the headlines: a russian missile attack on a ukrainian military training base has killed at least 35 people and injured more than 130 others. the air strike was in yavoriv, just 25 kilometres from the border with poland. ukraine's president, volodymyr zelensky, visited wounded soldiers in a military hospital in the capital kyiv. during the visit, he awarded military orders and medals for courage and dedication and thanked the hospital staff for what he said was exemplary work in difficult conditions. pope francis has made an impassioned plea for an end to what he called a "massacre" in ukraine. addressing pilgrims in saint peter's square, he described russia's invasion as "unacceptable" and called for a real and decisive move towards negotiation. now on bbc news, dateline london.

hello and welcome to the programme which brings together bbc specialists and the foreign correspondents who write, blog and broadcast to audiences back home from the dateline london. two weeks in, what do russians know about the war that, in their country, dare not speak its name? europe begins to wean itself from russian energy, but is it fast enough? and as shortages bite, ukrainians restrict exports of wheat, but of those in the middle east who depend on it? joining us this week — henry chu, an experienced foreign correspondent at the la times who, as the us west coast sleeps, is ensuring its readers are kept up to date on what's happening in ukraine.

vera krichevskaya is a documentary film—maker. she helped to found tv rain, an independent channel in russia which has now been shut down. and joining me in the studio, gabriel gatehouse, international editor for bbc television's newsnight programme. good to have you with us. good to have you too with us as well, thank you very much, and to vera, forjoining us for the first time on this programme. vera, i would like to start with you, if i may. how are russians are finding out about what the kremlin calls its �*special military operation�*? good evening. can i start with the latest news? in one hour and 30 minutes, instagram in russia will be officially banned before, on this week, twitter and facebook was banned, so but all this started two weeks ago, the first day of the war. the new law was enforced that restricted to say the word �*war�* and to call it, this war, as a �*special operation�*. and another law was enforced, saying you cannot quote any source regarding the war,

except the official sources of the russian ministry of defence or the russian news state media. that�*s how it started, two weeks ago. is there a way russians can get around this? are they finding ways to get information? situation was changed several times. first week of the war, tv rain and other independent media could work during the first seven days. even more — maybe eight days. it was a kind of verbal game. for example, tv rain, tv dozhd give voices for many ukrainians, many ukrainian experts, participated, broadcasting. but later — later — new amendments were aired and any �*fake�* information regarding the war became punishable with 15

years in prison. crosstalk. and, of course, the authorities decide what is and is not fake. yes! henry, of course, the sanctions are clearly having an impact. that�*s one thing. but isn�*t there a risk in, for example, some of the social media companies have themselves withdrawn — have closed access to their sites in russia. is there is a danger that, actually, willing hearts and minds is not happening? is there enough of an effort to do that? well, it is a difficult challenge because to win hearts and minds, you need access to eyes and ears and, as vera was just saying, those avenues of information that are not from state sources are becoming fewer and fewer. it is not any more a war where nato, for example, is directly flying over russian airspace and can drop leaflets on the people, as we thought about wars back before — it is much more electronic now. and when you have the majority people still relying

on television, and if you are on the outside don't have access to those airwaves, then trying to actually get information over to them and to win them over is going to be a really tough task. as vera said, social media, too, are being shutdown — facebook, instagram and twitter. in fact, the facebook parent organisation, meta, is being designated an extremist organisation. and we also need to remember even those russians, younger ones, by and large, who are getting information on online sources and social media, that does not necessarily mean they're getting western information. it could be from russian sources themselves and from other pro—russian outlets, so finding that way in is really difficult. i think that perhaps, the most effective appeals to hearts and minds has

actually come from ukraine's own president, volodymyr zelensky, who speaks russian and has made direct appeals to the russian people in their own language to say, you know, this is not your war. why are your leaders doing this? and encouraging them to protest against that. but again, if there are no avenues in, then it is going to be very difficult to try to win those hearts and minds you talked about, sean. i suppose there are informal connections, aren�*t there, because so many ukrainians have russian relatives and vice versa? vast numbers. i've been speaking to peoplel in eastern ukraine especially, where most people have russian as a first language, _ who say they have beenj talking to their relatives inside russia but often, - you hear these heartbreaking tales of people saying, "guys! "you guys are bombing us here! "what are you doing?" - and their relatives _ on the other side of the divide saying, "we don't believe you. "this is propaganda. "these are the ukrainians doing it to themselves." i so you have these heart—rending situations where families - are being driven apart by war-

