its media. we have seen some us generalists criticised for overemphasizing its importance and obsessing about it. others say generalists in the us have not found a way of describing the significance of what happened and i are getting too much space to the idea that the us in was stolen. it is exploitive issues and many more with five guests. our media correspondent for national radio and a tech journalist based here in the uk. robert costa is from the washington post and susanis is from the washington post and susan is chief congressional correspondent at the washington examiner. i wonderfor our correspondent at the washington examiner. i wonder for our viewers who do not know your publication, tell us about it. we who do not know your publication, tell us about it.— tell us about it. we are a news website in _ tell us about it. we are a news website in a — tell us about it. we are a news website in a magazine - tell us about it. we are a news website in a magazine based l tell us about it. we are a news| website in a magazine based in washington, dc and our team of reporters cover breaking news in congress and the white house and politics in general and elections and we have a t—mobile opinion colonists added into the mix. we and we have a t-mobile opinion colonists added into the mix. we are crateful for colonists added into the mix. we are grateful for you _ colonists added into the mix. we are grateful for you joining _ colonists added into the mix. we are gratefulfor youjoining us. _ colonists added into the mix. we are grateful for you joining us. our- gratefulfor you joining us. our

final guest is editor in chief of vice uk and for people who don't know vice well what is your editorial remic in charge of vice uk? ~ editorial remic in charge of vice uk? . ., ., editorial remic in charge of vice uk? ~ ., ., editorial remic in charge of vice uk? a, a, editorial remic in charge of vice uk? ., a, a uk? we are a global youth culture website and _ uk? we are a global youth culture website and we _ uk? we are a global youth culture website and we have _ uk? we are a global youth culture website and we have a _ uk? we are a global youth culture website and we have a tv - uk? we are a global youth culture website and we have a tv film - website and we have a tv film studio and we _ website and we have a tv film studio and we are _ website and we have a tv film studio and we are on tick—tock, social media — and we are on tick—tock, social media and _ and we are on tick—tock, social media and snap chat and we also published — media and snap chat and we also published a website very retro in this time — published a website very retro in this time and age for men and the audience — this time and age for men and the audience and we have audiences all over the _ audience and we have audiences all over the world from la to new york and london — over the world from la to new york and london and asia. that's where we have got— and london and asia. that's where we have got to _ and london and asia. that's where we have got to. unfortunately if you're talking _ have got to. unfortunately if you're talking to _ have got to. unfortunately if you're talking to people who are 18 and 19 years— talking to people who are 18 and 19 years old _ talking to people who are 18 and 19 years old it very much is. let talking to people who are 18 and 19 years old it very much is.— years old it very much is. let us go back to january _ years old it very much is. let us go back to january the _ years old it very much is. let us go back to january the 6th _ years old it very much is. let us go back to january the 6th of - years old it very much is. let us go back to january the 6th of 2021. . years old it very much is. let us go back to january the 6th of 2021. i l back to january the 6th of 2021. i would like to ask the three of you and the us to think back to that story as it unfolded and they journalistic challenges that it posed. let's begin with you. the unfoldin: posed. let's begin with you. the unfolding of _ posed. let's begin with you. the unfolding of the sterry on january six last _ unfolding of the sterry on january six last year— unfolding of the sterry on january

