at it one last time. first, though, we hearfrom some of those challenging the so—called big five. among them — some familiar faces. welcome to the campaign — in underan hour... it's the final tv debate of the 2021 scottish parliament

elections here on the bbc. the leaders of the snp, the conservatives, labour, liberal democrats and scottish greens are facing each other with less than 48 hours till election day. but there are other parties fighting for your vote on thursday. and the voting system used for scottish parliament elections means smaller and newer parties are in with a real chance too. over the next half hour we'll hear from six of them who are are standing enough candidates to earn an election broadcast on tv and radio, including alex salmond, leader of the alba party. first up, another politician who doesn't need much of an introduction. george galloway, who was a labour mp in glasgow for the best part of two decades, now standing for another new party, all for unity. thank you for being with us this evening. if voters have not heard of your new party, which is possible given the polling we have seen so far, what are you all about? trying

to sto far, what are you all about? trying to step the — far, what are you all about? trying to stop the never _ far, what are you all about? trying to stop the never ending, - far, what are you all about? trying to stop the never ending, get - far, what are you all about? trying to stop the never ending, get off. to stop the never ending, get off the hamster wheel with the constant threats_ the hamster wheel with the constant threats with the break—up of the countrx — threats with the break—up of the country. we want people to vote tactically, — country. we want people to vote tactically, not the one they like, not the — tactically, not the one they like, not the one their mother or father voted _ not the one their mother or father voted for. — not the one their mother or father voted for, or the one they like best. — voted for, or the one they like best. but— voted for, or the one they like best, but the want to stop the break-up _ best, but the want to stop the break—up. hold your nose and vote for the _ break—up. hold your nose and vote for the hest— break—up. hold your nose and vote for the best candidate to save the union, _ for the best candidate to save the union, to— for the best candidate to save the union, to save britain. it is a big ass, _ union, to save britain. it is a big ass, but — union, to save britain. it is a big ass, but i — union, to save britain. it is a big ass, but i think it is an idea whose time _ ass, but i think it is an idea whose time has _ ass, but i think it is an idea whose time has come. we ass, but i think it is an idea whose time has come.— time has come. we will get to tactical voting _ time has come. we will get to tactical voting in _ time has come. we will get to tactical voting in a _ time has come. we will get to tactical voting in a moment i time has come. we will get to l tactical voting in a moment and time has come. we will get to - tactical voting in a moment and your name is all for unity, which isn't very unifying and some of the scottish population don't want to stop the never—ending, as he put it. there are those who want the british state to remain united. but there are those who want the british state to remain united.— state to remain united. but you want to foruet state to remain united. but you want to forget about _ state to remain united. but you want to forget about the _ state to remain united. but you want to forget about the rest _

state to remain united. but you want to forget about the rest of _ state to remain united. but you want to forget about the rest of the - state to remain united. but you want to forget about the rest of the 5096 l to forget about the rest of the 50% of the population? to forget about the rest of the 5096 of the population?— to forget about the rest of the 5096 of the population? they want to tear scotland out — of the population? they want to tear scotland out of _ of the population? they want to tear scotland out of the _ of the population? they want to tear scotland out of the british _ of the population? they want to tear scotland out of the british state - of the population? they want to tear scotland out of the british state so l scotland out of the british state so we have no common ground with them. but the majority of people in scotland in the referendum, in the opinion polls recently want britain to stay together. but you have got to stay together. but you have got to vote smart and tactically in order to bring that about. otherwise you will get a minority of the vote dictating the terms of politics for the next five years. you dictating the terms of politics for the next five years.— dictating the terms of politics for the next five years. you want people to vote tactically _ the next five years. you want people to vote tactically for _ the next five years. you want people to vote tactically for the _ the next five years. you want people to vote tactically for the union - to vote tactically for the union party in the constituency, but on the regional list vote is your new party not at risk of splitting the unionist vote, which is then at risk of giving more votes to the snp of the greens, the pro—independence parties? the greens, the pro-independence arties? ~ . the greens, the pro-independence arties? . ., the greens, the pro-independence arties? ~ . ., ,, ., ., , parties? what risks and snp ma'ority is the fact that — parties? what risks and snp ma'ority is the fact that what i parties? what risks and snp ma'ority is the fact that what labour, _ parties? what risks and snp majority is the fact that what labour, the - is the fact that what labour, the conservatives and the liberals are standing in seats where they have no hope of winning. so in the

