after very few intelligence assets. after the 31st when western forces fully disengage, we are going to be flying blind and that is a dangerous and i am moving forward. what blind and that is a dangerous and i am moving forward.— am moving forward. what do you antici ate am moving forward. what do you anticipate in _ am moving forward. what do you anticipate in the _ am moving forward. what do you anticipate in the immediate - am moving forward. what do you| anticipate in the immediate hours for the evacuation? i read out neat or�*s chief saying the evacuation remains a priority. that is hugely jeopardised by the basic security best now. . , , . best now. that is very much jeepardise- _ best now. that is very much jeepardise- i— best now. that is very much jeopardise. i would - best now. that is very much jeopardise. i would expect l best now. that is very much i jeopardise. i would expect the evacuation to move forward, once security on the ground is figured out. this is going to be a situation that unfolds hour by hour over the coming days and it is one that again is likely to pose a serious concerns for the west. that is leaving at the afghan people who are the ones with the suffering here. {aiin afghan people who are the ones with the suffering here.— the suffering here. colin clarke, s-ueakin the suffering here. colin clarke, speaking to _ the suffering here. colin clarke, speaking to me _ the suffering here. colin clarke, speaking to me just _ the suffering here. colin clarke, speaking to me just a _ the suffering here. colin clarke, speaking to me just a short - the suffering here. colin clarke, l speaking to me just a short while ago. you are watching bbc news. let's have a reminder of the news that has dominated the last few hours because there has been a

double bomb attack on kabul airport where crowds have been gathering in the hope of boarding an evacuation flight to escape afghanistan. the taliban herceptin 13 and 20 people have been killed and in the last few minutes, the has confirmed at least four us service members were killed in those attacks. several others were being treated for injuries. the pentagon says there are two blasts, one happened close to the airport's abbey gate and the other close to nearby baron hotel. the hotel had been used by some western nations as a staging point for the evacuation since the airlift began. i have been speaking to the retired army general mcmaster, who retired after serving in america up to 2018, under president trump.

i think we have to recognise this is only the beginning. this is what happens when you surrender to a terrorist organisation. it is worth pointing out that this so—called isis—k attack has all the hallmarks of a haqqani network attack and guess who's in charge of security in kabul now? siraj haqqani, who is a prominent al-qaeda member and also the military commander of the taliban. maybe now is the moment we can stop our self—delusion and stop believing that these groups are separate from one another and recognise that they are utterly intertwined and connected and what we are seeing is the establishment of a jihadist terrorist state in afghanistan and all of us will be at much higher risk as a result of this. you said in the middle of that answer, "it is time to think again."

you are not seriously suggesting that the white house presses the pause button this close to the deadline? heck yes, i am. i guess the question is for all of our political leaders, what is the mission? is the mission just to complete our surrender and withdrawal? or is it to get our citizens out and the afghans who are at the highest and most grave risk because they assisted us and were engaged in trying to build a better future for their country? if it is the latter, we better do a hell of a lot more than trying to hold on to a perimeter in a very small airport on the edge of a dense urban area. right? so if the mission is to get people out, our military can do that. we have the capability to do it. i think the question you're alluding to and it is the right one, is do we have the will to do it? i know you have written a really brutal assessment of the political dynamic. the decisions that have been made. i will come back to that in a moment or two but in terms of what is happening at the airport currently in these hours after the attack, let me just ask if you have after the attack, let me just ask you on that first because,

in your view as an army man, a military man, how do you secure that area? what will be going on in these moments on the ground? the only way to really do it is to push the parameter out. the problem is you have the masses of people batting on this perimeter and if you secure the perimeter you have no depth to identify the proximate depth. we had an early warning from an intelligence perspective, but that does not do a lot of good if you do not control your perimeter out to a sufficient range where you can screen people at a checkpoint and so forth, layered checkpoints that would identify a threat. force a terrorist to reveal hostile intent and capability before they get intermingled with the crowd like this or that close to the perimeter. so it would require additional forces, no doubt about it and greater risk as well. but i want to say, as a soldier, a lot of this talk about no casualties as an end in and of itself, i think what soldiers want more than anything is to not be pitied, but instead to have political

leadership that will give them the resources and authority necessary to accomplish a worthy mission, a worthy mission, a mission that is worthy of the sacrifices they make. i will return to that point in a moment, but in practical terms, do you think it is still possible to get all of the remaining americans, let alone all of the foreigners, but the americans out of afghanistan before the 31st? no way. no. and of course there is the question of how many americans are there we do not know about, and where are they in the country? what if they are in jalalabad or other areas? 0r still in the far south? i really... it is impossible to know. does that alarm you? it should because everyone is talking about the humility and withdrawal of american forces from vietnam in 1975. i think we are going to fast forward from that disturbing image to the hostage crisis in tehran in 1979. that is what i fear.