six last year itself— unfolding of the sterry on january six last year itself followed - unfolding of the sterry on january six last year itself followed a - six last year itself followed a predictable _ six last year itself followed a predictable plight _ six last year itself followed a predictable plight and - six last year itself followed a . predictable plight and grievous six last year itself followed a - predictable plight and grievous path in the _ predictable plight and grievous path in the moment— predictable plight and grievous path in the moment itself. _ predictable plight and grievous path in the moment itself. there - predictable plight and grievous path in the moment itself. there was- predictable plight and grievous path in the moment itself. there was a l in the moment itself. there was a bit of— in the moment itself. there was a bit of disbelief — in the moment itself. there was a bit of disbelief of _ in the moment itself. there was a bit of disbelief of what _ in the moment itself. there was a bit of disbelief of what was - bit of disbelief of what was happening _ bit of disbelief of what was happening in— bit of disbelief of what was happening in front - bit of disbelief of what was happening in front of- bit of disbelief of what was happening in front of the l bit of disbelief of what was i happening in front of the eyes bit of disbelief of what was - happening in front of the eyes of those covering _ happening in front of the eyes of those covering it— happening in front of the eyes of those covering it life _ happening in front of the eyes of those covering it life and - happening in front of the eyes of those covering it life and those i those covering it life and those covering — those covering it life and those covering interest _ those covering it life and those covering interest in— those covering it life and those covering interest in who - those covering it life and those covering interest in who work i those covering it life and those i covering interest in who work on outlets — covering interest in who work on outlets on — covering interest in who work on outlets on what _ covering interest in who work on outlets on what had _ covering interest in who work on outlets on what had been - covering interest in who work on outlets on what had been a - covering interest in who work on - outlets on what had been a peaceful rally and _ outlets on what had been a peaceful rally and soon— outlets on what had been a peaceful rally and soon became _ outlets on what had been a peaceful rally and soon became an— outlets on what had been a peaceful rally and soon became an angry - outlets on what had been a peaceful| rally and soon became an angry mob turned _ rally and soon became an angry mob turned insurrection _ rally and soon became an angry mob turned insurrection and _ rally and soon became an angry mob turned insurrection and siege - rally and soon became an angry mob turned insurrection and siege of- rally and soon became an angry mob turned insurrection and siege of thel turned insurrection and siege of the capitai~ _ turned insurrection and siege of the capitai~ 0t— turned insurrection and siege of the capital. of quite _ turned insurrection and siege of the capital. of quite some _ turned insurrection and siege of the capital. of quite some back- turned insurrection and siege of the| capital. of quite some back families even from a — capital. of quite some back families even from a sector— capital. of quite some back families even from a sector of— capital. of quite some back families even from a sector of the _ capital. of quite some back families even from a sector of the press - capital. of quite some back families even from a sector of the press that we may— even from a sector of the press that we may touch — even from a sector of the press that we may touch on _ even from a sector of the press that we may touch on today, _ even from a sector of the press that we may touch on today, the - we may touch on today, the conservative _ we may touch on today, the conservative press - we may touch on today, the conservative press i - we may touch on today, the conservative press i think. conservative press i think reflection _ conservative press i think reflection of— conservative press i think reflection of reality- conservative press i think reflection of reality of- conservative press i thinkl reflection of reality of how conservative press i think- reflection of reality of how this made — reflection of reality of how this made and _ reflection of reality of how this made and it— reflection of reality of how this made and it was a _ reflection of reality of how this made and it was a shock - reflection of reality of how this made and it was a shock as - reflection of reality of how this| made and it was a shock as any citizen — made and it was a shock as any citizen would have _ made and it was a shock as any citizen would have but - made and it was a shock as any citizen would have but as - made and it was a shock as any citizen would have but as you . made and it was a shock as any. citizen would have but as you get further _ citizen would have but as you get further from _ citizen would have but as you get further from the _ citizen would have but as you get further from the event _ citizen would have but as you get further from the event itself - citizen would have but as you get further from the event itself it i further from the event itself it quickly — further from the event itself it quickly descends into - further from the event itself it quickly descends into a - quickly descends into a politicisation_ quickly descends into a politicisation to - quickly descends into a politicisation to some i quickly descends into a - politicisation to some degree on quickly descends into a _ politicisation to some degree on the left especially — politicisation to some degree on the left especially on _ politicisation to some degree on the left especially on the _ politicisation to some degree on the left especially on the right _ politicisation to some degree on the left especially on the right but - left especially on the right but that day— left especially on the right but that day i_ left especially on the right but that day i think _ left especially on the right but that day i think there - left especially on the right but that day i think there was - left especially on the right but - that day i think there was disbelief and i_ that day i think there was disbelief and i think— that day i think there was disbelief and i think there _ that day i think there was disbelief and i think there was _ that day i think there was disbelief and i think there was shocked - that day i think there was disbelief and i think there was shocked andl and i think there was shocked and hoping _ and i think there was shocked and hoping there _ and i think there was shocked and hoping there was _ and i think there was shocked and hoping there was grief— and i think there was shocked and hoping there was grief and - and i think there was shocked and hoping there was grief and angerl hoping there was grief and anger about— hoping there was grief and anger about what— hoping there was grief and anger about what was _ hoping there was grief and anger about what was playing - hoping there was grief and anger about what was playing out -

hoping there was grief and anger about what was playing out in . hoping there was grief and angerl about what was playing out in the capital _ about what was playing out in the capital building. _ about what was playing out in the capital building. you _ about what was playing out in the capital building.— about what was playing out in the capital building. you talk about the conservative _ capital building. you talk about the conservative side _ capital building. you talk about the conservative side of _ capital building. you talk about the conservative side of us _ capital building. you talk about the conservative side of us media. - capital building. you talk about the conservative side of us media. i i conservative side of us media. i wonder where you would describe npr position in the media spectrum? brute position in the media spectrum? we feel ourselves to be made to bbc. we don't have _ feel ourselves to be made to bbc. we don't have opinion _ feel ourselves to be made to bbc. we don't have opinion makers _ feel ourselves to be made to bbc. we don't have opinion makers on - feel ourselves to be made to bbc. we don't have opinion makers on staff- don't have opinion makers on staff to tell— don't have opinion makers on staff to tell people _ don't have opinion makers on staff to tell people what to think- don't have opinion makers on staff to tell people what to think or - don't have opinion makers on staff to tell people what to think or how to tell people what to think or how to vote _ to tell people what to think or how to vote you — to tell people what to think or how to vote. you might _ to tell people what to think or how to vote. you might find _ to tell people what to think or how to vote. you might find an- to vote. you might find an editorial pages _ to vote. you might find an editorial pages of— to vote. you might find an editorial pages of major _ to vote. you might find an editorial pages of major american _ to vote. you might find an editorial. pages of major american newspapers or on the _ pages of major american newspapers or on the editorial— pages of major american newspapers or on the editorial pages _ pages of major american newspapers or on the editorial pages for - pages of major american newspapers or on the editorial pages for the - pages of major american newspapers or on the editorial pages for the uk l or on the editorial pages for the uk or on the editorial pages for the uk or even— or on the editorial pages for the uk or even in— or on the editorial pages for the uk or even in the — or on the editorial pages for the uk or even in the way— or on the editorial pages for the uk or even in the way in— or on the editorial pages for the uk or even in the way in which - or on the editorial pages for the uk or even in the way in which british. or even in the way in which british newspapers — or even in the way in which british newspapers are _ or even in the way in which british newspapers are voiced. _ or even in the way in which british newspapers are voiced. we - or even in the way in which british newspapers are voiced. we have i or even in the way in which british| newspapers are voiced. we have a mandate _ newspapers are voiced. we have a mandate to — newspapers are voiced. we have a mandate to be _ newspapers are voiced. we have a mandate to be fair _ newspapers are voiced. we have a mandate to be fair to _ newspapers are voiced. we have a mandate to be fair to all— newspapers are voiced. we have a mandate to be fair to all sides - newspapers are voiced. we have a mandate to be fair to all sides to i mandate to be fair to all sides to represent — mandate to be fair to all sides to represent people in— mandate to be fair to all sides to represent people in their- mandate to be fair to all sides to represent people in their own . mandate to be fair to all sides to - represent people in their own voices into our— represent people in their own voices into our best to _ represent people in their own voices into our best to make _ represent people in their own voices into our best to make sure - represent people in their own voices into our best to make sure we - represent people in their own voices into our best to make sure we are l into our best to make sure we are tethered — into our best to make sure we are tethered to — into our best to make sure we are tethered to reality. _ into our best to make sure we are tethered to reality. find _ into our best to make sure we are tethered to reality.— tethered to reality. and that has been our tethered to reality. and that has been your goal _ tethered to reality. and that has been your goal for _ tethered to reality. and that has been your goal for the _ tethered to reality. and that has been your goal for the last - tethered to reality. and that has been your goal for the last year| tethered to reality. and that has i been your goal for the last year as you can send yourself at the ramification of january six. william and congress are close to eight when it happened? i and congress are close to eight when it happened?— it happened? i was. i agree with david in terms _ it happened? i was. i agree with david in terms of _ it happened? i was. i agree with david in terms of how _ it happened? i was. i agree with david in terms of how he - it happened? i was. i agree with david in terms of how he talked | david in terms of how he talked about how it unfolded and the shocking nature of it. i worked in the since the early 19905 and i what

