think it's important if you are able to share that because it allows. — are able to share that because it allows. it — are able to share that because it allows, it gives other people the confidence to reach out and get support~ — confidence to reach out and get support. we need to invest. we've -ot support. we need to invest. we've got to— support. we need to invest. we've got to raise — support. we need to invest. we've got to raise in real terms the level of spending so we can reflect its importance within the nhs. we lost inpatient _ importance within the nhs. we lost inpatient beds within the nhs. we know— inpatient beds within the nhs. we know what works, the talking therapies that are so important to people _ therapies that are so important to people. we know what to do but unfortunately we are often sending people _ unfortunately we are often sending people far away from their communities. let's take this as a before _ communities. let's take this as a before and — communities. let's take this as a before and after moment when we finally— before and after moment when we finally accept the importance of delivering that parity.

sending patients to england is what you want? hate sending patients to england is what ou want? ~ ., ., , you want? we are saying treat people on the basis — you want? we are saying treat people on the basis of _ you want? we are saying treat people on the basis of need _ you want? we are saying treat people on the basis of need rather _ you want? we are saying treat people on the basis of need rather than - on the basis of need rather than their— on the basis of need rather than their location, _ on the basis of need rather than their location, because - on the basis of need rather than their location, because at - on the basis of need rather than their location, because at the i their location, because at the moment— their location, because at the moment we _ their location, because at the moment we have _ their location, because at the moment we have a _ their location, because at the moment we have a postcode i their location, because at the - moment we have a postcode lottery, that will— moment we have a postcode lottery, that will dictate _ moment we have a postcode lottery, that will dictate what _ moment we have a postcode lottery, that will dictate what level— moment we have a postcode lottery, that will dictate what level of- that will dictate what level of service — that will dictate what level of service you _ that will dictate what level of service you get, _ that will dictate what level of service you get, but - that will dictate what level of service you get, but what - that will dictate what level of service you get, but what i i that will dictate what level of. service you get, but what i want that will dictate what level of- service you get, but what i want to ask my— service you get, but what i want to ask my colleagues _ service you get, but what i want to ask my colleagues is _ service you get, but what i want to ask my colleagues is how- service you get, but what i want to ask my colleagues is how are - service you get, but what i want to ask my colleagues is how are you i ask my colleagues is how are you going _ ask my colleagues is how are you going to — ask my colleagues is how are you going to afford _ ask my colleagues is how are you going to afford it? _ ask my colleagues is how are you going to afford it? it _ ask my colleagues is how are you going to afford it? it is— ask my colleagues is how are you going to afford it? it is all- ask my colleagues is how are you going to afford it? it is all very. going to afford it? it is all very well— going to afford it? it is all very well saying _ going to afford it? it is all very well saying that _ going to afford it? it is all very well saying that we _ going to afford it? it is all very well saying that we need - going to afford it? it is all very well saying that we need this i going to afford it? it is all very. well saying that we need this and that, _ well saying that we need this and that. we — well saying that we need this and that. we need _ well saying that we need this and that, we need more _ well saying that we need this and that, we need more doctors, - well saying that we need this and that, we need more doctors, but| well saying that we need this and - that, we need more doctors, but how can we _ that, we need more doctors, but how can we afford — that, we need more doctors, but how can we afford it? _ that, we need more doctors, but how can we afford it? we _ that, we need more doctors, but how can we afford it?— can we afford it? we pay taxes in wales as well, _ can we afford it? we pay taxes in wales as well, by _ can we afford it? we pay taxes in wales as well, by the _ can we afford it? we pay taxes in wales as well, by the way. - can we afford it? we pay taxes in wales as well, by the way. the i wales as well, by the way. the fiscal deficit, _ wales as well, by the way. the fiscal deficit, the _ wales as well, by the way. the fiscal deficit, the amount of money we get _ fiscal deficit, the amount of money we get from — fiscal deficit, the amount of money we get from the _ fiscal deficit, the amount of money we get from the uk _ fiscal deficit, the amount of money we get from the uk government. fiscal deficit, the amount of money. we get from the uk government over and above _ we get from the uk government over and above the — we get from the uk government over and above the taxes _ we get from the uk government over and above the taxes we _ we get from the uk government over and above the taxes we pay - we get from the uk government over and above the taxes we pay is - we get from the uk government over and above the taxes we pay is 40 - and above the taxes we pay is 40 billion— and above the taxes we pay is 40 billion per— and above the taxes we pay is 40 billion per year~ _ and above the taxes we pay is 40 billion per year. [i— and above the taxes we pay is 40 billion per year. [i is _ and above the taxes we pay is 40 billion per year.— billion per year. it is covered by taxes paid _ billion per year. it is covered by taxes paid in — billion per year. it is covered by taxes paid in wales, _ billion per year. it is covered by taxes paid in wales, and - billion per year. it is covered byj taxes paid in wales, and should billion per year. it is covered by i taxes paid in wales, and should it not be the people in wales who decide how the taxes are spent on their basic public services rather than a parliament next door which two thirds of their time is run by a party that we have never ever voted for in our history as a nation? where is the democracy in that? people are talking about the priority— people are talking about the

priority in mental health services but these — priority in mental health services but these parties have had government positions for the last 22 years— government positions for the last 22 years in— government positions for the last 22 years in one — government positions for the last 22 years in one shape or form, and richard — years in one shape or form, and richard would like to get rid of the welsh _ richard would like to get rid of the welsh parliament, but if the rugby team _ welsh parliament, but if the rugby team is— welsh parliament, but if the rugby team is playing well, you don't pull it out— team is playing well, you don't pull it out of— team is playing well, you don't pull it out of the — team is playing well, you don't pull it out of the competition, you change — it out of the competition, you change the management and you get them performing —— isn't playing welt _ them performing —— isn't playing welt we — them performing —— isn't playing well. we need intervention as early as possible — well. we need intervention as early as possible and that is why we promote — as possible and that is why we promote talking therapies and a national— promote talking therapies and a national register to establish people's entry into primary health care services. people's entry into primary health care services-— care services. you are the only politician _ care services. you are the only politician who _ care services. you are the only politician who would _ care services. you are the only politician who would have - care services. you are the only politician who would have a i care services. you are the only - politician who would have a hotline to borisjohnson in downing street and you could ask for extra money. that would be guaranteed if you win? we know there is £1.2 billion of unallocated money in the budget next year and _ unallocated money in the budget next year and that is a comprehensive spending — year and that is a comprehensive spending review, so it is vital that the new— spending review, so it is vital that the new government with new ideas, not the _ the new government with new ideas, not the same 22 years of ideas that have failed — not the same 22 years of ideas that have failed wales, but new ideas, makes _ have failed wales, but new ideas, makes a _ have failed wales, but new ideas, makes a comprehensive review, critical— makes a comprehensive review, critical to— makes a comprehensive review, critical to the way things are run. there _ critical to the way things are run.

there is— critical to the way things are run. there is no— critical to the way things are run. there is no guarantee of extra money coming in the barn former yet, the formula which decides what wales and scotland get —— the barnett formula. but we know that other leaders across — but we know that other leaders across the uk and indeed the prime minister— across the uk and indeed the prime minister himself has identified the additional resources we required to deal with— additional resources we required to deal with the waiting times in the nhs _ deal with the waiting times in the nhs. ., ~ , ., deal with the waiting times in the nhs. ., ~, ., ., deal with the waiting times in the nhs. . ~, ., ., ,|] nhs. that 6 billion was our money. i cannot believe _ nhs. that 6 billion was our money. i cannot believe a _ nhs. that 6 billion was our money. i cannot believe a word _ nhs. that 6 billion was our money. i cannot believe a word the _ nhs. that 6 billion was our money. i cannot believe a word the welsh - cannot believe a word the welsh conservative say, after putting in their manifesto... pleased and interrupted me, mr davies. in the manifesto they said they would have five new build hospitals which has been revised, so how can we trust what the welsh conservatives are saying? i would like to get back to paul, thanks for the work you do, so important, and i am a social worker and have been for 27 years and i know the effect that this covid lockdown has had own children and young people and we need to listen to you, the professionals, and make the decision is based on what you

tell us are the most important things. tell us are the most important thins. ., ., tell us are the most important thints_ ., .,, ., tell us are the most important thins. ., ., , tell us are the most important thints. ., ., , ., tell us are the most important thins. ., ., things. you as a party often say these issues _ things. you as a party often say these issues predate _ things. you as a party often say these issues predate the - things. you as a party often say - these issues predate the pandemic, they are long—standing, part of austerity, and you were part of the partnership, the coalition in downing street, which brought in austerity, so you must take some responsibility for the hangover of austerity? let responsibility for the hangover of austeri ? , ., _, austerity? let me put on record, when the liberal _ austerity? let me put on record, when the liberal democrats - austerity? let me put on record, | when the liberal democrats were austerity? let me put on record, i when the liberal democrats were in coalition with a conservative majority government, i absolutely did not agree with their programme of austerity. i was ashamed of it and i'm putting that very clearly on record right now. mar; and i'm putting that very clearly on record right now.— and i'm putting that very clearly on record right now. may i 'ust say, to eve one record right now. may i 'ust say, to eveenery at — record right now. may i 'ust say, to everyone at home, i record right now. may i 'ust say, to everyone at home, do i record right now. may ijust say, to everyone at home, do you - record right now. may ijust say, to everyone at home, do you believel everyone at home, do you believe that the _ everyone at home, do you believe that the health service in wales is run efficiently and your benefit? because — run efficiently and your benefit? because my experience is that it isn't _ because my experience is that it isn't and — because my experience is that it isn't and despite what my colleagues here say. _ isn't and despite what my colleagues here say, how can we trust that they will deliver— here say, how can we trust that they will deliver on the promises that they have — will deliver on the promises that they have put in their manifestos?

mark— they have put in their manifestos? mark drakeford.— they have put in their manifestos? mark drakeford. wales has the lowest rate of coronavirus _ mark drakeford. wales has the lowest rate of coronavirus anywhere - mark drakeford. wales has the lowest rate of coronavirus anywhere in - mark drakeford. wales has the lowest rate of coronavirus anywhere in the i rate of coronavirus anywhere in the uk at the moment, and our vaccination programme is the most successful of any of the four uk nations. that is the work of our nhs, and when richard says he would hand us back to westminster, he is writing off everything that our people have done over the last extraordinary 12 months. it has shown the strength of our nhs and of the way we do things here in wales and we have kept people safe and we have done it at the most successful level in the uk. that is the case for the welsh nhs and i'm absolutely proud of it. i don't take kindly to people who suggest to us that things in wales cannot controlled by people who live and work and vote in wales. do our mps not live in wales? why do

we have _ do our mps not live in wales? why do we have mps and assembly members, both of— we have mps and assembly members, both of whom are doing half a job and getting a full pay packet? why is that— and getting a full pay packet? why is that happening? why are we squandering money on vanity projects that are _ squandering money on vanity projects that are costing this nation hundreds of millions of pounds? let's _ hundreds of millions of pounds? let's stick— hundreds of millions of pounds? let's stick to health. adam price. let's stick to health. adam price. let's remember, of course, despite the incredibly— let's remember, of course, despite the incredibly heroic— let's remember, of course, despite the incredibly heroic efforts - let's remember, of course, despite the incredibly heroic efforts by i let's remember, of course, despite the incredibly heroic efforts by the. the incredibly heroic efforts by the nhs and _ the incredibly heroic efforts by the nhs and everyone _ the incredibly heroic efforts by the nhs and everyone in— the incredibly heroic efforts by the nhs and everyone in wales - the incredibly heroic efforts by the nhs and everyone in wales that i the incredibly heroic efforts by the i nhs and everyone in wales that has sacrificed _ nhs and everyone in wales that has sacrificed over— nhs and everyone in wales that has sacrificed over the _ nhs and everyone in wales that has sacrificed over the last _ nhs and everyone in wales that has sacrificed over the last year, - nhs and everyone in wales that has sacrificed over the last year, i- sacrificed over the last year, i would — sacrificed over the last year, i would also _ sacrificed over the last year, i would also like _ sacrificed over the last year, i would also like to _ sacrificed over the last year, i would also like to pay- sacrificed over the last year, i would also like to pay tributel sacrificed over the last year, i. would also like to pay tribute to the first — would also like to pay tribute to the first minister, _ would also like to pay tribute to i the first minister, unconventional and at _ the first minister, unconventional and at night — the first minister, unconventional and at night like _ the first minister, unconventional and at night like this, _ the first minister, unconventional and at night like this, but- the first minister, unconventional and at night like this, but he i the first minister, unconventional and at night like this, but he has. and at night like this, but he has been _ and at night like this, but he has been a _ and at night like this, but he has been a conscientious _ and at night like this, but he has been a conscientious and - and at night like this, but he has. been a conscientious and seriously dear contrasting _ been a conscientious and seriously dear contrasting with— been a conscientious and seriously dear contrasting with some - been a conscientious and seriously dear contrasting with some of i been a conscientious and seriously dear contrasting with some of the i dear contrasting with some of the other— dear contrasting with some of the other leaders _ dear contrasting with some of the other leaders —— _ dear contrasting with some of the other leaders —— serious- dear contrasting with some of the other leaders —— serious leader. other leaders —— serious leader contrasting _ other leaders —— serious leader contrasting with— other leaders —— serious leader contrasting with some - other leaders —— serious leader contrasting with some of - other leaders —— serious leader contrasting with some of the i other leaders —— serious leader. contrasting with some of the other leaders _ contrasting with some of the other leaders. ., .., contrasting with some of the other leaders. ., _, ., ., ., leaders. you could do a deal with him. leaders. you could do a deal with him- despite _ leaders. you could do a deal with him. despite all— leaders. you could do a deal with him. despite all that, _ leaders. you could do a deal with him. despite all that, the - leaders. you could do a deal with him. despite all that, the sad i him. despite all that, the sad reality is. _ him. despite all that, the sad reality is. in _ him. despite all that, the sad reality is, in wales _ him. despite all that, the sad reality is, in wales as - him. despite all that, the sad reality is, in wales as in i him. despite all that, the sad reality is, in wales as in the l him. despite all that, the sad i reality is, in wales as in the rest of the _ reality is, in wales as in the rest of the uk. — reality is, in wales as in the rest of the uk. we _ reality is, in wales as in the rest of the uk, we have— reality is, in wales as in the rest of the uk, we have had- reality is, in wales as in the rest of the uk, we have had one i reality is, in wales as in the rest of the uk, we have had one of. reality is, in wales as in the rest i of the uk, we have had one of the highest _ of the uk, we have had one of the highest death _ of the uk, we have had one of the highest death rates. _ of the uk, we have had one of the

highest death rates. why? - of the uk, we have had one of the highest death rates. why? you i highest death rates. why? you referenced _ highest death rates. why? you referenced it. _ highest death rates. why? you referenced it. the _ highest death rates. why? you referenced it. the deep- highest death rates. why? you i referenced it. the deep inequalities that are _ referenced it. the deep inequalities that are there — referenced it. the deep inequalities that are there and _ referenced it. the deep inequalities that are there and of— referenced it. the deep inequalities that are there and of course - referenced it. the deep inequalities that are there and of course the i that are there and of course the association _ that are there and of course the association between _ that are there and of course the association between those i association between those inequalities, _ association between those inequalities, the _ association between those inequalities, the poverty. association between those i inequalities, the poverty and inequality— inequalities, the poverty and inequality and _ inequalities, the poverty and inequality and that _ inequalities, the poverty and inequality and that is - inequalities, the poverty and inequality and that is a - inequalities, the poverty and i inequality and that is a legacy of successive — inequality and that is a legacy of successive westminster- inequality and that is a legacy of- successive westminster governments, tabour_ successive westminster governments, labour and — successive westminster governments, labour and conservative, _ successive westminster governments, labour and conservative, that - successive westminster governments, labour and conservative, that have i labour and conservative, that have neglected — labour and conservative, that have neglected working _ labour and conservative, that have neglected working class _ labour and conservative, that have i neglected working class communities in wales _ neglected working class communities in wales that — neglected working class communities in wales that is— neglected working class communities in wales. that is why _ neglected working class communities in wales. that is why we _ neglected working class communities in wales. that is why we should i in wales. that is why we should never— in wales. that is why we should never give — in wales. that is why we should never give the _ in wales. that is why we should never give the keys _ in wales. that is why we should never give the keys to - in wales. that is why we should never give the keys to our - in wales. that is why we should never give the keys to our own. never give the keys to our own democracy _ never give the keys to our own democracy back— never give the keys to our own democracy back to _ never give the keys to our own democracy back to them. i never give the keys to our own democracy back to them. [- never give the keys to our own democracy back to them. i want to ick u- democracy back to them. i want to pick up on — democracy back to them. i want to pick up on that _ democracy back to them. i want to pick up on that point, _ democracy back to them. i want to pick up on that point, from - democracy back to them. i want to pick up on that point, from mark, | pick up on that point, from mark, where he said welsh labour have kept wales save, but wales has the highest death rate because of covid, regrettably, but having the link with the uk, that strengthens what we can do in wales, going forward, whether that is with the economy or health or education because a strong union benefits wales and wales benefits the union. the break—up adam would like to see at the constitutional chaos that would come from that referendum that he would like to put on the table over the next five years would detract from the work of the nhs and the

rebuilding after covid and delivering primary mental health services which we are aware that our display needed and building the staff morale back and we need a government that doesn't focus on constitutional change and referendums but focuses on rebuilding after the covid crisis. adam price, sorry. mark drakeford, do you acknowledge that the vaccine programme is a success down to the uk government? i programme is a success down to the uk government?— uk government? i absolutely agree that the uk government _ uk government? i absolutely agree that the uk government has - uk government? i absolutely agree that the uk government has done l uk government? i absolutely agree that the uk government has done a -ood that the uk government has done a good job— that the uk government has done a good job in— that the uk government has done a good job in securing supply of vaccine — good job in securing supply of vaccine for the whole of the uk. but in wales_ vaccine for the whole of the uk. but in wales we — vaccine for the whole of the uk. but in wales we have used that supply more _ in wales we have used that supply more effectively than anywhere else because _ more effectively than anywhere else because of the success of our nhs. jane dodds. | because of the success of our nhs. jane badde— jane dodds. i want to say, it is sad that we are — jane dodds. i want to say, it is sad that we are arguing _ jane dodds. i want to say, it is sad that we are arguing about - jane dodds. i want to say, it is sad l that we are arguing about something so critical like people's lives, we have seen an amazing feat by our scientists and doctors and nurses, in order to look after us as

patients and to save lives and to vaccinate us, and that is where the credit is due, not because of government, it is about the scientists and the medics and haven't they done a greatjob? let's just say that is the case because let's not argue about this. let's not play politics with this and let's concentrate on what the medics and professionals have done. mam and professionals have done. adam price. i and professionals have done. adam price- i think _ and professionals have done. adam price. i think that _ and professionals have done. adam price. i think that is _ and professionals have done. adam price. i think that is right. - and professionals have done. adam price. i think that is right. what - price. i think that is right. what we have seen _ price. i think that is right. what we have seen in _ price. i think that is right. what we have seen in the _ price. i think that is right. what we have seen in the pandemic i price. i think that is right. what i we have seen in the pandemic are great _ we have seen in the pandemic are great examples of innovation, and we have seeri— great examples of innovation, and we have seen the nhs which in wales has moved _ have seen the nhs which in wales has moved with_ have seen the nhs which in wales has moved with great agility and in the most _ moved with great agility and in the most enormous pressure, the hospitals — most enormous pressure, the hospitals that went up in weeks and the vaccination programme, local government working with the nhs, there _ government working with the nhs, there in_ government working with the nhs, there in lies a model of the future and coming — there in lies a model of the future and coming out of this pandemic, so let's apply— and coming out of this pandemic, so let's apply that to all the problems we have _ let's apply that to all the problems we have talked about in the challenges in the nhs tonight, let's take that _ challenges in the nhs tonight, let's take that spirit and apply it to the new wales we want to build. thank ou ve new wales we want to build. thank you very much- _ new wales we want to build. thank you very much- it _ new wales we want to build. thank you very much. it has _ new wales we want to build. thank you very much. it has been - new wales we want to build. thank you very much. it has been a - new wales we want to build. thank you very much. it has been a year. new wales we want to build. thank. you very much. it has been a year or more in wales of closed schools,