constituency i have just driven through, nicola sturgeon could easily be defeated if the tories and the liberals withdrew their candidate. in my south scotland constituency, you can elect me for 20,000 votes, get an extra unionist mst. it would take 100,000 votes to elect a conservative. it is not rocket science. vote smart is our message and people are turning onto it. if message and people are turning onto it. , ., , ., message and people are turning onto it. ., ,�* message and people are turning onto it. if your plan doesn't work and the snp do _ it. if your plan doesn't work and the snp do get _ it. if your plan doesn't work and the snp do get a _ it. if your plan doesn't work and the snp do get a majority - it. if your plan doesn't work and the snp do get a majority of. the snp do get a majority of pro—independence parties get a majority at holyrood, is it not democratic to just allow that second referendum? ida. democratic to 'ust allow that second referendum?— democratic to 'ust allow that second referendum? ., , , ., referendum? no, because it will have been done again _ referendum? no, because it will have been done again on _ referendum? no, because it will have been done again on a _ referendum? no, because it will have been done again on a minority - referendum? no, because it will have been done again on a minority vote, | been done again on a minority vote, almost certainly. in fact, i would bet my house against the snp not winning a majority of the vote and there is a gigantic proportion who will not vote at all. you cannot

have what is effectively 25% of the voters driving the break—up of britain, this is a country that has been together for 300 years, more than 300 years, you cannot break that up on a minority. hats? than 300 years, you cannot break that up on a minority.— than 300 years, you cannot break that up on a minority. how do you know the people _ that up on a minority. how do you know the people that _ that up on a minority. how do you know the people that don't - that up on a minority. how do you know the people that don't vote, | that up on a minority. how do you i know the people that don't vote, you cannot vote them as no voters? neither can you vote them as voters for breaking up the country. we had a referendum in which the vast majority voted, the biggest turnout we have ever had in scotland. i have been fighting elections here for a very long time. they voted decisively. but it was never respected, that is the point. if scotland does get a referendum in scotland does get a referendum in scotland did vote for independence, in your manifesto you're suggesting any people who voted against it should remain in the uk. if aberdeenshire votes no, how on earth would that work? you just start carving up scotland? it is

would that work? you 'ust start carving up scotland?_ would that work? you 'ust start carving up scotland? it is best not to to carving up scotland? it is best not to go down _ carving up scotland? it is best not to go down the — carving up scotland? it is best not to go down the separatist... - carving up scotland? it is best not to go down the separatist... it - carving up scotland? it is best not to go down the separatist... it is i to go down the separatist... it is in our to go down the separatist... it is in your manifesto? _ to go down the separatist... it is in your manifesto? wouldn't - to go down the separatist... it is in your manifesto? wouldn't it i to go down the separatist... it is| in your manifesto? wouldn't it be the greatest _ in your manifesto? wouldn't it be the greatest of _ in your manifesto? wouldn't it be the greatest of ironies _ in your manifesto? wouldn't it be the greatest of ironies in - in your manifesto? wouldn't it be | the greatest of ironies in breaking up the greatest of ironies in breaking up britain led to the breaking up of scotland? i can tell you in dumfries and galloway where i live, the overwhelming majority of people will not be dragged out of britain against their will. that phrase might be familiarto against their will. that phrase might be familiar to you because thatis might be familiar to you because that is what nicola sturgeon said about the eu referendum. so what is good for the goose is good for the gander. good for the goose is good for the tander. ., ., ,., .., ., gander. you also said income tax should be lowered _ gander. you also said income tax should be lowered to _ gander. you also said income tax should be lowered to come - gander. you also said income tax should be lowered to come in - gander. you also said income tax| should be lowered to come in line with england. use say higher taxes are an impediment for attracting and recruiting workers. those are not the words of a socialist? the words ofthe the words of a socialist? the words of the alliance _ the words of a socialist? the words of the alliance for _ the words of a socialist? the words of the alliance for unity, _ the words of a socialist? the words of the alliance for unity, a - the words of a socialist? the words of the alliance for unity, a broadly. of the alliance for unity, a broadly based party, which believes that paying higher tax for poorer

services under the snp is a very bad idea. we are paying taxes but education is poorer, child poverty is poorer. the health service is poorer. i think the idea of devolution has been betrayed. my was a fighter for devolution, one of the originalfighters for it a fighter for devolution, one of the original fighters for it a0 years ago and more. but it has been betrayed because it has been used, not to govern scotland better, but to break scotland away from the rest of the united kingdom, which is a fundamental flaw. of the united kingdom, which is a fundamentalflaw. d0 of the united kingdom, which is a fundamental flaw.— of the united kingdom, which is a fundamental flaw. do you have any evidence that _ fundamental flaw. do you have any evidence that when _ fundamental flaw. do you have any evidence that when you _ fundamental flaw. do you have any evidence that when you say - fundamental flaw. do you have any evidence that when you say higher| evidence that when you say higher taxes are an impediment to attracting people, where is your evidence? ., ., ., , evidence? you asked me about people leavint if evidence? you asked me about people leaving if there — evidence? you asked me about people leaving if there was _ evidence? you asked me about people leaving if there was a _ evidence? you asked me about people leaving if there was a referendum. - evidence? you asked me about people leaving if there was a referendum. i i leaving if there was a referendum. i didn't want to give you names because they would, by the end of the day been subject to a boycott