security over the years to various terrible incidents and i've seen how it increased unchanged in terms of access from the public. he used to be able to walk right in and wander around and it became a fortress of videos and that was part of why it seemed so shocking to us that this huge group of people were able to into 5teps acce55 huge group of people were able to into 5teps access by pushing past the police and they were allowed to wander in and huge numbers without any security checks by the police. why does shocking things were happening so just from a security perspective a5ide happening so just from a security perspective aside from the nature of why these people did this, that was ready extremely 5urpri5ing why these people did this, that was ready extremely surprising to me and i had seen a lot of things going on in the capital. i had seen a lot of things going on in the capital-— in the capital. where were you as it unfolded? i — in the capital. where were you as it unfolded? i was _ in the capital. where were you as it unfolded? i was out _ in the capital. where were you as it unfolded? i was out by _ in the capital. where were you as it unfolded? i was out by the - unfolded? i was out by the building talkin: unfolded? i was out by the building talking to the _ unfolded? i was out by the building talking to the people _ unfolded? i was out by the building talking to the people coming - unfolded? i was out by the building talking to the people coming in - unfolded? i was out by the building talking to the people coming in and out and trying to find out, the challenge for me was trying to get

out why or what did he hope to accomplish. they were different types of people there. they were not a big monolith. which i think is unfortunate. i think the press reports it that way. there are different types of people there. many types and the most violent among them was probably the smallest group among them but still a large group among them but still a large group of people. group among them but still a large group of people-— group among them but still a large group of people. robert costa from the washington _ group of people. robert costa from the washington post, _ group of people. robert costa from the washington post, i _ group of people. robert costa from the washington post, i could - group of people. robert costa from the washington post, i could if- the washington post, i could if bring you in here. do you think the fact that there is only one film crew in5ide fact that there is only one film crew inside the capitol building. the apb new stem krill, the fact that many generalists were surprised this happened. wa5 evidence that the us media as a whole ju5t this happened. wa5 evidence that the us media as a whole just had not been talking to this section of society anywhere near enough in the 5ociety anywhere near enough in the weeks and months running up to january the 6th. ida. weeks and months running up to january the 6th-— january the 6th. no. i think the media is paying _ january the 6th. no. i think the media is paying close _ january the 6th. no. i think the media is paying close attention j january the 6th. no. i think the i media is paying close attention to trumpet during the transition period and the attorneys for the media and for me at the time writing a book with bodie5 he did not know all of

the facts about what was happening behind the scenes. you had a president coordinating a pressure campaign against this on department ofju5tice state officials and his own vice president and other aide5 own vice president and other aides and lawmakers on capitol hill and at the time it seemed like this is more than ego trip for trump to have a ratty but it actually was the culmination of a coordinated effort to overturn an election which on january five year today we were not really clear about an evidence of that is my own reporting and i was outside the hotel on the night of january and were up to no good and it was clear as to this document that trump wa5 it was clear as to this document that trump was not on an ego trip, he was not having a ratty, this is notjust he was not having a ratty, this is not just a he was not having a ratty, this is notjust a 5pasm of a part of the country media was ignoring, this was an attempt to overturn an election and it took month5 an attempt to overturn an election and it took months to be pieced together that story and we are still piecing together the story.

reporting u5ing piecing together the story. reporting using the background methods is something that goes many years back where your coffee is that of course they must be in the 19705. so it's what you are saying that actually the story was extraordinary but he did not reveal any structural problems with the way that you miss media or us journalism problems with the way that you miss media or usjournali5m work5? problems with the way that you miss media or usjournali5m works? i media or usjournalism works? i think we all need to step back in the media in front of the way they try to follow every day which is to presume nothing. what happened was pre5ume nothing. what happened was that a failure of the media it was a failure of imagination that the american democratic system and people in the media but also in politics could not really fathom that the peaceful tran5fer politics could not really fathom that the peaceful transfer of power would be truly disrupted and i think as we move forward when you hear people say we need to cover democracy more apt to me is really an argument to have more of an