cancelled exams, and uncertainjob markets for young people so with the next question, we have ruth who lives near wrexham.— next question, we have ruth who lives near wrexham. thank you, good evenin: . lives near wrexham. thank you, good evening- i'm — lives near wrexham. thank you, good evening- i'm a — lives near wrexham. thank you, good evening. i'm a school— lives near wrexham. thank you, good evening. i'm a school nurse _ lives near wrexham. thank you, good evening. i'm a school nurse working l evening. i'm a school nurse working with a _ evening. i'm a school nurse working with a nursing — evening. i'm a school nurse working with a nursing team, _ evening. i'm a school nurse working with a nursing team, and _ evening. i'm a school nurse working with a nursing team, and over- evening. i'm a school nurse working with a nursing team, and over the l with a nursing team, and over the last 12 _ with a nursing team, and over the last 12 months _ with a nursing team, and over the last 12 months during _ with a nursing team, and over the last 12 months during this - with a nursing team, and over the i last 12 months during this pandemic, we have _ last 12 months during this pandemic, we have treen— last 12 months during this pandemic, we have been working _ last 12 months during this pandemic, we have been working with _ last 12 months during this pandemic, we have been working with young. we have been working with young people. _ we have been working with young people, exhibiting _ we have been working with young people, exhibiting levels- we have been working with young people, exhibiting levels of- we have been working with young people, exhibiting levels of poorl people, exhibiting levels of poor mental— people, exhibiting levels of poor mental health, _ people, exhibiting levels of poor mental health, and _ people, exhibiting levels of poor mental health, and my- people, exhibiting levels of poor mental health, and my question| people, exhibiting levels of poor. mental health, and my question is, what _ mental health, and my question is, what would — mental health, and my question is, what would he _ mental health, and my question is, what would be yours _ mental health, and my question is, what would be yours and _ mental health, and my question is, what would be yours and your- mental health, and my question is, i what would be yours and your party's plan to _ what would be yours and your party's plan to increase _ what would be yours and your party's plan to increase practical— what would be yours and your party's plan to increase practical support - plan to increase practical support for young — plan to increase practical support for young people _ plan to increase practical support for young people and _ plan to increase practical support for young people and the - for young people and the organisations— for young people and the organisations who - for young people and the organisations who work i for young people and the - organisations who work alongside them _ organisations who work alongside them in _ organisations who work alongside them in improving _ organisations who work alongside them in improving mental- organisations who work alongside them in improving mental health| them in improving mental health provision? — them in improving mental health rovision? ., ~ them in improving mental health rovision? . ,, them in improving mental health rovision? ., ~' , them in improving mental health rovision? . , . provision? thank you very much. let's focus _ provision? thank you very much. let's focus on _ provision? thank you very much. let's focus on young _ provision? thank you very much. let's focus on young people, - let's focus on young people, schools, job creation schemes, jane dodds. schools, 'ob creation schemes, jane dodds. ., ~' , ., , . schools, 'ob creation schemes, jane dodds. . ,, , . . schools, 'ob creation schemes, jane dodds. . , . . . ,, dodds. thank you very much and thank ou for the dodds. thank you very much and thank you for the work— dodds. thank you very much and thank you for the work that _ dodds. thank you very much and thank you for the work that you _ dodds. thank you very much and thank you for the work that you and - dodds. thank you very much and thank you for the work that you and your - you for the work that you and your organisation does, it is really important. to talk about the welsh

education minister who is a liberal democrat and what she has been doing, she has been rolling out mental health hubs within schools and we need to extend those absolutely. i would like to talk about organisations like the one ruthis about organisations like the one ruth is from, the third sector, really important that we absolutely recognise their roles, bring them to the table, they should be a statutory position where third sector organisations can come to the table and talk with us about the work they do. young people in particular, the welsh liberal democrats want to do things like free school, free bus travel, we want to make sure there is an absolute expectation that employers take on young people, because this has been such a difficult time for young people, almost like a lost generation. we really need to focus on them and support them. thank you ruth for all you do. i on them and support them. thank you ruth for all you do.— ruth for all you do. i lost generation. _ ruth for all you do. i lost generation. difficult - ruth for all you do. i lostj generation. difficult time ruth for all you do. i lost - generation. difficult time for young people so is now the time to bring in a new curriculum, a revolution in the way schools work? you mention

kirsty williams who is in charge of education, but is now the time for a revolution in schools? i get education, but is now the time for a revolution in schools?— revolution in schools? i get the idea, of course, _ revolution in schools? i get the idea, of course, but _ revolution in schools? i get the idea, of course, but it - revolution in schools? i get the idea, of course, but it is - idea, of course, but it is absolutely something that everybody wants, because we haven't had a major... wants, because we haven't had a ma'or. .. .. wants, because we haven't had a ma'or... ., , . major... the teaching unions that don't want _ major... the teaching unions that don't want it. _ major... the teaching unions that don't want it. some _ major... the teaching unions that don't want it. some teaching - major... the teaching unions that i don't want it. some teaching unions don't want it. some teaching unions do want it and _ don't want it. some teaching unions do want it and there _ don't want it. some teaching unions do want it and there are _ do want it and there are organisations that support it and we do need to be moving forward on this. the first made in wales curriculum since we started and it is essential that we move forward and push up the education standards, all the time, so we can build on what has been happening. delay it? we need to push — what has been happening. delay it? we need to push it _ what has been happening. delay it? we need to push it forward, - what has been happening. delay it? we need to push it forward, it - what has been happening. delay it? we need to push it forward, it is - we need to push it forward, it is already in train and the planning is there so let's make sure we continue those achievements for our young people in terms of the new curriculum.— people in terms of the new curriculum.- i'm . people in terms of the new i curriculum.- i'm not people in terms of the new - curriculum.- i'm not going curriculum. richard? i'm not going to pretend — curriculum. richard? i'm not going to pretend to _ curriculum. richard? i'm not going to pretend to be _ curriculum. richard? i'm not going to pretend to be an _ curriculum. richard? i'm not going to pretend to be an expert - curriculum. richard? i'm not going to pretend to be an expert on - curriculum. richard? i'm not going i to pretend to be an expert on mental health. _ to pretend to be an expert on mental health. iet _ to pretend to be an expert on mental health, let me say that upfront, but what baffles me is that one of the

aspects _ what baffles me is that one of the aspects of— what baffles me is that one of the aspects of mental health is giving someone — aspects of mental health is giving someone hope, hope for the future, and frankly. — someone hope, hope for the future, and frankly, having already one of the poorest levels of education in the poorest levels of education in the united kingdom, and in the lower quartile _ the united kingdom, and in the lower quartile of— the united kingdom, and in the lower quartile of the oecd report, this hardly— quartile of the oecd report, this hardly gives us hope and optimism. then creating a welsh baccalaureate, a different _ then creating a welsh baccalaureate, a different qualification that virtually no business outside of wales, — virtually no business outside of wales, inside of wales to a large degree, — wales, inside of wales to a large degree, but outside of wales will even _ degree, but outside of wales will even understand.— degree, but outside of wales will even understand. how even understand. mark drakeford. how does that give — even understand. mark drakeford. how does that give people _ even understand. mark drakeford. how does that give people hope _ even understand. mark drakeford. how does that give people hope and - even understand. mark drakeford. how does that give people hope and of - does that give people hope and of course _ does that give people hope and of course people are going to... mark drakeford- — course people are going to... mark drakeford. thank _ course people are going to... mark drakeford. thank you _ course people are going to... mark drakeford. thank you for _ course people are going to... mark drakeford. thank you for the - drakeford. thank you for the question- — drakeford. thank you for the question- i _ drakeford. thank you for the question. i agree _ drakeford. thank you for the question. i agree with - drakeford. thank you for the question. i agree with what l drakeford. thank you for the - question. i agree with what richard said, hope for the future is important, and i'm passionately determined that there will be no lost generation in wales. as a

result of the pandemic. we saw what happened in wales in the 805 when our young people really were written off in the great margaret thatcher experiment and that is why we offer a guarantee in our manifesto of work, training or education for all our young people, as we work to make the economy recover. a5 for mental health... the economy recover. as for mental health... �* ., ., ., . health... before we move on, you are offerin: health... before we move on, you are offering the — health... before we move on, you are offering the guarantee _ health... before we move on, you are offering the guarantee now, _ health... before we move on, you are offering the guarantee now, you - offering the guarantee now, you could have done that by now, 50 offering the guarantee now, you could have done that by now, so why is that going to be possible after may but not now? the is that going to be possible after may but not now?— may but not now? the levels of employment — may but not now? the levels of employment in _ may but not now? the levels of employment in wales - may but not now? the levels of employment in wales are - may but not now? the levels of| employment in wales are higher may but not now? the levels of- employment in wales are higher than in the uk at the levels of unemployment are lower than in the uk, but we have an economic crisis that goes alongside the pandemic, 50 we need in the next two years special measures to make sure that our young people coming out of school and college, where there normal opportunities won't be available, that we make sure that that period is not wasted in their lives. ~ ., that period is not wasted in their lives. ~ . ,., that period is not wasted in their lives. ~ . ., ., ,, that period is not wasted in their lives. ~ . ., lives. what sort of 'obs can you offer these h lives. what sort of jobs can you offer these people? _

lives. what sort of jobs can you offer these people? jobs - lives. what sort ofjobs can you | offer these people? jobs across lives. what sort ofjobs can you - offer these people? jobs across the board, offer these people? jobs across the board. using _ offer these people? jobs across the board, using our _ offer these people? jobs across the board, using our social— offer these people? jobs across the board, using our social partnership| board, using our social partnership forum and working with the private sector employers, i've been with a large engineering company to date who will take on apprenticeships, and they do that every year, we will create 125,000 new apprentices in wales and the metal —— mental health point ruth reyes, when i have spoken to young people, a mental health champion, what they say they want, a variety of ways, contacting people online, speaking on the telephone, having better services in schools, mental health is absolutely not enough to provide one sort of service. you need to provide a variety of services so that young people with different sorts of needs and responding in different ways know the help is available. adam price, on thejobs guarantee that labour is offering, you say you would give everyone in wales under 24 would give everyone in wales under 2a a job. where and how would those jobs come?

24 a job. where and how would those 'obs come? ~ �* ., 24 a job. where and how would those 'obs come? ~ �* . . ~ , ., jobs come? we'll have a £6 billion welsh green _ jobs come? we'll have a £6 billion welsh green deal _ jobs come? we'll have a £6 billion welsh green deal investing - jobs come? we'll have a £6 billion welsh green deal investing in - welsh green deal investing in renewable energy and infrastructure investment across wales. we'll be investing — investment across wales. we'll be investing in creating jobs in public services, — investing in creating jobs in public services, from childcare to education. we'll be working with private _ education. we'll be working with private sector employers and providing the wage subsidies which youth _ providing the wage subsidies which youthjob guarantees... how providing the wage subsidies which youth job guarantees. . ._ youth 'ob guarantees... how many 'obs youth job guarantees... how many jobs would — youth job guarantees... how many jobs would you _ youth job guarantees... how many jobs would you be _ youth job guarantees... how many jobs would you be creating? - youth job guarantees... how many jobs would you be creating? howl youth job guarantees... how many - jobs would you be creating? how many would be needed?— would be needed? 60,000 'obs directly through i would be needed? 60,000 'obs directly through the i would be needed? 60,000 'obs directly through the welsh h would be needed? 60,000jobs| directly through the welsh green deal _ directly through the welsh green deal. we've said that, different to the welsh... all deal. we've said that, different to the welsh- - -_ deal. we've said that, different to the welsh. . ._ we - deal. we've said that, different to | the welsh. . ._ we will the welsh... all in a year? we will have a five — the welsh... all in a year? we will have a five year _ the welsh... all in a year? we will have a five year commitment. - the welsh... all in a year? we will have a five year commitment. we | have a five year commitment. we think— have a five year commitment. we think we — have a five year commitment. we think we shouldn'tjust have a two-year— think we shouldn'tjust have a two—year programme in terms of youth employment. we've got to eradicate youth _ employment. we've got to eradicate youth and _ employment. we've got to eradicate youth and employment because we all lose, talk— youth and employment because we all lose, talk about a lost generation. wales— lose, talk about a lost generation. wales loses if we have long—term youth _ wales loses if we have long—term youth unemployment because it means

those young people can't realise their— those young people can't realise their potential.— those young people can't realise their potential. andrew rt davies? it's about their potential. andrew rt davies? it's about hope _ their potential. andrew rt davies? it's about hope and _ their potential. andrew rt davies? it's about hope and building - their potential. andrew rt davies? it's about hope and building backi it's about hope and building back after the covid crisis and making sure that we create the 65,000 jobs in the economy, 15,000 of which are greenjobs. in the economy, 15,000 of which are green 'obs. . ,., in the economy, 15,000 of which are green jobs-— green 'obs. labour and plaid cymru and greenjobs. labour and plaid cymru and the liberals _ greenjobs. labour and plaid cymru and the liberals in _ greenjobs. labour and plaid cymru and the liberals in abolition - greenjobs. labour and plaid cymru and the liberals in abolition have i and the liberals in abolition have had five years to do that. share and the liberals in abolition have had five years to do that. are you offerin: had five years to do that. are you offering every _ had five years to do that. are you offering every young _ had five years to do that. are you offering every young person - had five years to do that. are you offering every young person a - had five years to do that. are you offering every young person a job within a year? eds, offering every young person a 'ob within a year?�* offering every young person a 'ob within a yeart�* within a year? a reformed career service, within a year? a reformed career service. an _ within a year? a reformed career service, an arm's-length - within a year? a reformed career. service, an arm's-length economic service, an arm's—length economic organisation based on what used to be done to create a real economy, not falsely promised. businesses create jobs, not falsely promised. businesses createjobs, working not falsely promised. businesses create jobs, working with government to create a real economy and create prosperity. to create a real economy and create throseri . �* . to create a real economy and create throseri . �*, . ., . prosperity. let's hear from a ounter prosperity. let's hear from a younger audience _ prosperity. let's hear from a younger audience member. | prosperity. let's hear from a - younger audience member. sophie, what do you make of what's been said? ~ . what do you make of what's been said? . , . , , said? well, being a university first-year _ said? well, being a university first-year students, _ said? well, being a university first-year students, the - said? well, being a university first-year students, the last l said? well, being a university| first-year students, the last 12 first—year students, the last 12 months — first—year students, the last 12 months has _ first—year students, the last 12 months has been _ first—year students, the last 12

months has been really- first—year students, the last 12 months has been really hard. i first—year students, the last 12 - months has been really hard. going from face—to—face _ months has been really hard. going from face—to—face teaching - months has been really hard. going from face—to—face teaching to - months has been really hard. goingl from face—to—face teaching to online learning _ from face—to—face teaching to online learning it's— from face—to—face teaching to online learning it'sjust. _ from face—to—face teaching to online learning. it'sjust, yeah, _ from face—to—face teaching to online learning. it'sjust, yeah, it's- from face—to—face teaching to online learning. it'sjust, yeah, it's been. learning. it'sjust, yeah, it's been really— learning. it'sjust, yeah, it's been really difficult _ learning. it'sjust, yeah, it's been really difficult because _ learning. it'sjust, yeah, it's been really difficult because i'm - learning. it'sjust, yeah, it's been really difficult because i'm in - learning. it'sjust, yeah, it's been really difficult because i'm in myi really difficult because i'm in my last year— really difficult because i'm in my last year and _ really difficult because i'm in my last year and i've _ really difficult because i'm in my last year and i've been - really difficult because i'm in my last year and i've been doing - last year and i've been doing face—to—face _ last year and i've been doing face—to—face learning - last year and i've been doing face—to—face learning for - last year and i've been doing i face—to—face learning for three years — face—to—face learning for three years i— face—to—face learning for three years. i found _ face—to—face learning for three years. i found it _ face—to—face learning for three years. i found it difficult - face—to—face learning for three years. i found it difficult to - face—to—face learning for three years. i found it difficult to doi years. i found it difficult to do the online _ years. i found it difficult to do the online learning. _ years. i found it difficult to do the online learning. we - years. i found it difficult to do the online learning. we don't| years. i found it difficult to do - the online learning. we don't seem to he _ the online learning. we don't seem to be getting — the online learning. we don't seem to be getting the _ the online learning. we don't seem to be getting the same _ the online learning. we don't seem to be getting the same support- the online learning. we don't seem to be getting the same support as. the online learning. we don't seem i to be getting the same support as we did face—to—face. _ to be getting the same support as we did face—to—face. i— to be getting the same support as we did face—to—face. i know— to be getting the same support as we did face—to—face. i know it's- to be getting the same support as we did face—to—face. i know it's a - to be getting the same support as we did face—to—face. i know it's a lot - did face—to—face. i know it's a lot of pressure — did face—to—face. i know it's a lot of pressure on _ did face—to—face. i know it's a lot of pressure on tutors _ did face—to—face. i know it's a lot of pressure on tutors but - did face—to—face. i know it's a lot of pressure on tutors but we - did face—to—face. i know it's a lot of pressure on tutors but we feel| of pressure on tutors but we feel like we _ of pressure on tutors but we feel like we aren't— of pressure on tutors but we feel like we aren't getting _ of pressure on tutors but we feel like we aren't getting enough - like we aren't getting enough support _ like we aren't getting enough su- tort. ~ ., like we aren't getting enough su- tort. ~ . ., like we aren't getting enough su-tort. ~ ., ., ~' like we aren't getting enough su-tort. . ., ,, ., . support. what would you like to hear from these politicians? _ support. what would you like to hear from these politicians? how- support. what would you like to hear from these politicians? how can - support. what would you like to hear from these politicians? how can they make things better for you from these politicians? how can they make things betterfor you end from these politicians? how can they make things better for you end the remaining period in university? the?r remaining period in university? they need to realise _ remaining period in university? they need to realise and _ remaining period in university? they need to realise and recognise... they're — need to realise and recognise... they're always _ need to realise and recognise... they're always on _ need to realise and recognise... they're always on about - need to realise and recognise... they're always on about schools need to realise and recognise... - they're always on about schools and little ones _ they're always on about schools and little one's schools _ they're always on about schools and little one's schools but _ they're always on about schools and little one's schools but they- they're always on about schools and little one's schools but they aren't i little one's schools but they aren't looking _ little one's schools but they aren't looking at — little one's schools but they aren't looking at adults _ little one's schools but they aren't looking at adults as _ little one's schools but they aren't

looking at adults as well. - little one's schools but they aren't looking at adults as well. 0nline i looking at adults as well. 0nline isn't _ looking at adults as well. 0nline isn't helping _ looking at adults as well. 0nline isn't helping us _ looking at adults as well. 0nline isn't helping us with _ looking at adults as well. 0nline isn't helping us with our- looking at adults as well. 0nline| isn't helping us with our studies. have _ isn't helping us with our studies. have you — isn't helping us with our studies. have you got— isn't helping us with our studies. have you got a _ isn't helping us with our studies. have you got a job _ isn't helping us with our studies. have you got a job to _ isn't helping us with our studies. have you got a job to go - isn't helping us with our studies. have you got a job to go to? - isn't helping us with our studies. | have you got a job to go to? how isn't helping us with our studies. i have you got a job to go to? how is it looking after uni?— have you got a job to go to? how is it looking after uni? yes. you're 0k? it looking after uni? yes. you're ok? i'm working _ it looking after uni? yes. you're ok? i'm working on _ it looking after uni? yes. you're ok? i'm working on a _ it looking after uni? yes. you're ok? i'm working on a care - it looking after uni? yes. you're| ok? i'm working on a care home it looking after uni? yes. you're . ok? i'm working on a care home as it looking after uni? yes. you're - ok? i'm working on a care home as an assistant, ok? i'm working on a care home as an assistant. so — ok? i'm working on a care home as an assistant. so we _ ok? i'm working on a care home as an assistant, so i've been _ ok? i'm working on a care home as an assistant, so i've been doing - ok? i'm working on a care home as an assistant, so i've been doing that - assistant, so i've been doing that assistant, so i've been doing that as well— assistant, so i've been doing that as well as — assistant, so i've been doing that as well as doing _ assistant, so i've been doing that as well as doing my _ assistant, so i've been doing that as well as doing my studies. - assistant, so i've been doing that as well as doing my studies. it'si as well as doing my studies. it's been _ as well as doing my studies. it's been very— as well as doing my studies. it's been very difficult. _ as well as doing my studies. it's been very difficult.— been very difficult. maybe you'd like some of— been very difficult. maybe you'd like some of your _ been very difficult. maybe you'd like some of your tuition - been very difficult. maybe you'd like some of your tuition fees i been very difficult. maybe you'd i like some of your tuition fees back if it hasn't been great this year? some nodding here. who is offering to push for that, then? we some nodding here. who is offering to push for that, then?— some nodding here. who is offering to push for that, then? we have that in our manifesto _ to push for that, then? we have that in our manifesto that _ to push for that, then? we have that in our manifesto that they _ to push for that, then? we have that in our manifesto that they will - to push for that, then? we have that in our manifesto that they will be - to push for that, then? we have that in our manifesto that they will be a l in our manifesto that they will be a reimbursable after the course has not been up to standard. as a father whose daughter started her course and made the choice to opt out i can understand the difficulties that sophie and many students have faced but also our commitment to create 150,000 apprenticeships and also about vocational courses. the

economy of the 215t—century needs vocational skills as well as academic skills. we vocational skills as well as academic skills.— vocational skills as well as academic skills. . . . academic skills. we are offering a two mission _ academic skills. we are offering a two mission fees _ academic skills. we are offering a two mission fees cut _ academic skills. we are offering a two mission fees cut not - academic skills. we are offering a two mission fees cut notjust - academic skills. we are offering a two mission fees cut notjust as i academic skills. we are offering a two mission fees cut notjust as a| two mission fees cut not just as a one-off— two mission fees cut not just as a one-off but— two mission fees cut not just as a one—off but permanently —— tuition fees cat~ _ one—off but permanently —— tuition fees cat. returning to what i had, a free university education. we should be attracting people into education and we _ be attracting people into education and we need to raise the education maintenance allowance.— and we need to raise the education maintenance allowance. tuition fees are difficult for _ maintenance allowance. tuition fees are difficult for you, _ maintenance allowance. tuition fees are difficult for you, jane _ maintenance allowance. tuition fees are difficult for you, jane dodds, - are difficult for you, jane dodds, but would you offer and make sure that people like sophie are refunded? lethfe that people like sophie are refunded?— that people like sophie are refunded? ~ ., ., ., ., ~' that people like sophie are refunded? . ., ., . refunded? we would need to look at it. iwant refunded? we would need to look at it- i want to — refunded? we would need to look at it- i want to say _ refunded? we would need to look at it. i want to say about _ refunded? we would need to look at it. i want to say about tuition - it. i want to say about tuition fees, taking a back to the coalition. people don't raise it any more on the doorsteps. they're worried about theirjobs. for people like sophie working in a care home, thank you for what you do. we need