campaign and possibly worse. since we had that conversation the bank of scotland has made it clear that if scotland has made it clear that if scotland breaks away from the rest of the country, they will be off. we should avoid all of that and try to make devolution work to make scotland better within the union. that is what we stand for. george gallowa , that is what we stand for. george galloway, thank _ that is what we stand for. george galloway, thank you _ that is what we stand for. george galloway, thank you very - that is what we stand for. george galloway, thank you very much i galloway, thank you very much indeed. there aren't many political parties who've had a bigger impact on politics this past decade than ukip. nigel farage led them as they forced the issue of brexit up the agenda. and while he's away, his old outfit are still around. donald mackay leads the party in scotland and donald mackay, i'm wondering what the uk independence party can offer in a world where brexit�*s been achieved? the point in ukip, both in scotland and wales is we are the only mainstream party campaigning to get rid of the respective assemblies, in this case, the scottish parliament.

it is glorified and an expensive form of local authority, it is unnecessary and it should be deposited in the nearest recycling receptacle. the first minister of scotland earns more than the prime minister of great britain, which is a nonsense. we want to offer a voice to people who don't want the parliament in the first place, which we estimate to be around 16% of the population of scotland. we estimate to be around 1696 of the population of scotland.— population of scotland. really? 1696 ofthe population of scotland. really? 1696 of the population — population of scotland. really? 1696 of the population don't _ population of scotland. really? 1696 of the population don't believe - population of scotland. really? 1696 of the population don't believe in i of the population don't believe in the scottish parliament? i can give ou a co- the scottish parliament? i can give you a copy of _ the scottish parliament? i can give you a copy of the _ the scottish parliament? i can give you a copy of the poll _ the scottish parliament? i can give you a copy of the poll if _ the scottish parliament? i can give you a copy of the poll if you - the scottish parliament? i can give you a copy of the poll if you want l you a copy of the poll if you want it. ., . ., , , , you a copy of the poll if you want it. ., , ,, |f you a copy of the poll if you want it. ., , , , ifthe it. the general consensus... if the media would _ it. the general consensus... if the media would pay _ it. the general consensus... if the media would pay attention, - it. the general consensus... if the media would pay attention, we - it. the general consensus... if the j media would pay attention, we did circulate it at the time but the media ignored us.— circulate it at the time but the media ignored us. after everything the scottish _ media ignored us. after everything the scottish parliament _ media ignored us. after everything the scottish parliament has - media ignored us. after everything | the scottish parliament has done... you arejoking, it makes the scottish parliament has done... you are joking, it makes political mediocrity into an art form. there

are no heseltine, michael foot or churchill in that lot. are no heseltine, michaelfoot or churchill in that lot.— are no heseltine, michaelfoot or churchill in that lot. there are not in westminster _ churchill in that lot. there are not in westminster either. _ churchill in that lot. there are not in westminster either. fair- churchill in that lot. there are not| in westminster either. fair enough but we have _ in westminster either. fair enough but we have sixth _ in westminster either. fair enough but we have sixth formers - in westminster either. fair enough | but we have sixth formers debating and earning nice money for doing so. they are making scotland for the 21st—century, most would argue. i would question that. we are standing to give voice to those want rid of the scottish parliament, as our colleagues in wales who want rid of the welsh assembly. let’s colleagues in wales who want rid of the welsh assembly.— the welsh assembly. let's look at brexit, the welsh assembly. let's look at brexit. what _ the welsh assembly. let's look at brexit, what has _ the welsh assembly. let's look at brexit, what has brexit _ the welsh assembly. let's look at brexit, what has brexit done - the welsh assembly. let's look at brexit, what has brexit done for l brexit, what has brexit done for scotland? ~ ., brexit, what has brexit done for scotland? . . ., , �* ., brexit, what has brexit done for scotland? . . . , �* ., ., scotland? what has brexit done for scotland? what has brexit done for scotland? arguably, _ scotland? what has brexit done for scotland? arguably, we _ scotland? what has brexit done for scotland? arguably, we haven't - scotland? what has brexit done for| scotland? arguably, we haven't had scotland? what has brexit done for. scotland? arguably, we haven't had a proper brexit anyway because we always argued we should leave without any deal, and that didn't happen and that is why we have the difficulty in northern ireland. i am one of those people who believe, ukip is a party believes governments don't solve problems they create