imagination, sometimes a big one about what is possible in the united states and to be attentive to that. it intere5t —— an interesting way of framing it. david i can hear you trying to come in. i framing it. david i can hear you trying to come in.— framing it. david i can hear you trying to come in. i think we have to listen carefully _ trying to come in. i think we have to listen carefully to _ trying to come in. i think we have to listen carefully to what - trying to come in. i think we have to listen carefully to what bob - to listen carefully to what bob co5ta has just said to listen carefully to what bob co5ta ha5ju5t 5aid right to listen carefully to what bob co5ta has just said right there. to listen carefully to what bob co5ta ha5ju5t 5aid right there. in a sense, the media had done so much to hearfrom 5ome a sense, the media had done so much to hear from some supporters both a sense, the media had done so much to hearfrom 5ome supporters both in the period after but really every since the american media was taken by complete surprise on election night in 2016. there is no failure to toughestjump supporters. to recognise the implications of what the media report was sharing. and there was an actual layer that makes it different and a5

there was an actual layer that makes it different and as criminal activities that may en5ue and this is different because there are structural forces at play and institutions paste emotion and open revolt against its leaders and there were efforts to leverage the5e were efforts to leverage these powerful po5ition5 were efforts to leverage these powerful positions in government to overturn the will of the american vote. ~ . .. . vote. when we consider the description _ vote. when we consider the description you _ vote. when we consider the description you have - vote. when we consider the description you have given i vote. when we consider the l description you have given us vote. when we consider the - description you have given us and the description roberts has given us, su5an from the washington u5, su5an from the washington examiner i wonder if you feel that american media plu5 plu5 coverage of the fallout from january 5ix all the way through the last 12 months has been proportionate? i think it's been proportionate? i think it's been a little political. i been proportionate? i think it's been a little political.— been a little political. i think it is about trying _ been a little political. i think it is about trying to _ been a little political. i think it is about trying to tie _ been a little political. i think it i is about trying to tie republicans to overthrowing an election and overthrowing the government. there are a lot of people who feel very strongly that trump's i5 are a lot of people who feel very strongly that trump's is on the term was undermined by democrats and the

wa5 undermined by democrats and the whole russian collision storyline that dominated its entire time i thinkjoe came to some of the behaviour we saw and that's a story line that also deserves consideration. obviously i'm not going to agreement the fellow gue5t5 going to agreement the fellow guests on this issue but i feel like the reporting generally speaking i5 reporting generally speaking is generally bia5ed toward democrat5 reporting generally speaking is generally bia5ed toward democrats in the papers and radio stations and that's just been a factor of life here in america and for them to look at base i did not see it as democracy about to be overthrown. i saw it like i think i really do ego trip for president trump i think it had dire consequences. what he did in his final weeks in office. i don't know if i really felt like democracy was under threat. it seemed to me there was never a real possibility. ibis

seemed to me there was never a real ossibili . �* . .., , i. possibility. as we consider your criti . ue possibility. as we consider your critique of— possibility. as we consider your critique of the _ possibility. as we consider your critique of the liberal _ possibility. as we consider your critique of the liberal media - possibility. as we consider your critique of the liberal media in l possibility. as we consider your i critique of the liberal media in the us coveragejanuary the critique of the liberal media in the us coverage january the 6th critique of the liberal media in the us coveragejanuary the 6th and the months that have followed. also need to factor in that donald trump wa5 to factor in that donald trump was very good business for the liberal media in the us and january the 6th allowed his impact on us politics and his impact on their bottom line to reach beyond his presidency? i reject that premise. you are insinuating the media is driving its coverage _ insinuating the media is driving its coverage and in a transactional way based on _ coverage and in a transactional way based on clicks to follow trump and i based on clicks to follow trump and i don't _ based on clicks to follow trump and idon't think— based on clicks to follow trump and i don't think that's accurate. show me evidence of that. i i don't think that's accurate. show me evidence of that.— me evidence of that. i could point to the fact — me evidence of that. i could point to the fact that _ me evidence of that. i could point to the fact that a _ me evidence of that. i could point to the fact that a tv _ me evidence of that. i could point to the fact that a tv network - me evidence of that. i could point to the fact that a tv network like | to the fact that a tv network like msnbc is spending a lot of time looking atjanuary 5ix msnbc is spending a lot of time looking at january six and the consequences of everything that have followed and you could follow that's ju5tifiable but its critics would say it's a good way of driving ratings to inflate the importance of the story ver5u5 ratings to inflate the importance of the story versus other stories. to give it a disproportionate amount of

airtime. i give it a disproportionate amount of airtime. .. �* give it a disproportionate amount of airtime. ., �* ~ .. airtime. i don't know the intent. you are covering _ airtime. i don't know the intent. you are covering it _ airtime. i don't know the intent. you are covering it a _ airtime. i don't know the intent. you are covering it a lot - airtime. i don't know the intent. you are covering it a lot and - airtime. i don't know the intent. i you are covering it a lot and that's a fair— you are covering it a lot and that's a fair thing — you are covering it a lot and that's a fairthing to you are covering it a lot and that's a fair thing to say. msnbc is covering _ a fair thing to say. msnbc is covering up a lot and framing it in a different way. cnn is covering it its own— a different way. cnn is covering it its own way. the option here is to not cover— its own way. the option here is to not cover a — its own way. the option here is to not cover a major committee work on investigating an attack on the us capital and focus on biting's agenda and infrastructure. as an editorial choice _ and infrastructure. as an editorial choice to— and infrastructure. as an editorial choice to also covered january six a year after _ choice to also covered january six a year after but i see january six in a different— year after but i see january six in a different rate than the committee. the committee sees it framing at least _ the committee sees it framing at least congressman cheney has trump bein- least congressman cheney has trump being idle _ least congressman cheney has trump being idle that's not the story. trump — being idle that's not the story. trump may have been idle for a few hours _ trump may have been idle for a few hours but _ trump may have been idle for a few hours but the story is there weeks prior and — hours but the story is there weeks prior and the intent was there to disrupt— prior and the intent was there to disrupt elections than the other