to make sure we look after our carers, people who look after older people and vulnerable, you need better pay and conditions. flanl better pay and conditions. can i 'ust. .. better pay and conditions. can i just- -- we _ better pay and conditions. can i just... we want _ better pay and conditions. can i just... we want to _ better pay and conditions. can i just. .. we want to hear- better pay and conditions. can i just... we want to hear from i better pay and conditions. can i i just... we want to hear from mark drakeford- — just... we want to hear from mark drakeford. sophie's _ just... we want to hear from mark drakeford. sophie's position - just... we want to hear from mark drakeford. sophie's position is - just... we want to hear from mark| drakeford. sophie's position is why we offer the _ drakeford. sophie's position is why we offer the guarantee _ drakeford. sophie's position is why we offer the guarantee because - drakeford. sophie's position is why we offer the guarantee because as| we offer the guarantee because as sophie completes her education... it's remarkable to hear she's been working as a care work as well. as she completes her education i am just as determined that the next period in her life will be once where she can build for that future with a job, continuing education if that's what she'd prefer, going into a modern apprenticeship where degree level work really matters. that future will be there for young people in wales with a labour government. people in wales with a labour government-— people in wales with a labour government. people in wales with a labour tovernment. . ., , ., government. would you refund the fees? i government. would you refund the fees? i don't _ government. would you refund the fees? i don't live _ government. would you refund the fees? i don't live in _ government. would you refund the fees? i don't live in a _ government. would you refund the fees? i don't live in a fantasyland. | fees? i don't live in a fantasyland. frankly l'm _ fees? i don't live in a fantasyland. frankly i'm listening _ fees? i don't live in a fantasyland. frankly i'm listening to _ fees? i don't live in a fantasyland. frankly i'm listening to what - fees? i don't live in a fantasyland. frankly i'm listening to what my i frankly i'm listening to what my colleagues are saying here and the first thing — colleagues are saying here and the first thing that springs to mind is, why haven't you done this already,

and where's — why haven't you done this already, and where's the money going to come from? _ and where's the money going to come from? ., ., �* from? you wouldn't refund the fees? i didn't sa from? you wouldn't refund the fees? i didn't say that. _ from? you wouldn't refund the fees? i didn't say that, i'm _ from? you wouldn't refund the fees? i didn't say that, i'm saying - from? you wouldn't refund the fees? i didn't say that, i'm saying you - i didn't say that, i'm saying you have _ i didn't say that, i'm saying you have to — i didn't say that, i'm saying you have to be _ i didn't say that, i'm saying you have to be able to afford it. where will the _ have to be able to afford it. where will the money come from? we will support— will the money come from? we will support any— will the money come from? we will support any initiative that can support— support any initiative that can support any initiative that can support any pupil or any student providing — support any pupil or any student providing it's not at the sacrifice of other— providing it's not at the sacrifice of other perhaps arguably short—term issues _ of other perhaps arguably short—term issues one _ of other perhaps arguably short—term issues. one last thing. we need to bring _ issues. one last thing. we need to bring in _ issues. one last thing. we need to bring in things like free schools and academies so that people will have an _ and academies so that people will have an opportunity to increase their— have an opportunity to increase their skills and make them more marketable in an open and united kingdom — marketable in an open and united kintdom. ., .. marketable in an open and united kintdom. ., ~' ,, kingdom. thank you, the next t uestion kingdom. thank you, the next question comes _ kingdom. thank you, the next question comes from - kingdom. thank you, the next question comes from michael| kingdom. thank you, the next - question comes from michaeljones question comes from michaeljones from tony pandy. as first minister, what would you do to ensure _ as first minister, what would you do

to ensure that — as first minister, what would you do to ensure that people _ as first minister, what would you do to ensure that people get _ as first minister, what would you do to ensure that people get the - to ensure that people get the support— to ensure that people get the support they _ to ensure that people get the support they need _ to ensure that people get the support they need to - to ensure that people get the support they need to recover| to ensure that people get the - support they need to recover after covid? _ support they need to recover after covid? ~ ., .. support they need to recover after covid? . . ,, ., support they need to recover after covid? . ,, ., , , ,, ., support they need to recover after covid? . ,, ., ,, ,, covid? what kind of business do you have? i covid? what kind of business do you have? i run — covid? what kind of business do you have? i run indoor _ covid? what kind of business do you have? i run indoor leisure _ have? i run indoor leisure facilities _ have? i run indoor leisure facilities like _ have? i run indoor leisure facilities like indoor - have? i run indoor leisure facilities like indoor soft | have? i run indoor leisure - facilities like indoor soft play. how — facilities like indoor soft play. how has _ facilities like indoor soft play. how has the _ facilities like indoor soft play. how has the pandemic- facilities like indoor soft play. how has the pandemic been. facilities like indoor soft play. i how has the pandemic been for facilities like indoor soft play. - how has the pandemic been for you? really tough. the support has been -ood really tough. the support has been good for— really tough. the support has been good for some _ really tough. the support has been good for some businesses - really tough. the support has been good for some businesses but- really tough. the support has been good for some businesses but not. good for some businesses but not leisure _ good for some businesses but not leisure and — good for some businesses but not leisure and hospitality _ good for some businesses but not leisure and hospitality where - good for some businesses but not leisure and hospitality where it. leisure and hospitality where it doesn't — leisure and hospitality where it doesn't cover— leisure and hospitality where it doesn't cover the _ leisure and hospitality where it doesn't cover the bills - leisure and hospitality where it doesn't cover the bills going i leisure and hospitality where it i doesn't cover the bills going out. large _ doesn't cover the bills going out. large buildings— doesn't cover the bills going out. large buildings cost _ doesn't cover the bills going out. large buildings cost a _ doesn't cover the bills going out. large buildings cost a lot - doesn't cover the bills going out. large buildings cost a lot of - doesn't cover the bills going out. i large buildings cost a lot of money to run. _ large buildings cost a lot of money to run. fixed — large buildings cost a lot of money to run, fixed costs _ large buildings cost a lot of money to run, fixed costs and _ large buildings cost a lot of money to run, fixed costs and the - large buildings cost a lot of money to run, fixed costs and the grants. to run, fixed costs and the grants 'ust to run, fixed costs and the grants just to _ to run, fixed costs and the grants just to leave _ to run, fixed costs and the grants just to leave you _ to run, fixed costs and the grants just to leave you with _ to run, fixed costs and the grants just to leave you with a _ to run, fixed costs and the grants just to leave you with a big - to run, fixed costs and the grants just to leave you with a big hole. | just to leave you with a big hole. mark— just to leave you with a big hole. mark drakeford? _ just to leave you with a big hole. mark drakeford? the _ just to leave you with a big hole. mark drakeford? the best - just to leave you with a big hole. mark drakeford? the best thingi just to leave you with a big hole. i mark drakeford? the best thing we can do for businesses in wales like michael's is can do for businesses in wales like michael' , ., . ~' can do for businesses in wales like michael' , ., .~ , michael's is to make sure the pandemic— michael's is to make sure the pandemic is _ michael's is to make sure the pandemic is under _ michael's is to make sure the pandemic is under control - michael's is to make sure the pandemic is under control so | michael's is to make sure the - pandemic is under control so that businesses can reopen, start earning a living and do so with the confidence of knowing that we won't be going back into the difficulties we faced over the last 12 months. when i meet businesses, as i do all

the time, that's the message they give to me. as michael says, they are grateful for the support they received, from the uk government and the welsh government as well to help them through that extraordinary 12 months. what they really want to do is to be back trading, earning a living, not waiting for the next grant to come. the welsh government have set aside £200 million as a down payment to go on helping businesses straight after the election. whoever is in government, which are one of us is first minister after next thursday, there will be proposals waiting on the desk for them to spend that money, to support businesses like michael's and others's while they get back on their feet and need and others's while they get back on theirfeet and need extra help. seldom their feet and need extra help. adam price? i their feet and need extra help. adam price? i don't — their feet and need extra help. adam price? i don't understand, _ their feet and need extra help. adam price? i don't understand, though, i price? i don't understand, though, wh wait? price? i don't understand, though, why wait? in _ price? i don't understand, though, why wait? in england _ price? i don't understand, though, why wait? in england and - price? i don't understand, though, why wait? in england and scotland| why wait? in england and scotland there _ why wait? in england and scotland there have been restart grants of up to 18. _ there have been restart grants of up to 18, £19,000, which have been provided — to 18, £19,000, which have been provided to hospitality businesses

and others to have had to remain closed _ and others to have had to remain closed and — and others to have had to remain closed and face the fixed costs michael — closed and face the fixed costs michael is referring to. why didn't you do— michael is referring to. why didn't you do that, mark? the hospitality sector— you do that, mark? the hospitality sector was— you do that, mark? the hospitality sector was pleading with you. these businesses — sector was pleading with you. these businesses are on the brink of bankruptcy, individuals on the edge of despair— bankruptcy, individuals on the edge of despair and yet you could have done _ of despair and yet you could have done that — of despair and yet you could have done that. why wait until after the election? — done that. why wait until after the election? do it now, get it into the bank— election? do it now, get it into the bank accounts of these businesses that absolutely need it. a bank accounts of these businesses that absolutely need it.— that absolutely need it. a simple reason, that absolutely need it. a simple reason. the _ that absolutely need it. a simple reason, the rules _ that absolutely need it. a simple reason, the rules don't _ that absolutely need it. a simple reason, the rules don't allow- that absolutely need it. a simple reason, the rules don't allow it. | reason, the rules don't allow it. we're in an election period. if i was handing out cheques to businesses in wales, adam price would be the first person to be calling foul, telling me i was using my position to influence the election. ., �* . my position to influence the election. . �* , ., ., election. that's not true. i wrote to ou a election. that's not true. i wrote to you a coople _ election. that's not true. i wrote to you a couple of _ election. that's not true. i wrote to you a couple of weeks - election. that's not true. i wrote to you a couple of weeks ago - election. that's not true. i wrote i to you a couple of weeks ago saying that the _ to you a couple of weeks ago saying that the senedd was still there, why don't we _ that the senedd was still there, why don't we recall it? opposition parties. — don't we recall it? opposition parties, certainly plaid cymru, would — parties, certainly plaid cymru, would have supported you acting even in the _ would have supported you acting even in the mixed of a campaign. that

doesnt in the mixed of a campaign. that doesn't change _ in the mixed of a campaign. that doesn't change the _ in the mixed of a campaign. trust doesn't change the rules. the rules are that you cannot spend money in that way when there's an election on. they're there for good reason and we have respected them. that's the important point here, which is why we were calling in february for a road map out of lockdown so the announcement could have been made outside of the election period, and the money could have been made to businesses. the money could have been made to businesses-— businesses. back to michael's point what we would _ businesses. back to michael's point what we would do _ businesses. back to michael's point what we would do if _ businesses. back to michael's point what we would do if we _ businesses. back to michael's point what we would do if we were - businesses. back to michael's point what we would do if we were given | what we would do if we were given the confidence _ what we would do if we were given the confidence of— what we would do if we were given the confidence of people, - what we would do if we were given the confidence of people, we - what we would do if we were giveni the confidence of people, we would reform _ the confidence of people, we would reform the — the confidence of people, we would reform the wda _ the confidence of people, we would reform the wda and _ the confidence of people, we would reform the wda and bring - the confidence of people, we would reform the wda and bring it - the confidence of people, we would reform the wda and bring it back i reform the wda and bring it back into existence, _ reform the wda and bring it back into existence, which _ reform the wda and bring it back into existence, which ultimately. reform the wda and bring it back i into existence, which ultimately has finance, _ into existence, which ultimately has finance, careers _ into existence, which ultimately has finance, careers advice _ into existence, which ultimately has finance, careers advice and - into existence, which ultimately has finance, careers advice and the - finance, careers advice and the promotion _ finance, careers advice and the promotion of _ finance, careers advice and the promotion of business - finance, careers advice and the promotion of business under. finance, careers advice and the i promotion of business under one umbrella, — promotion of business under one umbrella, delivering _ promotion of business under one umbrella, delivering for- promotion of business under one . umbrella, delivering for businesses. how long _ umbrella, delivering for businesses. how long would _ umbrella, delivering for businesses. how long would that _ umbrella, delivering for businesses. how long would that take? - umbrella, delivering for businesses. how long would that take? hot- umbrella, delivering for businesses. how long would that take?— how long would that take? not very lont at how long would that take? not very long at all? — how long would that take? not very long at all? months, _ how long would that take? not very long at all? months, years? - how long would that take? not very long at all? months, years? our- long at all? months, years? our triori is long at all? months, years? our priority is the — long at all? months, years? our priority is the economy - long at all? months, years? our priority is the economy and - long at all? months, years? 0ur| priority is the economy and that's what _ priority is the economy and that's what we — priority is the economy and that's what we have _ priority is the economy and that's what we have to _ priority is the economy and that's what we have to be _ priority is the economy and that's what we have to be doing, - priority is the economy and that'si what we have to be doing, getting the economy— what we have to be doing, getting the economy firing _ what we have to be doing, getting the economy firing to _ what we have to be doing, getting the economy firing to create - what we have to be doing, getting. the economy firing to create 65,000 'obs. the economy firing to create 65,000 jobs we _ the economy firing to create 65,000 jobs we always— the economy firing to create 65,000 jobs. i've always run— the economy firing to create 65,000 jobs. i've always run a _ the economy firing to create 65,000 jobs. i've always run a business- the economy firing to create 65,000 jobs. i've always run a business in. jobs. i've always run a business in the self—employed _ jobs. i've always run a business in the self—employed sector- jobs. i've always run a business in the self—employed sector and - jobs. i've always run a business in the self—employed sector and i. jobs. i've always run a business in. the self—employed sector and i know what it— the self—employed sector and i know what it is— the self—employed sector and i know what it is to — the self—employed sector and i know what it is to wake _ the self—employed sector and i know what it is to wake up _ the self—employed sector and i know what it is to wake up and _ the self—employed sector and i know what it is to wake up and realise - what it is to wake up and realise the money— what it is to wake up and realise the money isn't _ what it is to wake up and realise the money isn't there _ what it is to wake up and realise the money isn't there and - what it is to wake up and realise the money isn't there and you i what it is to wake up and realise i the money isn't there and you have bills to _ the money isn't there and you have

bills to play — the money isn't there and you have bills to play. that's _ the money isn't there and you have bills to play. that's my— the money isn't there and you have bills to play. that's my point, - the money isn't there and you have bills to play. that's my point, the . bills to play. that's my point, the people _ bills to play. that's my point, the people of— bills to play. that's my point, the people of wales _ bills to play. that's my point, the people of wales create _ bills to play. that's my point, the people of wales create the - bills to play. that's my point, the| people of wales create the wealth bills to play. that's my point, the . people of wales create the wealth to create _ people of wales create the wealth to create the _ people of wales create the wealth to create the employment _ people of wales create the wealth to create the employment to _ people of wales create the wealth to create the employment to pay. - people of wales create the wealth to create the employment to pay. —— i people of wales create the wealth to create the employment to pay. —— to pay for _ create the employment to pay. —— to pay for the _ create the employment to pay. —— to pay for the public— create the employment to pay. —— to pay for the public services. _ create the employment to pay. —— to pay for the public services. jlane - pay for the public services. jane dodds. thanks _ pay for the public services. jane dodds. thanks for _ pay for the public services. jane dodds. thanks for the - pay for the public services. jane| dodds. thanks for the question, michael. dodds. thanks for the question, michael- we _ dodds. thanks for the question, michael. we would _ dodds. thanks for the question, michael. we would be _ dodds. thanks for the question, michael. we would be looking i dodds. thanks for the question, | michael. we would be looking at dodds. thanks for the question, - michael. we would be looking at how we can support micro—businesses, how we can support micro—businesses, how we can support small and medium bone enterprises that are the backbone of the country. the work you do is so important. we want to help you to grow if that's what you want to do. we want to freeze business rates, we want to talk to people about what can replace them. we want to do bigger, we want an economic development bill looking at the whole of wales and how we can grow the economy and support small businesses like yourself. richard suchorzewski, _ businesses like yourself. richard suchorzewski, wouldn't - businesses like yourself. richard suchorzewski, wouldn't you, - businesses like yourself. richard suchorzewski, wouldn't you, by. suchorzewski, wouldn't you, by abolishing devolution can also be abolishing devolution can also be abolishing thousands of well—paid jobs, not politicians, butjobs in wales and moving them to england?

can i not please answer the question you asked _ can i not please answer the question you asked everyone else, which is the same — you asked everyone else, which is the same question? of you asked everyone else, which is the same question?— you asked everyone else, which is the same question? of course, yeah, but come onto _ the same question? of course, yeah, but come onto that. _ the same question? of course, yeah, but come onto that. the _ the same question? of course, yeah, but come onto that. the first - the same question? of course, yeah, but come onto that. the first thing i but come onto that. the first thing we can do is _ but come onto that. the first thing we can do is allow— but come onto that. the first thing we can do is allow businesses - but come onto that. the first thing we can do is allow businesses that | we can do is allow businesses that are currently closed, to open. that's — are currently closed, to open. that's the _ are currently closed, to open. that's the first thing. they're open in england — that's the first thing. they're open in england. why are we different? we say we— in england. why are we different? we say we have _ in england. why are we different? we say we have followed the science but at the _ say we have followed the science but at the end _ say we have followed the science but at the end of the day we have scientists _ at the end of the day we have scientists in england and in wales with different... scientists in england and in wales with different. . ._ scientists in england and in walesj with different. . ._ you with different... which ones? you 0 ten with different... which ones? you open them _ with different... which ones? you open them just — with different... which ones? you open them just now, _ with different. .. which ones? you open them just now, now- with different... which ones? you open them just now, now the - with different... which ones? you - open them just now, now the election has started _ open them just now, now the election has started but not all of them. which _ has started but not all of them. which ones aren't? which ones do you mean, which ones aren't open in wales that are open in england? for example you have situations whereby you have _ example you have situations whereby you have public houses that weren't able to _ you have public houses that weren't able to open. you have public houses that weren't able to open-—

you have public houses that weren't able to open._ but i able to open. they are open. but the 're able to open. they are open. but they're restricted, _ able to open. they are open. but they're restricted, severely i they're restricted, severely restricted.— they're restricted, severely restricted. ., restricted. the same way as england. nonsense. they're _ restricted. the same way as england. nonsense. they're not. _ restricted. the same way as england. nonsense. they're not. ask- restricted. the same way as england. nonsense. they're not. ask the i nonsense. they're not. ask the viewers. with _ nonsense. they're not. ask the viewers. with regards - nonsense. they're not. ask the viewers. with regards to - nonsense. they're not. ask the viewers. with regards to rates, | nonsense. they're not. ask the | viewers. with regards to rates, i agree _ viewers. with regards to rates, i agree we — viewers. with regards to rates, i agree. we have some of the fastest rising _ agree. we have some of the fastest rising business rates across the uk. that doesn't — rising business rates across the uk. that doesn't help small businesses. there _ that doesn't help small businesses. there are _ that doesn't help small businesses. there are now numerous empty shops throughout— there are now numerous empty shops throughout wales. can we not look at some _ throughout wales. can we not look at some incentive to help businesses move _ some incentive to help businesses move in— some incentive to help businesses move in there? some fort of —— some form _ move in there? some fort of —— some form of— move in there? some fort of —— some form of rate _ move in there? some fort of —— some form of rate relief. we would be open _ form of rate relief. we would be open to— form of rate relief. we would be open to that. form of rate relief. we would be open to that-— form of rate relief. we would be o-en to that. ., , i” open to that. how greenwood your economic plan _ open to that. how greenwood your economic plan b? _ open to that. how greenwood your economic plan b? well, _ open to that. how greenwood your economic plan b? well, there i open to that. how greenwood your economic plan b? well, there is i open to that. how greenwood yourl economic plan b? well, there is the throsect economic plan b? well, there is the prospect of — economic plan b? well, there is the prospect of green — economic plan b? well, there is the prospect of green jobs _ economic plan b? well, there is the prospect of green jobs but - economic plan b? well, there is the prospect of green jobs but if - economic plan b? well, there is the prospect of green jobs but if you i prospect of green jobs but if you want _ prospect of green jobs but if you want to— prospect of green jobs but if you want to go— prospect of green jobs but if you want to go down that route, is it really _ want to go down that route, is it really that — want to go down that route, is it really that green when, for example, you get, _ really that green when, for example, you get, through your local

authority or health board five pieces— authority or health board five pieces of— authority or health board five pieces of paper inviting you for a covid-19 — pieces of paper inviting you for a covid—19 test, in this case, half of them _ covid—19 test, in this case, half of them in _ covid—19 test, in this case, half of them in english and half of it in welsh — them in english and half of it in welsh. gk. let me make this point. i welshm let me make this point. i understand _ welsh. ok. let me make this point. i understand english, welsh. oli. let me make this point. i understand english, i welsh. (ijli. let me make this point. i understand english, i don't understand english, i don't understand welsh. other people understand welsh. other people understand welsh. other people understand welsh and not english. why are _ understand welsh and not english. why are we wasting these resources... why are we wasting these resources. . ._ why are we wasting these resources... t . . ~ . resources... we are talking about the green — resources... we are talking about the green economy. _ resources... we are talking about the green economy. 0k, - resources... we are talking about the green economy. 0k, adam i resources... we are talking about i the green economy. 0k, adam price. they don't want to abolish our parliament, they also want to abolish our language, as well. i did abolish our language, as well. i did not sa abolish our language, as well. i did riot say that- _ abolish our language, as well. i did not say that. you _ abolish our language, as well. i did not say that. you have _ abolish our language, as well. i did not say that. you have made - abolish our language, as well. i did not say that. you have made your i not say that. you have made your toint. not say that. you have made your point- we — not say that. you have made your point. we need _ not say that. you have made your point. we need new— not say that. you have made your point. we need newjobs - not say that. you have made your point. we need newjobs and i not say that. you have made your point. we need newjobs and we i not say that. you have made your i point. we need newjobs and we need point. we need new 'obs and we need new businesses, i point. we need newjobs and we need new businesses, and _ point. we need newjobs and we need new businesses, and entrepreneurs, i new businesses, and entrepreneurs, and there's— new businesses, and entrepreneurs, and there's great _ new businesses, and entrepreneurs, and there's great talent _ new businesses, and entrepreneurs, and there's great talent in— new businesses, and entrepreneurs, and there's great talent in wales i and there's great talent in wales and there's great talent in wales and the — and there's great talent in wales and the job— and there's great talent in wales and the job of— and there's great talent in wales and the job of government - and there's great talent in wales and the job of government is i and there's great talent in wales and the job of government is to. and the job of government is to unleash— and the job of government is to unleash that _ and the job of government is to unleash that and _ and the job of government is to unleash that and one _ and the job of government is to unleash that and one of- and the job of government is to unleash that and one of the i and the job of government is to i unleash that and one of the things we have _ unleash that and one of the things we have got— unleash that and one of the things we have got to _ unleash that and one of the things we have got to do _ unleash that and one of the things we have got to do is _ unleash that and one of the things we have got to do is to— unleash that and one of the things we have got to do is to the - unleash that and one of the things we have got to do is to the focus, i we have got to do is to the focus, we have got to do is to the focus,