them. the best way we can have a prosperous economy is to let businesses thrive in an environment which is not regulated by government any more than is necessary. scotland has 300,000 small businesses, i am one of them. we has 300,000 small businesses, i am one of them-— has 300,000 small businesses, i am one of them. we get no assistance at all. man one of them. we get no assistance at all- many will — one of them. we get no assistance at all. many will suffer _ one of them. we get no assistance at all. many will suffer because - one of them. we get no assistance at all. many will suffer because of - one of them. we get no assistance at all. many will suffer because of the l all. many will suffer because of the impact of brexit? i all. many will suffer because of the impact of brexit?— all. many will suffer because of the impact of brexit? i don't agree with that at all. many _ impact of brexit? i don't agree with that at all. many of— impact of brexit? i don't agree with that at all. many of them _ impact of brexit? i don't agree with that at all. many of them are - impact of brexit? i don't agree with | that at all. many of them are saying the will. that at all. many of them are saying they will- and _ that at all. many of them are saying they will. and many _ that at all. many of them are saying they will. and many are _ that at all. many of them are saying they will. and many are not, - that at all. many of them are saying they will. and many are not, brexit| they will. and many are not, brexit is tood they will. and many are not, brexit is good news _ they will. and many are not, brexit is good news for _ they will. and many are not, brexit is good news for some, _ they will. and many are not, brexit is good news for some, not - they will. and many are not, brexit is good news for some, not for - is good news for some, not for others, that is life but it gives us the opportunity to make our own laws, which is a good thing about it. ., , ., , ., , laws, which is a good thing about it. the group of people who are lookint it. the group of people who are looking forward _ it. the group of people who are looking forward to _ it. the group of people who are looking forward to brexit - it. the group of people who are looking forward to brexit more | it. the group of people who are - looking forward to brexit more than any other weather fishing fleets of the scottish coastal communities, they were promised a sea of opportunity and as one skipper told me the other day, they have a tied half in. ,., . , me the other day, they have a tied half in. , , me the other day, they have a tied halfin. , ,. . me the other day, they have a tied halfin. _ ,. ., ., half in. our policy is clear on that, we _ half in. our policy is clear on that, we would _ half in. our policy is clear on that, we would give - half in. our policy is clear on that, we would give a - half in. our policy is clear on that, we would give a 12 - half in. our policy is clear on | that, we would give a 12 mile

fishing limits around the seas for scotland, the conservatives always do one thing, they let you down. brexit has let us down. it's because it's not a clean brexit. once it settles, assuming it does, the british people will be able to make their own laws governed by their own parliament. you their own laws governed by their own tarliament. ., ., ., , ., parliament. you have made your point ahead of thursday's _ parliament. you have made your point ahead of thursday's vote. _ parliament. you have made your point ahead of thursday's vote. thank - parliament. you have made your point ahead of thursday's vote. thank you. | let's hear quickly from a couple of other parties we mentioned at the very start. the freedom alliance and, first, the scottish family party. our values are very distinctive, our pollies are promoting stable family life through marriage, unique within the party standing for the selection. our pro—life stance is also unique, we are opposed to abortion on demand and assisted suicide. the other parties are not opposing those things. our education policies, we don'tjust see the problems like other parties, we can also see the solutions. we are genuinely supportive of freedom of

speech. the genuinely supportive of freedom of s-eech. ., ~ ., . genuinely supportive of freedom of s-eech. ., ~ , speech. the freedom alliance party was formed — speech. the freedom alliance party was formed in _ speech. the freedom alliance party was formed in a _ speech. the freedom alliance party was formed in a short _ speech. the freedom alliance party was formed in a short time - speech. the freedom alliance party was formed in a short time in - was formed in a short time in response _ was formed in a short time in response to the government restrictions that have gone on over the year— restrictions that have gone on over the year since the covid pandemic was pronounced. and freedom alliance has come _ was pronounced. and freedom alliance has come together from business people. _ has come together from business people, health professionals and caring _ people, health professionals and caring individuals who are interested in human rights who make a difference to stop the restrictions on peoples lives affecting people in an adverse way. next up — reform uk. an outfit that began its life as the brexit party. michelle ballantyne is their leader in scotland. she's been an msp for the past five years — though she was elected as a conservative back in 2016. welcome to the programme. your party is pro—brexit, anti—independence, what else have you got to offer? irate what else have you got to offer? we are what else have you got to offer? - are fundamentally about common sense. we understand that actually decisions should be taken close to the people so we are not against