reason — disrupt elections than the other reason i'm not giving msnbc credit here the _ reason i'm not giving msnbc credit here the reason they keep covering this is— here the reason they keep covering this is the — here the reason they keep covering this is the aftershock ofjanuary six is _ this is the aftershock ofjanuary six is not — this is the aftershock ofjanuary six is not that this was an isolated episode — six is not that this was an isolated episode. attempts to frame the 2020 election— episode. attempts to frame the 2020 election as _ episode. attempts to frame the 2020 election as if i get an election continue _ election as if i get an election continue in a rampant rate in many states— continue in a rampant rate in many states to _ continue in a rampant rate in many states to the point where people are trying _ states to the point where people are trying to _ states to the point where people are trying to run for office seeing the election was a lie and change election— election was a lie and change election laws this is a pervasive new movement in american politics that deserves attention and scrutiny _ that deserves attention and scrutin . ~ .. . that deserves attention and scrutin . ~ . , .. that deserves attention and scrutin . ~ . , ., , scrutiny. what is your view of this, no one is suggesting _ scrutiny. what is your view of this, no one is suggesting this - scrutiny. what is your view of this, no one is suggesting this is - scrutiny. what is your view of this, no one is suggesting this is not. scrutiny. what is your view of this, | no one is suggesting this is not the story but it's the degree to which it's being covered. do you suspect liberal media had incentives to be on editorialjudgement5 for focusing on editorialjudgement5 for focusing on this? i on editorial 'udgements for focusing on this? .. on editorial 'udgements for focusing on this? . ., . on editorial 'udgements for focusing on this? . ., , . on this? i want to be careful about acce -atin on this? i want to be careful about accepting the idea _ on this? i want to be careful about accepting the idea of _ on this? i want to be careful about accepting the idea of liberal- on this? i want to be careful about accepting the idea of liberal media that the washington post is exactly the way the guardian is. american newspapers try by and large. he had new5paper5 try by and large. he had 5en5ibilities and outlooks and the experience is religiou5 —— i think the choices but they have outlook

thati5 the choices but they have outlook that is different than bee5 are expected based on the spectrum you might find in the uk. msnbc doe5 play what happened onjanuary might find in the uk. msnbc doe5 play what happened on january 5ix the investigation in the aftermath to a greater degree and emma disproportionate degree than like npr or the new york times which does cover ingrate that's the kind of policy arguments and political debates that robert referred to. i would remind your cable doe5 would remind your cable does everything disproportionate. it never does things as a magazine with 17 different storie5 never does things as a magazine with 17 different stories in our. they cover three or more stories and they will do out of proportion regardless. analogy i5 will do out of proportion regardless. analogy is this is fundamentally the story of our moment. it's wrong to say there were concerns about the integrity of these elections and gives the5e elections and gives organisations at times including the washington examiner which i respect and not of internists but let's be clear for your viewers it's a and not of internists but let's be clearfor your viewers it's a right of centre outfit who5e ceo is

currently campaigning for his publication by campaigning against their advertising against the credibility of the rest of the media and they have cast out the changes that were made because of the pandemic and not scare but those were evaluated and found not to affect the election. so i want to finish this thought. casting doubt on that element in the wake of thousands of lawsuits and hundreds of evaluations by election officials of evaluations by election officials of the right on the left and republican and democrats i5 of the right on the left and republican and democrats is to give credence to something that's been discredited. ~ .. credence to something that's been discredited. ~ . , credence to something that's been discredited-— discredited. what is interesting listeninu discredited. what is interesting listening to _ discredited. what is interesting listening to all _ discredited. what is interesting listening to all three _ discredited. what is interesting listening to all three of- discredited. what is interesting listening to all three of you - discredited. what is interesting listening to all three of you is l discredited. what is interesting i listening to all three of you is the degree of emphasis on the functioning of american democracy and if he can bring you in, your editor in chief of vice uk i wonder if you have observed the story whether this mark5 if you have observed the story whether this marks a broader 5hift whether this marks a broader shift in generous intere5t whether this marks a broader shift in generous interest in how democracy functions and how that's described to their audiences? i

think it reflects a shift in the us but i think that contrasting that with what's been happening in the uk we still very much have a media focusing on the individualfoibles of our politicians and they need to and it broke la5t of our politicians and they need to and it broke last year and you can contrast that with the way repeat5 covered in the us pre55 contrast that with the way repeat5 covered in the us press for us to someone like kerry simmons and the differences between the uk and the us pre55 differences between the uk and the us press is aping the us media right now is focused on democratic proce55e5. now is focused on democratic processes. the ways in which people can be disenfranchised of their votes and the gerrymandering that occurs where in the uk for better or worse we are focused on the character of our politicians which is why when you see people criticise borisjohnson it is why when you see people criticise boris johnson it wont is why when you see people criticise borisjohnson it wont be long until they get a date again about the way he dresses are present to himself it still very much a personality driven political system. irate still very much a personality driven political system.— still very much a personality driven political system. we looked at how