we have _ we have got to do is to the focus, we have had _ we have got to do is to the focus, we have had one _ we have got to do is to the focus, we have had one economic- we have got to do is to the focus, we have had one economic policy| we have got to do is to the focus, i we have had one economic policy for about— we have had one economic policy for about 5060 — we have had one economic policy for about 5060 years, _ we have had one economic policy for about 5060 years, which _ we have had one economic policy for about 5060 years, which is - we have had one economic policy for about 5060 years, which is writing i about 5060 years, which is writing large _ about 5060 years, which is writing large chegues _ about 5060 years, which is writing large chegues to— about 5060 years, which is writing large cheques to foreign _ about 5060 years, which is writing | large cheques to foreign companies that come _ large cheques to foreign companies that come in— large cheques to foreign companies that come in for— large cheques to foreign companies that come in for a _ large cheques to foreign companies that come in for a while _ large cheques to foreign companies that come in for a while and - large cheques to foreign companies that come in for a while and then i that come in for a while and then they go— that come in for a while and then they go -- — that come in for a while and then they go -- 50, _ that come in for a while and then they go -- 50, 60 _ that come in for a while and then they go —— 50, 60 years. - that come in for a while and then they go —— 50,60 years. we i that come in for a while and thenl they go —— 50, 60 years. we have seen _ they go —— 50, 60 years. we have seen that, — they go —— 50, 60 years. we have seen that, the _ they go —— 50, 60 years. we have seen that, the economic - they go —— 50, 60 years. we have seen that, the economic model. they go —— 50, 60 years. we have seen that, the economic model is| they go —— 50, 60 years. we have i seen that, the economic model is not working. _ seen that, the economic model is not working. so— seen that, the economic model is not working, so instead _ seen that, the economic model is not working, so instead of— seen that, the economic model is not working, so instead of giving - seen that, the economic model is not working, so instead of giving moneyi working, so instead of giving money to them, _ working, so instead of giving money to them, we — working, so instead of giving money to them, we need _ working, so instead of giving money to them, we need to _ working, so instead of giving money to them, we need to back— working, so instead of giving money to them, we need to back our- working, so instead of giving money to them, we need to back our own . to them, we need to back our own home-grown — to them, we need to back our own home—grown businesses, - to them, we need to back our own home—grown businesses, they- to them, we need to back our own home—grown businesses, they are to them, we need to back our own i home—grown businesses, they are the key to— home—grown businesses, they are the key to the _ home—grown businesses, they are the key to the future — home—grown businesses, they are the key to the future success _ home—grown businesses, they are the key to the future success of _ home—grown businesses, they are the key to the future success of wales i key to the future success of wales so let's _ key to the future success of wales so let's provide _ key to the future success of wales so let's provide them _ key to the future success of wales so let's provide them with - key to the future success of wales so let's provide them with the i key to the future success of wales| so let's provide them with the kind of patient — so let's provide them with the kind of patient loans _ so let's provide them with the kind of patient loans that _ so let's provide them with the kind of patient loans that businesses i so let's provide them with the kindi of patient loans that businesses get in germany— of patient loans that businesses get in germany where _ of patient loans that businesses get in germany where banks _ of patient loans that businesses get in germany where banks there, i in germany where banks there, including — in germany where banks there, including publicly— in germany where banks there, including publicly owned - in germany where banks there, including publicly owned ones, i in germany where banks there, - including publicly owned ones, they do so _ including publicly owned ones, they do so well, — including publicly owned ones, they do so well, the _ including publicly owned ones, they do so well, the average _ including publicly owned ones, they do so well, the average length - including publicly owned ones, they do so well, the average length of. including publicly owned ones, they do so well, the average length of a | do so well, the average length of a bank_ do so well, the average length of a bank loan — do so well, the average length of a bank loan for— do so well, the average length of a bank loan for business _ do so well, the average length of a bank loan for business in _ do so well, the average length of a bank loan for business in wales, i bank loan for business in wales, five years — bank loan for business in wales, five years. many— bank loan for business in wales, five years. many of— bank loan for business in wales, five years. many of them - bank loan for business in wales, five years. many of them are - bank loan for business in wales, . five years. many of them are three years— five years. many of them are three years but_ five years. many of them are three years but we — five years. many of them are three years but we have _ five years. many of them are three years but we have got _ five years. many of them are three years but we have got to _ five years. many of them are three years but we have got to create . five years. many of them are three years but we have got to create a i years but we have got to create a lon- years but we have got to create a long term — years but we have got to create a long term view, _ years but we have got to create a long term view, creating - years but we have got to create a long term view, creating a - years but we have got to create a . long term view, creating a platform for success — long term view, creating a platform for success for— long term view, creating a platform for success for welsh _ long term view, creating a platform for success for welsh business. - long term view, creating a platformi for success for welsh business. has our for success for welsh business. has your economic _ for success for welsh business. your economic strategy been for success for welsh business.- your economic strategy been right, mark drakeford, back in big companies like ford for example? aston martin. you have given millions of pounds to these companies which have gone or they did not even come in the first

place. has that strategy been wrong? aston martin is in wales and still in wales, providing thousands of jobs, so i agree with what adam says, about the need to make sure that we grow indigenous businesses and we invest in the foundational economy and jobs in wales but it is not either or, a welsh labour government, where there are opportunities to bring jobs to wales, went say to them, we are not going to discuss that with you —— won't say to them. we should be doing that and also investing in our own economy. there are thousands and thousands ofjobs in wales today because of the jobs that had been brought to wales, some go, but many stay and they are really important jobs to wales. stay and they are really important jobs to wales— jobs to wales. these parties have had five attempts _ jobs to wales. these parties have had five attempts at _ jobs to wales. these parties have had five attempts at it _ jobs to wales. these parties have had five attempts at it and - jobs to wales. these parties have had five attempts at it and not. jobs to wales. these parties have had five attempts at it and not on i had five attempts at it and not on one attempt had they succeeded, and the average wage in wales is two and a half_ the average wage in wales is two and a half thousand pounds less for a worker— a half thousand pounds less for a worker than it is in england and scotland — worker than it is in england and scotland so how can you believe, if you give _

scotland so how can you believe, if you give them the mandate again, that they— you give them the mandate again, that they will have any more success? _ that they will have any more success? adam's i it is a big constitutional bust up with a referendum on independence —— adam's bil referendum on independence —— adam's big idea _ referendum on independence —— adam's big idea is _ referendum on independence —— adam's big idea is a _ referendum on independence —— adam's big idea is a constitutional bust up. imagine how difficult that will be. ~ . up. imagine how difficult that will be. . . ., up. imagine how difficult that will be. ~ . ., . ., ., be. we have one leader who would like a referendum _ be. we have one leader who would like a referendum on _ be. we have one leader who would like a referendum on welsh - like a referendum on welsh independence and another one who would like to get rid of the institution of the senedd altogether. when jones institution of the senedd altogether. whenjones has got the next question. —— gwenjones. good evening. d0 next question. -- gwen jones. good evenina. ~ ., , evening. do you think now is the time to start _ evening. do you think now is the time to start building _ evening. do you think now is the time to start building towards i evening. do you think now is the time to start building towards a| time to start building towards a welsh — time to start building towards a welsh referendum _ time to start building towards a welsh referendum to _ time to start building towards a welsh referendum to gain- welsh referendum to gain independence? _ welsh referendum to gain independence?— welsh referendum to gain independence? yes independence? adam price. yes because that _ independence? adam price. yes because that is _ independence? adam price. yes because that is the _ independence? adam price. yes because that is the only - independence? adam price. yes because that is the only way - independence? adam price. yes| because that is the only way that independence? adam price. yes - because that is the only way that we are going to achieve our potential as a nation. all the things we have talked about tonight, by taking our future into our own hands, that is the way we solve our problems, and the way we solve our problems, and the solutions will never come from westminster. look at the shambles

and corruption in westminster, and i know, i saw it up close when i was an mp, the way we solve our problems is to believe in our own ability. we have great talent in wales and we have great talent in wales and we have huge advantages in terms of the green industrial revolution, that we can tap into, but we are not able to do that at the moment. even the licences for renewable projects, they come from the crown estate, devolved in scotland but not in wales, where do the royalties go? to the exchequer in westminster? that is one example where wales is not able to realise its potential, but we have to realise our potential for top the vaccine and the furlough scheme have come as a result of the union and they _ scheme have come as a result of the union and they have _ scheme have come as a result of the union and they have been _ scheme have come as a result of the union and they have been good - scheme have come as a result of the union and they have been good for l union and they have been good for wales? . . . . , . .. wales? the vaccine was manufactured in wales and — wales? the vaccine was manufactured in wales and delivered _ wales? the vaccine was manufactured in wales and delivered by _ wales? the vaccine was manufactured in wales and delivered by the - wales? the vaccine was manufactured in wales and delivered by the nhs - in wales and delivered by the nhs working with local government in wales, the great success there, and you talk about the pandemic, look what happened in the pandemic. innovation within public health wales can we had tests that we had tests that were ready to wales and

they were stolen by the uk government, and we had... rubbish. absolute rubbish. _ government, and we had... rubbish. absolute rubbish. we _ government, and we had... rubbish. absolute rubbish. we had _ government, and we had... rubbish. absolute rubbish. we had the - absolute rubbish. we had the furlou:h absolute rubbish. we had the furlough scheme _ absolute rubbish. we had the furlough scheme extension i absolute rubbish. we had the - furlough scheme extension denied to us when we needed it most. we could not have the longer firebreak because the westminster government said no. �* , because the westminster government said no-_ that - because the westminster government said no._ that will - because the westminster government said no._ that will be l said no. andrew davies. that will be the constitutional _ said no. andrew davies. that will be the constitutional chaos _ said no. andrew davies. that will be the constitutional chaos caused - said no. andrew davies. that will be the constitutional chaos caused by i the constitutional chaos caused by slapping _ the constitutional chaos caused by slapping a independence referendum on the _ slapping a independence referendum on the table, and any incoming welsh government— on the table, and any incoming welsh government needs to be focused solely— government needs to be focused solely on — government needs to be focused solely on delivering for the people of wales, — solely on delivering for the people of wales, economically, in the public— of wales, economically, in the public services and on our environment and in education, not tied down— environment and in education, not tied down the constitutional argument and debate. when we can reconvene _ argument and debate. when we can reconvene in cardiff bay on the 6th of may. _ reconvene in cardiff bay on the 6th of may. it— reconvene in cardiff bay on the 6th of may, it will be the most powerful welsh _ of may, it will be the most powerful welsh parliament that has ever convened, those tools need to be used _ convened, those tools need to be used to— convened, those tools need to be used to lift — convened, those tools need to be used to lift people out of poverty in wales — used to lift people out of poverty in wales and lived greater educational attainment and lift the

waiting _ educational attainment and lift the waiting times in the nhs. someone ”romotin waiting times in the nhs. someone promoting the _ waiting times in the nhs. someone promoting the union, _ waiting times in the nhs. someone promoting the union, does - waiting times in the nhs. someone promoting the union, does it - waiting times in the nhs. someone promoting the union, does it annoyj promoting the union, does it annoy you, what is going on in downing street, in terms of who paid for the refurbishment of a flat, for example?— refurbishment of a flat, for exam - le? ~ . refurbishment of a flat, for exam - le? ~ , . , refurbishment of a flat, for examle? ~ , , example? the prime minister has been ve clear example? the prime minister has been very clear and — example? the prime minister has been very clear and he _ example? the prime minister has been very clear and he has _ example? the prime minister has been very clear and he has put _ example? the prime minister has been very clear and he has put that - example? the prime minister has been very clear and he has put that on - very clear and he has put that on the record — very clear and he has put that on the record but i'm focused on the welsh _ the record but i'm focused on the welsh parliamentary election and making _ welsh parliamentary election and making sure we deliver four people the length and breadth of wales and what we _ the length and breadth of wales and what we have seen as part of the uk is the _ what we have seen as part of the uk is the success of... hang on. let me finish _ is the success of... hang on. let me finish the _ is the success of... hang on. let me finish. the strength of the vaccination programme which if these parties _ vaccination programme which if these parties had _ vaccination programme which if these parties had their way, we would have been in _ parties had their way, we would have been in the _ parties had their way, we would have been in the european medicines agency— been in the european medicines agency and the european vaccination programme rather than the uk vaccination programme which is really— vaccination programme which is really important. it vaccination programme which is really important.— really important. it must be frustrating _ really important. it must be frustrating for _ really important. it must be frustrating for you, - really important. it must be frustrating for you, so - really important. it must be| frustrating for you, so would really important. it must be i frustrating for you, so would it really important. it must be - frustrating for you, so would it not be simpler if borisjohnson was to just say who paid in the first place for the refurbishment? boris johnson aid for the for the refurbishment? boris johnson paid for the refurbishment _ for the refurbishment? boris johnson paid for the refurbishment himself. paid for the refurbishment himself and he _ paid for the refurbishment himself and he has put that on the record. in and he has put that on the record. in the _ and he has put that on the record.

in the first — and he has put that on the record. in the first place? he and he has put that on the record. in the first place?— in the first place? he said he paid for himself— in the first place? he said he paid for himself and _ in the first place? he said he paid for himself and that _ in the first place? he said he paid for himself and that is _ in the first place? he said he paid for himself and that is what - in the first place? he said he paid for himself and that is what he i in the first place? he said he paid. for himself and that is what he said on the _ for himself and that is what he said on the record, that he paid for the refurbishment. people are not interested in the wallpaper in downing street but they are interested in public services and how people can achieve in the education _ how people can achieve in the education system in wales and they are really— education system in wales and they are really interested injobs and security— are really interested injobs and security and creating jobs for the future _ security and creating jobs for the future in — security and creating jobs for the future in wales, that is what people want to— future in wales, that is what people want to talk about. jane future in wales, that is what people want to talk about.— want to talk about. jane dodds. reau want to talk about. jane dodds. really important _ want to talk about. jane dodds. really important question, - want to talk about. jane dodds. really important question, and | want to talk about. jane dodds. | really important question, and i would _ really important question, and i would just— really important question, and i would just like _ really important question, and i would just like to _ really important question, and i would just like to say, _ really important question, and i would just like to say, andrew. really important question, and i. would just like to say, andrew must be ashamed — would just like to say, andrew must be ashamed of— would just like to say, andrew must be ashamed of the _ would just like to say, andrew must be ashamed of the sleaze _ would just like to say, andrew must| be ashamed of the sleaze happening at the _ be ashamed of the sleaze happening at the moment— be ashamed of the sleaze happening at the moment the _ be ashamed of the sleaze happening at the moment the conservative - at the moment the conservative party. _ at the moment the conservative party. it — at the moment the conservative party. it really— at the moment the conservative party, it really is _ at the moment the conservative party, it really is a _ at the moment the conservative party, it really is a shameful- at the moment the conservative. party, it really is a shameful time for boris — party, it really is a shameful time for borisjohnson _ party, it really is a shameful time for boris johnson and _ party, it really is a shameful time for boris johnson and the - for boris johnson and the conservatives, _ for boris johnson and the conservatives, and - for boris johnson and the conservatives, and backi for boris johnson and the i conservatives, and back to for boris johnson and the - conservatives, and back to adam's point _ conservatives, and back to adam's point committee _ conservatives, and back to adam's point committee referred - conservatives, and back to adam's point committee referred to - conservatives, and back to adam's . point committee referred to scotland and devolved — point committee referred to scotland and devolved powers _ point committee referred to scotland and devolved powers that _ point committee referred to scotland and devolved powers that scotland i and devolved powers that scotland had, we _ and devolved powers that scotland had, we want _ and devolved powers that scotland had, we want those _ and devolved powers that scotland had, we want those powers - and devolved powers that scotland had, we want those powers in- and devolved powers that scotland i had, we want those powers in wales. scotland _ had, we want those powers in wales. scotland is _ had, we want those powers in wales. scotland is not — had, we want those powers in wales. scotland is not independent - had, we want those powers in wales. scotland is not independent but - had, we want those powers in wales. scotland is not independent but they| scotland is not independent but they have devolved — scotland is not independent but they have devolved powers, _ scotland is not independent but they have devolved powers, and - scotland is not independent but they have devolved powers, and may- scotland is not independent but they have devolved powers, and may i. scotland is not independent but theyl have devolved powers, and may ijust finish. _ have devolved powers, and may ijust finish. and _ have devolved powers, and may ijust finish, and therefore _ have devolved powers, and may ijust finish, and therefore we _ have devolved powers, and may ijust finish, and therefore we don't - have devolved powers, and may ijust finish, and therefore we don't need . finish, and therefore we don't need independence — finish, and therefore we don't need independence in— finish, and therefore we don't need independence in wales _ finish, and therefore we don't need independence in wales to - finish, and therefore we don't need independence in wales to have - finish, and therefore we don't need independence in wales to have the | independence in wales to have the powers— independence in wales to have the powers that — independence in wales to have the powers that they _ independence in wales to have the powers that they do _ independence in wales to have the powers that they do in _ independence in wales to have the powers that they do in scotland. i

powers that they do in scotland. let's _ powers that they do in scotland. let's spend _ powers that they do in scotland. let's spend our— powers that they do in scotland. let's spend our time _ powers that they do in scotland. let's spend our time now- powers that they do in scotland. let's spend our time now on - powers that they do in scotland. - let's spend our time now on creating 'obs let's spend our time now on creating jobs and _ let's spend our time now on creating jobs and making _ let's spend our time now on creating jobs and making sure _ let's spend our time now on creating jobs and making sure that— let's spend our time now on creating jobs and making sure that our- let's spend our time now on creating jobs and making sure that our healthj jobs and making sure that our health is protected — jobs and making sure that our health is protected and _ jobs and making sure that our health is protected and making _ jobs and making sure that our health is protected and making sure - jobs and making sure that our health is protected and making sure we - is protected and making sure we address— is protected and making sure we address the _ is protected and making sure we address the climate _ is protected and making sure we address the climate emergency. j is protected and making sure we i address the climate emergency. an independence — address the climate emergency. an independence referendum - address the climate emergency. an independence referendum and - address the climate emergency. an| independence referendum and plaid cymru _ independence referendum and plaid cymru12,_ independence referendum and plaid cymru 12. that — independence referendum and plaid cymru 12, that would _ independence referendum and plaid cymru12, that would be _ independence referendum and plaid cymru12, that would be a _ independence referendum and plaid cymru12, that would be a total- cymru12, that would be a total distraction _ cymru12, that would be a total distraction. —— _ cymru12, that would be a total distraction. —— want— cymru12, that would be a total distraction. —— want two. - cymru12, that would be a total distraction. —— want two. it - cymru12, that would be a total. distraction. —— want two. it would not solve — distraction. —— want two. it would not solve anything. _ distraction. —— want two. it would not solve anything. is _ distraction. -- want two. it would not solve anything.— not solve anything. as the federalist _ not solve anything. as the federalist party, - not solve anything. as the federalist party, do - not solve anything. as the federalist party, do you . not solve anything. as the l federalist party, do you feel squeezed out of this debate? as a leader presiding over a great liberal tradition in wales, you could face a wipe—out at the election, how do you feel about that? ., , election, how do you feel about that? .,, , ., , election, how do you feel about that? , ., , ., election, how do you feel about that? , ., , that? the last few years have been disappointing _ that? the last few years have been disappointing for _ that? the last few years have been disappointing for us, _ that? the last few years have been disappointing for us, the _ that? the last few years have been disappointing for us, the welsh - disappointing for us, the welsh liberal— disappointing for us, the welsh liberal democrats, _ disappointing for us, the welsh liberal democrats, we - disappointing for us, the welsh liberal democrats, we have - disappointing for us, the welsh. liberal democrats, we have been disappointing for us, the welsh- liberal democrats, we have been in wales— liberal democrats, we have been in wales now— liberal democrats, we have been in wales now hundred _ liberal democrats, we have been in wales now hundred and _ liberal democrats, we have been in wales now hundred and 60 - liberal democrats, we have been in wales now hundred and 60 years i liberal democrats, we have been ini wales now hundred and 60 years we have deep— wales now hundred and 60 years we have deep roots _ wales now hundred and 60 years we have deep roots and _ wales now hundred and 60 years we have deep roots and we _ wales now hundred and 60 years we have deep roots and we are - wales now hundred and 60 years we have deep roots and we are looking i have deep roots and we are looking forwards _ have deep roots and we are looking forwards and — have deep roots and we are looking forwards and we _ have deep roots and we are looking forwards and we are _ have deep roots and we are looking forwards and we are putting - have deep roots and we are looking forwards and we are putting the - forwards and we are putting the recovery— forwards and we are putting the recovery first _ forwards and we are putting the recovery first for _ forwards and we are putting the recovery first for wales - forwards and we are putting the recovery first for wales —— - forwards and we are putting the recovery first for wales —— nowi forwards and we are putting the . recovery first for wales —— now for 160 years — recovery first for wales —— now for 160 years and _ recovery first for wales —— now for 160 years and we _ recovery first for wales —— now for 160 years and we have _ recovery first for wales —— now for 160 years and we have deep- recovery first for wales —— now for| 160 years and we have deep roots. recovery first for wales —— now for i 160 years and we have deep roots. in terms 160 years and we have deep roots. terms of the contrast between scotland and wales, don't you think one of the reasons that scotland has a better deal in terms of power and also in terms of funding is because