having a devolved parliament, we think it is a positive thing and can be a good thing for scotland. what we are concerned about is this a move away from integrity and common sense, the move away from having policies that make a positive difference that improve our education systems, that increase the benefits from health and address of theissues benefits from health and address of the issues we have in scotland such as the drugs problem, such as our ability to deliver locally, right across the country for people. we are about saying there are policies we should be looking at and we have laid those out... {titre we should be looking at and we have laid those out. . ._ laid those out... give us one of them now. _ laid those out... give us one of them now. you _ laid those out. .. give us one of them now, you call— laid those out. .. give us one of them now, you call it— laid those out... give us one of them now, you call it a - laid those out... give us one of| them now, you call it a contract with the people?— with the people? sorry, i didn't catch what— with the people? sorry, i didn't catch what you _ with the people? sorry, i didn't catch what you asked _ with the people? sorry, i didn't catch what you asked about - with the people? sorry, i didn't catch what you asked about it. | with the people? sorry, i didn't - catch what you asked about it. give us an example _ catch what you asked about it. give us an example of _ catch what you asked about it. give us an example of one of your policy that delivers what you have just set out? that delivers what you have 'ust set out? ., ., ~ that delivers what you have 'ust set out? ., ., 4' ., .., ., that delivers what you have 'ust set out? ., ., ~ ., .. ., ., that delivers what you have 'ust set out? ., ., ., , out? looking at education, that is fundamental _ out? looking at education, that is fundamental because _ out? looking at education, that is fundamental because if _ out? looking at education, that is fundamental because if we - out? looking at education, that is fundamental because if we don't i out? looking at education, that is i fundamental because if we don't get it right in scotland the opportunities for our young people going forward will be cut tailed on

the global stage. we actually want to scrap the curriculum for excellence and we think it is time to call time on it, we do not think it is delivering. it to call time on it, we do not think it is delivering.— it is delivering. it is now the time to do that? _ it is delivering. it is now the time to do that? peoples _ it is delivering. it is now the time to do that? peoples have - it is delivering. it is now the time to do that? peoples have been i it is delivering. it is now the time| to do that? peoples have been so much over the past year, is it time to rip things up and start again now? �* . ., , ~ , to rip things up and start again now? ~ ,�* now? actually, ithink it is. big chante now? actually, ithink it is. big change is _ now? actually, ithink it is. big change is always _ now? actually, ithink it is. big change is always difficult - now? actually, ithink it is. big change is always difficult at - now? actually, ithink it is. big| change is always difficult at any time, but we are in a situation where we had exams cancelled last year and this year, although i don't understand why. you are socially distanced in exams so i thought it would be the one thing they could deliver effectively. but they have cancelled them, so given some of these things are not taking place and education has been severely disrupted, one of the things we need to do is get it back on track. it is a good time to say how we're going to do that catch up and we can do it with a much more focused education that actually delivers good numeracy and literacy and prepares the

foundation that you need for higher thinking and advanced academics. this one of the policy is you do not want any more lockdowns. site might have worked six months ago but is that going to cut through with the voters now?— voters now? what people need to think about _ voters now? what people need to think about is _ voters now? what people need to think about is the _ voters now? what people need to think about is the precedent - voters now? what people need to think about is the precedent set l voters now? what people need to| think about is the precedent set in terms of health care and how we deal with issues like a virus because they come every year and they vary in strength. looking back at the early 2000 is we had the saints sort of death rates and problems and for this pandemic this time around with covid we approached it in a totally different way and we seem to be very unprepared for it because dan originally to protect the nhs and everyone understood that but then it dragged on for a year and it has been extended in terms of the coronavirus act. the government would have _ coronavirus act. the government would have said _ coronavirus act. the government would have said that _ coronavirus act. the government would have said that is _ coronavirus act. the government would have said that is to - coronavirus act. the government would have said that is to protect

people. do you oppose any further lockdown under any circumstances in the future? ~ ., ., , , the future? lockdown not supported by significant. _ the future? lockdown not supported by significant, and _ the future? lockdown not supported by significant, and insignificant, - by significant, and insignificant, scientific reasoning. so hospitals would have _ scientific reasoning. so hospitals would have to _ scientific reasoning. so hospitals would have to be _ scientific reasoning. so hospitals would have to be bursting - scientific reasoning. so hospitals would have to be bursting at - scientific reasoning. so hospitals would have to be bursting at the | would have to be bursting at the seams? i would have to be bursting at the seams? ~' ., , would have to be bursting at the seams? ~' . , ., seams? i think it means that the death rate _ seams? i think it means that the death rate is _ seams? i think it means that the death rate is soaring _ seams? i think it means that the death rate is soaring and - seams? i think it means that the death rate is soaring and the - death rate is soaring and the transmission means that this is fatal for large transmission means that this is fatalfor large numbers transmission means that this is fatal for large numbers of people transmission means that this is fatalfor large numbers of people in particular young people. what we have at the moment is a situation with the virus where we could have protected the vulnerable groups were the elderly that were really vulnerable to the virus and we should have allowed the economy, after the initial lockdown we fought to find out what the risks were of covid and we should have allowed much of the economy to continue and not interrupted education to the level we did. the evidence does not stack up behind the decisions made and those that have taken the time to examine that in detail have seen