and what we should recognise is siraj haqqani, the security chief now for the taliban is the greatest kidnapper of american and other foreigners in the afghanistan— pakistan region. so someone who has been kidnapping our citizens, killing many of them in captivity, is now in charge of security. what did we expect when we signed the surrender agreement with the taliban? let mejust let me just update our viewers, the hospital saying around 60 injured have arrived now from kabul airport, so exactly as we were saying earlier, the numbers are increasing as anticipated, is absolutely following that path, around 60 people arriving at hospital so far. if you have used that phrase and have written about it, that the us,

defeated ourselves, you wrote, that we signed an agreement with the taliban. that is a brutal conclusion and just briefly because we have touched on it already, why do you make that assessment?— touched on it already, why do you make that assessment? while, it is exactly what _ make that assessment? while, it is exactly what we _ make that assessment? while, it is exactly what we did, _ make that assessment? while, it is exactly what we did, right? - make that assessment? while, it is exactly what we did, right? we - exactly what we did, right? we entered into negotiations with the taliban without the afghan government, we delivered a blow to the afghan legitimacy by doing that, and then what we did to get to this agreement is make a concession after concession. we didn't force a ceasefire, we forced the afghan government to... some of the most heinous people on earth who then immediately went back into terrorising the afghan people and what we have seen now is prioritising the withdrawal of any kind of effort to secure that his withdrawal and get people out of harms way. how is it possible we gave up all these airfields? that is... you know, before we evacuate the military, before the civilians. all this just shows that we prioritise to just getting the hell

out of there, regardless of what the consequences would be. you out of there, regardless of what the consequences would be.— consequences would be. you talked about president _ consequences would be. you talked about president biden _ consequences would be. you talked about president biden doubling - consequences would be. you talked | about president biden doubling down on what president trump had agreed to. did president trump get played with all that talk about peace talks? ~ , ,., , ., with all that talk about peace talks? ~ , ., , talks? absolutely, he got played. and he bought — talks? absolutely, he got played. and he bought into _ talks? absolutely, he got played. and he bought into the _ talks? absolutely, he got played. . and he bought into the self-delusion and he bought into the self—delusion of a borderline between the taliban and al-qaeda. we know those groups are intertwined. and the person who personifies how connected they are is siraj haqqani, as i have already mentioned. he is an element of this delusion is, maybe the taliban will impose a more benign element of sharia. why do you think everyone is clamouring to get out there? because they know they will be living in hell under taliban rule. the third delusion, and probably the most significant of all, is there will be no consequences for a lost war in afghanistan. we are already seeing the re—establishment of the islamic emirate, we know these terrorist groups gain orders of magnitude instability when they can maintain their resources and they now have

resources to mobilise and they are andjihad. we need to —— we keep talking about we need to end this endless war, but they are waging an endless war, but they are waging an endlessjihad against us endless war, but they are waging an endless jihad against us and as soon as we realise that maybe then we will be able to marshal the will to sustain the effort to secure our children and our families from these criminals. ., ., , ., , criminals. two final questions, if i could. president _ criminals. two final questions, if i could. president biden _ criminals. two final questions, if i could. president biden said - criminals. two final questions, if i could. president biden said there| could. president biden said there was no way of withdrawing without chaos ensuing. was he wrong? weill. was no way of withdrawing without chaos ensuing. was he wrong? well, i mean that may _ chaos ensuing. was he wrong? well, i mean that may be _ chaos ensuing. was he wrong? well, i mean that may be true, _ chaos ensuing. was he wrong? well, i mean that may be true, but _ chaos ensuing. was he wrong? well, i mean that may be true, but it - chaos ensuing. was he wrong? well, i mean that may be true, but it seems. mean that may be true, but it seems like we were determined to make it as hard on ourselves as we could, right? how the heck does it make sense to withdraw the military before civilians? that can't make sense. how does it make sense to give up airfields all over the country and keep the airfield that is most difficult to secure, it has the lowest maximum on ground or air capacity to get out. how is it possible to secure only the military

side and not not the civilian side so more people could get civilian flights? i could go on about this, but it seems as if we were determined to give every advantage to our enemies and i guess because of the self—delusion, that may be the taliban respect or desire for an orderly withdrawal and would guarantee the movement of people through checkpoints... we know all of this is lies, but it is astounding that anybody in their right mind, anybody with eyes could see what was going to happen once the taliban were in control. i suppose you concentrate there a lot on the practicalities, but the pushback from both the trump organisation and the white house now would be that after 20 years the fundamental decision had to be taken to end this war. now, i understand politics, i understand pragmatism, but as a military man, it must fly in the face of everything that you believe in to see american forces cut and run?_ cut and run? absolutely, it does. and ou cut and run? absolutely, it does. and you know — cut and run? absolutely, it does. and you know what? _ cut and run? absolutely, it does. and you know what? was - cut and run? absolutely, it does. and you know what? was it - cut and run? absolutely, it does. and you know what? was it a - cut and run? absolutely, it does. and you know what? was it a go | cut and run? absolutely, it does. i and you know what? was it a go at the outcome? you know, is the