there is an snp government and there is a credible threat of scottish independence which gives them the best leveraged in london and that is what we would get with the election of a plaid cymru government? if i'm elected as first minister, it would send a jolt of electricity into westminster because they would have to sit up and listen to us.— to sit up and listen to us. richard. if we had independence _ to sit up and listen to us. richard. if we had independence i - to sit up and listen to us. richard. if we had independence i would i to sit up and listen to us. richard. i if we had independence i would have an electric— if we had independence i would have an electricjolt, that is for sure. we cannot— an electricjolt, that is for sure. we cannot kick this constitutional can down— we cannot kick this constitutional can down the road indefinitely. it has to— can down the road indefinitely. it has to be — can down the road indefinitely. it has to be dealt with and you may be surprised _ has to be dealt with and you may be surprised by what i'm going to say, the one _ surprised by what i'm going to say, the one thing i will agree with adam, — the one thing i will agree with adam, is _ the one thing i will agree with adam, is that the people of wales do need to— adam, is that the people of wales do need to decide. if we want independence. but at the same time they need _ independence. but at the same time they need to decide whether we want abolition _ they need to decide whether we want abolition because the rest of your

colleagues are sitting in between, gradually, giving us independence, we are _ gradually, giving us independence, we are sleepwalking towards independence, but you are running towards _ independence, but you are running towards independence, adam. we want towards independence, adam. we want to abolish _ towards independence, adam. we want to abolish it _ towards independence, adam. we want to abolish it because we think it is economically disastrous and we believe — economically disastrous and we believe from our co—is no way you could _ believe from our co—is no way you could provide the services that the welsh _ could provide the services that the welsh people need —— we believe from our calculations there is no way you could _ our calculations there is no way you could provide. you our calculations there is no way you could provide-— could provide. you have said that very frequently — could provide. you have said that very frequently this _ could provide. you have said that very frequently this evening, - could provide. you have said that very frequently this evening, and j very frequently this evening, and you have talked about the salaries of politicians if you are elected committee would be earning 68,000 and you said you have got to stop the gravy train, would you take the salary? i would the gravy train, would you take the salary? iwould be the gravy train, would you take the salary? i would be giving up my alternative employment, so i would say yes, _ alternative employment, so i would say yes, providing you do the work, but for— say yes, providing you do the work, but for the — say yes, providing you do the work, but for the people of wales to be

aware. _ but for the people of wales to be aware. our— but for the people of wales to be aware, ourthree but for the people of wales to be aware, our three colleagues here over the — aware, our three colleagues here over the last five years have earned {1.5 over the last five years have earned £15 million — over the last five years have earned {1.5 million between them. are they value _ £1.5 million between them. are they value for— {1.5 million between them. are they value for money? £1.5 million between them. are they value for money?— value for money? mark drakeford. your answer _ value for money? mark drakeford. your answer on _ value for money? mark drakeford. your answer on this _ value for money? mark drakeford. your answer on this one. - value for money? mark drakeford. your answer on this one. on - value for money? mark drakeford. your answer on this one. on this l your answer on this one. on this issue the — your answer on this one. on this issue the choice _ your answer on this one. on this issue the choice in _ your answer on this one. on this issue the choice in the _ your answer on this one. on this issue the choice in the election l your answer on this one. on this | issue the choice in the election is very clear. you have parties standing who do not believe in wales and who would hand us back to westminster, and parties standing who do not believe in the uk, but my party, the labour party, believes in both. we believe in a strong wales and a successful uk. i believe in our ability and i believe in our potential and i'm welsh to my very core but that does not mean that i believe we should sever our links with working people elsewhere... you do have candidates who are standing who are pro independence. thea;r do have candidates who are standing who are pro independence.— who are pro independence. they are all standing — who are pro independence. they are all standing on _ who are pro independence. they are all standing on the _ who are pro independence. they are all standing on the labour _ who are pro independence. they are

all standing on the labour party - all standing on the labour party manifesto in wales, and the manifesto... manifesto in wales, and the manifesto. . ._ manifesto in wales, and the manifesto... ., . . , ., manifesto... you have candidates who are backin: manifesto... you have candidates who are backing independence. _ manifesto... you have candidates who are backing independence. the - manifesto... you have candidates who are backing independence. the labour manifesto is — are backing independence. the labour manifesto is that _ are backing independence. the labour manifesto is that we _ are backing independence. the labour manifesto is that we should _ are backing independence. the labour manifesto is that we should continue i manifesto is that we should continue to back devolution within wales. share to back devolution within wales. are those candidates unionists? they i to back devolution within wales. are | those candidates unionists? they are labour candidates. _ those candidates unionists? they are labour candidates. backing _ labour candidates. backing independence. _ labour candidates. backing independence. they - labour candidates. backing independence. they are i labour candidates. backing i independence. they are standing labour candidates. backing - independence. they are standing on our manifesto _ independence. they are standing on our manifesto which _ independence. they are standing on our manifesto which says _ independence. they are standing on our manifesto which says decisions. our manifesto which says decisions about people in wales should be made only by people in wales but that does not mean that they should cut ourselves off from our friends and colleagues in other parts of the united kingdom.— colleagues in other parts of the united kingdom. thank you all very much. united kingdom. thank you all very much- thank— united kingdom. thank you all very much. thank you _ united kingdom. thank you all very much. thank you to _ united kingdom. thank you all very much. thank you to our _ united kingdom. thank you all very much. thank you to our audience. i united kingdom. thank you all very| much. thank you to our audience. it is time to bring this part of the debate to an end. thanks to the virtual audience. we will hear closing remarks from each of the party leaders, and the production team drew lots to determine the order. first up is adam price from plaid cymru. fits order. first up is adam price from plaid cymru— order. first up is adam price from plaid c mru. �* . ., plaid cymru. as we emerge into the liuht plaid cymru. as we emerge into the li . ht from plaid cymru. as we emerge into the light from this _ plaid cymru. as we emerge into the light from this darkest _ plaid cymru. as we emerge into the light from this darkest of _ plaid cymru. as we emerge into the light from this darkest of years, i light from this darkest of years, there is something in the air, more

potent and more powerful even than the virus we have been battling. hope of a new beginning, with a spring election which becomes the moment of our rebirth, the future is in our hands, and in seven days we can write this future together, we can write this future together, we can write this future together, we can write all the wrongs and a future without poverty and homelessness and without hunger, a future that will be better than the past because we will build it together. what a victory that will be. . ~' , ., , together. what a victory that will be. . ,, , ., , . together. what a victory that will be. . , . . . be. thank you very much. richard suchorzewski. _ be. thank you very much. richard suchorzewski. a _ be. thank you very much. richard suchorzewski. a plaid _ be. thank you very much. richard suchorzewski. a plaid cymru i be. thank you very much. richard i suchorzewski. a plaid cymru future, an independent _ suchorzewski. a plaid cymru future, an independent wales _ suchorzewski. a plaid cymru future, an independent wales and _ suchorzewski. a plaid cymru future, an independent wales and then i suchorzewski. a plaid cymru future, an independent wales and then a i an independent wales and then a bankrupt — an independent wales and then a bankrupt wales. that is where we are heading _ bankrupt wales. that is where we are heading unless we wake up, so vote for the _ heading unless we wake up, so vote for the abolish the assembly party at the _ for the abolish the assembly party at the top — for the abolish the assembly party at the top of the white ballot paper, — at the top of the white ballot paper, and together we shall save wales— paper, and together we shall save wales and — paper, and together we shall save wales and save the union both together~ _ wales and save the union both

together. and stop us from sleepwalking which the others would cause, _ sleepwalking which the others would cause, towards independence. mark drakeford. over— cause, towards independence. mark drakeford. over the _ cause, towards independence. mark drakeford. over the last _ cause, towards independence. mark drakeford. over the last month i've| drakeford. over the last month i've been all over— drakeford. over the last month i've been all over wales. _ drakeford. over the last month i've been all over wales. people - drakeford. over the last month i've been all over wales. people have i been all over wales. people have told me _ been all over wales. people have told me that _ been all over wales. people have told me that they— been all over wales. people have told me that they are _ been all over wales. people have told me that they are glad - been all over wales. people have told me that they are glad that i been all over wales. people have i told me that they are glad that they have lived _ told me that they are glad that they have lived in— told me that they are glad that they have lived in wales _ told me that they are glad that they have lived in wales during - told me that they are glad that they have lived in wales during the - have lived in wales during the pandemic _ have lived in wales during the pandemic. and _ have lived in wales during the pandemic. and that _ have lived in wales during the pandemic. and that is - have lived in wales during the| pandemic. and that is because have lived in wales during the - pandemic. and that is because labour values _ pandemic. and that is because labour values are _ pandemic. and that is because labour values are your — pandemic. and that is because labour values are your values _ pandemic. and that is because labour values are your values as _ pandemic. and that is because labour values are your values as well. - pandemic. and that is because labour values are your values as well. —— i values are your values as well. —— labour~ _ values are your values as well. —— labour~ next— values are your values as well. —— labour. next week _ values are your values as well. —— labour. next week one _ values are your values as well. —— labour. next week one of- values are your values as well. —— labour. next week one of the i values are your values as well. —— i labour. next week one of the people here will— labour. next week one of the people here will be _ labour. next week one of the people here will be your _ labour. next week one of the people here will be your next _ labour. next week one of the people here will be your next first _ here will be your next first minister~ _ here will be your next first minister~ '— here will be your next first minister. i am _ here will be your next first minister. i am asking - here will be your next first minister. i am asking for. here will be your next first i minister. i am asking for your here will be your next first - minister. i am asking for your vote, so that— minister. i am asking for your vote, so that i_ minister. i am asking for your vote, so that i can — minister. i am asking for your vote, so that i can help— minister. i am asking for your vote, so that i can help finish _ minister. i am asking for your vote, so that i can help finish the - minister. i am asking for your vote, so that i can help finish the job, i so that i can help finish the job, and guide — so that i can help finish the job, and guide wales _ so that i can help finish the job, and guide wales into— so that i can help finish the job, and guide wales into the - so that i can help finish the job, and guide wales into the bright| and guide wales into the bright future — and guide wales into the bright future if— and guide wales into the bright future if you _ and guide wales into the bright future. if you value _ and guide wales into the bright future. if you value it, - and guide wales into the bright future. if you value it, please l and guide wales into the bright. future. if you value it, please vote for it _ future. if you value it, please vote for it vote — future. if you value it, please vote for it. vote labour— future. if you value it, please vote for it. vote labour on— future. if you value it, please vote for it. vote labour on the - future. if you value it, please vote for it. vote labour on the 6th i future. if you value it, please vote for it. vote labour on the 6th of. for it. vote labour on the 6th of may _ for it. vote labour on the 6th of ma . g . for it. vote labour on the 6th of ma . . . , for it. vote labour on the 6th of may-_ imagine - for it. vote labour on the 6th of may._ imagine howl for it. vote labour on the 6th of i may._ imagine how wales may. jane dodds. imagine how wales would be if we _ may. jane dodds. imagine how wales would be if we put _ may. jane dodds. imagine how wales would be if we put recovery _ may. jane dodds. imagine how wales would be if we put recovery first, i would be if we put recovery first, imagine how wales would be if our businesses and our high streets could create those jobs, businesses and our high streets could create thosejobs, imagine how wales would be if people with mental

health issues were notjudged and got the treatment they wanted. imagine how wales would be if we had homes that were cheap to heat and we put the climate at the heart of everything we did. that is the sort of wales that we want. i hope you will consider voting liberal democrat on the 6th of may. thank you. andrew rt davies. you are in charre thank you. andrew rt davies. you are in charge next — thank you. andrew rt davies. you are in charge next week, _ thank you. andrew rt davies. you are in charge next week, you _ thank you. andrew rt davies. you are in charge next week, you will- thank you. andrew rt davies. you are in charge next week, you will decide i in charge next week, you will decide the direction of the country for the next five _ the direction of the country for the next five years. when the welsh rugby _ next five years. when the welsh rugby team doesn't perform, we don't scrub— rugby team doesn't perform, we don't scrub the _ rugby team doesn't perform, we don't scrub the rfu or cancel the team in the six _ scrub the rfu or cancel the team in the six nations, we change the coaching — the six nations, we change the coaching staff. this is your chance not to _ coaching staff. this is your chance not to repeat the errors of the last 22 years _ not to repeat the errors of the last 22 years but to make a real difference and vote welsh conservatives for a bright new future, — conservatives for a bright new future, a _ conservatives for a bright new future, a bold wales in a strong uk. take the _ future, a bold wales in a strong uk. take the chance, let's run with it and that's— take the chance, let's run with it and that's get back playing the game so that— and that's get back playing the game so that wales are at the top of the league _ so that wales are at the top of the league table, not at the bottom.

thank— league table, not at the bottom. thank you — league table, not at the bottom. thank you very much for coming this evening. that's it for me. my thanks to the leaders. let's cross to nick servini for the second part of the programme. good evening and welcome to the second part of the leaders debate. in this part we'll be hearing from three other parties who are after your votes in the senedd elections. it is fair to say that the greens, reform and ukip aren't going to be leading the next welsh government about the electoral make up of the senedd after maybe six may be tight which means the balance of power could lie with a range of different parties. in the next half—an—hour we'll discuss some of the main issues of the campaign but first we'll start with some opening statements. the production team drew lots to determine the order and first up is neil hamilton, leader of ukip wales. first up is neil hamilton, leader of ukip wales-— first up is neil hamilton, leader of ukip wales. thank you. devolution has failed wales. _ ukip wales. thank you. devolution has failed wales. it's _ ukip wales. thank you. devolution has failed wales. it's the _ ukip wales. thank you. devolution has failed wales. it's the poorest l has failed wales. it's the poorest

part of the uk and we are poorer today relative to the rest of the country than we were 20 years ago despite 22 years of labour government propped up as necessary by plaid cymru and the lib dems. the welsh government don't have the money for major structure improvements like the ma, doesn't have the money to provide decent public services like health and education. the nhs has been a shambles with five of seven health boards in special measures or targeted intervention. the school results are the worst in the uk. a housing crisis and yet the welsh government grandstand by saying we are a nation of sanctuary for illegal immigrants.- are a nation of sanctuary for illegal immigrants. time up. you will have plenty _ illegal immigrants. time up. you will have plenty of— illegal immigrants. time up. you will have plenty of other - will have plenty of other opportunities to bring up those issues. amelia womack, thejoint leader of the green party in wales and england. leader of the green party in wales and england-— and england. deputy leader, yes. wales desperately _ and england. deputy leader, yes. wales desperately needs - and england. deputy leader, yes. wales desperately needs a - and england. deputy leader, yes. wales desperately needs a green| wales desperately needs a green representation. in this election, more _ representation. in this election, more people than ever before are voting _ more people than ever before are voting green for the first time.

join them _ voting green for the first time. join them. you'll be voting for tens of thousands of new green jobs. for genuine _ of thousands of new green jobs. for genuine investment in our communities, to ensure that we tackle _ communities, to ensure that we tackle the — communities, to ensure that we tackle the shocking inequalities experienced across wales. and, of course, _ experienced across wales. and, of course, to— experienced across wales. and, of course, to take real action on the climate _ course, to take real action on the climate and — course, to take real action on the climate and nature emergencies. voting _ climate and nature emergencies. voting green in this election will rebuild _ voting green in this election will rebuild a — voting green in this election will rebuild a resilient post—pandemic wales, _ rebuild a resilient post—pandemic wales, fit— rebuild a resilient post—pandemic wales, fit for the 21st—century. gk wales, fit for the 21st-century. ok and the wales, fit for the 21st—century. and the final wales, fit for the 21st—century. ok and the final opening wales, fit for the 21st—century. ci; and the final opening statement, reform uk, represented byjamie jenkins. i reform uk, represented by jamie jenkins. . reform uk, represented by jamie jenkins. , ., . reform uk, represented by jamie jenkins. . . jenkins. i grew up on a council estate and _ jenkins. i grew up on a council estate and i've _ jenkins. i grew up on a council estate and i've seen _ jenkins. i grew up on a council estate and i've seen what i jenkins. i grew up on a council estate and i've seen what 22 l jenkins. i grew up on a council- estate and i've seen what 22 years has done in terms of inequalities. a newborn person in wales today and the gap in how long they will live between wales and england has doubled. things can be better.

people say they don't trust politicians. i'm standing in the election to make a difference. you trusted in the reform party when we were the brexit party by giving us an overwhelming majority in the 2019 european election. if you trust us again we can reform the senedd, so let's do it next week.— let's do it next week. let's pick up on some of— let's do it next week. let's pick up on some of the _ let's do it next week. let's pick up on some of the themes _ let's do it next week. let's pick up on some of the themes we - let's do it next week. let's pick up on some of the themes we heard l let's do it next week. let's pick up | on some of the themes we heard in the previous debate. the first question tonight is, how do we protect the environment while trying to get the economy back on track after covid? amelia womack. these two issues go _ after covid? amelia womack. these two issues go hand-in-hand - after covid? amelia womack. these two issues go hand-in-hand and i after covid? amelia womack. these two issues go hand—in—hand and we must _ two issues go hand—in—hand and we must rebuild — two issues go hand—in—hand and we must rebuild after the pandemic. we've _ must rebuild after the pandemic. we've seen it destroying a vision of the past. _ we've seen it destroying a vision of the past, business as usual, and people _ the past, business as usual, and people are — the past, business as usual, and people are looking for new ideas to rebuild _ people are looking for new ideas to rebuild wales. we can invest in our industrial— rebuild wales. we can invest in our industrial future with a green industrial revolution, a green new deal with— industrial revolution, a green new deal with thousands of newjobs. ensuring — deal with thousands of newjobs. ensuring we are investing in

renewables, sustainable transport, warm _ renewables, sustainable transport, warm homes to tackle fuel poverty which _ warm homes to tackle fuel poverty which boosts the economy and people's— which boosts the economy and people's opportunities and creates the resilient wales we desperately need _ the resilient wales we desperately need so— the resilient wales we desperately need. so all our recovery should have _ need. so all our recovery should have the — need. so all our recovery should have the environment at the heart of it because _ have the environment at the heart of it because it— have the environment at the heart of it because it meansjobs, opportunities, training and education and we are tackling the biggest _ education and we are tackling the biggest problems of our time. the roblem biggest problems of our time. tie: problem you have, biggest problems of our time. ti9 problem you have, all of the parties are tripping over themselves on environmental policies. it is great to bring it up off the agenda but we don't need the greens any more a way? don't need the greens any more a wa ? . . don't need the greens any more a wa ? , , :, , way? the best time to put the olicies way? the best time to put the policies in _ way? the best time to put the policies in place _ way? the best time to put the policies in place is _ way? the best time to put the policies in place is when i way? the best time to put the policies in place is when the i way? the best time to put the i policies in place is when the welsh assembly— policies in place is when the welsh assembly started and the second—best is now _ assembly started and the second—best is now the _ assembly started and the second—best is now. the other parties have had their_ is now. the other parties have had their opportunity to tackle the big issues _ their opportunity to tackle the big issues and yet we haven't seen them meet _ issues and yet we haven't seen them meet targets, we haven't seen them challenge _ meet targets, we haven't seen them challenge what needs to be happening with the _ challenge what needs to be happening with the clear investment into the future _ with the clear investment into the future and — with the clear investment into the future and we haven't seen them detiver— future and we haven't seen them deliver on— future and we haven't seen them deliver on what needs to happen to tackle _ deliver on what needs to happen to tackle the — deliver on what needs to happen to tackle the climate emergency. if people _ tackle the climate emergency. if people want green, they must vote

green _ people want green, they must vote green because it's only by voting green _ green because it's only by voting green that— green because it's only by voting green that you get those policies. and more — green that you get those policies. and more importantly, the green scrutiny— and more importantly, the green scrutiny when the other parties failed _ scrutiny when the other parties failed to— scrutiny when the other parties failed to deliver. neil hamilton. let's be honest, _ failed to deliver. neil hamilton. let's be honest, the _ failed to deliver. neil hamilton. let's be honest, the so-called l failed to deliver. neil hamilton. - let's be honest, the so-called green let's be honest, the so—called green recovery is actually counter—productive because what we're doing making ourselves impoverished. renewable energy is much more expensive than conventional fuel sources. as a result of wales being the poorest part of the uk with incomes three quarters of what they are in the uk we are burdening the poorest people in the uk with extra costs of fuel and living their lives. businesses again have a massive extra cost that will be imposed on them. we will make it more difficult to recover and not less. the cost of renewable energy is coming down dramatically, wind energy in particular. it has come down but it is still vastly more expensive than conventional power generation. wales produces almost nothing in terms of c02 almost nothing in terms of co2 emissions. why should wales be the