that and i think those are concerns that and i think those are concerns that they have invaded many of our rights as citizens through the coronavirus act and actually imposed and continued to impose and are intending to continue some of these impositions and these have had a devastating effect on mental health and education and on our general well—being is the population and civil rights. there's a lot of issues about how we can get some of those back so yes, we are very concerned about the overreach of government in some of this. he published some plans for attacks, and want to scrap quite a range of taxes including the scottish replacement for tax stamp duty. itigiha replacement for tax stamp duty. who would benefit — replacement for tax stamp duty. two would benefit from replacement for tax stamp duty. “two would benefit from that? replacement for tax stamp duty. “tit“ut? would benefit from that? everyone. replacement for tax stamp duty. “tit“uf> would benefit from that? everyone. i tax proposals are economically based and also a uk wide and we are proposing should be much more coherence between the way in which

we do it across the uk. it is about stimulating the economy because our public welfare systems both in terms of education and health and the terms of how we run our local government or require a strong economy and so we have to stimulate the wealth creating part of the economy for everyone to benefit. so if you look at the plan we put forward there are clear sections that immediately benefit those less well off but the exception is about terminating the wealth creating section because that ultimately enables us to have a good nhs and free education and get the things we needin free education and get the things we need in terms of good road services, public rail services, without a wealth creating sector everything else fails. and government has simply forgotten that and they're relying increasingly on the tax—and—spend system which ultimately leads to failure in the economy. ultimately leads to failure in the econom . . . ultimately leads to failure in the econom. m ., , ultimately leads to failure in the econom. ~. ., , ., ~ economy. michelle ballantyne, thank ou ve

economy. michelle ballantyne, thank you very much- _ this campaign couldn't have begun more dramatically. alex salmond, former first minister, snp leader before nicola sturgeon — announced he'd be leading a new party, alba. and as you can see he is in the studio this evening. good evening. the independence campaign seems to be going fairly well at the moment according to the opinion polls with record levels of support. i according to the opinion polls with record levels of support.— according to the opinion polls with record levels of support. i think we have helped _ record levels of support. i think we have helped that _ record levels of support. i think we have helped that in _ record levels of support. i think we have helped that in alba _ record levels of support. i think we have helped that in alba because l record levels of support. i think we i have helped that in alba because one of the consequences of the alba intervention is to put the independence front and centre of this election campaign and people have had no choice because of the bigger we brought to this complaint so i'm pleased that that has happened and hopefully we will get the reward for this week. “you the reward for this week. you in'ected the reward for this week. you injected also _ the reward for this week. you injected also robert - the reward for this week. you injected also robert the bruce, bannockburn, the declaration of arbroath. is there not a concern that the sturgeon for example who

says that she is pursuing a patient persuading strategy to get people who are still to be persuaded across the line gently and in time, that you are going to fight them off and undo all the hard work. that is certainly what she feels. the declaration _ certainly what she feels. the declaration of _ certainly what she feels. the declaration of arbroath certainly what she feels. t“ie declaration of arbroath and certainly what she feels. t“ij: declaration of arbroath and it has at 701st anniversary on the 6th of april during this campaign, we launched a declaration for scotland and what we were taking in is something that resonates through history and a document which encapsulates the idea of the sovereignty of the people. a hugely important document that is relevant today that the scottish people should be sovereign again. we do not disavow history to be modern. history is important to understand your past and have more chance of shaping the future. but your past and have more chance of shaping the future.— shaping the future. but you understand _ shaping the future. but you understand that _ shaping the future. but you understand that this - shaping the future. but you understand that this tooth l shaping the future. but you i understand that this tooth and shaping the future. but you - understand that this tooth and claw

nationalism might work with the supporters but will be too much for those who need to be persuaded gently. mt; those who need to be persuaded tentl . y , those who need to be persuaded tentl _ ~ , , ., , those who need to be persuaded tentl. g , .,., , gently. my view is the vast ma'ority of scots gently. my view is the vast ma'ority of seats who — gently. my view is the vast ma'ority of scots who know i gently. my view is the vast ma'ority of scots who know about t gently. my view is the vast ma'ority of scots who know about it _ gently. my view is the vast majority of scots who know about it are - of scots who know about it are intensely proud of the declaration of arbroath and they should be. this is a document celebrated by the american senate and by presidential order as being instrumental in the american declaration of independence several hundred years later. if america is proud of the declaration of arbroath than scotland should also be proud of it. most of arbroath than scotland should also be proud of it.— of arbroath than scotland should also be proud of it. most scots do not share your — also be proud of it. most scots do not share your urgency _ also be proud of it. most scots do not share your urgency to - also be proud of it. most scots do not share your urgency to get - not share your urgency to get independence done, even if the opinion polls suggest is about a 50-50 opinion polls suggest is about a 50—50 split | opinion polls suggest is about a 50—50 split i saw one opinion poll today suggesting that the majority do not want a referendum for at least five years. you want it the day after the vote! i least five years. you want it the day after the vote!— least five years. you want it the day after the vote! i want to start negotiations _ day after the vote! i want to start negotiations as _ day after the vote! i want to start negotiations as soon _ day after the vote! i want to start negotiations as soon as _ day after the vote! i want to start negotiations as soon as next - day after the vote! i want to start | negotiations as soon as next week day after the vote! i want to start i negotiations as soon as next week if alba are successful. from my experience after winning the