and bombs, but also emotionally and no longer sharing a shared truth. - ijust want to pick up - on what henry was saying about social media and . winning hearts and minds. i mean, meta, facebook'sl parent company yesterday, i think, took the extraordinary decision to suspend its - prohibition on calls _ for violence against russians. now, 0k, they have been blocked in russia so maybe it isjust - a business decision but talking about how not to win hearts i and minds, right, it is| an incredible decision. that does sound bizarre. i�*d interested to see what the company�*s explanation is for that. i suppose the group of people who might have access to information are the people around president putin. have you detected in the conversations and the contacts you have in russia any sense of unease within the regime? i would be very interested to know to what extent i the greater kremlin — - the tight circle around putin — actually believes thisl

orwellian propaganda that they are putting out. or to what extent... what sort of numbers are we talking about? is it sort of a couple of dozen, 100? i would say more in the region of a couple of dozen. - i mean, this is in flux. but it's shrinking, right? so, i always used to think of putin's powers restingl on a three—legged stool. so you had the oligarchs, - the money men, the technocrats — people like sergey lavrov, who are basically career - politicians, make the system run but essentially do - what they are told — i while getting quite rich at the same time — and then, there were the 'siloviki' — - the strong men, right? the people from the security apparatus and all of that. - and i always thought of putin's power resting on those three l legs, but i think what we have| come to realise in the last two weeks, 2.5 weeks is that. the influence of those two first groups — the oligarchs and the apparatchiks, - has lessened. and the influence of— the strongmen is much stronger. so, really, the key question is what are they thinking? l right. and i don't know what you i

think, vera, but i don't think anyone really knows. vera. first of all, i would like to say that the that the state, the regime created years ago — in 2014 — they created non—existent world for the audience, for russian viewers and then believed in this non—existent world. i think they started believing of their own propaganda — that is what happened. otherwise, you cannot explain to anyone this invasion. it is the first thing. the second thing is i think it is clear already that putin got a very non — extremely non—professional report. we got a leak from different sources today that one general — fpb general and his deputy was put on home arrest today.

house arrest, yes? yeah, house arrest, today, and this particular general reported about what is going on in ukraine. so it looks like the kremlin started understanding that they knew nothing about what is going on in ukraine, really. got you. henry, president biden on friday again returned to the question of sanctions. president putin had said on thursday — the first address i think he�*s made on the subject publicly — yes, some things are going to hurt but we are going to mitigate the effects. biden has moved fast. is there any frustration that the pace at which the europeans and british are moving, because they are manifestly moving at a slower pace

in terms of banning oil and gas imports. i think on the fuel question, you are right that there is a two—speed effort going on. on some of the previous ones, though, in terms of sanctioning actual people — for example, the lawmakers in the duma who voted for — in favour of this — of recognising the breakaway republics, on different oligarchs and some of the other sanctions that have been applied, i think there was much more unanimity and a bit more synchronicity in terms of when they actually imposed these sanctions. and actually, although biden, you know, did announce this ban on oil and gas imports from russia, and then on some products, perhaps putting more tariffs on them from — by revoking this most favoured nation trading status, i think there is some sympathy in washington that europe, of course, is in a very different situation from the us when it comes to reliance on russian fuel and russian products. you look at what the us imports in terms of barrels of oil

from russia — it is only about 700,000 a day, whereas for europe, it is 4 million. and then you also have some european countries that are one — almost 100% reliant on russian gas. so, to tell their people that now you need to freeze or actually be paying through the roof for home heating and home cooking is going to be very difficult, so i think there are some compassion there within washington as to europe trying to go a little bit slower, and also recognising that, for example, you have chancellor 0laf scholz in germany already taking that step of suspending the nord stream 2 pipeline, which the biden administration had wanted for a long time and now, they actually have done. the figures, gabriel, are dramatic, aren�*t they? i mean,60% of russia�*s oil exports go to europe, only 2% of that is to the uk, the rest to the eu, but 8% to the us. i mean, it�*s — europe is absolutely exposed on this front. i was thinking when this first started, in the first week, i few days, everyone was -