one to bear the burden when china and india and other countries that are massively contributing to what others think is a climate emergency are doing next to nothing?- are doing next to nothing? amelia womack? we _ are doing next to nothing? amelia womack? we all _ are doing next to nothing? amelia womack? we all have _ are doing next to nothing? amelia womack? we all have to - are doing next to nothing? amelia womack? we all have to take - womack? we all have to take responsibility _ womack? we all have to take responsibility for _ womack? we all have to take responsibility for the - womack? we all have to take responsibility for the impact l womack? we all have to take - responsibility for the impact having on the _ responsibility for the impact having on the environment. by responsibility for the impact having on the environment.— responsibility for the impact having on the environment. by making people oorer? it on the environment. by making people poorer? it isn't — on the environment. by making people poorer? it isn't doing _ on the environment. by making people poorer? it isn't doing that, _ on the environment. by making people poorer? it isn't doing that, solar - poorer? it isn't doing that, solar anels poorer? it isn't doing that, solar panels are _ poorer? it isn't doing that, solar panels are on — poorer? it isn't doing that, solar panels are on the _ poorer? it isn't doing that, solar panels are on the roofs - poorer? it isn't doing that, solar panels are on the roofs of- poorer? it isn't doing that, solar| panels are on the roofs of homes poorer? it isn't doing that, solar . panels are on the roofs of homes to tackle _ panels are on the roofs of homes to tackle fuel— panels are on the roofs of homes to tackle fuel poverty, to make sure people _ tackle fuel poverty, to make sure people don't have to choose between heating _ people don't have to choose between heating their homes and putting food on their— heating their homes and putting food on theirtable. heating their homes and putting food on their table. these ideas mean we can tackle _ on their table. these ideas mean we can tackle inequality and tackle some _ can tackle inequality and tackle some of— can tackle inequality and tackle some of the big issues of the time and ignoring the climate emergency when _ and ignoring the climate emergency when people around wales are experiencing flagging... —— experiencing flagging... —— experiencing flooding. experiencing flagging. .. -- experiencing flooding. nothing to do with it. experiencing flooding. nothing to do with it- when — experiencing flooding. nothing to do with it. when people _ experiencing flooding. nothing to do with it. when people are _ experiencing flooding. nothing to do with it. when people are at - experiencing flooding. nothing to do with it. when people are at risk- experiencing flooding. nothing to do with it. when people are at risk of. with it. when people are at risk of risin: sea with it. when people are at risk of rising sea levels. _ with it. when people are at risk of rising sea levels. i _ with it. when people are at risk of rising sea levels. i want _ with it. when people are at risk of rising sea levels. i want to - with it. when people are at risk of rising sea levels. i want to give i with it. when people are at risk ofi rising sea levels. i want to give an opportunity _ rising sea levels. i want to give an opportunity for — rising sea levels. i want to give an opportunity forjamie _ rising sea levels. i want to give an opportunity forjamie jenkins. - rising sea levels. i want to give an l opportunity forjamie jenkins. wales has over 870 — opportunity forjamie jenkins. wales has over 870 miles _ opportunity forjamie jenkins. wales has over 870 miles of— opportunity forjamie jenkins. wales has over 870 miles of coastline - opportunity forjamie jenkins. wales has over 870 miles of coastline and one of— has over 870 miles of coastline and one of the — has over 870 miles of coastline and one of the things _ has over 870 miles of coastline and one of the things we _ has over 870 miles of coastline and one of the things we want - has over 870 miles of coastline and one of the things we want to - has over 870 miles of coastline and one of the things we want to do - has over 870 miles of coastline and one of the things we want to do is i one of the things we want to do is

to actually— one of the things we want to do is to actually make _ one of the things we want to do is to actually make wales _ one of the things we want to do is to actually make wales one - one of the things we want to do is to actually make wales one of - one of the things we want to do isi to actually make wales one of the leading _ to actually make wales one of the leading parties— to actually make wales one of the leading parties and _ to actually make wales one of the leading parties and countries - to actually make wales one of the leading parties and countries with| leading parties and countries with regards _ leading parties and countries with regards to— leading parties and countries with regards to tidal— leading parties and countries with regards to tidal energy. _ leading parties and countries with regards to tidal energy. there's . regards to tidal energy. there's those _ regards to tidal energy. there's those opportunities. _ regards to tidal energy. there's those opportunities. we - regards to tidal energy. there's those opportunities. we need l regards to tidal energy. there's those opportunities. we need ai those opportunities. we need a balance — those opportunities. we need a balance because _ those opportunities. we need a balance because in _ those opportunities. we need a balance because in terms - those opportunities. we need a balance because in terms of - those opportunities. we need a| balance because in terms of the environment, _ balance because in terms of the environment, you've _ balance because in terms of the environment, you've seen - balance because in terms of the environment, you've seen the l environment, you've seen the explosion— environment, you've seen the explosion in— environment, you've seen the explosion in manufacturing i environment, you've seen the . explosion in manufacturing jobs. environment, you've seen the - explosion in manufacturing jobs. the reform _ explosion in manufacturing jobs. the reform party— explosion in manufacturing jobs. the reform party want _ explosion in manufacturing jobs. the reform party want to _ explosion in manufacturing jobs. the reform party want to cut _ explosion in manufacturing jobs. the reform party want to cut business i reform party want to cut business rates _ reform party want to cut business rates and — reform party want to cut business rates and get _ reform party want to cut business rates and get wales _ reform party want to cut business rates and get wales open - reform party want to cut business rates and get wales open for- rates and get wales open for business _ rates and get wales open for business and _ rates and get wales open for business and if _ rates and get wales open for business and if we _ rates and get wales open for business and if we can - rates and get wales open for business and if we can get i rates and get wales open forl business and if we can get the rates and get wales open for- business and if we can get the red and taxes — business and if we can get the red and taxes lower— business and if we can get the red and taxes lower for— business and if we can get the red and taxes lower for business, - business and if we can get the red| and taxes lower for business, they want _ and taxes lower for business, they want to— and taxes lower for business, they want to make _ and taxes lower for business, they want to make it— and taxes lower for business, they want to make it work— and taxes lower for business, they want to make it work in— and taxes lower for business, they want to make it work in the - and taxes lower for business, they want to make it work in the uk- and taxes lower for business, they| want to make it work in the uk and make— want to make it work in the uk and make it— want to make it work in the uk and make it competitive _ want to make it work in the uk and make it competitive next _ want to make it work in the uk and make it competitive next to - want to make it work in the uk and make it competitive next to the - make it competitive next to the chinese — make it competitive next to the chinese competitors. _ make it competitive next to the chinese competitors. people i make it competitive next to the | chinese competitors. people are buying _ chinese competitors. people are buying things _ chinese competitors. people are buying things from _ chinese competitors. people are buying things from china - chinese competitors. people are buying things from china and - chinese competitors. people are . buying things from china and having to get— buying things from china and having to get it _ buying things from china and having to get it over— buying things from china and having to get it over the _ buying things from china and having to get it over the other— buying things from china and having to get it over the other side - buying things from china and having to get it over the other side of- buying things from china and having to get it over the other side of the l to get it over the other side of the world _ to get it over the other side of the world china— to get it over the other side of the world. china are _ to get it over the other side of the world. china are building - to get it over the other side of the world. china are building more - world. china are building more cautiftower _ world. china are building more cauliflower power— world. china are building more cauliflower power stations - world. china are building more cauliflower power stations to l cauliflower power stations to deliver — cauliflower power stations to deliver these _ cauliflower power stations to deliver these things. - —— building more coalfired power stations — -- building more coalfired power stations. ., ., , ., -- building more coalfired power stations. ., ., , . . stations. how do you square that with building _ stations. how do you square that with building a _ stations. how do you square that with building a new— stations. how do you square that with building a new m4 _ stations. how do you square that with building a new m4 relief - stations. how do you square that i with building a new m4 relief road? ultimately we need betterjobs within— ultimately we need betterjobs within wales. _ ultimately we need betterjobs within wales. we _ ultimately we need betterjobs within wales. we will- ultimately we need betterjobs within wales. we will support. within wales. we will support tooking — within wales. we will support looking at— within wales. we will support looking at tidal— within wales. we will support looking at tidal energy - within wales. we will support looking at tidal energy etc- within wales. we will support| looking at tidal energy etc but within wales. we will support . looking at tidal energy etc but if wates— looking at tidal energy etc but if wates isn't— looking at tidal energy etc but if

wales isn't open— looking at tidal energy etc but if wales isn't open for— looking at tidal energy etc but if wales isn't open for business, l wales isn't open for business, people — wales isn't open for business, people aren't _ wales isn't open for business, people aren't going _ wales isn't open for business, people aren't going to - wales isn't open for business, people aren't going to invest i wales isn't open for business, | people aren't going to invest in wales— people aren't going to invest in wales if— people aren't going to invest in wales if they— people aren't going to invest in wales if they think— people aren't going to invest in wales if they think they - people aren't going to invest in wales if they think they will - people aren't going to invest in wales if they think they will be| wales if they think they will be stuck— wales if they think they will be stuck on — wales if they think they will be stuck on a _ wales if they think they will be stuck on a car _ wales if they think they will be stuck on a car park. _ wales if they think they will be stuck on a car park. you - wales if they think they will be stuck on a car park. you need i wales if they think they will be i stuck on a car park. you need to wales if they think they will be - stuck on a car park. you need to get wates— stuck on a car park. you need to get wates 0pen— stuck on a car park. you need to get wates open to — stuck on a car park. you need to get wales open to attract _ stuck on a car park. you need to get wales open to attract people - stuck on a car park. you need to get wales open to attract people in - stuck on a car park. you need to get wales open to attract people in and| wales open to attract people in and then we _ wales open to attract people in and then we have — wales open to attract people in and then we have more _ wales open to attract people in and then we have more opportunity- wales open to attract people in and then we have more opportunity to l then we have more opportunity to invest— then we have more opportunity to invest in— then we have more opportunity to invest in green— then we have more opportunity to invest in greenjobs. _ then we have more opportunity to invest in greenjobs. one - then we have more opportunity to invest in greenjobs. one thing i invest in greenjobs. one thing doesn't — invest in greenjobs. one thing doesn't come _ invest in greenjobs. one thing doesn't come without - invest in greenjobs. one thing doesn't come without the - invest in greenjobs. one thing. doesn't come without the other. invest in greenjobs. one thing - doesn't come without the other. the issue is jobs. — doesn't come without the other. issue isjobs, amelia doesn't come without the other. tip; issue isjobs, amelia womack. doesn't come without the other. issue isjobs, amelia womack. you talk about keeping the other parties honest but in terms of meeting very ambitious climate targets, are you prepared to bring in legislation that will for example close a steel plant? that will for example close a steel lant? ,, , ., that will for example close a steel lant? ,, , . . ., . plant? steel is at the heart of a green industrial— plant? steel is at the heart of a green industrial revolution, . plant? steel is at the heart of a i green industrial revolution, we plant? steel is at the heart of a - green industrial revolution, we need railways _ green industrial revolution, we need railways and sustainable transport. it is essential and green steel is an opportunity to invest. do it is essential and green steel is an opportunity to invest.- an opportunity to invest. do you acce -t an opportunity to invest. do you accept that _ an opportunity to invest. do you accept that jobs _ an opportunity to invest. do you accept that jobs will _ an opportunity to invest. do you accept that jobs will be - an opportunity to invest. do you accept that jobs will be lost - an opportunity to invest. do you accept that jobs will be lost in l an opportunity to invest. do you| accept that jobs will be lost in so accept thatjobs will be lost in so many industries across wales if we try to hit the targets in your manifesto?— try to hit the targets in your manifesto? . �* , ., . . manifesto? that's not true. we're lookin: at manifesto? that's not true. we're looking at a _ manifesto? that's not true. we're looking at a just — manifesto? that's not true. we're looking at a just transition. - manifesto? that's not true. we're looking at a just transition. at - looking at a just transition. at wales, — looking at a just transition. at wales, what wales has never been given— wales, what wales has never been given is— wales, what wales has never been given is that kind of opportunity to retrain, _

given is that kind of opportunity to retrain, redevelop, as the climate changes, — retrain, redevelop, as the climate changes, of— retrain, redevelop, as the climate changes, of different issues. by ensuring — changes, of different issues. by ensuring we are investing in opportunities, injobs for the opportunities, in jobs for the future, — opportunities, injobs for the future, we can stop investing in jobs _ future, we can stop investing in jobs in — future, we can stop investing in jobs in a — future, we can stop investing in jobs in a system that is now fundamentally broken. we are seeing more young people not wanting to buy cars but _ more young people not wanting to buy cars but wanting a sustainable public — cars but wanting a sustainable public transport network that is the cheapest _ public transport network that is the cheapest and easiest option. the changing — cheapest and easiest option. the changing network will help to secure 'obs changing network will help to secure jobs in _ changing network will help to secure jobs in that— changing network will help to secure jobs in that area rather than relying _ jobs in that area rather than relying on the jobs of the past but steel— relying on the jobs of the past but steel isn't— relying on the jobs of the past but steel isn't at risk.— steel isn't at risk. we've seen a massive deindustrialisation - steel isn't at risk. we've seen a massive deindustrialisation of l steel isn't at risk. we've seen a i massive deindustrialisation of the uk as a result of this green talk. industries like steel, concrete production, glass, the high energy using industries have moved to other parts of the world where they have lower environmental standards than we have. it has been absolute perversity. irate we have. it has been absolute perversity-— perversity. we have a responsibility, - perversity. we have a responsibility, don't l perversity. we have a i responsibility, don't we? i perversity. we have a _ responsibility, don't we? i don't accet responsibility, don't we? i don't accept that— responsibility, don't we? i don't accept that c02 _ responsibility, don't we? i don't accept that c02 is _ responsibility, don't we? i don't accept that c02 is a _ responsibility, don't we? i don't accept that c02 is a pollutant. l responsibility, don't we? i don't| accept that c02 is a pollutant. it accept that co2 is a pollutant. it makes plants grow and as a result of the limited warming taking place over the last 100 years, 10% more

land surface is capable of growing crops, which is good. in a world where hunger is a massive problem for billions of people we are making it easier to give people the basic necessities of life. poverty is the biggest issue for me in wales, not some middle—class academic obsession which doesn't affect people who don't have to cope with the problems with daily life. ordinary people living in houses they can't afford to heat our where they don't have choices. abs. to heat our where they don't have choices. �* . . , , to heat our where they don't have choices. �* . ,, ., choices. a middle-class obsession? it isn't a middle-class _ choices. a middle-class obsession? it isn't a middle-class obsession, i it isn't a middle—class obsession, the poorest— it isn't a middle—class obsession, the poorest communities are going to be hit _ the poorest communities are going to be hit hardest by these issues. flooding — be hit hardest by these issues. flooding is caused by more unpredictable weather events as a result— unpredictable weather events as a result of— unpredictable weather events as a result of climate change and destroying natural landscapes which would _ destroying natural landscapes which would normally absorb water. our actions _ would normally absorb water. our actions are — would normally absorb water. our actions are causing impacts. climate change _ actions are causing impacts. climate change isn't — actions are causing impacts. climate change isn't in the future, it is in people's— change isn't in the future, it is in people's homes and living rooms in these _ people's homes and living rooms in these floods. we saw fires in

australia _ these floods. we saw fires in australia-— these floods. we saw fires in australia. . �*, ., ., ., australia. that's nothing to do with us. what australia. that's nothing to do with us- what we _ australia. that's nothing to do with us- what we got — australia. that's nothing to do with us. what we got to _ australia. that's nothing to do with us. what we got to look _ australia. that's nothing to do with us. what we got to look at - australia. that's nothing to do with us. what we got to look at in i australia. that's nothing to do with | us. what we got to look at in terms of this, us. what we got to look at in terms of this. the — us. what we got to look at in terms of this, the environment, _ us. what we got to look at in terms of this, the environment, health, i of this, the environment, health, they come — of this, the environment, health, they come in— of this, the environment, health, they come in one _ of this, the environment, health, they come in one thing _ of this, the environment, health, they come in one thing together. | of this, the environment, health, i they come in one thing together. as they come in one thing together. as the reform — they come in one thing together. as the reform party— they come in one thing together. as the reform party we _ they come in one thing together. as the reform party we want _ they come in one thing together. as the reform party we want to - they come in one thing together. as the reform party we want to investl the reform party we want to invest in electric— the reform party we want to invest in electric cars. _ the reform party we want to invest in electric cars. if _ the reform party we want to invest in electric cars. if you _ the reform party we want to invest in electric cars. if you look- the reform party we want to invest in electric cars. if you look around i in electric cars. if you look around wales, _ in electric cars. if you look around wales, where _ in electric cars. if you look around wales, where are _ in electric cars. if you look around wales, where are they— in electric cars. if you look around wales, where are they charging i wales, where are they charging points— wales, where are they charging points going _ wales, where are they charging points going to _ wales, where are they charging points going to be? _ wales, where are they charging points going to be? we - wales, where are they charging points going to be? we create i wales, where are they charging i points going to be? we create jobs by getting — points going to be? we create jobs by getting the _ points going to be? we create jobs by getting the charging _ points going to be? we create jobs by getting the charging points i points going to be? we create jobs by getting the charging points in. i by getting the charging points in. the important _ by getting the charging points in. the important thing _ by getting the charging points in. the important thing is, _ by getting the charging points in. the important thing is, air- the important thing is, air pollution _ the important thing is, air pollution from _ the important thing is, air pollution from the - the important thing is, air pollution from the current| the important thing is, air- pollution from the current cars causes — pollution from the current cars causes dementia _ pollution from the current cars causes dementia and - pollution from the current cars causes dementia and lung i pollution from the current cars i causes dementia and lung cancer, pollution from the current cars - causes dementia and lung cancer, so we could _ causes dementia and lung cancer, so we could have — causes dementia and lung cancer, so we could have a _ causes dementia and lung cancer, so we could have a better— causes dementia and lung cancer, so we could have a better health, - we could have a better health, better— we could have a better health, better environment _ we could have a better health, better environment with - we could have a better health, better environment with a i we could have a better health, i better environment with a targeted approach — better environment with a targeted approach i— better environment with a targeted a- roach. . ., ., better environment with a targeted a--roach. . ., ., ., . better environment with a targeted a- roach. ., ., ., ., ., ., approach. i want to move on and ask the following — approach. i want to move on and ask the following question, _ approach. i want to move on and ask the following question, which - approach. i want to move on and ask the following question, which the i the following question, which the previous debate ended with, do you think now is the time to start building towards a referendum on welsh independence? i’m building towards a referendum on welsh independence?— building towards a referendum on welsh independence? i'm happy to go with a referendum _ welsh independence? i'm happy to go with a referendum on _ welsh independence? i'm happy to go with a referendum on welsh _ with a referendum on welsh independence as long as it includes an option that we get rid of the senedd and move to a system where we transfer power not from one set of politicians in cardiff to

westminster or vice versa but we transfer it to the people. we want elected health boards which will determine priorities in local communities rather than having it in the hands of vaughan gething as it has been over the last five years. elected school boards can decide the priorities and the curriculum taught in schools and not something imposed by politicians in cardiff or elsewhere.— by politicians in cardiff or elsewhere. , , , ., ., elsewhere. this is puzzling, how do ou want elsewhere. this is puzzling, how do you want to — elsewhere. this is puzzling, how do you want to bring _ elsewhere. this is puzzling, how do you want to bring political - you want to bring political decision—making closer to people but at the same time you want to abolish the senedd, in which case the powers go to westminster and not cardiff. you go around wales and asked people, do they think government is closer to them today than it was 20 years ago, i don't think many will agree. we haven't got 50% turnout in the senedd election. that tells you a lot about how the welsh people think about the senedd.— think about the senedd. you've chanced think about the senedd. you've changed your — think about the senedd. you've changed your tune _ think about the senedd. you've changed your tune on _ think about the senedd. you've changed your tune on this i think about the senedd. you've changed your tune on this over| think about the senedd. you've i changed your tune on this over the years. i changed your tune on this over the ears. . , ., years. i have. i interviewed you countless— years. i have. i interviewed you countless times _ years. i have. i interviewed you countless times and _ years. i have. i interviewed you countless times and you - years. i have. i interviewed you countless times and you said i years. i have. i interviewed you| countless times and you said the years. i have. i interviewed you i countless times and you said the big

reason . . �* �* countless times and you said the big reason . , �* r . reason was we'd get brexit and there would be more _ reason was we'd get brexit and there would be more powers— reason was we'd get brexit and there would be more powers for— reason was we'd get brexit and there would be more powers for the - would be more powers for the devolved administrations. that's certainly true — devolved administrations. that's certainly true and _ devolved administrations. that's certainly true and that's - devolved administrations. that's certainly true and that's better l certainly true and that's better than what we had but over the last five years in the senedd, what i've learnt is, it's not capable of bringing real representative government to wales. we've always had a labour government, we live in a one—party state effectively. it a one—party state effectively. it took you five years as a well— paid took you five years as a well—paid set member to learn that labour are the major political force? set member to learn that labour are the major politicalforce? i could have told you that. i the major politicalforce? i could have told you that.— the major politicalforce? i could have told you that. i was going to co have told you that. i was going to no on to have told you that. i was going to go on to say _ have told you that. i was going to go on to say that _ have told you that. i was going to go on to say that because - have told you that. i was going to go on to say that because wales | have told you that. i was going to | go on to say that because wales is such a poor country and the welsh government doesn't have the means of raising the amount of money needed to provide for decent public services in wales because the tax baseis services in wales because the tax base is so low, that means devolution is bound to fail in wales. i was prepared to give devolution the benefit of the doubt when i was first elected because we'd had two referenda in wales but after 25 years it's time for the welsh people to have their say and give their verdict.— welsh people to have their say and

give their verdict. amelia womack? we would support _ give their verdict. amelia womack? we would support a _ give their verdict. amelia womack? we would support a referendum i give their verdict. amelia womack? | we would support a referendum and give their verdict. amelia womack? i we would support a referendum and we would _ we would support a referendum and we would support an independence vote in that— would support an independence vote in that referendum. it's clear that there's— in that referendum. it's clear that there's been a lack of, a poverty of ambition— there's been a lack of, a poverty of ambition from westminster. i want to brin- ambition from westminster. i want to bring your— ambition from westminster. i want to bring your example of steel into this because during the brexit negotiations that steel wasn't considered important by westminster but that's— considered important by westminster but that'sjobs and considered important by westminster but that's jobs and lives in wales, not considered important. we know that with _ not considered important. we know that with the ambition we have in wales, _ that with the ambition we have in wales, the — that with the ambition we have in wales, the talent we have, we believe — wales, the talent we have, we believe that most people can believe something fit for the 21st—century and to— something fit for the 21st—century and to be — something fit for the 21st—century and to be more nimble as a welsh nation _ and to be more nimble as a welsh nation at — and to be more nimble as a welsh nation. at the moment we are being hampered — nation. at the moment we are being hamered. ., ., i. , . . hampered. how do you square that with the figures? _ hampered. how do you square that with the figures? a _ hampered. how do you square that with the figures? a report - hampered. how do you square that with the figures? a report by i with the figures? a report by cardiff university says the gap between public spending and the revenue in wales is about £13 billion a year. a lot of the green subsidy schemes your party would like are expensive and we can't afford them.