majority in 2011 as first minister will began negotiations with westminster and that resulted in a referendum in 201a, three years later we forecast another transition period of 18 months if scotland had voted for independence for a total of four and happier so. voted for independence for a total of fourand happierso. now voted for independence for a total of four and happier so. now before and have years scotland could be independent but one thing is for certain if you do not start, you will not finish.— certain if you do not start, you will not finish. nicola sturgeon is cautious and _ will not finish. nicola sturgeon is cautious and accepts _ will not finish. nicola sturgeon is cautious and accepts that - will not finish. nicola sturgeon is cautious and accepts that he i will not finish. nicola sturgeon is cautious and accepts that he is i cautious and accepts that he is cautious and accepts that he is cautious by nature. he criticised herfor cautious by nature. he criticised her for being too cautious but you are a gambler by nature. is she not just been more shrewd than you? ii just been more shrewd than you? if everyone was back to football team in the selection votes alba that we can storm this election. but think sometimes in politics put it this way, back in 2012 in the edinburgh agreement between myself and david cameron there was an argument that

the leadership of the national movement were ahead of the people because support for independence backin because support for independence back in those times was 20, 30%. now there is a substantial argument that support for independence is ahead of the politicians and my view is that politicians in these circumstances should lead and not follow. there is a suggestion _ should lead and not follow. there is a suggestion that _ should lead and not follow. there is a suggestion that in _ should lead and not follow. there is a suggestion that in danger - should lead and not follow. there is a suggestion that in danger of i a suggestion that in danger of undoing the push for independence. the course which you devoted your life, to get yourself elected. it is about you, and ego project. that life, to get yourself elected. it is about you, and ego project. about you, and ego pro'ect. that is not the about you, and ego pro'ect. that is hot the case. * about you, and ego pro'ect. that is not the case, firstly i about you, and ego project. that is not the case, firstly this _ about you, and ego project. that is not the case, firstly this can i about you, and ego project. that is not the case, firstly this can only i not the case, firstly this can only benefit the calls for independence. i then asked for opinion polls have shown that on current ratings the snp would win nothing in the regional list and if even a quarter of independence supporters... there is nothing on the regional list. if even a quarter of these independence instead of wasting their vote on the

party and labour to get elected would switch to alba bay will be about one of alba candidates elected. ., about one of alba candidates elected. . :: :: , , ., elected. there a 50-50 split and should you _ elected. there a 50-50 split and should you then _ elected. there a 50-50 split and should you then be _ elected. there a 50-50 split and should you then be gaming i elected. there a 50-50 split and should you then be gaming the l should you then be gaming the system? it does not then represent the public? i system? it does not then represent the tublic? , . , ., the public? i listened closely to doutlas the public? i listened closely to douglas ross — the public? i listened closely to douglas ross of— the public? i listened closely to douglas ross of the _ the public? i listened closely to i douglas ross of the conservative party and he is arguing for people to vote for them on the list. if it is good for douglas ross than the independence supporters and alba should argue for the same thing. this is the system that we have got and we have a huge opportunity to get that super majority in the scottish parliament to allow us to face down borisjohnson. the scottish parliament to allow us to face down boris johnson. the snp have been criticised _ face down boris johnson. the snp have been criticised in _ face down boris johnson. the snp have been criticised in this i have been criticised in this campaign quite vigorously by their opponents for the record on health, education and drug deaths and so on, do you think that criticism is fair? i think the snp would benefit from a more coherent opposition. with

labour, tory liberal democrats, they've been helpless. hopeless at criticising the snp on the record. annabelle golding was infinitely superior to what you've got now. every government should be set on its laurels and should be held to account. the point i'm making is that the reason for that is the labour, tory party liberals are so hysterical in the constitution and they repeat that endlessly and that no time for doing their actualjob as opposition parties. so they are incompetent and that is why alba would be doing a lot of good injecting ideas into the scottish parliament. ii injecting ideas into the scottish parliament.— injecting ideas into the scottish parliament. , , ., , ., parliament. if they should be more focused in their _ parliament. if they should be more focused in their criticism _ parliament. if they should be more focused in their criticism should i focused in their criticism should you not take half of the brain because you were first minister of an snp government for more time at the nicola sturgeon has been so you have got some of these drugs deaths and figures on health and education on your record as well. the and figures on health and education on your record as well.— on your record as well. the snp government _ on your record as well. the snp government l —