this is impacted _ political system. we looked at how this is impacted on _ political system. we looked at how this is impacted on the _ political system. we looked at how this is impacted on the way - political system. we looked at how this is impacted on the way it - this is impacted on the way it democracy a5 this is impacted on the way it democracy as described in general is a 90 di5cussed democracy as described in general is a 90 discussed the proportionate nature of how this was covered. let us turn to the tech giant5 because one strand of the story that has not gone away is the role of the tech giant5. twitter and facebook have been accused of acting too slowly when it came down to taking po5t5 inciting violence onjanuary when it came down to taking po5t5 inciting violence on january the 6th. they're also being accused of overreaching and interfering in politics of banning 5ome overreaching and interfering in politics of banning some political accounts of course the most high—profile example of that is donald trump his twitter account was suspended not long afterjanuary 5ix 5u5pended not long afterjanuary six and in the last few days congre55woman marjorie taylor green has been banned from twitter permit me to sharing covid—19 misinformation and what more do we know to take a congre55woman off their platform? it’s know to take a congresswoman off their platform?— their platform? it's a different thin. their platform? it's a different thing. donald _ their platform? it's a different thing. donald trump - their platform? it's a different thing. donald trump removed j their platform? it's a different - thing. donald trump removed from twitter because of his incitement to

violence and marjorie taylor green had five 5trike5 for covid—19 misinformation riches vitally important and i think the role that twitter and facebook and other social media platforms pay him all of these conversations both national and international speak to their power. there are preventative5 of the old media and the light of motherly web5ite5 the old media and the light of motherly websites are getting ready to social media. we often forget that social media is a public space but is privately owned and there are rules in privately owned organisations. if you fall afoul of them you get kicked off the challenge for social media platforms and you have to try and benefit both sides and keep both sides happy and what we have seen in this conversation is a politically polarised debate so you're damned if you do and damned if you don't. dare you do and damned if you don't. are ou you do and damned if you don't. are you uncomfortable if they are taking

decisions about which politicians can and cannot reach the scare that to offers? i can and cannot reach the scare that to offers? .. can and cannot reach the scare that to offers? ~ , . . to offers? i think social media in aeneral to offers? i think social media in general has _ to offers? i think social media in general has tried _ to offers? i think social media in general has tried to _ to offers? i think social media in general has tried to tip - to offers? i think social media in general has tried to tip the - to offers? i think social media in l general has tried to tip the scales because _ general has tried to tip the scales because they can. there privately owned _ because they can. there privately owned and — because they can. there privately owned and can do what they want and they have _ owned and can do what they want and they have banned a lot of conservative places and then people who have _ conservative places and then people who have wanted to talk more informative me about covid—19 and lockdowns — informative me about covid—19 and lockdowns and vaccines and the effectiveness of vaccines and some of the _ effectiveness of vaccines and some of the people who have been banned it does— of the people who have been banned it does not— of the people who have been banned it does not make a lot of sense they were stating actual facts that from medical— were stating actual facts that from medical doctors about covid—19 they were taken— medical doctors about covid—19 they were taken off the platform because it's called _ were taken off the platform because it's called under this change covid-i9 _ it's called under this change covid—19 misinformation id and i feel like — covid—19 misinformation id and i feel like it — covid—19 misinformation id and i feel like it because a lot of people to question the fairness of social media _ to question the fairness of social media accounts. they are under the scrutiny— media accounts. they are under the scrutiny of— media accounts. they are under the scrutiny of congress because they

have cut — scrutiny of congress because they have cut enemies and people are angry— have cut enemies and people are angry at— have cut enemies and people are angry at them at the right and left so in _ angry at them at the right and left so in the _ angry at them at the right and left so in the next year or two you will see the _ so in the next year or two you will see the government tried doing monitor— see the government tried doing monitor and manage this and step in because _ monitor and manage this and step in because they don't have friends on either— because they don't have friends on either side — because they don't have friends on either side of the aisle right now so they— either side of the aisle right now so they are caught in the middle but from my— so they are caught in the middle but from my own perspective some of the people _ from my own perspective some of the people you see getting banned from facebook— people you see getting banned from facebook and twitter doesn't make a lot of— facebook and twitter doesn't make a lot of sense — facebook and twitter doesn't make a lot of sense and it doesn't seem fair~ _ lot of sense and it doesn't seem fair~ |_ lot of sense and it doesn't seem fair. .. , .. lot of sense and it doesn't seem fair. ., , ., . fair. i wonder whether you agree with the broader— fair. i wonder whether you agree with the broader principles - fair. i wonder whether you agree j with the broader principles being raised here. but also the specific question about your business which relies on these platforms. do you feel vulnerable they could at any point take a position against you or any other business? i point take a position against you or any other business?— any other business? i think if you ask any edits _ any other business? i think if you ask any edits or _ any other business? i think if you ask any edits or of _ any other business? i think if you ask any edits or of any _ any other business? i think if you | ask any edits or of any publication that puts — ask any edits or of any publication that puts content out the answer is always _ that puts content out the answer is always going to be yes. because fundamentally it is one of the few issues _ fundamentally it is one of the few issues i _ fundamentally it is one of the few issues i reckon everyone will agree with me _ issues i reckon everyone will agree with me on — issues i reckon everyone will agree with me on a have far too much power to decide _ with me on a have far too much power to decide what goes out and what

does _ to decide what goes out and what does not and they have too much power _ does not and they have too much power to — does not and they have too much power to decide who gets hurt and who gets _ power to decide who gets hurt and who gets the maximum amount of reach so facebook— who gets the maximum amount of reach so facebook or as it's now known meta- _ so facebook or as it's now known meta- can— so facebook or as it's now known meta— can choose to change its algorithm — meta— can choose to change its algorithm and it will not gather every— algorithm and it will not gather every single social media editor and publication into a room and explain this is— publication into a room and explain this is what's going to happen and how it _ this is what's going to happen and how it will— this is what's going to happen and how it will affect their content. you just— how it will affect their content. you just wake up one morning and you realise _ you just wake up one morning and you realise your— you just wake up one morning and you realise your content is not forming the same — realise your content is not forming the same way it used to. this happened _ the same way it used to. this happened in a high—profile case in the uk _ happened in a high—profile case in the uk this— happened in a high—profile case in the uk this is an account about breaking — the uk this is an account about breaking news stories and hundreds and thousands of followers and it's gone _ and thousands of followers and it's gone tell— and thousands of followers and it's gone. tell us why. it�*s and thousands of followers and it's gone. tell us why.— gone. tell us why. it's difficult to know. it gone. tell us why. it's difficult to know- it was _ gone. tell us why. it's difficult to know. it was aggregating - gone. tell us why. it's difficult to - know. it was aggregating information amongst linking accounts that it owns and we don't really know and twitter has not definitively when said nor has the owner come out and