we know the uk is in debt and wales has its _ we know the uk is in debt and wales has its share of that and actually at this— has its share of that and actually at this point it is interesting, about— at this point it is interesting, about how we can create green investment, we know the borrowing rates _ investment, we know the borrowing rates are _ investment, we know the borrowing rates are low, sorry, interest rates are low, _ rates are low, sorry, interest rates are low, this — rates are low, sorry, interest rates are low, this is a time to borrow and build. — are low, this is a time to borrow and build, and as we have seen from other— and build, and as we have seen from other economic recessions around the world, _ other economic recessions around the world, this _ other economic recessions around the world, this is — other economic recessions around the world, this is a time to invest. by investing — world, this is a time to invest. by investing in — world, this is a time to invest. by investing in an independent wales it means— investing in an independent wales it means we _ investing in an independent wales it means we have the freedom, and a wales— means we have the freedom, and a wales with — means we have the freedom, and a wales with more, we do want to have parity— wales with more, we do want to have parity with _ wales with more, we do want to have parity with powers in scotland, but it is how _ parity with powers in scotland, but it is how we — parity with powers in scotland, but it is how we invest in a future which — it is how we invest in a future which is — it is how we invest in a future which is not hampered by the lack of ambition— which is not hampered by the lack of ambition from westminster. it is uuite ambition from westminster. it is quite clear _ ambition from westminster. it is quite clear that _ ambition from westminster. it is quite clear that money does not grow on trees— quite clear that money does not grow on trees and — quite clear that money does not grow on trees and the _ quite clear that money does not grow on trees and the economic _ quite clear that money does not grow on trees and the economic plan, i've| on trees and the economic plan, i've seen _ on trees and the economic plan, i've seen no _ on trees and the economic plan, i've seen no credible _ on trees and the economic plan, i've seen no credible economic— on trees and the economic plan, i've seen no credible economic plan - on trees and the economic plan, i've| seen no credible economic plan from plaid cymru — seen no credible economic plan from plaid cymru regarding _ seen no credible economic plan from | plaid cymru regarding independence. people _ plaid cymru regarding independence. people are _ plaid cymru regarding independence. people are fed — plaid cymru regarding independence. people are fed up _ plaid cymru regarding independence. people are fed up of— plaid cymru regarding independence. people are fed up of the _ plaid cymru regarding independence. people are fed up of the egos - plaid cymru regarding independence. people are fed up of the egos from . people are fed up of the egos from politicians, — people are fed up of the egos from politicians, we _ people are fed up of the egos from politicians, we want _ people are fed up of the egos from politicians, we want to _ people are fed up of the egos from politicians, we want to abolish - people are fed up of the egos from politicians, we want to abolish the| politicians, we want to abolish the senedd. _ politicians, we want to abolish the senedd. so — politicians, we want to abolish the senedd. so the _ politicians, we want to abolish the senedd, so the reform _ politicians, we want to abolish the senedd, so the reform party- politicians, we want to abolish the . senedd, so the reform party position is very— senedd, so the reform party position is very clear. — senedd, so the reform party position is very clear. we _ senedd, so the reform party position is very clear, we want _ senedd, so the reform party position is very clear, we want two _ is very clear, we want two referendums, _ is very clear, we want two referendums, and -

is very clear, we want two referendums, and the - is very clear, we want ton referendums, and the polls is very clear, we want two - referendums, and the polls show there _ referendums, and the polls show there is— referendums, and the polls show there is no— referendums, and the polls show there is no mandate _ referendums, and the polls show there is no mandate for- referendums, and the polls show- there is no mandate for independence and no _ there is no mandate for independence and no poles — there is no mandate for independence and no poles to— there is no mandate for independence and no poles to abolish _ there is no mandate for independence and no poles to abolish the _ there is no mandate for independence and no poles to abolish the senedd. l and no poles to abolish the senedd. we are _ and no poles to abolish the senedd. we are a _ and no poles to abolish the senedd. we are a party— and no poles to abolish the senedd. we are a party of— and no poles to abolish the senedd. we are a party of the _ and no poles to abolish the senedd. we are a party of the union - and no poles to abolish the senedd. we are a party of the union and - and no poles to abolish the senedd. we are a party of the union and we i we are a party of the union and we believe _ we are a party of the union and we believe the — we are a party of the union and we believe the senedd _ we are a party of the union and we believe the senedd has _ we are a party of the union and we believe the senedd has its - we are a party of the union and we believe the senedd has its place, i we are a party of the union and we i believe the senedd has its place, as the brexit— believe the senedd has its place, as the brexit party— believe the senedd has its place, as the brexit party we _ believe the senedd has its place, as the brexit party we fought - believe the senedd has its place, as the brexit party we fought to - believe the senedd has its place, as the brexit party we fought to get. the brexit party we fought to get powers _ the brexit party we fought to get powers back _ the brexit party we fought to get powers back to _ the brexit party we fought to get powers back to the _ the brexit party we fought to get powers back to the uk _ the brexit party we fought to get powers back to the uk from - the brexit party we fought to get powers back to the uk from the. the brexit party we fought to get . powers back to the uk from the eu and we _ powers back to the uk from the eu and we are — powers back to the uk from the eu and we are not— powers back to the uk from the eu and we are not in— powers back to the uk from the eu and we are not in this _ powers back to the uk from the eu and we are not in this to— powers back to the uk from the eu and we are not in this to get- powers back to the uk from the eu and we are not in this to get the i and we are not in this to get the powers— and we are not in this to get the powers back— and we are not in this to get the powers back to— and we are not in this to get the powers back to westminster. i and we are not in this to get the| powers back to westminster. we and we are not in this to get the - powers back to westminster. we don't want wales— powers back to westminster. we don't want wales to — powers back to westminster. we don't want wales to be — powers back to westminster. we don't want wales to be an _ powers back to westminster. we don't want wales to be an annex. _ powers back to westminster. we don't want wales to be an annex. we - powers back to westminster. we don't want wales to be an annex. we are . want wales to be an annex. we are quite _ want wales to be an annex. we are quite clear. — want wales to be an annex. we are quite clear. we _ want wales to be an annex. we are quite clear, we would _ want wales to be an annex. we are quite clear, we would have - want wales to be an annex. we are quite clear, we would have a - quite clear, we would have a referendum _ quite clear, we would have a referendum on— quite clear, we would have a referendum on both, - quite clear, we would have a i referendum on both, separate referendums _ referendum on both, separate referendums with— referendum on both, separate referendums with a _ referendum on both, separate referendums with a yes - referendum on both, separate referendums with a yes or- referendum on both, separate referendums with a yes or noi referendum on both, separate - referendums with a yes or no answer and we _ referendums with a yes or no answer and we would — referendums with a yes or no answer and we would campaign _ referendums with a yes or no answer and we would campaign to— referendums with a yes or no answer and we would campaign to stay- referendums with a yes or no answer and we would campaign to stay in. referendums with a yes or no answer| and we would campaign to stay in the union— and we would campaign to stay in the union because — and we would campaign to stay in the union because wales _ and we would campaign to stay in the union because wales is— and we would campaign to stay in the union because wales is stronger- and we would campaign to stay in the union because wales is stronger in i union because wales is stronger in the union— union because wales is stronger in the union and _ union because wales is stronger in the union and we _ union because wales is stronger in the union and we would _ union because wales is stronger in the union and we would campaigni the union and we would campaign against _ the union and we would campaign against independence. _ the union and we would campaign against independence. you - the union and we would campaign against independence.— the union and we would campaign against independence. you are happy with the status _ against independence. you are happy with the status quo _ against independence. you are happy with the status quo effectively - against independence. you are happy with the status quo effectively in - with the status quo effectively in that you want the senedd to remain and yet a referendum, it would be mean we would be paralysed for a number of years, so what is the point? number of years, so what is the oint? ~ . ., ., number of years, so what is the oint? . ., ., ., ., number of years, so what is the oint? ~ . ., ., . . ., point? we are going to have another election in five _ point? we are going to have another election in five years _ point? we are going to have another election in five years and _ point? we are going to have another election in five years and we - point? we are going to have another election in five years and we can - election in five years and we can have _ election in five years and we can have the — election in five years and we can have the same _ election in five years and we can have the same parties— election in five years and we can have the same parties are - election in five years and we can| have the same parties are saying election in five years and we can - have the same parties are saying we want independence _ have the same parties are saying we want independence and _ have the same parties are saying we want independence and others- have the same parties are saying we want independence and others are l want independence and others are saying _ want independence and others are saying we — want independence and others are saying we want _ want independence and others are saying we want to _ want independence and others are saying we want to polish _ want independence and others are saying we want to polish so - want independence and others are saying we want to polish so if- want independence and others are saying we want to polish so if we i saying we want to polish so if we have _ saying we want to polish so if we have a _ saying we want to polish so if we have a referendum _ saying we want to polish so if we have a referendum we _ saying we want to polish so if we have a referendum we can - saying we want to polish so if we have a referendum we can put i saying we want to polish so if we . have a referendum we can put that saying we want to polish so if we - have a referendum we can put that to bed -- _ have a referendum we can put that to bed -- we _ have a referendum we can put that to bed -- we want— have a referendum we can put that to bed -- we want to— have a referendum we can put that to bed —— we want to abolish. _ have a referendum we can put that to bed —— we want to abolish. we - have a referendum we can put that to bed —— we want to abolish. we have i bed —— we want to abolish. we have -ot

bed —— we want to abolish. we have got great _ bed —— we want to abolish. we have got great talent _ bed —— we want to abolish. we have got great talent in _ bed —— we want to abolish. we have got great talent in wales, _ bed —— we want to abolish. we have got great talent in wales, just - bed —— we want to abolish. we have got great talent in wales, just looki got great talent in wales, just look at the _ got great talent in wales, just look at the 0scars— got great talent in wales, just look at the oscars this _ got great talent in wales, just look at the oscars this week, _ got great talent in wales, just look at the oscars this week, anthony. at the oscars this week, anthony hopkins — at the oscars this week, anthony hopkins what _ at the oscars this week, anthony hopkins. what we _ at the oscars this week, anthony hopkins. what we do _ at the oscars this week, anthony hopkins. what we do want - at the oscars this week, anthony hopkins. what we do want is - at the oscars this week, anthony hopkins. what we do want is to i hopkins. what we do want is to reform — hopkins. what we do want is to reform the _ hopkins. what we do want is to reform the senedd, _ hopkins. what we do want is to reform the senedd, because i hopkins. what we do want is to reform the senedd, because iti hopkins. what we do want is to. reform the senedd, because it is broken _ reform the senedd, because it is broken and — reform the senedd, because it is broken and people _ reform the senedd, because it is broken and people who - reform the senedd, because it is broken and people who are - reform the senedd, because it is. broken and people who are thinking of voting _ broken and people who are thinking of voting for— broken and people who are thinking of voting for abolish _ broken and people who are thinking of voting for abolish the _ broken and people who are thinking of voting for abolish the assemblyi of voting for abolish the assembly is mainly— of voting for abolish the assembly is mainly the — of voting for abolish the assembly is mainly the antilabour_ of voting for abolish the assembly is mainly the antilabour vote - of voting for abolish the assembly is mainly the antilabour vote after| is mainly the antilabour vote after 22 years. — is mainly the antilabour vote after 22 years. so— is mainly the antilabour vote after 22 years. so we _ is mainly the antilabour vote after 22 years, so we want _ is mainly the antilabour vote after 22 years, so we want to _ is mainly the antilabour vote after 22 years, so we want to scrutinise what _ 22 years, so we want to scrutinise what goes — 22 years, so we want to scrutinise what goes on _ 22 years, so we want to scrutinise what goes on in _ 22 years, so we want to scrutinise what goes on in wales. _ 22 years, so we want to scrutinise what goes on in wales. you - 22 years, so we want to scrutinise what goes on in wales.— 22 years, so we want to scrutinise what goes on in wales. you have been there five years. _ what goes on in wales. you have been there five years, what _ what goes on in wales. you have been there five years, what about _ what goes on in wales. you have been there five years, what about those - there five years, what about those plans? brute there five years, what about those lans? ~ ., �* there five years, what about those lans? . ., �* 4' ., there five years, what about those lans? ., �* ,, ., ., there five years, what about those lans? . ., �* 4' ., ., ,, plans? we don't know how the senedd can be reformed _ plans? we don't know how the senedd can be reformed and _ plans? we don't know how the senedd can be reformed and what _ plans? we don't know how the senedd can be reformed and what reforms - plans? we don't know how the senedd can be reformed and what reforms are| can be reformed and what reforms are an issue and i did not know that the abolish the assembly party was in favour of this, and that is progress, isuppose, and a big problem is under devolution the welsh government simply does not have the money it needs to do what needs to be done in wales. as you said, the funding gap which independence would cause amounts to about 20% of the welsh economy, and thatis about 20% of the welsh economy, and that is something which is just impossible to imagine, that an independent government would be able to survive without having a massive

squeeze on public spending. and it would not be able to borrow sums of that kind. plaid cymru won't not tell us what the currency will be in wales after independence but we need to use the strength of the uk where we are a part of it, to do what we need to do in wales.— we are a part of it, to do what we need to do in wales. now to the next cuestion. need to do in wales. now to the next question- what _ need to do in wales. now to the next question. what will _ need to do in wales. now to the next question. what will you _ need to do in wales. now to the next question. what will you do _ need to do in wales. now to the next question. what will you do to - question. what will you do to balance the demands of the health service and rebuild the mental and physical health of the people of wales? a question that we are reflecting from the previous debate. amelia womack.— reflecting from the previous debate. amelia womack. when we begin the conversation — amelia womack. when we begin the conversation we _ amelia womack. when we begin the conversation we have _ amelia womack. when we begin the conversation we have to _ amelia womack. when we begin the | conversation we have to acknowledge that mental health was bad before the pandemic and in young people especially it was worsening. we do need _ especially it was worsening. we do need to— especially it was worsening. we do need to make sure that mental health has parity— need to make sure that mental health has parity with physical health, but make _ has parity with physical health, but make sure — has parity with physical health, but make sure that we are talking about a long—term plan and strategy, not 'ust a long—term plan and strategy, not just looking at this pandemic, as a moment — just looking at this pandemic, as a moment it — just looking at this pandemic, as a moment. it should be the moment to change _ moment. it should be the moment to change everything with health and

mental— change everything with health and mental health, bringing it down into communities at the local level is vital and — communities at the local level is vital and important. we know there is a funding — vital and important. we know there is a funding gap, before the pandemic, yet again, and the pandemic— pandemic, yet again, and the pandemic really has exacerbated everything... also making sure we are investing in the people who have helped _ are investing in the people who have helped us— are investing in the people who have helped us and making sure we are giving _ helped us and making sure we are giving doctors and nurses a fair waqe — giving doctors and nurses a fair wage. while working to those big challenges. quickly on mental health. — challenges. quickly on mental health, we need to address those underlying issues about why people have mental health problems, such as unpredictable housing and unpredictable housing and unpredictable jobs as well as address— unpredictable jobs as well as address the health issues beyond 'ust address the health issues beyond just illness and make sure we have a genuine _ just illness and make sure we have a genuine health service and not just — genuine health service and not just l — genuine health service and not 'ust... . ., , g. just... i want to bring in jamie jenkins. just... i want to bring in jamie jenkins you _ just... i want to bring in jamie jenkins. you were _ just... i want to bring in jamie jenkins. you were a _ just... i want to bring in jamie i jenkins. you were a professional jenkins. you were a professional statistician with the ons beforehand. you built up quite a following on twitter, especially with your criticism of wales in terms of the handling of the

pandemic. clearly a big impact of the nhs could be if we have another peak in terms of coronavirus, and your party has ruled out any future lockdown? that is reckless, isn't it? ~ lockdown? that is reckless, isn't it? . . ., lockdown? that is reckless, isn't it? ~ ., ., ., lockdown? that is reckless, isn't it? . ., u ,, lockdown? that is reckless, isn't it? ., ., .. ,, it? we have got a successful vaccine rolled out, across _ it? we have got a successful vaccine rolled out, across wales _ it? we have got a successful vaccine rolled out, across wales the - rolled out, across wales the majority _ rolled out, across wales the majority of _ rolled out, across wales the majority of people _ rolled out, across wales the majority of people have - rolled out, across wales the majority of people have got| majority of people have got antibodies, _ majority of people have got antibodies, and _ majority of people have got antibodies, and we - majority of people have got antibodies, and we are - majority of people have got antibodies, and we are not| majority of people have gotl antibodies, and we are not a majority of people have got - antibodies, and we are not a party who want— antibodies, and we are not a party who want people _ antibodies, and we are not a party who want people to _ antibodies, and we are not a party who want people to lose - antibodies, and we are not a party who want people to lose lives, - antibodies, and we are not a party. who want people to lose lives, what we are _ who want people to lose lives, what we are saving. — who want people to lose lives, what we are saying. we _ who want people to lose lives, what we are saying, we have _ who want people to lose lives, what we are saying, we have had - who want people to lose lives, what we are saying, we have had the - we are saying, we have had the biggest — we are saying, we have had the biggest government— we are saying, we have had the biggest government data - we are saying, we have had the - biggest government data collection in the _ biggest government data collection in the last— biggest government data collection in the last year— biggest government data collection in the last year and _ biggest government data collection in the last year and we _ biggest government data collection in the last year and we know - biggest government data collection in the last year and we know the i biggest government data collection in the last year and we know the atj in the last year and we know the at risk people — in the last year and we know the at risk people and _ in the last year and we know the at risk people and we _ in the last year and we know the at risk people and we have _ in the last year and we know the at risk people and we have talked - in the last year and we know the at . risk people and we have talked about mental— risk people and we have talked about mental health. — risk people and we have talked about mental health, for— risk people and we have talked about mental health, for example, - risk people and we have talked about mental health, for example, but - risk people and we have talked about mental health, for example, but we i mental health, for example, but we have locked — mental health, for example, but we have locked down _ mental health, for example, but we have locked down the _ mental health, for example, but we have locked down the whole - mental health, for example, but wej have locked down the whole country on one _ have locked down the whole country on one of— have locked down the whole country on one of the — have locked down the whole country on one of the questions— have locked down the whole country on one of the questions from - have locked down the whole country on one of the questions from the . on one of the questions from the previous— on one of the questions from the previous hour— on one of the questions from the previous hour was _ on one of the questions from the previous hour was talking - on one of the questions from the previous hour was talking about| on one of the questions from the i previous hour was talking about the impact _ previous hour was talking about the impact of— previous hour was talking about the impact of lockdown _ previous hour was talking about the impact of lockdown on _ previous hour was talking about the impact of lockdown on peoples - previous hour was talking about the i impact of lockdown on peoples mental health _ impact of lockdown on peoples mental health and _ impact of lockdown on peoples mental health and on— impact of lockdown on peoples mental health. and on business. _ impact of lockdown on peoples mental health. and on business. we - impact of lockdown on peoples mental health. and on business. we would i health. and on business. we would not close _ health. and on business. we would not close businesses _ health. and on business. we would not close businesses and _ health. and on business. we would not close businesses and schools . not close businesses and schools because — not close businesses and schools because that _ not close businesses and schools because that has _ not close businesses and schools because that has had _ not close businesses and schools because that has had a _ not close businesses and schoolsi because that has had a damaging effect _ because that has had a damaging effect. prevention _ because that has had a damaging effect. prevention is _ because that has had a damaging effect. prevention is better- because that has had a damaging effect. prevention is better thani effect. prevention is better than the cure — effect. prevention is better than the cure. �* ,, effect. prevention is better than the cure. �* ., ., effect. prevention is better than the cure. ., ., ~ ., . the cure. but you do not know what the cure. but you do not know what the future holds? _ the cure. but you do not know what the future holds? to _ the cure. but you do not know what the future holds? to say _ the cure. but you do not know what the future holds? to say explicitly i the future holds? to say explicitly now that a lockdown would not happen. now that a lockdown would not ha en. ~ . now that a lockdown would not ha en, . ., ., now that a lockdown would not hauen. ~ . . , now that a lockdown would not ha -en. . . . , . . now that a lockdown would not hauen. . . . , . . , happen. what we have been clear is that we would _ happen. what we have been clear is that we would take _ happen. what we have been clear is that we would take a _ happen. what we have been clear is that we would take a risk _ happen. what we have been clear is that we would take a risk based - that we would take a risk based approach — that we would take a risk based approach by— that we would take a risk based approach by protecting - that we would take a risk based approach by protecting those i that we would take a risk based l approach by protecting those who