so shocked by what happened and then, suddenly, - everybody came together — i mean, the response was quite incredible. | the sort of europe which we think of as being sort - of congenitally disunited - really came together on this and i was thinking in those days — and i was talking i to people inside russia - in moscow and trying to figure out what was going on inside i the kremlin, and would anyone turn against putin - if the consequences — economic consequences, lifestyle consequences —| for these people - seemed dire enough. and there was a moment, i wondered whether if, . in those early days i when they were piling on the pressure, day by day, and it was getting bigger- and bigger, europe had said, you know what? i we're not going| to buy your gas. don't care what it costs. we'll print money. - we will do whatever it — you know? - i wondered, at that point, - whether there might have been a palace coup. whether some of the people around him, who have beenl around him for 15, 20 years,

who have got very rich - while sort of ranting - and railing against the west at home but, you know, going to their... - in truth, this is russia�*s export. it doesn�*t really have much else of scale. the whole regime l runs on oil and gas. that is their lifeblood, - that is what gives them power, that is what gives them wealth. so, i wondered whether some of those people who, - you know, rail against the west at home but go on holidays- in their nice, fancy yachts and stay in their villas - in tuscany and send their kids to british boarding schools, i whether, if there had i been the energy thing, if europe had said, i "do you know what? "we're not buying your gas any more," whether somebody - would admit against him. it's speculation, but i think- maybe that window has passed i'iow. yeah, that was an opportunity. vera, clearly, one side effect of the kind of surge in oil prices that actually means russia gets a bit more for what it does sell — the 20% to china and all the rest of it — but do you get the impression from talking

to friends in russia that the sanctions are yet hitting ordinary russians? are they yet feeling the effects of this? no, no, no, they are panicking. there is a panic en masse. in saint petersburg. i mean, average people, because prices forfood — for very simple food baskets, meats, sugar, grains, — are going up every day. people try to buy something in advance and it is already shortage on shelves at supermarkets. people are panicking. and there is a problem with the banking system as well. so i think it hurts the average people from the beginning. from the second day, i would say. i don't know about you, vera, but my friends in moscow, many of whom are journalists

and many of whom have been forced to flee — as you said, journalism has effectively become a crime punishable by 50 years in jail - they now find themselves in a position whereby, i have got a friend who hasjust left. his visa cards don't work because of british sanctions, he cannot get any this money out of his bank accounts in russia because of russian counter sanctions, some of these lectures are hurting the wrong people. it's it�*s a paradox. absolutely, absolutely. most of my colleagues found themselves on tuesday morning without money. no money and they can�*t work? yeah! in georgia, in istanbul, no money. cards stopped working. it is a disaster for them. henry, when we�*re talking about kind of unintended consequences, we have kind of been here before, haven�*t we, where exports of oil had not been made available by countries as a punishment — this is us, in a sense, punishing ourselves for a good cause — but it is possible russia may by making it harder to get oil and gas.

remind us what impact that had after the yom kippur war, as we called it, in �*73 when arab countries punished those who had supported israel. that was what some people called the first oil shock that the world have experienced up to that point and it meant that the us, for example, was under embargo with oil from the middle east and i think oil prices went up by about fourfold. per barrel during that time. so it was really felt, certainly in the us and other parts — of the world when there was rationing and there was really quite an uproar in the us over this and president nixon, at the time, was really grasping at different ways to try to get oil into the country and make sure it was not going to lead to his own downfall for that reason. and what it had, though, is a more long—term effect on the us, was a sort of clearing of the mind and the realisation that the us needed to develop different energy sources, that it could not only rely on the middle east any longer, that it needed to increase

domestic production, it needed to increase efficiency and so, it led to a real soul—searching when it came to energy policy and then what you have now is an interesting turn of the wheel of history because what happened within a few years is that the soviet union, then, actually became the word's largest oil producer. they started doing a lot more production and exploration in siberia and so, that ended up diversifying the overall supply so that there was not this kind of reliance on the middle east. and now what do we see with the usa saying it is going to ban russian oil, the biden administration is actually talking about getting more oil from, where? the middle east. saudi arabia. so, what goes around, comes around. 0r, indeed, venezuela. i saw some comments from nicolas maduro, from the president of venezuela, where is almost public enemy