narrative correct that we have accomplished nothing in afghanistan? maybe now we are realising we did may be accomplished quite a bit, as we see the rights of the people we have supported over these years being extinguished. it was the was a narrative correct that we could not sustain the effort? we were spending the equivalent of 2.5% of our defence budget on operations in afghanistan. even before the capitulation agreement we had 8500 troops there. that is a lot if you are ecuador, but we are not ecuador and actually at the time of withdrawal there are more coalition troops there, european and others there, than there were us troops. that was sustainable over time. was afghanistan going to remain a ward of the international community for the foreseeable future? yes. is it worth it? i think it was, especially now when we are confronted with the alternative. ., now when we are confronted with the alternative. . ., , . ~ ., alternative. that was back to talkin: alternative. that was back to talking to — alternative. that was back to talking to me _ alternative. that was back to talking to me a _ alternative. that was back to talking to me a little - alternative. that was back to talking to me a little earlier, i alternative. that was back to - talking to me a little earlier, and as i was saying, brutal in his

assessment of the current decisions and decisions leading up to the international forces withdrawing now. i just international forces withdrawing now. ijust want international forces withdrawing now. i just want to take your life to the white house because we are expecting you can see the election already and some of the report is already in the room, so i don't think we are that far away from the start of the latest news briefing. the door open, as they are hesitating a bit, but i don't think we are quite there, but i will keep an eye on that and we'll bring you the latest from the white house. we know president biden has beenin house. we know president biden has been in the situation room making an assessment and we still if there is any pivot in terms of the american strategy, but the pentagon already... that update that american forces, us soldiers have been killed in today was my attack, with other us agencies reporting that at least for military personnel from america have died today in kabul. we will keep an eye on that and we will obviously be straight

back there to hear from them, but the british prime minister borissov and has been talking in the last while. let's hear what he had to say. while. let's hear what he had to sa . , . while. let's hear what he had to sa , , ., ., while. let's hear what he had to sa . , ., ., ., ., , say. this threat of a terrorist attack is _ say. this threat of a terrorist attack is one _ say. this threat of a terrorist attack is one of— say. this threat of a terrorist attack is one of the - say. this threat of a terrorist l attack is one of the constraints that we have been operating under in operation pitting, the big extraction that has been going on. and we have been ready for it, prepared for it and i want to stress that we are going to continue. and we are now coming to... towards the end of it, neither indeed, —— the very end of it, in any respect and we have already extracted the overwhelming majority of those under both the schemes, the eligible uk persons, uk nationals, plus the afghans, the interpreters and others, and it has been a totally phenomenal effort by the uk. there has been nothing like it for decades

and decades. but clearly what this attack shows is the importance of continuing that work in as fast and as efficient a manner as possible, in the hours that remain to us and thatis in the hours that remain to us and that is what we're going to do. borisjohnson confirming that that is what we're going to do. boris johnson confirming that the evacuations continue. let's speak now to colonel richard kemp, who was a commander of british forces in afghanistan. richard, welcome to the programme. it has been a very distressing day, with the number of casualties figure is rising by the hour. your thoughts after what we have seen?— hour. your thoughts after what we have seen? , ~ , have seen? yes, i think is the prime minister said. _ have seen? yes, i think is the prime minister said, this _ have seen? yes, i think is the prime minister said, this attack _ have seen? yes, i think is the prime minister said, this attack was - minister said, this attack was expected right from the very beginning of this evacuation operation and i think indeed we got some pretty specific intelligence that was available in the media only a few hours ago, pretty much pinpointing it in time, so it is not as though our armed forces in afghanistan, are raf and army, were

not ready for it, we were prepared for it, and of course do their best to try to prevent it, but a suicide bomb attack is one of the most difficult forms of attack, if not the most difficult form, to identify and then present before it actually occurs, so it is almost impossible to avoid something like this. the americans _ to avoid something like this. the americans were saying not that long ago, but there was the fear of further attacks. you don't know anything on the ground, what will british forces and other forces currently be doing?— british forces and other forces currently be doing? they will be maintaining _ currently be doing? they will be maintaining the _ currently be doing? they will be maintaining the operation - currently be doing? they will be maintaining the operation that l currently be doing? they will be i maintaining the operation that they have been conducting for a while now, in other words protecting themselves and kabul airport. i would assume that... inaudible operations have been paused at least temporarily, maybe not, buti operations have been paused at least temporarily, maybe not, but i would have thought so at this stage. and they are also, of course, on the ground, dealing with casualties and preparing for another tack along the same lines, which i think gains in

likelihood as we get closer and