5aid nor has the owner come out and spoke to the press. this lack of transparency that we are concerned about the many impact that social media platforms have but it seems interesting points in terms of this idea of we are putting a lot of our egg5in idea of we are putting a lot of our eggs in terms of the media and baskets that we don't have control out. we will remember things like the media picked video in the late 2000 thousand5 early 20105 when suddenly facebook prioritised video content and people are hired to produce video5 content and people are hired to produce videos and regular writers were fired on the back of that and suddenly facebook turned off that type of traffic to the platforms end5 setting me you find media having to move again and this is one of the big issues here we really are seeing the media platforms being led by social media giant5. seeing the media platforms being led by social media giants.— by social media giants. there's an interesting _ by social media giants. there's an interesting concept _ by social media giants. there's an interesting concept that _ by social media giants. there's an interesting concept that here -

by social media giants. there's an interesting concept that here for i interesting concept that here for example — interesting concept that here for example we forget in america with the first— example we forget in america with the first amendment these are private — the first amendment these are private companies in the air in our mess— private companies in the air in our mess and — private companies in the air in our mess and beat dominate the way in which _ mess and beat dominate the way in which people acquire information but also and _ which people acquire information but also and yet they have their own first amendment rights to choices about— first amendment rights to choices about who they are allowed to talk on their— about who they are allowed to talk on their platform. that's not regulated by the government and yet there are _ regulated by the government and yet there are questions about first amendment principles and pay and congresswoman being taken off the platform _ congresswoman being taken off the platform who has the authority to speak— platform who has the authority to speak to — platform who has the authority to speak to her constituents duly elected — speak to her constituents duly elected and that does raise significant concerns. i think there's— significant concerns. i think there's been a lot of look at the claim _ there's been a lot of look at the claim made by conservatives that they are — claim made by conservatives that they are targeted and i think a time when _ they are targeted and i think a time when there — they are targeted and i think a time when there seems to be asymmetrical level of— when there seems to be asymmetrical level of misinformation on this information from certain kinds of right-wing — information from certain kinds of right—wing figures about covid—19 for example and the platforms are struggling to deal with it and there

are ways _ struggling to deal with it and there are ways to deal with it without which _ are ways to deal with it without which can — are ways to deal with it without which can be fully exploited. questions are mean for how the media interacts with the tech platforms ju5t interacts with the tech platforms just to bring this discussion back in the last few minutes we have heard how you have written a book and now you covered that story and alloys and days that followed the 5torming of the capital say you've done a number of different types of determinism, and i wonder whether you think there are broader le55on5 you think there are broader lessons that now need to be applied as the media continues to cover the story as it evolves. mr; media continues to cover the story as it evolves-— as it evolves. my advice to colleagues _ as it evolves. my advice to colleagues with _ as it evolves. my advice to colleagues with detail - as it evolves. my advice to colleagues with detail to i as it evolves. my advice to | colleagues with detail to be vigilant— colleagues with detail to be vigilant and _ colleagues with detail to be vigilant and vigorous - colleagues with detail to be vigilant and vigorous and i colleagues with detail to be - vigilant and vigorous and listening to what— vigilant and vigorous and listening to what people _ vigilant and vigorous and listening to what people are _ vigilant and vigorous and listening to what people are doing - vigilant and vigorous and listening to what people are doing in - vigilant and vigorous and listening to what people are doing in the i to what people are doing in the country— to what people are doing in the country and _ to what people are doing in the country and that _ to what people are doing in the country and that means - to what people are doing in the country and that means not - to what people are doing in the| country and that means notjust talking — country and that means notjust talking to voters _ country and that means notjust talking to voters but _ country and that means notjust talking to voters but talking - country and that means notjust talking to voters but talking to. talking to voters but talking to state — talking to voters but talking to state officials _ talking to voters but talking to state officials and _ talking to voters but talking to state officials and local- talking to voters but talking to i state officials and local officials. what's _ state officials and local officials. what's happening _ state officials and local officials. what's happening out _ state officials and local officials. what's happening out in - state officials and local officials. what's happening out in the - state officials and local officials. - what's happening out in the country. they need _ what's happening out in the country. they need a — what's happening out in the country. they need a constitutional— what's happening out in the country. they need a constitutional crisis - what's happening out in the country. they need a constitutional crisis on l they need a constitutional crisis on the horizon— they need a constitutional crisis on the horizon if— they need a constitutional crisis on the horizon if it _ they need a constitutional crisis on the horizon if it ever— they need a constitutional crisis on the horizon if it ever happens - they need a constitutional crisis on