on your record as well. the snp government i lead _ on your record as well. the snp government i lead was - on your record as well. the snp government i lead was not i on your record as well. the snp i government i lead was not perfect, but we had a range of achievements and the proof of course is when we were elected again in 2011 with a resounding overall majority in the scottish parliament in a proportional system. we built the bridge over the river forth, the first council tax and scrap tuition fees. there was lots of good things that that snp government did. ithihat that that snp government did. what is our that that snp government did. what is your solution _ that that snp government did. what is your solution to _ that that snp government did. what is your solution to the _ that that snp government did. what is your solution to the drug deaths? certainly more facilities, we need more rehab and we need to have a real thing, more rehab and we need to have a realthing, notjust more rehab and we need to have a real thing, notjust that more rehab and we need to have a real thing, not just that we should get the powers from westminster, i am sympathetic to nicola sturgeon on that, but what we do with these powers once we get them and if you keep repeating the same mistakes, i have been in politics a long time, and i've lost count of the number of war on drugs campaigns that we've seen and maybe it is time to have what to do that nicola sturgeon has suggested, and will rethink and an inclusive look and perhaps even send it to the citizens assembly which is

a great adventure is a great adventurous idea which the ordinary people might come up with a solution that a spell the politicians. there have been a _ that a spell the politicians. there have been a lot _ that a spell the politicians. there have been a lot of _ that a spell the politicians. there have been a lot of questions i have been a lot of questions directed towards you and this campaign about your character but what i do want to ask is do you regret that you are given many opportunities to apologise for some of the behaviour you admitted to in court and if you have done that at the start of this campaign with that not have made things considerably easierfor you? not have made things considerably easier for you?— easier for you? certainly not because i — easier for you? certainly not because i apologise - easier for you? certainly not because i apologise ten i easier for you? certainly not i because i apologise ten years ago for what actually happens, not what i was accused of on court but what actually happened and i did the same thing in the court case. it is done ten years ago and it was done last junein ten years ago and it was done last june in the court case. the court case is important because a jury and predominantly female journey acquitted me of all charges. the criminal charges, i'm talking about... i criminal charges, i'm talking about... “j criminal charges, i'm talking about... ,, , ., criminal charges, i'm talking about... ,, ., .,

about... i think we should get onto tolitics or about... i think we should get onto politics or not _ about... i think we should get onto politics or not rehash _ about... i think we should get onto politics or not rehash it endlessly. | politics or not rehash it endlessly. recently told an interviewer that if you did apologise it would overshadow everything and gain momentum of its own? the overshadow everything and gain momentum of its own? the argument is that was done — momentum of its own? the argument is that was done and _ momentum of its own? the argument is that was done and it _ momentum of its own? the argument is that was done and it is _ momentum of its own? the argument is that was done and it is time _ momentum of its own? the argument is that was done and it is time to - momentum of its own? the argument is that was done and it is time to move i that was done and it is time to move onto politics. that was done and it is time to move onto politics-— onto politics. one more question, in a sentence. — onto politics. one more question, in a sentence. if _ onto politics. one more question, in a sentence, if things _ onto politics. one more question, in a sentence, if things do _ onto politics. one more question, in a sentence, if things do not - onto politics. one more question, in a sentence, if things do not go i onto politics. one more question, in a sentence, if things do not go your| a sentence, if things do not go your way on thirsty than what next? i love a hypothetical question but i hypothesise on success and not failure and alba are rising. bile}. failure and alba are rising. alex salmond, _ failure and alba are rising. alex salmond, thank _ failure and alba are rising. alex salmond, thank you _ failure and alba are rising. alex salmond, thank you very much. there are more parties vying for your vote on thursday. head to the bbc scotland news website for more on all those standing and their policies. right now, though — stay with us, because we've got that final leaders debate coming up in about 20 minutes. just two days now until the election and the leaders of scotland's five main parties will be right here to debate live. we have nicola sturgeon of the snp, the conservative douglas ross, on a sour of the labour party

patrick harvie of the queens and willie many of the liberal democrats. that is at ten to scotland, the bbc news channel and the iplayer. we're back with reaction to that at 10:30 on bbc one scotland. we'll see you then. cold winds abroad would weather to many parts of the uk, eyre turn dry overnight. increasingly wintry showers in northern scotland. colder than last night, not as wet as widely, winds won“t than last night, not as wet as widely, winds won't be as strong. where we had clear skies, scotland and northern england, we are more likely to have a touch of frost.

showers moving across into wales, across the midlands towards the south—east of england,