number one in washington, saying he had had a very respectful and cordial meeting with an last sunday talking about exactly this — accessing some of venezuela�*s oil. absolutely, energy shocks make for interesting bedfellows. gabriel, you know ukraine incredibly well, you lived there for some years, you are backwards and forwards regularly and you have of friends there. it is a vast country — i mean, you showed me some of that when i visited for work and worked with you. vast, beautiful country. agriculturally, so rich. and yet, last weekend, they were imposing export controls — not just on wheat, but things as basic as poultry and eggs and almost everybody has got poultry around the country in such a rural country — a country with such big rural areas. does that suggest that they are really now getting seriously worried about food supplies? i think they are seriouslyl worried about everything. i think, for the moment, - from ukrainians i am speaking to, is that they are fighting fortheir lives, right? - cities like mariupol are encircled. - people are melting snow to drink. -

so, i think the sort of — i the slightly longer—term, you know. — you can see them putting in these policies which will be i kind of governmental thinking, you know, thinking for the long term, i but the average person is thinking, "where do| "i run to? "how can i live once i have run there? i :and what are our prospects for kind of maintaining - our independence? " — and those are i the ones that have the ability to move. the other ones, in these surrounded cities, - they are facing the prospect of potentially very - long sieges, encirclement. potentially starvation conditions. right. because outside humanitarian supplies are not getting in. ..are not getting in. and if we see the kind of tactics that russia i and the syrians used - in syria, you know, we see what the ukrainians might be looking forward to, - and this is a very scary prospect. i henry, ijust wanted to pick up on the consequences of this worldwide, because one of the things i did not know

until this conflict started is how much of a country like lebanon — and i think yemen as well, but lebanon in particular — is dependant on ukrainian wheat. now, there is a country on its uppers, that is bankrupt, that is struggling to feed its people and suddenly, ukrainian wheat — i think russia and ukraine together is about 30% of the traded wheat in the world — it is not there. it is not available. i mean, this is a war it could be exported, couldn�*t it? in terms of instability, ukraine, central europe but other parts of world could start to feel that instability as well? political instability, and also just food insecurity. i think, for lebanon — for those of us who remember looking — at those incredible photos after the blast in the beirut port damaged those huge grain

silos — that is why so much of lebanon's grain came in and i think it is an amount that it had relied on ukraine for was about 60% of its grain supply and, as you say, it is a completely bankrupt country now and it is desperately looking for other sources of grain and in egypt, as well, which i think is the word's largest wheat importer, that is another country where wheat is incredibly subsidised by the government — and rightfully so, for population that is quite dependent and quite poor on wheat. and so, if those prices start going up, which some experts say could be happening already — obviously, some prices are already going up and injuly, perhaps, being felt all the more — well then you could be exporting political instability to those places. and it is not just within that sort of more close—lying region. actually, a lot of the wheat goes as far as afield as asia. i think indonesia has about a quarter of its wheat from ukraine and there, it is processed into instant noodles and snacks and other things that very poor people rely on. so, you are right that this could actually be felt all the way out in ripples around the world to the extent that today, i think,

the united nations food and agricultural organization said that you can have 13 million more people experiencing food insecurity by next year, and that isjust because of what is happening in what is often called the breadbasket of europe — and certainly, perhaps, the breadbasket of the world. yeah, i mean, the wheat trading figures in chicago — the ones i saw most recently — was 50% up, the cost, since the invasion. that is the bulk price. we have a minute each just at the end before we go. vera, first — what worries you most about the trajectory of this war, about the way things are going? i think it might last very long. and i do not believe now, in this particular moment, that this war might be ended tomorrow or in a week. it does not look so. and, obviously, it is going to be a huge wave of repressions inside russia as well

and endless amount of deaths. henry. wel, just thinking of those incredible numbers of people escaping the country — i think that it is over 2.5 million now — and they say half of those are children. women and children are being allowed out. men of fighting age are told to stay within ukraine. but what does this do to a country long—term? already, i think that is about over one eighth of people under the age — of 18 in ukraine have left. what does that mean demographically and for the future? what does that mean about national_ what does that mean about national identity? this will unfold for years to come. i have got a couple of minutes left. gabriel, do you want to pick up on some of those thoughts? henry is right that this is a catastrophe for ukraine. - but there is a question here. if this is — and vera touched