the horizon if it ever happens is- they need a constitutional crisis on the horizon if it ever happens is inl the horizon if it ever happens is in january— the horizon if it ever happens is in january 2025 _ the horizon if it ever happens is in january 2025 a _ the horizon if it ever happens is in january 2025 a fault _ the horizon if it ever happens is in january 2025 a fault states - the horizon if it ever happens is in january 2025 a fault states of- january 2025 a fault states of connectors _ january 2025 a fault states of connectors or— january 2025 a fault states of connectors or way— january 2025 a fault states of connectors or way of- january 2025 a fault states of| connectors or way of counting january 2025 a fault states of - connectors or way of counting the votes _ connectors or way of counting the votes is _ connectors or way of counting the votes is proposed _ connectors or way of counting the votes is proposed broadly- connectors or way of counting the. votes is proposed broadly speaking inside _ votes is proposed broadly speaking inside the — votes is proposed broadly speaking inside the republican— votes is proposed broadly speaking inside the republican party- votes is proposed broadly speaking inside the republican party and - votes is proposed broadly speakingl inside the republican party and that seems _ inside the republican party and that seems to— inside the republican party and that seems to be — inside the republican party and that seems to be a — inside the republican party and that seems to be a development- inside the republican party and that seems to be a development based i seems to be a development based on my reporting — seems to be a development based on my reporting that's _ seems to be a development based on my reporting that's active _ seems to be a development based on my reporting that's active right - my reporting that's active right now _ my reporting that's active right now. . ~' my reporting that's active right now. . ~ , ., my reporting that's active right now. . ~ i. . �*, my reporting that's active right now. . ~ . �*, . now. thank you. that's some final advice of the _ now. thank you. that's some final advice of the washington - now. thank you. that's some final advice of the washington post. . now. thank you. that's some final advice of the washington post. i i advice of the washington post. i will mention and bring us right back to january 5ix this new radio for a series pre5ented to january 5ix this new radio for a series presented by gambrell look5 5erie5 presented by gambrell looks at the build—up to january 5ix 5erie5 presented by gambrell looks at the build—up to january six and the causes of those riot5 at the build—up to january six and the causes of those riots and looks at the hearing on conspiracy theories and you can listen to the entire series right now on bbc silence. that is it for this edition and thank you for watching and thanks to all of our guests and we will see you next week.

snow and ice me for tricky chaplain conditions and places on friday. we will see less of that in the forecast for the week ahead. saturday will bring arre5ts now and more rain courtesy of this frontal system working at three east with heavy bursts of rain. we have a wedge of mild air. generally speaking mild leather around on 5peaking mild leather around on saturday morning but with it lots of cloud and outbreak5 saturday morning but with it lots of cloud and outbreaks of rain. we will see bands of heavy and tenderly rain 5ee bands of heavy and tenderly rain ranking east accompanied by du5ty rain5. may a ranking east accompanied by du5ty rain5. maya bit ranking east accompanied by du5ty rain5. may a bit 5tronger ranking east accompanied by du5ty rain5. may a bit stronger than that and exposed 5pots rain5. may a bit stronger than that and exposed spots and then the rain will clear to a mix of sunshine and showers a5 will clear to a mix of sunshine and showers as cold air works back in from the rest. there are anti—aircraft temperatures between five and 10 degrees. we are in that

cold air and five and 10 degrees. we are in that cold airand we five and 10 degrees. we are in that cold air and we will see when to showers in place. it 5tays breezy out there. temperatures will hold above freezing and quite cold especially in eastern scotland. we get into sunday and we have to screen at the appetite to see it but there is a ridge of high pressure trying to come in. what that is likely to do is bring fear showers and calm down the shower activity. we will see some of them could be written but they will be spell5 of sunshine. temperature i5 written but they will be spell5 of sunshine. temperature is between 5un5hine. temperature is between four and 10 degrees. you can see behind me ourfrontal four and 10 degrees. you can see behind me our frontal system beginning to work its way in from the left. a warm front pushing east as we get into monday with a wedge of air between the warm front al5o as we get into monday with a wedge of air between the warm front also a lot of crowd. monday will be a cloudy day with light rain and treasure and heavy rain getting into fights in scotland and northern ireland and wendy in the north. a

mild field to the letter with double digits for many of us. as a move out of monday into tuesday the cold front will be 5outh of monday into tuesday the cold front will be south but it would be weakening because pressure will be building and you can see the area of starting to build its way so not too much rain on the cold front and a list see spell5 of sunshine developing acro55 list see spell5 of sunshine developing across the northern half of the uk. we will be back into cold air but seven to 11 degrees with a touch above average for this point in january. touch above average for this point injanuary. ourarea of touch above average for this point injanuary. our area of high pressure will build more strongly acro55 pressure will build more strongly across the uk so many of us will be dry and there could be trust and fog around in the morning but we will see 5un5hine around in the morning but we will see sunshine and the greater chance 5ee sunshine and the greater chance of seeing cloud and rain alway5 acro55 of seeing cloud and rain alway5 across the north of the uk and mild. nine, ten, or” degrees. this

across the north of the uk and mild. nine, ten, or 11 degrees. this kind of weather takes us towards the end of weather takes us towards the end of next week and into the following weekend. nevertoo of next week and into the following weekend. never too far away. it weekend. nevertoo faraway. it could be except self allowing meaningful system to move across the far north bringing 5ome meaningful system to move across the far north bringing some rain at times and across northern areas it will be windy at times the next week. with that area high pressure it will be dry and the chance of some frost and fog in the south with 5ome frost and fog in the south with the weather looking le55 wintry through the week ahead.

tonight at ten, government advisors say a fourth vaccine do5e isn't needed for the moment against the omicron variant of coronavirus. new research shows a third dose or boosterjab is enough to protect against severe disease among adults. but nhs staff 5hortage5 due to covid infections have shot up. i think we have to be honest, and when we look at the nhs, it will be a rocky few weeks ahead. we'll be analysis the data and what it means. also tonight: you will call me sir or mr thackeray. the actor sidney poitier, whose pioneering films in the '505 and '605 shone a light on racism and social predjudice, has died. the aftermath of days of unrest in kazakhstan. security forces are ordered to shoot to kill protestors.

the government is to try to make developers pay billions