that we would take a risk based - approach by protecting those who are the most _ approach by protecting those who are the most vulnerable, _ approach by protecting those who are the most vulnerable, and _ approach by protecting those who are the most vulnerable, and looking - the most vulnerable, and looking down _ the most vulnerable, and looking down the — the most vulnerable, and looking down the whole _ the most vulnerable, and looking down the whole nation _ the most vulnerable, and looking down the whole nation is - the most vulnerable, and looking down the whole nation is causing| down the whole nation is causing suicide _ down the whole nation is causing suicide to— down the whole nation is causing suicide to the _ down the whole nation is causing suicide to the economy - down the whole nation is causing suicide to the economy and - down the whole nation is causing suicide to the economy and if - down the whole nation is causing| suicide to the economy and if you don't _ suicide to the economy and if you don't have — suicide to the economy and if you don't have an _ suicide to the economy and if you don't have an economy— suicide to the economy and if you don't have an economy to - suicide to the economy and if you don't have an economy to pay - suicide to the economy and if you don't have an economy to pay fori suicide to the economy and if you - don't have an economy to pay for the nhs they— don't have an economy to pay for the nhs they witi— don't have an economy to pay for the nhs they will be _ don't have an economy to pay for the nhs they will be no _ don't have an economy to pay for the nhs they will be no nhs _ don't have an economy to pay for the nhs they will be no nhs to _ don't have an economy to pay for the nhs they will be no nhs to fix - don't have an economy to pay for the nhs they will be no nhs to fix the i nhs they will be no nhs to fix the other— nhs they will be no nhs to fix the other things — nhs they will be no nhs to fix the other things we _ nhs they will be no nhs to fix the other things we have _ nhs they will be no nhs to fix the other things we have got - nhs they will be no nhs to fix the other things we have got and - nhs they will be no nhs to fix the other things we have got and if. nhs they will be no nhs to fix the | other things we have got and if you take the _ other things we have got and if you take the data. _ other things we have got and if you take the data, we _ other things we have got and if you take the data, we spend _ other things we have got and if you take the data, we spend 1.4- other things we have got and if you take the data, we spend 1.4 billion| take the data, we spend 1.4 billion on the _ take the data, we spend 1.4 billion on the nhs, — take the data, we spend 1.4 billion on the nhs, 2 _ take the data, we spend 1.4 billion on the nhs, 2 billion— take the data, we spend 1.4 billion on the nhs, 2 billion on— take the data, we spend 1.4 billion on the nhs, 2 billion on the - take the data, we spend 1.4 billion on the nhs, 2 billion on the fellowi on the nhs, 2 billion on the fellow skin, _ on the nhs, 2 billion on the fellow skin. and — on the nhs, 2 billion on the fellow skin, and waiting _ on the nhs, 2 billion on the fellow skin, and waiting lists— on the nhs, 2 billion on the fellow skin, and waiting lists are - on the nhs, 2 billion on the fellow skin, and waiting lists are now- skin, and waiting lists are now going — skin, and waiting lists are now going up. _ skin, and waiting lists are now going up. and _ skin, and waiting lists are now going up, and people - skin, and waiting lists are now going up, and people talk- skin, and waiting lists are now going up, and people talk a i skin, and waiting lists are now| going up, and people talk a lot about— going up, and people talk a lot about numbers _ going up, and people talk a lot about numbers and _ going up, and people talk a lot about numbers and what - going up, and people talk a lot about numbers and what they| going up, and people talk a lot- about numbers and what they might do for mentai— about numbers and what they might do for mental health _ about numbers and what they might do for mental health —— _ about numbers and what they might do for mental health —— 2— about numbers and what they might do for mental health —— 2 billion _ about numbers and what they might do for mental health —— 2 billion on - for mental health —— 2 billion on the furlough _ for mental health —— 2 billion on the furlough scheme. _ for mental health —— 2 billion on the furlough scheme. we - for mental health —— 2 billion on the furlough scheme. we are i for mental health —— 2 billion on i the furlough scheme. we are quite clear. _ the furlough scheme. we are quite clear. we _ the furlough scheme. we are quite clear, we would _ the furlough scheme. we are quite clear, we would get— the furlough scheme. we are quite clear, we would get the _ the furlough scheme. we are quite clear, we would get the nhs- the furlough scheme. we are quite i clear, we would get the nhs waiting list back— clear, we would get the nhs waiting list back to — clear, we would get the nhs waiting list back to pre—pandemic _ clear, we would get the nhs waiting list back to pre—pandemic levels, i clear, we would get the nhs waiting| list back to pre—pandemic levels, we are hot— list back to pre—pandemic levels, we are not against— list back to pre—pandemic levels, we are not against trying _ list back to pre—pandemic levels, we are not against trying to _ list back to pre—pandemic levels, we are not against trying to stop - are not against trying to stop people — are not against trying to stop peopte irr— are not against trying to stop people in terms _ are not against trying to stop people in terms of— are not against trying to stop people in terms of working, i are not against trying to stop . people in terms of working, we are not against trying to stop - people in terms of working, we want to get— people in terms of working, we want to get people — people in terms of working, we want to get people working _ people in terms of working, we want to get people working and _ people in terms of working, we want to get people working and get - to get people working and get businesses _ to get people working and get businesses working, - to get people working and get businesses working, that - to get people working and get businesses working, that is i to get people working and get. businesses working, that is the issue _ businesses working, that is the issue we — businesses working, that is the issue we have _ businesses working, that is the issue we have got _ businesses working, that is the issue we have got with - businesses working, that is the issue we have got with mentali issue we have got with mental health — issue we have got with mental health i— issue we have got with mental health. i know— issue we have got with mental health. i know people - issue we have got with mental health. i know people who - issue we have got with mental. health. i know people who have issue we have got with mental- health. i know people who have lost lives and _ health. i know people who have lost lives and jobs — health. i know people who have lost lives and jobs and _ health. i know people who have lost lives and jobs and it _ health. i know people who have lost lives and jobs and it is _ health. i know people who have lost lives and jobs and it is devastating l lives and jobs and it is devastating for people — lives and jobs and it is devastating for peopte but— lives and jobs and it is devastating for people but we _ lives and jobs and it is devastating for people but we have _ lives and jobs and it is devastating for people but we have got - lives and jobs and it is devastating for people but we have got to - lives and jobs and it is devastating | for people but we have got to have hope _ for people but we have got to have hope because _ for people but we have got to have hope because people _ for people but we have got to have hope because people won't - for people but we have got to have hope because people won't investi for people but we have got to have i hope because people won't invest in business _ hope because people won't invest in business if— hope because people won't invest in business if they— hope because people won't invest in business if they think _ hope because people won't invest in business if they think mark- business if they think mark drakeford _ business if they think mark drakeford is— business if they think mark drakeford is planning - business if they think mark drakeford is planning a - business if they think mark| drakeford is planning a third iockdown— drakeford is planning a third lockdown already. _ drakeford is planning a third lockdown already. we - drakeford is planning a third lockdown already. we have i drakeford is planning a third i lockdown already. we have got drakeford is planning a third - lockdown already. we have got a vaccine _ lockdown already. we have got a vaccine and — lockdown already. we have got a vaccine and we _ lockdown already. we have got a vaccine and we have _ lockdown already. we have got a vaccine and we have got - lockdown already. we have got a vaccine and we have got to - lockdown already. we have got a i vaccine and we have got to embrace it and _ vaccine and we have got to embrace it and there — vaccine and we have got to embrace it and there is— vaccine and we have got to embrace it and there is no _ vaccine and we have got to embrace it and there is no evidence - vaccine and we have got to embrace it and there is no evidence we - vaccine and we have got to embrace it and there is no evidence we will. it and there is no evidence we will io it and there is no evidence we will go into— it and there is no evidence we will go into a — it and there is no evidence we will go into a third _ it and there is no evidence we will go into a third wave _ it and there is no evidence we will go into a third wave at— it and there is no evidence we will go into a third wave at the - it and there is no evidence we will. go into a third wave at the moment. if go into a third wave at the moment. it you _ go into a third wave at the moment. it you are _ go into a third wave at the moment. it you are att— go into a third wave at the moment. if you are all irr— go into a third wave at the moment. if you are all in the _ go into a third wave at the moment.

if you are all in the senedd, - if you are all in the senedd, elected into the senedd, it will be one of the dominant issues, and it is at a chronic level, over 200,000 people in wales waiting over nine months, and yet the answer for you is to have more elections at a local level, how is that going to help? it level, how is that going to help? it will give people who are the users of the health service is say in how the priorities in their local areas are arrived at rather than form getting deciding what the policy is going to be —— vaughan gething. this is an important part of improving health services, to make them more responsive to the needs of patients and their views, and what we have is and their views, and what we have is a monolith in wales which is run essentially, essentially, from cardiff. if you live in north wales, the health board has been in special measures untiljust before the election, now for overfive measures untiljust before the election, now for over five years. we have seen massive scandals... that is all in the past.—

that is all in the past. well, you sa that. that is all in the past. well, you say that. what _ that is all in the past. well, you say that. what do _ that is all in the past. well, you say that. what do you _ that is all in the past. well, you say that. what do you think, - that is all in the past. well, you i say that. what do you think, what ou could say that. what do you think, what you could do _ say that. what do you think, what you could do to _ say that. what do you think, what you could do to make _ say that. what do you think, what you could do to make a _ say that. what do you think, what you could do to make a tangible l you could do to make a tangible difference to these waiting lists? before the pandemic we were still failing to meet welsh government targets on waiting lists by spectacular numbers, and so it has got to be about getting better value out of the money that you spent on health service because the health service in wales takes half of the budget of the welsh government. it's massive. , ., , ~ . budget of the welsh government. it's massive. , . g ,, , budget of the welsh government. it's massive. , ., , ~ , massive. jamie jenkins can come in. increasin: massive. jamie jenkins can come in. increasing the _ massive. jamie jenkins can come in. increasing the amount _ massive. jamie jenkins can come in. increasing the amount of— massive. jamie jenkins can come in. increasing the amount of money - massive. jamie jenkins can come in. increasing the amount of money the i increasing the amount of money the welsh government can spend on the health service, we are not going to be able to make these differences that we want. you be able to make these differences that we want-— be able to make these differences that we want. ., . , . that we want. you are the party that would like to — that we want. you are the party that would like to abolish _ that we want. you are the party that would like to abolish the _ that we want. you are the party that would like to abolish the senedd - that we want. you are the party that would like to abolish the senedd as| would like to abolish the senedd as well? _ would like to abolish the senedd as well? i're— would like to abolish the senedd as well? ., . ~' would like to abolish the senedd as well? ., . ,, ,., ., would like to abolish the senedd as well? ., .~ ., . . , well? to take power from politicians in cardiff to — well? to take power from politicians in cardiff to people _ well? to take power from politicians in cardiff to people on _ well? to take power from politicians in cardiff to people on the _ well? to take power from politicians in cardiff to people on the ground i in cardiff to people on the ground in cardiff to people on the ground in wales, through elected health boards and through elected school boards. in boards and through elected school boards. ., boards and through elected school boards. . . :: :: boards. in england we have 200 commissioning _ boards. in england we have 200 commissioning groups _ boards. in england we have 200 commissioning groups and - boards. in england we have 200 commissioning groups and the l boards. in england we have 200 i commissioning groups and the bbc have reported _

commissioning groups and the bbc have reported a _ commissioning groups and the bbc have reported a huge _ commissioning groups and the bbc have reported a huge postcode - have reported a huge postcode tottery— have reported a huge postcode lottery in— have reported a huge postcode lottery in england, _ have reported a huge postcode lottery in england, so - have reported a huge postcode lottery in england, so this- have reported a huge postcode i lottery in england, so this abolish the assembiy _ lottery in england, so this abolish the assembly argument - lottery in england, so this abolish the assembly argument of - lottery in england, so this abolishi the assembly argument ofjoining lottery in england, so this abolish i the assembly argument ofjoining up with england — the assembly argument ofjoining up with england to— the assembly argument ofjoining up with england to fix _ the assembly argument ofjoining up with england to fix the _ the assembly argument ofjoining up with england to fix the problems - the assembly argument ofjoining up with england to fix the problems is l with england to fix the problems is clearly— with england to fix the problems is clearly not — with england to fix the problems is clearly not the _ with england to fix the problems is clearly not the problem, _ with england to fix the problems is clearly not the problem, so - with england to fix the problems is clearly not the problem, so do - with england to fix the problems is clearly not the problem, so do we i clearly not the problem, so do we want _ clearly not the problem, so do we want in _ clearly not the problem, so do we want in wales— clearly not the problem, so do we want in wales to _ clearly not the problem, so do we want in wales to join _ clearly not the problem, so do we want in wales to join the - clearly not the problem, so do we | want in wales to join the postcode tottery— want in wales to join the postcode tottery of— want in wales to join the postcode lottery of england _ want in wales to join the postcode lottery of england or— want in wales to join the postcode lottery of england or have - want in wales to join the postcode lottery of england or have more i lottery of england or have more control— lottery of england or have more control in— lottery of england or have more control in wales? _ lottery of england or have more control in wales? the _ lottery of england or have more control in wales? the nhs i lottery of england or have more i control in wales? the nhs needs reform _ control in wales? the nhs needs reform brie — control in wales? the nhs needs reform. ~ ., control in wales? the nhs needs reform. ~ . ., control in wales? the nhs needs reform. ~ . . ., , reform. we have a postcode lottery in wales already. _ reform. we have a postcode lottery in wales already. let's _ reform. we have a postcode lottery in wales already. let's not - reform. we have a postcode lottery in wales already. let's not imagine | in wales already. let's not imagine that you can wave a magic wand and produce something that is not going to happen. it is produce something that is not going to ha en. , ., . , produce something that is not going to hauen. , ., . , ., produce something that is not going to ha..en_ , ., ., , ., , to happen. it is not a bed of roses on the other— to happen. it is not a bed of roses on the other side _ to happen. it is not a bed of roses on the other side of— to happen. it is not a bed of roses on the other side of the _ to happen. it is not a bed of roses on the other side of the border. . to happen. it is not a bed of roses. on the other side of the border. i'm not on the other side of the border. i“n not suggesting it is. i don't suggest everything is better in england because i know that is not the case. it is to do with making government more responsive to the people and giving the people on the ground, the uses of public services, a key role in deciding the priorities.— a key role in deciding the riorities. ~ . ., , ., a key role in deciding the riorities. ~ . ., , a key role in deciding the riorities. . ., , ., priorities. what would your party do to reduce waiting _ priorities. what would your party do to reduce waiting lists? _ priorities. what would your party do to reduce waiting lists? waiting i to reduce waiting lists? waiting lists were a _ to reduce waiting lists? waiting lists were a big _ to reduce waiting lists? waiting lists were a big issue _ to reduce waiting lists? waiting lists were a big issue before i to reduce waiting lists? waiting| lists were a big issue before the pandemic— lists were a big issue before the pandemic and there was a funding gap that was— pandemic and there was a funding gap that was not being met and there was an ever—increasing of about 1.2 billion— an ever—increasing of about 1.2 billion increasing up to 2030, and

we need — billion increasing up to 2030, and we need to— billion increasing up to 2030, and we need to make sure we address all of our— we need to make sure we address all of our opportunities in the health service _ of our opportunities in the health service and remove the barriers for people _ service and remove the barriers for people re—entering the health service, — people re—entering the health service, to fix the backlog. we need to look— service, to fix the backlog. we need to look at— service, to fix the backlog. we need to look at other solutions like even looking _ to look at other solutions like even looking at — to look at other solutions like even looking at other forms of cancer care, _ looking at other forms of cancer care, like — looking at other forms of cancer care, like introducing things like radiotherapy. we need to make sure that we _ radiotherapy. we need to make sure that we have a holistic approach to how we _ that we have a holistic approach to how we work with our health and social— how we work with our health and social care — how we work with our health and social care. delivering that in communities. but the nhs needs investment but we also need to —— we also need _ investment but we also need to —— we also need to— investment but we also need to —— we also need to tackle the mental health— also need to tackle the mental health issues which have affected doctors _ health issues which have affected doctors and nurses and bring them back into _ doctors and nurses and bring them back into the health service. now we have closing — back into the health service. now we have closing statements _ back into the health service. now we have closing statements from - back into the health service. now we have closing statements from the i have closing statements from the leaders starting with jamie jenkins from leaders starting with jamiejenkins from the leaders starting with jamie jenkins from the reform party.— from the reform party. people in wales say they — from the reform party. people in wales say they do _ from the reform party. people in wales say they do not _ from the reform party. people in wales say they do not trust i wales say they do not trust politicians _ wales say they do not trust politicians and _ wales say they do not trust politicians and in _ wales say they do not trust politicians and in 2019 i wales say they do not trust| politicians and in 2019 when wales say they do not trust i politicians and in 2019 when we wales say they do not trust - politicians and in 2019 when we were the brexit— politicians and in 2019 when we were the brexit party. _ politicians and in 2019 when we were the brexit party, you _ politicians and in 2019 when we were the brexit party, you put— politicians and in 2019 when we were the brexit party, you put your- politicians and in 2019 when we were the brexit party, you put your trust i the brexit party, you put your trust in us _ the brexit party, you put your trust in us by— the brexit party, you put your trust in us by giving _ the brexit party, you put your trust in us by giving us— the brexit party, you put your trust in us by giving us an— the brexit party, you put your trust in us by giving us an overwhelming | in us by giving us an overwhelming manrity_ in us by giving us an overwhelming majority in — in us by giving us an overwhelming majority in one _ in us by giving us an overwhelming majority in one of— in us by giving us an overwhelming majority in one of the _ in us by giving us an overwhelming majority in one of the national- majority in one of the national elections _ majority in one of the national elections and _ majority in one of the national elections and we _ majority in one of the national elections and we delivered i majority in one of the national elections and we delivered forj majority in one of the national- elections and we delivered for you. next week—

elections and we delivered for you. next week is— elections and we delivered for you. next week is your _ elections and we delivered for you. next week is your opportunity i elections and we delivered for you. next week is your opportunity to i elections and we delivered for you. i next week is your opportunity to put your trust— next week is your opportunity to put your trust in— next week is your opportunity to put your trust in us— next week is your opportunity to put your trust in us again _ next week is your opportunity to put your trust in us again and _ next week is your opportunity to put your trust in us again and if- next week is your opportunity to put your trust in us again and if one i next week is your opportunity to put your trust in us again and if one in. your trust in us again and if one in ten people — your trust in us again and if one in ten people on— your trust in us again and if one in ten people on the _ your trust in us again and if one in ten people on the regional- your trust in us again and if one in ten people on the regional bad i your trust in us again and if one in| ten people on the regional bad list vote for— ten people on the regional bad list vote for the — ten people on the regional bad list vote for the reform _ ten people on the regional bad list vote for the reform party - ten people on the regional bad list vote for the reform party you i ten people on the regional bad list vote for the reform party you willl vote for the reform party you will -et vote for the reform party you will get one _ vote for the reform party you will get one in — vote for the reform party you will get one in ten— vote for the reform party you will get one in ten of— vote for the reform party you will get one in ten of your— vote for the reform party you will get one in ten of your politicians i get one in ten of your politicians in the _ get one in ten of your politicians in the senedd _ get one in ten of your politicians in the senedd representing - get one in ten of your politicians in the senedd representing you i get one in ten of your politicians . in the senedd representing you —— regional— in the senedd representing you —— regional list — in the senedd representing you —— regional list vote. _ in the senedd representing you —— regional list vote. we _ in the senedd representing you —— regional list vote. we want - in the senedd representing you —— regional list vote. we want to - in the senedd representing you —— i regional list vote. we want to make wales— regional list vote. we want to make wales 6 _ regional list vote. we want to make wales 6 better— regional list vote. we want to make wales a better place. _ regional list vote. we want to make wales a better place.— regional list vote. we want to make wales a better place. amelia womack. this election — wales a better place. amelia womack. this election is _ wales a better place. amelia womack. this election is happening _ wales a better place. amelia womack. this election is happening at _ wales a better place. amelia womack. this election is happening at a - this election is happening at a criticai— this election is happening at a critical point in our history and the greens scrutiny is attentional to post _ the greens scrutiny is attentional to post pandemic recovery. experts say that _ to post pandemic recovery. experts say that on — to post pandemic recovery. experts say that on the regional balance on most _ say that on the regional balance on most ballots it is between the greens, — most ballots it is between the greens, abolish the assembly and the tories, _ greens, abolish the assembly and the tories, and _ greens, abolish the assembly and the tories, and historically over1 mittion — tories, and historically over1 million labour votes have been wasted — million labour votes have been wasted on _ million labour votes have been wasted on that list, do not waste yours _ wasted on that list, do not waste yours vote — wasted on that list, do not waste yours. vote for the green party and together— yours. vote for the green party and together we can transform wales. finatty. _ together we can transform wales. finally, neil hamilton. the together we can transform wales. finally, neil hamilton.— finally, neil hamilton. the idea that the senedd _ finally, neil hamilton. the idea that the senedd represents - finally, neil hamilton. the idea - that the senedd represents ordinary people in wales is nonsense. it is proved by the reaction of welsh politicians in the senedd to brexit,

33% voted for brexit in wales but 80% of the members in the senedd voted to remain at the welsh government aided and abetted by the lib dems and plaid did their best to frustrate the results of the referendum which was your decision, as to the future wales. wales is the poorest part of the uk and we are poorer today than 22 years ago and we have had a permanent labour government and we are going to get a labour government again after the 6th of may because plaid are already cosying up to mark drakeford, so the only way to get around this is to get rid of the senedd. to only way to get around this is to get rid of the senedd.— get rid of the senedd. to all of ou, get rid of the senedd. to all of you. thanks — get rid of the senedd. to all of you, thanks for _ get rid of the senedd. to all of you, thanks forjoining - get rid of the senedd. to all of you, thanks forjoining us. - get rid of the senedd. to all of i you, thanks forjoining us. there are other parties contesting the election. prop out, the communist party of great britain, and the freedom alliance. you can find out more about their policies over on the website. that is it. polling day next

thursday with counting happening the day after, we will have comprehensive coverage throughout the day on bbc wales, tv, radio and online, next friday, the 7th of may. thanks for watching. goodbye.

tonight at ten — campaigners vow to fight a new law which could leave hundreds of thousands of people facing huge bills for fire safety renovations on their homes. the new fire safety bill came into force today. the government says it will save lives. critics say it could leave many who own flats with flammable cladding facing bankruptcy. millions of people across this country are affected by this. you are ruining people's lives. we don't have the funds to fix this problem that was not of our making. the new law comes in the wake of the grenfell tower tragedy in 2017, which claimed the lives of 72 people. the fire safety bill, which has received royal assent, will actually help to save lives by changing some of these awful regulations and guidelines that existed previously, and this will help save lives.