on this — if this ends up- being a short war — i and let's hope it is — and that ukraine - comes out of it with its independence more or less intact, ukraine will end up| being a much stronger country than it was when it went in. i the corrosive question of russian speakers i versus ukrainian speakers - will have almost entirely been wiped out by this cataclysmic. event and this common enemy. for unity? absolutely. russia, on the other hand — vera is quite right on this —| no matter how long this war goes on how it ends, - it is going to get very, very dark in russia, i i think, as vera says, - repressions, the economy that we've talked about, | all this kind of stuff, until this regime is removed, things are going to get dark. | i have no doubt that this war is the beginning of the end l for vladimir putin. it is a question of how long the end takes to| come to fruition. i think, you know, at the end of the day, all wars end -

in a negotiated settlement and i think, this week, i we were kind of in a place where it could either be - a short war with a negotiated settlement — perhaps something recognising crimea and the separatist - republics and neutrality- for ukraine — or a long war. and i think we were kind of in that pivot point - when we saw talks in turkey that did not go incredibly- well, i think that is - being decided right now. gabriel gatehouse, henry chu, vera, thank you all very much. vera, thank you all very much. vera, i look forward to welcoming you back into the studio very soon and to have henry back with us. see you again soon, i hope. this is it from us. see you again next weekend. goodbye. hello, there. it�*s mid—march, days are getting longer and the sunshine

is getting stronger, and we will see some of that as we go through out week ahead. there�*s going to be a lot of dry weather in the forecast. pretty mild, by day, in the sunshine. chilly at night still, with some patchy mist and fog, and there will be some rain this week but it is most likely to be through wednesday. now, for the here and now, we�*ve got rain clearing to the east, this little area of cloud bringing showers into scotland and one down into the south—west. now, these showers in the south—west may be heavy and thundery and they�*ll drift along the channel coast during the early part of the morning. at the same time, some showers moving out of northern ireland into central and southern scotland, along with northern england, with the best of the sunshine perhaps a little bit further south, into central parts of england and wales with highs of 1a degrees. now, there�*s going to be a good deal of dry weather around on tuesday as well, with light winds. yes, a weather front will start to move in from the far north—west and we could see a few early morning showers, some patchy mist and fog around, but they will clear away quite quickly. a good deal of dry weather, light winds for most and so,

in the sunshine, it will feel quite pleasant with highs of 15 degrees. cloud and rain starts to push in from the atlantic. it�*s a cold front behind it, bringing in some colder air. but at the same time, we�*ve got this very warm air that�*s moving up in from the near continent and where these two frontal systems will meet, well, that is where we are likely to see a real clash with some heavy rain, potentially — as much as half an inch likely to fall in some places on wednesday. it�*s likely to stay dry, though, east anglia and south east england, and by contrast, here we could see temperatures peaking at 17 degrees — 63 fahrenheit. the average for this time of year in the south is around 11 celsius. the rain will clear its way south and east through wednesday night into thursday and it may well take its time in doing so and lingerfirst thing across that south—east corner, with a ridge of high pressure building in behind. so after a cloudy, damp start across the far south—east, an improving weather story. a little bit of showery rain into the far north—west — not amounting to too much.

thursday will see highs of around ten to 13 degrees. a little bit cooler because the wind direction�*s changing slightly, coming in off the north sea, but it does mean friday and saturday, we keep that dry theme going and, again, those temperatures peaking at 15 degrees. enjoy.

this is bbc news — welcome if you�*re watching here in the uk or around the globe. i�*m david eades. our top stories: a missile attack on a ukrainian military training base close to the polish border kills at least 35 people — the local mayor is defiant: translation: they can bomb us, but they will never be able - to break ukrainian spirit. they will never be rulers at our land. ukraine�*s president zelensky visits injured troops. the country says it�*s lost 1300 soldiers in battle. and "stop this massacre". the words of pope francis who�*s made an impassioned plea for an end to the violence.